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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/15/2008 4:55:09 PM | Sounds like she just really wanted some bling on her finger!
A ring to some means a lifelong commitment to each other. A commitment that you want to share the rest of your life with that person, through good and bad, etc.
A ring to others means a pretty rock to flaunt to everyone and a 100,ooo wedding that says, "This is my BIG day"!
I have said no to a ring because it was exactly that, something pretty to show my friends. If the commitment isn't there from both people then a ring isn't the answer. You have to want it for the right reasons. I know that right reason for me is only gonna happen once...as it should for most.
I think you made the right decision with this girl! | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/15/2008 5:03:36 PM | Have to be honest, you dont seem to be too cut up about it.
You would be honestly if she was THE ONE , so my opinion is lucky you and good on you for not bowing to the pressure and being true to yourself.
best of luck with your future. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/15/2008 5:42:16 PM | | Well Dude! As bad as it may sound, you screwed up!!! The not talking thing is a definate no no. I'm not going to read all that posted, but you really don't need to go past caller 4. She's not the sharpest mover either, but that's the other story. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/15/2008 5:44:57 PM |
One day I receive a phone call from a private number and its her. She starts to tell me that it is over and that she met some guy 2 months ago that proposed to her and she accepted! Now recently she just moved in with the guy and left me hanging like I was nothing.
The bottom line is, does a ring really make a difference? My 3 years with her, was that not enough commitment? I mean I was going to give her a ring at some point.
A) Don't assume she was telling you the truth. I.E. the "other guy" might not even exist. Lots of women lie to test and bait men.
B) Don't assume she was telling you the whole truth. I.E. the "other guy" might actually exist and she was banging him while you two were together. She probably looked for a commitment from you first as, my guess is, you might have been better looking and made more money, than him. Most women try to marry up, not down. If he was 1B and not 1A, it was probably due to earning power.
C) In the end, it just didn't work out. If it was meant to, it would have. Don't ask yourself why, there's no point asking, you'll never get an answer.
Does a ring make a difference? To women married before, I'd say no, they don't get the same social stigma as a never been married before woman.
Something you should learn about most women. They cannot handle rejection of any kind. Anything perceived as rejection is an assault on them and an assault on who they are as a person. It's not really true, but you'll find most women won't listen to what you have to say otherwise. Because once a woman is pissed, she really stops listening to anyone and anything.
Does a ring make a difference?
Wrong question.
Did your relationship with this woman make a difference enough for both of you in your lives right now?
Well, you got your answer. Be grateful, most men lose their house and kids to get that much. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/15/2008 6:55:36 PM | Your "ex" girlfriend was a very shallow woman.
If you hung in there for 3 years, that to me is committment. I think you were smart to want to wait until you were settled into your career, it shows strength of character and a need to be successful. You would think she would be appreciative of that fact or at least supportive.
Obviously she was after one thing and its best she went on her way. It was a hard thing i'm sure for you to go through, but it is better to find out now than 3 yrs. into a marriage what she is really like.
Be glad to get rid of her, and go find someone that will appreciate you for your relationship not for a piece of jewelry.
Trust me, a ring means absolutely nothing to a woman who loves you unconditionally.
Good luck. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 3:29:17 AM |
do you continue to repeat the same patterns but expecting different results? (Thats insanity) [/quote}
Exactly! getting married again would mean repeating past mistakes and therefore would be insanity. The point of my story was not to say "Woa is me. Look how bad things were for me". The point was, I learned that I don't need to be married to be committed. I stood the tests and I know what I'm capable of and who I am and what I value in life. What benefit is it for me to get married? What do I gain from it? I know women who have been married and divorved three and four times. What can marriage offer me that I can't getting by telling a woman, "I love you. There is nobody else for me , but you" and then simply acting upon it. In my book, there are workers and there are runners. Marriage won't change a runner into a worker and a worker isn't going to run simply because there is no ring their finger. Do you really think a worker is going to say, "Yeah I'd love to work on strengthening this, committed long term relationship and bond we have, but I just remembered, we're not married, so you're on your own. I don't care how much it hurts anyone, I'm out. Sounds like a runner to me. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 11:20:10 AM | i dont think she should have pressured the op for marriage....maybe drop hints every now and then....but not that often...i actually think the op made a good decision and she couldnt understand that....he should just work on his career now and just move on.... | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 12:44:44 PM | "Another thing I do not understand is how she leaves me and decides to marry a guy she hardly knows! What do you guys think on this issue?"
She's just in love with the idea of being married like so many other women brainwashed you could say for it would have made a diffence as she seems to care more about that wedding then anything else sounds like another narsisstic **** be glad she's gone she would have divorced you and took a crap load of your money.... | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 1:05:06 PM | | While it would be easy to bash her and tell you how lucky you are, the fact is, she wanted to get married so why the hell shouldn't she be bringing it up to you and talking about it with you? We all blab on about communication, well she was communicating with you, she wanted to get married, now! You didn't want to, so it was good that you didn't and she did so it was good that she moved on and found someone who wanted to get married right away also. Hopefully it works out for them, the stats are against them, but who wishes for someone to have a bad marriage? That would say a lot about someone's character wouldn't it. She was open and honest with you, you were on a different page entirely, so what exactly did she do wrong? | |
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~Kyn~
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Joined: 2/15/2008
Msg: 110 | |
| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 1:28:42 PM | I already posted in this thread at 67...
...but I just wanted to mention this because its an important factor alot of people and in particular men dont realise.
This is the practicalities of thinking of marriage and children at that age.
Assuming the OP's ex-girlfriend is about the same age ie. 25 and that she'd like to have children...
IF they got engaged now...
Thats likely an engagement party (lets give that within 3 months)
Then 12 months before a wedding and actually get married.
6 months of marital bliss before they start thinking of babies.
85% of people conceive within a year.
Another 10 lunar months before the child is born.
That brings it up to around 28-9 years of age before the FIRST child even enters the picture.
And every year that goes by...that age increases for the woman...along with all the associated medical risks while the odds of it happening...decrease.
Whether what the young lady has done is right or not...whats motivated her...none of us truly know and can only speculate.
But for her...in all reality in reference to her life path...she's made a good decision. | |
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DazzyB
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Joined: 10/9/2006
Msg: 111 | |
| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 1:42:07 PM | In my opinion there are two sides to every coin...
If we are talking about the 'right' girl for you, someone who believes in the 'ring' and who desires the commitement, then yes I think it does matter. Saying that, I was married for over thirteen years to a very religious person. She became abusive and violent in the later years when I refused to pray and sing with her (yes, talk about hypocrisy!!). She then started to take note of other guys from the church that we went to but never did anything further about it (although she did allow it to worsen our relationship as I was finding it harder and harder to trust her). I eventually decided to call it a day because I could not take any more of the physical abuse. As soon as the divorce came through she started to go off with other blokes. I couldnt help thinking that this was what she wanted to do all along, but it was only the 'ring', mixed with her own religious hangups that prevented her. In other words, although she did not go off with other men in action because she had a ring on her finger, she was doing it in her heart which consequently affected us.
Hope that makes sense... | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 1:57:36 PM | She wanted to be engaged, like many women want. It's one of the most common reasons that women in their twenties leave men--because the man "won't commit"--ie, won't propose or move towards marriage.
If you loved her, you could've proposed while getting your career on track, but postponed the wedding until you were financially stable.
The ring is more than a ring to many people, especially women. It symbolizes something important and is a concrete reminder that they are in a relationship that is "going somewhere". | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 1:58:41 PM | She wants her Cinderalla wedding, like all women. They all want their day in the spotlight, but wont admit it. When the attention fads and marriage becomes rountine, many men and women jump ship. She did you a favor by marrying the other guy. And don't worry dude, you can laugh your a$$ of at her in a few years when she's divorced, and has filled out her pants some. | |
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~Kyn~
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Joined: 2/15/2008
Msg: 114 | |
| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 2:03:33 PM | She wants her Cinderalla wedding, like all women. They all want their day in the spotlight, but wont admit it.
Oh FFS get a clue.
All...?
I coulda had an easily afforded $20, 000 wedding...but instead I went for a small church service, an at home caterer with a marquee and about 80 guests.
Cost about $2000
I'll never understand how people are so nasty and bitter inside they just wanna see other people fall and dance on their grave.
Clearly nothing REALLY important has happened in their lives to draw some fricken perspective & self reflection on things. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 2:37:46 PM |
I'll never understand how people are so nasty and bitter inside they just wanna see other people fall and dance on their grave.
Its not that we're nasty; Its just that some men find it highly annoying when a woman has her entire wedding planned including the honeymoon...before she meets the man. | |
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~Kyn~
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Joined: 2/15/2008
Msg: 117 | |
| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 2:56:17 PM | Its not that we're nasty; Its just that some men find it highly annoying when a woman has her entire wedding planned including the honeymoon...before she meets the man.
Honestly? so what?
For alot of women...thats her dream day...with her DREAM MAN...That'd be YOU if she loves you
I guess the real question is how much did the divorce cost? for message 114
Didnt cost a cent my friend...oh yes it did!...cost my ex hubby the price of the lunch we went out to after he picked me up on the way to court to finalise everything.
He offered by the way.
For as surprising as this may be...SOME people are capable of keeping things in perspective and not spout anger, dumbass comments or want to bask in nasty glee and hope for others misfortunes. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 4:49:45 PM | I think your ex-girlfriend took the promise ring, but for some reason still felt that you two weren't exclusive. My impression, and I could be wrong, is that she kept her options open and dated or at least kept looking at/thinking about other people. This is easier if you lived 45 minutes away from each other. Also, because of the fact that it seems that it was easy for you to not speak to each other for a couple of weeks.
Her phone might have been disconnected because she had already moved into another man's place and she didn't need a phone of her own.
She might have been hurt enough during your last argument to lie about another man asking her to marry her. Rejection makes people do crazy things. But she also might have been doing exactly the same thing with another man as with you during those 3 years, for perhaps much longer than 2 months. He was just the guy to ask first.
You can't have been with her for that long and not sensed that perhaps her commitment to you wasn't all that she was asking from you.
As for me, a ring matters. I would love a ring. It meant something when I got a promise ring at 17, but I wasn't sure what it meant. I wish we had communicated better at the time. I had no idea what it was supposed to mean. I was going off to college, and he was going to a different college. He never mentioned marriage, so I gave him the promise ring back when we went our separate ways, and said I wanted to be free to date other people (I was only 17!) Later he was so upset about it that his college roommate paid for my train ticket to go see him. I had no idea what to say to him. He was very depressed, but still never mentioned any kind of future with me, except that I got the idea he didn't like that I might be dating someone else.
I think that it is extremely romantic if you both are in love, and are talking about a future together, for the man to get down on his knees and ask you to marry him while holding a ring for you. My sister's boyfriend flew to Paris where she was an intern, and asked her to marry him on bended knee on top of the Eiffel Tower. (Yes, they are still married, and have 3 boys.) Sigh!
I think that it takes about 6 months to get to know someone enough to imagine marrying them, and all 4 seasons to really see most sides of their personality. An engagement means exclusivity while you go through one of the most difficult periods of marriage--planning a wedding together. If you can get through that, you are doing rather well. If any two people can agree on all those details, you've got something. An engagement means you have a year or so to try on the idea of being married by calling each other your "fiancee." However, you can still break up 2 minutes before saying "I do." (For all those who think an engagement is some kind of prison.)
An engagement states your intentions with someone. If you never intend on marrying someone, that is OK if the person you are with doesn't find that a problem. But if you are in love with someone who wants to be married someday, and you want that person to be YOU, then you take that into consideration, and formalize your intentions with them.
I think men often take liberties with a woman's feelings. I feel I have a right to know how much of a man's attentions are simply his appreciation of my physical form and youth, and how much of his attention will fade as my looks and youth fade.
A woman risks a lot having a man's baby. She can't give the same amount of attention to the man for a significant period of time after having a baby. In fact, not ever again will he have her undivided attention in the same way. (Unless you plan a "date night!")
So it pays to know that he is going to stick by her through PMS, pregnancy, morning sickness, a huge change to her figure, screaming in pain, night feedings, etc........
If she thinks you only like her for her cute, young figure and her smile, then she might think that as soon as she has a really stressful time, you will be gone, unless you go out of your way to show your love--even more than just promises, and talking about love--doing loving things (besides sex--we take sexual interest as a given,) acting on it, formalizing it. This is where complimenting a woman on her beauty can backfire. The more you say how cute she is, the more she worries that as soon as her looks change, you might leave for the next cute girl. They are making younger ones every day.
When I became engaged, everyone at the bank I worked in wanted to see the ring. Everyone Oooed and Ahhhed over it. (I was in 5 branches of a bank at the time--a lot of people.) I didn't even have to say anything. They saw it. They saw me. We were both glowing, that ring and I. I hope that someday the person you give a ring to--if you ever do decide to give a woman a ring--glows. If she is the right one, she will make the RING look good!
Even now, after having been married 14 years, and dating again, I would still like a ring from a man. I might even turn one down--or not! But if a man were to get down on his knees in front of me in a public place, in front of many other people, and pull out an expensive "symbol" -- if it was the right man, my heart would skip a beat. If it was the wrong man, I still would admire his courage!!
And no, it would not be to get an expensive piece of jewelry. I have gotten them as gifts before. You can get jewelry any day of the year. But not a piece of jewelry that marks a moment in time that was a turning point for both of you. And no, it would not be to put the ring through his nose figuratively. It would be a sign of a willingness to want to work things out, to take the time to plan ahead for our future--together. A willingness to even have HOPE for the future. Gosh, a man who has hope, is not jaded and cynical, and suspicious about love....... now that's a rare man these days.
This man could give me a $50. dollar ring, and we could have a ceremony in the pavillion in the park, with a picnic for our family and friends, and it would be lovely.
The "piece of paper" is always negotiable. Any contract is. You can have a pre-nup. You can write it on a paper airplane and fly it into the ocean. The important thing is to state your intentions, communicate your dreams, your vision of the future you might have together, be willing to make plans, and act on them cooperatively. You can do this in a shack, a houseboat, or a mansion. (But it would probably be a different woman in each one! Some women wouldn't agree to the shack or the boat.)
No one has a crystal ball. But no business ever got off the ground easily without a business plan. No partnership works well without discussion and boundaries and putting at least something down on paper.
Unless, of course, you want to have all the "control" and assume that no planning or cooperation is necessary, because you will simply dictate all the shots.
Or because you say to yourself, that it will either work without any planning, or not at all and you are gone.
Does a ring make a difference? You decide. Imagine the woman you are lovingly, happily married to someday. Picture sitting next to her, telling your children about the day you decided she was THE ONE. What are you telling them? ............. Did you write her name across the sky while she stood on the beach with tears in her eyes?
The woman that is worth that picture in your mind is the one you will do that for. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 5:01:44 PM | In all honesty, yes it would make a difference. Most likely after 3 years her friends, her parents, her aunts and uncles, cousins, old school mates, the deacon at the church were probably asking her on a daily basis... Haven't you set a date yet? or When ARE you two going to tie the knot? Perhaps every day one of her co workers would tease her or make a snide remark and she was dying of embarrassment every day that she wasn't "good enough" for you to want her. Peer pressure is what they call it and I have seen it happen with a few friends of mine when we were just out of high school. One friend ended up becoming very ill from the stress that family and friends were putting on her. Of course they were only asking out of kindness but to her it magnified the situation every day.
Perhaps she wanted that fairy tale wedding or maybe she just wanted the outward commitment for herself and her family but you have to admit, society does market to young women that fantasy just like they market to men the perfect "victoria secret" woman.
Someone asked if any women would marry someone after 2 months? I can say I did at 6 weeks after being divorced for 3 months and we were together for 17 years. We are still best of friends. Do I recommend doing that? No, but you better believe when it came time for our daughter to marry she used that against us. lol She knew him for 4 weeks and they are on their 4th year still going strong. So who is to say?
Good luck on your next ltr OP. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 7:03:56 PM | | Kyn, the OP said she was 21. She's got plenty of time for babies, and frankly, she needs to do some growing up herself before she tries to raise someone else! I sincerely hope she's got better sense than to have a baby with someone she's known and gotten engaged to in only two months, but I doubt she does, given the fact that, well, she met someone and got engaged to him in two months. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 7:13:31 PM |
Most likely after 3 years her friends, her parents, her aunts and uncles, cousins, old school mates, the deacon at the church were probably asking her on a daily basis... Haven't you set a date yet? or When ARE you two going to tie the knot? Perhaps every day one of her co workers would tease her or make a snide remark and she was dying of embarrassment every day that she wasn't "good enough" for you to want her. Peer pressure is what they call it and I have seen it happen with a few friends of mine when we were just out of high school. One friend ended up becoming very ill from the stress that family and friends were putting on her. Of course they were only asking out of kindness but to her it magnified the situation every day.
Yet another scenario where someone is too immature to get married. So you think the OP should have proposed before he was ready, financially or otherwise, just because she was too childish to handle the people who would question her relationship with him? Here's an answer to the question "when are you going to set a date?": "WHEN WE'RE READY." And then change the subject.
I see no reason to propose just so she can "save face" with the people she unfortunately surrounds herself with. NO one should be pressuring a 21 year old about marriage. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/16/2008 8:28:17 PM |
I see no reason to propose just so she can "save face" with the people she unfortunately surrounds herself with. NO one should be pressuring a 21 year old about marriage
OBX I don't think it was so much proposing to "save face" but the fact that she wanted to get married and he wouldn't commit to even an engagement and lets face it, relatives can be jerks. Remember you can pick your friends but you can't pick your family! I will say that back *coughs* years ago girls were still expected to get married right out of school. I married (my first husband) 5 months after graduating H.S. . Some people still expect girls to do that. My friends parents were very concerned that he had every intention of getting the proverbial milk for free and then discarding her when he got where he wanted to be financially etc. I think it is a legit parental concern in my book. I don't see many parents letting "WHEN WE"RE READY" deter them from continually asking.
What I am saying is, if the OP was really serious about the young lady he could have made the proposal, gave her the ring that meant so much to her, stated his concerns and TOGETHER they could have worked out a financial plan and time line. Compromise, a plan is MUCH better then being left to hang blowing in the wind IMHO. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/18/2008 1:02:45 PM | I think you dodged a bullet here my friend. Your ex was obviously only thinking about what SHE wanted without showing too much concern for your needs.
If you explained to her that you wanted to focus on your career while still staying in the relationship in order to build a better future for both of you and that STILL wasn't enough for her then I say you're better off without her.
And I'd bet good money that her and her new "fiance" won't make it past a year.
Good luck to you | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/18/2008 4:50:32 PM | I married (my first husband) 5 months after graduating H.S. .
How did that work out for ya?
Some people still expect girls to do that.
They need to get over it and join the rest of us in the 21'st century. It's still not a good enough reason to get married before you are ready, before you can support yourselves financially without going into debt.
My friends parents were very concerned that he had every intention of getting the proverbial milk for free and then discarding her when he got where he wanted to be financially etc. I think it is a legit parental concern in my book.
In my book it's really none of the parents business. She's 21, not 15, and can make her own decisions. If her parents want something to be concerned about, there's always the fact that she's jumped into an "engagement" with someone she's known for 2 months!
I don't see many parents letting "WHEN WE"RE READY" deter them from continually asking.
Again, who cares if they do keep asking? Them continually asking wouldn't deter ME from continually ANSWERING, "When We're Ready."
What I am saying is, if the OP was really serious about the young lady he could have made the proposal, gave her the ring that meant so much to her...
Ah yes, back to the ring. Which is what this is all about anyway, right? What if he'd proposed to her, but told her he couldn't afford a ring just yet? What if he said, "I want us to be engaged, let's set a date...I just can't get you the ring yet, but I am saving for it now and you will have it as soon as I can get it for you." I wonder what her reaction would be to that? Something tells me she'd be right where she is now, with the guy who could afford to give her the bling she wanted. Again, for her, this is about the sparkly thing, not the commitment. He'd already given her a promise ring, which is a sign of a commitment. It means he's committed to her until he can give her a "real" proposal and ring. It just wasn't big and sparkly enough. | |
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| Does a ring make a difference?
Posted: 6/18/2008 7:35:32 PM | I don't see it as the girl wanted a date set for the wedding - she wanted the ring as a tangible commitment from the OP. If she'd already waited for 3 yrs, she may have been willing to wait a bit longer for him - just wanted that one little thing (ring).
Was she pressuring for a date or a super expensive ring?
Either way. You sound like it happened for the best for you, and it may have for her as well. Wish her well, and carry on with your own. | |
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