Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Politics  > Heeeeeere's Johnny!      Home login  
 AUTHOR
 Bluesman2008
Joined: 4/2/2008
Msg: 76
Heeeeeere's Johnny!Page 4 of 6    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6)
The browser is what you're using right now. The browser window is what you're typing in. There's a very small URL window at the top of it (no matter what browser you're using). Copy/paste it into that. I don't get that you're not seeing it.
 427cammer
Joined: 3/1/2008
Msg: 77
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/5/2008 8:58:23 PM
Charlemagne, would you label every single person who advocated fighting inWWII a warmonger? If not then I'm guessing that you meant it as a slur.
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 78
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/5/2008 9:01:02 PM

would you label every single person who advocated fighting inWWII a warmonger?

Answering a question with a question usually means one has no answer. I'll take that to mean you cannot justify how the term is inaccurate when it comes to John McCain. I wasn't referring to anyone who participated in WWII, I was referring to John McCain.

I meant it as the accurate statement I believe it is.
 427cammer
Joined: 3/1/2008
Msg: 79
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/5/2008 9:05:57 PM
By that reasoning, when a bigot uses a racial slur, it could never be called mudslinging... he believed it to be an accurate staement.
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 80
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/5/2008 9:23:15 PM
I am not a bigot and it was not a racial slur. Why do you feel the need to twist my words and profess to know my motives in saying what I say? You're protesting a bit too much.

I'm still waiting to hear in what way "warmonger" is inaccurate in describing John McCain?
 427cammer
Joined: 3/1/2008
Msg: 81
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/5/2008 9:43:24 PM
Charlemagne, according to your own words warmonger is a noun not an adjective. It is adjectives we use when describing people.

By that strict definition, then yes McCain could be called a warmonger... as well as many other notable names in history such as John Kennedy, Franklin Roosevelt, Teddy Roosevelt, Abraham Lincoln, and George Washington; they are all warmongers.

Really we're just going around in circles. I can see how it's very easy to get into namecalling spats participating in these forums. I'll admit that I've done some nose tweaking on other threads, on this one I was trying to stick to the topic and present my views on McCain's speech in a fair way. I wasn't going to abandon my views, but I never meant to get dirty...
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 82
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/5/2008 11:00:08 PM
I appreciate that words are very powerful and I am a person who chooses mine carefully. I did not use the term as a slur, to insult McCain, or to sling mud. I used it because based on his behavior as well as his repeated statements, it is accurate.

He does advocate war.
He does endorse war.
He made it clear in his acceptance speech that he wouldn't hesitate to precipitate another war....or two.

Strong word? Absolutely, and given the gravity of his words and intentions, I'd say its use is appropriate.

Derogatory? That's open to interpretation. Personally I find his views, attitudes, and intentions extremely derogatory. Extreme. Irrational. Unreasonable. Myopic, even delusional, to the point that he's starting to evoke visions of Hitler. The man frightens me; he is not rational.
 cpfstock
Joined: 11/7/2005
Msg: 83
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 5:47:36 AM
Actually I thought I heard McCain say, "I hate war." He then went on to briefly describe how bad it is. But, like Obama and every other presidental candidate I've ever heard he did say he would use military action, if needed.
It's the standard position of any candidate.
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 84
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 7:21:20 AM
WWII was a defensive war. Our own shores not in peril yet with the Germans and Japan had already attacked a military installation. There will come times where you will have no choice. Those who speak of diplomacy now and reducing our current global garrison military understand this and don't talk about sending flowers to our enemies hoping to appease although that's how we had it spun to us last week.

I still consider myself a Republican although these people aren't my Republicans. Hearing these people claim while frothing at the mouths that we are only American if we support taking what we want when we want, sticking guns in other's faces to get it, and telling other cultures how they are going to live or else makes me sick.

What I saw in that arena last week was the biggest bunch of anti-Americans I had ever seen in one place at one time.
 darjeeling
Joined: 3/11/2005
Msg: 85
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 7:34:20 AM
^^^^^^^^^^^




Added you to my Favorites List for that one, itechman42 !!!!

I'm about as far left as it can get on certain issues but I still have regard and respect for conservative positions when they make sense ... I would not however call them anti-American as much as confused-Americans.

My Respect.
darjy
 itechman63
Joined: 7/7/2005
Msg: 86
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 7:50:59 AM
Thanks for the correction Darjeeling.

America was not founded on any of the principles these people see as requisite to be an American. These Republicans I saw last week are not Conservatives, that much is for sure.
 TheStefano
Joined: 6/15/2008
Msg: 87
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 8:02:12 AM
highlander3, yes, I've noticed McCain repackaging Obama's platform.....wondered if anyone else had.

First they make fun of it, then they reword it and call it their own.........too funny.
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 88
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 9:01:41 AM
WWII was a defensive war. Our own shores not in peril yet with the Germans and Japan had already attacked a military installation. There will come times where you will have no choice. Those who speak of diplomacy now and reducing our current global garrison military understand this and don't talk about sending flowers to our enemies hoping to appease although that's how we had it spun to us last week.

Well stated.

Hearing these people claim while frothing at the mouths that we are only American if we support taking what we want when we want, sticking guns in other's faces to get it, and telling other cultures how they are going to live or else makes me sick.

This was my reaction as well. Although I've always been a registered Democrat, I have never been far left. I used to feel I didn't entirely fit in with either party because there are things I believe that are traditionally Republican views and there are things I believe that are traditionally Democratic views. I just believe what I believe regardless of who claims to own that belief.

As I've learned more about each party's core values, however, I've realized that my beliefs are more in tune with Democrats even though I'm still relatively moderate in my views.

The former S.O. was a self proclaimed Marxist and I'm here to tell ya, some of the wildness that came out of his head was pretty far out there. So far out there that his ideas were as unsettling to me as most of what I hear coming from some Republicans. Maybe being extreme in either direction isn't such a good thing, eh? Maybe adopting policies that take a little from this side, a little from that side, a little from over here, and a little from over there could work well. Just a thought.

I've noticed McCain repackaging Obama's platform.....wondered if anyone else had.

Yes, I have. In fact, just saw a sound bite on CNN showing McCain saying ~ and I kid you not ~ that we will achieve energy independence from foreign oil in ten years. I see him using more and more of Obama's words and you know what? I don't believe for a second that he's doing it because he means it; I think he's doing it to get elected. And I find that insulting to my intelligence and common sense, offensive even.
 dmotz
Joined: 7/25/2006
Msg: 89
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 9:24:17 AM
Ahh...another McCain bashing thread.
I am voting for Obama as I have stated over and over but, you guys are really pissing me off here.
To not really know anything about McCain and yet fill these posts with verbiage is silly.
John McCain IS A HERO...He has done more in the Senate than Obama and biden combined. He has done more for this nation than any other Senator in DC. You may not like his politics but you really should respect the man who has served YOU so well.
 KatLKN0621
Joined: 1/28/2008
Msg: 90
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 9:33:16 AM
I watched McCain's speech the other night and was struck by his history with the military. His entire life and in fact the lives of his family are completely entwined in the military (both his father and his grandfather were Admirals and his sons are serving as well). Certainly, I have great respect for their service. I have plenty of relatives who have served in the military and have 2 nephews in Iraq currently.

However, a Leader MUST HAVE A BROADER VIEW!! If all you have known is the military and war, then it stands to reason that will be your first instinct. Shoot first and ask questions later. I think the last 7 years has shown what a poor policy that can be. And now we are facing more challenges. Russia, Iran, and North Korea plus many more are going to require some pretty tricky diplomacy in the next few years. If your answer is "just nuke 'em" where does that leave us?

The conflict in Georgia showed us that blustering about war is not effective. If you leave out calm diplomacy and reason your options become very limited. I do not believe that John McCain has it in him to deny his background and those instincts to jump into battle. He has shown his loose temper too many times.
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 91
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 9:55:45 AM
dmotz, since when is scrutinizing the man's judgement and decision making ability or discussing his views and incessant flip flopping "bashing"? Nobody I've seen has denied that he served America; nobody I've seen has disrespected that aspect of his life.

This does not mean, however, that he deserves my vote. If he's done good things in the Senate, great, let him remain there and continue to accomplish things that don't give him unilateral decision making capability because that would be disastrous.
 dmotz
Joined: 7/25/2006
Msg: 92
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 10:01:39 AM
Ok...Charlemagne...What has Obama done in the Senate or as a community organizer that he should be the one to get your vote? Or are you just going down the party line?
Please explain ANYTHING Obama has done that has made this nation a better place?
 geeleebee
Joined: 5/26/2008
Msg: 93
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 10:08:26 AM

ahh...another McCain bashing thread.
I am voting for Obama as I have stated over and over but, you guys are really pissing me off here.
To not really know anything about McCain and yet fill these posts with verbiage is silly.
John McCain IS A HERO...He has done more in the Senate than Obama and biden combined. He has done more for this nation than any other Senator in DC. You may not like his politics but you really should respect the man who has served YOU so well.


Those of us who have researched McCain are making a logical, reasoned, well-thought out decision to vote for Obama.
In my opinion, anyone who serves in our military is a 'hero'. Period.
You state that McCain has 'done more...than Obama and Biden combined...' , could you give some examples? And, as for the statement about McCain doing 'more for this nation...', could you give examples comparing what he's done with, say, Teddy Kennedy?
Again, anyone who has served in our military doesn't have to earn my respect--it is a given.
 darjeeling
Joined: 3/11/2005
Msg: 94
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 10:13:07 AM
Charlemagne08,

For someone who claims to have limited experience battling in the political realm, I have to say that your arguments are {and have consistently been} really topnotch. I greatly admire your 'to the point' writing skills, and your intellectual ability to dispense with the all the peripheral clutter and get to the very heart of the matter within the various arguments. You are a formidable opponent and I am quite glad you are on our side in making this case.

Well Done ... and My Respect to you as well.

Cheers
darjeeling
 dmotz
Joined: 7/25/2006
Msg: 95
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 10:20:54 AM
What has Obama done that deserves your vote..again...answer that one. Do not get me started on Teddy...of all the great Democrats to serve you would have to pick the one who is best known for killing Mary Jo!
Biden has had a good carreer and is an honest man. Obama has done nothing...really...what has he done?
McCain has done plenty...just an example would be campaign finance reform...Look up his carreer and match it to Biden and especially Obama...you will see McCain is way out in front in the accomplishment department.
 faith2565
Joined: 3/25/2006
Msg: 96
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 10:32:12 AM
dmotz,

Here goes...... You asked for it and you got it.
-----------------------------------------

Obama's current economic advisors are Austan Goolsbee of the University of Chicago and Jeffrey Liebman of Harvard University.[2]
Obama wrote: "We should be asking ourselves what mix of policies will lead to a dynamic free market and widespread economic security, entrepreneurial innovation and upward mobility [...] we should be guided by what works."[3] Speaking before the National Press Club in April 2005, he defended the New Deal social welfare policies of Franklin D. Roosevelt, associating Republican proposals to establish private accounts for Social Security with Social Darwinism.[4]

As Illinois State Senator in 2000, Obama voted in favor of an industrial hemp bill.[5]
[On April 20, 2007, Obama introduced a bill in the Senate (Shareholder Vote on Executive Compensation Act - S. 1181) requiring public companies to give shareholders an annual nonbinding vote on executive compensation, popularly called "Say on pay." A companion bill introduced by Rep. Barney Frank passed the House the same day.[6] Several corporations voluntarily have begun to give shareholders such a vote because of concerns about excessive CEO salaries. Some critics have said that the federal law would interfere with the traditional state oversight over corporate governance.[7]
[edit]Labor rights
Obama supports the bi-partisan Employee Free Choice Act, which passed the House of Representatives in 2007, but failed to pass the Senate. Obama promises to sign the EFCA into law if he is elected President. [8]
[edit]Minimum wage
Obama favored the increase in the federal minimum wage from $5.15 an hour to $7.25, and he voted to end the filibuster against a bill to accomplish that.[9][10]
[edit]Equal pay
Obama favors the concept of equal pay (the abolition of wage differences based on gender).[11] He has supported legislation designed to improve the effectiveness of the Equal Pay Act of 1963. In 2007, the House of Representatives passed the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, which, according to the National Federation of Independent Business, would have allowed "employees to file charges of pay discrimination within 180 days of the last received paycheck affected by the alleged discriminatory decision."[12] The bill would have overturned the Supreme Court decision in Ledbetter v. Goodyear. There the Court dismissed a woman's discrimination claim because she had filed it more than 180 days after the first affected paycheck. The bill died in a 2008 Senate vote in which Obama and other Democrats could not break a Republican filibuster.[13]
[edit]Education
During an October 2004 debate, Obama stated that he opposed education vouchers for use at private schools because he believes they would undermine public schools.[14]
In a July 2007 address to the National Education Association, Obama supported merit pay for teachers, to be based on standards to be developed "with teachers."[15] Obama also called for higher pay for teachers.[15] Obama's plan is estimated to cost $18 billion annually and was originally planned to be partially funded by delaying NASA's Constellation program for five years[16] but he has since reconsidered and stated that he will look for "an entirely different offset"[17]. "We owe it to our children to invest in early-childhood education; and recruit an army of new teachers and give them better pay and more support; and finally decide that, in this global economy, the chance to get a college education should not be a privilege for the few, but a birthright of every American." [18] He also opposes the teaching of intelligent design.[19]
[edit]Energy policy
In his New Energy for America plan, Obama proposes to reduce overall U.S. oil consumption by at least 35%, or 10 million barrels per day, by 2030 in order to offset imports from OPEC nations.[20][21]
Obama voted in favor of the Energy Policy Act of 2005, which provided incentives (chiefly tax breaks) to reduce national consumption of energy and to encourage a wide range of alternative energy sources.[22][23] It also resulted in a net tax increase on oil companies.[24]
Obama and other Senators introduced the BioFuels Security Act in 2006. "It's time for Congress to realize what farmers in America's heartland have known all along - that we have the capacity and ingenuity to decrease our dependence on foreign oil by growing our own fuel," Obama said.[25] In a May 2006 letter to President George W. Bush, he joined four other midwest farming state Senators in calling for the preservation of a $0.54-per-gallon tariff on imported ethanol.[26]
In an interview with NBC's Tim Russert on May 4, 2008, Obama said, "...we've got a serious food problem around the world. We, we've got rising food prices here in the United States." "There's no doubt that biofuels may be contributing to it. And what I've said is, my top priority is making sure that people are able to get enough to eat. And if it turns out that we've got to make changes in our ethanol policy to help people get something to eat, then that's got to be the step we take."[27]
Regarding the domestic use of nuclear power, about McCain´s plans for 45 new plants, Obama said that it's not serious, it's not new, it's not the kind of energy policy that will give families the relief they need. [28]. Obama declared himself flatly opposed to building the Yucca Mountain nuclear waste repository in Nevada [29] [30].
In 2006, in response to Illinois residents' concerns about unreported radioactive leaks by Exelon Corporation, Obama introduced a Senate bill to effect mandatory disclosure of such leaks. In 2008, The New York Times, which had endorsed Hillary Rodham Clinton[31], charged that, in revising his bill, Obama had "removed language mandating prompt reporting and simply offered guidance to regulators".[32] In response, the Obama campaign cited a National Journal analysis of the revised bill, showing that "Obama's bill would require that any leak of radioactive materials exceeding the levels set by the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and the EPA be reported to state and local authorities, and to the NRC within 24 hours."[33]
Obama and other Senators introduced a bill in 2007 to promote the development of commercially viable plug-in hybrids and other electric-drive vehicles in order to shift away from petroleum fuels and "toward much cleaner – and cheaper – electricity for transportation".[34] Similar legislation is now in effect in the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007.[35] Obama proposes that the U.S. Government invest in such developments using revenue generated from an auction-based cap-and-trade or emissions trading program to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.[36]
Obama stresses innovation as a means to improve energy efficiency, calling for a 50% improvement by 2030. He has called for a 50 mpg–U.S. (4.7 L/100 km / 60.1 mpg–imp) rule, proposing tax credits to automakers in order to ease the transition.
He opposes drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.
On June 22, 2008 Obama proposed tightening regulations on oil speculators in an effort to ease record high prices of oil.[37] "My plan fully closes the Enron loophole and restores common-sense regulation," Obama said.[38]
Obama supporters at a campaign rally in Austin, Texas, on February 23, 2007. Mr. Obama said he supports universal health care and programs to increase access to education.[39]
[edit]Health care
On January 24, 2007 Obama spoke about his position on health care at Families USA, a health care advocacy group. Obama said, "The time has come for universal health care in America [...] I am absolutely determined that by the end of the first term of the next president, we should have universal health care in this country." Obama went on to say that he believed that it was wrong that forty-seven million Americans are uninsured, noting that taxpayers already pay over $15 billion annually to care for the uninsured.[40] Obama cites cost as the reason so many Americans are without health insurance.[41] Obama's health care plan includes implementing guaranteed eligibility for affordable health care for all Americans, paid for by insurance reform, reducing costs, removing patent protection for pharmaceuticals, and required employer contributions.[42] He would provide for mandatory health care insurance for children.
In July of 2008 The New York Times reported that Senator Obama has promised to “bring down premiums by $2,500 for the typical family.” His advisors have said that the $2,500 premium reduction includes, in addition to direct premium savings, the average family's share of the reduction in employer paid health insurance premiums and the reduction in the cost of government health programs such as Medicare and Medicaid. [43]
[edit]NASA
"As president, Obama will support the development of this vital new platform Crew Exploration Vehicle to ensure that the United States' reliance on foreign space capabilities is limited to the minimum possible time period."[44][45] Obama has previously advocated a delay of the NASA Constellation Program by at least five years in order to fund educational programs.[46] He has since reversed this position, stating "I know it's still being reported that we were talking about delaying some aspects of the Constellation program to pay for our early-education program ... I told my staff we're going to find an entirely different offset, because we've got to make sure that the money going into NASA for basic research and development continues to go there. That has been a top priority for us."[47]
[edit]Network neutrality and government use of information technology
In a June 2006 podcast, Obama expressed support for telecommunications legislation to protect network neutrality on the Internet, saying: "It is because the Internet is a neutral platform that I can put out this podcast and transmit it over the Internet without having to go through any corporate media middleman. I can say what I want without censorship or without having to pay a special charge. But the big telephone and cable companies want to change the Internet as we know it."[48] Obama reaffirmed his commitment to net neutrality at a meeting with Google employees in November 2007, at which he said, "once providers start to privilege some applications or web sites over others, then the smaller voices get squeezed out, and we all lose."[49] At the same event, Obama pledged to appoint a Chief Technology Officer to oversee the U.S. government's management of IT resources and promote wider access to government information and decision making.[50]
[edit]Taxation
Obama has proposed a tax plan which includes an $80 billion tax cut for poor and middle-class families and repeal the tax cuts for the richest one percent of taxpayers. His tax plan calls for billions in breaks by nixing income taxes for the 7 million senior citizens making less than $50,000 a year, establishing a universal credit for the 10 million homeowners who do not itemize their deductions -- most of whom make less than $50,000 annually -- and providing 150 million Americans with tax cuts of up to $1,000. Persons making at least $250,000 or more would pay payroll tax on their entire income, as opposed to the first $102,000[51][52] and would see their capital gains tax increase from 15% to 20-28%. [53] Obama spoke out in June 2006 against making recent, temporary estate tax cuts permanent, calling the cuts a "Paris Hilton" tax break for "billionaire heirs and heiresses."[54] Speaking in November 2006 to members of Wake Up Wal-Mart, a union-backed campaign group, Obama said: "You need to pay your workers enough that they can actually not only shop at Wal-Mart, but ultimately send their kids to college and save for retirement." His tax plan would bring in an additional $700 billion in taxes over the next 10 years. [55]
In The Audacity of Hope and the Blueprint for Change[56] Obama advocates responding to the "precarious budget situation" by eliminating "tax credits that have outlived their usefulness", closing corporate tax loopholes, and restoring the PAYGO policy that prohibits increases in federal spending without a way to compensate for the lost revenue.[57]
[edit]Lobbying and campaign finance reform
Obama has spoken out numerous times against the influence of lobbying in the United States.[58][59] He also co-sponsored legislation that limits lobbyists' influence by mandating that lawmakers pay full charter fare when flying on lobbyists' corporate jets.[60]
On January 24th, 2007, in reference to his stated plan to take public financing should he procure the nomination, he said, "I think that for a time, the presidential public financing system works." On November 27, he said, "I will aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election," and on February 28, 2008, he wrote that he planned to "aggressively pursue" a publicly financed campaign, later promising to sit down with John McCain to ensure "a public system" of campaign financing is preserved.[61] However, on June 19th, 2008, he opted out of public campaign financing and declared, "I support a robust system of public financing of elections (...) but the public financing of presidential elections as it exists today is broken."[62][63]. Furthermore he has maintained that he will not take contributions from federal lobbyists and special interests during his 2008 presidential campaign.
According to his website, if elected president, Obama would create an online database of lobbying reports, campaign finance filings and ethics records, and would create an independent watchdog agency to oversee congressional ethical violations.
[edit]Immigration
Obama supports a guest worker program, [64] and voted in favor of the Bush administration backed Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2007. Obama has said that he "will not support any bill that does not provide [an] earned path to citizenship for the undocumented population."
Obama has said that he does not believe that 12 million illegal immigrants can be deported. He said "It's not going to happen. We're not going to go round them up ... We should give them a pathway to citizenship."[65]
In September 2006, Obama voted for the Secure Fence Act, authorizing the construction of 700 miles (1,100 km) of fencing along the United States–Mexico border.[66]
Obama has supported granting driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.[67]
In June of 2007, Obama voted against declaring English as the official language of the US government. [68]
In November of 2007, Obama stated that, "We can … go a long way toward meeting industry’s need for skilled workers with Americans. Until we have achieved that, I will support a temporary increase in the H-1B visa program as a stopgap measure until we can reform our immigration system comprehensively." [68]
In July of 2007, Obama said, "Find out how many senators appeared before an immigration rally last year. Who was talking the talk, and who walked the walk -- because I walked…I didn't run away from the issue, and I didn't just talk about it in front of Latino audiences."[69][70]
[edit]Affirmative action
In reference to state ballot initiatives on affirmative action, Obama's spokeperson Candice Toliver said that "Senator Obama believes in a country in which opportunity is available to all Americans, regardless of race, gender or economic status. That's why he opposes these ballot initiatives, which would roll back opportunity for millions of Americans and cripple efforts to break down historic barriers to the progress of qualified women and minorities."[71][72]
Obama writes in his most recent book, The Audacity of Hope: "Affirmative action programs, when properly structured, can open up opportunities otherwise closed to qualified minorities without diminishing opportunities for white students."[73] In July, Obama stated, "I am a strong supporter of affirmative action when properly structured so that it is not just a quota, but it is acknowledging and taking into account some of the hardships and difficulties that communities of color may have experienced, continue to experience, and it also speaks to the value of diversity in all walks of American life."[74]
[edit]Trade
Barack Obama made critical statements about the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) during the Democratic primaries, calling the trade agreement "devastating" and "a big mistake".[75] His economic advisor Austan Goolsbee later met with the Canadian consul general in Chicago; the Canadian memo of the meeting, which was obtained by Fortune, stated that Obama's rhetoric was explained as "more reflective of political maneuvering than policy."[75] Later, during a debate before the Texas and Ohio primaries, Obama offered to threaten Canada and Mexico with American withdrawal from the agreement unless it was renegotiated. Before a closed meeting with donors in San Francisco, Obama referenced, "small towns in Pennsylvania" where, "(residents) cling to ...anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."[76][75] Obama also noted that free trade comes with its own costs: he believes the displacement of Mexican farmers by more efficient American counterparts has led to increased immigration to the United States from that country.[75]
[edit]Faith based programs
In July 2008 Obama announced that he wants to expand federal funding of faith-based programs and establish a "Council for Faith-Based and Neighborhood Partnerships". He specified that, under his plan, federal money given to places of worship could only be used on secular programs. In particular, he mentioned, on July 1 in Zanesville, Ohio, that "support for social services to the poor and the needy have consistently been underfunded". He went on to praise President Bush's efforts, but contended that the current administration's plan never managed to "rally the armies of compassion."[77][78]
[edit]Foreign policy

[edit]Overview
His first major speech on foreign policy was delivered on April 23, 2007 to the Chicago Council on Global Affairs. He identified the problems that he believes the current foreign policy has caused, and the five ways the United States can lead again, focused on "common security", "common humanity", and remaining "a beacon of freedom and justice for the world":[79]
"Bringing a responsible end" to the war in Iraq and refocusing on the broader region.
"Building the first truly 21st century military and showing wisdom in how we deploy it."
"Marshalling a global effort" to secure, destroy, and stop the spread of weapons of mass destruction.
"Rebuild and construct the alliances and partnerships necessary to meet common challenges and confront common threats," including global warming.
"Invest in our common humanity" through foreign aid and supporting the "pillars of a sustainable democracy – a strong legislature, an independent judiciary, the rule of law, a vibrant civil society, a free press, and an honest police force."
During the speech Obama called for an expansion of the United States Armed Forces "by adding 65,000 soldiers to the Army and 27,000 Marines", an idea previously introduced by Secretary of Defense Robert Gates.
In a Washington, DC speech entitled "A New Strategy for a New World"[80] delivered July 15, 2008, Obama stated five main foreign policy goals:
ending the war in Iraq responsibly;
finishing the fight against al Qaeda and the Taliban;
securing all nuclear weapons and materials from terrorists and rogue states;
achieving true energy security; and,
rebuilding our alliances to meet the challenges of the 21st century.
[edit]Foreign policy advisors
Barack Obama is currently advised on foreign policy by a support group of approximately 300 people organized into 20 teams based upon subject.[81] A core group of advisors, led by Susan E. Rice and Anthony Lake, filters hundreds of papers and messages daily to provide the Senator with more concise positions on foreign policy and more specific reactions to international developments. Obama's foreign policy advisers have included Richard Danzig, Mark Lippert, Gregory Craig, Dennis McDonough, Daniel Shapiro, Scott Gration, Sarah Sewall, Ivo Daalder, Jeffrey Bader, Mark Brzezinski, Zbigniew Brzezinski, Richard Clarke, Roger Cressey, Philip Gordon, Lawrence Korb, James Ludes, Robert Malley, Bruce Riedel, Dennis Ross, Mona Sutphen, and Samantha Power (resigned March 7, 2008).[82][83][84]
[edit]Foreign policy issues
[edit]Diplomacy and negotiations
Obama's campaign website states:
The United States is trapped by the Bush-Cheney approach to diplomacy that refuses to talk to leaders we don't like. Not talking doesn't make us look tough — it makes us look arrogant, it denies us opportunities to make progress, and it makes it harder for America to rally international support for our leadership. Obama is willing to meet with the leaders of all nations, friend and foe. He will do the careful preparation necessary, but will signal that America is ready to come to the table, and that he is willing to lead.[85][86]
Returning to that theme on May 18, 2008, Obama told a crowd in Pendleton, Oregon that "strong countries and strong presidents talk to their adversaries. ... That’s what Reagan did with Gorbachev." He continued, "Iran, Cuba, Venezuela — these countries are tiny compared to the Soviet Union. They don’t pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us. And yet we were willing to talk to the Soviet Union at the time when they were saying, 'We’re going to wipe you off the planet.' "[87]
After John McCain criticized those remarks as evidence of Obama's "inexperience and reckless judgment," Obama responded that the United States should have "the courage and confidence" to talk to its adversaries. "Demanding that a country meets all your conditions before you meet with them, that’s not a strategy. It’s just naive, wishful thinking."[87]
[edit]Intelligence
In a broad foreign policy address at Chicago's DePaul University on October 2, 2007, Obama touched on intelligence concerns and government secrecy, saying:
I'll turn the page on a growing empire of classified information, and restore the balance we've lost between the necessarily secret and the necessity of openness in a democratic society by creating a new National Declassification Center. We'll protect sources and methods, but we won't use sources and methods as pretexts to hide the truth.[88]
Obama proposes giving the Director of National Intelligence a fixed term independent of Presidential control as one means of depoliticizing the intelligence process and reforming the U.S. intelligence community.[89] In a 2007 article appearing in Foreign Affairs, Obama wrote, "...we should institutionalize the practice of developing competitive assessments of critical threats and strengthen our methodologies of (intelligence) analysis.[90]
He originally opposed efforts to include any legal immunity, especially retroactive immunity, for government officials and telecommunications firms alleged to have taken part in the Bush administration's warrantless eavesdropping program as part of legislation to modernize the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act.[91] However, on June 20, 2008, Obama issued a statement saying that he would support the FISA Amendments Act of 2008 passed the previous week by the House of Representatives, although he would attempt to have a retroactive immunity provision included in the bill removed before it came to a Senate floor vote.[92] Obama's decision to vote in favor of a bill containing an immunity provision attracted criticism from some of his activist supporters.[93] Obama voted for an amendment to strip retroactive immunity from the bill, but the amendment failed to pass.[94] On July 9, he voted for the entire FISA amendments bill which still included retroactive immunity.[95]
[edit]Missile defense and the military
Obama said he would institute an "Independent Defense Priorities Board," cut investments from an “unproven missile defense system,” "set a goal for a world without nuclear weapons," "work with Russia to take our ICBM's off hair trigger alert" and "slow the development of Future Combat Systems." [96]
On April 23, 2007 Barack Obama addressed the Chicago Council on Global Affairs Obama and called for an expansion of the United States Armed Forces "by adding 65,000 soldiers to the Army and 27,000 Marines", an idea previously introduced by Secretary of Defense Robert Gates, and "providing them with the first-rate equipment, armor, training, and incentives they deserve"; despite his incentives to slow the development of Future Combat Systems. [97] [98]
[edit]Nuclear proliferation
Obama has spoken out against nuclear proliferation. According to his campaign website, Obama will "crack down on nuclear proliferation by strengthening the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty."[99] Obama has also vowed to stop the development of new American nuclear arms, pursuing an ultimate goal of "a world without nuclear weapons."[99]
[edit]Foreign aid
Obama is the principal sponsor of the Global Poverty Act of 2007 (S.2433), co-sponsored by Senators Chuck Hagel (R-NE) and Maria Cantwell (D-WA). It calls for a "comprehensive strategy to further the United States foreign policy objective of promoting the reduction of global poverty". [100] A similar bill, H.R. 1302, was passed by the House of Representatives on September 25, 2007. [101] On August 6, 2008 the Republican National Committee also described the bill as costing $845 billion. [102] The Congressional Budget Office, however, has stated that "implementing S. 2433 would cost less than $1 million per year...." [103]
[edit]Countries and regions
[edit]Afghanistan
Obama announced a plan — if elected — to deploy an additional 7,000 troops to Afghanistan. "As president, I would pursue a new strategy, and begin by providing at least two additional combat brigades to support our effort in Afghanistan" "We need more troops, more helicopters, better intelligence-gathering and more nonmilitary assistance to accomplish the mission there" "I would not hold our military, our resources and our foreign policy hostage to a misguided desire to maintain permanent bases in Iraq," Obama said on July 14, 2008.[104]
After meeting with French President Nicolas Sarkozy in Paris on July 25 as part of a world tour, Obama said in the joint news conference with Sarkozy, "Afghanistan is a war that we have to win" because al-Qaeda and the radical Islamic Taliban movement cannot be allowed to establish new havens for planning "terrorist attacks . . . that could affect Paris or New York." Obama declared that there were no effective options to this policy, saying, "So we don't have a choice; we've got to finish the job." Obama said the United States "needs to send two additional brigades at least" to Afghanistan and praised Sarkozy for his willingness to send more French troops to that country.[105]
[edit]Arab-Israeli conflicts
Referring to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in January 2006, Obama denounced Hamas while praising former Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon. At a meeting with then Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom on the eve of Hamas' sweeping election victory,[106] Obama stated that Sharon's role in the conflict had always been "absolutely important and constructive."[107] At a meeting with Palestinian students two days later, Obama stated opposition to Hamas in favor of rival party Fatah, noting his desire to "consolidate behind a single government with a single authority that can then negotiate as a reliable partner with Israel." In a comment aimed at Hamas, he said that "the US will always side with Israel if Israel is threatened with destruction."[108]
Obama was also a co-sponsor of the Palestinian Anti-Terrorism Act of 2006, which in part calls on "members of the international community to avoid contact with and refrain from financially supporting the terrorist organization Hamas until it agrees to recognize Israel, renounce violence, disarm, and accept prior agreements, including the Roadmap."[109]
Obama defended Israel's response to the killing of eight Israeli soldiers and kidnapping of two others near the border with Lebanon, telling NBC's Tim Russert on August 22, 2006, "I don't think there is any nation that would not have reacted the way Israel did after two soldiers had been snatched. I support Israel's response to take some action in protecting themselves."
Discussing the 2006 Israel-Hezbollah War Obama said, " don't fault Israel for wanting to rid their border with Lebanon from those Katyusha missiles that can fire in and harm Israeli citizens, so I think that any cease fire would have to be premised on the removal of those missiles."[110]
Speaking to the American Israel Public Affairs Committee on 2 March 2007, Obama called Israel "our strongest ally in the region," and stated: "We must preserve our total commitment to our unique defense relationship with Israel by fully funding military assistance and continuing work on the Arrow and related missile defense programs." On the Palestinian Authority's new unity government, Obama said: "We should all be concerned about the agreement negotiated among Palestinians in Mecca last month."[111]
In March 2007, Obama told Democratic activists in Iowa, "Nobody is suffering more than the Palestinian people. ...if we could get some movement among Palestinian leadership, what I'd like to see is a loosening up of some of the restrictions on providing aid directly to the Palestinian people."[112][113]
Obama has also discussed in more general terms his views about the Palestinians vis-à-vis the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. On June 4, 2007, he stated that:
...resolution [to the conflict] and a better life for all people... is something that can be achieved, but it's going to require some soul-searching on the Palestinian side. They have to recognize Israel's right to exist; they have to renounce violence and terrorism as a tool to achieve their political ends; they have to abide by agreements. In that context, I think the Israelis will gladly say, "Let's move forward negotiations that would allow them to live side by side with the Palestinians in peace and security."[114]
Obama denounced former President Jimmy Carter for meeting with Hamas. Obama said "Hamas is not a state, Hamas is a terrorist organization."[115]
In June 2008, Obama became the first presidential candidate ever to publicly back the traditional Israeli position that Jerusalem remain forever undivided under Israel rule. "Jerusalem will remain the capital of Israel, and it must remain undivided," Obama declared on June 4, 2008.[116][117] Days later, he said, "obviously, it's going to be up to the parties to negotiate a range of these issues. And Jerusalem will be part of those negotiations."[118]
On a July, 2008 world tour focused on trouble spots for U.S. national security interests, Obama met with Israeli president Shimon Peres, prime minister Ehud Olmert, oppostion party leader Benjamin Netanyahu, and Palestinian Authority president Mahmoud Abbas and prime minister Salam Fayyad. Obama reiterated that Jerusalem should be the capital of Israel, but that territorial disputes regarding that city and elsewhere needed to be resolved without direct U.S. involvement. "That’s an issue that has to be dealt with by the parties involved, the Palestinians and the Israelis, and it is not the job of the United States to dictate the form in which that will take, but rather to support the efforts that are being made right now to resolve these very difficult issues that have a long history." On the same trip, Obama said, "The state of Israel faces determined enemies who seek its destruction, but it also has a friend and ally in the United States that will always stand by the people of Israel."
Obama also issued a warning to Iran at the same time, saying, "A nuclear Iran would pose a grave threat and the world must prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon." Obama said no options were "off the table" in dealing with a nuclear threat from Iran but that the country should be offered diplomatic incentives in the form of "big carrots" as well as punitive measures or threats in the form of "big sticks." Obama said, "I think there are opportunities for us to mobilize a much more serious regime of sanctions on Iran, but also to offer them the possibility of improved relations in the international community if they stand down on these nuclear weapons."[119]
[edit]Armenian genocide
On January 19, 2008 Obama announced that as a U.S. Senator, he has stood with the Armenian American community in calling for Turkey's acknowledgement of the Armenian Genocide, and supports its recognition. In 2006, Obama criticized Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice for firing United States Ambassador to Armenia, John Evans, after he used the term "genocide" to describe Turkey's killing of hundreds of thousands of Armenians. Obama said that he shared with Rice his "firmly held conviction that the Armenian Genocide is not an allegation, a personal opinion, or a point of view, but rather a widely documented fact supported by an overwhelming body of historical evidence".[120]
On June, 2008 Obama restated his commitment to U.S. recognition of the Armenian Genocide in a letter to ANCA Chairman Ken Hachikian. "I share your view that the United States must recognize the events of 1915 to 1923, carried out by the Ottoman Empire, as genocide. As you know, this resulted in the deportation of nearly 2,000,000 Armenians, of whom 1,500,000 men, women, and children were killed", wrote Obama[121].
[edit]Cuba
In an August opinion piece in the Miami Herald, he stated: "A democratic opening in Cuba is, and should be, the foremost objective of our policy." He then went on to note: "We need a clear strategy to achieve it – one that takes some limited steps now to spread the message of freedom on the island, but preserves our ability to bargain on behalf of democracy with a post-Fidel government." More to the point, his administration would recognize that "bilateral talks would be the best means of promoting Cuban freedom."[122] In a speech before the Cuban American National Foundation in Miami Obama hardened his position, vowing to maintain the economic embargo against Cuba and not to begin normalizing relations with the US until the island nation took "significant steps towards democracy" including the "freeing of all political prisoners". He characterized his position as "strong, smart, and principled" diplomacy. [123]
[edit]China
On March 20, 2008 Obama criticized his rivals for undermining America’s security: "Because of the Bush-McCain policies, our debt has ballooned. This is creating problems in our fragile economy." "It also means we’re having to pay for this war with loans from China. Having China as our banker isn’t good for our economy, it isn’t good for our global leadership, and it isn’t good for our national security. History teaches us that for a nation to remain a preeminent military power, it must remain a preeminent economic power."[124]
[edit]Darfur


Obama addressing the Save Darfur rally at the National Mall in Washington, D.C. on April 30, 2006.[125]
In a December 2005 Washington Post opinion column, and at the Save Darfur rally in April 2006, Obama called for more assertive action to oppose genocide in the Darfur region of Sudan.[126] He has divested $180,000 in personal holdings of Sudan-related stock, and has urged divestment from companies doing business in Iran.[127] In the July-August 2007 issue of Foreign Affairs, Obama called for an outward looking post-Iraq War foreign policy and the renewal of American military, diplomatic, and moral leadership in the world. Saying "we can neither retreat from the world nor try to bully it into submission," he called on Americans to "lead the world, by deed and by example."[128]
[edit]Europe
Obama said he would "ask more from our European allies" to win the struggle in Afghanistan. "You can't have a situation where the United States is called upon to do the dirty work, or the United States and Britain are called upon to do the dirty work, and nobody else wants to engage in actual firefights with the Taliban."[129]
[edit]Iran
During his 2004 Senate campaign, Obama stated that he had not ruled out military action against Iran. In a meeting with the Chicago Tribune editorial board, Obama stated: "The big question is going to be, if Iran is resistant to these pressures, including economic sanctions, which I hope will be imposed if they do not cooperate, at what point are we going to take military action, if any?" Obama stressed that he would only use force as a last resort.[130] Obama has not declared a change in this stance since the 2004 campaign. In 2006, he called on Iran to "take some ownership for creating some stability" in Iraq.[131]
In an interview with NBC's Tim Russert on October 22, 2006, Obama said, "I think that military options have to be on the table when you're dealing with rogue states that have shown constant hostility towards the United States. The point that I would make, though, is that we have not explored all of our options...We have not explored any kind of dialogue with either Iran or North Korea, and I think that has been a mistake. As a consequence, we have almost no leverage over them."[132]
Speaking to the American Israel Public Affairs Committee on March 2, 2007, Obama stated that he regards Iran's government as "a threat to all of us," stating that the US "should take no option, including military action, off the table. Sustained and aggressive diplomacy combined with tough sanctions should be our primary means to prevent Iran from building nuclear weapons."[133] Diplomacy would include "more determined U.S. diplomacy at the United Nations," "harnessing the collective power of our friends in Europe who are Iran's major trading partners," and "a cooperative strategy with Gulf States who supply Iran with much of the energy resources it needs."[134] He formulated a strategy of "direct engagement with Iran similar to the meetings we conducted with the Soviets at the height of the Cold War."[135]
In a September 2007 speech in Iowa, Obama voiced concern over Bush administration policy on Iran:
...we hear eerie echoes of the run-up to the war in Iraq in the way that the President and Vice President talk about Iran. ... They issue veiled threats. They suggest that the time for diplomacy and pressure is running out when we haven't even tried direct diplomacy. Well George Bush and****Cheney must hear — loud and clear — from the American people and the Congress: you don't have our support, and you don't have our authorization for another war.[136]
Obama has criticized Hillary Clinton for voting in favor of classifying the Iranian Quds Force as a terrorist organization, saying the measure could enable Bush to launch military action against Iran,[137] stating that he would have voted against it if he had not been in New Hampshire campaigning.[138] The Clinton campaign has countered that this was inconsistent with Obama's co-sponsorship of a 2006 Iran sanctions bill which contained a similar designation.[139]
In June 2008, Obama called Iran the greatest threat in the Middle East.[140] "There's no greater threat to Israel or to the peace and stability of the region than Iran," Obama said on June 4, 2008.[141]
After meeting with French President Nicolas Sarkozy in Paris on July 25 as part of a world tour, Obama issued his strongest warning yet to Tehran with Sarkozy at his side. Obama urged Iran to "end its illicit nuclear program" or face increased pressure from a unified international community, saying that the Iranian government should not "wait for the next president" before accepting proposals to resolve the current stalemate with Western countries.
Obama said that the world faced an "extraordinarily grave situation" from Iran's pursuit of a uranium enrichment program, which the United States and its allies fear could be used eventually to build nuclear weapons. Obama said that he had found "uniform concern about Iran" in his meetings with leaders in the Middle East and Europe on his trip.[105]
[edit]Iraq
Obama was an early opponent of Bush administration policies on Iraq, when many Democratic leaders supported the Congressional joint resolution authorizing the Iraq War. Obama was not yet in the United States Senate, and therefore unable to vote on the joint resolution. On October 2, 2002, the day Bush and Congress agreed on the joint resolution authorizing the Iraq War, Illinois State Senator Obama addressed the first high-profile Chicago anti-Iraq War rally in Federal Plaza at noon and said: "I am not opposed to all wars. I'm opposed to dumb wars. [...] You want a fight, President Bush? Let's finish the fight with Bin Laden and al-Qaeda, through effective, coordinated intelligence, and a shutting down of the financial networks that support terrorism, and a homeland security program that involves more than color-coded warnings."[142]
During a July 2004 interview reported by the New York Times when asked how he would have acted in regard to the Iraq resolution in 2002, Obama answered "What would I have done? I don't know. What I know is that from my vantage point the case [against invading Iraq] was not made" and that he was "not privy to Senate Intelligence reports," using it as a reason to support John Kerry and John Edwards in the 2004 election.[143] Obama defended his words on a later edition of Meet the Press saying that he made the statement because it was during the middle of an election in which his party's presidential nominees had both voted to authorize the war and noting that he was openly opposed to the war as early as 2002.[144]
Speaking before the Chicago Council on Global Affairs in November 2006, he said: "The days of using the war on terror as a political football are over. [...] It is time to give Iraqis their country back, and it is time to refocus America's efforts on the wider struggle yet to be won." In his speech Obama also called for a phased withdrawal of American troops starting in 2007, and an opening of diplomatic dialogue with Iraq's neighbors, Syria and Iran.[145]
On January 30, 2007, Obama introduced the Iraq War De-Escalation Act of 2007 into Congress. Among other things, the Act calls for capping the level of troops in Iraq at January 2007 levels, and for commencing a phased redeployment of US forces from Iraq "with the goal of removing all combat brigades from Iraq by March 31, 2008, a date that is consistent with the expectation of the bipartisan Iraq Study Group.[146][147] Announcing the act on the Senate floor, Obama stated that "no amount of American soldiers can solve the political differences at the heart of somebody else's civil war."[148]


David Petraeus gives an aerial tour of Baghdad to Barack Obama and Chuck Hagel.
Obama has not supported cutting funding to the war as a way to end U.S. involvement in the conflict. He stated that, "Once we were in, we were going to have some responsibility to try to make it work as best we can".[149] Obama was however one of 14 senators who voted against the successful passage of H.R.2206 in May 2007, a bill meant to provide continued funding for the Iraq war free from any withdrawal deadlines.[150]
In an interview with BBC's HARDtalk on March 6, 2008, Obama foreign policy adviser Samantha Power stated that Obama's pledge to "have all [US] combat brigades out of Iraq within 16 months"[151] was a "best case scenario" that "he will revisit when he becomes president." She continued, saying that "what we can take seriously is that he will try to get US forces out of Iraq as quickly and responsibly as possible."[152] [153]
Obama said that he would "continue to refine my policy" after visiting Iraq, saying that his timetable for troop withdrawal was not intractable. [154] On July 3, Obama reasserted his position on withdrawal saying "I have always said I would listen to commanders on the ground. I have always said the pace of withdrawal would be dictated by the safety and security of our troops and the need to maintain stability. That assessment has not changed and when I go to Iraq and I have a chance to talk to some of the commanders on the ground, I’m sure I’ll have more information and will continue to refine my policies."[155].
Obama said he would set a goal of having all U.S. combat brigades out of Iraq by summer 2010 and shift more resources to fighting Taliban in Afghanistan.[156] "We can safely redeploy our combat brigades at a pace that would remove them in 16 months" "That would be the summer of 2010 -- two years from now, and more than seven years after the war began," Obama said on July 14, 2008.[157]
[edit]Pakistan
In an address on national security to the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars on August 1, 2007, Obama stated that as President he would consider military action in Pakistan in order to attack al-Qaeda, even if the Pakistani government did not give approval.[158] Obama said, "I will not hesitate to use military force to take out terrorists who pose a direct threat to America."[159] He also said "As President, I would deploy at least two additional brigades to Afghanistan to reinforce our counter-terrorism operations".[160]
On August 1, 2007 Obama declared in a foreign policy speech that the United States must be willing to strike al Qaeda targets inside Pakistan, with or without the consent of the Pakistani government. He claimed that if elected, "If we have actionable intelligence about high value terrorist targets and President Musharraf won't act, we will".[161] On the same day in response, then-White House press secretary Tony Snow highlighted the policy's shift from the position established by the Bush Administration, he said: "Our approach to Pakistan is one that not only respects the sovereignty of Pakistan as a sovereign government, but is also designed to work in a way where we are working in cooperation with the local government".[162]
After weeks of discourse surrounding the policy, Obama said there was misreporting of his comments, saying that, "I never called for an invasion of Pakistan or Afghanistan." He clarified that rather than a surge in the number of troops in Iraq, there needs to be a "diplomatic surge" and that if there were "actionable intelligence reports" showing al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden in Pakistan, the U.S. troops as a last resort should enter and try to capture terrorists. That would happen, he added, only if "the Pakistani government was unable or unwilling" to go after the terrorists.[163]
Obama has said that he would hold Pakistan accountable for the massive military aid it has received from Washington if he were elected to the White House.[164] He said his administration will increase pressure on Pakistan to come to terms with terrorist safe havens along its northern border with Afghanistan. He noted that the US was providing Pakistan military aid which he said was being misused by that country to prepare for a war against India.[165]
[edit]South Ossetia
"I wholeheartedly condemn the violation of Georgia's sovereignty. I think it is important at this point for all sides to show restraint and to stop this arms conflict. Georgia's territorial integrity needs to be preserved and now is the time for direct talks," Obama said on August 8, 2008.[166] Moscow sent tanks into the pro-Russian separatist region of South Ossetia when Georgia, a staunch U.S. ally,[167] launched a major military offensive to retake the breakaway province.[168][169]
[edit]Social policy

[edit]Abortion and contraception
In his write-in response to a 1998 survey, Obama stated his abortion position as: "Abortions should be legally available in accordance with Roe v. Wade."[170]
While serving in the Illinois Senate, Obama received a 100 percent rating from the Illinois Planned Parenthood Council[171] for his support of abortion rights[172] Since his election to the United States Senate Obama has maintained a 100 percent rating from Planned Parenthood (as of 2007) and NARAL (as of 2005).[173] Obama opposed the Induced Infant Liability Act.[174]Obama is reported to have opposed it because of technical language that might have interfered with a woman's right to choose and because Illinois law already required medical care in such situations, even though the third version of this bill contained explicit language affirming Roe vs. Wade. [175]
Obama voted against the Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act, saying "I think that most Americans recognize that this is a profoundly difficult issue for the women and families who make these decisions. They don't make them casually. And I trust women to make these decisions in conjunction with their doctors and their families and their clergy."[176] Obama voted against a bill that made it a federal crime for anyone other than a parent to accompany a minor across state lines to obtain an abortion.[177] The bill was signed into law by President Bush in 2005. Obama has, however, expressed support of bans on late-term abortions, provided they include exemptions for the life or health of a mother [178]
Obama voted for a $100 million education initiative to reduce teen pregnancy and provide contraceptives to young people.[176]
[edit]Disability rights
Obama was the only Democratic presidential candidate to issue an unsolicited statement expressing his views on disability community issues. For example, he stated his intention to sign the UN Convention on the Rights of People with Disabilities, and expressed his support of the ADA Restoration Act.[179]
[edit]Environmental policy and record
The Sierra Club has described Obama as having a "strong record of support for clean air, wetlands protection, and clean energy."[180]
Obama believes that the burning of fossil fuels has contributed significantly to global warming. He has stated:
The issue of climate change is one that we ignore at our own peril. There may still be disputes about exactly how much is naturally occurring, but what we can be scientifically certain of is that our continued use of fossil fuels is pushing us to a point of no return. And unless we free ourselves from a dependence on these fossil fuels and chart a new course on energy in this country, we are condemning future generations to global catastrophe.[181]
He has pledged to cut greenhouse gas emissions 80 percent below 1990 levels by 2050 by creating a market-based cap-and-trade system.[181] Obama also has plans for improving air and water quality through reduced carbon emissions.[181]
Obama worked as a member of the US Senate Committee on Environment and Public Works during the 109th Congress.[182]According to the League of Conservation Voters (LCV), Obama has made pro-environment votes on 10 of 15 congressional resolutions documented in the 2007 National Environmental Scorecard. The resolutions in the listed by the scorecard for the first session of the 110th Congress include energy legislation regarding fuel efficiency and clean/renewable energy, oil refineries, undermining renewable electricity, offshore drilling, liquid coal, biofuels, water resources, population, farming subsidies, and eminent domain.His lifetime environmental voting percentage given by the LCV in 2007 is 86 which dropped from the previous year due to four absences that count negatively on the LCV scorecard.[183]In his recent presidential campaign Obama rejected John McCain's proposed suspension of federal gas taxes claiming it would hurt consumers, hinder highway construction, and endanger jobs. Obama criticized the idea of a gas tax "holiday" as a ploy by his rivals "designed to get them through an election" and not actually help "struggling consumers".[184]
The League of Conservation Voters has given Barack Obama the highest lifetime rating of anyone currently running for president [185].
[edit]Native Americans
Obama has stated, "The bond that I would like to create between an Obama administration and the [Native American] nations all across this country...is something that is going to be a top priority." Obama added that "few have been ignored by Washington for as long as native Americans – the first Americans" and that "too often Washington has paid lip service to working with tribes while taking a one-size-fits-all approach" and promised "that will change when I am president".[186]
Obama is the first presidential candidate to have been given honorary membership into a Native American tribe, the Crow Nation. At a private adoption ceremony, Obama was given the Crow name "One Who Helps People Throughout the Land".[186]
[edit]African Americans
On July 14, 2008, Obama said in Cincinnati to the annual convention of the NAACP: "No matter how much money we invest in our communities, how many 10-point plans we propose, how many government programs we launch, none of it will make a difference — at least not enough of a difference—if we also at the same time don't seize more responsibility in our own lives."[187] "I consistently believe that when it comes to whether it's Native Americans or African-American issues or reparations, the most important thing for the U.S. government to do is not just offer words, but offer deeds," Obama told a meeting in Chicago in July 2008.[188]
[edit]LGBT issues
Obama voted against the Federal Marriage Amendment which would have defined marriage as between one man and one woman, but has said he personally believes that marriage is defined as a religious bond between a man and a woman. He supports civil unions that would carry equal legal standing to that of marriage for same-sex couples, but believes that decisions about the title of marriage should be left to the states.[189][190][191] He has called for the repeal of the federal Defense of Marriage Act.[192]
Obama stated on March 15, 2007, that "I do not agree...that homosexuality is immoral."[193] During the July 23, 2007 CNN/YouTube debate, Obama further stated that "... we've got to make sure that everybody is equal under the law. And the civil unions that I proposed would be equivalent in terms of making sure that all the rights that are conferred by the state are equal for same-sex couples as well as for heterosexual couples."[191] Obama supports expanding the protections afforded by hate crimes statutes to cover crimes committed against individuals because of sexual orientation or gender identity. He has also stated his opposition to the United States' military's "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy.[194]
Obama was criticized for inviting Reverend Donnie McClurkin, Mary Mary and Reverend Hezekiah Walker — who all have a history of making anti-gay remarks — to participate in a three-day gospel music campaign tour called "Embrace the Courage", as part of Obama's "40 Days of Faith and Family" campaign in South Carolina.[195] The Obama campaign responded to criticism in a press release, saying, "I strongly believe that African Americans and the LGBT community must stand together in the fight for equal rights. And so I strongly disagree with Reverend McClurkin's views and will continue to fight for these rights as president of the United States to ensure that America is a country that spreads tolerance instead of division."[195] For events held Sunday, October 28, 2007, Obama added Reverend Andy Sidden, an openly gay pastor.[196]
One of Obama's delegates, the Rev. James T. Meeks, who also served on Obama's exploratory committee for President, was named one of the "10 leading black religious voices in the anti-gay movement" in 2007 by the Southern Poverty Law Center.[197]
In a letter read to the Alice B. Toklas LGBT Democratic Club on June 29, 2008, Obama announced his opposition to Proposition 8, an initiative measure proposed for the 2008 California General Election ballot that, if passed, would amend the California Constitution to affirm that only marriage between a man and a woman is valid in California. In the letter, Obama stated that he supports extending "fully equal rights and benefits to same-sex couples under both state and federal law." [198]
[edit]Gun control
As a state legislator in Illinois, Obama supported banning the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic firearms, increasing state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms and requiring manufacturers to provide child-safety locks with firearms.[199] He supported a "ban" on the sale and possession of handguns on a political questionnaire.[200][201] In 1999, he urged for prohibiting the operation of any gun store within five miles of a school or park, which according to gun-rights advocates would eliminate gun stores from most of the inhabited portion of the United States.[202] He sponsored a bill in 2000 limiting handgun purchases to one per month.
As state senator, he voted against a 2004 measure that allowed self-defense as an affirmative defense to those charged with violating local laws making it otherwise unlawful for such persons to possess firearms.[203] He also voted against allowing persons who had obtained domestic violence protective orders to carry handguns for their protection.[202]
From 1994 through 2002, Obama was a board member of the Joyce Foundation, which provides funds for gun control organizations in the United States.[204][205]
While in the US Senate, Obama has supported several gun control measures, including restricting the purchase of firearms at gun shows and the reauthorization of the Federal Assault Weapons Ban.[206] Obama voted against legislation protecting firearm manufacturers from certain liability suits, which gun-rights advocates say are designed to bankrupt the firearms industry.[207] Obama did vote in favor of the 2006 Vitter Amendment to prohibit the confiscation of lawful firearms during an emergency or major disaster, which passed 84-16.[208]
During a February 15, 2008 press conference, Obama stated, "I think there is an individual right to bear arms, but it's subject to commonsense regulation."[209] Obama has also stated his opposition to allowing citizens to carry concealed firearms[210] and supports a national law outlawing the practice.[211][212]
Obama is rated F by the National Rifle Association.[citation needed] The NRA describes the recipient of its F grade as a "true enemy of gun owners’ rights."[213] He is also rated F by Gun Owners of America[214] who stated that Obama will "Get the Dems 'Barack' into the Business of Gun Control".[215]
Obama initially voiced support of Washington DC's handgun ban. Following the Supreme Court decision on the ban, he voiced support of the decision overturning the law, saying, "Today's decision reinforces that if we act responsibly, we can both protect the constitutional right to bear arms and keep our communities and our children safe." [216]
[edit]Death penalty
Obama has said that the death penalty is used too frequently and inconsistently. However, he favors it for cases in which "the community is justified in expressing the full measure of its outrage."[217] Speaking as a state senator about the Illinois legislature's constant additions to the list of factors that render a defendant eligible for the death penalty, Obama said, "We certainly don't think that we should [...] have this laundry list that does not make any distinctions between the run-of-the-mill armed robbery that results in death, and systematic killings by a terrorist organization. And I think essentially what the reduction of aggravating factors does, is it says, 'Here's a narrower set of crimes that we think potentially at least could deserve the death penalty.'"[218] In his own words, "While the evidence tells me that the death penalty does little to deter crime, I believe there are some crimes — mass murder, the rape and murder of a child — so heinous that the community is justified in expressing the full measure of its outrage by meting out the ultimate punishment. On the other hand, the way capital cases were tried in Illinois at the time was so rife with error, questionable police tactics, racial bias, and shoddy lawyering, that 13 death row inmates had been exonerated."[219]
On June 25 Obama condemned United States Supreme Court decision Kennedy v. Louisiana, which outlawed the death penalty for a child rapist when the victim was not killed. He said that states have the right to consider capital punishment, but cited concern about the possibility of unfairness in some sentences[220].
[edit]Civil liberties
Obama voted in favor of the 2006 version of the USA PATRIOT Act.[221] He voted against the Military Commissions Act of 2006[222] and later voted to restore habeas corpus to those detained by the U.S. (which had been stripped by the Military Commissions Act).[221] He has advocated closing the Guantanamo Bay detention camp, but has not supported two specific bills that would have done so.[223] Obama still opposes the use of torture[224] and used to oppose warrantless domestic wiretaps by the U.S.[225] He voted against the Flag Desecration Amendment in 2006, arguing that flag burning didn't justify a constitutional amendment, but said that he would support a law banning flag burning on federal property.[226] As of August 8th, 2008, the ACLU has given Obama a score of 80% on civil liberty issues for the 110th Congress U.S. Senate.[227]
[edit]USA PATRIOT Act
As noted above, Obama voted to reauthorize the USA PATRIOT Act, which extended the Act, but with some amendments. Such amendments would clarify the rights of an individual who has received FISA orders to challenge nondisclosure requirements and to refuse disclosure of the name of their attorney.
He voted against extending the USA PATRIOT Act’s Wiretap Provision on March 1, 2006. This bill would give the FBI the authority to conduct “roving wiretaps” and access to business records. Voting against this bill would prolong the debate, keeping the USA PATRIOT Act provisional whereas voting for this bill would extend the USA PATRIOT Act as permanent.[228]
[edit]Religion
Obama has encouraged Democrats to reach out to evangelicals and other church-going people, saying, "if we truly hope to speak to people where they’re at—to communicate our hopes and values in a way that’s relevant to their own—we cannot abandon the field of religious discourse."[229][230] He supports separation of church and state and contends that: "I also think is that we are under obligation in public life to translate our religious values into moral terms that all people can share, including those who are not believers. And that is how our democracy’s functioning, will continue to function. That’s what the founding fathers intended."[231] In July 2008, Obama said that if elected president he would expand the delivery of social services through churches and other religious organizations, vowing to achieve what he said President Bush had fallen short on.[232]
[edit]Embryonic stem cell research
Obama supports embryonic stem cell research and was a co-sponsor[233] of the 2005 Stem Cell Research Enhancement Act which was passed by both houses of Congress but vetoed by President Bush. Obama condemned Bush's veto, saying, "Democrats want this bill to pass. Conservative, pro-life Republicans want this bill to pass. By large margins, the American people want this bill to pass. It is only the White House standing in the way of progress - standing in the way of so many potential cures." He also voted in favor of the 2007 bill for embryonic stem cell research that was passed but was also vetoed by President Bush.[234]
[edit]Vaccination
At an April 21, 2008 campaign rally in Pennsylvania, Obama said "We've seen just a skyrocketing autism rate. Some people are suspicious that it's connected to the vaccines. This person included. The science right now is inconclusive, but we have to research it." Obama pointed to someone in the audience when he said "this person included", suggesting that Obama may have not been referring to himself when he said "some people are suspicious".[235]
[edit]Marijuana decriminalization and medical marijuana
"I think we need to rethink and decriminalize our marijuana laws," Mr. Obama told an audience during a debate at Northwestern University in 2004. "But I'm not somebody who believes in legalization of marijuana." His campaign says, "Senator Obama does not believe in legalization of marijuana, but agrees with President Bush that long minimum sentences for first-time drug users may not be the best way to occupy jail space or heal people from their disease."[236]
When asked if he would curtail DEA raids of medical marijuana growers he said "I would because I think our federal agents have better things to do, like catching criminals and preventing terrorism. The way I want to approach the issue of medical marijuana is to base it on science, and if there is sound science that supports the use of medical marijuana and if it is controlled and prescribed in a way that other medicine is prescribed, then it's something that I think we should consider." [237]
[edit]Parental responsibility
During a February 28, 2008 speech in Beaumont, Texas, Obama said, "It's not good enough for you to say to your child, 'Do good in school,' and then when that child comes home, you got the TV set on, you got the radio on, you don't check their homework, there is not a book in the house, you've got the video game playing... So turn off the TV set, put the video game away. Buy a little desk or put that child by the kitchen table. Watch them do their homework. If they don't know how to do it, give them help. If you don't know how to do it, call the teacher. Make them go to bed at a reasonable time. Keep them off the streets. Give 'em some breakfast... I also know that if folks letting our children drink eight sodas a day, which some parents do, or, you know, eat a bag of potato chips for lunch, or Popeyes for breakfast[...] You can't do that. Children have to have proper nutrition. That affects also how they study, how they learn in school."[238]

---------------------------------------

Obama/Biden 08
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 97
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 10:44:43 AM
What has Obama done in the Senate or as a community organizer that he should be the one to get your vote? Or are you just going down the party line?
Please explain ANYTHING Obama has done that has made this nation a better place?

Here is but a sample of bills Senator Obama has sponsored in the Senate:

* S.CON.RES.25 : A concurrent resolution condemning the recent violent actions of the Government of Zimbabwe against peaceful opposition party activists and members of civil society.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 3/29/2007) Cosponsors (7)
Committees: Senate Foreign Relations

* S.J.RES.23 : A joint resolution clarifying that the use of force against Iran is not authorized by the Authorization for the Use of Military Force Against Iraq, any resolution previously adopted, or any other provision of law.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 11/1/2007) Cosponsors (None)
Committees: Senate Foreign Relations

* S.114 : A bill to authorize resources for a grant program for local educational agencies to create innovation districts.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 1/4/2007) Cosponsors (None)
Committees: Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions

* S.115 : A bill to suspend royalty relief, to repeal certain provisions of the Energy Policy Act of 2005, and to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to repeal certain tax incentives for the oil and gas industry.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 1/4/2007) Cosponsors (None)
Committees: Senate Finance

* S.116 : A bill to authorize resources to provide students with opportunities for summer learning through summer learning grants.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 1/4/2007) Cosponsors (3)
Committees: Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions

* S.692 : A bill to amend title 38, United States Code, to establish a Hospital Quality Report Card Initiative to report on health care quality in Veterans Affairs hospitals.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 2/27/2007) Cosponsors (1)
Committees: Senate Veterans’ Affairs

* S.713 : A bill to ensure dignity in care for members of the Armed Forces recovering from injuries.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 2/28/2007) Cosponsors (34)
Committees: Senate Armed Services

* S.737 : A bill to amend the Help America Vote Act of 2002 in order to measure, compare, and improve the quality of voter access to polls and voter services in the administration of Federal elections in the States.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 3/1/2007) Cosponsors (1)
Committees: Senate Rules and Administration

* S.767 : A bill to increase fuel economy standards for automobiles and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 3/6/2007) Cosponsors (6)
Committees: Senate Commerce, Science, and Transportation

* S.1324 : A bill to amend the Clean Air Act to reduce greenhouse gas emissions from transportation fuel sold in the United States.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 5/7/2007) Cosponsors (2)
Committees: Senate Environment and Public Works

* S.1389 : A bill to authorize the National Science Foundation to establish a Climate Change Education Program.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 5/14/2007) Cosponsors (3)
Committees: Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions

* S.1430 : A bill to authorize State and local governments to direct divestiture from, and prevent investment in, companies with investments of $20,000,000 or more in Iran’s energy sector, and for other purposes.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 5/17/2007) Cosponsors (26)
Committees: Senate Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs

* S.1513 : A bill to amend the Higher Education Act of 1965 to authorize grant programs to enhance the access of low-income African-American students to higher education.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 5/24/2007) Cosponsors (None)
Committees: Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions

* S.AMDT.905 to S.761 To require the Director of Mathematics, Science, and Engineering Education to establish a program to recruit and provide mentors for women and underrepresented minorities who are interested in careers in mathematics, science, and engineering.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 4/23/2007) Cosponsors (None)

* S.AMDT.923 to S.761 To expand the pipeline of individuals entering the science, technology, engineering, and mathematics fields to support United States innovation and competitiveness.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 4/24/2007) Cosponsors (None)

* S.AMDT.924 to S.761 To establish summer term education programs.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 4/24/2007) Cosponsors (1)

* S.AMDT.2692 to H.R.2764 To require a comprehensive nuclear threat reduction and security plan.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 9/6/2007) Cosponsors (2)

* S.AMDT.3073 to H.R.1585 To provide for transparency and accountability in military and security contracting.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 9/26/2007) Cosponsors (4)

* S.AMDT.3078 to H.R.1585 Relating to administrative separations of members of the Armed Forces for personality disorder.
Sponsor: Sen Obama, Barack [IL] (introduced 9/27/2007) Cosponsors (7)

From a piece in the L.A. times:

CHICAGO - An unlikely visitor came calling one day in 1986 at the offices of the tony Chicago conservation group Friends of the Parks: a gangly, boyish community organizer from the rough-and-tumble far South Side named Barack Obama.

Dressed in a black leather bomber jacket, he made his pitch softly and earnestly to the group's community planner. Parents in the blighted, minority neighborhoods where he worked were desperate for safe, inviting play areas for their kids, but they lacked clout. Friends of the Parks had clout but sought ways to increase its efforts for minorities.

Together, Obama argued, the two groups could persuade Chicago's recalcitrant parks district to improve green areas on the far South Side, which had been devastated by steel-plant closings.

The meeting was scheduled to last 30 minutes but stretched to two hours, recalls Johnny Owens, the community planner. "He had an air of authority and a presence that made you want to listen," Owens said.

It was the first step in an informal partnership between Obama's constituents and Friends of the Parks that led to renovations and increased security in a handful of far South Side parks and playgrounds.

Ensuring that swings have seats and sandboxes are free of glass might not seem requisite skills for a man who could be president of the United States. But associates say Obama's approach to the unglamorous task illustrates his style as a community organizer - an experience he cites as "the best education I ever had," qualifying him to unite a racially and socially fractured nation and "create change from the bottom up."

"Barack realized that to get things done, you need to mobilize people in a collaborative way," said Gerald Kellman, the Chicago community organizer who hired Obama to work in the far South Side in 1985.

"He was a bridge-builder," recalled Friends of the Parks president Erma Tranter.

Personally, I think there's something to be said for someone who has the ability to unite people. We saw this ability in a big way during the DNC.

If this isn't enough information for you, maybe you need to do your own homework.
 darjeeling
Joined: 3/11/2005
Msg: 98
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 11:05:40 AM
dmotz
I for one, will actually concede your point that in terms of accomplishment within the Senate it would be hands down that McCain has accomplished more than Obama has, I also agree with Charlemagne that the US Senate is the perfect vehicle for John McCain's continuing service, and not to the levers of unitary power.

Believe it or not, I am coming late to being on the Obama bandwagon ... and my endorsement is based on my observation that over the long haul he has displayed a remarkable ability to counter adversity with a measured judgement and grace, and to do so without castigating his political rivals and opponents ... thereby toning down the political animosity and rancor.

I believe he seriously desires to get beyond the partisan politics and business as usual that has ruled in Washinton for so long and threatens to keep us in perpetual gridlock ... sort of like Lincoln's claim that he defeated his enemies by making them his friends.

At the dawn of a new millenium, with the world changing so quickly, with America in an actual decline, and with all the challenges that we face, we litterally, do not have the time to continue in such nonsense. To continue down our present path will result in either our permanent decline, or the decimation of the American middle class, and possibly both.

If Obama can tame the savage beast of US political distortions ... and I believe he can ... I think it shows he has the ability to do so within the international realm, and not to do so risks that otherwise we will be facing a real global calamity.

I for one would prefer that America and the world avoid such fate ... while others with entirely venal interests would like to provoke it. This is a time for wise, considered, and cautious leadership on the international front, combined with bold and decisive action on the domestic front.

John McCain has those priorities in the exact reverse.

caw
 geeleebee
Joined: 5/26/2008
Msg: 99
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 11:13:26 AM

What has Obama done that deserves your vote..again...answer that one. Do not get me started on Teddy...of all the great Democrats to serve you would have to pick the one who is best known for killing Mary Jo!
Biden has had a good carreer and is an honest man. Obama has done nothing...really...what has he done?
McCain has done plenty...just an example would be campaign finance reform...Look up his carreer and match it to Biden and especially Obama...you will see McCain is way out in front in the accomplishment department.


You didn't respond to my requests. YOU pick the Democrat, if you can't compare McCain with Kennedy. I don't have to look up his record--I asked you if you could back up your statement about McCain doing more than any other Senator.
By now, you have (hopefully) read through the lists posted in regard to Obama's accomplishments.
 Charlemagne08
Joined: 8/14/2008
Msg: 100
view profile
History
Heeeeeere's Johnny!
Posted: 9/6/2008 11:15:46 AM
For someone who claims to have limited experience battling in the political realm, I have to say that your arguments are {and have consistently been} really topnotch. I greatly admire your 'to the point' writing skills, and your intellectual ability to dispense with the all the peripheral clutter and get to the very heart of the matter within the various arguments. You are a formidable opponent and I am quite glad you are on our side in making this case.

Well Done ... and My Respect to you as well.

Wow, thank you. Quite frankly, I feel quite out of my league with some posters who are much more well read than me and who seem to possess a much more thorough understanding of some of the issues.

One of the reasons I started participating in the political forums was to learn, and I'm learning a lot. I may not know everything, but I know what I believe in.

Thank you for the kind words.
Show ALL Forums  > Politics  > Heeeeeere's Johnny!