| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 7:41:45 AM | .
That makes him Obama's Uncle?
The name listed is not the name in the family genealogy.
The man listed was from Ill. Not Kansas.
Uncle Charlie was in the Navy, based on the Kansas records.
Obama misspoke. | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 7:42:08 AM | | The part I don't get is the part where Obama lied about which camp and when....oh sorry, I meant "misspoke". Besides there is no conclusive proof that he actually had an Uncle that was even actually there. He does have some distant cousins in the Bush administration though....lol | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 7:52:25 AM | My first in-laws were in the camps. The family, of course, didn't speak about it much (because mom would literally lose it) but I saw the numbers tatooed on their arms. For years I said that my former mom in law, Sabina was imprisoned in Auschwitz probably because that's the camp with the most notoriety or the one that I remember the name of most readily. She wasn't, she was in Dachau. I guess I'd better never run for president either. I thank God these two people were in my life because I saw just a microcosm of the aftermath of this part of history...I'll never forget them.
We're still talking about this given the revelations in the last day or so from Scott McClellan's book? I think Obama mentioned he made a mistake and misspoke. What would you advise a candidate to do when he makes a mistake? Maybe apologizing and 'owning' it is a better option than piling heaps of lies on top of an insane error in judgement and NEVER admitting wrong doing. Don't most reasonable people simple fess up to the mistake and say, "Sorry...I've been campaignng hard lately and I misspoke." | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 104 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:05:16 AM | Let me recap the highlights of this thread.
So, Obama makes a speach in New Mexico and with great pride makes reference to an uncle who served in the war. Giving specifics even!
Someone points out that he doesn't have an uncle because his mother is an only child.
Someone points out that the Americans did not liberate Auschwitz.
Then Obama announces he was mistaken, it wasn't an uncle, but a great uncle.
Then Obama announces it wasn't Auschwitz but another Nazi death camp.
Then Obama's video speach on HIS website has edited out the reference to the uncle and Auschwitz.
Then Obama's geneology record that was accessible a week ago on the internet has now disappeared.
So here's my question. Do you suppose Obama meant to say the "uncle"* came out of the closet instead of the attic after the war?
*note Rev. Wright was like an "uncle" also
I've seen Obama's church website "change" after being scrutinized
I've seen Obama's own website "change" after being scrutinized
I've seen information once easily available on the internet about Obama mysteriously disappear or "change" after being scrutinized.
Doesn't that just seem "odd" to the rational person? | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:15:54 AM | Or the other side of that coin.
Obama states he had a relative that liberated a death camp.
Then everyone goes nuts trying to prove he didn't, by researching information that's totally wrong, and actually has zero to do with what he actually said factually.
End result ?
Let's all be glad he didn't say sweetie, when he said that.
In the meantime, another chance to take the battle to McCain is lost, when every day counts, and even Rupert Murdoch is saying he's in trouble.
Various people claiming to be Democrats waste energy, and avoid the most pressing issue in American politics today.
Doesn't that just seem "odd" to the rational person?
It does if you realize what a McCain victory in November entails, I agree. | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 106 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:17:26 AM | does that explain why the video on his own website has edited out the questionable statement as if it never existed?
This has nothing to do with McCain
This has nothing to do with Clinton
This is a thread discussing the events of Obama's speach in New Mexico. | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:20:36 AM | Posted from the only Genealogy site still up on 5-28 about....
http://genealogy.about.com/od/aframertrees/p/obama_two.htm
6. ii. Stanley Armour DUNHAM
The family is found living with Ruth's parents in the 1920 federal census of Sedgwick County, Kansas. In 1930, Ralph Jr. and Stanley are with their maternal grandparents in Butler County, Kansas, while their father, Ralph Sr. was enumerated with his parents in Sedgwick County, Kansas.
14. Rolla Charles PAYNE was born 23 August 1892 in Olathe, Johnson County, Kansas and died in Kansas in October 1968.
15. Leona MCCURRY was born about May 1897 in Kansas.
Rolla Charles PAYNE and Leona MCCURRY married in Kansas about 1922 and had the following children:
1. i. Madelyn PAYNE
ii. Charles W. PAYNE born about 1924.
iii. Arlene PAYNE born about 1926.
The same site 5-30.
6. ii. Stanley Armour DUNHAM
The family is found living with Ruth's parents in the 1920 federal census of Sedgwick County, Kansas. In 1930, Ralph Jr. and Stanley are with their maternal grandparents in Butler County, Kansas, while their father, Ralph Sr. was enumerated with his parents in Sedgwick County, Kansas.
14. Rolla Charles PAYNE was born 23 August 1892 in Olathe, Johnson County, Kansas and died in Kansas in October 1968.
15. Leona MCCURRY was born about May 1897 in Kansas.
Rolla Charles PAYNE and Leona MCCURRY married in Kansas about 1922 and had the following children:
1. i. Madelyn PAYNE
ii. Charles Thomas PAYNE born in 1925.
iii. Arlene PAYNE born about 1926.
OBAMA CHANGE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Uncle Charles W. PAYNE born about 1924. becomes Charles Thomas PAYNE born in 1925.
I bet Shrillary DID it.........ODD? | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:27:51 AM |
This has nothing to do with McCain
This has nothing to do with Clinton
This is a thread discussing the events of Obama's speach in New Mexico.
Which is deflecting time and energy away from the actual main target. | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 109 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:30:26 AM |
What is the Uncles name?
Payne C. T. Pfc 355thInf is not the name listed in the genealogy
Charles W. Payne, born 1924, enlisted 10Nov42, Navy, 6293977 Registered, order #12019, Kansas City, Wyandotte Co., Board #4
This persons order # has changed from 12019 to 12017 in the 24 hours since it was originally posted.
http://www.kshs.org/genealogists/military/wwiiveteransresults.php?page=421&branch=N | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:34:46 AM |
does that explain why the video on his own website has edited out the questionable statement as if it never existed?
I don't blame him for editing it out. It shows me that he sees no value in wasting time knit-picking at insignifiicant details. | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 112 | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:53:12 AM |
OBAMA CHANGE>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Uncle Charles W. PAYNE born about 1924. becomes Charles Thomas PAYNE born in 1925.
I have noticed the change too ......amazing what money can buy................keep the funds rolling in folks !
If its your relative-you know who they are and where they were .My one grandfather was with the Gurkhas surveying retreating armies all the way back to the India/Burma border area,digging in and making a stand amidst a barbaric onslaught .
If you can't remember who it was exactly and which camp exactly......why would you mention it unless you seek votes from that particular audience .Or reflected glory.yet I hear people say that McCain served,was imprisioned,tortured and his son is a serving soldier in Iraq ? lol.....that aint enough ! You are braver for getting the names wrong of some uncle you never knew .
Concentration camps were not holiday camps for the inmates or for the Allied Armies .So if you can't be bothered to know the why and wherefores......just don't mention it .
My father would say that this particular generation was the most heroic of the century.........we should remember these little "trifles" | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 9:55:43 AM |
It shows me that he sees no value in wasting time knit-picking at insignifiicant details.
Winston Smith corrected " insignifiicant details."
How close is this corruption to Obama???
When Michelle Obama's Thesis was reposted on the Net, were there edits to
" insignifiicant details." ??
OBAMA is for Change..... | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 115 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 11:30:16 AM | I wrote Obama's geneology record to my hard drive some time ago along with other interesting facts about Obama. The reason I did that was because I'd found things would "change" when I'd go back and look an additional time after whatever the issue came under fire. Obama's church website was the first time I encountered it.
So, because past behavior is a good indication of future behavior I wrote his ancestry to my hard drive. I did find a Charles T. Payne as well as a Charles W. Payne
Fourth Generation (Great Grandparents):
15. Leona MCCURRY was born about May 1897 in Kansas.
Rolla Charles PAYNE and Leona MCCURRY married in Kansas about 1922 and had the following children:
1. i. Madelyn PAYNE
ii. Charles W. PAYNE born about 1924.
iii. Arlene PAYNE born about 1926.
Fifth Generation (Great Great Grandparents):
28. Charles T. PAYNE was born about June 1861 in Missouri and died sometime after the 1930 census where he is enumerated with his eldest daughter Lillie in Kansas City, Wyandotte County, Kansas.
And as has been stated the records have been "changed" since I downloaded this information. | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 11:40:57 AM | does that explain why the video on his own website has edited out the questionable statement as if it never existed? I don't blame him for editing it out. It shows me that he sees no value in wasting time knit-picking at insignifiicant details.
You don't consider that misrepresentation eh? (a.k.a. lying).. Or would you be suggesting that lying is okay, as long as we're running for president?
-Suth'nBoy 
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 11:47:35 AM | I am reading, not only here on forum, but, comparing things said/done prior to this run for the Democratic nomination to the present and the 'change' Obama is proclaiming is turning up more and more to mean what can be 'changed' to benefit him in the Presidential race.
I'm truly not saying that as a biased opinion. I've already stated my views on McCain's brash behavior and, like it or not, McCain's stance on Military issues... and his own admittance of not being expert on the Economy.
There's a poll out today that McCain leads Obama. It was on the Yahoo homepage. I have to look it back up since the page is updated several times a day and I didn't copy/paste it when I first saw it. The reason I personally believe McCain leads and will widen the lead is because... agree with McCain or not... he pretty much states his position/attributes and weaknesses... whereas Obama will not admit to weaknesses. The majority of America tends to trust those who will state their positive and negative sides. | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 11:53:39 AM |
You don't consider that misrepresentation eh? (a.k.a. lying).. Or would you be suggesting that lying is okay
Like my resume...... Oxford.
OK until I was Challenged.
I misspoke. Unless I can edit the Oxford Transcripts...... | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/30/2008 11:13:41 PM | Have you McCain supporters seen that your hero doesn't even know how many troops are in Iraq, or where thay are located? Even though he claims the war and national security are his strong points. I don't hold this against him though. All of these candidates have been campaigning hard for months and must be exhausted.
You might try to avoid "sweating the small stuff" once in awhile. It may open your eyes to a bigger picture. | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/31/2008 7:06:50 AM | Give Obama the potato test
http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080531/COLUMNIST14/805310319/-1/COLUMNIST
HE GENERATES even more gaffes than Dan Quayle. "We have not exhausted our nonmilitary options in confronting the Iranian threat; in many ways, we have yet to try them," Sen. Barack Obama says on his Web site. "If Iran abandons its nuclear program and support for terrorism, we will offer incentives like membership in the World Trade Organization."
It was Albert Einstein who first defined insanity as "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
"Perhaps Mr. Obama is unaware that one of [Iranian President Mahmoud] Ahmadinejad's first acts was to freeze Tehran's efforts for securing WTO membership because he regards the outfit as 'a nest of conspiracies by Zionists and Americans,'•" wrote Amir Taheri in the Wall Street Journal this week.
In 2006, Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice offered Iran a package of incentives including "improving Iran's access to the international economy, markets, and capital, through practical support for full integration into international structures, including the WTO."
Mr. Obama can escape Einstein's charge by pleading ignorance. He didn't know about U.S. overtures to Iran, or Mr. Ahmadinejad's rejection of them. But shouldn't a candidate for president know these things?
Last week, I twitted Mr. Obama for saying he'd campaigned in 57 states, for not knowing that his home state of Illinois borders on Kentucky, and for claiming the Cuban Missile Crisis (October, 1962) was defused by President Kennedy's summit meeting with Nikita Khruschchev (June, 1961). Earlier, Mr. Obama said 10,000 people were killed when a tornado struck Greensburg, Kansas last year (the death toll was 12), and assumed Afghans speak Arabic (they don't).
After Mr. Obama took opposite sides on successive days last week on whether Venezuelan dictator Hugo Chavez should be engaged or isolated, ABC's Jake Tapper described him as "a one-man gaffe machine." And that was before his Memorial Day twofer.
Speaking in New Mexico, Mr. Obama seemed not to understand Memorial Day honors those who died in war, and claimed his uncle was one of the soldiers who liberated the Auschwitz concentration camp. Since Auschwitz was liberated by the Red Army, and Mr. Obama's mom was an only child, this is unlikely.
When this misstatement was spotted by bloggers, the Obama campaign said the senator had in mind his great uncle, Charles W. Payne, who, the campaign said, had served in the 89th Infantry Division, which liberated Ohrdruf, a slave labor camp that was a satellite of Buchenwald. This explanation has satisfied most journalists. But Charles W. Payne is not listed on the roster of the 89th Infantry Division, perhaps because the Kansas State Historical Society says Charles W. Payne entered the Navy on Nov. 10, 1942.
Mr. Obama has told the Auschwitz story before. But in an Oct. 2, 2002 speech, the protagonist was his grandfather:
"My grandfather signed up for the war the day after Pearl Harbor was bombed, fought in Patton's army," Mr. Obama said then. "He saw the dead and dying across the fields of Europe; he heard the stories of fellow troops who first entered Auschwitz and Treblinka."
(Stanley Dunham entered the Army on June 18, 1942. Treblinka, which, like Auschwitz, is in Poland, was liberated by the Red Army.)
It isn't a good idea to take what Mr. Obama says at face value. As facts emerged, he issued eight different descriptions of his relationship with the Rev. Jeremiah Wright. The "uncle at Auschwitz" story might be again revised.
Dan Quayle was just 41 and looked younger when George H. W. Bush plucked him from relative obscurity to be his running mate. Journalists portrayed Mr. Quayle as inexperienced and not too bright, an image cemented on June 15, 1992, when, while officiating at a spelling bee in Trenton, New Jersey, he corrected a 12-year-old's spelling of "potato," telling the boy there was an "e" on the end.
Mr. Quayle was wrong, but not terribly. "Potatoe" was an accepted spelling through the 19th century, and the error was on a cue card provided by school authorities. But journalists needed no further proof that Mr. Quayle was a dunce.
Journalists have been more kind to Mr. Obama, though his gaffes exceed those of Mr. Quayle, and he has less experience. Mr. Quayle had served four years in the House and eight in the Senate before becoming vice president.
Still, the question arises: Can Barack Obama spell "potato?" | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 121 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/31/2008 9:59:13 AM |
Have you McCain supporters seen that your hero doesn't even know how many troops are in Iraq, or where thay are located? Even though he claims the war and national security are his strong points. I don't hold this against him though. All of these candidates have been campaigning hard for months and must be exhausted.
You might try to avoid "sweating the small stuff" once in awhile. It may open your eyes to a bigger picture.
Considering Obama thinks we're a nation of 57 states I wonder if he even knows were Iraq is.
That's quite a pot shot isn't it? No less offensive than what you've said.
Let's agree to disagree on what we all find important pre-qualifiers to lead this country without belittling or calling each other names.
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/31/2008 10:04:38 AM |
Considering Obama thinks we're a nation of 57 states I wonder if he even knows were Iraq is.
Oh My  I missed where Obama counts 57. Was it in a speech? Maybe he was including the Arab Nations he plans to 'talk into' joining hands with us and becoming extended states of the USA.
Sorry... couldn't resist. Did he really say the USA has 57 states? I'd say that was far far far worse than not knowing an exact head count of troops stationed in any specific Country.
Buttt, I will give Obama the point that he is a terrific Orator. | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 123 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/31/2008 10:52:56 AM | Obama has been getting a pretty fair shake from the press.
I would consider it newsworthy if a presidential candidate didn't know how many states were in the country he's campaigning to lead.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws | |
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| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/31/2008 2:29:43 PM | | Did it ever occur to you that he visited some states more than once? I myself have visited over 100 states in the past couple of months. Thought I needed to explain that one since it went over some heads! | |
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_JAFO_
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Joined: 11/9/2007
Msg: 125 | |
| Obama ducking sniper fire?
Posted: 5/31/2008 3:39:09 PM | Ok I'll bite. Interesting spin on the state count.
In his speech he says he's been to 57 states -- with 1 more to go -- Alaska and Hawaii he wouldn't be going to.
He was acutely specific about those last states though.
Lemme guess. You didn't bother to watch the video clip? | |
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