| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/4/2008 10:00:34 AM | So....animal control was out here again today. Now the people are saying that my dog is running loose (outside of my property) and keeps coming on their property and being a 'nuisance'. So, I handed the guy a bag of dog treats, my dogs favorite toy, took off his collar and told the guy that if he could get my dog to come past his boundary then I would listen to what he had to say. After 30 minutes, he got in his car and even tried to get my dog to chase the car. Naturally, my dog didn't go past his boundary...with or without the collar on.
But here is the kicker. (Wasn't the same guy I usually deal with). This guy said that if they get another call they are going to deem him 'dangerous' and I will have to build a kennel with a concrete pad, chain link fence, AND a tie-out.
Any ideas you guys? Because now I am truly starting to get pissed off about this whole thing. The cat wasn't hurt. My dogs don't run off my property. And now these women are making up a whole bunch of bull shyt. There are like 7 dogs and a handful of cats that run loose out here and wreak havoc....but somehow I am the one getting in 'trouble'?? WHAT?
~Welder's Girl~ | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/4/2008 12:27:02 PM | If it comes to that hopefully a lawyer can help you with this. And you can go after them for harrassment
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/4/2008 3:22:43 PM | MSG#1,!Welder bootie wrote:Cat and dog both run free. Dog 'attacks' cat. Cat is taken to the vet. No open wounds, 2 bruises. Owners of cat insist that 2 x-rays be taken of the cat. Vet said x-rays were not necessary. Owner insisted, so vet took x-rays.
Poor Kitty 
Welder says:1. Who is at fault?
Cats fault for not running fast enough to a tree 
welder says:2. Who should pay what?
Every owner should pay for their own pets.If you let them run free you should know the threats out there in the neighborhood.Cat should have ran faster 
Welder says:3. Is a law suit acceptable in this situation?
When you go to court just tell the judge you didn't see your dog bite the cat and you don't know that the dog has ever bit a cat. Also tell that the cat didn't look hurt or in need of a vet.But you know that the cat owner is a dog hater. Probly get tossed out of court. Their word against yours.
I know that a lot of dogs get all the blame for trash getting torn up and scattered around when most of the time it's the cats. Cats always jump up on cars and if you really look real closely a cat hits his front paws on the top edge of the fender and then it's back paws hit the fender a little below and the back claws dig into the paint. If you see cat prints on your car go look closely.. Maybe a new paint job would cost more than the cats vet bills. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/4/2008 11:00:42 PM | If it were a perfect world, I'd say they agree amicably to pay the bill, 50/50.
Or just let it go and move on. The animals turned out all right in the end. Split the bill, kiss, make up, and move on. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/5/2008 3:36:23 PM | Is the Dog ok?  Bad kitty picking a fight with that poor dog. I hope the dogs ok. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/6/2008 5:01:55 AM | Seems to me if you allow your pets to roam free then you must accept the fact that the world can be a dangerous place.
OP you were very considerate to offer any vet payment at all but of course with us human animals all too often kindness is taken for weakness so if and when you decide to appease be prepared to draw the line somewhere.
Bottom line though is the cat was trespasssing on your property. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/6/2008 5:05:01 AM | LOL @ Guy. Yeah he had a couple good scratches on his face...but I got him some antibiotic for that just to make sure he doesn't get an infection. I keep him cleaned up with some saline and triple antibiotic ointment.
~Welder's Girl~ | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/6/2008 10:36:34 AM | Personally, it pisses me off when people let their cats run loose. Why the F*ck should it be any different for cats
& dogs? That's totally unfair. Cats will often wreck a person's garden, while taking a crap! And they are exposed
to predators like coyotes & cougars, dogs, stupid people & cars! I volunteer at our local SPCA shelter & we had
2 cats hit by cars in rceent weeks (hit & runs), one had a broken jaw, the other a broken jaw & a broken leg! 
The owners gave them up, because of the cost of the vets bills.The surgery for the jaw, cost over $400! I am glad
they do this, they used to have to put animals down under these circumstances, but the thing that makes me the
angriest, is that it is totally unneccessary! Leash training cats is not that difficult, it's actually pretty easy. I have
been trying to establish it here in Abbotsford, but people just don't get it?!? 
Put your cats on a leash or keep them indoors. I have never had an outdoor cat (off of a leash, that is), since I
left home in my teens. In my opinion, if you want a pet, look after it. It ain't brain surgery! | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/6/2008 12:11:32 PM | I say you were nice enough to call the cat's owner and tell her what happend and offer to pay for the cat to get examined... that's more than most people would have done, so if they can't accept that then too bad for them, don't pay a dime, especially if it's happened before. People need to learn how to control their animals or just not get them.
I have 3 very large dogs and I have 5.5 acres of property. My dogs are avid hunters and anything that is smaller than them is fair game. Now they don't go hunting in other people's yards but if someone's animal comes wandering into our yard I'm not going to stop them... It's either my dogs get to them or the cougars, lynx's and coyotes get to them. (for the record my dogs haven't ever killed another person's pet but they have injured a few)
You've done your job by containing your dogs, it's not your problem if others come into your yard. It's like someone breaking into your house, your guard dog biting them, then they turn around and try to sue you because your dog "attacked" them... it's just stupid, your neighbours know you have dogs that protect their yard so if they can't keep a handle on their own animals they can't bother you with it. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/6/2008 8:13:03 PM | Dog owner is at fault, unless there is no leash law, or the cat was attacked on the dog's property.
Cats, unlike dogs are allowed to roam free. I don't know about other places, but where I live, dogs are not in the "wrong" if they kill another animal that has entered it's property (birds, cats, squirrels...etc). But off of their property is a different story. Learned this after reading the city bylaw.
So as much as it sucks, the dog owner (by law) "should" be the one paying for any medical bills for that cat. I personally don't allow my cats to roam free, but if I did I wouldn't try to claim medical expenses because another animal that attacked them. I would feel it was my own stupid fault for allowing them outside and risking it. What would the cat owner have done had the cat been attacked by a wild animal? Can't go trying to get money off of that now can you?
However, saying that, I don't agree with dogs roaming free unattended either. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/7/2008 3:36:02 AM | Well....since they are continuing with their drama regardless of what I do...I say, the next time that dang blasted cat comes up and one of my dogs goes after it...I'm not even going to bother with it. If they kill it...oh shucks. I'll scoop it up, carry it down to them, and tell them a bob cat must've gotten it. Or I'll just bury it outback and be done with it. I think I was being more than accomodating to them...but since they've had animal control out here EVERY DAY this week...I'm finished being nice.
~Welder's Girl~ | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/7/2008 6:56:47 AM |
MSG#17,Carrie wrote:So in this case BOTH parties are at fault because neither animal was on a leash or in a fenched in yard that was fully secure.
MSG#6 Welder wrote:He doesn't really run 'free'...he is contained with an invisible fence. What I should have said is that he is free to run on our property. The cat in question had run up through the yard
MSG#20,quiet john wrote:What if it had been a toddler wandering onto your property and your dog had taken a disliking to it and tried to toss it a few feet?
I think your posting is a bit extream because were talking about a cat/dog. An actually the toddlers parents should keep an eye on their toddler.. It's not my job or your job or welders job to keep an eye on every person in this worlds toddlers. An you taking your dog for walks. I hope you clean up after your dog. I know some people that walk their dogs and their dogs pee and poo in everyone elses yard and pee on peoples car wheels.That wheel and tire sometimes cost more than you paid for your dog. As far as I'm concerned thats no different than me walking up and taking a pee on your car.
MSG#26 welder wrote:Naturally, my dog didn't go past his boundary...with or without the collar on. //But here is the kicker. (Wasn't the same guy I usually deal with). This guy said that if they get another call they are going to deem him 'dangerous' and I will have to build a kennel with a concrete pad, chain link fence, AND a tie-out. I would go outside the county and find someone up higher and get in touch with them an tell them your story. See what they have to say. Do not forget to tell them about the person telling you they was going to deem your dog dangerous. Sounds like to me he's over riding his athority for no cause. Call the state animal control. This guy's job might be on the line and he might not know it.
MSG#27 Fleur wrote:If it comes to that hopefully a lawyer can help you with this. And you can go after them for harrassment
Good point and I agree. These people are nothing more than trouble makers and kissing up to animal control and the one guy in animal control.. I'd be documenting everything he says. This guy obviously isn't a fair person. He's not supposed to be partial.
I would be certain to pick up a couple "No Tresspassing" signs next time your at walmart and get them posted. This sometimes stops a great percentage of problems.
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/7/2008 7:58:10 AM | | Animal Control cannot tell you how to contain your dogs. That is up to your county courts. If 5 dogs is within your limits and your dogs do not run off your property they will have to take you to court and prove that your dogs are "aggressive" Thet means have a history of bite on record. Not the cat or dog on their territory. You can contact me privately. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/7/2008 8:01:16 AM | Grrr! When it gets down to it, you have an irresponsible pet owner (the felines) who are putting the blame on the responsible pet owners (WeldersGirl) simply because it is easier for them to do such, than to take actions that are responsible on their part.
Oh sheesh...I also despise the non-pooper scoopers mentioned! I live in a community where it is a rule, not just a courtesy. Besides the roaming dogs who poop where they wanna poop, I have seen many owners walk without picking up...and you even see them glancing around to see if anyone is looking!
Maybe they should have licenses to own animals, just like we have licenses to operate a motor vehicle or other?? ;O) | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/7/2008 6:58:30 PM | If you have a few signs that say "guard dog on duty" or "No Trespassing" you will avoid a lot of headaches with the animal control people and your surrounding neighbours. I will let you know though, in most places if you have a sign that says "BEWARE OF DOG" they take it as you are warning people that your dog is vicious or that you are aware that you own a dangerous dog. Be careful when buying signs, maybe even talk to a local police officer and ask which would be best. I know that in Surrey BC if you have a sign that says BEWARE OF DOG you can still lose your dog if it bites some one while still in your yard or house just because you are basically saying you have a dangerous dog... Guard dogs on duty would probably be your best bet, that and the no trespassing signs that were mentioned.
(I also argee that people should have to pick up after their pets, it should be the law and you should get a fine if you don't. And if you get caught letting your dog go "do their business" on someone elses yard you should get a fine and have to give up the dog) | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 4:06:53 AM | Stubble--I will contact you via message when I have a bit more time. I'm just responding here real fast.
As far as signs go...I do have no trespassing signs and 'guard dogs on duty' signs posted every 50 feet all the way around my property (in order for it to hold up in court, in my state, if someone were to trespass on my property and get bitten they have to be posted every 50 feet). I also have a huge ass sign that says 'attitude adjuster on duty' with the pic of a german shepard. That one was more of a joke...but hey, it's still posted up. Anyone with half a brain should be able to understand that there are dogs in my yard.
~Welders Girl~ | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 6:42:54 AM |
I say, the next time that dang blasted cat comes up and one of my dogs goes after it...I'm not even going to bother with it. If they kill it...oh shucks.
I know you are frustrated, but that is NOT the attitude to take. Think of the cat, who has no choice but to be outside if the owners don't want it inside. Should the cat suffer death by attack because it's owners don't seem to care......and you not care if it was one or more of your dogs that did it? How about trying to create a solution for the sake of an innocent animal, rather than say "if they kill it, oh shucks". I assume you don't leave your dogs off leash outside unattended, am I right? Do your dogs know the "leave it" command? Are they high prey driven breeds? If they have high prey drive they shouldn't be off leash, they could go after any number of animals, leaving your property no matter how well trained they are. Instinct is much more powerful than trained behavior. Not only for the sake of the animals that could be attacked, but for your own dogs that could be hit by a car or suffer a counter attack. Even a cat can do damage to a dog. My own dog (Rotti mix) years back got swiped by my cat, and cut him open just below his eye. Had it been say half an inch higher, my dog probably would've suffered some extensive damage to his eye, probably even blindness.
If the owners of this cat are still allowing it to go outside after it had already been attacked, then they're pretty stupid and don't care one bit about the welfare of their cat, but it still isn't the cat's fault. Can't help it if it's owners are irresponsible morons. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 6:56:14 AM | She has 5 dogs! It is a pack. The cat running through the yard is prey. The cat has to go or she will never get any sleep. Even if it is a yorkie setting the pack off on "prey drive" there is no stopping it unless she is there (maybe with her cattle probe)
Its like a bunny in front of a greyhound....oh white plastic bag nowadays.
Having 1 dog is not the same as having 5.
My dogs know the "leave it" command. Down to a t-bone steak on their snout. A stray cat running through THEIR yard
Yeah tell a man to pull out before he ejaculates...you wont get pregnant!
Put some candy infront of a toddler and tell him not to touch it!
Let me buy you some chocolate during your period then say you cant have it!
The dogs brain and memory is SMALLER then yours.
Poor kitty I think I will go eat chinese food today. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 7:14:59 AM | Hahaha, nice try stubblesux!
Like I said, if they have high prey drive, regardless of this particular cat, they shouldn't be off leash in an unfenced area. I'm well aware of pack mentality and prey drive, doesn't mean the owner should turn a blind eye to it. And if she's not there, the dogs definately shouldn't be off leash/untethered.
And she SAYS the cat comes into her yard, all you have is her word that the statement is true. Chances are if they chase the cat, they'll chase it inside or outside of the yard. I highly doubt the cat would even stray into the yard with 5 dogs in it, especially after already being attacked.
Obviously you are not an animal lover, cause true animal lovers care about all animals, not just their own.
As far as your comparisons go, yes, a man can pull out before he ejaculates (and the "you won't get pregnant" statement is stupid, has nothing to do with the comparison), a child can have candy in front of him and be told not to touch it and not touch it (cruel, sure....but possible), and not all people like chocolate...LOL. I haven't touched it in years. Even still, it would be possible to have it and not eat it, with a little willpower. Greyhounds aren't typically let off leash either, unless competing in lure coursing, in which case the "bunny" is a bag. You'd never catch a responsible Greyhound owner allowing their dogs to be off leash in an unfenced yard.
Point is, she knows her dogs will attack the cat (and probably other animals too), and still allows them to be off leash. IMO, that's just as irresponsible as the cat owners. If you can't responsibly handle 5 dogs, you shouldn't own 5 dogs. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 7:53:14 AM | I do believe the poster as she has never lied that I have known of....
As for her particular county/city laws I will have to do some research for her but I am 99% possitive she is within the law. Now how do I know this? Well I am a dog trainer and most of my clients live near the DC area so I know the laws very well. DC is one of the toughest areas on dogs because of pit bulls. Now I have lived in Missouri for 2 years so I am just pulling this from memory but at the age of 4 months all dogs in the DC area must be license and collar...blah blah. Always wear them blah blah blah. Always on a leash or in the house. Not allowed on school property. If the are outside the have to be confined in a kennel no smaller then 5x6x12 and tarp covered and kids cant open.
As for my love of animals...cats can roam free. They jump on cars pee on bushes make kittens in trash can...its crazy! Now ask me if I have tube fed any lion cubs. Have you? Raised any deer? Saved any raccoon this year? How many baby squirrel fell out of your trees? Love those hedge hogs but hard to cuddle with. Reptile rescue is not slimey. Do you know what avians are? Pot belly pig rescue is very rewarding but not as much as training dogs for the disabled! | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 9:12:30 AM |
MSG#44,Katina wrote:Point is, she knows her dogs will attack the cat (and probably other animals too), and still allows them to be off leash. IMO, that's just as irresponsible as the cat owners. If you can't responsibly handle 5 dogs, you shouldn't own 5 dogs.
Katina?You really should read the intire thread so you know what your talking about.The cat obviously loves the abuse so it crosses into a dogs home territory.The dog owner in this case is a responcible pet owner. More so than anyone I know of with in 5 miles of me. Katina? You don't happen to be related to the Cat owners do you?
MSG#6 Welder wrote:He doesn't really run 'free'...he is contained with an invisible fence. What I should have said is that he is free to run on our property. The cat in question had run up through the yard
msg 44,Katina wrote:Obviously you are not an animal lover, cause true animal lovers care about all animals, not just their own.
Stay on topic Katina.This is not about if someone is an animal lover or not.Its about who is responcible for the vet bill. I say that cat needs to grow a brain and quit going on the dogs domain. I think the cat might be into pain or else really lacking in brains.
I have the remedy.Have the "Cat" owner to buy a collor that matches the "dog" owners fence only on the opposite side of the underground fence. I say keep your animals on your own property and this chit won't be happening.
Dog owner takes care of his animals and contains them. Cat owner is at fault.Cat owner needs to be sited for "Animal Running at Large" | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 1:01:19 PM | All of you are basing this on the OP being 100% honest about the situation, and of course she's going to say that her dogs are doing nothing wrong, the other owner isn't here to give their side of the story. Problem is, none of us know without actually seeing it, so try and look at it from all angles rather than side with the only half of the story you've heard.
To the OP. If the cat is coming into your yard (and I'm not saying you ARE lying about it, I'm just looking from all sides since I really don't know), get it on video. If the dogs really are only attacking the cat on your property, you can get out of having to pay vet bills if you can prove that the dogs did not leave your property, and were simply defending it from a "trespasser".
And stubblesux....what the heck are you talking about? What does feeding lion cubs (which don't typically show up around downtown Windsor..LOL), raising deer, saving raccoons....etc have to do with this? But since you mention it, I've done my fair share of helping animals that aren't my own. I volunteer at my local humane society, I've taken in stray animals, fostered, and yes, even rescued some wild animals (6 baby raccoons one time who's mother had been hit by a car). If an animal is in danger or suffering, you can bet your arse I'll do what I can to help. I even had a stray male cat neutered before he was placed in a new home. Not my responsibility but I did it anyway. There's enough unaltered cats out there already.
And good for you for being a dog trainer, but your not someone I'd likely ever use or suggest to train a dog, if you are saying it is ok to let 5 dogs (or any number of dogs) be out in an unsecured yard unattended then you're showing just how ignorant you are about dog behavior (and yes, a trainer and a behaviorist are two different things). I have worked with enough dogs to know they cannot be trusted off leash and unattended. Of course not to say I disagree with a dog or dogs being off leash supervised. | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 1:33:11 PM |
All of you are basing this on the OP being 100% honest about the situation What other choice do we have? Let's assume the cat's owner does take this to court. The OP shows up, the neighbors do not, who is the judge going to side with?
I would rather assume the OP is telling the truth than assume that she is not. What benefit would she derive here by not providing the actual facts?
As for the animal control person threatening you with having to build a secure run and such, bunk! The burden of proof is still on your neighbors, making up stories holds no weight. Now, if they had film of your dogs running free, than you could be in a world of doggie doo doo.
My dog also roams freely outside. Confined very nicely by an invisible fence. The neighbors cats often come to visit but they also all get along well. The OP met her obligation and responsibility by confining her dogs to her property. It is the cat owners that have acted irresponsibly. I hope you withdrew your offer to help with the vet bill after all this, end of story! | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 1:41:59 PM | Well Katina lets hope that you are lucky enough to never be hit by a drunk driver and spend the rest of you life in a wheelchair or you loose your sight or you have a child born with CP. Basic dog obedience is too boring and know it all owners like you are not worth my time. Now go buy some KMR and help a coon its springtime and leave the dog training to those who are qualified.
ps $5000 fine in most states if you do not have your wildlife rehab license...and the animal dies. Do you have yours? | |
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| Cat vs. Dog
Posted: 6/8/2008 5:01:59 PM | | The cat was hurt by the dog, so yeah, dog owner pay up. But to let your pets run free, that's sad and a safety issue. Where do you live that cats and dogs can just roam free? | |
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