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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 8:20:45 AM | | I can only speak from my own personal experience an that is that the legal system does not help very much in the area to help to enforce the protection orders or in any other matter. I stayed for over 14yrs I married him right out of high school an it was not like that until we got married an I was told that the piece of paper meant he now owned me. I came from a family that u get married for better or worse an I was young. I worked but he made sure he kept me with barely any money as he took me to an from work. I had no friends was not allowed to see my family. I ended up pregnant an of course I was ruinin his life he also made sure I had no phone or car. It is not as easy to get out as everyone says it is let me tell u. Plus they work on your self esteem where u think u deserve it (didnt make the steak they way he wanted it or fold the clothes the way he thought they should be) so u think ok if I do this an this better then things will get better(not true of course). I left one time before the last which was for good an it was when I became pregnant for my second child he tried to make me lose the baby an called my little girl a bit** one thing to call me that but not my little angel. Now if it wasnt for artimis house thur everything I dont know what I would have done but he got supervised visits at his grandma an at that time I was still around 21 an didnt think to have someone else drop her off an pick her up he talked me into being a family again as he now wanted the baby an so forth me being stupid an naive an raised to forgive I took him back an for a while it did change but not long. I later tried to get assistance thur welfare so I could leave an they said I made $5.00 to much believe it or not. I had no one who could help I was ashamed an didnt want anyone to know because everyone thought he was this great man. Didnt know what happened behind the close doors. In 2000 I was workin 3 jobs an hiding money so I could move out an my son was 8 an daughter was 10 had never seen him hit them or anything in front of me but that one night my son came to me cryin sayin take me somewhere safe dont let daddy hurt me anymore an that did it was one thing for it to happen to me(which is not right) but another to my kids I was thinkin I was keepin my kids safe an that they would have the 2 parent household that one parent was so looked down on. Within 3 days I had went down an got another protection order ,called my parents from work to let them know what was goin on an had my brothers help me move out in 4 hours before he got home from work an they moved my things into storage or into there home an it was the day before christmas they would not have had a christmas there as we had no christmas tree or present my parents made sure we had it all.Most of my brothers an sister had moved out as before there was no room an if he would have called childrens service they could have taken my kids which he tried no less. I am now on my second 5 yr protection order my kids had supervised visitation thur what is called here ermas house but he would break there rules over an over so for 4 long yrs I had to take my kids who would throw up an cry all the way there to see there dad for 1 hour a week an he could not be nice they finally took his visitation after my daughters therapist called over his breakin the rules all the time an them doin nothin because the lady in with them he would flirt with plus she ended up with ulcers at the age of 11 an my son at 9 they kept tellin me he was there father an he has rights. Ok then why couldnt he be nice to them I wasnt there so that can not be blamed on me I didnt tell them anything negative about him no matter what as he was there dad. But when is it for the best interest of the kids if he would have been doing better takin the parentin class he refused to take or the batters group even said he was not to be left alone with the kids an that he would batter again. I have been gone now for 8 yrs an would never go back but even in my divorce the lady judge treated me like crap I dont have a lot of faith in the legal system he has gotten off so many times for breakin it (cpo) or they just dont want to fill out the paper work or whatever. I just know my children an myself are safe an happy now dont judge these people so hard u have no idea if u have never been in the same situation. They are controllin an manipulative an are not in the case of men a real man because real men do not treat women an children like that. I am not a bitter person I have lived an learned an wished I could have done it different but that is in the past an I can not change that I can only learn from it an go on. I was lucky he didnt kill me what keep me goin was my kids which he would tell me he would take them an I would never see them again. I just know I owe my life to artimis house (batteries group) from gettin me a attorney pro bono to counselin for myself an childrent they are a god sent. Sorry this is so long just my opnion an my situation | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 8:38:36 AM | I had the same thing happen to me by my wife. she threw me out after i bought her a 350-Z-and then a boat and all new furt. when i went back to collect she said no. and 4 hrs later the cops showed up at my mothers to arrest me for violence on her..there were no witness..she made the hole thing up and she has been married 6times before.she did the samething to her last husband..the only diff..was he did not show up for court so she found me married me the golddiggerand thru me to the wolves her and her friend..they are both on here looking for more suckers that they can take to the bank.or have through in jail.for what ever she can get out of them..i was treated like scum by the courts and her.i was married with my first wife for 47 yrs..she came down with alziemers desease and i took care of her four five yrs before i but her in A home..so why would i marry her just to beat her???????? would like to hear from you and your thoughts. at wishing for you-1975..thanks for sharing this space with me..i hope that i ans some of your questions ..never stood a chance..  | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 8:48:53 AM | HI.. i had the same thing happen to me my wife thru me oue after i bought her a new 350-Z-and a boat and all new furt.when i went back to collect my things she started accusing me of affairs.w/her best freind and the neighbors so i left did not want to fight with her i loved her..4hrs later the cops showed up at my mothers house to arrest me but there was no proof on me or her at the time..so they did not arrest me but she took me to court anyways,she has done this before with her other husbands,that only diff is she new were i was at..she has been married 6 times now.she is a pro at this and her and her friend who works together on this site are looking for more suckers that they can take to the bank or jail.and take what they can get and sell it. to make money and move on.to the next..the courts treated me like scum i did not stand a chance she but on one great act. i never laid a hand on her.i was married before to my 1st wife for 47 yrs before she came down with alziemers desease.i took cqare of her the last five yrs and had to put her in a home.so why would i all of a sudden marry her and beat her?????
she is a pro at this her and her friend beware of these two.she is back on this site and they don't care..what she does and who she hurts..i didn't stand a chance.. Don would like to hear from you.. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 9:02:55 AM | | were did my life go..i had a bad case of falling in love with the wrong persaon and then being treated like scum.she is a liar and gold digger.she will take you to the bank and have you through in jail after she gets what she wants from you.I bought her a 350-Z- and boat and furt, and then when she was done with me she told me to leave and then she faked a beating..and the cops showed up at my mothers and tryed to arrest me but there was no witness and proof.but she did take me to court anyways and she won i didn't stand a chance she had her strae withness who is working this site again with her so they can find another sucker and have him thrown i jail.i was married to my first wife for 47 yrs until she came down with alzimers dease and then i had to but her in a home..i took care of her the last 5 yrs ..and then i meet her and fell in love again and she burnt me for it.and had me fead to the wolves..she has been marries 6 times already and i along with her last husband who she did the same way.only i wasn't as lucky she new were i was at. and now she is trying to ruin my life. she has all the witness that are on her side that are woman froends of hers that she has used before and they are coming after me..why after 47 yrs would i marry her and then all of a sudden decide to beat her. and not the one that i was with from 1956 to 2006.. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 9:04:08 AM | Heartseekertrue is 100% correct. I am the manager at a Domestic Violence shelter
in California. It is the children who suffer the most. I work with these people
every day. I file TRO's almost every day. YES THEY DO WORK!!!
Any questions? | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 9:28:35 AM | "The RED FLAGS"in an abussive relationships
If you hear these "famous"words-RUN
1.You are stupid
2.Nobody loves you I am always there for you
3.I hate my mom-she deserves to die.
4.Your friends are stupid.
5.Nobody called(erased messages)
6.Whose phone# is this?
7.We won't be going to the party because she/he is attending
8.You can not go out with your friends.
9.Your skirt is too short.
10.You can't talk right or write.
11.I want you to quit your job(you barely making it)
12.You don't love me if you don't..........
13.Why are you late?
All abussive people are CONTROLLING.They will never change.You are in their lives -they are not in yours.Everything is ABOUT them.They decide who you can be with or talk to.
You let them hit you once-Let that be the LAST time.If you let your kids see the abussiveness-they actually think that it is "normal"and once they are in relationships ...they will accept the same | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/20/2008 10:57:02 PM | Silken Fire
I fell in love with my x/bf and we lived together for almost three years. The first year was great. We did everything together. We would going dancing, cook, clean, wash the car, visit the families. Then the mother of his children started calling him for reasons that had nothing to do with the kids. We started having problems in Dec of 2007 so he left. I went thru the holidays alone and completely falling apart. In the middle of January of this year, I ran into him. He was dirty, hungry and living out of the car I bought him. I felt bad and offered a dinner and a shower for him. Well it was raining for days and I told him to stay until the rains let up. Yes I know my fault completely. He said he wanted to try. Next thing I know he started hitting me. He cold****d me on the side of my face. Left me a bruise the size of a 50 cent piece by my mouth. That was the start. To sum it all up. I ended up getting hit with num-chucks. You know what those are. What the martial arts use. basically the sticks with chain or rope connecting them. I was also held a prisoner. He told his daughter that he had to beat me at times to keep me in line. I escaped on March of this year and went straight to the police. I filed charges and a restraining order. I had them take pictures of the bruises. Well, time passed and I went to court. I was awarded the restraining order. But they dropped the charges. You ask why. Because those so called idiots at the police station lost the pictures and even tho they had the num-chucks for evidence, they said it was not enought. So he is free and then I find out I was not the first domestic violence. But because both the domestic's were in different counties. NOTHING was done. I sought counseling and am now trying to get my life back together. One more thing, women don't leave at times because they hope that he will change. So I leave this in Gods hands. Praise the Lord I haven't seen him. We only live within 15 miles of each other and I was always looking behind my back to see if I would find him around. Then I realized that snakes and cowards never leave there space. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 7:15:41 AM | It's very true ~ one must see the error of their ways ~ before any change is possible.
Education being court ordered and forced to attend ~ naturally one is annoyed , resentful , and really put out in general. ~ Just to attend, is all they can force you to do.
and if you don't ~~ they can only make you "wish" that you had. ~
In attending you will find you are in class with a bunch of "losers" like yourself.
Each one will have some kind of sad story as to how they got there. You will get to heard some strange and funny stories. ~ It becomes quite clear that many are just plain screwed up ~ some just have a criminal mind ~ and some are simple minded and fell in with bad woman that pushed their buttons because they were easy to push. No ryhme or reason ~ more of a "I got you last" thing.
and then the class begins ~ you learn that there only about 5 reasons that make people mad. They are simple and easy to understand reasons~ you expore each and see how they might apply to you and your situation.
You learn that "you" ~ is the only thing that you "might " be able to control. You cannot control others! It's not your job ~to control others! ~This was where I found relief and the error in my ways . ~ I left my childhood home with some notion that a "man" was responsible for "EVERYTHING" ~ boy! what a load off it was ~ to final understand ~ my responsibilty were limited. That a woman has the right to do what ever she wanted too! ~ Even if it's wrong ~ no matter!
You learn how women (people) will attempt to pull you off base and make you act out a behavior in responce to theirs. ~ There is a foul line ~ know where it is ~ don't cross the foul line ~ don't be sucked in with anger or passion.
I think that the worst of them ~ walk away with something ~
and this is all any system can do at this point in addressing inapporiate behavior.
If you continue being a fool ~ your lot in life will not improve ~ you'll end up with an all expences paid stay at "Fudge Packed Hotel" complete room service with a girlfriend named "Bubba"
Oh ! and the money? ~ there's no financing ~ thats part of the punishment ~ you pay to stay in the world of free men. You pay for the classes, you pay the courts, you pay probation fees ~~ you pay your fines ~ and your attorney fees and your bailbonds man OR you go to jail ~~ it's your choice
The incentive is there for you to be a good student ~ You'd have to be a damn idiot to see it any other way.
Dance
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 7:30:53 AM | Well what I would like is a deployment of american police over in the UK to show the UK how it is done.
Maybe our lot would get off their fat lazy bottoms and do something for a change.
We have taken on the American way in debts and by following the president, so lets have a few swopping policemen - would frighten criminals who commit domestic violence to death in this country, if they got arrested for the crime and then got sent to prison.
While male police take the lead, and while male judges sit on the bench there is no hope for women apart from running and hiding like the animal that they have been treated like by the criminal but this time it is with the courts support for him and throw her into a dirty old run down home for battered wives - When he should be in a home/prison for being a Bas*id to the human race.
How come if it is the law in the UK "that a criminal shall not profit from his crime" do so many violent men walk away from domestic violence the winners, with the house, the money, and anything else they could get their hands on before they got their sorry arses divorced??
SORRY CHAPS RANT OVER but sick to death of english law protecting the criminal and hounding the victims. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 7:51:05 AM | Last year here in this town where I live..
A woman threw herself onto the road and rolled around to put marks on her body..
Then she called the cops and told them her husband had beat her up..
When they came looking to arrest her ol- man , a young boy that lives next door told the cops what she had done..
She was arrested instead of him for making a false report..
He divorced her and got custody of the kids.
He found out she was cheating on him and wanted to get him put in jail so that she could be with her boyfriend.. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 9:41:27 AM | Yes nebula22 ` those things do happen ~ and it's the job of good judges and investigating officers to be aware of this ~ sometimes they do well ~ and sometimes ~they don't.
Men make many, many mistakes ` their choice of women ~ to start ~ the most fun ones ~ are rarly the bests ones for companions. ~ They are just more fun ~ and you pay for fun.
To learn how to pick and choise ~ seem to affect your whole ~ doesn't it?
If you want an amusement ride ~ and all the thrills and laughs that goes with it ~ It's there. ~ But understand your life becomes an Amusement Park.
The sad part for a man is to get invested heart and soul only to discover you are on the ride of your life ~ did that little 130 pound darling fox you in? ~ or what! Made you spend your money ~and act a fool ?
She can't take you anywhere ~ you don't already know how to go ~(Eagles)
The fault is yours. ~ for being fooled.
The skills required to see these ladies for what they are ~ is not always easy ~ but the signs are there ~ you are just refusing to see them! ~ You are having too much fun and she's sooo hot!
I enjoy a women full of fire and wild behavior at times ~ but you don't bring them home to mother! Leave them where you find them ~ don't play the puppet fool. ~ Learn to say "no" ~ or "Hell No"
I've never ran a women off telling her "NO" ~ they seem to like it really ~ consider it a challenge ` they will pout and act mad ` but thats all in the game.
You make them work hard ~ let them fault the line if there be one.
You just set back and try to enjoy the show
Dance | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 11:18:49 AM | Snglmoma2.... Your post makes several worthy points in terms of educating people about how a person can become financially disempowered in a relationship to the extent that "choice" becomes only the ability to choose between crap, crappier and crappiest. It's so hard when a person is already down to almost nothing (having been stripped of most of the things that give a person any feeling of control) to surrender those final things that at least make taking care of the kids possible. It's why I am such a strong proponent of women staying in school and getting their careers well underway before they EVER have children.
Even a dowdy transition house is better than "no place to go" but I understand when a woman is fighting to just try to hold on to those last pieces that remain from what she once had. I am so glad you and your children survived that situation and that there are now women's groups to offer the emotional support you needed...
I left our home and now the legal system allowed him to stay in our recidence eventhough the DA chose in my favour .............meanwhile he stole all my childrens belongings and mine..........now tell me again why women don't leave???
It is not as easy as it sounds..........
I urge all women to do background checks before really getting into relationships.
Self defence is a must -it saved my life.Also THERE ARE SIGNS before the abuse.
This is a good piece of advice Sunscents... I forgot to check where you are that you have access to people's background records but I don't know of any such device here in Canada. I can think of many arguments against someone who is dating someone else doing criminal records checks on every person they meet such as invasion of privacy but I agree that there are signs that are pretty telling IF (and I do mean IF) a person knows what they are... And you're right, it's NOT as easy as it sounds... Not by a long shot.
First of all,I don't see why any charge that is laid for domestic violence,should not be accompanied by a restraining order against the person charged,which should be invoked immediately.
I'd say that in most cases, where an assault charge has been laid, there is a restraining order issued Helinda. But that paper is only as strong in its warning as the ears it falls on... And.. there are a lot of cases where it takes time for the police and Crown to decide if charges should even be laid...
I had one case a few years ago where the guy held lifted his wife up by her neck in front of her 12 year old daughter, tore her clothes off of her and beat her up. His intention was to humiliate her and of course, to control her. He was arrested and taken to jail but he told the Justice of the Peace that his business that he ran out of their home would be ruined if he wasn't allowed to return to the matrimonial home. (He had a telephone business line in the home that he could easily have call forwarded). The JP, let him return to the house that same night!! It's these kind of asinine decisions that make women feel so very unsure about what to do...
The only thing I got from the first one was to hang around the coffee shops, so the police got to know me personally, and would therefore respond to a call more quickly!
OMG Tchofclas... I can't believe even a counselor would feel so helpless in the face of the circumstances that they'd stretch to tell you to develop an affinity for donuts and coffee shops. I'm sure it wasn't funny when the counselor said it, but I hope you can laugh now about how off-the-wall that suggestion is!
And I think as women, we have to realize if the signs are there, no matter how nice he seems, run for your life, as that is what it may come down to if you persue the relationship. I think we have to get rid of the fairytale thinking that we can change him, or he wouldn't do that to me.
You make an excellent, excellent point here TchofClas... I hope everybody reads it because it goes to the heart of what causes some of the problems. I'm sure there aren't too many of us who haven't heard someone talk about why they are down on their luck and blaming their previous partners for infidelity or for "unfairly" accusing them of infidelity. And it is usually ALL of their exes. Many people decide that THEY can be the ones to love that person back into normal behaviors... I hate to say it but women are particularly prone to this kind of thinking and some of it goes to ego. We read all the time on these forums about how we shouldn't judge others but I think there is a big difference between paying attention to a red flag and rendering a judgment. That magical thinking is the stuff of fantasies and people need to be completely "heads up" when someone is playing on their compassion to gain a foothold into their lives.
Guess when he was finally out, (took 6 years) he figured he had nothing to lose by coming back after me.
There is no one so dangerous as someone with nothing to lose. Especially the guy who already has a criminal record, can't find a job because of it and can't support himself. Such was the case with my offender. It meant NOTHING to him to go to jail and EVERYTHING to him to be able to impose himself on someone who ALSO knew he had nothing to lose. It's not only an extremely dangerous situation but the playing field is NEVER equal.. And, these people choose someone with A GREAT DEAL to lose...
If people would only listen... | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 11:48:40 AM | Wishing for you - 1975.... I am not quite sure how to respond to your posts except to say that I am sorry you were hurt by someone. I appreciate your posting because if nothing else, it illustrates what can happen when we don't pay attention to those red flags we've been discussing in this thread.
A number of people are talking about something called "malicious prosecution" and of course, in an imperfect system, it does happen that manipulative, controlling people will also use the judicial system to take what they want from our lives. The legal doctrine has always been the preference to "let 12 guilty men go free rather than to punish 1 innocent man" but I doubt that the victims of the 12 guilty men would agree.
It sounds to me like you needed a better lawyer...
In the middle of January of this year, I ran into him. He was dirty, hungry and living out of the car I bought him. I felt bad and offered a dinner and a shower for him. Well it was raining for days and I told him to stay until the rains let up. Yes I know my fault completely. He said he wanted to try. Next thing I know he started hitting me. He cold****d me on the side of my face. Left me a bruise the size of a 50 cent piece by my mouth.
With such people, no good deed ever goes unpunished Azteca!
I filed charges and a restraining order. I had them take pictures of the bruises. Well, time passed and I went to court. I was awarded the restraining order. But they dropped the charges. You ask why. Because those so called idiots at the police station lost the pictures and even tho they had the num-chucks for evidence, they said it was not enought. So he is free and then I find out I was not the first domestic violence. But because both the domestic's were in different counties. NOTHING was done.
This makes me so sad and so angry! Why couldn't the person who took the pictures testify that they had seen your injuries and taken pictures that had subsequently been lost? Something really stinks in your situation Azteca... I think this is the type of case that merits reporting higher and higher in the chain of command at the police station and with the prosecutor's office.
We saw in the OJ Simpson trial how the defence used the "chain of evidence" to undercut the prosecution's position but anyone with any common sense could see that the blood in his Bronco certainly pointed to his guilt along with many other things. But it shows how the technicalities getting people off or keeping people from being charged can interfere with the fair and equitable administration of justice.
Once again, I am so sorry that happened to you...
The incentive is there for you to be a good student ~ You'd have to be a damn idiot to see it any other way.
And there are many "damn idiots" out and about Dance... Your message #59 is VERY informative about what they're trying to get across in anger management classes and about the limitations of the system to try to drill it into people's heads that they can't control other people but you know what? They can... control other people that is... For awhile anyway...
For some those classes are probably a real eye-opener and they do relieve someone of feeling "responsible for every damn thing"... I don't doubt that for a minute. But for the guy who has no boundaries and thinks of other people as appliances who are simply on this earth to serve him, they are simply a joke. (Ditto for female abusers).
She was arrested instead of him for making a false report..
He divorced her and got custody of the kids.
He found out she was cheating on him and wanted to get him put in jail so that she could be with her boyfriend..
Nebula... For every story where justice not only got done but was also "seen to be done", there are countless stories of where justice has truly worn the blindfold...
I guess your point overall is to say that underlying motives are often a critical consideration when allegations of abuse come about and I don't think anyone can dispute that but I also think these cases are more exceptions than the rule.
We could get into some heavy-duty story-swapping but the point I am trying to make with this thread is that when people ask why someone in an abusive situation doesn't "just leave", it is often because they can't feel safe in the "system's" ability to take care of the offender in such a way that they are safe to move on.
Sadly, the people who could really speak to this issue are no longer here to be able to talk to us about what the legal system did or failed to do or what they think could have made a difference. It isn't only the medical profession who can "bury their mistakes"... God help us! | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 3:34:55 PM | yep ~ mistakes are made ~ but they are few.
men don't need to be strong arming anyone ~ much less women.
I know for a fact women are not near as delicate as they appear. ~
But you loose any consideration if they show up with marks on them. ~
You might well be subjected to your rights of trial. ~ and it really starts getting expensive. Even if you win.
and this is the small stuff ~~ You have Hurt someone! You have damage them physically and mentally
There a lot more women being abused then men being railroaded by the system.
Don't start the pattern of an abuser ~
I started out as a space violator ~ this is learned behavior ~ my father was very rough with me as a child. ~ criminally rough ~ He did this when no one else was around, from the age of 2 to 8 ~ then he got more confindent with his abuse and did it openly.
It continued until one day ~ the mouse turned. ~
When your space is consitently violated as a little person ~when there is "no" place safe or no place thats yours ~ you will repeat the behavior.
I can and did violate others people space for the simples reasons if they annoyed me. ~~ Big guys, little guys ~ women ~ it made little difference, if I was annoyed or put out with someone. ~ I never beat on a woman but I did strike two ~ one time~ and thats one time too much.
Somehow ~ men have to grow passed their raising ~ You have been taught bad behavior that is totally unexceptable in todays world.
If we were cavemen ~ it might be different and more acceptable.
Dance | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 3:49:08 PM | I do have to admit that the Police Depatment in WPB Florida did a great job of helping me out.I had a wonderful lady officer who immediately noticed my being overly stressed out .I was sitting at the police station and the first thing the lady officer said after seeing the teeth marks on my body that" I can tell that you are "running on trendeling"and if you don't mind I would like to take you to the back room and check your body out for any further injuries".I said-ok.
I removed my shirt and she asked me if I was aware that I had a sharp mark from neck down to my tailbone........I said I didn;t know and didn't feel it . The officer explained that some people do not even know that they have been shot until much later!She kept on taking lots of pictures.
The mark came from the initial attack when he jumped on top of me at night and the jump was so severe that the mattress cave in ,moved from underneath me and I got crushed against the iron railing on that side of the bed.
The best thing was that an officer at the sceene told me that when my ex called and put a claim against me ,he had fershly scratched marks on one side of his face.He also said that a wound that small will not bleed 24 hours later!Also the same officer had been on the sceene before when he beat up the girlfriend before me and again......had self made injuries.
Again -Do not ever be afraid of telling anybody what's going on if you are being abused!!!IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT!!!Take pictures yourself and let someone know you had done so.Again after the first hit ...........they won't stop.......they get worse.
When you do write your restraining order.............only put down what happened......don't talk about anything else on the sheet but stick to that moment........I do believe that if you linger on your testimony about previous events....it gets weaker...kind of like ..."here goes another one".."you desrved it-since you didn't have the smarts to get the hell outta there earlier"
BE STRONG-only weak people are controlling and abusive............it is hate against themselves....and you are only the innocent by-stander. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 4:25:20 PM | Here in dubois county indiana I was flat out told than women's abuse of men is of NO CONCERN because the level of violence is lower than when men abuse women. This from a CONSELOR named Bernie Kay at southern hills (a mental help center). In 1992 I went to crisis connection concerning disturbing behavior of my then wife. They IGNRED me for 40 minutes then told me I needed to leave or the police would be called! They made NO record I was there. In 1994 my son went there on advice of an unknown relative. He was ignored and ALL the FEMALE people were taken before he was seen. To this day he becomes angry at his treatment. I was mostly emotionally abused but there were slaps and thrown objects from time to time. If I were late from work for even a few minutes she would go on a mad fit about my being no good and a cheater. I NEVER cheated! After being abused for years I plowed her hard! OH! Now there is violence and I am a criminal. The beast made my then 7 year old son read stories out loud and show pictures of men killing their kids to my then 4 year old son. No one cared about that and she was never charged or even interviewed. When I found this out I immediately filed for divorce. We divorced in November 1998 and she still harrasses me at every opportunity. The judge would not even order her to stay out of my house! In another year my youngest son will graduate and I will be able to move as they both will be out of school.
YES I was evil in taking revenge and have gone to counseling and have learned and made some changes in my life. So long as low life social workers with an agenda of their own are in control of domestic disputes and only see women as the victims and men as always being the problem this country has NO HOPE of stopping violence.
The only thing I see that is just the last 2-3 years developing is both parties are being held liable for the CHILD abuse they are causing the kids who are stuck in the mess.
Any one who has been married knows men and women are the same! We are both capable of great good or evil. I chose evil and will regret it to the day I die. The really sad thing is I see no other way the situation was going to be resolved. If I had left with the boys she would have had the law on her side even more. So I spent 3 years sleeping at my son's bedroom door so they would be safe. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 5:25:42 PM | ER,
More and more jurisdictions are recognzing that men can be victims of DV as well as women. Sounds like your crew up there could use a good lawsuit to force equal treatment under the law. However, the notion that only women can be victims has been discredited and the news should be filtering out to your neck of the woods any day now.
I'm glad you've gotten through it as well as you have! | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 5:28:08 PM | To say the least.. I caught my ex using meth..And on a singles site.. (go figure) Tried to "work things out"... No change in her for the last month of our "relationship".. I tried to talk to her many times.. About her drug use and hitting the kids almost daily.. (hers from another lover) To no avail.. Finally I had enough.. I was leaving and being the "adult" to let her know what was about to happen.. Again she was high and didn't take it so well.. She really scared me and I've never seen that side of her before.. I've known her for 5-6 years.. Been together for 2 1/2.. Well I was tired of being assaulted and threatened so I left WITHOUT LAYING A HAND ON HER OR THE BOYS!!! I was arrested 45 minutes later when she brought the cops to my friends house after calling me to see "where I was and if I was alright, that she loved me and was sorry".. I was arrested on a couple felony charges along with child abuse.. As of now felonies have been dropped but I'm still going to trial on the lessers they lowered it to.. And I have to sue her for all my belongings if I want them back!!! That's what the state said.. Lesson learned.. Time to move on.. I'll sue her... I will never date a girl who has a history of drug use or mental health problems... I didn't know this til' I talked to her Dad a week before this all went down and he told me "she's always been like that".. I was like WTF!! Have a good day everyone.. Moving on..  | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 6:45:49 PM | I feel for you, man. I also admire your decision to learn and move on. Good for you!
When I worked as a counselor I saw quite a few clients who had stories similar to this. Street-smart women don't have to hit you to hurt you. If a woman hits her own kids, she's going to hurt you one day, especially if she uses drugs like meth. Count on it and get out before she decides she owns you.
Walking out on the kids, even if they aren't yours, would have been a bad option. An "anonymous" report to Child Protective Services would put the system on notice about her, especially if there's meth lying around.
We used to tell our clients that it was up to them to realize that they would never be able to control their provocative or combative partners, and while we could vouch for their progress, if the cops got called they'd be presumed guilty and go through exactly what you went through. However, after a conviction it's even worse, because you won't get a trial.
You're lucky that you have the wherewithall to take it to trial. There were some clients who pled out even though they probably really were innocent--because they didn't feel they could afford to go to trial. But for them we used to point out that they picked the partners who were able to convince the cops to make arrests. So, they too came to see that they were responsible for their predicament. That in no way absolved the partners who used the legal system as a weapon, but for the rest of us it's good to know what can happen when you pick a female partner who has poor impulse control.
Good luck! Be sure to have a witness present when you get your stuff! | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 6:47:36 PM |
Any one who has been married knows men and women are the same! We are both capable of great good or evil. I chose evil and will regret it to the day I die. The really sad thing is I see no other way the situation was going to be resolved. If I had left with the boys she would have had the law on her side even more. So I spent 3 years sleeping at my son's bedroom door so they would be safe.
As I've said before on this thread, there can be no doubt that some men have been through hell while living with an out-of-control woman and knowing that to leave would leave the kids at her mercy. Custody and access issues were weighted in favor of the woman with something called the "tender years doctrine" that historically held that children under 7 were better off with their mothers. That doctrine is no longer openly applied in many jurisdictions but it still forms a part of the basis for some of the custodial decisions being made by older judges who have remained more traditional in their thinking.
In the late 80's, I was aware of battered mens groups starting up in my area but I don't know if they still are running. I see with a quick google that there is help for men through some of the transition houses, the John Howard Society and various independent support groups that someone simply starts out of their own homes.
I think society is slowly realizing that we can't put mens' backs up to the wall and expect them not to eventually react but change is slow to come about. One of the reasons women have the help and groups that they do is because women have actually started to speak up and some have even started their own discussion groups... Often those groups will be around books like Bruce Fisher's "Rebuilding", Patricia Evan's "The Verbally Abusive Relationship or Harriet Lerner's "The Dance of Anger". I wonder why more men are not doing this?
I was arrested on a couple felony charges along with child abuse.. As of now felonies have been dropped but I'm still going to trial on the lessers they lowered it to.. And I have to sue her for all my belongings if I want them back!!!
Maybe her Dad would be willing to testify? or neighbors? or anyone?
If "she's always been like that", why hasn't he or someone else stepped in .. at least for the kids' sakes? Somebody should be discussing the situation with the government agency that protects children in your area.
As for your stuff, it's common that property division is litigated when a longterm relationship ends. Of course, if she's hooked on meth and unable to work, chances are good, she will have pawned anything of value by the time it gets to court.
The consequences of abuse are far-reaching for the victim regardless of gender and I think, to some extent, this also illustrates why so many people live with abuse for far longer than they should... because the losses and risk to those they love become bigger and bigger and bigger over time. Many end up just trying to do damage control instead of worrying about themselves. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 7:55:38 PM | The law does what it's allowed, by the laws passed in how to handle these situations. No system is going to be perfect and yes, there is always room for improvement. The law is there to use when in need, but one has to be, "Self Assertive", along with doing all the legality's. Something to remember, “The law can’t get there, as fast as you can protect yourself either.”
I've seen a fare share of domestic violence, when I was growing up-- from neighbors-- in some family members and from some friends, I've met along the way. There is more out there, then anyone would ever think. Never been in one myself, but did date a man a while back, for a few months, that I soon found out, what was a deal breaker for me, through several people telling me, “You better watch him”. I did some digging research, stopped dating him, and he did not like that. I ended up being stalked for a good long time after. Found out the man had gotten away with domestic abuse, too many times before with other women, but not this time around.
So I had a taste of legal law and it took a lot of, "Time", dealing with them, but justice was finally reached. I learned that if you don’t get satisfaction from one, under the law person your dealing with, go higher up, it works. I never gave up, made up my mind, "I'm not quitting, this person is going to learn what's not right". And he did, with me anyway. He got a big fine, time in jail and it's on his record, so that the next lady that comes along, if she uses her head, will do a check, see it and make up her own mind. That is one reason, I pressed so hard and hung in there with the time.
Self assertive: I brought home another big dog, added a pump 12 gage shot gun, already had my CCP and training in self defense behind me. I did what I was told to do, which was not much from the law department, so I sought out a well known lawyers advice and she did not even charge me for that. I sent a certified letter of desist, got the receipt back, took a copy to the station along with, saved cell and land line phone records, emails, letters sent, all message recordings that filled two recording tapes, heck, I saved everything, and put up my four no trespassing signs.
One week, On a nice Sunday afternoon, I sat out on my front porch steps, with a cup of coffee, cell phone sitting beside me and shot gun lying across my legs. I saw his car coming down the road, while I starred hard, not moving anything, but my head with his car moving. He did not turn into my drive that day, but speeded up, driving on past. That was the last time, he drove up in my yard. Sometimes, when your dealing with the not so sane, you have do things that you never dreamed of having to do, just to beat the unstable minded person your suddenly having to deal with. I just had to deal with the phone calls after that afternoon, for a long time, until the day he realized that he was found guilty. I showed up, but never was called into see the judge. Plenty enough evidence was presented. The cop assigned to the case, told me he was very impressed, with my how neat and organized my evidence was.
About a few months later, after that day of justice, I was driving down a country road, slowly. Saw him driving toward me, and he passed, without a glance toward me, and that was much better then what the situation was before that day.
One thing I want to say, to anybody, going through something like or the actual domestic abuse, whether it is from a man or a woman, "This life is too short. You can be a great person, with compassion, have plenty of tolerance for the normal stresses in life, love for life, etc..., but when one is faced with these circumstances, there comes a time for one to decide not to a be a victim. Then it's time to do what you've got to do, to stand up for yourself and if you have children, that standing up should be even more powerful."
It does not matter how big or small one is, "It's time for mind over matter and to become bigger then what ones challenges are."
Anyone who's been through it, “Hat's off to you for surviving and make sure, you self educate, to avoid any other occurrences.”
Peace To All In This Forum | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/21/2008 11:59:14 PM | I noticed the RED flags when in my last relationship but I ignored all of them and I can honestly say that I learned my lesson though it was at the sake of my life....he very easily could have killed me.
I am still waiting on the court date for the Battery charges that I pressed against him and he has been out of jail for about 2 weeks now ..... after I found out that got out of jail I had a dream that he was after me and I woke up screaming on the top of my lungs.
I am constantly on my guard now and I do not go anywhere by myself anymore either.
I do have a restraining order against him but we all know how good they are....they are kinda like tp that you wipe with if ya know what i mean. lol | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/22/2008 3:28:11 AM | hey i actually live in australia and spent 8 years in a domestic violence relationship and the justice system here is ridiculous i met my now x when i was 15 and he was 27 im sure that says enough.i eventually had 2 kids 2 him...... why didnt i just leave?1 things 4 sure it wasnt coz i loved him coz i knew the 1st day he laid hands on me that love doesnt hurt that bad....i think it was more i would rather be hit than be alone at the time. and my kids? i had attempted 2 get away on numerous occassions but never succeeded. finally when it came 2 the crunch and i knew i had 2 leave i had no choice but to think of my kids and decided to trust his parents with my kids as they were dead against what he was doin....so i left living in a diffrent motel everyday 4 the first 3 months always 2 be atleast 2 hours from each other.then he went 2 jail so i decided 2 get a house and get my kids back.so i rang up my inlaws and told them i had a place and the kids can come home and they said ok finally the day came 4 my kids 2 come home......and they bolted and me tryin 2 get help from the justice system has been impossible my daughter who would now be 7 and my son 5 on the 30th of this month.
it has been near 3 years now since i have seen them heard from them nothing at all.and i have no legal grounds what so ever because i signed a form of what i thought was temporary custody so it was my fault im hoping 1 battered woman is reading this so i can say.....its not love,dont worry about being alone just go dont look back 4 1 second dont think 2wice just go.i had so many people saying that 2 me and i didnt listen i was put on life support twice had broken ribs now what have i got 2 live 4?my kids are gone?my self respect was almost none existent but all i could think is im going 2 fight i wasnt sure what 4 but i was goin 2 and i did. | |
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| Domestic violence and the legal system...How has it treated you?
Posted: 7/22/2008 5:14:19 AM | Why Leave?
Most would think that if a woman leaves a relationship that may be abusive whether physically or emotionally or both that she is free from the damaging, negative actions of her ex partner. More and more stories come to light that this simply is not the case. Unfortunately in the fight for control, the abuser will continue to use family law, courts and children's services agencies to continue the abuse. The emotional abuse to the detriment of the mother and in turn the children, can be carried on for years. In fairness, there are cases when the man is the victim as well and should be duly noted although this is written with what many women have experienced as the main source of reference.
Due to what seem to be contradictions in family and child protection law, women are continually exposed to their abusers and/or made victims of a system that does not appear to recognize or have the means to end the cycle. In some cases it's relevance has not yet even been acknowledged.
Harassment, defamation of character and emotional abuse in particular are very hard to prove, especially when it is a matter of "he said, she said". Oftentimes the children are caught in the middle and/or used to drag out court proceedings, have mothers investigated by children's services or carry messages from the father. This, in turn can further isolate the woman, cause detrimental effects to her self esteem, confidence and ability to effectively parent. All aiding the vicious circle to continue when her mental stability is questioned as could be her ability to parent.
Some judges are still of the mindset that just because there is abuse against the mother, the father would not necessarily abuse the children. In some cases when a man has lost control of the woman he then turns to the children to regain the means to enable his ability to fulfill his own needs for power. In some cases the children become the victims of emotional abuse by being sought to take the “side” of the father and become alienated from the mother. Where there are options such as vexatious litigation, they can take years to prove and in the meantime the woman and children continue to suffer the negative effects. In some cases it would seem there are legitimate reasons for motions where children, access and custody are involved. It can then merely be a means to have the process dragged out and further the harassment. There also seems to be no hindrance in regards to alienation of the children from their mother or discouraging disparaging remarks towards the mother as it is difficult to both prove and enforce.
In regards to the children's protection agencies, their hands are figuratively tied. They are obligated to investigate any allegation of neglect, abuse etc. What many may not realize is the detrimental effects this may have on the mother. Even when there is no cause for protection of the children or an agency's involvement, they must undergo the scrutiny of such agencies, sometimes having the family's schools, doctors or counselors involved and made aware of the investigation. It could be considered highly embarrassing and damaging to one's reputation, only to have the file eventually closed and no concerns brought to light.
While many professionals are being trained to be aware of the sensitivities of these issues, there still remains a stigma that women who declare abuse are possibly vindictive or mentally unstable. There are very little effective and expedient avenues for women to protect themselves from ongoing abuse from their ex partners through family law and children's agencies. It is described as a process many women have to simply try to "get through" and "stay strong" amidst the constant persecution of character, intimidation and threats through the actions of the ex-partner and in regards to the children's custody and access.
How many women give up just to simply end the harassment? How many are pushed to the point that mentally they can no longer effectively parent their children and have to have children's agencies involved? How many turn to drug and alcohol addiction as a means to cope with the abuse and disappointment at having no means to protect themselves from what would seem ongoing persecution of their character, intimidation and harassment they are unable to prove? How many develop eating disorders? How many seek counseling and prescription medicine to treat depression?
My hope is that by spreading this message, those in positions of power can address the contradictions that leave women falling through the cracks and find a way to protect them before too much damage is done. Also to see the signs of ongoing abuse through children's agencies and the court system/family law and acknowledge their existence.
References
Children's Safety: Contradiction in the System
by Pamela Cross
http://www.owjn.org/custody/contra.htm
Custody and Access or Contact and Control?
Georgina Taylor and Ajax Quinby, Facilitators
Custody and Access Support Group, Munroe Transition House
http://www.bcifv.org/resources/newsletter/1994/spring/contactcontrol.shtml
After the Abuse Has Ended
CenterSite
http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=8490&cn=2
Custody, Access and Child Support in Canada
REPORT ON FEDERAL-PROVINCIAL-TERRITORIAL CONSULTATIONS
http://www.justice.gc.ca/eng/pi/pad-rpad/rep-rap/cons/fpt_cons/nfldb-tnb.html
CHAPTER 1:
The Divorcing Family
http://cmte.parl.gc.ca/Content/HOC/committee/361/sjca/reports/rp1031529/sjcarp02/12-ch1-e.htm#0.2.5FPCNZ.Y2KCKM.UT5O3F.X2
This is a piece I have written recently and I find it fits in well with the discussion. Sorry for the length but I find the links under references are also good reading in regards to the many faceted issues of domestic abuse. Oh and "hello" all, hope I didn't offend any forum etiquettes   | |
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