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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 11:34:11 AM |
I would like to theorize, that it seems to me, that there are two points to this thread:
The first point, that of the bpd affected individuals, who, despite their actions at times, first and foremost wish to be understood, among other things, as being people with a conscience, with empathy, etc, unlike a sociopathic individual. The bpd individual is a normal person acting out to drastic extremes, and that those responses are normal, due to the pressures of abnormal and drastic emotional turmoil experienced within. They want themselves to be seen separate from their actions, their sins, as they truly are caring individuals. Unlike sociopaths, who, seemingly everybody agrees, truly do lack a caring nature, and therefore, do not deserve to be separated from their sins, because they really are rotten to the core, so to speak.
And...
The second point, that of the spouse (or S/O, or some other affected individual) who would state that, regardless if the bpd individual has bpd or sociopathic or other tendencies, they wish to be understood as individuals whose lives have been damaged severely in the company of that individual. Many actions by the bpd individual seem the same as those committed by the sociopathic individual, so it matters little, or not at all, as to why those behaviours occur, to the recipient. The same damage occurs through the actions of the bpd individual, and that is what matters to the recipient.
Hmmm... I have thought of another point here:
Seems to me like there has been a white elephant in the room all along.
Seems to me that both non bpd affected, and bpd affected alike, view sociopaths as rotten creatures. The bpd individuals seem to be hurt, to no end, by being confused with sociopaths, by the non's. And the non's don't really care because the bpd individuals' actions often seem to be the same, whether they are bpd or sociopath, anyways.
Sooo... I am curious.. how do bpd individuals view sociopaths? Perhaps the same way that many nons view them... basically rotten creatures that do not deserve love because they feel no empathy, and therefore do not deserve to be seen as separate from their sins? Hmmm....
Very good points skyblue!
Sociopaths.... wow... I don't even know what to say here. I can't say that NO ONE deserves love. However, I think someone who gets involved with a sociopath or a borderline has the right to know about the illness. I also think that each person should be looked at and not judged in a general manner. Not all borderlines are addicted to sex, not all borderlines are addicted to drugs/alcohol, not all borderlines have no conscience....
I've often wondered after reading posts how many people who were involved with a borderline knew UP FRONT about the illness? How many found out about the illness after the damage had been done and the relationship was beyond repair? Those involved with a borderline, was the borderline getting help? What about those that do get help and work hard at making themself a better person? | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 12:23:03 PM | Hmmm... I have thought of another point here:
Seems to me like there has been a white elephant in the room all along.
Seems to me that both non bpd affected, and bpd affected alike, view sociopaths as rotten creatures. The bpd individuals seem to be hurt, to no end, by being confused with sociopaths, by the non's. And the non's don't really care because the bpd individuals' actions often seem to be the same, whether they are bpd or sociopath, anyways.
Sooo... I am curious.. how do bpd individuals view sociopaths? Perhaps the same way that many nons view them... basically rotten creatures that do not deserve love because they feel no empathy, and therefore do not deserve to be seen as separate from their sins? Hmmm....
I have nothing against sociopaths......
And I'm not hurt being confused with a sociopath...
The problem is wrong pathology....or "mistaken identity" if you will.
Borderlines react from "extreme overemotion" and "extreme fear"
Sociopaths react from "lack of emotion, and (most times) self promotion"...whether it be money, prestige etc.
Borderline is a disorder, sociopathy (psychopathy) is a syndrome.
Because I am both bi-polar, and BPD, and have been trying to recover, it's important to know which disorder is at work to know how to solve problems. They look very similar, but the thinking is very different.
My agenda in being on this thread, is to try to educate NON's about borderline past the information given in self help books. Borderlines are usually very confused about the way they feel. They very often have been told that how they feel is wrong...by someone in authority. So, they go along with the authority, even though it goes against what they believe. In time, they often end up not having a clue what they feel. That is the lack of identity of BPD....it accounts for "mirroring"....we search for a lead to follow, because that's what we're used to doing. It accounts for a whole lot of things.
Understandably, NON's take what's happened to them very personally...and they can actually take on some of the personality of a BPD if the relationship has been long and gruelling. I really hate seeing people who have been pounded into the ground, and they have no idea why.
I try to explain in an unbiased way....and yes I try to keep it unbiased, because believe me, I 've been on the receiving end too....what MIGHT have actually been happening....like a BPD who cheats on an SO.....more than likely has NOTHING to do with the SO....likely the unstable identity has taken a hit from somewhere, and by being ADORED (read: sex) the identity is restored. I know if it was me, knowing that I hadn't done something wrong would help.
The self help books are great....but if a NON is getting info from a confused BPD, the info is only going to be partially accurate.
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 12:24:38 PM | Here are my answers MSG 878:
I've often wondered after reading posts how many people who were involved with a borderline knew UP FRONT about the illness?
I didn’t even know that such a disorder existed let alone that she had anything at all.
How many found out about the illness after the damage had been done and the relationship was beyond repair?
In retrospect, it may have already been “beyond repair” when I learned what it was and what I was dealing with. Still I tried my best not to “kick her to the curb” for as long as I could in the hope she would overcome this.
That said, the final series of episodes were far beyond what I could tolerate or accept.
Those involved with a borderline, was the borderline getting help?
She was seeing a therapist that specializes in “Eating Disorders” for six years (at the time) as well as a psychiatrist that monitored her anti-depression medications.
This all began shortly after she attempted suicide and was institutionalized.
She was well aware of what BPD was and was terrified of that diagnosis because she believed it would prevent her from securing employment or health benefits amongst other things.
What about those that do get help and work hard at making themself a better person?
I commend such individuals. It is not a path for the “faint of heart”.
If my BP had confronted her “demons” and sought specific help I would not have left her.
Hope this helps. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 1:02:19 PM |
I guess my question is... in dating... or whatever.. how do you know when its just a personality clash, or when BPD, is what is causing the problems in a relationship...
Hi Julie....
Unfortunately, BPD and personality clash are kind of synonymous......
MISUNDERSTANDINGS, are a big problem for BPD. We often take something someone has said "personally", when it wasn't meant that way. Or, we may be "confused" (see above post) and not know what to make of what's being said....or, we may try to understand, and question the person, making them think that we are trying to interrogate, or analyze them.
The solution......time....the better you know the person, the more you will understand what they're saying.
In the meantime, try not to overreact, if you don't understand, ask....and if you ask try to keep the questions to a minimum | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 1:21:04 PM |
It's weird. She always seemed to be a wanderer with no goal. With me she sucked me dry after all the effort I put forward, with her reciprocating being nil in comparison.
She was a really smart girl and very intense. I just never knew what was really going on with her deep inside, despite how close we were (sounds weird eh).
She probably was a wanderer with no goal. That's part of the identity disturbance.
Depending on how badly the individual is abused, and what they had been "taught" they may have big trouble even distinguishing right from wrong....which can result in bigger trouble.
A simple example....one could take a beautiful child....and tell them that they're "ugly" depending on the temperament of the child...easygoing, to uptight.....after an amount of time, that child will believe that they are ugly.
Your last sentence doesn't sound weird to me at all....................................... | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 7:09:03 PM | It is definitely not for the faint of heart. Even the VERY small percentage of bpd's who do admit and seek help...the success rate is dismal. many providers do not even admite them as patients.
Vexsome diagnosis, and a very damaging relational environment for the one involved with them (in romantic relationship esp)
Most bpd's also samouflage the true nature well..until it is way too late. The statement "you only hurt the one you love" was written about them... | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 7:11:23 PM | Hi Quazi,
The wine was your cue that something was up....and she wanted you to ask about it.
BPD will sometimes use "props" to initiate a conversation.....I've had this done to me more times than I can count. I've found that ignoring "props" is not a very good idea.
Make no mistake, it was not a prop. The amount of alcohol this woman could drink was staggering considering her low body weight/height. Should I have said “don’t tell me you’ve started drink this early” would have been met with predictable results. Seeing her drink that early in the day took me aback and I wondered how much had she drank prior to our dates?
I was “walking on eggshells” for a long time and you may be right, perhaps I should have confronted it more often. As you must know, that would have resulted in an “episode.”
She did not react well to any form of questioning on her behavior/actions.
BPDs apply “splitting” to themselves as well as others. To suggest that she was less than “perfect” in any aspect in her life was to suggest that she was completely and wholly the opposite.
It lasted as long as it did because I had a way of leading her to see certain things on her own and she often would say “you always cheer me up”. Of course this was much easier when I was not her “target”.
Earlier in this thread I said (MSG 625):
Later I learned that she had been in weekly therapy for six years and in addition had to see a psychiatrist weekly for depression medication. I was concerned because she drinks alcohol and asked if she was allowed to while on the medication.
From Page 36 of “Stop Walking on Eggshells”:
BPD and substance abuse disorders often go hand in hand (Oldham et al. 1995). Another study (Links et al. 1988) reported that about 23 percent of borderline patients had a diagnosis of substance abuse. Borderline substance abusers are more likely to abuse more than one drug (a frequent combination is drug and alcohol abuse), are more likely to be depressed, have more frequent suicide attempts and accidents…
The weekend before “The Stamp Episode” I took her out to dinner on Friday night and she was going to a church friend’s birthday party Saturday. I didn’t hear from her Saturday and was concerned because it did not follow her pattern. She finally called at 11:40 at night and had been in a car accident that totaled her car. She went on for quite a while about the police questioning her if she was drinking. She fooled the police but I knew that she had.
Did you ever find out what the REAL problem was?
I don’t even know where to begin. Yes I do and this was not a prop to initiate a discussion about a particular problem. We spoke daily so I was aware of all sorts of issues she was having in her life.
The real problem? I could write four or five pages and it makes me sad to think of the experiences she encountered in her life starting with her early childhood.
Quazi you asked this a few posts ago and you did not receive an answer:
I have a question, and any input is welcome, I'm getting a new spin on how "non's" feel after a breakup from what Ceij says in this paragraph.
Here's my question....did you feel "had"...as in "duped" or "conned" by your BPD?
Here we go. The simple answer is yes but that is a disservice to anyone reading this.
I did not see the subtle signs in our first dates though my intuition did.
Earlier I said (MSG 625):
One night she called me crying. She said that she just got home from her therapist. Her therapist said not to tell me that she has eating disorders so soon. She was afraid that I would find out and leave her. I reassured her that I would not.
I had entered an alien world that I was ill prepared to recognize let alone comprehend.
The seriousness of these issues did not manifest until we began reaching each new level of intimacy and trust. I was already “in love” with her and that is not something that happens frequently in my life so I was determined to “make this work.”
When I sought help I was dismayed that the issue did not lie within me. I so hoped that it did for I am capable of correcting the things that I can – the things within me.
When my therapist told me (again from MSG 625):
Then my therapist said something to me that I did not understand. She told me I wasn’t in love with my GF. She said I was in love with the “mirror” that my GF was presenting to me.
I was devastated. How could I be such a fool? How was it that I did not recognize the subtle signs? Why did I not question my intuition earlier? Why did I not simple leave her during the first “episode”?
Yes I felt betrayed. Yes I felt like I was a fool.
Still to this day I prefer to take responsibility for the situation than to cast blame on my former GF. This is normal for an ENTJ. By nature I command my life and am not a victim of my circumstances. Even with that I know so much about how she came to where she was and somewhere within me my soul grieves for her.
On one occasion (Valentine’s Day candy episode) I stopped her and asked “Look, maybe we should just end this now” (and this was not the first or the last time I asked her this). She replied with “I’m not breaking up with you. You can dump me if you want but I’m not leaving you – no way.”
Why did I not just end it then or many other occasions? Why did I let it progress to the point it did? I found myself questioning my long-standing beliefs and values.
For a time I became hyper-vigilant but eventually I found a balance. I accepted that we all exhibit BPD traits from time to time.
One day my therapist told me that there was no real reason for me to continue. She enjoyed our conversations and most especially her desire to know more about a “near-death” experience in my past and the mysticism and spiritual beliefs that came as a result.
We no longer spoke about BPD and my newfound interest in psychology had me treating our sessions as a form of tutoring in my academic exploration of a science I had only scratched the surface of previously.
I quoted this passage from the end of “eggshells” before but will post it again now:
This book has taken you on a journey through a land, that until recently, you may not have known even existed. You’ve learned what BPD is, why people with BPD act the way they do, the part that you play in the dynamic, and how to take back control of your life.
But the trip is not over yet. As complex as BPD behavior can be, obtaining knowledge is the easy part. Now comes the wisdom: taking what you’ve learned and applying it to your life.
This may involve questioning long-standing beliefs and values.
It may mean facing issues that you've been avoiding for
years. It may mean revisiting the unspoken "bargain" you've
struck with the BP in your life: that their needs and views are always,
always more important and more "right" than yours. No
one can hold up this kind of bargain very long without seriously
compromising their own mental health.
We can't promise that it will be easy. But we can promise
that it will be worthwhile. In the process, you will find out what
you really value and who you really are. You will discover
strengths you didn't know you had. Few things in life are more
important than this.
As William Shakespeare said four hundred
years ago, (Hamlet, Act I. Scene iii, Lines 78-80).
This above all, to thine own self be true,
And it must follow as the night the day
Thou canst not then be false to any man.
We hope that the knowledge and tools you've gained from
this book serve you well on the rest of your journey.
To all nons involved with a BP reading this please get a copy of “Stop Walking on Eggshells” and read it over and over before making any decisions.
To the BPs (and the nons), there is hope. Please get a copy of “eggshells” and go to page 230 and read the story written by “Diane”, a woman that recovered from this disorder and has a fulfilling life with a husband and children. Pay special note to what she did and endured to reach that and what she says to those that cared for her.
To the BPs from my quote of a “Third Eye Blind” song (MSG 628):
Everyone's got to face down the demons, Maybe today.. We can put the past away….
We all need to face down our demons. You are not alone.
As always, I wish everyone happiness and may all the best things find their way to you.
Ceij | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/4/2008 8:28:13 PM | Hi Ceij....
Speaking as a BPD, who has more experience with BPD's than I care to think about, if anything seemed even remotely "unusual" when I arrived, I would ask about it in a very inoffensive way....I would look at the glass, and say something like...."ah, your team must be winning....". If there's a rage coming, I'd rather get it out of the way sooner, than later.....I found that an invited rage, was preferable to a simmered rage. It was a bit of self preservation.....for me, anyway.
I also accept responsibility for myself, and my actions.....now. I will not, though take responsibility for my partner's actions. I have no control over my partner's actions, or choices. A partnership involves two people. It takes two to tango. You took the situation on, in good faith.....how could you possibly know what would happen?
The reason you tolerated what you did?.......three words........love is blind. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 4:28:20 AM |
I have nothing against sociopaths...... And I'm not hurt being confused with a sociopath...
You know, something has been bothering me thinking about this stuff, and my past experiences, and I have been having trouble putting my finger on it...
My ex, having BPD, (and thus also having an unstable identity), would, seemingly in pursuit of drama and/or excitement in her life, clearly and regularly, take on a perfect sociopathic personality while planning and committing acts of infidelity. She would have clear remorselessness, and no empathy or conscience anywhere to be found whatsoever. I have seen it many times, and also talked to her in this state, and found absolutely none. And, she would sometimes spend weeks convincing that person that I was a completely different and evil person. I have talked to them also.
So, is it not the case then, that during those episodes, the BPD person essentially becomes a sociopath in every way... albeit temporarily?
Of course after the event, it was extreme remorse, etc, on her part, likely designed for more gratifying attention and drama. She mentioned once, what an exciting way for her to live, full of fire and passion and tragedy and intense drama.... truly a person is then at last fully alive, and only so, during this time, no... ??
Btw, I understand this may or may not be the case for other BPD individuals, but it certainly was hers.
But, isn't the constant need/craving for attention, and drama, and the acting out to extremes to achieve it, and the 'personality adoption', including possibly 'sociopathic personality adoption', clearly part of the BPD definition? And, by the BPD individual so adopting a sociopathic persona, it then becomes so easy and effortless for a BPD individual to do whatever is needed to achieve self gratification.
So, here we have a person that essentially exhibits chronic sociopathy, through and through.
They are not being confused with a sociopath.
They have become one temporarily.  | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 8:39:43 AM |
But, isn't the constant need/craving for attention, and drama, and the acting out to extremes to achieve it, and the 'personality adoption', including possibly 'sociopathic personality adoption', clearly part of the BPD definition? And, by the BPD individual so adopting a sociopathic persona, it then becomes so easy and effortless for a BPD individual to do whatever is needed to achieve self gratification.
Wish I could answer this for you. While I have been diagnosed with BPD, never have I sought constant need for attention or drama. I hate having attention and I hate drama. Maybe that is the norm for some but it obviously isn't the norm for all.
I will admit that at times I feel lost and unsure of who I am. But after being diagnosed and seeing and understanding what I didn't see and understand before, I've made life changing decisions in my life to better myself. I started first by eliminating all the unnecessary drama in my life (meaning toxic people) followed by focusing on the behaviors I exhibited at times and didn't like and what I could do to avoid those behaviors. One of the things my therapist greatly stressed was to identify triggers and warning signs within myself (such as specific thoughts or behaviors) and when I noticed these I needed to find some constructive way to vent. So now when I feel a mood swing coming on I go exercise or clean house. If it is really bad and the exercise or housework doesn't help, I just eliminate myself from the ratio until I've calmed down and can think clearly. I've worked hard to not be someone that people fear. After taking these life changing steps I can't tell you how many people have told me that they have seen such an improvement in me and they aren't afraid of me anymore.  | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 9:52:09 AM | Hi skybluejeep....
I'm going to start by saying that NON's cannot fathom the depth of emotion that BPD's feel....with that said...
[quoteMy ex, having BPD, (and thus also having an unstable identity), would, seemingly in pursuit of drama and/or excitement in her life, clearly and regularly, take on a perfect sociopathic personality while planning and committing acts of infidelity. She would have clear remorselessness, and no empathy or conscience anywhere to be found whatsoever. I have seen it many times, and also talked to her in this state, and found absolutely none. And, she would sometimes spend weeks convincing that person that I was a completely different and evil person. I have talked to them also.
Ok....the pursuit of drama and/or excitement is not conscious, if the BPD has not recognized their disorder....it's NORMAL...chaos was probably normal for her during her childhood. We don't CRAVE it, as we appear to....when STABILITY reigns, we get nervous, we don't know how to act.
She somehow perceived that you weren't paying enough attention to her....could have been that you went out after work with the boys for a beer....you may have fought, and you left her alone.....regardless of what precipitated the infidelity, she was PUNISHING you for something. This is what people don't get...BPD is esentially emotions gone wild. The remorselessness goes to the fact that she BELIEVED AT THAT MOMENT that you deserved what she had done. Then when she saw how the sh*t was hitting the fan, she backtracked 'I DIDN'T MEAN IT, IT DIDN'T MEAN ANYTHING....I'M SORRY"....am I close? Next....would a sociopath try to convince people that you were a completely different and evil person....nope they don't give a rat's as* about other people....that was a case of plain old BPD devaluation.
[quoteShe mentioned once, what an exciting way for her to live, full of fire and passion and tragedy and intense drama.... truly a person is then at last fully alive, and only so, during this time, no... ??
Since we're getting to the nitty gritty here, I'm going to ask if she was diagnosed BPD? She almost sounds more "histrionic " PD to me. Or she was talking expansively? I personally didn't enjoy life until I worked on giving BPD up. The constant emotional ups and downs are exhausting.
But, isn't the constant need/craving for attention, and drama, and the acting out to extremes to achieve it, and the 'personality adoption', including possibly 'sociopathic personality adoption', clearly part of the BPD definition? And, by the BPD individual so adopting a sociopathic persona, it then becomes so easy and effortless for a BPD individual to do whatever is needed to achieve self gratification
I'm going to make a very broad statement here so that you'll understand.....I don't mean this for anyone specific or even BPD as a group.
AGAIN what people don't understand is that the craving attention, and drama and acting out to extremes to get it, is NORMAL for us. Acting "normal" for me was much harder than the attention and drama seeking behaviour.......I didn't know what "normal" was.
There is no question that BPD can be incredibly manipulative..but again that goes back to the abandonment issue in personal relationships, anyway.....sometimes we have to go to extreme lengths as children to get our needs met....and we get very good at it. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 5:29:21 PM | Hi Quazi,
I’d like to know more about this from a BP’s perspective:
I'm going to start by saying that NON's cannot fathom the depth of emotion that BPD's feel...
Because Nons can manage the out outward expression of our emotions does it mean that we do not experience the same “depth”?
Do you really believe that a BP’s emotions are “different” than a non’s because our outward expression of them and because our behavior is tempered, measured and controlled?
Does restraint and self control indicate that a non’s depth of emotions is any less?
Does a non not ever experience intense joy, or sadness, or grief, or rage?
Isn’t the difference the appropriateness in the level of these emotions for a given situation?
For example, should someone verbally insult or slight me I will not experience the emotion of rage but should anyone physically attack my niece, rest assured the rage I would feel and express would be just as “deep” and as explosive as anything a BP could ever imagine.
Therefore how is it that I could not “fathom” the depth of an emotion?
Isn’t it more that a non cannot fathom how a BP could feel the depth of an emotion that is not warranted for a given situation? | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 6:34:56 PM | I swear, would someone please start to kick some so called doctors in the backside.
"""Borderline"""" Personality Disorder, is this like being a little bit pregnant?
Sorry but either someone has or hasn't a disorder.
And no I haven't and wouldn't. I have a nice stress free life and choose to keep it that way. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 6:44:50 PM | | Not dated but my ex best friend is a psychotic BPD! Her ex-husband, her family, guys she dates, EVERYONE wants to get the hell away from her! People only put up with her shit for a few months, then she makes you move to Russia just to get the hell away from her. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 6:56:14 PM |
I have a question, and any input is welcome, I'm getting a new spin on how "non's" feel after a breakup from what Ceij says in this paragraph.
Here's my question....did you feel "had"...as in "duped" or "conned" by your BPD?
I feel "duped" by my BPD, but ultimately, I feel *more* "duped" by myself. A lot of the post-break-up involved self-chastisement. Never knew about BPD until the dying cries in year five when a fellow poster on a bipolar forum suggested I look up "BPD". There were so many signs in the intitial, middle and end stages of the relationship, but I got swept along into the "marvelous". How pitifully dumb can one be, is a frequently asked of myself, sub-concious question?
My guy was high-functioning, brilliant and a diagnosed bipolar on lithium. We did not experience the daily drama that others describe. However, when it did happen, it was bizarre and bewildering and damaging.
He never went into therapy. I did. He has former SO's who became alcoholics and/or are on anti-depressants. And you know, the truth of the matter is that he is not evil but he is so damaged that he needs to extract every fibre he can take, just so that he can survive. I still feel that I am in an emotional "no-man's land" but, I feel more sorry for him than I do for myself. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 7:00:52 PM | Yes, I have known somebody like this on and off for 20 years....they really started to change about when they become an adult....I have gone back to see how things were and had to break off our friendship after 6 months because it was causing me to be physically sick (too many ups and downs)....Both her aunt and mom have problems so I guess it runs in the family. I love her to death but now know that we could never be a couple.
Talk about frustrating though....it got to the point that it was like were completely talking different languages....tell me one day how important I was to her and the next ignore me. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 7:05:39 PM |
Not dated but my ex best friend is a psychotic BPD! Her ex-husband, her family, guys she dates, EVERYONE wants to get the hell away from her! People only put up with her shit for a few months, then she makes you move to Russia just to get the hell away from her.
wow...just wow.
how long did you tolerate the behavior and why? | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 7:09:36 PM |
Isn’t it more that a non cannot fathom how a BP could feel the depth of an emotion that is not warranted for a given situation?
Yes, non's experience intense joy, sadness, grief, or rage.....and, obviously not all crimes are committed by mentally ill individuals. Non's can be driven to "snap" just like mentally ill individuals, under the proper circumstances....it's called a "psychotic break". But, if you are driven to that "breaking point", you are no longer "normal".
So, in your rage at the person who is physically attacking your niece, how far would your "rage" go? Do you know how angry you could get? Could you have a "psychotic break", and "snap"?
I will not disclose details, but I have experienced "blind rage", literally. There have been a couple of times, that I had to be told what I did. This is the main reason, why my recovery is crucial. These were not blackouts from alcohol....I don't drink.
I sincerely hope that you never experience this phenomenon....it's extremely frightening. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 7:24:10 PM |
"""Borderline"""" Personality Disorder, is this like being a little bit pregnant?
Sorry but either someone has or hasn't a disorder.
The term "Borderline" refers to behaviour being on the "borderline" between neurosis, and psychosis.
Steps are being taken to re-name the disorder to "Emotional Dysregulation" disorder, or something similar to that.
Emotional Dysregulation encompasses more than Borderline, but doesn't cover the full spectrum of the illness. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 7:43:44 PM | Ceij: First of all I want to say  I don't know you, but thank you for reading my posts on this thread and whispering quietly to a very special friend of mine that I'm quite normal indeed in your eyes. I knew that...I just wanted to hear it from you. lol...(j/k)
You seem to have been affected by a BPD that made you question your own sanity at times.. and I've done the same. All of us walk a thin line of sanity and insanity if we really think about it. For instance, if someone were to harm my animals or my family, I would have no problem killing them in cold blood without ever blinking an eye. Would that term me a menace to society?? No, that would make me a brave soul doing whatever I had to do in order to protect what I love the most no matter what the consequences were to me.
Any long period of time spent with a mentally unstable person will certainly change your own behavior in the long run if you're exposed to that unstable behavior long enough. I've met a few people on here that I felt something was just "off" with them but I'm in no way qualified to diagnose them nor are they the least bit qualified to diagnose me.
All of us can exhibit some form of dysfunctional characteristics at certain times in our lives, but in the end we all have to be accountable for our actions and those that recognize that are the ones that have to have compassion for those that can't (or won't) take responsibility for their own behavior.
PS: Quazi...I'm very proud of you. You've recognized your disorder and have poured out your heart on this thread in order to help others that suffer from from BPD. Again, I'm proud of you. You've made a difference in many people's lives and will continue to do so, I'm sure.
Sans | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 8:11:12 PM | I presented an exaggerated hypothetical example for illustrative purposes but yes, I am aware of my “primordial instincts” and I am grateful I was not ever put into a situation where my emotions and those instincts were unleashed.
But we’re missing the point are we not?
So, in your rage at the person who is physically attacking your niece, how far would your "rage" go?
It would go as far as necessary to stop the attack. Should her attacker employ a weapon there would be no limit. I would not stand by and allow it to occur.
Do you know how angry you could get?
Yes, not from any experience in my past but I can certainly speculate.
Again, while I have experienced intense emotions, the control of those emotions and my actions and appropriate expression of those emotions for a given situation is the point.
Could you have a "psychotic break", and "snap"?
The definition of “psychotic break” does not apply to this hypothetical scenario. A psychotic break is defined as:
“Psychiatrists may informally use the term "psychotic break" in hindsight to describe the first episode of psychosis in a patient who has been diagnosed with the chronic condition of schizophrenia.”
“Psychosis is a symptom or feature of mental illness typically characterized by radical changes in personality, impaired functioning, and a distorted or nonexistent sense of objective reality.”
“Patients suffering from psychosis have impaired reality testing; that is, they are unable to distinguish personal subjective experience from the reality of the external world”
So the answer by definition is no.
Preventing the rape or murder of the niece I raised as my daughter, by whatever means necessary would not be a “psychotic break”.
If my perceived reality was so distorted that I “imagined” the attack when in fact it never occurred then we could proceed with the discussion of a psychotic break.
The point here is that BPs experience rage as you describe from your personal experience for reasons that nons find unfathomable.
It’s not that we cannot fathom the depth of the emotion, rather that the depth of the emotion is not proportional to what we consider rational behavior.
The point here is a BP’s emotions are neither different nor “deeper” than a non’s.
The reasons or triggers and the simplicity and intensity of the emotions due to what a non considers to be an imagined or exaggerated perception of a situation is what differentiates the two.
I sincerely hope that you never experience this phenomenon....it's extremely frightening.
I hope I never experience this as well. The inner demons that a BP experiences are frightening indeed. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 8:58:53 PM |
Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
No....but I think I have spoken to a lady with one...
I was talking with her.....she smiled and slapped my face...
she quickly apologized......but then slapped me again.
I made a dash for the door.....when I saw her walk towards the kitchen drawers | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/5/2008 10:33:04 PM | Somehow, 36 pages seems fitting for this topic.
My first clinical job, in my first clinical staffing, the topic was a patient diagnosed with BPD. The clinical director paused, looked at me, and asked if I understood BPD. I smiled and said, "Yes, I've dated them for years." Cracked everyone up, but it was no lie. Even lived with one for a while...thank God for pocket doors. I used to back into the laundry room and slide the pocket door between us and lock it then wait in there with the cat liter box until she got tired of pounding on the door and shouting names at me. First one I ever dated had a thing with knives...liked to see my blood...
I think ladies diagnosed with BPD do so well attracting unsuspecting men because in the positive mood they'll tell you all the wonderful things about yourself that no one else ever did. And they often like to make love on the first date if they're in "that mood." Such a rude suprise later when they turn and wanna kill you for something like not having a stamp handy.
I used to facilitate addiction treatment groups in state prison. Kinda for fun I'd read the criteria for borderline personality disorder to the guys. Usually about half of them would shout out that I was describing their wife or girlfriend.
Today, lots of books on the subject. Lots of great coping techniques to use for both those so diagnosed and the ones that love them. BPD is still, an Axis II diagnosis meaning its a condition that isn't gonna change, can only be dealt with by learning various coping skills.
Would I ever knowingly date a lady so diagnosed again? No way in hell.
And ladies beware. There are a few men so diagnosed. I would rather deal with a room full of ladies diagnosed with BPD than deal with one man with that diagnosis. | |
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| Ever date someone with BPD? (Borderline Personality Disorder)
Posted: 12/6/2008 8:09:58 AM |
The reasons or triggers and the simplicity and intensity of the emotions due to what a non considers to be an imagined or exaggerated perception of a situation is what differentiates the two.
I guess my Doctor called it a "psychotic break" because no other term fit the situation properly. It was not a "fugue" or an alcoholic "blackout".
This subject is rather distressing for me, as the consequences of my actions when these blackouts occurred were life threatening.
If you can find an appropriate "yard stick" to measure your emotions against mine, and whose will go furthest before we end up dead or in a rubber room, carry on.....
There is currently only one way to measure the brain with complete accuracy....on autopsy.
This topic is moot, and I will not discuss it further. | |
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