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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/16/2008 7:46:39 PM | Hi, Silkenfire. I found myself in this situation. I was married to an alcoholic for many years. His disease was pretty well managed by him, up until about the last three years of our marriage. He slowly started to escalate out of control. He would become abusive, demanding i sleep on the floor, chasing me around demanding sex. He used to call me all sorts of fabulous names. He also had a few affairs. This all finally accumulated into him going into a violent rage, holding a knife to my throat and threatning to kill me. I will never forget the rage in his eyes. I managed to get away from him but he caught up with me and threw me down a flight of stairs.
He also threatened to knife my two beloved dogs to the wall. I remember waking up at the bottom of the stairs, both my dogs were barking hysterically, i grabbed them both ran to the car and locked myself in. He appeared with a baseball bat. Luckily i had a spare set of keys hid in the car and managed to drive away. I drove straight to a store i knew the police often sat at.
The officer who took my statement was very rude. I was pretty upset, he kept telling me that if i didnt calm down he wasnt going to take my statement, He actually said are you sure this is what you want cause there will be a restraning order.
Victim witness and the crown were all very good though. They took everything i said into consideration.
I think i stayed as long as i did because my kids were young then and i only worked part time. I was afraid to leave and afraid to stay.
This has changed my life alot, ive grown alot and learned to do alot of things on my own. My self esteem is much better, although i cant stand it when someone sneeks up on me from behind, it still scares the hell out of me. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/16/2008 7:51:42 PM |
Not picking on you Pink Rose Lady, just saying it is possible to leave sooner. You don't have to be assualted..to make the choice to leave.
I agree with you Leigh but I want to point out to you that there are some situations where the abuser and his target have just met, he becomes disrespectful, she leaves and tells him that there will not be a relationship and then and there, the stalking and harassment begin...
I know a lady who went out with a guy once... decided he seemed too "off" for her to feel comfortable and told him she would not date him again. The next time she came home from an evening out and opened her closet door, the guy came rushing out and hammered her into unconsciousness. When she woke up, he was trying to saw her foot off at the ankle with a filleting knife... He made a helluva mess of her leg!
I know more than one person who has only had one date with someone, left them and had severe problems... I am one of those people...
If all it took was "leaving", many of us would not have been so badly hurt. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/16/2008 8:10:49 PM | Hi, Silkenfire. I found myself in this situation. I was married to an alcoholic for many years. His disease was pretty well managed by him, up until about the last three years of our marriage. He slowly started to escalate out of control. He would become abusive, demanding i sleep on the floor, chasing me around demanding sex. He used to call me all sorts of fabulous names. He also had a few affairs. This all finally accumulated into him going into a violent rage, holding a knife to my throat and threatning to kill me. I will never forget the rage in his eyes. I managed to get away from him but he caught up with me and threw me down a flight of stairs.
He also threatened to knife my two beloved dogs to the wall. I remember waking up at the bottom of the stairs, both my dogs were barking hysterically, i grabbed them both ran to the car and locked myself in. He appeared with a baseball bat. Luckily i had a spare set of keys hid in the car and managed to drive away. I drove straight to a store i knew the police often sat at.
I am so sorry that happened to you Dreamcatcher... So very, very sorry...
The officer who took my statement was very rude. I was pretty upset, he kept telling me that if i didnt calm down he wasnt going to take my statement, He actually said are you sure this is what you want cause there will be a restraning order.
This is precisely the attitude that many of us have encountered when we're already badly hurt and shook up. I think that the "seasoned" officers are worse because they've seen so many people so badly hurt and they are also disillusioned with the system. They take it out on the victims because there is no place else to vent but if you get talking with them, they will tell you that they know the system isn't working and they are seeing way too much domestic violence. They also know women are staying because they know that if the woman can't get some distance from the offender, there is a strong possibility it will increase her danger.
Victim witness and the crown were all very good though. They took everything i said into consideration.
I think i stayed as long as i did because my kids were young then and i only worked part time. I was afraid to leave and afraid to stay.
Please only answer my next questions if you are totally comfortable to do so. Was he charged? Convicted? Acquitted? Sentenced? Did he leave you completely alone after that?
This has changed my life alot, ive grown alot and learned to do alot of things on my own. My self esteem is much better, although i cant stand it when someone sneeks up on me from behind, it still scares the hell out of me.
Good for you Dreamcatcher! I don't think being abused is a necessary lesson in life but I do think that where we manage to actually recover, we are often a lot more in touch with our own boundaries, our own triggers and our own vulnerabilities at the end of it all. For those of us who just wanted to love and be loved, it's a helluva price to have paid. May life always be kind to you... | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/16/2008 8:46:28 PM | I worked for a year as a counselor in a DV treatment program a few years back.
Ever since the OJ Simpson trial, the police forces and DAs in California have taken a much tougher line against DV. Now, if a report is made, the policy is to make an arrest and the DA is the one who presses charges. The alleged victims have no further say in the matter once the police are called.
For a while it was an automatic arrest of the man if any sort of mark could be found on the woman or if she claimed she'd been restrained in any way. Now it depends on who calls. The one who makes the call is presumed to be the one in need of assistance from the police. We used to have our clients call if it looked like things were getting dicey--if the relationship was mutually combative.
The penalties got a lot stiffer too. The standard plea agreement was 1.5 years of supervised probation followed by another 1.5 of OR, plus 52 weeks of group and/or individual DV counseling that the clients paid for themselves, plus whatever time they served awaiting arraignment and/or disposition (from 1 to 10 days in some cases), plus fines and restitution of up to $5,000. And that was a first offense.
Some of those guys were real pieces of work. A few of them were victims of clever partners. However, they all had one thing in common, a very poor opinion of themselves as men. The ones who learned how to refrain from responding to their impulses gained enough self-respect to be safe with themselves and loved ones. It was great when that happened. Very rewarding. However, in most cases the ordeal with the police for both batterers and their victims was usually enough to ensure that the relationships didn't last. In many cases that turned out to be the best for both of them. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/16/2008 9:17:09 PM | Ever since the OJ Simpson trial, the police forces and DAs in California have taken a much tougher line against DV. Now, if a report is made, the policy is to make an arrest and the DA is the one who presses charges. The alleged victims have no further say in the matter once the police are called.
I watched the OJ trial with the same horror as so many people felt and felt "diminished" (since I have served the legal profession for over 20 years of my life) by the utter mockery it made out of the administration of justice. But it clearly showed where the system was terribly weak and I am so very glad to hear that California stiffened up their handling methods for these types of cases.
I think that it's key to have the offender know that his or her target does not have any say once the police are called but Ace... if that offender gets off, the victim is going to be in serious trouble for making the call to begin with regardless of whether or not, they had the capacity to have the charges stayed later... So it only addresses part of the problem (which is better than none...).
For a while it was an automatic arrest of the man if any sort of mark could be found on the woman or if she claimed she'd been restrained in any way. Now it depends on who calls. The one who makes the call is presumed to be the one in need of assistance from the police. We used to have our clients call if it looked like things were getting dicey--if the relationship was mutually combative.
That "automatic arrest" stuff isn't so good either... I've seen some victims mark themselves and then scream "abuse"... And I can't figure out how they are thinking if they change that over to "who calls" them... All an offender needs to know is to be the one to call first... But I guess if he or she is on the phone, the victim has time to run...
Here in Canada, in my area, they are starting to arrest both parties, particularly if both are marked in any way... It's obviously not getting any easier...
The penalties got a lot stiffer too. The standard plea agreement was 1.5 years of supervised probation followed by another 1.5 of OR, plus 52 weeks of group and/or individual DV counseling that the clients paid for themselves, plus whatever time they served awaiting arraignment and/or disposition (from 1 to 10 days in some cases), plus fines and restitution of up to $5,000. And that was a first offense.
Whew! Those are some STIFF penalties for a FIRST offence. Might as well begin as they mean to go on... But where it's not a first offence and they are released on bail, there's some serious danger presenting itself...
Some of those guys were real pieces of work. A few of them were victims of clever partners. However, they all had one thing in common, a very poor opinion of themselves as men. The ones who learned how to refrain from responding to their impulses gained enough self-respect to be safe with themselves and loved ones. It was great when that happened. Very rewarding. However, in most cases the ordeal with the police for both batterers and their victims was usually enough to ensure that the relationships didn't last. In many cases that turned out to be the best for both of them.
You've delivered some good news here in this thread and I can just imagine what kind of stories you heard as you coordinated these groups.
I've always wondered if they shouldn't let the hardened cons do a little bit more "educating" in such groups. I understand that many of them don't have much use for men who beat women and/or children. Perhaps with the repeat offenders, that wouldn't be such a bad idea. And some of those work camps they have in the States where they have to tow the line wouldn't be such a bad thing where someone might come to realize they aren't so hot as a bully after all...
Thank you for adding your experience to our knowledge base. Don't be surprised if you have an influx of survivors all headed for beautiful California... | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/16/2008 11:44:25 PM | There are also automatic stay-away orders issued, so that the offenders don't just go back home and start in again. If an offender needs to get his stuff, a sheriff goes with him. If the victim makes a credible report of unwanted contact, they do pick offenders up and revoke probation long enough for the victim to get situated in a new place.
Of course, some of those victims let their unreformed batterers know where they are--it's a very bad move.
If a year of weekly group sessions won't get through to a guy, nothing much will. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/17/2008 4:58:21 AM |
Was he charged? Convicted? Acquitted? Sentenced? Did he leave you completely alone after that?
Yes, he was charged with assault with a weapon, assault, uttering death threats,andthreatning to harm an animal.
The crown was pushing for jail time, my lawyer was pushing for house arrest because if he went to jail, he would lose his job, Therefore he wouldnt be able to pay child support. In the end he ended up with six months house arrest and 18 months probation.
He did leave me alone after that. He got himself into A.A and has been sober ever since. He did tell me that i actually saved his life by calling in the police that night and he just wishes that it didnt take losing me and the kids and everything he had to sober up.
The thing that gets me sometimes is,he got lots of help for his problems, he has pretty well rebuilt his life. I didnt get any help and still struggle with some issues from that whole time.
Another whole issue is, i have a 19 year old daughter, and guess what, she picked a man just like her dear old dad used to be. I have watched him spiral slowly out of control for the last year. I have told my daughter she needs to get away from him because things will get nothing but worse. This all recently culminated in him burning her with a ciggarette and doing 2000 dollars in damage to her car. She did call the police on him, but really struggles with wanting to go back with him. Victim witness has offered her counselling so i am really encouraging her to take it. The whole cycle just seems to be repeating itself with her, i feel really guilty for that as i think seeing what she saw growing up, she thinks this is how a man is suppose to treat a woman. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/17/2008 5:46:17 AM | ok i have to respond to this having been there myself...why did i stay?....my ex was so scary and i was so scarred from the abuse i was almost dead inside and in fact discussing it with my kids who are grown now..tell me i was a "ghost"..that hurt
anyway many times i took him back because in my own head i thought he was scarier outside lurking around, i never knew where he would show up and pounce, the police cannot be everywhere even with an order of protection at best he was held "overnight" and then released with all that anger pointed in one direction at me
How did i get rid of him, well he finally attacked my son (chocked his own son) when he intercepted the violence and turned my ex's range towward him (my son)..i called the police, finally got a permanent order of protection in place and actually found the courage to call when the need arose..and never looked back.
i wish all you out there luck but know this, i truly understand why "we" stay when all our senses tell us it best to leave. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/17/2008 6:02:13 AM | Lancashire police were fast in attending the day i left, it was about 6am,by the time they got their act together my ex was on his way to work they then realised they couldnt drive to Preston from Blackpool to arrest him,they left it 4 months as it had to be the same officer dealing with it,surely for a man who already had 2 previous convictions for indecent assault(these4 were not against me) they should have gone straight there and pulled him in,i had no idea of his past until i heard it over the police radio,i was asked by the officer not to repeat what i had just heard.
,i was hit once ,that was the day i left and spent hours at the hospital then made arrangements to leave, we went to stay with neighbours and went into Refuge the next day,whilsttrying to sleep at my neighbours i had a call from the police and i broke into tears as was terrified by then of a man with a Lancashire accent,i agreed they could send someone out to do my statement even though it was nearly 1am,how insensitive are these people id already told the officer his accent frightened me and yes they sent out a man to take my statement.
WE finally got to court 8mths later.had to stand real close to him in court,i broke down so was allowed to sit in the lerather chair at the front near the judge,both lancashire and Essex domestic violence officers,victim support and the court welfare were brilliant.
The let down was the sentencing,he was fined and asked by the police prosecutor that conditions were put in order that he is never to go to C#####es##r so i will be able to live in peace.what a let down,a fine be agood boy and into the bargain tell the man where i had moved to{had to put the ### instead of my location}this has only allowed him to be free to go out and reoffend.and thats justice ....... | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/17/2008 6:24:39 AM | In the state of Texas ~ here's the way it works ~
If the police are called out ~ by "anyone" ~ and the arrive and find evidence of domestic violence ~ even the smallest bit ~ a shoving , pushing, tripping and falling ` marks on an arm, fat lip ~ were someones personal space has been violated. ~ somebodys going to jail~ and the state is fileing charges and these charges can't not be dropped by anyone except the DA office.
You are now finding yourself in the "system" and the system will administor to the problem. ~ The Judge with render a decision after hearing the evidence ~ It's wise to hire an attorney. I hired two! ~ not wishing to be railroaded ~ and that can happen to you , at this point ~ if they are very mad at you or ~~ you are showing great disrespect to the courts.
I found it to be fair ~ you will be fined ` and placed on probation ~ and advanced schooling will be required if you wish to walk in the world of free men. Could be anger control or spouse abuse classes.
These classes are very good and do work if you trying to do the right thing~ they give you the skills to address the issues of living with a mate ~ even if she might be misbehaving herself. I found the skills priceless in day to day living with everyone.
This process take 2 years or more to complete ~ and you've spent some $3,000.00 not counting your attorney fees and invested much time. ~
This is a quick overview ` ~ sparing you all the human drama and juicy details.
Dance | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/17/2008 6:40:12 AM | | At least the cops come now. When I was a kid with Step-dad beating the living crud out of us kids with a hammer, giving us broken bones & black eyes as big as a tennis ball, I got on the phone and was told by the cops that they couldn't do anything till someone died. You could hear the screaming in the background, but no one would come. Nowadays, I'm actually more afraid of the cops, than any man on the street. They treat everyone guilty until proven innocent. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/17/2008 8:59:04 PM | OP- I didn't read through any other posts yet. But my ex-hubby came in one night wanting to fight. Don't even know why. Long story short, I ended up being shot in my knee (guess he was tryin' to be gangster or something...and yeah, luckily I can laugh about it now). I ended up having to drive myself to the hospital. I go in, they fix my leg up after a couple of hours...cops get there. Ask what happened. I tell them. Next thing I know I'm being read my Miranda Rights and being told that I'm under arrest for assault, disorderly conduct, and various other piddly ass charges. He got arrested too. But, why the hell did I? I was the one with a bullet in my leg and a shattered knee and a broken leg. He, on the other hand, had no signs of physical harm.
Now, the aftermath....my charges were eventually dropped. He pled out to injury with a weapon and was put on one year probation. Mind you....I wasn't in the best time of my life back then...partying, doing drugs, etc. and that was really the reason I didn't leave him then. Because my brain wasn't operating at full force. Once I sobered myself up and other things came to light...I high tailed it out of there!
~Welder's Girl~ | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/18/2008 5:26:23 AM | OP,, I didn't read every post but enough to get your drift..
I just want to share a recent story about what just happened to a friend of mine who lives in South Carolina..
His child was teething and because it was in pain it was crying..
His wife was unhappy because the child wouldn't stop crying.
She bit the baby hard enough to make it scream while Clyd was standing in the same room.
He hit the **** for biting his baby.
She called the cops who arrested him and wouldn't even listen to him about what happened.
His bail was $25000.
They still refuse to do anything about her biting the baby.
How many times do you think men go to jail when it is the woman who is wrong? | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/18/2008 7:04:47 AM | the thing is ~ two wrong don't make a right.
You don't hit people. With very few exceptions ~ we see it done on TV alot ~ but thats not the way real life works.
this couple you speak of ~ is a classic example of poor coping skills and their relationship regardless of who , what is involved ~ is doomed from the start.
The child being the victim of a sorted mess. ~ What will this relationship ever grow into? ~ It'd be foolish to think things might hopfully ~ somehow improve.
If it takes 4 thousand dollars ~ to understand, know and accept this ~ it's money well spent.
I remember being annoyed with my wifes treatment of a child ~ and how upset a man can get over it ~ but to stike out and hit your lover , you are destroying your very future with this woman. ~ She might have a hard time forgetting your abuse. ~ Most women I've ever beeing involved with ~ you can for get about any future ,firery passionate, unbridle, wild sex for starters.
You can easily kill perfect loving relationship one second at a time with just words alone. To add a strong hand ~ your are living the life of a fool and destroying all thats around you. ~ Regardless of whats she's done ~ it don't matter, from whoredogging to mistreating the children.
There is another way to address this inapporiate behaviors ~ and they "work" ~ hitting doesn't work ~ only makes matters worse.
Dance | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/18/2008 7:19:03 AM |
In the end he ended up with six months house arrest and 18 months probation.
He did leave me alone after that.
Hi Dreamcatcher. 6 months of house arrest is actually pretty serious business, even though it doesn't sound like much. I've heard some guys say they'd rather do their time in jail than to be out in the public with a "babysitter" who suddenly shows up at their house at 9:00 p.m. to make sure they're at home. I guess they find it embarrassing. Suffice to say, it sounds like it "worked" if he left you alone afterward.
He didn't just get 6 months of this and 18 months of that... He also earned himself a lifelong criminal record and these days, that can be a huge impediment to guys trying to start over or climb the ladder at work. The majority of employers are running criminal records checks now and since having a job is the first step toward starting over, many of them find themselves with university degrees working at entry-level jobs.
(On a personal note, I've learned the hard way that if we meet somebody who is living with friends, is unemployed or working at an entry level job at 45+ years of age, a person needs to really be investing in finding out where he's been for the past year.)
The thing that gets me sometimes is,he got lots of help for his problems, he has pretty well rebuilt his life. I didnt get any help and still struggle with some issues from that whole time.
I guess I am somewhat blessed since the Crime Victims Assistance Fund in our province, pays for my trauma therapy which includes EMDR. You may want to check with your local police to find out the Victims Assistance dept. and see if those people can hook you up with some groups or special therapists. You don't deserve to have to walk through life feeling troubled my friend.
Another whole issue is, i have a 19 year old daughter, and guess what, she picked a man just like her dear old dad used to be.
Dads are pretty important people in their daughters' lives whether they know it or not. Through him, a young girl learns to understand what she can expect from men in her life and where what she learns is that she can't trust or rely on them or that they will in fact, be cruel, it's not unusual for the daughter to try to re-write history with a better outcome in her adult life.
For me, this would be a time when I'd call in the troops... I'd be constantly "visual" no matter what he did, I'd drag some powerful women into her life and I'd make sure she has a permanent escape route. I'd even have her read some of the forums on POF that talk about domestic violence. I'm thinking, Dreamcatcher, that if you get into therapy and share that with her, she may also be willing to go.
I know that the teacher can only tearch when the student is ready to learn but some messages do seem to get through when they need to... Good luck to you! | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 12:13:56 PM | anyway many times i took him back because in my own head i thought he was scarier outside lurking around, i never knew where he would show up and pounce, the police cannot be everywhere even with an order of protection at best he was held "overnight" and then released with all that anger pointed in one direction at me
I know that this is a strange thing for the average person to understand but I understand it from the inside out. I always felt I could handle my tormentor if I was prepared for him and nothing was so frightening to me as to think he would suddenly be standing in front of me in the dark. Knowing that it would take the police a long time to get to me (particularly since at one point, I lived some distance from town), there simply wasn't a question of my relying on a restraining order to deter him (especially after he'd been drinking). And, in my view, that is one of the key problems with the legal system. They want us to get restraining orders because that is really the only protection the system can offer but doing so, often inflames the aggressor and then... we are still left trying to deal with him. Apart from 24/7 guards, there is no protection other than to move several hundred miles and change one's name. You're extremely lucky that in your case, it worked for you Funnybring... Congratulations on getting out.
The let down was the sentencing,he was fined and asked by the police prosecutor that conditions were put in order that he is never to go to C#####es##r so i will be able to live in peace.what a let down,a fine be agood boy and into the bargain tell the man where i had moved to{had to put the ### instead of my location}this has only allowed him to be free to go out and reoffend.and thats justice .......
You mention the previous convictions in your post Poohbear... Although I can't tell from your post how lengthy your history with him was, I wonder if these were new news to you? In my case, we were already at trial when the judge said to my offender, "I see by your history, that your criminal record for matters of this nature is almost as tall as I am and that concerns me..." Neither the police, nor the Crown told me in advance that he had a lengthy history of convictions for assaults. But that same judge STILL gave him a conditional discharge with probation to follow... Within an hour of the trial, despite the restraining order, he was calling me and insisting I come to him.
There needs to be some form of warning... a release that allows a police officer to tell the victim/target that someone who is harassing them has a lengthy criminal history when the convictions are also related to assaults. As the months and years go on in an abusive association or relationship of any kind, the victim gets more and more worn down by the constant attrition. I wonder what would happen if we had access to those kinds of records. I think some places in the world, there might be that access but if there isn't, there should be...
I found it to be fair ~ you will be fined ` and placed on probation ~ and advanced schooling will be required if you wish to walk in the world of free men. Could be anger control or spouse abuse classes.
Thank you for adding your thoughts to this thread Dar. I've heard some people say that anger management classes only actually work when the offender decides for his or herself that they need them. Where they're court-ordered, they are often treated as a big joke by the offender... Steel walls that can only be bent by God himself I guess...
This process take 2 years or more to complete ~ and you've spent some $3,000.00 not counting your attorney fees and invested much time. ~
The money for attorney fees could be a deterrent where the offender is viably employed and fearful of losing a substantial part of his savings but legal aid is offered where the offence is indictable (or a felony in the US).. At least here in Canada... So the end result is that the taxpayers also get to pay for the offender's defence in many cases. That doesn't seem to much matter to those who lack conscience enough to assault to begin with...
That's one I can't think of an alternative for though... The right to representation is inherent to our constitutions and I believe it must be that way but to an aggressive person, appreciating the taxpayer's expense is the last thing on his or her mind. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 12:41:05 PM | At least the cops come now. When I was a kid with Step-dad beating the living crud out of us kids with a hammer, giving us broken bones & black eyes as big as a tennis ball, I got on the phone and was told by the cops that they couldn't do anything till someone died. You could hear the screaming in the background, but no one would come.
Aye... just reading this gave me the shudders Spumoni... How awful for you and your family!!!
It made me also think about how often on POF, we get threads where someone is lamenting feminism and the changes in male/female roles these past 30 years. It's stories like yours that explain why there needed to be changes to these roles and we're still such a very long way from stopping the damn violence.
I remember when I was a kid... my father beat the hell outta one of my sisters with his belt... for not making her bed. He left bloody lacerations from her calves right up to her neck. When my mother got home from work, she asked my sister to come to her and my sister carefully walked over to stand in front of my mother. My mother asked my sister to turn around and then slowly peeled her housecoat from her body to be able to see the whipmarks. Then, she turned my sister around and said, "What on earth did YOU do?" How could any 8 year old child have merited that kind of a beating, for ANY reason? My sister was kept out of school for the next few days until she could walk properly so that the teachers wouldn't know... We all faced being ostracized if we told "the secret"... So I know how horrendous that was to go through and I am sorry that happened to you...
Nowadays, I'm actually more afraid of the cops, than any man on the street. They treat everyone guilty until proven innocent.
I will still take my chances with them over an abuser any day of the week. Until we have cops that are robots, they're bound to be negatively affected by their work and I can honestly say, I don't know how they do it.
Now, the aftermath....my charges were eventually dropped. He pled out to injury with a weapon and was put on one year probation. Mind you....I wasn't in the best time of my life back then...partying, doing drugs, etc. and that was really the reason I didn't leave him then. Because my brain wasn't operating at full force. Once I sobered myself up and other things came to light...I high tailed it out of there!
The guy shot you in the knee and got one year of probation???!!!??? OMG!
When people wonder why women stay, they should read stories such as yours. I applaud your honesty about "not being in the best time of your life" Welderwantedthis, but even if you were partying, you sure as Hell didn't deserve to be shot. And he should have been locked up!!! GRRRR!!!! 
How many times do you think men go to jail when it is the woman who is wrong?
Nebula, this isn't a gender-specific issue and it never ceases to amaze me how every thread about violence finds posts that essentially say, "well.. women do it too!" We KNOW that... And I don't think the consequences should be any less for a woman than they are for a man. I try so hard to make any posts I do on the subject non-gendered but it makes them drag out to always be saying "him or her"....
And the fact that women "do it too", certainly does not "justify" any kind of violence.
I have to tell you that on one occasion when my young daughter bit her father while they were "playing" alongside the couch where I was lying down, he bit her back and bit her at the very top of her cheek close to her eye. My immediate concern was to comfort her but around her, I said to him, "You better not be here when I get up off this couch because if you are, I am going to hurt you!" He had the good sense to leave and I left him shortly after... But I well understand your friend's reaction.
In my view, either the police investigation was tremendously sloppy or the judge was ignorant! Thankfully, as the laws change, they change for both genders and that, is how it should be. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 12:43:56 PM | One woman in the UK got beaten half to death - (the hospital mistakenly booked her in as a road traffic accident) and he was let off, his statement to the police said they bumped heads.
His mate, got into a row with his wife, she punched him and he pushed her off, he is now serving time.
All things are equal - in the UK
In the UK Stalkers have to physically assault the person before the police will act - Now how stupid is that | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 12:58:17 PM | | i lived with a violent partner for 5yrs once it started affecting my child i waited for the next assult then called the police he was arrested and bailed not to come near me, he came back a day later at 3 in the morning urinated through my letter box the fell into a drunken sleep on the doorstep again i had him arrested, he was taken to court for assult and resisting arrest and got 6mnths probation and that was it , i felt a bit let down but he has since moved town, although the justice system was a let down the police were fantastic giving support installing panic alarms and making sure i was safe , i stayed with him so long because i deludely thought i loved him and if he were to stop drinking it would get better , he stopped and it got worse but on the bright side he gave me a wonderfull daughter | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 1:43:03 PM | Kudos to you Silken Fire! Your first posts really spell it out, and just maybe someone will be helped by it.I owned my own farm, and the second time my boyfriend attacked my son, I ran to my truck and left, calling 911, and as I hoped, he followed me. I was told to drive to the police station and they would meet me. The 2 constables were very good, but the Sargent said if we had been living together more than 3 months, he was entitled to half of everything I had.I said excuse me? "Well, I've read the family law books, and I know!" My reply was "Well, I've been to Four lawyers, and I think they know more than you do!" I can only imagine if I had been an uninformed woman. However, I was told if I was afraid to go home, I shouldn't. My son and his girlfriend and I went back the next day to have him charged, and the Sargent said it was like 2 guys going outside a bar to fight! How can you compare a 220 lb man assaulting a 140 lb kid to a bar fight? I realize this may sound like it is off topic, but it took me a couple of more tries to finally get the man out of the house. Then he called me 3 times and asked if he could pick up some stuff he'd left for the fellow he was working for that day. Turned out he was drinking and guess he decided he was going to straighten me out for once and for all!.I was screaming like a banshee 'cause I thought I was going to die My son climbed out a window, ran to the neighbors and called the police, and when they didn't show up, drove to another neighbors and called again. Thank goodness the fellow he'd come to get the stuff for came in the house and pulled him off me, or I'd not likely be writing this. When the police still hadn't shown up, I called a friend of his and asked him to come and get him out of the house, and even he arrived before the police. The police refused to charge him, I had to do it. In answer to your original question,not only did the crown never contact me, they called none of the witnesses, the crown read off that I had called him 3 times that day. (Pretty hard to call someone in a transport when he has no cell phone) He got off signing a Peace bond (Like the American restraining order) The problem with either of these documents is they will only work with a reasonable person, and if the person was reasonable, you wouldn't need one in the first place.
A friend who had been in a similar situation (her husband broke her arm and got nothing) lent me her Rottwieller, and ended up giving me the dog as she bonded so strongly to me. I eventually moved, not an easy thing to do with 26 horses, but at least I am not afraid to go to the barn at night. One thing I did learn out of this. If you have any kind of visible injury, or even not so visible, get to hospital emergency, so you have a record of it, and in some cases their reporting it will get him charged. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 5:13:15 PM |
They still refuse to do anything about her biting the baby.
How many times do you think men go to jail when it is the woman who is wrong?
What she did to the baby was wrong. No doubt. However, his assault on her was not legally justified. He wasn't protecting the baby from harm, he was punishing her for a wrong she'd already committed.
If there was evidence of a bite mark then the cops should have referred the case to child protective services. Your friend should have called them in or called the police, or insisted that she get some parenting classes. But one thing he could have done immediately is taken the baby and left the scene before he hit her.
What I saw among my clients were many men whose victims had done wrong. Victims can be very provocative and we used to help our clients strategize about how to handle the provocations. One that typically got a client in trouble was when the partner would physically block an exit. The temptation in a situation like that is to physically push past, but if you do that it is an assault. We told them to go out a window if necessary if they had to get out of a situation before exploding. We also told them to ditch their dignity and run away from situations when they could feel their blood start to boil.
Your friend's partner obviously did wrong--but so did he. And no, the justice system isn't fair to alleged abusers. I think we're all actually relieved that they've switched from ignoring the abuse for as long as possible to jumping in to prevent the abuse from escalating. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/19/2008 11:50:14 PM | In the UK Stalkers have to physically assault the person before the police will act - Now how stupid is that
That's just downright scary Loz... I didn't know the UK was so far behind... I would have thought with likes of Margaret Thatcher in there for awhile, there would be more "bodily harm" laws than "revenue & property fighting"...
Hmmm...
he came back a day later at 3 in the morning urinated through my letter box the fell into a drunken sleep on the doorstep
I knew someone who did EXACTLY the same thing... Is the physical equivalent of "pi$$ on her" in a drunk's mind... Is the emotional equivalent of "repulsive" in a sober woman's mind... 
Then he called me 3 times and asked if he could pick up some stuff he'd left for the fellow he was working for that day.
See? There's no form of manipulation too far below them sometimes... I mean.. nothing they won't do to step on just one more piece of our faces before they're carted off... GRRR 
In answer to your original question,not only did the crown never contact me, they called none of the witnesses, the crown read off that I had called him 3 times that day.
Yuppers.. my experience as well... No contact with crown whatsoever...
The problem with either of these documents is they will only work with a reasonable person, and if the person was reasonable, you wouldn't need one in the first place.
Excellent point TchofClas! It makes so much sense, that it is as though they can't "hear it"... I don't know why they don't "get" that we're not dealing with a "reasonable" person... for cryin' out loud!!!
I eventually moved, not an easy thing to do with 26 horses, but at least I am not afraid to go to the barn at night. One thing I did learn out of this. If you have any kind of visible injury, or even not so visible, get to hospital emergency, so you have a record of it, and in some cases their reporting it will get him charged.
With 26 horses, I'da rode one and led all the others... just to get out... But that can't have been easy...
And yes, I agree, documenting absolutely everything does help... Dated pictures included... | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 6:33:19 AM | My turn..............before i got married there were no signs of abuse...stupid me didn't do his background check.If I had done this -I would have found out that he had been charged before.
Before I married him I told him that if he ever lays his hands on me I am not the kind of girl who will just take it period.
one month into the marriage I had already discovered a lot of things about him that I did not care for(stealing ,lying .........)this guy was really well to do too.
7 months later I told him that I wanted out -I could not stand him anymore and knowing what a low life this guy turned out to be.One night I told him that I wanted a divorce..was nice about it and said that he needs a peson who is like him and who doesn't care what he does.Well-he came after me at night,put his teeth through my skin in various places -LIKE A DOG.He was determent to end my life.........except I never told him that I knew self defence............in seconds I was on the top of him ,screaming and ready throw the last hit to his throat......but but but ...a woman STILL must to remember...........a man can have a previous record of domestic violence ..........and keep on doing this to all his women victims.
In my case if I had killed him that night I would have got the death sentence.
I left our home and now the legal system allowed him to stay in our recidence eventhough the DA chose in my favour .............meanwhile he stole all my childrens belongings and mine..........now tell me again why women don't leave???
It is not as easy as it sounds..........
I urge all women to do background checks before really getting into relationships.
Self defence is a must -it saved my life.Also THERE ARE SIGNS before the abuse. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 6:49:26 AM | Hi silken fire,
I have never had any experience of this accept through stories told to me by many women,but,as usual will get my tuppence worth in.
First of all,I don't see why any charge that is laid for domestic violence,should not be accompanied by a restraining order against the person charged,which should be invoked immediately.
I think that most people involved in domestic violence have a learned experience from their mother or father,and continue the behavior without realisng that they can be the king or queen who reigns over the generation that stops it. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 7:35:31 AM | ^^^^ Helinda, you can't tar everyone with the same brush. I went for counseling during and after the experience related previous. The second counselor was very good. He commented that I did not fit the profile, as my parents had a very good marriage, my father never never raised his voice , never mind acted out physically, and told my first husband "It takes a pretty small man to hit a woman". (Yes, in spite of the fact after my first marriage I swore I would never get in that situation again, it happened) One of the best things that counselor did was go over signs to look for that a man is abusive, and had me make a list, which I still have. One of the most important is how he treats his mother, but at this age, most men's mothers are no longer around, but you can tell a lot by how they talk about them. I'd recommend counseling for anyone who has been through this, but be aware, all counselors are not created equal. The only thing I got from the first one was to hang around the coffee shops, so the police got to know me personally, and would therefore respond to a call more quickly!
I remember the one officer who came to the house asking me why I would be with someone like that. My reply was "If they came with it printed on their foreheads, you'd have all the thieves and murderers in jail!" However, thanks to counseling, you can recognize the signs that are there. And I think as women, we have to realize if the signs are there, no matter how nice he seems, run for your life, as that is what it may come down to if you persue the relationship. I think we have to get rid of the fairytale thinking that we can change him, or he wouldn't do that to me. As someone else said, The second relationship, I laid it on the line that if he ever hit me, he was out of there. After the first year I knew it was over, but he constantly told me I would never get rid of him, he would never leave. Guess when he was finally out, (took 6 years) he figured he had nothing to lose by coming back after me. My lawyer suggested I could sue him in civil court, but he had no assets other than his truck, and if he was vindictive before, I can only imagine what that would have done. And for the poster who took self defense, I took two courses, but you have to keep it up so that your reactions are automatic, 'cause you won't have the opportunity to think! So if anyone is thinking of takeing this route, be sure you continue to practice.If you can take it with a friend, then you can help each other review it on a regular basis, or take it with one of your kids. The one I took, the woman who taught it allowed neither men or boys to see what she taught, as she wanted what you learned to be a surprise, since that element alone can mean the difference in your survival. | |
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