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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/21/2008 10:16:09 PM | | 24/7 ??? Isn't that some sort of bdsm term? Because if it isn't it should be. Need my space to breathe | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/21/2008 10:23:58 PM | | I miss 24/7 (which it really isn't 24/7, since folks work 40 hrs a wk, plus commute time, separate hobbies, etc.) I miss having someone to cook for, to split the Sunday newspaper with , to Share chores with, to wake up with each morning. After five and a half years, I've had my fill of living without a spouse... | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/21/2008 10:31:45 PM |
I know that there are others, who feel the same way. How many, or what percentage, I have no idea. The predominant attitude on POF is that if one is “sincere” about seeking a relationship, then one MUST want 24/7/365, and be focused on “forever”. Otherwise, the prevailing judgment seems to be that it’s “just FWB”. Well, mark me down as ONE who IS seeking a "sincere" relationship, I'm not sure FWB's even exist (long run), but I also DO NOT think that the 24/7/365 is an absolute requirement to qualify the relationship as either sincere or..happily ever after.
It's not that I'm absolutely closed minded to a co-habitation arrangement, in fact....I can see where it could make sense in many ways; but I'm with you OP.....I'm just not sure built for the 24/7 business. LOL! it would have to be an awfully BIG house!
What's really sad is to think that people can't be "committed" to their relationship, remain faithful, and be totally supportive and caring...UNLESS they co-habitate.
I can remember a lecture I gave my 17 yr old daughter once who came home 40 mins. late....and when I questioned her....she says....WHY do you think I was doing something bad just because I'm late? LOL! I just told her that I DON'T worry about her having sex at 11:40PM......I worry about that at 3:00 PM underneath the bleachers....at 11:40PM....I worry about her in a ditch bleeding from a car accident. The point here IS: If you can't trust a partner JUST because they're not joined at the hip with you....on the 24/7/365 basis.....then HOW do you trust them when they're off at work....9, 10, 12 hrs a day?
I understand the whole 24/7 thing if you have kids together.....sure; but this IS a dating site.....and my observations are that the largest percentage of people here have been married, divorced.....probably most are NOT considering MORE children....just trying to raise the ones we already have....so yes.....WHY would the 24/7 thing be such an issue??? | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/22/2008 5:34:45 PM |
What's really sad is to think that people can't be "committed" to their relationship, remain faithful, and be totally supportive and caring...UNLESS they co-habitate.
That's interesting, because that's part of what annoys me. There are a lot of people who assume that if you aren't committed to getting to 24/7 and marriage, then it's just FWB, or "sex for entertainment".
It's entirely possible to be sincerely committed to one person, for however long it's meeting the needs of both, without either wanting 24/7. I know one couple that has been "exclusive" and very much in love for 15 years, and spend weekends together. They've gone on week long vacations together, but they don't have the "business" of a shared household.
For my part, I've had that sort of arrangement with someone, who lived in another City, for several years. Maybe it kept things intense, because of yearning for time together, and savoring it, when we were.
I could be wrong, but I get the "vibe" that some mature women, are almost like teenage girls, who plan the wedding down to the last detail. The only unknown is who the groom will be. It seems to me that some women are so focused on "long term" and "marriage", that they skip right past caring very much about the intensity of eros, which, to me, is the point of a relationship.
I have friends to do stuff with, and friends I can talk about life's problems. I have friends, with whom I share meaningful joint activities, like work. If I wanted a "room mate", I could find one, and if I wanted a "room mate" who likes to cuddle, I could get a cat. There is only one intense need, that can only be satisfied within an intimate relationship between a man and woman (for heterosexuals), and that really doesn't have anything to do with picking out furniture together.
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/22/2008 8:13:53 PM | hat's interesting, because that's part of what annoys me. There are a lot of people who assume that if you aren't committed to getting to 24/7 and marriage, then it's just FWB, or "sex for entertainment".
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I haven't noticed that, the way you phrase it. I've read many profiles that DO SAY, "I am seeking a LTR", or after middle age "I'd like to grow old with you" or "seeking that last first date". But nowhere have I read or heard that unless you want to get married and live together, its only FWB or "entertainment". Could you quote (since we aren't allowed to name)" a lot" of those people who say that? It's not for me, since I've read 100's of profiles, but for the others who might be confused what normal people do.
(((No, I am not going to try to "prove" it to you, and waste my time poring through threads to give you examples.)))
I didn't think you could prove it. Why do people say weird stuff with nothing to back it up? Like the threads were woman after woman will say "I really love sex, but I want to get to know a man before sleeping with him" and they get shot down or some other weird theory proposed, that contradicts what most people say and do? So, show us the proof of your theories if you want to be taken seriously. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/22/2008 8:18:24 PM |
nowhere have I read or heard that unless you want to get married and live together, its only FWB or "entertainment". Could you quote (since we aren't allowed to name)" a lot" of those people who say that?
It's not in profiles, so much, as in posts. If you don't accept the premise that time after time, people will refer to "getting the goodies, without the committment", as one post put it, ok. It's fairly common, though, that people will call those who believe in having a sexual relationship, who aren't interested in having one be 24/7 or marriage, as "using" someone, "not sincere", "recreational sex", etc..
No, I am not going to try to "prove" it to you, and waste my time poring through threads to give you examples. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/22/2008 8:22:17 PM | ~OP~ I think the great thing about being a little older is that we truly can define what works best for ourselves in the relationship department. I require a lot of alone time. Not time at the mall, not time with girlfriends, a-l-o-n-e time. I don't think I'd do well with someone who isn't like-minded in that regard. I don't like to have to explain that, justify it, asks for it nor will I argue about it. That seems to be a deal killer for some who do best with 24/7. And I do need nights where I sleep alone. I don't like the smuffocation feeling that sleeping with another person nightly gives me, and that usually happens rather quickly. Probably one reason I'm single after so many years. Ideally, I think I'd do fine 'full-time' with someone if there were areas of the residence designated for alone-time, a bedroom of my own/and his own for those times when I simply want to sleep alone, watch a movie, read a book, have insomnia and ponder the world's mysteries. It seems to me that often times, those who have been in my life feel threatened by these things. It's too bad really. I once tried to alter these things in myself and I was miserable, he was miserable and in the end, it was the end. Maybe the key for me is someone who works nights, odd hours or even works in Alaska fishing for three months at a time...LOL I don't know, it takes a special person to understand things of this nature without feeling insecure, I think!!  | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 5:36:20 PM |
~OP~ I think the great thing about being a little older is that we truly can define what works best for ourselves in the relationship department. I require a lot of alone time. Not time at the mall, not time with girlfriends, a-l-o-n-e time. I don't think I'd do well with someone who isn't like-minded in that regard. I don't like to have to explain that, justify it, asks for it nor will I argue about it. That seems to be a deal killer for some who do best with 24/7. And I do need nights where I sleep alone. I don't like the smuffocation
You summed up my feelings on it very nicely, VGE. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 6:55:55 PM |
For me, I don't want to always remember to put the toilet seat down.
Really, everybody should be putting seat + lid down - gross things happen when you don't. I do it all the time and I live alone. It takes a millisecond, is done by reflex as easily as turning off the car lights or the key in the ignition. Hardly a big deal, in other words.
I don't want to have to "discuss" with someone whether to watch the Brewer's game or "House"
So have a couple of TVs. Maybe she likes all the same shows anyway.
nor "plan" grocery shopping with someone else.
Again, hardly a big deal. You make a list. Include stuff you both like. Voilà, it's done.
I don't want to plan "shopping trips"
Again, this is a molehill, not a mountain. 'We have to get a gift for X - wanna go tomorrow night?' 'OK' 'OK'. Geeze, is that ever hard!! 
and if I want to run to Wal-Mart at 2AM, I don't want to have to explain.
Why? What is such a huge issue about this?
I want to come home and take a nap, when I'm tired, and stay up til 2A, when I'm not. So do it. I suspect you've never had a wife, just a controlling drill sargeant.
I don't want to have to shave on Saturday, unless we've made plans to go out. I don't want to have to make the bed, or make sure the towels are picked up.
You don't like being an adult, do you?
I want to web surf, sometimes, and not have to stop and focus, because someone else wants to have a conversation. Basically, I don't want to have to explain why I do the things I do, or explain "why" I'm doing something, as if I have to get permission or approval.
Oddly enough, if you care about the well-being of someone, that can actually be a pleasure - it's called 'sharing'.
that they skip right past caring very much about the intensity of eros, which, to me, is the point of a relationship.
How dull. How much more enjoyable to have one person that you can talk to and do chores with and share eros with - all right there in your own home!
There is only one intense need, that can only be satisfied within an intimate relationship between a man and woman (for heterosexuals), and that really doesn't have anything to do with picking out furniture together It's a ton of fun to go pick out the furniture together and then come home and do the horizontal mambo on it 
I don't need to isolate myself from people to have sufficient 'alone time'. I'm inside my own head; unless I was with someone who never stopped talking, I'm fine with doing my pondering in the shower or walking to work or driving to do chores or in any of the many times I'm alone during the day.
I didn't think I'd like living with someone . Turned out I loved it. Why? Because he was company I enjoyed. We'd do mundane things together but joke around and have fun. Laundry is a lot better when two of you are goofing off and doing it. Same goes for dishes.
It's great to have someone who might just take over in the kitchen when you're tired - or cook with you (also lots of fun). Shopping's faster when you split up the list.
Of course, you have to marry the person whose company you enjoy most. It's got to be the person you like being with so much that you don't get tired of it except rarely. And, when you are with somebody like that, all those great heaving issues you mentioned above ( ) are not worth bothering about because the rewards are so much better.
However, if you're the sort of person to regard something simple and ridiculously easy like putting the lid of a toilet down or telling someone 'I realize I badly need X and Walmart's not crowded at 2 AM' to be massively difficult chores, you're quite right to live by yourself. Me, I would much rather live with a pleasant person and deal with trivial inconveniences than waste my emotions and thoughts on sweating the miniscule stuff and remaining alone because of it. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 7:11:54 PM | No, not at all, but I am sure that you realize that [seemingly] 95% of Americans over the age of 13 simply could not function or would not be caught dead without their cell phone. Meaning, I doubt if any/many of these folks have any appreciation whatsoever for "Alone" time. To be home ALONE watching a movie, or reading a book or whatever is probably not very high on their priority list.
I have nothing against 24/7 and have done it several times but I think it is simply Human Nature for people to take each other for granted when in a 24/7. I doubt if many people who were in a 24/7 for any length of time could or would claim otherwise with a straight face. I think "periods apart" are good for any relationship up to a point. From the responses, there are obiviously many who do NEED and enjoy Alone time.
I think 2 possible "solutions" would either be to find a mate who feels the same obviously and is more than willing to give their mate plenty of "brathing room" or find someone who has to travel at times on business or else might have rotating shifts as VGE mentioned. Someone with a straight 40 hour shift different than your own might be a bit much though. I have worked rotating shifts for the last 25 years, and I think overall, it had a positive influence on all of my relationships. Just made us appreciate our time together all the more. Another angle is how many hours each works and just what happens if ONE of the parties can or does retire? Does that make things better or worse or ?
Perhaps the ideal solution is simply and understanding partner and a 2 story house?
At any rate it is always nice to see that others NEED their alone time. And value it. I just don't think "most" folks can understand it. Good thing it is a Big Ocean out there, eh? | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 8:59:05 PM | I am comforted by reading the posts on here that there's bright hope for our future economy!
We get to sell two homes instead of one! Each home will need it's own furniture! We'll sell two toasters instead of one! Double the major appliance sales! Yesssssss!!!
Where there are kids involved, two sets of most items so we can be "the best parents we can be"...
All this wonderful "ME" and "MY" stuff is already completely prevalant on sites like this one. So most of the people on here are with the program.
But what about the people not on here? How can we transmit the need to buy more stuff to those poor saps who value their family and their relationships more than their self-centeredness???!!!
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 9:05:34 PM | For me, I don't want to always remember to put the toilet seat down. Really, everybody should be putting seat + lid down - gross things happen when you don't. I do it all the time and I live alone. It takes a millisecond, is done by reflex as easily as turning off the car lights or the key in the ignition. Hardly a big deal, in other words.
A perfect illustration, really, of why I don't want to be 24/7. It's not that these things can't be negotiated, if they had to be; but why would I want to? Your post, Merrylass, boils down to telling me why I'm "wrong" to want to do what I want to do in the moment. That's fine, you can feel that way, and I can ignore you, and no one's feelings are hurt.
Why would I want to listen to that at home, though, where I can't get away from it, and have someone telling me what I should want, how I should be different, etc.. ?
That whole conflict about everyday things, that have nothing to do with romantic love, is what turns a nice romance into a daily aggravation.
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 9:15:04 PM | My goal would be 24/7. It doesn't have to be that way, but that IS how I'm built.
I'm not in a particular hurry to get there and I do have some ambivalence over it.
But yes... I want to share my life fully with the man I love completely and accept totally.
Were I to love that way and *he* be of the separate residences camp... yeah, I'd accept that.
Same if he had strong feelings about living together or marriage.
Those are details compared with wide open loving.
My fellow - happily - seems to be on the same wave length as I am. He's a 24/7 kinda guy. With some ambivalence too.
He's just not in a hurry to get there either...
We need to give it time and care and concern to make sure everything is working and everyones needs are being met. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 9:29:04 PM |
Why would I want to listen to that at home, though, where I can't get away from it, and have someone telling me what I should want, how I should be different, etc.. ?
The longer this thread continues, Ren, the more I can't see your point of view as it's layed out by "needing space".
You're older than me, so I think you know that those silly "toilet seat" issues happen for more reasons than living together. They occur, often, because it's a "safe" outlet for blowing off steam to avoid the larger rumbling elephants in the house: major sexual issues, money problems or incompatibilities, e.g.
Also, just because a romantic couple doesn't live together doesn't mean one doesn't make "demands" (which, btw, are sometimes rightful: we have a right to demand our partner, whether long-term or not, treat us better if they're falling down on the job). The "toilet seat" issue may not predominate, but other demands will and do: "why can't we see each other more often?; why can't we see each other less often?; let's go to a different restaurant for once; you're bringing your kids along again?; do you have to leave your hair in my car always?; did you forget to bring over the wine again?; I want to be spanked with the small paddle occasionally, too, y'know?; the vacation is only for five days?; you have food in your teeth;"
Obviously, the list never ends, whether it's a live-in, whether in a serial-dating relationship, whether a fukk buddy; whether a FWB, even with a dear platonic opposite-sex friend. (Of course, the "complaint" can be made by a woman OR man in the above examples, thought at times those "complaints" are justified).
ALL relationships are messy. Gawd, I would imagine there's an emotional transfer of energy, at times, even with a hooker, where one or the other makes requests out of a feeling of neglect, rightly or wrongly. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 9:40:52 PM |
Also, just because a romantic couple doesn't live together doesn't mean one doesn't make "demands" (which, btw, are sometimes rightful: we have a right to demand our partner, whether long-term or not, treat us better if they're falling down on the job).
Rory, I was married for 20 years, and we negotiated the day to day well enough to have a relatively peaceful, if unexciting, household intact. There was a "higher purpose", our daughters, that made an early dissolution an unacceptable alternative, given our values and views about the raising of the young.
Post divorce, I had several relationships of some duration ( 1 year, 3 years) that did not involve cohabitation. Weekends together, sure, but not an endless committment to a joint household. Those were exciting, and pleasant, and the little "demands" that come with an intimate relaitionship, didn't rise to the level of being "deal killers", until the passion began to fade.
This past year, I met someone, and had a relationship with someone, where it seemed to "make sense" to form a joint household. The irritations of cohabitation quickly overshadowed the delight of the relationship, and it ended after 5 months of living together. It ended well enough, and we remain very good friends, even riding to work (separate places of employment) most of the time.
We have the things of good friendship, but the passion died prematurely, and I discovered that I simply am not willing, at this point in life, to adjust to the "business" of running a joint household. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/23/2008 9:54:21 PM | Ah, there you go, then, I can understand that. I've never lived with a platonic female friend, it's never interested me.
My point remains, however, that ANY relationship, whatever the degree (or absence) of sexuality, will have its inevitable demands or requests, and some of those requests are legitimate. I agree it's more intense in a live-in set-up. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 2:12:03 AM |
boils down to telling me why I'm "wrong" to want to do what I want to do in the moment
Wrong? No. Wrong-headed in that I think you'll end up less than happy if you continue on this path - yep. Do you care? Not now but someday you might. Really, the point of my post was that I think you're missing out on some great things by focusing on the minute and pointless ones as though they are worth worrying about - and now you're arguing for your 'right' to do so! You go right ahead and immerse yourself in the pointless all you like - it's a free world
When people like Albert Ellis teach me that I upset myself by focusing on inconsequential things, I listen and change and - hey - get happier! Took me a while to figure it out. Some people never do.
Namaste | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 3:24:59 AM | Even in a committed relationship where you are living together, it shouldn't be 24/7. You both work, have friends, family, activities you like to do.
I am in a committed relationship and we will be living together soon. I do not expect to monopolize his time. He knows I love him for who he is and I don't want to change him. He spends alot of time with his brother working on cars and such. He is very close to his family. That is fine. I have no problem with that, because at the end of the day, we are together.
Anyone who wants to monopolize your time 24/7 is insecure. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 3:35:46 AM | | OP a good relationship revolves around each of the couple having independent friends and interests, and having time apart to do their own things, but being able to come together at certain times in the day and share quality time with each other. It's not about being in each others pockets. The thing is that so many people will say that they enjoy independence, but the minute they get into a relationship they will expect people to give up everything else in their life and concentrate on them, and this is when a relationship gets suffocating. I think the more confident you become the less you need someone there all the time to validate your identity, so the more relaxed you can be when you are actually in each others company. I look for a man with the same views as this, because I know if I find anyone who is not independent (i.e. emotionally needy) it will drain the life out of me, therefore I stay for a long time on my own, and I'm happy that way, but that doesn't mean I'm not open to sharing my life when I know the RIGHT man for me has appeared on my doorstep, and when the RIGHT person for you comes along you will probably think differently about sharing your life with someone. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 4:37:37 AM | Wrong? No. Wrong-headed in that I think you'll end up less than happy if you continue on this path - yep. Do you care? Not now but someday you might. Really, the point of my post was that I think you're missing out on some great things by focusing on the minute and pointless ones as though they are worth worrying about
Merrylass, I'm not picking on you, but you really illustrate the "point" so well, that I use your posts as a starting point. Your POV wouldn't be a "deal breaker" in terms of a dating relationship, but would drive me crazy, if it were 24/7.
I am not a hermit, and I do want and need social relationships in life with friends. I also need an intimate relationship with one woman at a time. At the same time, in terms of my daily life, I want to do what I want to do, not what someone else thinks is "best" for me.
While living on my own, I can have meat and potatoes for dinner, and enjoy what I eat. I can just hear you, Merry lass, "telling" me that what's best for me is a broiled chicken breast, with brown rice and broccoli, when I want a steak, fries, and corn on the cob with lots of butter and salt. Are you objectively "right"? Of course, but I don't want someone hovering around me in daily life, "nagging" me that I "should" put the toilet seat down, "should" eat broiled food with no fats or salt, and "should" organize my shopping, buying only what I have a coupon for, and so on.
I didn't just "make up scenarios". I lived in a marriage for 20 years, and as recently as this year, tried to adjust to 24/7. That experience confirmed my choice between the time of my divorce (8 years ago) and last year, that life is more pleasant, when I have relationships, but avoid the engulfment of 24/7.
Fortunately, there are many women, who are looking for the same sort of relationship, so it's not that difficult to find someone with compatible "relationship style". I was curious, in starting the thread, to find out if I was just "lucky" that I have been able to find what works for me, of if there is a significant group of women, who see it the same way.
As to the "fear" that some express, that some day, when I'm older, I'll regret not having made the accomodations necessarry to have someone with me, as we age. Maybe that motivates some, but, the truth is, as I've gotten older, it's just seemed simpler to "find someone", when I am between relationships. If anything, the pool gets larger, and my confusion about "dating" diminishes. So, for as long as my sex drive continues, I don't fear becoming unable to find a partner, so long as I "adjust" to the available "market" as I age. The other thing is that I'm not afraid of being "alone". If a time comes that's my permanent state, and relationships are no longe available, ok. For me, it's better to be alone, than to have someone around constantly nagging me about what's "best for me". | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 4:57:34 AM | | Hi, I really don't see why you have posted this comment. You are doing what suits you and what suits your partner or partners,and that's all that matters,because no-one else is involved. All relationships are different,so there is no such thing as a normal relationship,although you think it is normal. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 5:27:22 AM |
I agree with you that it doesn't have to be 24/7. In fact, after living alone for 15 years now I already know I couldn't handle living with my partner unless it was a two bedroom, two bathroom kinda deal with a common area in between. My boyfriend feels the same. We live in two different towns so we don't get to be together more than twice or three times a month, but that suits us both fine, for now. Of course the ideal would be to see each other once or twice a week, but that will happen if it is meant to happen.
Maybe this has been my problem, I have been too stressed about the 24/7 issue.
I love being together with someone all the time but when you're a long-distance relationship seperated by 350 km, it would improve things all around to not be in each other's hair all the time. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 5:29:40 AM | | Yes but with space and private times and this is called respect and learning the rules of a more mature union. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 6:21:15 AM |
As to the "fear" that some express, that some day, when I'm older, I'll regret not having made the accomodations necessarry to have someone with me, as we age. Maybe that motivates some, but, the truth is, as I've gotten older, it's just seemed simpler to "find someone", when I am between relationships. If anything, the pool gets larger, and my confusion about "dating" diminishes. So, for as long as my sex drive continues, I don't fear becoming unable to find a partner, so long as I "adjust" to the available "market" as I age. The other thing is that I'm not afraid of being "alone". If a time comes that's my permanent state, and relationships are no longe available, ok. For me, it's better to be alone, than to have someone around constantly nagging me about what's "best for me".
I've said it myself a million times Renaissance Man. Better to end up happy alone than lonely in a miserable relationship. I couldn't bare the thought of ending my days with someone who tries to take away everything in my life that I feel passionately about and replace it with the 'politically correct' version. Sometimes you just have to stick to what you believe in and what keeps you happy, and anyone who trys to shame anyone into thinking differently is self righteous, and IMO would be a nightmare life companion. | |
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| Does the goal have to be 24/7?
Posted: 7/24/2008 8:08:24 AM | ^^^^ And who here is advocating getting into and staying in a 'miserable relationship'? Did I not say that you need to find someone whose company you enjoy the most? Nobody is telling the OP that he MUST live in misery, are they?
but I don't want someone hovering around me in daily life, "nagging" me
Yes, dear. We get that. All women are unreasonable and see their only job as 'nagging' men if the men aren't perfect all day every day so you're quite right to avoid the whole lot of 'em. | |
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