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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/16/2008 5:38:45 PM | Contary to belief ` I feel men have a harder time being independent. ~ Women carry the major load in home life and the business world as well ~ has been my observation.
~ A man might be receiving the credit but a woman is behind it somewhere (ofcoarse this don't apply to us manly men, plumbers, mariners, and the like) but ~ Without women working as hard as they do ~ life would be "no" fun! They like this co-dependency thing. ~ Their magic is ~ making you think that it's your idea and they are very good at it!
The thing with many women is ~ they want you there! ~ and if you are not "there" you are somewhere else! ~They figure messing around and getting into things!
I like to watch man TV programs and Man movies in my shorts! I might make big mess and leave them for days ~ I'm not screwing around ~ just enjoying a little quality time ~ picking my nose. When I'm tired of being independent and need a little Co dependency and the sweet sound of your footsteps ~ I know you are not far ~~
Dance | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/16/2008 5:50:51 PM | Oh for cripes sake! WHY are all the melt-worthy men someplace like freakin' Ontario or Texas?! ;)
OK State of Misery men...take some lessons from DanceCard!  | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 4:53:26 AM | HarleyKat,
What's your favorite color? Oh wait, let me guess, if you shared that it would show weakness. Why does this thread rile you so?
Greg | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 5:45:16 AM | you're assuming that everyone veiws this site as " a dating site to meet people where we think depending on each other to traverse this journey called life is a plus?"
I don't feel that depending on anyone is a plus nor do I feel I'm looking for someone to 'depend' on to "traverse this journey of life". | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 9:55:49 AM | only going on holidays with your pals or only doing something if someone else does it = dependant
having the confidence to go out and do what you want when you want = independant
some people are only able to do stuff if they have their hand held, others can do things without being dependant on others being there or having support off others.
i travelled round the world by myself and im off to paris by myself later this month too so i would class myself as independent
being independent doesnt mean you stop looking for intimacy, love and companionship
it just means that when required, youve got the grapes to do things by yourself | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 12:00:29 PM | I am here, and I am 'independent'. Now, ones interpretation of 'independent' can be different than anothers. I like to do most things for myself, and do my best to do things by myself, but on occasion one does need help in an aspect of their 'life'. Mine, is in the 'companion' category. I don't want to change as a person, and change to become someone I am not, lose my 'independence'. I would like to enhance my life, not change it. I am using this to try something that could possibly 'help'. In this regard, I would like to have a 'companion'. Wanting to be with 'someone else', is that such an 'independent' thing?!   | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 1:18:05 PM | As to the OP's question - I can only speak for myself. I am an independent lady and quite happy with it. Would I still like to meet someone to go out with? -Yes.
Do I want to be married again or live with somebody? - Not necessarily. As I state in my profile a man in my life is not a necessity, but would be a welcome luxury.
I am saying - I can take care of myself. I do not "need" anyone to take care of me. Men say they do not want someone looking to support them, when they meet one, they then say they want a woman who "needs them". One could ask what's up with those statements from men. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 3:12:16 PM | Naturally you will GROW to need the person you initially WANT as time goes on.
Why...this sounds like someone who will NEED a man, eventually...uh oh!
Sweethang100, i think you're hitting the nail on the head.
Although it is a generalization, the original OP question was what do women mean when they tout the word "independent".... and i think when we men read it, we see those woman as the ones you described in your posts....so we steer clear.
This is exactly what I'm talking about! See...women really aren't "independent", as the word is used here.
Personally, I think, that many women are following the typical trend, because most of them think that all men want someone INDEPENDENT. I also believe that most of the women claim it, because everyone else says it.
So, a word to the wise, for those that say it: Based on all the men I've spoken to on this site (and believe me when I say that I've spoken to thousands)...I would say that almost all the men I've spoken to have said that they wanted someone to need them as much as they need the woman!
In fact, I think most men want to be needed, as much as most women want to be needed by men, regardless of what they claim here.
Most don't want to go alone to places, and that's why many are here. Most don't want to cook alone, and that's why they're here. Most don't want to pay bills alone, and again, that's why many are here. Most don't want to do any of those lovely things that most people are forced to do when they're alone, just because they have to when they're single. No, that's why they're here, seeking someone to do those things with, because it's more fun to do them when you're in a relationship with someone. Hence, that's why many are here. Oh, and have any of you tried to have sex alone? Hmm..that would be interesting, eh? hehe
That's not to say, most can't...just that most don't want to. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 4:45:30 PM | Why...this sounds like someone who will NEED a man, eventually...uh oh!
Over time, it's part of a healthy relationship (if that's where you end up). Do I walk around advertising it as something I must have in order to date someone? No. Do I want to hear someone I'm considering dating throw it at me as something I must adhere to? Nope. I mentioned that after the quote you posted...but you didn't include it. That was my point...
Also - not needing people in general and not needing specifically someone you're involved with for a long time are two different statements. Therefore "I don't need a man" or "I don't need anyone" is quite different from "I don't need THAT man" or "THAT person"...it's not personal...if someone says that to you specifically (especially if you are azz-deep in a relationship with them - then YES, take offense and question your relationship).
I have friends and (some) family that over the years became a need in my life, and vice versa...but it's an AFTER EFFECT of knowing someone and being a part of their lives for years..we're talking 2, 5, 10, 20 years....I mean that's only natural.
I also don't flinch as much over time in a LTR if I hear someone say that to me either...with my ex, I actually didn't react at all after a couple years. I don't think a person should avoid needing someone emotionally EVER, but they should realize that it's gonna happen anyway if you are with them long enough (or should).
I have more of a supplemental view of relationships...it may add a nice bonus to my life...and eventually even become part of it - but being alone for me never stops me from doing much - I don't mind going to places with someone if I can meet em there and leave when I want. And you don't even have to have sex alone - but you also don't have to cook em breakfast either.
I don't know the older I get the less I want to live by anyone else's schedule at all...I kind of like doing things only when I am in the mood to - unless of course they're cutting me a check for it. Hell, I won't go to the grocery store for more than a week if I'm not in the mood to go - and I don't have to explain it to anyone. Naturally I do what I have to do when serious things I can't control pop up - but for the most part anything that involves me in any way, I want final say on it if at all possible. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 5:06:02 PM | Hello Maculon,
I hope I can explain a little better to you what "independent women" means. First, I would like to state that a lot of men say that they are seeking an "independent" women, but I don't think they know what it truly means as well.
Simply put, it means I don't need you. In text form that sounds completely cold and callus. Without further explanation I can understand why you have questions. The follow up to the " I don't need you" is simple. This would mean that she is a self sustaining woman who can and does take care of herself in her daily living situation. This is the part where it gets a lot better for you:) If an independent woman has an interest in you, then in most cases it's a genuine interest in the person you are and not in how well you can take care of her basic daily needs. This is NOT to say that she does not need you to or want you to take care of her needs as a woman. I personally would prefer to be wanted than needed. To put it even more simply; She has chosen you because she sees a quality in you that makes her "want" to be with you. She may still need you to tell her that she's pretty, fun, loving , etc... She wants you in her life to complete her in way that only a companion can do. I hope this helped you:)
**Donna | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 6:34:07 PM | (LadyLock252) Simply put, it means I don't need you. In text form that sounds completely cold and callus. Without further explanation I can understand why you have questions. The follow up to the " I don't need you" is simple.
Uhm, yah.
You know, I understand and appreciate your motivation... BUT...
No man with ANY integrity and a spine is going to stick around for your "explanation" after you pull the "I don't need you!" garbage on him. The thing that a lot of women don't seem to realize is, YOU CATCH MORE FLIES WITH HONEY THAN VINEGAR. Saying "I don't need you!" is ATTITUDINAL CRAP, and no matter how much perfume you pour on crap, it's still crap.
In another thread, a woman is decrying (rightly, IMHANHO) lack of tact in speaking, and suggesting that women generally exercise more tact when speaking than men do. So, why do so many women insist on being so rudely blunt right out of the gate? Who are you trying to impress? I'll let all y'all in on something, and never mind that the Man Hive-Mind revoked my Group-Speak privileges: NO man is impressed by the "I don't need you!" assertion. It ALWAYS comes across as whiny, shrieky, and EXTREMELY unpleasant, no matter WHAT you follow it up with.
Some things don't NEED to be said, ya know.
Arlo  | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 10:33:23 PM | | It means I have a great job, own my house, pay my bills on time. I'm not looking for a man to take care of me financially but to be there for me emotionally. I'm independent. Maybe independAnt means something different. lol | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 11:03:59 PM | Arlo Troutman,
Many men run for outer space when they hear the L word or admission of fondness or expectation/hope/desire to be with them. What's that? I have asked for probably 3 favors in my life from a guy--like a ride home from work, or I'm locked out of my house, or I have a cement patio furniture piece that needs moving. They run for outerspace in those cases, too. So, I've learned to put in my own cast iron sink and put up my own fence, post holes and all, no assistance. Even got the steaks on the grill when they walk up to the door...wait, I never trust 'em to show up until they're actually HERE. Is that independent or simply PTSD kicking in? | |
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| If you're independent, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 11:04:43 PM | Arlo Troutman,
Many men run for outer space when they hear the L word or admission of fondness or expectation/hope/desire to be with them. What's that? I have asked for probably 3 favors in my life from a guy--like a ride home from work, or I'm locked out of my house, or I have a cement patio furniture piece that needs moving. They run for outerspace in those cases, too. So, I've learned to put in my own cast iron sink and put up my own fence, post holes and all, no assistance. Even got the steaks on the grill when they walk up to the door...wait, I never trust 'em to show up until they're actually HERE. Is that independent or simply PTSD kicking in? | |
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| If you're independent, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 12:20:50 AM | If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 5:06:02 PM
Hello Maculon,
I hope I can explain a little better to you what "independent women" means. First, I would like to state that a lot of men say that they are seeking an "independent" women, but I don't think they know what it truly means as well.
Simply put, it means I don't need you. In text form that sounds completely cold and callus. Without further explanation I can understand why you have questions. The follow up to the " I don't need you" is simple. This would mean that she is a self sustaining woman who can and does take care of herself in her daily living situation. This is the part where it gets a lot better for you:) If an independent woman has an interest in you, then in most cases it's a genuine interest in the person you are and not in how well you can take care of her basic daily needs. This is NOT to say that she does not need you to or want you to take care of her needs as a woman. I personally would prefer to be wanted than needed. To put it even more simply; She has chosen you because she sees a quality in you that makes her "want" to be with you. She may still need you to tell her that she's pretty, fun, loving , etc... She wants you in her life to complete her in way that only a companion can do. I hope this helped you:)
**Donna
So, essentially you're saying that you want someone to take care of you SEXUALLY, only? Umm...wouldn't you be better off just waiting for marriage? Personally, I want to be both wanted and needed! You say you don't need the person, yet, when you get into a relationship...both parties SHOULD NEED each other! Sooner or later, you're going to feel that need, anyway, aren't you? If you still NEED the person to tell you that you're pretty, etc...well, you make it sound like you have an insecurity problem. Personally, I can look in the mirror and say, you look pretty good, and I DON'T NEED someone to tell me that! I can ask myself if I'm fun too. So, WHAT do you REALLY NEED A MAN FOR; to tell you that you're all that? Hmm...that's very scary!
Arlo Troutman Joined: 3/23/2008 Msg: 262 view profile History If you're independant, why R U here? Posted: 6/17/2008 6  07 PM (LadyLock252) Simply put, it means I don't need you. In text form that sounds completely cold and callus. Without further explanation I can understand why you have questions. The follow up to the " I don't need you" is simple. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Uhm, yah. You know, I understand and appreciate your motivation... BUT... No man with ANY integrity and a spine is going to stick around for your "explanation" after you pull the "I don't need you!" garbage on him. The thing that a lot of women don't seem to realize is, YOU CATCH MORE FLIES WITH HONEY THAN VINEGAR. Saying "I don't need you!" is ATTITUDINAL CRAP, and no matter how much perfume you pour on crap, it's still crap. In another thread, a woman is decrying (rightly, IMHANHO) lack of tact in speaking, and suggesting that women generally exercise more tact when speaking than men do. So, why do so many women insist on being so rudely blunt right out of the gate? Who are you trying to impress? I'll let all y'all in on something, and never mind that the Man Hive-Mind revoked my Group-Speak privileges: NO man is impressed by the "I don't need you!" assertion. It ALWAYS comes across as whiny, shrieky, and EXTREMELY unpleasant, no matter WHAT you follow it up with. Some things don't NEED to be said, ya know. Arlo
No kidding...I mean, ladies, come on...I DON'T NEED YOU garbage is just that. YOU DON'T NEED ANY MAN? Yeah, ok, we'll go with that, for now. But, you're here why; because you're seeking a guy? Now, that is about as conflicting as it gets! Talk about mixed signals. Notice, I didn't say any ol' guy...just someone special that understands the things and emotions you NEED in a relationship...or, is it all an act?
curlygirly25 Joined: 4/20/2008 Msg: 263 view profile History If you're independant, why R U here? Posted: 6/17/2008 10  23 PM It means I have a great job, own my house, pay my bills on time. I'm not looking for a man to take care of me financially but to be there for me emotionally. I'm independent. Maybe independAnt means something different. lol
So, what you're saying to the guys, then, is this: Don't pay for my meals, and I'll pay my own bills, and if you want a piece, great! Hey, I'm sure many of them will be happy to get a piece for nothing. Keep offering yourself that way. Don't they have a name for that? j/k I noticed you want them to be there for you emotionally. Isn't that a need?
Translation
Joined: 5/12/2008 Msg: 264 view profile History If you're independant, why R U here? Posted: 6/17/2008 10  55 PM It could be a car racing emblem.
Maybe I'll create one that everyone can stick on their car. ;) Then, when they become all upset because the guy they're dating won't take them serious, again (which makes them look mighty needy), they can reread it, hehe.
yoodle
Joined: 9/30/2006
Msg: 265
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History
If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/17/2008 11:03:59 PM
Arlo Troutman,
Many men run for outer space when they hear the L word or admission of fondness or expectation/hope/desire to be with them. What's that? I have asked for probably 3 favors in my life from a guy--like a ride home from work, or I'm locked out of my house, or I have a cement patio furniture piece that needs moving. They run for outerspace in those cases, too.
So, I've learned to put in my own cast iron sink and put up my own fence, post holes and all, no assistance. Even got the steaks on the grill when they walk up to the door...wait, I never trust 'em to show up until they're actually HERE. Is that independent or simply PTSD kicking in?
So, you meet guys who are losers and you think that is the way most men are? That does sound like PTSD kicking in. Might I suggest some additional hormones for that problem? hehe...j/k
No, honestly, I've had friends who were guys that put in sinks for me, and helped me move furniture, and even male friends and ex's., who have helped me out financially.
That doesn't mean all men are like the ones you described, just the ones you're hanging out with.
Of course, if you continually hang out with men like that, those types will continue to treat you the same way. They MIGHT not show up, they might not make the steaks for you, they might not pick up something at the store for you, or help you move furniture, or carry your purse for you, or what have you.
If they run for the hills...well, that's the type you are setting yourself up to be with. I won't let those types come within 10 feet of me, much less be romantically involved with me. To me, those guys are nothing but users.
No wonder you want to be independent. It's not that you WANT to be, you HAVE TO BE with those types.
Of course, they would run for the hills, if that's the case. Lose the losers and you won't have to fix your doors, your sinks, etc. There are REAL MEN that exist, believe it or not.
And REAL MEN don't mind doing those things for a lady. They actually ENJOY helping, showing up on time, showing up (at all), and being there for their lady love, in all situations.
If he doesn't...lose him, because he's NOT A REAL MAN; he's just a head game player out for a cheap lay.
If he runs for the hills when you say, "I love you", he's got some serious emotional issues. So, why would you want him? Good riddance to those that run. | |
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| If you're independent, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 4:54:15 AM | | I would consider myself independent in that I have don't need a man to help me out in my daily living. I have a career that I love which pays me well enough to cover the bills and do the things I want. I can change the tire on my car, book it in for service when it needs to go in, mow the lawn, use a weedwacker, change a fuse and kill a spider. So I don't NEED a man (in what would be considered a 1950's notion) and I would like to find a man who doesn't NEED me. To share my day, to hold, to laugh with...to love. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 4:56:17 AM |
(yoodle) Arlo Troutman,
Many men run for outer space when they hear the L word or admission of fondness or expectation/hope/desire to be with them.
Perhaps true, but TOTALLY IRRELEVANT. Just answer the fookin' question: WHAT do you hope to accomplish with the "need/want" crap? Men have TOLD women over, and over... and OVER... that's it's nakedly aggressive, and yet most women STILL insist on nit-picking it to death, and telling us that it doesn't mean what we think it means, and that we're morons for being put off by it.
Don't piss on my boot and tell me it's raining. You either CAN'T hear what men are saying, or you WON'T hear what men are saying. Either way, even a man with the patience of Job is gonna get tired of having to explain something so basic over and over... and OVER... again.
Time to get out of Dodge. Adios, muchachas.
Arlo | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 5:42:41 AM | The healthy, average american woman is independent and can take care of the kids, house , laundry, pull a 40 hour work week ~ tend to the ageing and ill ~ make it to Sunday moring service , feed the horses ~ and buy grocerys ~ she just needs us a around to open jams and ride the pony ~
You have over valued yourself if you think otherwise.
It's not a matter of need ` but one of desire ~ she'd desire it to be different
Dance | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 7:09:05 AM | OK...I would not go as far as Dancecard did ^^ up there...lol...I WANT a man for more than to open jars and ride the pony! LOL
I guess the reason this is such a heated debate, is that we as women get approached by men on a regular basis who tell us how they have so much to offer in the means of support that have NADA to do with what we are searching for.
My last relationship...my God...we were so freakin' compatible and awesome together. When we first met, he asked me, "If we get to the point of living together, would you be willing to work only part time?" That was HIS need to be the provider, which goes against MY need to be self sufficient.
I have merged households with someone who of course, at the time I thought it could be "forever." His had the bigger home and we each had four children (though 1 of mine was already on his own)...so it was the logical thing to merge to HIS house. I rented out my home, got rid of a lot of things we did not need two of, and used the cash for things we did need or want. When it did end (and the reasons are not relevant) it was almost as if I had to start over...except that I had my home to return to...I did have to buy all of those things that were gotten rid of.
Of course I could have played it safe and NOT sold things off...but when you are in the mentality that it will be "forever"...you don't think anything else. It's the same reason why I would not think of a pre-nup, though I have nothing against them.
My point is...and I have not finished my initial cup of java, so bare with me!! LOL...my point is, I am INDEPENDENT because I WANT to work full time, I WANT to work as opposed to having someone care for me....I WANT to have my own things and not rely upon someone else to provide them or "ok" their purchases....I WANT to have my own cash for my own emergencies...I WANT to make my own decisions about my life without having to consult someone else....and I DON'T WANT to take away from someone elses desires to WANT these same things.
But I also WANT companionship, intellectual conversations, company, someone to grow old with, etc...I guess when it gets down to it...INDEPENDENCE simply means that you are bringing things to the table, just as he is...PHYSICAL things... | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 7:23:56 AM | Greg...what would that have to do with the topic at hand?? (Wouldn't wanna break any forum rules, yanno?! I was in Banned Camp once or twice before...did not like it!)
But actually...I would have to say that I couldn't write them at this time, because if I were getting married, my vows would be based on that INDIVIDUAL that I was marrying...and I could not possibly summon up such NOW, without knowing the individual to who I was vowing to! Sorry! ;O) | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/18/2008 8:56:11 AM | OK...maybe I am having a blonde moment...but how?! LOL
Were you expecting that I would cite a bunch of vows which kill the whole concept of Independence, such as "love, honor, obey?"
Actually I could love and honor someone and retain my independence...and I never agreed with the whole "obey" thing, anyway! LOL
OK...thinking of someone who I might have married...lol...I would have vowed to remain his friend and partner in crime...to cherish the happy moments as much as the lessons learned from the sad ones...to never lose hope in times of hardship, illness, or woe...to be faithful in mind, body, and spirit....
Is that enough for ya' to make whatever point you are hoping to make? LOL Cause I thinks me needs a Xanax now! ;) | |
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