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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/21/2009 9:00:50 PM | I don't know exactly why I'm wading into this one - cause really I don't have a lot of recent experience with any of this, and its a raw, real nerve to a lot of people. This is all just guesses and conjecture. I don't know.
However, If you're asking whether psychopaths get their just deserts, well no it doesn't seem like that happens as much as might be hoped. If you believe the news on it, a lot end up in high tech firms or the government. My cuz once mentioned that one CEO he'd worked with was completely straight about his diagnosis. Oogh.
My sis, who works in a hmm,,. how do you say,.. well as a ripper, had a bud who was basically a paid friend to a complete jerkwad but wealthy guy. It doesn't look like the worst commonly end up lonely. Maybe in a way - paying someone to hang out is a type of alone.
For the rest of us that don't have such solid stripes its probably a lot more hit'n miss whether we'll eventually be sentenced to live alone in a basement suite for our missteps. Its sort of like neutral brown too - every household can say it has some. I'm betting those who suffer horribly feel alone around the rest of us; while they're hiding a ten inch long welt they picked up for vacuuming at the wrong time they're also smiling to say, "whoa - you've your own apartment, but your ex still leaves messages to complain about how you're letting the cat get too fat. Man that must be crap".
For me terms like "abusers" don't help that much because we're too diverse a group to know what that means. It feeds a labeling frenzy. People who are good at understanding relationships look around the label to find out what its referring to. Its a skill - and certainly not mine.
And can I just mention that just as I finished this evrybdy put together a post that makes about 800 times more sense. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/21/2009 9:18:34 PM | Wow is all I can say to this entire thread.
Not trying to be gender specific but since for the most part we are talking about woman being abused I will just go with that LOL
There is something I think most people have missed but, yet all have touched on. Eventually woman leave the abuser for good. There will always be a "next" to the abuser because he has well honed skills in what he does. He figures out what finally made his partner snap and changes it with the next one. Over many next's he learns just how far he can without crossing the line completely with each woman he abuses.
I do agree the woman is as well at fault to some level for what she has gone through. However if anyone here understands true mental torture and even many different militarizes uses some of the same techniques as an abuser uses. You must first understand how he slowly over time take the power away from his victim so they feel truly powerless within their own life. The sad part is they never see it coming. Once you understand how this is done then you may understand how this will effect the victim and how she feels when living within the same space as him on a day to day basis.
This has really only been in the for front of news and media for about the past 10- 15 years. Before this woman woman were told to let the water cool and go back home and talk to him. Society has finally caught up to the reality of domestic violence. One thing I have noticed over this past 10 - 15 years is the amount of time a woman stays with her abuser is getting less and less. This is a good sign. Woman are more open to not being the victim or playing one for near as long as they were before. Soon these men will have no one to abuse because woman will figure it all out. Education is power, woman used to stay for 20 year, today the average is 5 years. So to some degree I agree woman can be head responsible for what they are going through. As now the information is in abundant, just depends on how long before the woman wakes up one day and realizes she is not who he says she is.
We can all sit here in ivory towers and say it could never happen to me, and my god I would not want anyone to ever have to truly walk a mile in their shoes but the reality is until you do you will never know 100% why a woman might stay or go back.
****Men who do this are no different then woman that do this it is a people thing not a gender thing**** | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/21/2009 11:13:14 PM | The abuser end up in jail with a guy named bubba. And karma gets him in the azz. Or hopefully they just die painfully.
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/21/2009 11:53:51 PM |
we automatically assume that the victim becomes the criminal when they decide to hurt others,
And you don't?
but nobody ever seems to bash the willing victims that perpetuate the cycle of the abuser
And the victims have a choice? You have some really strange views on abuse.
because the victim is looking to be hurt, whereas the abuser is merely looking for a loving, lasting relationship
You must be kidding.
I have to agree with MariCocoPSU. Sad as hell if you ask me.
i hang out at a pretty grungy bar, full of older alcoholic scumbags.
No wonder you've got such utterly distorted views. Yes. Eventually abusers wind up alone, in prison, or dead which is where they belong.
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/22/2009 2:23:09 AM | | Abusers are often skilled emotional manipulators, so if one relationship ends they can probably find another partner. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/22/2009 8:57:13 AM |
The abuser end up in jail with a guy named bubba. And karma gets him in the azz. Or hopefully they just die painfully.
Now that would be the greatest but I highly doubt it. The thing is try getting any justice. Not likely to happen. Oh here and their they may spend a night or two that's about all they will get.
Once the woman is gone for good, the worst thing she can do is let him know where she is and what she is doing. Due to the way the courts work he has the right to defend himself. There for he needs to get all the paper work that includes her information as well. After most woman get involved in the court process she learns it is better for her to just disappear. There is still very little the courts can do to keep you safe. How many times when the guy kills the woman do you hear, she had a restraining order against him. A piece of paper means nothing to him. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/26/2009 7:27:51 AM | | OP: Most of the abusive people I have known are pretty successful in attracting new partners. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/26/2009 8:35:14 AM | "Abusers are often skilled emotional manipulators, so if one relationship ends they can probably find another partner."
Right on there. Shoot, even guys - if you can call them that - like Ted Bundy and Scott Peterson get love letters and flowers from literally thousands of women, your garden variety abuser surely knows what makes a woman tick. Female abusers probably do similar things. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/26/2009 12:10:01 PM | | Silken I can say that I havne't heard it put so perfectly form my perspective..you have namiled it on the head..there is definiely a huge part of it that is contempt that would be shown!..seriously almost a HATE TOWARDS ME!..I hadn't thought of it lke that..that they hate to have to rely on us!..but they will always have to rely on someone else to survive..because they can't live in society alone..they can't..they can't hold jobs..especially with the alcoholic part..wow..gave me alot to think about!..TY. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/26/2009 3:21:14 PM | My closest experience to the type of abusers mentioned in this thread is loosing women to them. One "former" abusive boyfriend, whom I was completely unaware of, attacked me when I was picking a girl up for a first date. We left him laying on the ground screaming but I did not ask her out again. Despite his criminal record of assaults, she later married him and then divorced him after he put her in the hospital. It would not surprize if they were back together again and/or he has killed her. Its the same story repeated ten of thousands of times. POF is home to many on both sides circulating in and out of these relationships. Kind of troubling but that's life.
It may seem unfair but if a woman has a history of relationships with abusive men, I stay clear of her. I don't fear the guys, its her "chemistry" I am concerned about. Chemistry tends to trump commitment. Besides, if I stay away from the women then their lovers aren't a problem. Having lost women to these "bad boys", it is clear such women aren't looking for an equal partner in a relationship. The most common key words to look out for are "knows what he wants and knows how to get it." The odd thing I have found in most of these guys is they are deadbeats but since honesty isn't there, they may appear successful. Part of what they want is money and support from the women and they know how to get it by playing her chemistry. A couple of the women who dumped me for these bad boys actually had the nerve later to ask me for money to bail them out. The irony of the dumped nice guy: no good deed goes unpunished. I told them they chose to be out of my address book and weren't going to be in my checkbook.
I find it hard to blame the guys. Their behavior is rewarded while those of us who refuse to learn the lessons these guys have taught, have few prospects. Its part of that "chemistry" thing and one cannot argue with a woman's chemistry. I wonder what percentage of cosmetic sales is to cover bruises? | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/26/2009 3:42:25 PM | | They either end up alone, change, find a codependent masochist or die. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/26/2009 4:15:17 PM | Silken I can say that I havne't heard it put so perfectly form my perspective..you have namiled it on the head..there is definiely a huge part of it that is contempt that would be shown!..seriously almost a HATE TOWARDS ME!..I hadn't thought of it lke that..that they hate to have to rely on us!..but they will always have to rely on someone else to survive..because they can't live in society alone..they can't..they can't hold jobs..especially with the alcoholic part..wow..gave me alot to think about!..TY.
You're welcome!!! I have read your post and my heart goes out to you for what you have been through. Since you mention survivors being hard on themselves, I would like to add something that is, I feel, extremely important for survivors to know as their healing continues.
From the moment most of us are first attacked, our own perceptions of the world around us are forever changed. It's important for us to research the effects of trauma on the brain because it is such a critical part of our healing (and something that kept me "stuck" until I understood it). It's one thing to be with a guy who is forever beaking off and threatening. In those times, it's still possible for us to believe that he is just blowing off steam or, my favorite term, blowing smoke up our butts. But the very first time he physically attacks, all guesswork is gone and we are left with the grim reality that he will actually do what he threatens to do. (Compare knowing your car could use a brake job with actually losing your brakes at 40 miles an hour with an intersection ahead and you get some idea of the enormity of that realization.)
It has been explained to me that in that moment of trauma, our brains literally "freeze" or cease to be able to process new information. We now have "post traumatic stress disorder" and we go into the numb state that involves nightmares, flashbacks and a world that becomes surreal. Whatever we lose in the attack, we cannot grieve because our ability to process has become frozen. The subsequent decisions we make now come from that frozen place and as many people realize, some of them are difficult for people to understand. Few people have lived with terrorism or understand that the traumatized person is now living in a world of fear that often forces her to make decisions based on survival instinct. If, for instance, the attacker has threatened one's children, many of us will continue to stand in his way at risk of great harm to ourselves.
Thank God there is now something called "EMDR" (Eye Movement Desensitization Reprocessing) that when used by a skilled therapist, can "unstick" the brain and allow us to begin processing that trauma and all the others we have been through. PTSD IS curable!
My main point here Sacker is that many of us don't understand why we stayed around or why we, usually intelligent beings, would put ourselves in harm's way. The answer is that once we KNOW that they will do precisely as they've threatened, many of us will live to protect those we love, our careers and all that we've worked so hard for... We need to forgive ourselves and understand what happened during the first trauma.
We also need to understand that certain professions will attract these nutbars and nursing is at the top of the list because of the nurturing element and the good wages nurses earn.
I hope you will also find this helpful and I hope the OP won't mind my slight derail of the main topic...  | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/27/2009 8:09:42 AM | Fantastic post Dave, it bears repeating. I've had experiences that mirror yours, only not quite to the point of getting attacked by an ex. Those abuser guys, whatever level they are, can appear incredibly charming, They know what a woman wants to hear and know just what buttons to push. It hurts the honest guys, putting them at a major disadvantage. I've always been one to tell a woman the truth, not rudely or hurtfully, but to tell her what's real not just what she wants to hear.
I had a situation where a so-called friend (ex-friend now of course) did this and stole a girlfriend of mine. I tried to reason with her, but her final words as she walked away from me were "I feel good about this, don't f**k with me". Well, fastforward a few months and one night when I was coming in to work, there she was, looking very sad. He dumped her as soon as his libido ran out with her, which didn't take long. I just went about my business and ignored her. I didn't take any satisfaction at her misfortune, but neither did I feel sorry for her. The warning signs were there the whole time. If she chose to ignore them.................well, not my fault.
I too have learned to steer clear of women who habitually are attracted to abusers and silver-tongued devils. Eventually that attraction will win out over any commitment she may have with me. A well-versed manipulator has every advantage over an honest guy when it comes to relationships with a woman who maybe vunerable to such tactics. Sad, yes, unfair, maybe, but still true.
"It would not surprize if they were back together again and/or he has killed her. Its the same story repeated ten of thousands of times. POF is home to many on both sides circulating in and out of these relationships. Kind of troubling but that's life.
It may seem unfair but if a woman has a history of relationships with abusive men, I stay clear of her. I don't fear the guys, its her "chemistry" I am concerned about. Chemistry tends to trump commitment. Besides, if I stay away from the women then their lovers aren't a problem. Having lost women to these "bad boys", it is clear such women aren't looking for an equal partner in a relationship. The most common key words to look out for are "knows what he wants and knows how to get it." The odd thing I have found in most of these guys is they are deadbeats but since honesty isn't there, they may appear successful. Part of what they want is money and support from the women and they know how to get it by playing her chemistry. A couple of the women who dumped me for these bad boys actually had the nerve later to ask me for money to bail them out. The irony of the dumped nice guy: no good deed goes unpunished. I told them they chose to be out of my address book and weren't going to be in my checkbook.
I find it hard to blame the guys. Their behavior is rewarded while those of us who refuse to learn the lessons these guys have taught, have few prospects. Its part of that "chemistry" thing and one cannot argue with a woman's chemistry. I wonder what percentage of cosmetic sales is to cover bruises?" | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/27/2009 8:42:24 AM | | I will restate what has already been pointed out - abusers ARE manipulators!!! My exH was my trifecta - emotionally, verbally and physically abusive and darn if it wasn't less than a month after divorce, he had a girlfriend. It blew my mind how quickly he conjoled a little cute young thing into his web and told her that I was out of my mind and was the liar. I tried to tell her what she was getting into but she believed him so she will find out one day the hard way! | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/27/2009 9:27:54 AM | No, abusers always will have someone. For some sick reason, many fall in Love with abusers, because in their minds, they are showing that they care.
Nice people end up alone. That's reality. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/27/2009 11:36:46 AM | "My exH was my trifecta - emotionally, verbally and physically abusive and darn if it wasn't less than a month after divorce, he had a girlfriend. It blew my mind how quickly he conjoled a little cute young thing into his web "
This used to blow my mind........now, sadly, I see it for what it is - par for the course. It's easy for them because first, they know just what to say and do, and second, in their minds, the ends always justify the means, fair or not. Unfortunately, as much as I hate to say it, the abuser is simply doing, at the end of the day, what any good salesman with a product to market does - he's responding to what the "market" - in this case the dating world - wants. And, unfortunately, flash goes much farther than substance in that realm much of the time. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/27/2009 6:38:36 PM | It may seem unfair but if a woman has a history of relationships with abusive men, I stay clear of her. I don't fear the guys, its her "chemistry" I am concerned about. Chemistry tends to trump commitment. Besides, if I stay away from the women then their lovers aren't a problem. Having lost women to these "bad boys", it is clear such women aren't looking for an equal partner in a relationship. The most common key words to look out for are "knows what he wants and knows how to get it." The odd thing I have found in most of these guys is they are deadbeats but since honesty isn't there, they may appear successful. Part of what they want is money and support from the women and they know how to get it by playing her chemistry. A couple of the women who dumped me for these bad boys actually had the nerve later to ask me for money to bail them out. The irony of the dumped nice guy: no good deed goes unpunished. I told them they chose to be out of my address book and weren't going to be in my checkbook.
I think some of you "nice guys" need a better understanding of women and these "bad boys" as well because without it, you might find that it's really hard to find a woman capable of compassion, tenderness, forgiveness and understanding for your own weaknesses and foibles.
What MANY... (and I do mean MANY) of these "bad boys" have figured out is that a huge number of women like to be treated as though they are important and necessary in a man's life. Many of the "bad boys" are drawn to strong women who have perhaps stood by someone through a rough time, raised their children on their own, developed good careers under challenging conditions... whatever the case may be, the "bad boy" notices that his target is capable of a great deal of compassion and understanding. They notice that she likes to be complimented, listened to, paid attention to... and that's what they do.
You have stated that it's a woman's chemistry that draws a bad boy to her rather than accepting that many of these "bad boys" are out looking for someone who will listen to their "hard knocks" stories and try to help them get up from wherever they've fallen. I wish I had a nickel for every "bad boy" who has approached me with some very credible and entirely reasonable story about why he hasn't made it in life yet.
From the time our first baby doll is placed in our arms, we are groomed to care for and respond to the "cries" of others. We are given mini-brooms, easy bake ovens, tiny sets of dishes and pots and pans... When I was a little girl, I don't recall receiving one gift that wasn't designed to make a nurturing person out of me. But that's not necessarily a bad thing because there are some people who are fighting their way through a tough time who truly are deserving of another chance, a hand up and someone's love.
What you call a woman's chemistry is often a woman responding to someone who actually treats her like he needs her in his life. Is that really an awful thing? If you were dating or married to someone who put everything else in life first and then a so-called "bad girl" came along and made you feel like a king, could you resist her? Would you?
As awful as this situation often turns out for the women that have been trained from the cradle to be nurturing caregivers or simply for women who fall for the con of a man who for awhile, pretends to need them, it's even more awful for the general population to refuse to open its eyes to the way women are raised or the fact that women get lonely just like men do when their own partners aren't inclined to treat them with the specialness they deserve.
You do yourselves no favors to pretend the "bad boys" have it all together when all you need to do is take a page out of their books in terms of making the women in your life feel special and needed. Then take that one extra step and keep showing her that she's special.
It isn't her chemistry as much as it is her need to be loved and needed. When a woman's tenderness, compassion and willingness is considered "bad chemistry", we're ALL gonna be in BIG trouble! | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/27/2009 8:39:05 PM | They may not be alone as often as they deserve to, but by making someone else's life hell on earth, they earn themselves a VERY special place in Hell.   | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 12:02:01 AM | "Do abusers end up alone?"
I sure hope so. They need to stop terrorizing others and live their lonely, miserable lives by themselves. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 12:30:02 AM |
Do abusers end up alone?
From what I've seen....no, they don't. There's always someone around willing to put up with the abuse. People who don't care enough about themselves, who don't want to work and just keep depending on him/her for the money, etc. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 3:05:10 AM | | I know a man who attempted to abuse his first wife but the thing is she was such a tough woman that she beat the crap out of him every time he tried to hit her. Now she eventually got fed up with him and he is now with a family member of mine,has been for years now, and he beats the hell out of her all the time. So I think that abusers do not end up alone. They eventually find someone who will put up with the physical abuse forever. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 4:15:58 AM | No, I think the victim/survivor is most likely to end up alone. After all, they are the one's who end up being violated so much, it takes so long to heal and move on w/o fear. Often you'll find these people settling on being alone, self-sufficient, and somewhat content with no drama and playing it safe, then gambling on the possibility they may get trapped in an abusive cycle again. If they decide to not be alone, they tend to wait much later in life before stepping back out into the world again, but at that time have incredible inner strength and wisdom.
It's the abusers who continue to not be alone, as they are driven to be in control and to control. Therefore, they will eventually find that one person who knows nothing better then to be abusive and are too weak to seek help, admit there's a problem, and would rather live in a living hell then to be alone. Also, when they start to fight back eventually, it just adds fuel to the bonfire, but still you'll find that both people seem to somehow get off on it ... each taking turns being the controller and the enabler.
Funny how it works, huh? | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 4:58:10 AM | Abuse of any kind is a dynamic requiring an abuser and an abusee. They are drawn together like two magnets.
I agree that abusers were abused themselves, but there is no excuse. They can find the help they need and if they truly want to change, they can. Abusers are like Pit Bulls, its in the way they are raised some people say, but you never know when your docile seemingly loving Pit Bull will turn on you and harm or kill you.
Some women and men enjoy living with a time bomb. Time bombs have triggers or ignitors. We don't always know what those are. An abusive relationship requires two very ill people. The abusee is an enabler. They are usually docile, caring, warm-hearted, sympathetic people. Some people think they are spineless, but somewhere down the line, someone has broken their back. They are emotionally challenged.
Do I think the abuser will wind up alone? Yes, and for the rest of their miserable lives unless they admit it, get help for it, and desire to change permanently. | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 6:02:09 AM | It all goes back to drama 1o1. Its a cycle, when you recognize it you can break it , in what ever form it arrives. This is the most simple description that makes sense I have ever seen. Peace!
Rescue>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dependancy
> <
Victim | |
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| Do abusers end up alone?
Posted: 4/28/2009 6:23:03 AM | "I think some of you "nice guys" need a better understanding of women and these "bad boys" as well because without it, you might find that it's really hard to find a woman capable of compassion, tenderness, forgiveness and understanding for your own weaknesses and foibles. "
A woman can be that way and still know when the line is crossed from compassion and such to enabling and being taken advantage of.
"What you call a woman's chemistry is often a woman responding to someone who actually treats her like he needs her in his life. "
Funny how that works - the non-abusive guy who does this is seen as needy, weak and smothering. Maybe because he isn't as good at pushing buttons?
"a so-called "bad girl" came along and made you feel like a king, could you resist her? Would you?"
Yes, I've done it before.
"It isn't her chemistry as much as it is her need to be loved and needed. When a woman's tenderness, compassion and willingness is considered "bad chemistry", we're ALL gonna be in BIG trouble!"
And where is the above available, except for the players? You don't see it around here.
Oh, and just to set the record straight, I'm not a nice guy, at least I don't consider myself one. A fair-haired angel I'm not, but I also don't feel the need to put on a big act to impress or win over a woman.
Were I to get involved involved with someone, I would want her to love ME, the REAL me, not some act I used to play upon her sympathies or impress her. If I can't have someone who likes the real me, I'd rather have no one at all. I refuse to live a lie. If I fail, if I succeed, at least I live as I believe.
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