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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 12:27:27 PM | If this is a new social phenomenon, I'd expect that it is more evident in the 40 - 50 something crowd. I'd be very surprised if a guy in his teens, 20's or 30's adopted this philosophy, simply based on the typical male libido. That being said, I'd assume middle aged guys (who are passed "mid-life" crisis) would be more likely to be methodical and calculating about potential future relationships. If the risk vs reward doesn't look promising, a guy may just decide he's had enough of actively dating, and would rather spend his time on activities he finds enjoyable. While not actively shunning women, he just isn't going out of his way to date or make himself available.
I commented in another thread that I have probably 6 0r 7 male friends who would be great catches for somebody, but they are content with their single life, and aren't actively seeking relationships. (Yes they are happily heterosexual) All have been either married, or in LTR's that went bad. They just don't want to play the dating game anymore . . . | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 1:09:39 PM |
You know, it would surprise me a lot if these men that weren't looking didn't stay on the market long. I have male friends who are single and haven't had a date in years. They're not looking, and nothing is happening. It might work differently for women, but for a guy if you do not actively make an effort to date, chances are you will not get anywhere. If you're not looking, it won't happen.
I don't believe that. I think someone who's not looking, focuses on what makes him happy, enjoys activities and has a social life will naturally meet people anyway. Difference being he's not as worried about what each and every interaction means or where it goes. Once you just talk to people to be friendly and you don't care, you have no consequences - so there's no fear of rejection, cause you're not asking. I think you'd be more outgoing if there was no downside to it...and might make you more attractive.
If having a great relationship IS important to someone, then deciding not to actively pursue one is really just 'settling' for less than they want. And we all know we shouldn't settle, right?
Yes and no. It's far worse to get involved with just anyone to be involved than it is to enjoy being single while you are (which for all of us is inevitable at some point in life), but for these men a relationship becomes more something they'd do if the circumstances were right, but otherwise, not that big a deal. That's an awesome mindset to be in, because no matter what happens, you're good with it. I don't think it's as important to them anymore...nor should it be (unless and until they do meet someone who becomes a relationship).
If it's not important to someone, how would you ever have a great relationship when the 'special person' in your life is way down on your priority list, just below changing the car oil and watching the Simpsons? If a relationship is important to someone, there's no power struggle there. They already know what they want, what they'll sacrifice, where things stand. If you're dating someone who wasn't looking for a relationship nor placed any importance on it in their lives, you're certainly going to come into difficulties or serious incompatibilities when things start getting serious, and one or the other of you needs to change their lifestyle in some way for the relationship to progress or work.
It's an oxymoron that you would be dating someone who wasn't placing importance on a relationship....that's sort of the whole point, they wouldn't just recreationally "date" unless they were just bored. Why bother unless and until someone knocks your socks off and you WANT to pursue it? There's way more important stuff going on out there than worrying about a relationship you're not in (or may never be). | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 1:18:07 PM | I don't believe that. I think someone who's not looking, focuses on what makes him happy, enjoys activities and has a social life will naturally meet people anyway.
True....if you focus too much on finding a mate, you might not find it...but then there's the OTHER extreme, where you don't "put yourself out there" to interact with people in an environment where women are located.
There's this one guy I know.....I try to get him to go out and have "fun" with some friends of mine, but he's more content spending time watching a new movie on his new HDTV and great sound system or working on his car at his own home. Basically he has little or NO interaction with others outside of work or his house. I mean, I guess he's content. But he's also "hermit-like" as well. But hey, that's him I guess....suit himself.
He'll sometimes go out on occasion to a friends BBQ, but everyone one of his friends are married or couples, and he just hangs with them. And he never approaches women in public, just not his thing.
Thing is though, he claims his "lack of desire" to have interest in women are due to the fact he had like 4 of them as roomates.....'nuff said apparently. He keeps saying that over and over as if that were the "Keystone" to his reason of his lack of desire to pursue women. Apparently, his experience with having LIVED with 4 women caused all this perhaps?
If you don't put yourself in an environment where single women simply don't exist, chances are you WILL not find someone.
But it's good not to obsess over it either. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 1:25:47 PM |
If you don't put yourself in an environment where single women simply don't exist, chances are you WILL not find someone.
And the same thing applies to women too. If a woman confines herself to an environment where single men don't exist, then she is unlikely to find a guy. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 1:32:14 PM |
And the same thing applies to women too. If a woman confines herself to an environment where single men don't exist, then she is unlikely to find a guy.
Wow, tell me something I don't know  | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 1:39:24 PM |
And the same thing applies to women too. If a woman confines herself to an environment where single men don't exist, then she is unlikely to find a guy.
It's true for everyone - gender has nothing to do with it. No one's gonna meet anyone - friends, dates, network, or anything else if they never go anywhere.
For me the word "find" isn't really accurate, because I don't look...if I see something I like, I make a move and whatever comes of it comes of it - but otherwise I don't care either way. I enjoy everything I do for what it is, not how many men I'll meet doing it.
For me (and a lot of women I know) men are a nice bonus, but certainly not a goal. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 1:57:07 PM | Yes it seems to be a social phenomenom..........with the cost of divorce if a marriage goes bad, prenups sometimes not holding much water with lawyers finding loopholes in those these days. Women becoming more and more independant and not needing men anymore. So seriously folks............what's the point???? I've been single for 20+ years now and as much as I like the company or attention of women, I do not want the stress and drama that goes with serious relationships. Women have trust issues with men, men have trust issues with women etc. etc. I have a big network of friends, men and women both that feel this way and quite frankly, it's hard to find encouragement in getting serious with anyone because of all this, with the divorce rate as high as it is. I don't think people take marraige as seriously these days. It's too easy to get out anymore. Also, I have a lot of friends, men and women that are married and wish they weren't, especially my friends that are married the second and third time. Besides a large number of people are going the FWB route these days, including myself, no stress, no drama, we have our seperate lives but have companionship. What more do you need?????
I know this is a pessimistic veiw on relationships but then it's also reality................ | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 2:17:06 PM | Oh gosh, yes, fulfillment does not necessarily come from a formal man/woman relationship. However, having a good friend and lover to grow old with does makes like more fulfilling, in my opinion, especially when an individual reaches a certain age. It's like having a mirror for one's own experience. If you don't have the mirror, you can't really see yourself. The trend is to spend more time doing self-knowledge and self-evaluation, in order to be a 'cleaner' mirror. It is not that people do not want to be in a relationship....they want to be sure that they are ready and that there is a good foundation, so that the relationship won't fail. Building a foundation sometimes takes some lonely time - self-growth time- ( in which the individual is happy just being by him/herself)....
You wait till you can actually be totally accountable for what you do. If you are not accountable to yourself, how can you be to another? People are just taking the time to evolve, that's all. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 3:33:06 PM | That's a dream
.................And in who's heart you are utterly and completely safe.
When I see elder couples walking hand in hand there is something so touching about the aura of love that seems to surround them... More so than the hot young couple whose 'love' is hormonally and narcissistically driven
YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH a pretty good dream, occasionally even a reality.
There is always HOPE, you guys.
If you lose hope, you might as well be dead.
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 3:58:36 PM | Aprincelyfrog:
What a great post & yes … I have noticed the same type of attitude among my male friends who are single. What’s even more astonishing to me is that my friends & me are older … 48-55 yrs of age. I would have thought that there would be plenty of women in this age group that would welcome a serious relationship in their golden years vs. being alone. However my experiences seem to parallel what you have described here.
As far as my direction? Well, I think I am beginning to slowly agree with the attitude prevalent among your friends & for me that is surprising. One of the reasons it took me so long to file for a divorce once my marriage began to fail was my fear of the unknown. You see I got married at a very young age and was married for 30 yrs. I never expected to be single again & I was totally unprepared for it. After my divorce I invested about 2 yrs working on me & choosing not to date. Then when I began dating I expected to meet someone in a short amount of time, fall in love & get married. Well, that was 2 yrs ago. What I discovered is the longer I am single the more comfortable it gets. Don’t get me wrong … my preference is still to have someone special in my life vs. being alone … let’s just say I’m no longer desperate to find someone. And I might add … that (in itself) is a good thing.
So I think I agree with your friends & I also think you’ve observed a trend that is probably much more common than most people realize.
Great Post!
Gary | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 6:17:54 PM | I dont feel this is a new social phenomenon at all....
even the little guys feel that way about women!
Poor Alfalfa was having a difficult time sticking to his vows! :)http://freemasonry.bcy.ca/fiction/other/our_gang.html
started a long time ago!
*
Spanky: Let’s start a club right now. The He-man Woman-haters. I'll be president.
Alfalfa And I'll be second president, and you can be third president.
Buckwheat Thanks.
Spanky Alright, get up and do exactly what I do. Put your hand on your heart, and raise your other hand. We, the He-man Woman-haters club...
Alfalfa and Buckwheat We, the he-man woman-haters club...
Spanky ...promise not to fall for this Valentine’s business...
Alfalfa and Buckwheat ...promise not to fall for this Valentine’s business...
Spanky ...because girls are the bunk.
Alfalfa and Buckwheat ...because girls are the bunk.
We ladies will sure miss you! | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 6:26:09 PM | Miashakti,
I thought the OP was pretty clear in his posting when he described his friends who were adopting this new social phenomenon this way … “All of these guys are very educated & successful men ind the group & divorced. They are not angry, bitter, dysfunctional or suffering from any malady but are genuinely warm, caring, compassionate human beings... just your all around great catches that women always seem to be searching for.”
It didn’t sound to me like the guys he was describing are codependent who “who did not know how take care of themselves let alone to love them, & yet who at the same time, needed someone to pick up after them, clean their house, cook their meals, & the same with many of my single friends who make dating a lower priority in their life now-a-days. I think however, that most of them share my feelings … that I would love to meet someone special, fall in love & begin a relationship that would last the remainder of my years. The thing that has changed is these guys that we’ve described simply aren’t desperate to find someone like that any more.
Maybe it’s the result of how difficult it is to find someone compatible at our age. Maybe it’s the whole idea of not looking for your happiness through others but internally. I don’t know but it is a real change that I’ve observed in others & I am beginning to see in myself.
I’ve said it before & I’ll say it again. I don’t think I will ever achieve the complete happiness & satisfaction that those couples involved in a successful, long-term relationship will achieve. However, at the same time I also have to face the fact that I may never find that person. I think it’s important we all find a way to be happy in our present situation … whatever that may be. That does not mean I will ever give up hope of meeting someone special & starting a new relationship.
Gary | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 6:29:56 PM | Gary
I am sure that describing women in the 48-55 age group as being in their "golden years" will garner you much attention ... not a lot of which will be very nice. But perhaps attention of any sort would be welcome.
Miashakti
Looking past some of your more ... uh ... esoteric beliefs, you seem to have a decent grasp of the problems people face. Well, except that many men, including myself, prefer being single over being in a relationship.
Off topic; I Googled Tantric and it's amazing how many Tantric "teachers" charge for their "services".
On Topic; I think it is just as it's always been. But different.
Do have a nice day!
EDIT: GAry, scratch the above | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 7:10:37 PM | Lepetitemorte,
You Wrote:
Gary … I am sure that describing women in the 48-55 age group as being in their "golden years" will garner you much attention ... not a lot of which will be very nice. But perhaps attention of any sort would be welcome.
EDIT: GAry, scratch the above.
My Response:
My reference to “golden years” was meant to be complimentary and I include myself in that same group. When I think of gold I think of something that is valuable and a possession that many inspire to. I feel the same way about individuals in my age bracket. If I offended you or anyone else4 … believe me it was completely unintentional.
As far as your comment about my welcoming attention of any sort I can’t ague with you there either. I try to make new friends whenever I can & when I am successful I certainly welcome it.
Gary | |
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sware2
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Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 190 | |
| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 7:39:07 PM | | no.. the problem lies in respect and manners. I had some men thank me for waiting to have my doors opened.. etc. I want respect.. I earn it. I want to be treated as a lady.. I first have to be one. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out.. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 7:39:41 PM | Miashakti,
You Wrote:
Gary, although the Op pointed out the above average attributes of his friends preferring the single life, from my pov, they lived in the midst of a contemporary culture, a field, that did not offer much to the possibility of what is possible between man and woman ... So, there hasn't been a whole helluva lot of really good stuff to give up.
My Response:
I couldn’t disagree with you more. Our contemporary life has not served to diminish the potential that a good relationship has to offer … if anything it has (in my mind) made it more unique & more desirable than ever. And as far as their not being “a whole helluva lot of really good stuff to give up” … As I stated in my previous post, the first 20 yrs of my marriage was wonderful. The good stuff included, but was not limited to:
- Having someone special to share the highs & the lows
- Having some one to think of when your day is difficult & you need a reason to smile
- Having someone to do special things for
- Having someone to rush off to call when there is good news to share
- Having someone to hug & support when there is bad news to share
- Having someone to love.
Once again ... I am not championing the single way of life. I only agreed with the observations that the OP mentioned in his original posting. But as you can see ... I will never take for granted the benefits of a successful relationship & all it has to offer.
Gary | |
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zeeba
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Joined: 3/27/2008
Msg: 192 | |
| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 7:52:40 PM |
I’ve said it before & I’ll say it again. I don’t think I will ever achieve the complete happiness & satisfaction that those couples involved in a successful, long-term relationship will achieve. However, at the same time I also have to face the fact that I may never find that person. I think it’s important we all find a way to be happy in our present situation … whatever that may be. That does not mean I will ever give up hope of meeting someone special & starting a new relationship.
Gary, your statement really hit home with me...and it makes a lot of sense. In fact, it may be what the OP was saying as well (and I am great at rushing to conclusions, although the whole prospect still makes me sad.)
Bottom line: It's a different world for those of us in our 40s and 50s, whether we have ever been married or not. I'm beginning to realize that there are many different types of relationships other than the proverbial "getting married and living happily ever after" (and whoever said that was a guarantee, anyway?) Maybe men and women both are just tired and settling in with being happy with their own lives.
I do hope that in all of this, we don't withdraw to the point of becoming completely antisocial. I have one cat, and I don't want to be the crazy cat lady -- yikes!  | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 8:15:21 PM | Yes, it's true for both sexes, but especially men i think. I'm definitely right there myself. Everybody i think i might like, both have the house, and "stuff".... no one wants to move for sure, who's going to give up all their "stuff"? Traditionally guys always lose here, but more and more, i think they are choosing to just make their life and home comfortable and give up the search.... toys or woman? toys or woman? | |
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sware2
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Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 194 | |
| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 8:29:25 PM | | I find all this so sad.. I had the most wonderful marriage for 20 yrs and did the till death did we part. True love is awesome.. just difficult to find anyone else that believes in it still. I do not choose to be alone.. I choose to wait for the right one. I still want to dream and hope and believe... there is a Santa .. right? | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/26/2008 8:57:08 PM | Yes, I think this is a new social phenomenon. By large measure men are questioning the upside to relationships and the drama that seems to be required. True mutual friendship appears to be a lost concept.
Ahh well, back to the work and toys! | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/27/2008 12:08:09 AM | | I love to date. Even if it's just to have the warmth of someone next to you that smells good while you watch Scrubs. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/27/2008 12:39:30 AM |
I don't think people take marraige as seriously these days. It's too easy to get out anymore.
I think the exact opposite. Marriage is too easy to get into. Remember Carmon Electra[sic]? The media said she got drunk with a friend and they got married that night.
The people who make a mockery of marriage are the ones who got married. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/27/2008 12:42:00 AM | As for me, long before I saw this thread, I have been considering staying single if my current lady and I were to part, like death.
I know she would be impossible to top, so why would I bother?
I haven't figured out how to handle sex if I stay single, but that would work out.
I have a treasure, and I am keeping her. | |
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| Is this a new social phenomenon???
Posted: 5/27/2008 1:46:00 AM | Personally, it sounds like there are an awful lot of angry men on this site. It also sounds like there are an awful lot of men that are going without affection and sex.
It's not that women want to control YOU, they just want to be respected as human beings. And, there's nothing wrong with that.
However, if 'some' of you fellas can't bring yourselves to respect someone other than yourself...well, maybe you're right. Maybe it's best if you remained celebate and alone. After all, you would be doing the women a favor by doing so. No one wants to be with a guy that is angry, just because you ask him to do something or act a certain way that doesn't hurt your feelings, trust me.
However, I suspect that women will still be able to find men that know how to treat them, respectfully. It just won't be the ones that are here and remain angry. Those that decide they're not going to respect anyone, but themselves, will lose out.
For those who are claiming they're happy that way...might I suggest a good sex store for you? You will probably need it, eventually, hehe.
Ladies, stick to your guns about keeping your respect and might I suggest you hold the quarter between your knees even tighter? hehe.  Fellas, have fun fishing, lol     | |
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