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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 8:52:11 AM |
I believe this forum is entitled "The Hillraisers, just won't fold" and not "We have been for McCain since the beginning". For those that have been firm supporters of McCain 'rock on', but for those that are acting like 'spoiled brats' or 'sore loser' because their candidate did not win 'move on'. What will the die hard Clinton people do if she is selected as the VP?
Yes it is, and I was a Hillary supporter, big time. I was not a McCain supporter from the beginning, even though I have known him for many years. Changing from a Hillary supporter to a McCain supporter does not mean I'm a "spoiled brat" or a "sore loser". It means given the choices, I am more comfortable with McCain.
When people evaluate candidates, they always have to pick from a list of imperfect people. I can't remember once when a candidate ran where he or she completely agreed with my POV. I worry about people who have such a shallow view of the world that they would just agree with any political platform hook, line and sinker. That doesn't show much critical thinking IMO.
I can't tell you what other people will do if Cinton gets the VP nod, but I can tell you what I will do. I will still vote for McCain. Being VP does not mean leading the country, it means being VP. It's not looking like Obama will pick Hillary for VP, and I'm hoping he doesn't. IMO, it's the only way he could possibly win is with Bill and Hillary's cache. I don't want to see them used that way -- in fact, I'm disappointed that Hillary said she would even accept the VP slot.
I have nothing against McCain. There is a big difference in a person supporting McCain because they are still upset with Obama's win or Clinton's not winning.
Yes, they're upset and for many reasons. First and foremost is fear regarding Obama's ability to fill the office. People who are supporting him, for the most part, are just hoping he fills out that "change" mantra with some actual policy, and that he will rise to the occasion in office. That's a dangerous way of thinking, IMO.
The people who don't support Obama feel that in these hard times we should not be putting an unknown quantity into office. I see no difference in putting Obama into office compared to a member of the DC city council or the local sheriff.
When kids took the ball back because they lost; how did you handle the situation? Did you cave into them? Did you move on? Maybe, you were the kid that took his or her ball back. Where do we go from here?
A little weird asking people what they did when they were 3, but if you must know, I was a tomboy and rarely lost the ball. But if I fell out of a tree, or someone else caught it on rare occasion, I just brushed myself off and kept on going.
Don't know what that has to do with politics though.
Here is Texas ~ more people here are racist then you would think possible ~ when you get down to the fine hairs. ~ They are not volient or militant about it ~ it's more of a suttle underlying fact. ~
I've spent a lot of time in Texas, and if you're spending time outside of Austin, you're probably right. I've got friends and family all over the state, and a relative that runs a government agency in Austin. He's known the Bush family for years, and thinks our President is a moron.
Austin is liberal. In the last few Presidential elections, it's gone Democrat, even though most of the rest of the state went Republican (Dallas is liberal too).
The rest of Texas is considerably more conservative. The "subtle" racism you're talking about is more the "good ole boys" not seeing blacks (or Hispanics, for that matter) as leaders, but they'll still drink and be friends with you. I see that changing in the not too distant future.
But the majority of people who are fearful of Obama becoming President aren't basing their selection on race. I know I'm not.
If the first chair is handed to the GOP ~ America has reach her Zenith in the 21 century and never will shine the light of freedom "by example" near as brighty again. We will be enslaved by special interest forever more. ~ It will be all about~ Coroperate America and Coroperate values of Global scale.
If that's true, then we're screwed, because if Obama becomes President he will be the next Jimmy Carter, and the country will be going to hell in a handbasket.
With that, they're calling my flight.
McCain 08! | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 11:31:03 AM | Vote for McCain and move on. You have a right to vote for whom you feel comfortable. This is America a free country.
I will vote for Obama under the same rights.
Have a Blessed Day!
===========================
McCain sounding more like Clinton--
==========================
McCain defends charge that Obama playing race card
NEW: McCain says he agrees that Obama is playing race card
McCain campaign says Obama played race card "from the bottom of the deck"
Obama spokesman immediately denies the assertion
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Sen. John McCain defended his campaign Thursday for saying that Sen. Barack Obama is playing the race card....................................................................
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Obama 08' | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 12:05:13 PM | Hey Faith, to add to what your saying, it was Hillary's campaign that played the race card first.
Now Obama has played the cards delt to him and won regaurdless (something Black People do regularly) they want to change the game.
"hard working, WHITE working class people" Hmmmmmmmmmmm who started that one??
I seriously doubt that anyone who truely supported Hillary would even remotely contemplate supporting McCain since he's the diametric opposite to everything Hillary stood for.
I smell Neo-Cons in sheeps clothing.... which would also explain why she has all this campaign debt that Barack Obama, not her (supporters) is helping her with.
Seems like Rush Limbaugh's plan to flood Hillary's voting booths with "cloaked" Neo-Cons in an effort to prop her up against McCain almost worked. Now that the primaries are over, they went back to their original choice and left Hillary to blow in the breeze.
"with friend like that........."
Truth of the matter is if you are a real Hillary supporter you may sit this one out if you were really that bitter that Barack won, but you wouldnt shoot yourself in the proverbial foot by supporting McCain who is the opposite of Hillary politically and issue wise over Barack Obama who closely mirrors the policies of Hillary.
Most likely if your gonna vote McCain now, it was always your plan to do so!
Someone who has more time on there hands than I should do some reserch on which states had last minute voter registration switches so that people could participate in the democratic primaries, along with the numbers of registered republicans who participated in the democratic primaries as well. I'm pretty sure the results would be very telling! | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 12:58:11 PM |
I seriously doubt that anyone who truely supported Hillary would even remotely contemplate supporting McCain since he's the diametric opposite to everything Hillary stood for.
I smell Neo-Cons in sheeps clothing......
Either that, or they are racist and would rather switch parties, than vote for a black man to be the President of the United States.
I've already seen two posters on other threads admit to this.
Obama 2008! | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 1:15:30 PM | Seems like Rush Limbaugh's plan to flood Hillary's voting booths with "cloaked" Neo-Cons in an effort to prop her up against McCain almost worked. Now that the primaries are over, they went back to their original choice and left Hillary to blow in the breeze.
agreed blacksheep ~ I had my conserns ~ months back ~
then blew it off~ what moron would do such a thing? ~
answer; ~ A Flush Plumbob moron!
and the present state ~ appears to confirm this.
We need to understand ( and accept) ~ that there is no low ~ that the some GOP members won't bow too! ~ as shocking as it appears .
AND ~ fly on the wall !!! ~~~ I'm looking for my can of "Raid" ~~
Please offer us ~ how you preceive how exactly Obama ~ is "inkind" to Jimmy Carter?
America had just lynched a good man ( thou twisted as he was)****Nixion for his ~ over the top behavior ~ in spite of getting us out of a stalemated war ~ opening communication with an arch nemesis ( the Chinese) to speak of only a few of his acheivments ~ So "we" Americans thought it smart ~( the truth being "dumber then a sack of hammers") ~ so Jimmy Carter ( peanut farmer from Georgia ) came on the scene ~ all sqweeking clean ~ with his navie ways to capital hill and Howdy Doddie smile. ~
How do you explain this quanium leap to the Senator Obama? ~ For I've hear this before and either I missing something or ~ you are not telling us all you know. ~ Do you think ~ Obama is that out of touch with Capital Hill? I admit, he's no Lyndon Bains Johnson, no John Hightower or the late and great Sentor Derkson ~ but he's bright and quick and got his own parking spot already.
He young and still got growth in his body and mind ( he can still learn things) ~ not in decay ~ or decline. He don't have to "know it all" ~~ just the right places to go a get the information he needs. ~ And where's McCain going to go? ~~ to the likes of people like the Gopher~ "Phill Gramm" ~ or Rowe or Wolfowitz? ~ Now there a mind trust ~ that'd sell their own Grandmother for future options on Arizonia Beach Front Property.
Or is McCain just "all knowing" this late in life? don't need nobodys imput ~ One of the Bush types, "Let it be written , let it be done" ~????????????????????
Dance
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 9:33:12 PM | Obama repeatedly pledged to use only federal funding for his campaign and reversed himself. He cannot be trusted. He changed his position to allow offshore drilling at the same time his party leaders blocked a bipartisan effort to pass legislation doing just that. The CSPAN were ordered turned off by the same party leaders to prevent the public seeing the protest against their shenanigans. Some in the mainstream press actually blamed Republicans for blocking the legislation. He said the troop surge would not work in Iraq but it clearly did and he favors a similar troop surge in Afghanistan and a possible invasion of Pakistan. The "rich" that Obama wants to tax are actually small business owners that employ 70% of the population. Multinationals can simply shift whatever production and profit off shore to avoid punishing taxes.
It was race that got him his senate seat. He was a civil rights lawyer who made millions by suing people he claimed were practicing racism. His law practice and his voting record, what little there is of it, indicate he favors reciprocity for slavery, basically taking away money from former slave owners and giving it to descendants of slaves. Just like his pledge about federal campaign funding, he has stated he does not favor such a wealth transfer. Can he be trusted? Is it only racism when someone discriminates against another because of race or does it also include those who discriminate for someone because of their race? Maybe some people define racism based on the race involved. | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 9:43:57 PM | I sincerely hope you start checking some facts before you post garbage.
indicate he favors reciprocity for slavery, basically taking away money from former slave owners and giving it to descendants of slaves.
Totally wrong.
http://cbs2.com/campaign08/barack.obama.slavery.2.786137.html
SPRINGFIELD, Ill. (AP) ― Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama opposes offering reparations to the descendants of slaves, putting him at odds with some black groups and leaders. | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 9:48:17 PM | It is easy for dems to vote for McCain. He isn't that much more republican than Arnie Schwarzenegger. Is it that hard to remember that a lot of republicans didn't like McCain because they felt he was too much of a democrat? While the mainstream media helped McCain get the nom (the NY Times actually endorsed him), as part of what they THOUGHT was going to be a knock out punch for the gop, they may not have foreseen this outcome. I am sure they thought Obama would just tapdance his way to DC. But, as Gallup has pointed out today (44/44), it hasn't turned out that way.
SD | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 10:12:00 PM | The numbers are changing. Obama is in the lead again 47/44 (CNN reported) and also with the electoral college. He is doing well for an unknown a few months ago. Americans really desire change.
Obama 08 | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/2/2008 10:15:19 PM |
It is easy for dems to vote for McCain.
Well, I'm a dem, and I say BS. And I don't know any dems who would even dream of voting for McCain. | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 5:53:18 AM |
It was race that got him his senate seat. He was a civil rights lawyer who made millions by suing people he claimed were practicing racism. His law practice and his voting record, what little there is of it, indicate he favors reciprocity for slavery, basically taking away money from former slave owners and giving it to descendants of slaves. Just like his pledge about federal campaign funding, he has stated he does not favor such a wealth transfer. Can he be trusted?
So you are saying he is "somewhat" knowledgable about racism??
Can he be trusted ~? ~ Can you be trusted? Can McCain be trusted ?
Can I trust anyone that changes their minds ~ as the climate and facts change? ~
What do you want? ~ more Bush? ~ I fear the answer is "Yes!"
Dance | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 9:46:01 AM | I suppose it to natural progression that each one of us learns to understand and deal with race issues at our on speed and our own level.
Some of us find the burden placed on us at birth by virue of "who" our parents were and exactly when and where we were born.
For others , it's the climate that we were born in ~ the education level of our parents and their values and mindset. ~
For some of us ~ it's seen, as something to overcome ~ to rise above ~ to aspire beyond.
For other's ~ it's something to perpetuate ~ to relish in ~ to continue as we were programed in our raising. ~
All the talking about it ~~ won't change it ~ if you are twisted ~ your twisted and your thinking is jaded.
To say Obama is black ~ is an error ~ to say he's white is equally so ~
I admit ~ by self admission ~ he claims to be black. ~ WHY!
I personally see him as not black , and not white ~ his self admission ~ is a reality that "we" have thrust on him ~ with simple minds. "WE" required him to choice. ~
We will not allow him to be just ~ a person. ~~ you know ~ like yourself.
That this is an condition ~ speaks poorly of us all. ~ Where is the "days pay for a days
work" ~ Were is judgeing one by merit and what one does?
We can't all be the same ~ We sould not be required to appolizie for our birth.
Veiled racial attack after attack ~ and if he addresses this atacks "openly" ~ he's played the race card.
With all respects ~ he did misspeak ~ he used the term ~" McCain" and not "McCain supporters" ~ McCain has not spoken one word about race ~~ he don't have too ~ nor would I think he'd ever stoop that low ~ again ~ he has no need to ~ his supporter will and "are" doing it by proxy. ~
I have and know many friends ~ that are this way ~ they can't help themselfs ~ and I can't help them either ~ They'd vote more of the same ~ rather then have a man of mixes race in the big chair. ~~ I can only surmise the last 8 years wasn't really all that bad for them. That the 2 trllion dollars spent on a war predicated under false pretense and having so little to show for it ~ does not anger them like it does me. That "We the People" ~ just applies to people like themselfs.
That ~ they see a way out of this mess ~ without having to change what we are doing.
That we can continue to make bad choices ~ and expect good out comes.
I'm just not sure about us anymore.
If you vote for McCain ~ in "no way" could you understand what it is ~ that the DNC stands for. ~ it's completely impossible ~ in "no way" can you imply or suggest that you are an educated voter.
Dance | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 3:39:56 PM |
Truth of the matter is if you are a real Hillary supporter you may sit this one out if you were really that bitter that Barack won, but you wouldnt shoot yourself in the proverbial foot by supporting McCain who is the opposite of Hillary politically and issue wise over Barack Obama who closely mirrors the policies of Hillary.
I'm personally not bitter at all. I am disappointed that the Democrats picked a guy who's not capable of running the country, but I'm a big girl. I'll get over it.
McCain is not the opposite of Hillary, George Bush is the opposite of Hillary. Hillary is to the right of Obama, as you can ascertain by looking at the numbers of any organization that does such rankings. Last year, Obama was the most liberal Senator as scored by the National Journal. Hillary was number 16, which was a big swing to the left for her as well.
Hillary's lifetime liberal ranking is 79 percent; Obama's is 88 percent.
http://nj.nationaljournal.com/voteratings/
In 2007 McCain's conservative rating on social issues was 59 percent, in other words, very moderate. National Journal was not able to compile a rating on economic issues because he missed too many votes in 2007 (probably trying to avoid getting labeled as a Bush supporter, lol).
Over the years, McCain has become much more moderate, as can be seen here:
http://www.nationaljournal.com/voteratings/pdf/06republicans.pdf
vMost likely if your gonna vote McCain now, it was always your plan to do so!
Not so. I absolutely would have voted for Hillary if she'd run. I was a Hillraiser. In other words, I raised more than $100K for her campaign. You think I would have done that if I'd originally planned to vote for McCain?
AND ~ fly on the wall !!! ~~~ I'm looking for my can of "Raid" ~~
And Dance, your comments are in complete violation of the POF TOS. Only warning. Don't do it again. Next time my comments will be directed to the violations forum.
Please offer us ~ how you preceive how exactly Obama ~ is "inkind" to Jimmy Carter?
Oh Lord, are you serious? Obama has even less experience than Jimmy Carter (who had been a one term Governor), and is a neophyte to the entire political scene.
Do you think ~ Obama is that out of touch with Capital Hill? I admit, he's no Lyndon Bains Johnson, no John Hightower or the late and great Sentor Derkson ~ but he's bright and quick and got his own parking spot already.
When I was on the Hill I also had my own parking spot, and probably a better one than he has. I also knew my way around a whole lot better. You don't develop that know how in a year. The man's never introduced a bill by himself, and the two he cosponsered were of pretty much no consequence.
He's got NO Senatorial cred. The average senior staffer probably gets more respect than he does.
Now there a mind trust ~ that'd sell their own Grandmother for future options on Arizonia Beach Front Property.
As compared to throwing your own white Grandma under the bus to make a point? Sheesh.
Or is McCain just "all knowing" this late in life? don't need nobodys imput
It's precisely the opposite. McCain values EVERYONE's input. The older you get, the more you know, the more you realize what you don't know. That's called wisdom.
Obama took the high road. He says McCain is not racist just cynical.
Would be pretty hard to call McCain a racist, having a black daughter and all. Obama wouldn't be able to get away with it. If he could, I bet he'd try. Don't forget he had no trouble calling his own white Grandmother a racist.
The numbers are changing. Obama is in the lead again 47/44 (CNN reported) and also with the electoral college.
Anyone who knows the difference between their ass and a garbage truck could tell you that a 3 point margin is not statistically significant. And we don't have a friggin clue as to the Electoral College numbers. We're nowhere near being able to accurately predict.
I personally see him as not black , and not white ~ his self admission ~ is a reality that "we" have thrust on him ~ with simple minds. "WE" required him to choice. ~
No we don't require Obama to be anything. Tiger Woods never allowed himself to be classified as black (and to my knowledge never dated any woman who wasn't a blonde Swedish model). He always considered himself multiracial. How other people see you and how you see yourself are two completely different things.
When a person walks down the street the only thing you have to evaluate race by is what they look like (given that you even give a crap in the first place).
Adrian Fenty, Halle Berry both look more black than white, so my guess is that most people perceive them to be black. Mariah Carey looks more white than black, so people who don't know may think she's white. Carly Simon, who's mother was biracial, is one-quarter black -- and I bet NO ONE ever looks at her as black, or even thinks she might be mixed. So what you see is just what you see, and it doesn't carry a whole lot of importance.
You can still classify yourself according to your own personal identity.
We will not allow him to be just ~ a person. ~~ you know ~ like yourself.
Bullcrap. I've got some black step-brothers and sisters, and a mixed race half-sister. They consider themselves to be what they are -- gifted professionals, loving spouses and great parents. Race is just way down the line.
No one at our family get togethers looks at race, we just get together and shoot the breeze like anyone else. Race is the last thing anyone thinks about.
With all respects ~ he did misspeak ~ he used the term ~" McCain" and not "McCain supporters" ~ McCain has not spoken one word about race ~~ he don't have too ~ nor would I think he'd ever stoop that low ~ again ~ he has no need to
I guarantee you that McCain is not tacitly supporting anyone in the party making racial comments. The guy has a mixed race family just like I do. People who live like that don't see race the same way.
If you vote for McCain ~ in "no way" could you understand what it is ~ that the DNC stands for. ~ it's completely impossible ~ in "no way" can you imply or suggest that you are an educated voter.
Oh yes I can. Not only that, but I am way more educated on the issues than most voters. Slinging arrows at people who don't agree with you is a good way to ensure that no one ever takes you seriously.
It seems to be what many Obama supporters do in these threads: question your intelligence, your integrity, your mental balance -- just because you don't agree.
IMO, if that's the way you have to try and make your point, you don't have one.
McCain 08! | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 4:28:55 PM |
Last year, Obama was the most liberal Senator as scored by the National Journal.
I wish you people would quit posting this misinformation. I cited a source that showed the spokesman for that particular magazine stating that the information was skewed because it went vote for vote and not overall....and that Obama had missed some votes because of his presidential run.....and that IN TRUTH, he really was not as liberal as he was scored on that 'test'. | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 4:43:34 PM | If he was 3 or 4 it really doesn't matter. He's still well to the left of Hillary Clinton. In his first two years he was 16th and 10th respectively, so he's been definitely moving to the left.
Obama's lifetime rating is 9 points ahead of Hillary's, and when Obama's been in the Senate for as long as Hillary, my guess is it's going to be way up in the 90s.
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 4:45:09 PM | Obama didn't just miss "some" votes. He was criticized by his own party and spanked by Harry Reid for missing more votes than anyone else running, at the time.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/11/02/obama.missed.votes/index.html?iref=newssearch
I am going to leave here and go call our presidentials and let them know that they better look at their schedules, because these are not votes you can miss," Reid said on the Senate floor Friday.
Some say Obama purposely avoided certain votes (Iran National Guard Senate Vote) for political expediency. Slick.
SD | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 5:51:42 PM | If you vote for McCain ~ in "no way" could you understand what it is ~ that the DNC stands for. ~ it's completely impossible ~ in "no way" can you imply or suggest that you are an educated voter.
Oh yes I can. Not only that, but I am way more educated on the issues than most voters. Slinging arrows at people who don't agree with you is a good way to ensure that no one ever takes you seriously.
Oh Yes I can. Not only that I can ~ I will ~ You support one team of the other ~ for this position ~ there is no in between. ~ I don't care how smart you are. It be like lifting both legs and trying to jump. ~ Reality will catch up with you `everytime.
My opinion is a good as your ~ maybe better ~ I've never been part of the problem but the final solution. ~ The last people you want to ask about a war ~ is a soldier.
My point is ~ I've had enough of the Grand Old Party ~ on my dime. ~ I guess you haven't ~ a little government payollia somewhere? ~ 1st and 15 th important days for you?
Dance | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 9:11:48 PM | Trusting McCain? Noooooo. I could never trust him to make serious decisions. He seems likely to make snap decisions that could have disastrous consequences for us all. His hair trigger temper, emotional instability and immaturity make me feel very uncomfortable about him being our next President.
Obama, on the other hand, is trustworthy and the kind of guy you would want in the White House making the big decisions. He is steady and has nerves of steel that will serve him well during the most challenging moments of his presidency.
GO OBAMA!! | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/3/2008 9:34:10 PM |
Trusting McCain? Noooooo. I could never trust him to make serious decisions. He seems likely to make snap decisions that could have disastrous consequences for us all. His hair trigger temper, emotional instability and immaturity make me feel very uncomfortable about him being our next President.
Let the Dewhining begin! | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/4/2008 4:01:08 AM |
Did somebody say true debate? The kind without teleprompters?
You know, this whole teleprompter argument trying to make Obama look like a fool because he uses them is a load of manure. McCain uses them too, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why people are trying to say that it's bad for Obama but o.k. for McCain. | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/4/2008 4:54:08 AM | No one is criticizing the use of teleprompters. The point of the comment was that Obama is a hemming and hawing fool without them. I've never heard so much stuttering and "uhs" in my life.
McCain may not be a gifted orator, but he doesn't sound like Porky Pig when you get him away from a teleprompter.
I'm guessing this is why Obama refuses to confont McCain "Town Hall" style where he would have to show his deficiencies in "off the cuff" commentary. | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/4/2008 5:48:40 AM | we have 3 months ~ time for an excellent crescendo leading up to the grand faually ~
I think it's a process of time , money and baiting each other. ~ That Mc Cain wants it ~ is a good enough reason to not give it to him now.
who wants a can of worms opened on the 12th day and the 12th hour and not have several media cycles to get into damage control ~ this all requires ~ intense staffing and research and money ~~~~ lots of money.
~ win or lose ~ Bush is gone ` ~ being some sort of win for everyone.
All departing Prez ~ have a few last minute tricks up their sleeve ~ this in and of itself puts Obama in a blind. ~ Some fears might well be justified ~ and they don't all come from McCain personally.
Dance | |
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| The Hillraisers just won't fold
Posted: 8/4/2008 7:22:19 AM | when Obama "won" the primary I was upset-
now months later and Obama is neck and neck with of all people McCain- I'm angry
Obama has flip flopped on fisa, is "considering" offshore drilling, won't have town hall sytle meetings with McCain and didn't even get a bounce from his overseas photo op
even The Huffington Post is scratching their heads-
Clinton, as I have maintained all along, was the better candidate- | |
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