| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 5:33:13 AM |
Lots of people also start college or university and drop out. I'm a drop-out but I can't find that option. Maybe you should include that too. As for now, I have just included "drop out" in my profile. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 6:45:00 AM | I don't like that the only option for College is "some college"....makes it sound like I dropped out.
Can you not just make it so you can fill in what you want? Like give so many allowed characters? | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 7:18:11 AM | | Since this particular category is ultimately about money and not much else, it probably makes more sense to have income listed instead. I mean really, if you care about somebody's education the odds that it interests you because you like to compare degrees versus the fact that it hints at their income are about 1 in 10,000. Given the fact that I see a multitude of people on this site who couldn't spell to save their lives coupled with the fact that many of them are in posession of degrees, certificates, or diplomas , it stands to reason that a prospective dater's primary interest in another's education level attained has little to do with how broad the conversations could potentially be. In other words, just cut to the chase. Interests listed should suffice if somebody is actually here to find their soul-mate. For those looking for a free lunch, why waste time skirting the issue ? | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 7:49:12 AM |
How about just a "Yes" answer ........
This is going to be just as good as "religion"
Can I get an AMEN?!! | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 9:27:56 AM | | formal education has NOTHING to do with "smarts" .. having this "option" is degrading .. it is just as judgmental as race or sexual orientation discrimination .. it shows a complete lack of intelligence on your part .. michael | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 9:42:21 AM |
Since this particular category is ultimately about money and not much else, it probably makes more sense to have income listed instead.
++
Although I still wouldn't list my income.
I think that if they're going to bother adding new features, maybe something along the lines of more drinking or smoking options would be acceptable. I have a hard time deciphering if someone who drinks "often" means they get hammered every night at a bar, or if they drink a beer with dinner nightly. Similarly with smoking, what does "occasionally" mean? I smoke a cigar once in a great while, but should that really be considered "occasional" smoking?
I guess my point is that there are other areas that would benefit from a little more thought than my official "education."
The car / no car one is ok though, because that's actually somewhat relevant to how effective a relationship could be. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 9:56:51 AM |
there are some very smart people with only high school or ged education, and some not very smart people with degrees from supposedly top of the line schools who only got into those schools through sports/wealth/connections(i won't mention dubya here).
I looked up "smarts" on m-w.com, and I found it means "knowledge of how to do something smoothly and efficiently : expertise"
It's true that you can't conclude always about someone's "expertise" with respect to degrees. But for the most part, people who finished X degree have more expertise and make more money than people who didn't finish X degree. Even if you exclude how much money a person makes, people who finished a degree X generally have more intestinal fortitude than those who did not, since attaining that "expertise" goal requires sticking with things and a reasonable level of intelligence. Yes, some people get their parents to pull strings, or sneak through, etc. It's not perfect, but generally we can make good conclusions about people who finished a degree.
i agree with leanne, this screams shallow and elitist.
Think about this. Why do job postings require that people have a certain degree before applying? Is that elitist or shallow? It's certainly completely legal in most societies to discriminate a new hire based on education. So why shouldn't we do that for a long-term partner? If you want to own a house and raise a couple of kids, wouldn't you want someone who's at least capable of acquiring expertise? We need a drivers' license to own a car, a good credit rating to get a credit card, but nobody considers what's needed to be a good spouse or parent?
Ethnicity, religion, height, eye color, zodiac sign, etc. all mean nothing with respect to long-term potential for supporting a family, paying off a mortgage, making logical decisions, etc. When it comes to jobs, it's illegal to discriminate people based on ethnicity or religion in the US and Canada.
POF has always provided ethnicity and religion as a field on a profile. Which is more shallow/elitist in your opinion: education level (smarts, expertise) or ethnicity/religion? | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 10:24:04 AM | I don't judge people on anything. By adding these options it's just going to filter people out I wouldn't date anyway because of them being too judgmental or perhaps wanting somebody who makes X amount of money.
Dating is about what we want and we all want different things in a partner. Whether it is material, monetary, or in my case, compatible. We all need money for one reason or the other. It does indicate the common opinion that somebody is less intelligent because they failed to get a degree or graduate, I don't agree with that opinion.
I don't agree with it yet it works for me. Good posts on this topic everyone. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 10:57:49 AM | But for the most part, people who finished X degree have more expertise and make more money than people who didn't finish X degree.
Again I like to pitch in here. A Degree is a specific Type of Education, and by far not the only Type of Education. And no ... those who do have a Degree do not necesarily have more expertise or make more money than those educated in other Zones. No Argument in respect to comparing those who have an Education vs. those that do not, the answer is rather obvious.
Even if you exclude how much money a person makes, people who finished a degree X generally have more intestinal fortitude than those who did not, since attaining that "expertise" goal requires sticking with things and a reasonable level of intelligence.
Have you ever considered or even looked into the Lives of those who have all those Qualities and more and created a successful Career without even placing one Foot into the higher Schools of Learning? You seem to reserve those Virtues & Attributes exclusively for those who went down a particular Path of Education.
I could fabricate all sorts of Bullshit stellar Qualities about People who created successful Careers & Multi-Millions Dollar Business and compare them to uncreative, lazy "World-owes-me-a-living" University graduated People who only went there to secure themselves a Gov't Job, because they have no Initiative or Drive of their own.
Do you see what I am getting at? You are stereotyping Groups of People, and that is exactly what 'MikeySeattle' pointed out in his post above. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 11:03:36 AM |
Do you see what I am getting at? You are stereotyping Groups of People, and that is exactly what 'MikeySeattle' pointed out in his post above.
Remember I said "generally" everywhere. I never said there weren't exceptions.
If there were not truth to the generalization one can make about education level, companies wouldn't have hiring requirements and that kind of discrimination would be illegal. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 11:09:42 AM | ^^^^
companies have hiring qualifications because: they may need a person who is trained, or educated, in a specific field depending on the job requirements.
That specific training, or education, which may prepare a person to work in that specific job, certainly does not make a person date-worthy, or relationship-worthy. It just prepares them for that job or career.
A company is obviously not going to hire someone with only a grade 6 education to work at a job that requires an engineering degree. Just as a company that needs to hire a journeyman mechanic is not going to hire someone with a degree in psychology, who has no mechanical knowledge or training.
I don't think these companies are judging the people, who don't qualify for the specific jobs, as being unworthy people. They just don't have the training for that specific job.
It's not discrimination. It's just a way of ensuring the prospective applicant is prepared to do the job.
However, in the dating world, an engineering degree, a mechanic's trade certificate, or a psychology degree aren't too helpful when determining if the person is capable of having a relationship.
| |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 11:16:49 AM | Remember I said "generally" everywhere. I never said there weren't exceptions.
Better than 70% of my Family Members do not have Degrees and make more money than those that do have one. I seriously Doubt its for the "most part" either.
If there were not truth to the generalization one can make about education level, companies wouldn't have hiring requirements and that kind of discrimination would be illegal.
I was addressing your Reference to "Degrees", not Education. I never made any References in Respect to being qualified for any Sphere of Endeavour. It goes without saying that an Automotive Shop wants to see a Certificate of Qualification before it lets any Mechanic work on Mr. Jones' Lamborghini, since Lawsuits can be costly, and no different than letting a First Aid Attendant perform a Heart Transplant. If you are not qualified, you can't have the Job, same applies everywhere.
I would however not want to associate the Principle of Qualification exclusively to "Degrees", since Education comes in many Colours. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 12:04:27 PM |
Remember I said "generally" everywhere. I never said there weren't exceptions.
I disagree. I know lots of people with degrees who are complete idiots. There is no generalization to be made here. It just isn't valid, although everyone has different perspectives and observations of people, so I could see why you might think the way you do.
Whatever .... As someone said above, it just helps me filter out all the elitist ****es out there who think they are entitled to having an omg-uber-leet-phd-boyfriend-who-lacks-common-sense-but-it's-ok-because-he's-hot.
*sigh* lol | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 12:05:43 PM |
Lots of people also start college or university and drop out.
Who cares? I did, and I turned out much better than a lot of people. This isn't an accurate gauge of "smarts"
*fail* | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 1:47:09 PM |
Better than 70% of my Family Members do not have Degrees and make more money than those that do have one. I seriously Doubt its for the "most part" either.
Your family statistics [edit] differ from the US Department of Labor's:
http://www.bls.gov/emp/emptab7.htm (see this page for a better graphic).
Unemployment rate Education attained Median weekly earnings
in 2007 (Percent) in 2007 (Dollars)
1.4% Doctoral degree $1,497
1.3 Professional degree 1,427
1.8 Master's degree 1,165
2.2 Bachelor's degree 987
3 Associate degree 740
3.8 Some college, no degree 683
4.4 High-school graduate 604
7.1 Less than a high school diploma 428
Note: Data are 2007 annual averages for persons age 25 and over. Earnings are for full-time wage and salary workers.
Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics, Current Population Survey.
BLS has some data on the employment status of the civilian noninstitutional population 25 years and over
by educational attainment, sex, race, and Hispanic origin online.
The Bureau of the Census also has some data on the educational attainment online.
I would however not want to associate the Principle of Qualification exclusively to "Degrees", since Education comes in many Colours.
I agree that the education you're talking about can't be accurately measured, and "labels" are imperfect. But, degrees/diplomas/certificates are the best thing going to make a judgment, are they not? | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 2:00:07 PM | But, degrees/diplomas/certificates are the best thing going to make a judgment, are they not? What kind of judgement?
The purpose of this site should be to judge a person's suitability for dating, or for a relationship.
Maybe some academic snobs judge a person's suitability for a relationship based primarilly on the letters behind a person's name?
But I'd like to think that most people, place less relevance on degrees/diplomas/certificates than they place on things like personality traits, beliefs and values, lifestyle preferences, age, and numerous other factors when trying to judge a person's suitability as a life partner. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 3:53:27 PM |
What kind of judgement?
The purpose of this site should be to judge a person's suitability for dating, or for a relationship.
Maybe some academic snobs judge a person's suitability for a relationship based primarilly on the letters behind a person's name?
I think you're missing my perspective. It's not about snobbery.
Does wanting to have kids who are raised in a proper environment make someone a snob?Did you know it will cost something like $200,000 to raise a kid to the age of 18-20? That's a second mortgage if you want to own a home.
The statistics say that people with degrees make more money, so why does it make someone a snob to look for a partner who would be more likely able to support the goals of having a house and kids?
I will agree that for people interested just in dating, intimate encounters, activity partners, etc. that it might be snobbery to consider education level. But for long-term, it makes a lot of difference if you ask me. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 3:55:24 PM | Having lots of schooling tends to mean you have less of a chance of successfully having offspring:
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/97facts/edu2birt.htm
Is lots of schooling a good thing? Yes, if you're a corporation looking for good workers, or a government that wants good taxpayers. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 4:24:44 PM |
Having lots of schooling tends to mean you have less of a chance of successfully having offspring: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/97facts/edu2birt.htm
What makes you reach the conclusion that women will have "Less of a chance of successfully having offspring" ... I think you're misunderstanding "fertility" they way they describe it in this article.
Have a look at the end of the conclusion in the abstract of the article itself:
Conversely, rates for college-educated married women are much higher than those of less educated women. For college-educated women, low first birth rates for women in their twenties and high rates for women in their thirties point to the continuing trend of delayed childbearing.
I think it just means that people who are educated wait longer to have their kids, which makes sense (if you know how much time both things take). | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 5:30:50 PM | divefree:
considering that you keep emphasizing the financial aspects about this feature, as far as you're concerned, this is all about the possibilities of the money your potential partner has the potential to be making. and nothing else.
tell me that's not shallow. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 5:52:43 PM | Put me in the not a good idea column, I went to university and I'm quite easily one of the dumbest guys I know.
And the guy who said these things went to Yale:
"All I can tell you is when the governor calls, I answer his phone."
"Too many good docs are getting out of the business. Too many OB/GYN's aren't able to practice their love with women all across the country."
"There's an old...saying in Tennessee...I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee that says Fool me once...(3 second pause)... Shame on...(4 second pause)...Shame on you....(6 second pause)...Fool me...Can't get fooled again." | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 6:07:46 PM | I am not impressed with "book smarts", but give me someone who has a semblance of life smarts, and that will get my attention quickly.
I didn't respond to the education box either, that's only a small part of who I am. I have a very good education, but that is my personal information. It can be discussed in private conversation. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 7:13:42 PM | I myself do not judge people based on their level of education and certainly not on their income. If that's what some people are looking for though, I don't think that it's my place to judge them or their values just because they are different from mine.
I do ,however, feel that it's wrong to infere that the term 'smart' doesn't apply to people who have no formal education beyond High School.
Perhaps the option "Prefere not to say ", could be added, as well as some of the many other suggestions, mentioned above. | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 7:39:27 PM | Can you make an IQ test and post the results. That would be far more accurate. I can usually judge intelligence just from a few emails and the profile. I know many people with degrees that are idiots and several people that make excellent incomes without the framed document hanging behind the desk.
My mother retired from the FBI without completing her BS.
Is "Smarts" for the people who dont know what education means? | |
|
| Smarts options
Posted: 5/25/2008 7:57:12 PM |
considering that you keep emphasizing the financial aspects about this feature, as far as you're concerned, this is all about the possibilities of the money your potential partner has the potential to be making. and nothing else.
tell me that's not shallow.
Why is it shallow to want kids and a house?  I already said that raising a kid costs $200,000 over 20 years. A house costs at least $100,000 (a tiny one, probably not great for kids) or you pay at least that much in rent in 20 years... Are you missing the math on this? There are probably a couple of car payments in there, too.
To me, shallow would be saying: She has to have a degree so we can pay for three cars, two houses, a bass boat, daily spa treatments, etc. I'm just asking for the basics.
Wouldn't you say people with different education levels are less compatible in general (there I go again...)? I can see from the comments in this thread that lots of people who didn't finish university are intimidated by listing education level. To me, that is all the more reason it should be listed, so that the intimidation doesn't take place in a date and you can eliminate the intimidating people when you search. Read the following story from an intelligent woman (doing a PhD) who has a hard time getting follow-up dates (once the men figure out her education level): http://advice.eharmony.com/?page=view_thread&TID=9075&start=0 Just an excerpt:
Many men seem to be intimidated when they find out about either [my] tech career or the doctorate, and to a lot of people, travel somewhere outside the US can also seem like I'm one-upping them (a belief that I think is untrue; my parents are also die-hard travelers and I grew up with it). I asked a number of my male friends why I was having problems, and their repeated response was, "You're the most competant (sic) women I know, and if I was a single man, I don't know where I'd fit in your life."
Can you make an IQ test and post the results. IQ's not a predictor of success in life or relationships. From http://iq-test.learninginfo.org/iq07.htm
A Canadian television program recently tracked down some of the people with the highest IQ scores in North America. One man who has an extremely high genius IQ works as a motorcycle mechanic, hangs out with biker gangs, and is frequently in and out of jail.
Another man interviewed on the program has the highest IQ recorded in North America. He has worked as a bouncer in a bar for ten years, earns minimum wage, and lives in a tiny garage. Clearly, a high IQ is not enough to guarantee success in life. | |
|
Home
login 
