| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/27/2005 10:31:14 PM | It is pretty common knowledge that Constantine created the Christmas holiday to replace pagan winter solstice festivals. This is nothing new and truthfully, celebrating or not celebrating Christmas has very little to do with the Gospel itself. It is important that Jesus was born, it is far more important that He died for us.
Now on to Mithra. I just got through with a web search on this topic and it seems that the only ones pushing the Jesus-Mithra connection are atheist websites. The fact is that Mithra was around for a long time before Jesus was born, but it was known in the east. Mithraism was relatively new to the Romans at the time of Christ, and it is more likely the Romans borrowed from Christians to make their new religion more "mainstream". For example Mithra was NOT born of a virgin, he was born out of a rock.
Incidentally, we have no written texts from any of the followers of Mithra, so it is unclear exactly what they did believe. Most of the information we have regarding Mithra dates from the 2nd and 3rd century AD, and ironically, most of this was written by Christians! | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/28/2005 8:26:22 AM |
False prophets will arise and work miracles ??????
I thought miracles were God's thing. If someone is working a miracle won't God know about it? Can one do so with out his help. Oh wait, are you suggesting that there are more then the one God? Who is that is working these Miracles? Or are they really miracles? Or just signs and wonders to decieve?
And Again are you sure Your God is not the False one? | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/28/2005 8:54:41 AM | the Old Testament was begun around 2000 B.C. and completed around 400 B.C......What is far more probable is that as Mithraism developed, it started to adopt Christian concepts.
But!
Known throughout Europe and Asia by the names Mithra, Mitra, Meitros, Mihr, Mehr, and Meher, the veneration of this god began some 4000 years ago in Persia
Who is mocking Whom?
Mithraism had no concept of the death and resurrection of its god and no place for any concept of rebirth -- at least during its early stages...During the early stages of the cult, the notion of rebirth would have been foreign to its basic outlook...
But!
Aside from Christ and Mithras, there were plenty of other deities (such as Osiris, Tammuz, Adonis, Balder, Attis, and Dionysus) said to have died and resurrected. Many classical heroic figures, such as Hercules, Perseus, and Theseus, were said to have been born through the union of a virgin mother and divine father.......Mithras was believed to shut himself up in a cave from which he emerged once a year, born anew. The Persians introduced initiates to the mysteries in natural caves, according to Porphyry, the third century neoplatonic philosopher. These cave temples were created in the image of the World Cave that Mithras had created, according to the Persian creation myth.
Again don't Persia and Babylonian doctrines per date the Jewish. Like the jews were hung up in Babylon for a few generations, before getting hung up in Egypt, right? And it was after this that Mosses came down with the Jewish doctrine.
writers of the New Testament were Jews who shunned pagan philosophies
Didn't David Claim he needed a Harem to keep up with with the other (pagen) Kings. Or they would laugh at him, "what you only got one wife.... "
And Actually most of the New Testament was written\influenced by Paul, A Greek, who knew little of Jewish doctrines but would have known a lot about Pagan doctrines and Mithra.
So which came first the chicken or the egg? Jesus or Mithra? | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/28/2005 7:33:51 PM | Go to the first message in this thread if you want to see the many similarities between Christ and Mithra. I'd also like to point out once again that Matthew invented the whole virgin birth thing. Or rather he borrowed it from pagan religions. This is blatantly obvious if you read Is 7. Don't just read verse 14 because Matthew rips it out of context. There's just no way Jesus could have fulfilled Is 7:14. There's nothing in Is 7:14 about a virgin birth. The KJV deliberately has a mistranslation of the Hebrew almah in it. Everywhere else in the Bible the KJV translated almah as young woman or maiden.
I'll grant that there's probably not a whole lot of core doctrinal overlap between Christianity and Mithraism. One major exception is the elevation of Satan in Christianity to God's archenemy. This dualism is found in Mithraism (in Mithraism this duality is not perfect; Ahura Mazda will beat Ahriman in the end). It has no basis in OT Scripture. Also, in Mithraism Mithra slew a bull as a sacrifice. Followers would bath in bulls blood as atonement for their sins. The blood would wash them of their sins. Paul likes to use the phrase that Jesus's blood washed away our sins. Most of what Jesus taught was the same as what the Pharisees taught (e.g. baptism, the Golden Rule). At least one of the Apostles was an Essene and many have noted the similarities between Jesus's teachings and Essene teachings (e.g. they both went around healing people, rejection of the material world). | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/28/2005 7:34:55 PM |
Doesn't the religion of Mithra prove that Christianity is false?
No, but the Bible does. | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/28/2005 7:36:32 PM | | The Bible does not teach dualism. That is folklore. | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 6/28/2005 8:10:38 PM |
The Bible does not teach dualism. That is folklore.
True, it doesn't say that Satan is equal and opposite to God. Perhaps I didn't explain well. In Mithraism there are two major spiritual beings Ahura Mazda (the Wise Lord) and Ahriman (effectively the devil), if you don't include Mithra himself. Ahriman is not equal and opposite to Ahura Mazda. There is, however, a near dualism between them. Likewise in Christianity there is a near dualism between God and Satan. Satan was the most beautiful angel then he fell and became ruler of Hell (and he took a third of the angels with him). He's the ruler of this world too. He's in a constant battle against God with mankind as their chesspieces (e.g. Job, Adam & Eve). The climax of Revelations is the defeat of Satan. Yet when we look at just the OT Satan without the biases imposed by Christianity we see a minor character. In Job he's employed by God to accuse man of sins. Then they make a bet about Job's faith. God gives Satan carte blanche to do what he wants to Job and his family (let me emphasize that he needed God's approval). In the end God himself claims credit for inflicting evil on Job. In another place in the Bible Satan tempts David into taking a census. However the story is repeated elsewhere and it's God who's doing the tempting. The Garden of Eden story makes no mention of Satan. It's actually a talking serpent. Offhand I can't think of any other place in the OT that mentions Satan. Flash forward to the NT and Satan has been elevated from a two-bit servant of God to the axis of evil in the world. Rather like the near dualism in Mithraism. | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 7/3/2005 2:43:18 AM | There are so many saviours around the world born of virgins.
Example, the Mayan Kukulkan (Aztec Quetzalcoatl) was born of the virgin, died, resurrected, and is expected to return after a certain amount of time.
The Persians provided one of the first millenarian models for the near east with Zoraster (approx 800 bc) who was believed to be a prophet, who died, and was expected to return as the messiah in 12,000 years. | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 9/12/2005 10:07:07 PM | | J-roc, I think I mentioned the debate we had here on Mithra. Here it is. Some good points by both sides of the coin. I will point out again that we have NO written texts by followers of Mithra, so any claims as to what they believed is assumption. | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 9/13/2005 12:33:29 PM | Wasn’t Mitha that giant moth who fought with Godzilla?
No, wait, that was Mothra,
Never mind. | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 9/13/2005 9:31:56 PM | | Dosen't matter as they both were myths. | |
|
longte
|
Joined: 10/18/2004
Msg: 87 | |
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 9/13/2005 10:31:12 PM | Just for Enchantress
With what little I know of Mithra
you would not have enjoyed it much
Females were not allowed to be Mithrans
..
. | |
|
Ankh
|
Joined: 12/16/2005
Msg: 88 | |
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 12/16/2005 10:16:42 PM | I have to choose Mithra of the Jesus Myth. stating the old testiment as a source of jewish beliefs and laws is not really possible since the old testiment is so edited by the grecco/romans that it barely shows any resemblence to the words taught in the torah or talmud, so saying that such old scriptures talk about jesus are 99% unlikely. I can see the point of the religions borrowing from each other, but you have to add Sumerian/Babylonian text as well as Egyptian text also, all were later badly translated and edited by the roman/greeks incorporating their own beliefs and religions to the text thus destroying the true meanings. Studying about Mythra, Jesus, and Yeshua you will see that jesus/mithra are pretty much the same person, as you will see that yeshua or the one today refered to as jesus is different all together for the fact that Yeshua never spoke out against judaism, yet followed all of the jewish laws and taught others to do the same.
thank you for your time
Eternal_Ankh | |
|
| Mithra or Jesus ?
Posted: 8/19/2006 11:06:10 PM | | There's a great book called "The Case For Christ". It was written by an attorney?? who was athiest. After his wife became Christian and her life started changing he got pissed off about it and decided to go on a quest to disprove that Jesus was diety and man. During this quest he became a Christian. If you have any questions about it, this book can answer them. It is very intelligently written and also pretty interesting. | |
|
Home
login 
