|
|
|
|
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 12:57:34 PM | Tiger, I think you are confusing race with culture. This is no reflection on you, I am sure you are a great guy, but had you dated outside of your hemisphere, you would not have made this mistake. If you've read my post carefully, you would have noticed that I sad a smile is a strong come on sign in my home culture, as it is in many others; I have not made a statement that it so in North America have I? And yes, I know the expression "grow a set of balls", but I do find it highly ironic when a bunch of MEN advise a WOMAN to grow one. I don't suppose you see any irony in this, do you? First, it might be a little hard for me to do. Second, if I do, I won't need men in the first place, will I? JUST KIDDING.
All right, guys, if you are here to date, you've really got to get out of this pised off mood. It's not sexy.
OP, you seem quite determined to make your situation the man's fault. You got a lot of good advice on this thread and some very insightful comments, and yet you're bristling at just about every remark that indicates perhaps your actions played a part in the situation not working out the way you would have preferred. What's the goal here? To be confirmed as right, or to learn something that helps you do better next time?
All right, I am going to shout. WHICH PART OF ME CALLING MYSELF AN IDIOT FOR NOT CEASING THE MOMENT DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND? Where is the disagreement here? Do I need to keep acknowledging that I made an idiot out of myself in EVERY post of mine to avoid scolding? OK, I am done shouting.
you are one angry young sexy good looking woman.
you have pointed out how everyone is wrong.
That tiger, not having datedanyone outside his culture ( do asian people have a different culture or is being of a different race count as being a different culture? Did TW date a jewish woman? or do we actually have to travel to their home country in order to qualify )
Do all people in the western hemisphere have the same culture?
IN north america, and probably elsewhere but in a different language- we call any guy who is soft or isn't courageous a pu$$y. Sometimes a girl will be called this as well, by either another girl or a guy- usually the guy would have to be a close friend though...
for guys, it doesn't matter if we even know the guy .
its all good.
most people don't get bent out of shape about this.
but you are fit & cute, and possibly sexy in a very angry disturbing sort of way.
it's rather intoxicating.
anyway, i love the way you have told people that they are completely wrong and mistaken.
thanks for the heads up about the dating thing.
I certainly wouldn't want to miss out on all those dream dates with women who share the same opinion as you do.... or have the same outlook / philosophy..
someone on this thread is very very angry ( and yet sexy at the same time ) and this doesn't apply to any of people responding. not even grumpy guss.
wishing you all the best.
MM | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 2:10:06 PM |
Lots of the guys who scold me here must have never set their foot outside of their culture, and it shows.
People from a certain culture tend to act as if they are from that culture. Because some grow up in the same culture they are in as an adult makes it a bad thing? You have to act appropriately to the culture you are in. Here, a smile is just a friendly look, it's no sign of interest.
You can't go to a culture the opposite of yours, act like in your culture, and expect people to get what you mean. A smile in another culture could be a dirty look and scare people off, so should they know that you smiling at them is a sign of interest, being in their culture? | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 2:12:44 PM | Homeonthecoast, you just can't get yourself off that combative mood, can you? And you don't even realize that... Who said I thnk the majority of you have it wrong? Who said there IS right vs. wrong when it comes to cultures? Why don't you lighten up a bit..
And people who can't see the difference between embarrassed and playing games have my sympathy.
I couldn't get combative over a discussion on the Internet if I tried, it's just not in my nature. In fact, my very *lack* of combativeness is one of the reasons I was invited to Moderate another Forum I'm a member of. You on the other hand seem to be looking for offense where none is intended. The only one with any combativeness in this entire Thread is looking back from your nearest mirror. :-( You've have a wealth of advice and observation from others in this Thread, yet you get your back up when you hear something you don't like.
You can always find a reason to be offended, if you look hard enough... But that's a Wayne Dyer quote.
You start off a Thread saying a guy didn't sort through your mixed signals and somehow that makes it a guy problem. So far I haven't read any Posts that support your view, and somehow you think that means the rest of us don't *get it*, whether due to being unsophisticated or for any other reason. You've recognised that if you want another shot at this guy, you're going to have to hit the trails and do some work of your own. Many of us, including myself, have supported this idea.
By disagreeing with the vast majority of Posters, you are implying that you believe their opinions are wrong. This has nothing to do with cultural differences. Personally I live for disagreement, otherwise how else would we learn about different people and cultures? I have good friends from all over the world and I'm always learning from them, as they are from me. :-)
Apparently the only person who has your sympathy is the guy you met on the trail, because the rest of us clearly understand that you were embarrassed in the moment and that your admitted mixed signals were the result of being flustered and not of any games.
What we have said, and you seem to be ignoring, is that he obviously didn't get the message you were trying to send due to the confusion which he may or may not have detected, thus he took the easy (read - safe) way out and left. Most *nice/respectful* guys in North America would have acted the same way he did in that situation. By the same token, if you see him again, as a nice/respectful guy, he'll be more than happy to start over and see where it goes. After you tackle him to the ground so he can't make another hasty getaway, likely he'll even admit to being shy or nervous himself, hence the swift departure when he thought he was getting the brush off. As nice people you'll both have a chuckle and hopefully enjoy a nice ride together followed by beverages.
Happy trails. Hopefully he'll be out there looking for you as well.  | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 2:51:29 PM | Homeonthecoast wrote: You start off a Thread saying a guy didn't sort through your mixed signals and somehow that makes it a guy problem. So far I haven't read any Posts that support your view.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why don't you leave the girl alone? She made some semihumorous observations about a fairly common event, actually complimenting the male bicyclist for having desirable male qualities. Maybe there is a lesson in there for all of us
All she said was she was hot and sweaty and a guy on a bike stopped and said hi, and she didn't know what to say, and he rode off...
More importantly for forum users to take people seriously, one better have their basic facts correct. As such:
Theres a whole bunch of posts that agreed with her. A lot of ladies said "yeah I do that". you said "I haven't read any posts that support your view". Did you just not read any posts at all, or ???
And you were bashing on her...telling her to look in the rearview mirror, or is that what you call friendly forum policy where you are a forum moderator. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 3:13:06 PM | Awww, Olyman, you are so sweet, and you actually get my humor, thanks...  Would you marry me?
Is THAT forward enough for you, guys? 
For those who said no games were implied...
Because you were playing little games, hoping HE would make the first move.
Maybe he was giving mixed signals to you, but in the process of playing your game, you obviously sent HIM a VERY CLEAR message that you were not interested, so he left
Games are for kids...grow up, and quit playin'.
Oh, and someone has suggested he is lucky to have missed my signals. Now, that's supportive! We are all here to support each other, right? | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 3:40:14 PM | I'd better not get married so young in life, again. Yet, if I could find a good nutcase who thinks I'm the sane one...that wouldn't be so bad. But, I'd probably chat with her in a store or waiting frikin forever to buy stamps at the PO and then the clerk says "you could have used the APT", and I'd be too chikin to get her number too.
Thats the funny thing about this thread, if you said "we were all drinking after the races, and some of my old boyfriends came by and said things have changed, they want to get a job, and asked me to move in" You probably would have gotten lots more support by some.
As is, only about 50% of the people who understood this thread agreed with you, hey thats not too bad. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 3:55:45 PM | Did you not read the back of his jacket, Trail Patrol/EMT Just maybe he wasn't that good looking, might have been the sweat and the sunlight in your eyes lol.... | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 4:13:31 PM | OP: I'm gonna give it to you straight.
Generalizations about entire genders of people don't work. A smart-ass demeanor doesn't work. Mixed signals don't work. Game-playing and coyness don't work. Bullshit doesn't work. You don't really know if the guy was interested in you or not....all you know is that you didn't act on your own mild interest. Instead of analyzing the blown opportunity to death, a winner moves on and makes sure not to blow similar opportunities in the future.
Being too "cute", clever, sophisticated, or shrewd is always a chemistry-killer. If you just created the thread for troll purposes, then carry on  . However, if you're really looking for quality dates, you need to be straight-forward with potential partners and learn to recognize/screen guys who are capable of the same. The cat-and-mouse thing works for some people, but most men and women actually want to have fulfilling connections with each other. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 4:57:33 PM | | You couldn't catch him because he was Bicyclettus, Angel of Rim Jobs...you missed out on one of those "Divine Tests." Don't worry, there'll be more tests. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 5:04:05 PM | I don't see where it is said that we have to be supportive of everyone in every post. There is a warning on the threads main page informing the person who is about to post that they are opening themselves up for some criticism or whatever it says.
It is often very difficult for some people to ignore certain things that the OP puts out there that may be quite important over and above the main content of his/her post.
This is what happened with your post. This is the unintentional revelation.
It has happened to many other people as well- there is something revealing about what the person writes, that the OP doesn't know or care about. However other people find it very interesting. They don't mean to reveal this much about themselves but they do.
and the OP replies to these comments simply confirms the first impression. Insome cases it doesn't.
ON another thread one person posted something about having a terrible time on a date. In a later post, she mentioned having done something that may have prompted this entire thing. People picked up on it
She took several highly critical posts - a couple of body shots and one or two rabbit punches - before she returned.
She was NOT CRITICAL of the people who responded to her about her own behaviour.
She analyzed her actions, questioned her beliefs, reflected upon her own behaviour and came to the conclusion that perhaps she shouldn't have done what she did.
Few people said that she was entirely at fault.
Her responses were incredible. I was astounded at how calmly and rationally she accepted the comments. It was clear that she was comfortable looking inwards, questioning herself and accepting that there may be some things that could be better.
She wasn't mean- she seemed good natured about it. the thread ended on a positive note. She didn't always agree with the dissenting opinion. In fact, she defended herself on a couple of occasions and accepted that she may have been wrong on several other points.
The way she did it was incredible. EVeryone felt better for the experience.
She seems like a wonderful person, incredibly efficient and trying to be more effective.
bows to KD. offers flowers.
Your responses to people who were mildly-slightly-some- more than some -highly critical of your actions were quick and forthright-
you were having none of it.
1. you condemned these other people as having no experience, having never gone anywhere and thus not qualified to say anything to you about anything.
2. you were very condescending towards these people rather than look to see if what they were saying was even partly correct.
You didn't even attempt to hide your contempt for the people who responded.
I doubt that anyone's feelings were hurt- mine weren't as we have seen this sort of thing before. MOst simply chuckle . Many use these threads purely for entertainment and watch the participants have at it. There is so little information to be gleaned from it as if you have been around for a while, it's the same stories with different faces/names.
The purpose of these threads is not one of SUPPORT and SUPPORT EXCLUSIVELY.
If you thought that, this is just another misconception you have about this. People offer support to people who deserve it. Some give support right away and never question anything the OP says/does. It may turn out that this was/is the wrong thing to have done but they don't stick around long enough to find it out.
Many people find themselves in horrible dire situations and the support given to these men and women is immediate and unconditional.
imo, and I know it means nothing, you have shown yourself to have some traits that others find to be offputting. had you responded " oh, yeah, well, the thread title was sort of half serious and based upon allthe other threads about men being pigs."
and " oh. I wasn't aware that my assumptions about NA social interactions were inaccurate!" or " so smiling doesn't automatically mean a come on?" or " you mean playing coy or giving mixed messages to a guy isn't a good thing?"
or it would have gone a long way for you had you explained to the women who asked youwhat you meant about how you knew that the guy obviously was interested in you.
Many people found that hard to swallow actually.
YOu initially wrote it off by " women know these things or something similar.
I think that most of the women who posted and the many women who normally respond to this sort of things yet decided not to on this one - immediately figured out what this was and didn't even bother.
The amount of eye -rolling that must have happened at the end of the OP must have been enough to circle the earth. ( exaggeration not meant to deceive as I clearly don't mean that yet I don't mean the opposite of it either ) | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 5:13:12 PM | | ^^^^^ Bravo, bravo. What a wonderful listing of what went wrong in this thread without vitriol, sarcasm or cynicism. I hope the OP appreciates the time you took to run it down for her. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 5:36:13 PM | | abc, I don't know what it is, but this reads like another missed opportunity to be the woman you wish to be ...and not the one you find yourself using as your excuse for being. The man reads like he's considerate ...something that I'm sure amazes too many women, and you gave him every reason to ride on ...as he was, before he stopped and seemed waiting for you to 'drop your guard'. May I suggest that you get over it for being sweaty after eight miles of learning how healthy biking can be. It might not hurt you to practice going up that hill w/o pausing to rest, reflect upon, and will regret for opting to be the woman alone on top of it. Real men love real sweat on a real and beautiful woman, and there's no saying for what we might do for your getting all the sweatier, but 'cautious for fickle' before "so darn... respectful" might have had him pedal on as fast as he could. Maybe he was in a hurry to get home to ease what you 'stirred'. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 5:43:21 PM | | This is a good example of groupthink. I've got so many messages of support in private.. while in public I've got bashing over something I had neither stated nor implied. Well, I understand dating is a cruel game and makes everyone miserable, apparently I ended up being a lightening pole for some folks... good for you. I think anything and everything I can say is going to be misconstrued. It does not matter. Those who understood, understood. Others trying to prove to me the obvious, as if I've ever disagreed... go ahead. Some people are just too serious for their own good. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 6:07:35 PM | I think it's unfortunate that North American society is actually how you put it. I have spent time in several other areas of the world and you are right in some ways that men are men and step up to the plate. Actually when I travel I tend to become that man more so than here. North America is just.....well, different. I don't know if it's from way back in Puritanical days still filtering through (there is a bible belt for a reason) or the result of a feminist and litigious society, but women have become the new men to some degree. And I think they ironically hate it. (I'm certain to take the heat off of you now abc6587, if that's your real name).
I see a lot of women who wonder if chivalry is dead, but I've actually been scolded by women for holding the door for them and letting them enter a building before me. How insane is that? The fact is I would have held the door for any human that was approaching behind or beside me. I'm not here to bash women, I love them way too much for that. Just remember that you can't have your cake and eat it too. (Luckily for me I like pie).
As for other cultures, it really is different out there in the big, bad wild world. In Asia, for instance, women tend to be demure out in the open, but tigers in private. I sort of like that, personally, but I now men who wouldn't. In South America, it is common practice for men to go out and have sex (hell, women do it too) and go back to their wives and it really doesn't matter. The fact remains that for all of the craziness in North America (porn industry, Girls Gone Wild, and stuff like that), it is probably one of the most sexually repressed cultures in the world. If people had a more healthy attitude toward sex (and I don't mean having random sex), then perhaps guys wouldn't take your "MIXED" signals wrong and just ride off on you. Hell, men would approach married women and just for conversation if we thought it were okay. I've had women flash their ring in my face and tell me to go away. Little did they know I was there as much to talk to her single friend.
Anyway, OP, don't get too upset at people for voicing their opinions. Afterall, you did ask for it by initiating this thread. Take a moment and understand North American culture, just as we should learn a bit about yours and go away having learned something.
Reminds me of a quote:
"Every man I meet is my superior in some way. In that, I learn of him." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson | |
|
| |
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 6:59:17 PM | Now, THAT is a true Traveling Man spoken. Amen. Listen to him, he knows what he's talking about. And umpteen people have written me in private saying pretty much the same. Yes, of course abc6587 is my real name, what am I, hiding behind some silly nick? :-)
I am learning... sure... there is huge education value in this thread.. along with some noise. No, I am not upset. Silly actually... Too bad we can't have a forum of this size locally, would be easy to find out who is who... Which is to say, too bad you are not local, Traveller. | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:02:32 PM | | I just want to know how it goes when you see him again. I'm sure you won't miss your opportunity the next time. Our culture is very different from Europe and many other countries. Some for the good, some not. You do need to be more obvious with most American men. Sexual harassment claims are rampant and men are leery, with good reason. It's a shame that it has come to this, but for their own protection, many will not approach a woman without a blatant invitation. Ambivalence only causes more confusion. The direct approach leaves no question as to your feelings. Good luck! | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:06:34 PM | | Question. I don't have the slightest problem with blatant invitations on a forum like this where I know everyone is single; I'd hate to give blatant invitations where people can be attached.. so just how blatant is blatant enough? | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:07:28 PM | | Well you purposely stopped to get attention and you finally got some and from somebody you found attractive yet you played around and gave him mixed signals and drove off. What did you expect to happen? | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:10:52 PM | He was a highly evolved entity (maybe your guardian Angel)
that believed you required assistance and came to your aid!
When he realized you were in no danger, he simply dematerialized!
Happens all the time actually! | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:21:36 PM | beershark:
Because if, in a situation like this, if we do ask for the digits we become pigs, interested in only one thing. We are called insensative because we are hitting on you while your just trying to excersize. I'm sorry. I forgot. That only applies to dudes you don't think are "gorgeous". My bad.
Couldn't agree with you more my friend. Well put.  | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:31:08 PM | I think it's just a reflection of the kind of society we live in today. It is way too easy for a woman to throw the "harassment" or "stalker" flag, and since he didn't meet you in a venue where someone typically is looking for a date, he probably thought you weren't interested, and didn't want to push the issue. Unfortunate . . .  | |
|
| |
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 7:55:45 PM |
Question. I don't have the slightest problem with blatant invitations on a forum like this where I know everyone is single; I'd hate to give blatant invitations where people can be attached.. so just how blatant is blatant enough?
This all depends on how comfortable you are with how fast things progress.
If you are explicitly blatant about your sexual desires/wants from the outset - then you will turn off many men who, inspite of the propaganda insisting otherwise- don't immediately want that. Some guys actually DO want a relationship first and foremost and want that relationship to include sex.
I wouldn't put any blatant comments on your profile.
There are always guys on here who will send you dcik pix or will ask you for the money shot or pics of your boobs. You can do what you like.
WE all want someone who we find sexually attractive. Don't get caught up in that conversation.. it does go without saying.
Don't get wrapped up with your assumptions about what you think men are like. Or assume that something you have read in those books of yours apply to the man in front of you. The guy standing in frontof you may not have read the book in question and doesn't know that a guy is supposed to act 'that way'. he has been acting 'his way' for his entire life.
If you like the guy, tell him you like him. Tell him sooner as opposed to later. or too late.
Women who "fall in love" or " feel a deep connection " with/to a guy via email or IM chat seem overly weird to many guys and to the guys who find this normal and desirable- well those guys are to be avoided.
The people who seem to have the most success on here are those people who are upfront about their sexual desires or at the other extreme are simply to the point and get the job done! They don't wait weeks before meeting someone. They set up a time and place to meet within a few days or a week, meet in a public spot, do the cell phone get out of date free trick, tell the guy immediatel that it ain't gonna work, leave the guy there without wasting either of your time, then block the guy immediately upon getting back here. He will inevitably start the 'nasty date ' thread. YOu should best avoid contributing to that one.
Dont get caughtup in threads about superficial women or why women don't respond.
Just be the woman who deletes and doesn't respond and keep having a good time.
And move on to the next date. YOu are attractive. you are fit, you have a feisty attitude that some men enjoy. Don't get rid of it, just tame it down a bit.
You're not trying to attract everyone, hopefully you just want to attract men who are attracted to the way you are. So stay with that.
you and biker buddy may have had something in common from the get go. I can't imagine that people would be so spiteful as to not want you to meet the guy again. The way you described it left too much out.
Try to give a little in your conversation style.
It doesn't show much introspection to be openly dismissive of people who offer difference of opinions while singing the praises of people who agree with you.
So if you and your friend do engage in conversation for any length of time, it may be that you will disagree with something he says. Tell him that you disagree with him. NO one is saying that you should be a wet blanket or a door mat. Just try to put your point of view out without being dismissive. REalize that it is okay to agree to disagree.
YOu don't have to be coy of send out mixed messages. The line " come on up to my place for drinks." works well for most guys.
It seems to me that people from bigger cities tend to spend more time on the internet phase-
sending pof mail.
doing IM,
exchanging numbers
talking for hours for several days,
then driving 500 miles to meet someone.
This could be due to:
big city where no one knows anyone
past experiences
their security issues and sense of safety.
In Canada, this thought my not be so prevalent.
In NB, this trouble doesn't come up that much.
In my city it isn't an issue.
YOu walk down to the Second Cup , order your coffee and morning glory muffin and chat for a couple of hours, then walk around downtown.
People have busy lives so it may be another week or so before you can arrange another date. the real one.
oh.. gotta go. the dance is starting.. talk soon. have fun all.!! | |
|
| Why are men so darn... respectful?
Posted: 5/23/2008 10:17:43 PM | ABC... I just have to ask you your opinion about something since I now understand your mindset 
If you or a pretty woman were in a grocery store and everytime I would go down an isle we kept passing each other through and each time you smiled at me.... Is that an invitation for further communication ?
If so, I'm heading back to the local walmart because I've missed a whole lot of opportunities over the years ... | |
|
|
| Page 4 of 7
|
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 |
|
Home
login 
