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| | The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being AbusedPage 11 of 14 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14) |
Sorry Original Poster - but enough was enough, IMO.
It's cool Angelheart... Many of us have already agreed that there is more than one path to healing where a person truly wants and needs to heal. I simply don't think that is the case where "higher consciousness" equals "no conscience" but I am only one...
Anyway, getting back to the PURPOSE OF THIS THREAD... ahem... (sorry, had to clear my throat...  ), I read an awesome article today on self-forgiveness... The very first sentence gave me an epiphany... It read, "Oftentimes, we have to forgive ourselves for not forgiving ourselves." Man, that walloped me upside my head!!!
For me, that goes to the heart of my struggles with the constant question I always seemed to be dealing with... Was I doing the right thing??? What would happen if I just left? Could I live with myself if he actually hurt my grandson? Did I have options I failed to take into account? Was I letting fear rather than reality control me? I had a ton of questions and never any answers. And somewhere, in the fog of emotions, I just got lost. I became angry because so much of the time, I just didn't know what the hell to do and that anger was toward me. I have high expectations of myself and I don't think I had more than 4 seconds in 6 years when I felt I wasn't bending my own values into a pretzel.
So here I am now... trying to work with my limitations, my obvious naivete at the time (I never knew there were people who could be so horrendously cruel even tho' I grew up on the poor side of town... He wasn't like anyone I ever knew!) and my own sense of futility when I tried to explain to my loved ones, all the things that I didn't understand myself. In fact, I forgave him long before I forgave me. I expected more of me than I did of him...
The article suggests that we wrap our minds around the fact that many of us were just doing the best we knew how to do with what we knew at the time. So now, I'm working on forgiving myself for not forgiving myself... Sounds simple doesn't it? | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 3:05:20 AM |
"Oftentimes, we have to forgive ourselves for not forgiving ourselves."
Now, that makes logical sense actually.
The article suggests that we wrap our minds around the fact that many of us were just doing the best we knew how to do with what we knew at the time.
Spot on, IMO. Actually, another reason I stayed longer is that I personally couldn't leave until I knew within myself I had truly given my best effort in the marriage. Yet it was a costly choice to make and I don't mean tangible cost alone. Still, I did the best I could at the time. It took quite a while to get through the self-blame woulda shoulda couldas that change nothing really, so in that context, yes - I would agree with forgiving oneself for not forgiving oneself.
It really is simple to do - just sifting through the detours to get there isn't so simple. | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 3:28:53 AM | Detours? How bout the Los Angeles freeways???
I hear you strongly on the "can't go until I know Ive tried every way I know to make this work"... I've had a pattern of that in every relationship I've been in (okay.. I'll admit I haven't been in a lot after being married for a lo-0-o-ng time or in a LTR). And yanno, I don't think that's a bad thing either. It's kind of the other end of the pick-em-up-'n-chuck-'em-out-if-they-look-at- you-wrong strategy... I don't hear people say that much anymore.. that they have to be satisfied with their own efforts.. Now it's more.. "not being happy is all the reason you need to leave..." which I don't agree with. No relationship is "happy" ALL the time...
Backing up a ways, to one of your other posts Angelheart... A short way back here, we were talking about co-dependency. You mentioned that it wasn't a gender-specific problem and that startled me because I hadn't even thought of that. When I was in relationship groups and even a CODA group in the late 80's and early 90's, it was always a "woman's" thing... And that's where I began to object to being labelled with some kind of disorder because I was doing what I'd been trained to do as a wife and mother. Sometime after the first spasm of co-dependency books and workshops had run its course, I noticed some books coming out talking about what bs the co-dependency thing was but I never got a chance to read any of them...
Now, you got me wonderin'.... | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 4:02:24 AM |
And yanno, I don't think that's a bad thing either.
Nope - it isn't. Can't ever look back and say you gave less than your best to the relationship.
You can always look at your reflection in the mirror without regrets later as you know you gave your best to the relationship. What the other half of the relationship did or didn't do in the overall basics isn't your ownership or accountability.
You mentioned that it wasn't a gender-specific problem and that startled me because I hadn't even thought of that. When I was in relationship groups and even a CODA group in the late 80's and early 90's, it was always a "woman's" thing...
That's because women victims were the ones speaking up and even today, the accessibility to support services are more skewed favorably towards women yet there are male victims with the same need for supportive services as female victims. Men have much different barriers when it comes to disclosure in being a victim of abuse. Ergot - long past time we stopped looking at abuse as a gender specific issue, IMO.
Think about the very word "co-dependent". In order to be in a co-dependent relationship, the partner must also be co-dependent logically. Takes two to dance. They are reflections of each other, even when the behaviors are different. Can't be dependent on anyone without someone to be dependent upon.
EDIT: Just thought I'd add this snippet - the best mirrors of the co-dependent relationship dynamics are the alcoholic relationship and the abusive relationship. Regardless of what label is assigned to either partner, at the end of the day - both dance to really God-awful music within the relationship that is destructive to both.
Comparable to a rose by any other name is still a rose. Comparable to Cheech & Chong's "looks like chit, smells like chit, etc." routine years ago. Well, if it looks like chit and smells like chit and feels like chit - it probably is chit, so why taste it to be sure it is chit just because someone suggests that you do to make sure it is chit? The "co-dependent" is going to taste it just in case the less than 1% chance it isn't chit turns out to be true. Not just women - men too. | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 7:12:00 AM | (/my opnion is we all do what we do to survive ...religion i feel dosent come into it im proberley going to get blasted for saying this .....i often prayed to god please help me ....he never did i had to help myself .....so can we please stop preaching religion and higher teachings and get back to helping people who have been abused .....hugs joolsy)
Don't know it the quote thing will work.
I am not a religious person. To much bs within. But I have help from a higher power. Who I call God. This is on subject. In order to forgive myself this is what works for me. It also took a broken arm and a concusion from having my head hit enough to wake me up. I turned to drinking for years to try to cope. That was a bust. (I drank a lot in the relationship not after) My last drink was the day i got my arm broken. If it helps some cope than prayer or meditation in some form is what is needed to forgive outselves. Even if you sit quietley on your porch and reflect your praying. God or whome ever is not going to do it all for us just give us strength to do for ourselves. I believe that if we hold hate and don't learn to love ourselves we can't forgive ourselves or anyone else. And I don't know how that can be ignored. I am not blasting anyone just giving my opinion okay.
I wish everyone peace and love in there lives! | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 7:38:53 AM | | yes i agree kdbugg....you have to let the hate go .....and you no what i feel i always had someone by myside ...maybe it was an angel ....even now somedays she is there ...you take care ....peace and love joolsy | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 8:26:13 AM | i left this a while back on a poetry thread about being raw and emotionally exposed....take it for what it is I guess......through searching through different spiritual methods and ideas (and suffering through my own mistakes) peace was found.....one must be spiritually at peace (in whatever method suits them) before they can achieve inner peace.....in understanding fully what you don't believe, one finds out much about what they do believe....and through all of this searching, one will find themselves....and learn to look at themselves with an honest eye........
Dear Diary,
I wish I could fix the world...yanno??.....Wish I could make folks see.....that sadness even serves a temporary purpose....but it's purpose IS NOT to consume us. I wish I could show them what I see when I look at each of them. I wish we weren't our own worst critics. I wish that we coulda just knew all the stuff we hafta learn....for that would be the only way to eliminate suffering and such. If we eliminated it otherwise it wouldn't fulfill the purpose that it needed to. For the suffering leads to enlightenment eventually...and to rob someone of their suffering or sadness would be robbing them of their eyes. I wish I could SHOW them how it works....I wish I could show them a childhood wrapped up in abuse.....surrounded by anger....and what such an environment produced in the immediate following....the miserable times.....the self inflicted pain....I wish I could show you a father that realized what he did upon losing everything...and then show you ten years later a changed man.....who was just lost, and had to suffer to find his way....just as I had to suffer so that I wouldn't grow into a hateful violent being too... THEN I wish I could show them the loving heart that was a product of it all.....and the tons and tons of folks that have appreciated the hands that would stroke their hair while they cried....the arms that would hold them regardless of what they did wrong, and regardless of why.....and the ears that would listen to everything they had to say.......and the hope in their eyes upon finding such a person to unconditionally love them....b/c I KNOW what it's like to be lost...I know what it's like to absolutely hate yourself and everything that you've done...the bed you made.....and lying in it sleepless....I know what it's like to pray for death....to hurt others because I hurt.....to hate others because I hated myself....to wanna kick somebody's ass 'cause I had mine kicked a few times a day.......I know that I wouldn't understand all of this had I not suffered.....and I know that the hope in others' eyes upon finding understanding and love is priceless....and makes the suffering worth it....because there's NOTHING else that can make my heart feel that way.....absolutely nothing else that can remind me of how great this life is....and how we cross each others paths for a reason....upon getting to the end of "myself"...i found me......what I was meant to be....
i hurt for those others,
ash | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 9:08:37 AM | I can only Pity the Lady that has been abused by some Bad-Boy / Macho-Slob
that she had the poor taste in being attracted to..in the first place...!!
...and Hope that she finds someone that will treat her with more Respect .. and Love ..
than she may feel that she deserves...but Richly N e e d s...!!!
Woman-abusers should be entered into the
*Retroactive Abortion Program*...!!!!
... JMHO ...
*EDIT*...
'Angel'.....
The only problem with the Space-station idea....is....
It would cost more than $.50 to PUT them there...!!!
A simple *B-B* to the temple would be Much more Cost-effective..!!!
...Y?/N?... | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 9:19:38 AM |
Woman-abusers should be entered into the *Retroactive Abortion Program*...!!!!
I was thinking more in lines of giving them a one-way ticket to their own space station (which would include the man-abusers - there are sadly women who abuse as well) so they can have at it with each other. Should we give them the privilege of gravity? Naw - zero gravity would be more interesting, I think. Of course, they shouldn't be aware of being on candid camera either - adds new meaning to reality tv. Can you imagine one of them going to hit the other and landing on empty air instead?
~OT~ a bit - but imagination can be such a terrible thing to waste sometimes... | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 9:27:57 AM |
... ill-fated marriges by society (for example being frowned at if youre not married by a certain age), or religious pressures (for example arranged marriges) there would be alot less unhappy...
Unhappy, ill-fated marriages may sometimes be the result of imposition or influence, but are more often the result of infatuation--some go ahead against advice of family and friends. And some of those work, too.
If the "intent" is all wrong, short-sighted, uninformed...oh wait this is about being abused. Well, how do you know you're marrying 'a real deal'...someone who hasn't hidden character flaws in a closet so they don't even recognize them when they're doing them (i.e., abuse).
A marriage is a union of souls, a financial agreement, a caretaking and caregiving ageement, a partnership that requires growth and exposure--and chastity--to/for each other. The intent for social/financial/ gain to the exclusion or at the expense of the other person is...well, that's more like abuse than a marriage. Just as business deals often involve arm-twisting for financial gain--there is usually an agreement of some kind (though the two people in such deals don't have to live with each other ever after.
I won't get on a soap box about myths--"myths" tend to fail two people when put to the test (the myths of youth and beauty, sex, money, status being able to make--and sustain--a marriage)--principles, when put to the test will (that word) prevail.
Adhering to certain moral principles. I suppose if two people put in writing that they'll indulge in a marriage that involves polygamy or polyamo(u?)ry...well, that they understand what they're agreeing to.
So how do you get there? I find thoughtfulness hard to come by--prayer or meditation helps get to a place that involves imagination, goal setting, vision, a bigger picture than self (unless you imagine taking over the world, or obliterating a race, tribe, life)--and one more thing--cooperation (hopefully goodness and kindness). When a team refuses to cooperate, or is bent on undermining cooperation...ah never mind--how two people GET to this kind of place with each other varies. Yes, sociopaths can be chameleons, hiding a heart of stone. Yes some of us wonder if we should have asked more questions from the get go. Yes somewhere along the relationship lifecycle the other person's "true colors" were revealed, but it started so subtly that we forgave or overlooked the offense. Yes we make mistakes. They can be forgiven--and that is a lot of work. Like a bad tattoo, it may take many many corrective actions to obliterate the "coping skills" we derived. It is hard. Keep your eyes on the goal (find one, believe in it). Keep the goal positive, not destructive. Try not to adopt an affected or aberrant behavior to counteract the past. Ooh, now get rid of judgmental attitude (that's where I'm at): forgiveness is one thing; making sure it doesn't happen again is another. Finding that balance is self care. (Remember, the abuser may believe his/her actions and attitudes are "self care.") | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 9:43:43 AM | ~OT~ sort of -
Joolsy, you'll appreciate this, I think. Short story. My mother worked for a real ***** of a boss years ago. She was the "go for" this and that person. One day, she got so sick of his constant demeaning and insulting remarks that she peed in his coffee. Would you believe that was the first morning he didn't b*tch about the coffee? According to her, he said it was the best coffee he had ever tasted.
Okay - sorry for the sidebar, posters. | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 11:59:39 AM |
If the "intent" is all wrong, short-sighted, uninformed...oh wait this is about being abused. Well, how do you know you're marrying 'a real deal'...someone who hasn't hidden character flaws in a closet so they don't even recognize them when they're doing them (i.e., abuse).
you still havent got it.....
what i was saying was...it is the marrige that is making the abuser unhappy.
that the man or woman didnt have "
 hidden caracter flaws when they meet their partner.
you know like someone gay trying to live a straight life....
if pplz are not meant for each other they are not ment for each other.
just like my ex and me.....
Adhering to certain moral principles. I suppose if two people put in writing that they'll indulge in a marriage that involves polygamy or polyamo(u?)ry...well, that they understand what they're agreeing to.
i dont think a 12-15 yr old girl from a ethnic group where arranged marriges are common, knows exactley what she is agreeing to....or shall i say...pushed into...they have domestic violence too...and suircide of unhappy women.
So how do you get there? I find thoughtfulness hard to come by--prayer or meditation helps get to a place that involves imagination, goal setting, vision, a bigger picture
have you ever looked at that as a problem?
forgiveness is one thing; making sure it doesn't happen again is another
oh? not for me, cs i have learned from my mistakes... | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 12:41:51 PM |
just like my ex and me.....
saying that, he allways drank to much....i could tell u the whole sob story of my life, but i wont unless you really insist....
lets just say, pplz, for diffrent reasons, end up in marriges that ther are not supposed to be in... | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 3:58:51 PM | galonthemt;
I've read some of your post, throughout the Forums.
So I hope you don't mind me using your kind thoughts,
to include all the abused, whatever form they took at birth.
Enabler:
one who enables another to persist in self-destructive behavior by providing excuses or by helping that individual avoid the consequences of such behaviour.
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW...
how to fall in love without losing themselves.
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW...
when to try harder... and WHEN TO WALK AWAY.
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW...
that they can change the length of their negative patterns, the width
of their vision, but not the nature of their abuser(s).
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW...
that their childhood may not have been perfect... but still love that innocent child.
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW...
what they would and wouldn't do for love.
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW...
how to live alone... even if they do not like it.
EVERY ENABLER SHOULD KNOW..
whom they can trust, whom they can't, and why they shouldn't
take
it personally.
In many instances, men and women are ostracized when they report abuse. This is changing as we become more civilized.
Serenity Now,
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 4:08:50 PM |
Comparable to a rose by any other name is still a rose. Comparable to Cheech & Chong's "looks like chit, smells like chit, etc." routine years ago. Well, if it looks like chit and smells like chit and feels like chit - it probably is chit, so why taste it to be sure it is chit just because someone suggests that you do to make sure it is chit? The "co-dependent" is going to taste it just in case the less than 1% chance it isn't chit turns out to be true. Not just women - men too.
No chit... 
My therapist used to say, "Only you can determine how much chit you are going to be willing to dig through to find the chocolate" and of course, that takes us back to choices... having them or not "feeling" or "believing" that we have them... *sigh*
That's because women victims were the ones speaking up and even today, the accessibility to support services are more skewed favorably towards women yet there are male victims with the same need for supportive services as female victims. Men have much different barriers when it comes to disclosure in being a victim of abuse. Ergot - long past time we stopped looking at abuse as a gender specific issue, IMO.
I will say I think the courts have come along way to take the gender specificity (is that a word?) out of the system but they have a long way to go. When you consider that things like the "tender years doctrine" (where Mom was automatically given custody of the children under 7 in years gone by) are STILL lurking in the backgrounds of our much older judges, it isn't a surprise to know that many men are hanging in there just to be in their children's lives. Thank the powers that be that "shared custody" is now becoming more and more common.
And psychiatry often resorts to chemicals, to drugs..but that really only puts a band-aid on many problems, and does not eliminate the root causes. 'Root' is the important word here.
I don't agree... It is not a "bandaid" to treat someone for hormonal insufficiencies that have a tremendous effect on whether or not a person is feeling enough of the "pleasure chemicals" in their bodies that they experience chronic depression. While it may take some adjustment of the right prescriptions, I think that many people actually self-treat their own depressions with various addictions... whether they know that is what they're doing or not.
Normal people have chemicals like seratonin and dopamine running through their bloodstreams, helping them to feel well. Where the brain re-absorbs those chemicals too rapidly instead of allowing them to run their course, people come to realize that something is not right. Smoking, for instance, hits those pleasure chemicals and many people take up smoking in instinctive reaction to trying to repair themselves.
Anti-depressants go to the "root" of the problem which is our physiology because a person can't begin to repair the cognitive difficulties they experience in the fog of depression until they at least have the fighting chance that "normal" people have. For many, that's where recovery begins...
If it helps some cope than prayer or meditation in some form is what is needed to forgive outselves. Even if you sit quietley on your porch and reflect your praying. God or whome ever is not going to do it all for us just give us strength to do for ourselves. I believe that if we hold hate and don't learn to love ourselves we can't forgive ourselves or anyone else. And I don't know how that can be ignored. I am not blasting anyone just giving my opinion okay.
Well said KDBugg! I am also not what anyone could consider religious but I am deeply spiritual and ever so grateful for the "voice" that, in the darkest of my days, told me not to give up. When it came time for me to go, a series of unexplainable events happened that gave me the "ability" to go and I will always believe that I was being carried. If all we got was the "strength to do for ourselves", then maybe, that was all we really needed. Good post KD!
If we eliminated it otherwise it wouldn't fulfill the purpose that it needed to. For the suffering leads to enlightenment eventually...and to rob someone of their suffering or sadness would be robbing them of their eyes.
Ash.I.am... I wish I could put your beautiful message under a spotlight here for all to see... forever and ever, amen. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom, your heartache and your amazing depth with us...
And by the way, you are not alone in your "hurting" for those who can't... | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 4:29:23 PM | So how do you get there? I find thoughtfulness hard to come by--prayer or meditation helps get to a place that involves imagination, goal setting, vision, a bigger picture than self (unless you imagine taking over the world, or obliterating a race, tribe, life)--and one more thing--cooperation (hopefully goodness and kindness). When a team refuses to cooperate, or is bent on undermining cooperation...ah never mind--how two people GET to this kind of place with each other varies. Yes, sociopaths can be chameleons, hiding a heart of stone. Yes some of us wonder if we should have asked more questions from the get go. Yes somewhere along the relationship lifecycle the other person's "true colors" were revealed, but it started so subtly that we forgave or overlooked the offense. Yes we make mistakes. They can be forgiven--and that is a lot of work. Like a bad tattoo, it may take many many corrective actions to obliterate the "coping skills" we derived. It is hard. Keep your eyes on the goal (find one, believe in it). Keep the goal positive, not destructive. Try not to adopt an affected or aberrant behavior to counteract the past. Ooh, now get rid of judgmental attitude (that's where I'm at): forgiveness is one thing; making sure it doesn't happen again is another. Finding that balance is self care. (Remember, the abuser may believe his/her actions and attitudes are "self care.")
Whew Yoodle... You said a mouthful! I can't even pick out one statement I agree with more than the next... With a few careful reads, this can be a really wonderful recipe on the road to recovery. What an awesome and helpful post! Thank you so much!
Woman-abusers should be entered into the
*Retroactive Abortion Program*...!!!!
Not just "women-abusers" Namats... Any abusers... Anyone that can't recognize the boundaries and rights of others... Anyone who believes themselves to be "entitled" or above acting with integrity, conscience, respect and kindness...
I can't help but say I notice that it's is becoming more and more common for people to believe they are "above it all" based on the "it's all about me" thinking of the 80's and 90's that was suddenly a substitute for doing things that were the foundations of good self-esteem. Things like honouring commitments, working hard, being faithful, being loyal, being helpful, treating sexuality with the respect and sanctity such a beautiful gift deserves, caring about whether or not they hurt others while they plow along grabbing everything they can possibly grab for themselves... all slowly disappearing in support of the "I am so much more than you, so I deserve..." thinking of our times.
Can you imagine one of them going to hit the other and landing on empty air instead?
Wutta giggle! Thanks AH... It added to the thought of Joolsy peeing on somebody's toothbrush and gave me a few sorely needed belly laughs today! | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 4:37:19 PM |
If we eliminated it otherwise it wouldn't fulfill the purpose that it needed to. For the suffering leads to enlightenment eventually...and to rob someone of their suffering or sadness would be robbing them of their eyes.
I love this statement.
Truly, no matter what happens to us and by whose hand suffering is dealt to us - there is an invaluable wisdom pearl to be gained by each experience that is specific to us individually. The crazy zany irony is that until that wisdom is realized, one is inclined to repeat similar choices until they see what they need to see. Everything fulfills a purpose, even the horribly bad.
~OT~ to clarify purpose using a "safer" example. Last year, I received a call at 1:30 AM from my brother that my two-month old nephew had died. What made it more horrible for he and his wife is that they are both experienced and active EMT's of more than two decades yet no matter how many turns they took at ressusitating (spelling? lazy tonight) their baby while waiting for ambulance transport - it didn't bring their son back to them alive even for a second. SIDS - cause determined to be a reaction to vaccinations received the prior day.
I'll never forget my brother's words to me about his son's purpose in his short little life looking at that tiny grave. Short background: my sister-in-law had failed every rehab program including residential for a serious controlled substance addiction that several times nearly cost her not only her life but the life of their daughter. J's purpose, per my brother's words, was to give his mother a reason to overcome her addiction. His purpose had been fulfilled. My sister-in-law remains "clean" to this day. I guess in a way it is relevant to the topic as it goes without saying that where there is substance abuse, there is other abuse.
Back on topic, sort of: every experience in life teaches us something. What we learn from the experience correlates to how willing we are to look for the lesson relevant to ourselves as individuals. JMHO | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/1/2008 10:26:24 PM | galonthemt;
I've read some of your post, throughout the Forums.
So I hope you don't mind me using your kind thoughts,
to include all the abused, whatever form they took at birth.
Thank you for sharing this wisdom with us Ur Xoxo! Galonthemt is quite the woman, isn't she???
And if we can't be "enablers", would it be okay for us to be "inspirers" at least???
I'll never forget my brother's words to me about his son's purpose in his short little life looking at that tiny grave. Short background: my sister-in-law had failed every rehab program including residential for a serious controlled substance addiction that several times nearly cost her not only her life but the life of their daughter. J's purpose, per my brother's words, was to give his mother a reason to overcome her addiction. His purpose had been fulfilled. My sister-in-law remains "clean" to this day. I guess in a way it is relevant to the topic as it goes without saying that where there is substance abuse, there is other abuse.
That's amazing AH... Sad but amazing... I also believe that we are born with a mission... something that as souls, we were assigned to in heaven... I have many reasons to believe this and I find it sooo very comforting to know that baby's soul knew she was only "popping in" because she was needed back in heaven...
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/2/2008 2:01:41 AM |
im lost, what do you mean by that?
It was a tongue-in-cheek question in response to my feelings about women who were trained to be "good wives" being called "co-dependents" for doing what they'd been trained to do from the time they received their first Easy Bake Oven or mini mop and broom set and Ur Xoxo's post on enablers, NK.
Since enabling consists of anything we do that contributes to someone's toxic behaviors continuing, I was asking if it's at least okay to inspire... But I was really, just being kinda goofy... No worries. | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/2/2008 2:36:11 AM | I thought msg.313' s post was excellent on enabling, BTW.
Silken, regarding "tongue in cheek" humor about inspiring vs. enabling, there is a difference even on POF in the abuse threads running between the two.
Since enabling consists of anything we do that contributes to someone's toxic behaviors continuing, I was asking if it's at least okay to inspire... But I was really, just being kinda goofy... No worries.
First of all, I loved my easy bake oven!
We can always inspire rather than enable others by the way we conduct ourselves. Yet it doesn't mean that others will be inspired enough to effect a change. A good leader doesn't look behind to see who is following, rather proceeds forward with confidence regardless of the obstacles encountered and even when having to redirect course, still proceeds forward. That in and of itself is inspiring.
Sometimes enabling behaviors can be so insidious we don't even realize we are engaging in them. So the essential body of Msg. 313 was excellent in clarifying the enabler's "need to know" also perhaps "need to recognize" in order to turn around from enabling to inspiring.
Just my 2 cents worth. | |
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| The Process of Forgiving Ourselves After Being Abused
Posted: 7/2/2008 6:02:14 AM |
Sometimes enabling behaviors can be so insidious we don't even realize we are engaging in them. So the essential body of Msg. 313 was excellent in clarifying the enabler's "need to know" also perhaps "need to recognize" in order to turn around from enabling to inspiring.
This is one of the best statement going..............I always thought my purpose in life was to be a giver.....my knowledge, my wisdon,my caring etc.......the hard part was in knowing when the giving crosses the line into enabling......it's such a fine line that sometimes, if we are not in tune with who WE are we cross that line without realizing it.
The helping that we are perceiving that we are giving turns both the giver and the receiver into a dynamic that is a detriment to both. | |
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