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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/5/2008 9:08:55 PM | The last three posts really need to reread the post.
I do agree that most 12 year olds don't really understand hate, but I see it as their way of expressing the hurt that is caused by the parent that will not be a parent.
I mean I didn't read anything about new shoes in the OP or anything that implied the Dad was trying.
As for parent alienation. I think we should start a movement against the parents that alienate themselves. Maybe a couple of court cases and these parents will get the idea that they need to support their children emotionally, spiritually, and financially. The children are not toys to be put down when they are tired of them. I bet for every parent that bad mouths the other - there is a parent that tries to keep a bridge between the uncaring parent and the child. Go back and read the original post. She is not talking about a Daddy, she is talking about a father. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/5/2008 10:51:27 PM | Btj and insatiable, I have to respectfully disagree with both of you regarding hate. Unless you have lived with an abusive father, verbally and emotionally, you don't have any idea what you are talking about. When my x who is my daughter's biological father calls her a B**** and a wh***, she needs no encouragement from me to experience ill will toward her father. My X pays his support regularly and on-time and I think the kids and I would all rather receive nothing and have him treat the children decently and spend real time with them but that's never going to happen so we are grateful for the money and I do remind my children of that as well as other things that he does do.
A 12-year-old is perfectly capable of feeling hatred for his/her father or anyone else. These are feelings, they are having them and they have a right to have them. What is our job as parents, however, is teaching them what to do with those feelings so that they are behaving in a way that is positive for them and can hopefully create a better situation with the errant parent. When the emotions have passed, we again discuss that dad loves you in his own strange way and just as with everyone else, you need to try to rise above the situation and take the high road; easier said than done.
Come on people, even when we try to do the right thing and not badmouth the parent but find a constructive way to deal with the fallout for what they do to their children, do you not remember that at some point you likely hated the guy/gal too? So to discount their feelings or force them to show respect beyond what they are expected to show any adult person on the planet is unreasonable and I don't believe sound.
My children do not respect their father beyond what could I guess be called the de facto respect that I require them to have for myself and their father, i.e. more than good manners require because we ARE their parents. Beyond that, both of us have to earn respect from our children. My daughter has unfortunately been subjected to the brunt of her dad's verbal abuse and if she defends herself by a verbal counter-attack, I tell her that she should try not to allow her father to upset her to that extent and to try to wait and talk to him when both are more calm.
What people do not get is that some of these parents are not just absent and inconsiderate, they are bullies. I do not expect my children to get a beating at school without defending themselves and I do not expect them to refrain from defending themselves even from their father. When these events have occurred, whether my daughter or one of my sons, they tell me what happened, their part in things and discuss how to hopefully the next time not lose their cool even when their father invariably does.
My children love their father and it also breaks their hearts that they sometimes hate him. It is what it is, we muddle through and hope that things will get better. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/6/2008 9:46:28 AM |
If you want to make things easier on your girl just bring a step dad figure in her life. It will be so easier for your girl
Although bringing another male into her life to show her what a positive male role model should be, why does it have to be a step dad? Why couldn't it be a good friend of the family or for those that are religious, a priest? IMHO bringing in another "dad" would only complicate things more. Start thinking long term here, you are teaching your child that its ok to just replace the things that you don't like in your life. How is this going to effect her attitude when she has children? Wouldn't it be easier to just help her deal with and understand her emotions and concerns about her father? | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/6/2008 11:28:38 AM | Janofc is that directed at me? Are you trying to say that im iliterate? I was giving my opinion, my personal opinion that both my daughter and the person who posted this post my opinion. Do you have a 12 year old daughter who hates her father? Cas if you dont then how can you state your opinion about how a 12 year old feels about her situation regarding hating a parent. I havnt a clue how this womans daughter feels, however I was giving her some helpful advice regarding how my daughter has expressed her hatred and how we are coping as a family. So no I dont need to reread the post. Maybe you shouldnt be so judgemental on other peoples posts when they are just expressing their own views....god judgemental people make me soooo mad...... | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/6/2008 2:40:53 PM | | Cherie, I think Janofc was referring to Btj and insatiable, both of whom indicated that a 12-year-old cannot hate his/her parent and/or if he/she does, it is the fault of the other parent for alienating the child. If you reread her posts she was indicating that many children do go through this yada, yada. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/6/2008 7:48:03 PM | | let me tell you something she would not have this hurt for her father if he had been there for her but these fathers think they can pop in and out of there kids life and its ok when the guilt has come over, All your doing is making excuses for men out there if something is important to you you will goto any limit to reach it , So his child isn't that important to him and the other things are more important children aren't stupid they can figure it out | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/6/2008 8:02:29 PM | | no one can change her opinion about her father , except him. he doesn's seem to really want to. what she needs more then anything is a father figure. i'm guess you joined this sight in hopes of finding a good man that will love both you and your daughter. don't settle and definatly don't rush. some guys just don't age past the age of 5. others are kind loving honest and mature. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/7/2008 12:52:30 AM | no i was pretty much trying to say sod the ex
but im concerned the child is feeling hatred towards any1 dont blame her for feeling that way but shes the issue & 1 in need of help
ex1 = abusive alcoholic ex2 habitual crim
trust me i have a fare idea wot living with ratbags is all about but id still like to think my kids were not bought into arguments ...the deciding vote on me leaving the exes but never drawn into it
as for the father that calls his daughter a b**** & wh*** did u smack him in the gob? | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/7/2008 2:05:41 PM | I too have a 13 yr old daughter that has 'issues' with her father. She gets very moody and bitter either right before or right after she sees him. And these occasions are rare. he doesn't make a point to spend time with her or her brother. He actually had the gumption to get indignant when they didn't call him this past Father's Day. I've told her again and again that I realize she has some problems with him, but that she's going to have to talk to him about them. I can't solve them for her, but I'll be here for her if she wants to talk about it.
She made a statement one day that she was just going to give up on boys altogether. I told her that while she was just a teenager, that might not be a bad idea (wink, wink) however all boys (or men) are not the same no matter how much we girls might bash them. And that she should approach any new friendship on the merits of each situation. You never know who might be your new best friend.
You don't have to like him, but he is your father. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/7/2008 2:13:50 PM | | It's sad for sure that this child has said this, alot of circumstances like this happen because the mother does not allow the father to see the child also. If the father pays child support the father is equally allowed to see the child when he wants also or the father should not have to pay child support. Many times also the woman or the father turns the child against the other parent which is very sad also and if this happens the child should be taken away until both parents have solved their problems between each other. The child is number one not the parents that is what parents have to learn. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/7/2008 3:47:22 PM | I don't normally respond to these posts, but this one has really caught my attention. I think a lot of you who posted a response here has gotten a little bit of part of the idea of what it feels like to be a 12 year old with the idea that one of your parents has 'abandoned' you. I think I have a pretty good idea of how this feels because I was there. It wasn't my dad who abandoned me, it was my mother. She sent me and my brother to live with my dad (after she won full custody mind you) and we never heard from her again. I was able to meet her again when I was older and lived with her for a few years, but it was really hard because I truely hated her.
The hate that I felt was not the adult hate that we think of, the hate that I felt was a very hurt feeling which in turn made me angry at her and in turn felt like hate. When a child/teenager says they hate one of their parents, I believe that in that second, they really do. One great thing about children though is they have a magical way of providing unconditional love for their parent. Despite everything that is done to them, they still love them.
The only thing that helped my relationship with my mother was time. We never had a close relationship until I grew up, moved out and spent a lot of years without contact with her. Once I became an adult and realized that our relationship would not get better until I was the one that put my pride down, I contacted my mother.
When kids are growing up in a broken family, they really learn a lot about life. The thing is, they don't realize they have learned it until they start living their life as an adult. On the other hand, when you have these adults who are being selfish and not thinking about what they are really doing to their children by not showing them that they care for them, these people never 'got it'. My mom finally 'got it' in full only last year. I will be 30 next month. That is a long time.
The only advise I would have to a parent who is wanting to make this situation better for their child going through this is to just love them. I know it hurts when you are watching your child hurting because of what your ex is doing to them, but you can't control your ex. You can only control yourself and how you parent that child. It is up to the child and the other parent to decide to make the connection.
It helped me when I was young to have a place to be able to talk about my feelings without feeling like I was going to get in trouble. No matter how much you tell your kids that they won't get into trouble for talking to you, you can't help what you feel and that comes out in your body language. Kids are excellent readers of body language. Having a friend outside the family or a counseler is the best person for the child to talk to. Through the counseling I had, I learned that it was OK to feel angry and it was OK to tell someone I was angry. I learned a positive way of expressing my anger and feelings. These are things that need to be taught to an angry child. If these issues are not addressed, its hard telling where their anger will go.
Hope I was some help and sorry for going on and on.. lol | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/11/2008 2:25:55 PM | Btj and insatiable, I have to respectfully disagree with both of you regarding hate. Unless you have lived with an abusive father, verbally and emotionally, you don't have any idea what you are talking about. When my x who is my daughter's biological father calls her a B**** and a wh***, she needs no encouragement from me to experience ill will toward her father.
My 12 year old daughter came to me a couple of weeks ago and told me she hated her father, I knew she didn't like him, and in the 8 years our relationship had been over, his contact with the kids had been at best erratic.
OP says that the relationship has been over for eight years. 
I left a letter on the side in ref to his child support as he was trying to get it reduced as he was claiming he saw the children every month and was claiming travel expense, She asked me why daddy was telling lies? what could I say to her.
The OP only says that contact has been erratic but didn't mention frequency. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/12/2008 5:05:40 PM | My 16yr old doesnt have much of anything positive to say about his dad. I encourage him to communicate as much as possible, but I dont force him. It was his dad that chose to be away from him, it wasnt my sons choice or mine.
I had to explain to my ex (he got upset too) that he needs to earn our sons trust, and respect that it just doesnt come from saying Im sorry. Ex's past may be in the past but for our son its just as present as can be.
The ex and I get along which is a good thing! It is my hope that over time they will get closer, but only time will tell.
As for dealing with the emotions I say counseling would be a great idea, its helped my son. I also suggest never telling her its bad to feel so negative about her father, as humans we have the right to feel however we feel. Whether we like it or not children will decide on their own without our input how they feel about the absent parent in their lives; it is up to us to be supportive, understanding, and hope that things change for their benefit. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/13/2008 10:37:12 AM | | hey just read ur letter, sorry u r having sooo much pain from this... but, she is acting out toward you because she is afraid to act out at him when he is around. my kids did the same thing and i would even have to reprogram my son as i call it when he had been with his dad... he had such anger toward me i didn't understand! when both my kids got older... which now they r 15 and 17 i asked them why they treated me so badly when i was always there for them. they both said same thing... they were afraid to take it out on him because of his past behavior toward me so they took it out on me instead because they knew i would console them and show them i still cared reguardless of their behavior. they knew i wasn't the bad guy and that was just their way of showing they needed reassurance that i wouldn't leave, like he did.i hope this helps a little. my daughter doesn't even go see her father anymore she said she didn't feel the need to, that i am the one that has done for her all these years and he has done nothing to amount to having the right to be called her father, which stung but, is so true... my son goes out there still but, only to spend time with his dog and to get a ride to his job near by, even he has no use for his father... so before he comes again sit down and have a heart to heart with her and tell het it hurts u to see her so angry and ask if there is anything she wants to talk about... tell her u won't get mad no matter what she says and see where it leads. good luck and god bless! | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 7/13/2008 10:38:16 AM | | hey just read ur letter, sorry u r having sooo much pain from this... but, she is acting out toward you because she is afraid to act out at him when he is around. my kids did the same thing and i would even have to reprogram my son as i call it when he had been with his dad... he had such anger toward me i didn't understand! when both my kids got older... which now they r 15 and 17 i asked them why they treated me so badly when i was always there for them. they both said same thing... they were afraid to take it out on him because of his past behavior toward me so they took it out on me instead because they knew i would console them and show them i still cared reguardless of their behavior. they knew i wasn't the bad guy and that was just their way of showing they needed reassurance that i wouldn't leave, like he did.i hope this helps a little. my daughter doesn't even go see her father anymore she said she didn't feel the need to, that i am the one that has done for her all these years and he has done nothing to amount to having the right to be called her father, which stung but, is so true... my son goes out there still but, only to spend time with his dog and to get a ride to his job near by, even he has no use for his father... so before he comes again sit down and have a heart to heart with her and tell het it hurts u to see her so angry and ask if there is anything she wants to talk about... tell her u won't get mad no matter what she says and see where it leads. good luck and god bless! | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 8/31/2008 3:53:43 PM | | I would like to thankyou all for the replies, sorry it has taken me a while to respond, Today she said something that left me lost for words, and it struck me so hard that I feel in some way I've failed her, the hatered the anger she has towards her farther shocked me, I knew it was there, but I didn't realise it went that deep, She screamed at me that her father was dead and that he had been shot and killed in Iraq, When she goes back to school next week I am going to approach the school and see if there is anyway I can get her into counslling, I also don't know if I should speak to her father tell him what she said. I don't know what to do. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 10:55:24 AM |
At the end of the day he isn't my problem my daughter is, has anyone got any suggestions as how to deal with these negative emotions my daughter has in regards to her father.
Sit down with her and tell her that she needs to displace a lot of that anger towards YOU. Explain to her that you're just as much at fault here as her dad. Show her that you picked this guy and made a horrible, inexcusable, mistake in picking him as her dad. Then you use this as a life-lesson and tell her to learn from your mistake and be very selective in choosing HER husband. Tell her to not be irresponsible, like you, and end up putting HER children through the same pain she is going through now. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 12:48:45 PM | Ref msg 41 from OP "I don't know what to do."
I would beging with a talk to her about the differences between the anguer- as logical reaction of frustration, rejection- as logical result of dissapointments and... hate.
Just to be sure are not your perceptions and there is a clear defintion of her feelings.
If hate, plain and simple, for whatever the reasons, I suggest counseling.
In anyway, if not, proper counseling due to your inability compared to a professional would be better and may show some light about her anger in order to control it and not let take over as perjudicial resentment toward self and/or other persons/things as reflected pattern. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 1:47:49 PM | | this comes from my own experiance as a child same as your daugther my father was the same and when i hit 11 i disliked behond words as i blamed him for leaving me i thouht he didnt love me she probably feels like i did | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 6:01:03 PM | Your post sounds like I could have written it. My daughter is pretty fed up with her dad for all the same reasons. She's almost 13 and it's been going on for years. He doesn't get it and likely never will. She's tried to tell him how she feels over the years about different things, he deosn't hear her. Last week she said "He's a loser, Mom and I'm sick of it" While I don't condone calling her father a loser...I must admit I am growing tired of the same old "We can't change him, we have to just accept him for who he is and at the same time make boundaries for our own selves on what we will and will not tolerate. blah, blah" Well, she's decided her boundary is now that she's not going there anymore and quite frankly he leaves in 1 month for 8 months, (like every year) so I now say "If you don't want to go you don't have to." After all I can't even get her to talk to him on the phone lately.
Her latest thing with him is that she goes to see him and he doesn't spend time with her, he makes her work in his pizza shack, pays her like crap and docks her pay for the smallest thing then screams and yells at her and his other employees in front of all his customers....She says "I hate him. He is disrespectful to everyone and is a complete loser." I agree (for these reasons and many more), although I still say "It's not nice to call your father a loser or say you hate him."
Bottom line is, she has to know, she has a right to be mad, and she does deserve better. Otherwise she will grow up thinking it's ok to be treated like crap. If she wants to stand up to him, let her. These guys are not good role models or fathers. Sure, all kids get mad at their parents and I don't suggest every child should be allowed to make a decision like this, but seeing your child a few days over the over the summer does not make you a "parent" or "father". He hasn't committed to her and their relationship, so really... why should she? She deserves better than half-hearted crap, nevermind his anger which is lately in the mix on top of it. Every child does-no exceptions. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 6:18:31 PM | Dear Trulysingle....
Please be clear - without him - she would not exist - in a 12 yr old's brain what you are saying translates to "He was a mistake and that makes me a mistake" My children were not mistakes, and neither was he. Our journey is what it is. Do I wish he had been a better husband (perhaps faithful and drug-free), father, parent and grown-up- ABSOLUTELY. But it doesn't make him or them, mistakes. I take responsibility for my mistakes, but they aren't on the list. Staying with him would have been a mistake though.... :) | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 6:47:39 PM |
would like to thankyou all for the replies, sorry it has taken me a while to respond, Today she said something that left me lost for words, and it struck me so hard that I feel in some way I've failed her, the hatered the anger she has towards her farther shocked me, I knew it was there, but I didn't realise it went that deep, She screamed at me that her father was dead and that he had been shot and killed in Iraq, When she goes back to school next week I am going to approach the school and see if there is anyway I can get her into counslling, I also don't know if I should speak to her father tell him what she said. I don't know what to do.
Damn, that sucks. I'm sorry. You have not failed her, he has. Actually, her expressing this anger to you, says a lot about her feelings of safety with you. Your nearest city likely has a community mental health center that can help. In my experience, school counselors have their hands full with other topics. I would suggest a counselor who works with teens and/or adults, not "children" as teens who get treated like "children" do not benefit as much. (In my opinion, I'm in the field)
In the meantime, she needs validation. It sounds like she thinks it would be easier if he were dead. I've heard that before too. In some ways it might be and some ways it might not be. Explore both sides with her. Any glimmer of hope or possiblity for him to smarten up dies with him. She wants the hope, just not the pain of the stagnant crap. It sounds to me like she has reached a point where she needs a goal. I don't mean "what do you want to be when you grow up" I mean - learning to hold on to a glimmer of hope, some love for him (but not necessarily "like") all the while not holding the anger in, exploding out, or letting him get the best of her. Not quite as easy as it sounds, but a counselor can help. She can't change him, but she can find a way to safely get the anger out and change her own reactions.
Finally, explore how you would feel if she was you. What would you have needed your mom to say or do? Do them all and ask her for additional suggestions on how you can help her.
She has a right to be angry and is obviously in pain. Don't tell her what is and is not acceptable for her to feel. | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 7:11:48 PM | on the one hand, i have witnessed many spouses encouraging bad feelings towards one another. on the other hand, i have seen some pretty narcissistic spouses, both male and female. then, there is the "new" mate.
my kids are very observant. in order to deal with the many issues i have told them that you can love someone and not like them. furthermore, some people just don't have a full deck of cards. i've focused on their boundaries and expectations from their limited relationship with my ex, bravo'ed his attempts to support them finanancially, made friends with the new "lady" while still keeping distant so as not to get involved in what i see will be future drama, and also focused on what they need to do in any relationship: the barebones and the frills for those who deserve it.
my kids have also had to deal with the losses of their birth parents. i simply say, do not hate the man, hate the disease. with respect to their mama, i suggest that none of us knows what we would have done in her shoes.
my oldest gets it, my little one is still in denial and lets her rage seep out here and there, but knows "how" to be civil. their brother is in la la land. they see a future father in the making, in their brother, and they do not like what they see. i taught them tough love. i also point out they are living testaments to what supposedly "can't be done".
whenever i can, i show them "good" and "stable" men. i point out examples of "good couples". i feel badly that my marriage had to end. but it did. i think, given what transpired, we do a pretty good job. it's all very sad.
try to be objective in your discussions with her and not personalize the saga. don't let her see the papers where you are arguing. unfortunately, it wrecks havoc on kids esteem. logical or not. i tell my kids to wrap "white light" around bad situations and ask the universe to take care and make things right, after the lessons are learned. it gives them hope, but not expectations. still, boundaries are important. listen, but do not encourage. let her formulate her opinions and teach her to give voice to feelings and learn appropriate actions.
namaste to you, OP | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/2/2008 8:53:28 PM | My opinion may not be popular, but ... I don't see what the problem is in her disliking her father. Her feelings are a result of his behaviors and lack of involvement in her life, so why would she feel any differently about him? I would guess her "hatred" for her father is moreso a defence mechanism she is using to cover the pain and rejection she must be feeling from her father. She is entitiled to feel what she is feeling.
It baffles me why parents tell their children that the "absent" biological parent "loves and cares for them", when their actions and behaviors towards the kids show quite the opposite Should the behavior of this man be what the children think loving and caring is all about? | |
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| 12 year old that hates her father
Posted: 9/3/2008 6:04:27 AM |
Please be clear - without him - she would not exist - in a 12 yr old's brain what you are saying translates to "He was a mistake and that makes me a mistake"
You don't give children enough credit. They're smart enough to know what you're saying is what you meant. If you think they DON'T get it then it's your job as a parent to reassure them that they weren't a mistake.
My children were not mistakes, and neither was he.
He wasn't?!? So, why aren't you guys still together??
I take responsibility for my mistakes, but they aren't on the list. Staying with him would have been a mistake though.... :)
If you did take responsibility then you would realize that picking him in the first place led to you having to make the decision to leave. | |
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