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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 6:22:49 PM | | I believe what women mean by stating they are independent is that,they are not after a man because of what they financially possess,they have their life together and take care of themselves,they have a good job and have no problems supporting themselves,they have self respect,they feel that they've reached maturity and make wiser choices,they do not have an extreme insecurity of being alone,but,would rather have a partner to compliment and share their life with.Now I don't know if all women that claim they're independent follow all of the reasons stated above,but,that would be my definition of a completely independent woman that I myself am looking forward to being one day. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 6:24:37 PM | In an ideal life, a person starts off as dependent (on parents), becomes independent (on their own), and then is able to progress to interdependence. An interdependent person is much more suitable and open to a relationship than an independent person.
Some people may feel that needing others is a sign of weakness, but with interdependence, the essence is really about working with a partner (or team) toward a common goal. It's empowering and it's a choice born of strengths and respect. Interdependence is wanting the best for others …valuing, trusting and cherishing their unique abilities, while still being secure about your own. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 6:33:35 PM | | I think this question is one of the easiest Ive ever seen on here to answer! I'm independent, happy on my own and depend on no one for anything. However I'd like to share my life and when in a relationship I can compromise and let that person in. I dont need to be validated by someone else but do have room in my life to be with someone and as an equal x | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 6:48:55 PM |
...are you that much of a spineless wimp?
There we go. Nicely played. Bravo. The assumptions you make are typical and typically do not even come close to the mark.
If you'd like to know something about my situation ask. If you'd like me to post the definition of the word 'independent' ask, I'd be happy to post that. If you need an blurb on the difference between 'self-reliant' and 'independence' lemme know.
I'm always happy to educate the thick. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 7:46:26 PM |
(FullLifeWithKids) Too many men want little girls to dominate, or control.
Frankly, how would you know what "too many", or even "some", men want or don't want? You're not one, so it's a supposition at best.
By putting independant in the profile is a way of trying to let them know to move on.
Yeah, well... maybe more people should LISTEN to how others are PERCEIVING what they're saying, instead of sticking their fingers in their ears and saying, "Nyah-nyah-nyah!"
Arlo | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 8:45:34 PM | I personally don't give a damn how people are 'perceiving' me, and far less how some men do. Those who see my profile and can read more than ONE WORD, and resonate to something I wrote will respond as they see fit. I don't have the time nor inclination to censor myself to coddle peoples biases.
I like the word independence because I was NOT raised to be independent, not really. I was given messages my whole childhood and young adulthood that at some point if I wanted a REAL life I was going to have to get married and lean on some guy. I have also had the experience of being with a guy or two who didn't really think I COULD be independent, not because of what I was or wasn't doing, but because THEY were raised to believe that about women. I don't care what some of you men here think... this is still a part of our culture.. though it's dying fast, thank the goddess.
It took a whole lot of courage and hard work to become independent.. truly self-reliant. Not just because of the outside world but because of my own background and messages from society. Good grief, I'm 42 and about 10 years ago my bank asked where my 'husband' was when I went in to talk about a mortgage, and did I have his approval. (I have never used "mrs." not once) Needless to say they lost my patronage.
I have seen tons of threads about gold-diggers, and women who just date for a free meal, or "Are they after my money?: threads (maybe I would be if you actually HAD any...lol) and women who won't go dutch, or who ask what a guys occupation is or how much they make..etc..ad nauseum, or how to avoid splitting assets after a divorce... and on and on.
Men don't use the word because they are expected to be independent from childhood.. women are not.. not really. It's still something we CHOOSE to be, because there still is an alternative ^^^^ umm.. the above threads prove that. So yes, it is a matter of pride.. and in no way am I going to let some bitter, condescending and obviously unsympathetic jackasses take away my very real success and pride of accomplishment because they can't see anything besides their own narrow little point of view.
I have something to offer (other than my womb and subservience)... and I EARNED it. I didn't HAVE to ( I could have found some more old-fashioned guy and been his baby maker and personal servant.. which is what it would have been for me, some women can find fulfillment in that role, I'm not one of them), I CHOSE to live without a safety net, I CHOSE not to use my sexuality as a bargaining chip to make my life a little easier, and I accept all the rights and responsibilities of those choices.. and THAT is a fairly new thing in the world of women in the West. Damn right I'm proud of it. I've had many opportunities to trade on my being female for security, money, things, whatever... it's almost TOO EASY. So when a woman says independent please keep that in mind.. there are alternatives and it takes a woman of a certain integrity to stand on her own without taking advantage of this reality.
So quit trying to negate it, or devalue it. ver the years.
When my man gets ill, or needs a hand, I can actually BE THERE for him, instead of being a damn burden, I can actually be his mate, his partner, I have his back. My children can look up to me as a self-actualized person.. and not a personal scullery maid or breeding machine. I can contribute emotionally, intellectually, financially and in many other ways to a relationship. And my guy KNOWS that I am there because I truly wish to be with him... and not because I have no other choice. And I didn't have to be a whore to accomplish this, not even in marriage.
So I think I'll use the word independent.. I like it..I earned it. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 9:07:41 PM | Great post Ravenstar, speaking for all of us And for the nice and intelligent guys out there,thank you for being respectful about this topic  | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 9:31:39 PM | come on, what it means is they have a job, they wont be calling you thirty times a day saying "tell me I am pretty" or "when are you coming home"? They have a life, friends, interests and pay for the things they buy or want to buy.
It is a good thing... guys should not want a woman that has no job, no car, no place to live, no friends, no money, no hobbies and is looking for a man to "complete" them.
So, it is important, should be resepected and what they are really saying is that they have their **** together...
Better Late | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 9:32:36 PM |
i personally want a guy who can fork out some money and make my life easier, because the ones who don't/won't are self centered stingy **stards, not worth my time or trouble.
^^^ Whoa! You had me on your side from your previous post until you came out with this little nugget!
So you think a bloke should spend money on you and pay some of your bills when you're dating him just because he makes more money than you? Your profile says you're a delivery driver with no kids, so I assume it's just you we're talking about?
It's nobody else's fault you don't make the money you need to live the way you like, and it certainly wouldn't be MY problem if I started dating you. There are plenty of opportunities in the US to better yourself and learn new skills to get a better-paying job.
the ones who don't/won't are self centered stingy **stards, not worth my time or trouble.
^^^ I just had to repeat that line. The one's who won't are dating much classier broads than you lady! You just set the sisterhood back 30 years!
So, just because someone dates you it doesn't mean they're responsible for your bills. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 9:33:22 PM | Greg - the definition of "independent" is self-governance, self-determination, autonomy/self-rule....freedom.....
I am not sure what your second half of the question means....being in a relationship does not equal loss of the above (a healthy one anyway). I look at dependence as the root word of "independence" and the opposite something a little different. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 10:11:25 PM | Ya know, I have read all the comments on here and I want to share something; When I first started dating "back in the day", I made the mistake of telling a really nice guy that I didn't "need" him. I told him I wanted him but didn't "need" him. Now, I have matured and realized everyone wants to be NEEDED! I can cook , do laundry, clean house, raise children (all grown now), mow the lawn, rake the yard, plant a garden, change my oil, rotate my tires, tape and sand drywall, paint, lay carpet (not very well) but have found I enjoy doing all those things WITH someone else. And just because I CAN do these things, doesn't mean I wouldn't let a man or even ask a man to do them for me if there was one available. In fact, I recently met a gentleman that flat out told me he WANTS to be needed and depended on. Well, I can do that! I would much rather be the nurturer and spoil a man that would do these trivial things for me or with me than one that would tell me "you're so INDEPENDENT, do it yourself"
And the guys are right, it is a FEMALE word because guys have been raised to be the caretakers and providers. When they can't, they are looked upon as lowlifes and worthless. Guys are expected to be independent. Women are supposed to be the nesters.
The women are right as well though because too many men get it into their heads women (especially ones with kids) are looking for a meal ticket! Perhaps they assume the father isn't paying support because they didn't or knew guys that wouldn't. My ex never paid "child support" as such. I didn't ask for it. But he did buy school clothes, shoes, toys, Christmas, birthdays, and even assisted with my bills if I ever got in a bind. But for the most part, I am/was independent. Now, kids are grown, I live alone and, hey, if some nice guy wants me to "depend" on him, I'm ready! lol Nothing holdin' me here so he can sweep me off my feet! lol Seriously though, it was interesting to read everyone's true thoughts on the subject. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 10:20:12 PM | msg 56 - good post Morag
Interdependence is the key to a successful life as far as I'm concerned. I like what Stephen Covey said about it...
Independent thinking alone is not suited to interdependent reality. Independent people who do not have the maturity to think and act interdependently may be good individual producers, but they won't be good leaders or team players. They're not coming from the paradigm of interdependence necessary to succeed in marriage, family, or organizational reality.
--Stephen Covey | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 10:30:41 PM | Holy crappers Plaful, you sound like an amazing woman. A woman that is capable and can do is very attractive, and knowing when to back off the reins is also. I think that women look for the same in a man.
I had a girlfriend once that told me that she didn’t need me, but she wanted me. I didn’t really even absorb the second part of that. The words ‘I don’t need you’ was like getting hit by a bus moving at top speed while I wasn’t looking. I was in love with that woman and I did feel like an instant failure. I knew what she was saying, but that didn’t stop that heart sunk feeling.
I do look for a woman that is capable and can hold her own, and if needed I would even be a househusband. Why not? But many women do have an insistence on proving their independence, which does cause a wedge effect on a relationship. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/10/2008 10:47:33 PM | capitano blaugh, No one male or female is entirely independent nor do we exist to be alone. Everybody needs everybody in one way or another. You needed your mother and father when you were young. Your boss needed you to work for the company and you needed the boss's help so you would get paid. Or even if you own your own business you are entirely dependent of your customers.And right now you need someone to talk to to get your opinions across lol! Ravenstar had expressed her words of wisdom very well and I was thinking the same along with others that felt the same way. I always speak for myself obviously lol! and I have when I made that last comment. But sometimes I can be tactless along with other people that are and can be taken the wrong way. Ravenstar has a gift with her clear expressions and words. What she said a lot of people would agree with. Doesn't mean we don't have minds of our own. We are just on the same wave length. Do you understand now or shall I make it a little more clearer for you? | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/11/2008 12:58:43 AM |
i personally want a guy who can fork out some money and make my life easier, because the ones who don't/won't are self centered stingy **stards, not worth my time or trouble.
^^^ Whoa! You had me on your side from your previous post until you came out with this little nugget!
So you think a bloke should spend money on you and pay some of your bills when you're dating him just because he makes more money than you? Your profile says you're a delivery driver with no kids, so I assume it's just you we're talking about?
It's nobody else's fault you don't make the money you need to live the way you like, and it certainly wouldn't be MY problem if I started dating you. There are plenty of opportunities in the US to better yourself and learn new skills to get a better-paying job.
the ones who don't/won't are self centered stingy **stards, not worth my time or trouble.
^^^ I just had to repeat that line. The one's who won't are dating much classier broads than you lady! You just set the sisterhood back 30 years!
So, just because someone dates you it doesn't mean they're responsible for your bills.
i had to do a shocked double take at them quotes....and agree fully with sydneymale
you know if you dating someone, you can argue about who pays for the drinks, or the meal, but bills? are you kidding? | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/11/2008 1:48:31 AM |
i had to do a shocked double take at them quotes....and agree fully with sydneymale
Meeooww Kitten! lol
Nice tatts too! (and I did say 'tatts') | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/11/2008 2:09:54 AM | well, i am 100% independant. so many women out there are so damn needy and feel that they NEED a man in their lives. there are even women out there who can't live completely on their own (bills, car, rent) without the assistance of a man. for me, it's a HUGE part of who i am and i'm very proud of that fact because it did take a lot of hard work and determination to be completely self sufficient. when i go on a date, i pay for my damn self and i don't re-arrange my schedule or cut my bills short just for a guy. i put myself first, not a man.
also, some men are turned off by this so i put it out there so that if they are interested they know what they are getting into. hate to break this to you, but a lot of men like the feeling that they are in charge and/or prefer to pay for everything in order for a woman to be obligated to give back (in many forms). i've seen many profiles where men have stated they want a woman who is independant as well.
i looked at your profile and you state that you wouldn't embarass someone in public...does that mean you used to? is that not a given that you shouldn't embarass a woman in front of her peers? or by the statement that when you are in a relationship, you are committed to your partner...is that not also a given?
here's a question for you...what's it to you? do you find independant women intimidating or something? and since when did being independant become a bad thing? | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/11/2008 3:01:29 AM | Being "INDEPENDANT" in a relationship means that I am self-sufficient, and self-reliant. I don't need a man to solve all my problems, most of the time I have answers to situations and all I truely need is a listener. I don't need a man to "take care" of any/all ex-partners for me, I get tired of hearing "if I ever meet your ex some where", while he treats me worse than the last one did, and again, all I truely need is a listener, I don't need a man to take control of my life--as if I do not know how to do all this myself.
I grew up and I am an adult now. I can feed myself and walk and talk all on my own.
I want a companion in my life, someone who knows how to talk about feelings--other than anger. I want someone in my life that I can talk to about anything I want and know that he may not understand everything I say but is willing to listen none the less.
A man and a woman can quite comfortably be independant as well as dependant on each other in a relationship. I am independant and also dependable, but not interferring where I was not asked to go.
Hope this answers your question. | |
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| If you're independant, why R U here?
Posted: 6/11/2008 7:20:31 AM |
Do you understand now or shall I make it a little more clearer for you?
Please, continue. I'm depending on your superior knowledge stemming from a life independent of all others. I need and want you to enlighten me.
(By the way.... I have NEVER made any claim about my 'independence'. I have no need to make such a silly claim. I believe in personal responsibility, I am self-reliant and, like others, subscribe to the belief that I am interdependent WITH others rather than independent FROM them)
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