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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 9:38:34 AM | Enlightenment????
when I finally get to see the true you and find out how beautiful you are | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 9:50:41 AM | For me it's been a process, I don't think it ever ends.
1. When you start out discontent or souls searching, seek out answers, learn about religions, culture, history, the universe - figure out everything, then things happen and then you figure out you know nothing. (This was my atheist vs faith crisis.)
2. Then you chuck everything you've learned, go back and get a few things, and go few this whole process a half a dozen times. 3. Gain a "grand scheme of the universe perspective" (for me this involved contact with non-bodied beings and the sixth sense) 4. Then somehow - you have not idea how you got here, you've become quite happy and content and you still have only learned is that you are not sure you truly know anything for certain (because in some contexts it all seems true) but now it just doesn't matter because you are exactly where you should be - always learning. You are so completely content that there is hardly a difference between mediation and exsisting, because exsisting feels just like meditation - just "being" in life is blissful and relaxing, and growing and learning is endless and constant.
This is what it has meant to me.  | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 12:21:07 PM | Everyone's description of enlightenment is soooo beautiful! That is precisely what I meant at the start, that it stretches beyond divisive lines.. no matter our religious/spiritual background, we can all talk about enlightenment and find a commonality, love that :)
I will add mine to the mix later, for now I am thoroughly enjoying all of yours.. thanks  | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 2:36:52 PM | I didn't read any others responses so I could answer with an authentic inner perspective. Then I can go back and see if I'm totally off my rocker!!!
What do you think enlightenment is?
I think it is an eternal quest for deeper understanding.
What distinguishes an enlightened person from a non-enlightened person?
I think an enlightened person is no longer easily triggered by emotions and the actions of other people but acts authentically from deep within his/herself, based on internal beliefs by which the person lives their lives. I think an enlightened person remains opens to other's ideas and distinguishes ideas and opinions from the person. An enlightened person is also able to appreciate everyone for their differences.
Is it an end in and of itself, or a process/journey?
I think it is always an ongoing journey where one remains receptive and open minded.
What is the purpose of enlightenment.. ?
I think it is to grow closer to source -- God, and in that way, closer to one another.
On Edit: So after reading the other phenomenal responses I would just add. I think enlightenment always comes and can only come with the death of the ego. The two cannot exist together.
In my mind, the process of enlightenment always necessitates extreme self-awareness and honesty about our true feelings and thoughts at any given moment and time without any inner- judgment or negative self-talk whatsoever.
I believe it requires putting down the veil of what we might like to think we are and what we might want to be considered as, and seeing in truth who we are and then realizing at any given moment we have the power to change that -- to renew our mind, our spirits and our hearts. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 4:13:15 PM | Hey Sassy, hope you're doing well. This seems like the perfect thread to start back on.
What do you think enlightenment is?
I believe enlightenment is just awakening to a fuller sense of awareness. We are "self" aware already which means we distinguish between ourselves and the environment but those who are enlightened know that in the absolute sense, we are the environment. Unless you have a nihilistic viewpoint (I actually find nihilism illogical), the sense of compassion is heightened and you become more conscious of your actions because to hurt others or the environment is to literally hurt yourself.
What distinguishes an enlightened person from a non-enlightened person?
A sense of well being and contentness even in times of seeming hopelessness. They don't fret about the future to the point of distraction and they don't worry about phantoms from the past. They are in the Now... Focused and ready to help. There's times for reflection when there is nothing to do.
Is it an end in and of itself, or a process/journey?
I think it's a journey. We're all in this thing together so if one is awake, they should help others do the same when they're ready.
"Before enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment, chop wood, carry water".
-- Old Zen saying.
What is the purpose of enlightenment.. ?
To end the suffering mankind inflicts on each other and the other beings around us. We have enough to worry about with physical ailments.
It fosters compassion and is the logical way to teach us to stop hurting Ourself. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 4:26:49 PM | ^^^hey, where you been? lol, welcome back!
the sense of compassion is heightened and you become more conscious of your actions because to hurt others or the environment is to literally hurt yourself.
what he said. lol, as usual.
Cheers, Raven | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 5:35:20 PM | While empathy in itself is not enlightenment, it is (in my perception) a higher enlightment than is first percieved by most who have found the path.
I like that - it went straight in - thank you! | |
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Posted: 9/6/2008 5:40:58 PM | So after reading the other phenomenal responses I would just add. I think enlightenment always comes and can only come with the death of the ego.
An acronym for ego: Edging God Out - something to think about.
My ego never dies - it only sleeps - on days I'm doing good:-). Not-so-good days? I'm full of self - they manage to show up too. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/6/2008 7:11:34 PM | I think enlightenment is when one truly realizes they are a part of creator/god/goddess and can manifest in the same manner.
I believe that we are sparks of the creator and also have the ability to create anything we want. When we are enlightened we understand this perfectly and do not use it for harm because we are filled with the love of the creator. The mind to me is so powerful that it can create anything, possibly even immortality. However, the ego doesn't want this and will try everything possible to make this impossible, to have us not believe, including creating illness and old age.
I know people who can change how they appear just through their thinking (ie: look older than they are, then appear younger than they are).
I have experienced the power of the mind when I feel a cold coming on and I say "It's impossible for me to get sick" and believe it the first feelings of a cold go away...but if I say "oh, no, I'm getting sick" the sickness manifests.
This planet to me is a good place to practice overcoming ego and realizing our true potential and using our powers.
And I believe like you said in your post that the path is unique to each person. There is no one way. There may be many guidelines to help attain this state of being...but it an individual process.
I think it is a gradual process which occurs over many lifetimes.
The purpose, may be for the creator to experience herself. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 1:23:57 AM | | Awesome replies from everyone for sure...been reading them all over | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 6:46:34 AM | Hi Sassy:)
For me, being enlightened is simply being aware. Or awake. With your eyes wide open and turned towards the light. That's it. The details of what and how and where and who are not important to me (and in my opinion).
And it doesn't matter how one gets there neither as obviously some of us have managed to get there all on our own, with very little help or guidance. Or at least we think (or assume) we're there. Haha.
But the point I'm trying to make is that I am probably one of the least educated and most "not well read" person here on these boards. Yet...and that's a big yet...I understand (and have always understood) everything or most everything you guys talk about because I "felt" it all in my heart a long time ago.
You guys are simply providing me with words to put behind my messed up thoughts and you often give me clarity or validation (or not) for what was already inside of me in the first place.
Does this make any sense? Hellooooo??? Anyone?? Is there anybody out (or in) there?? 
By the way...I love you ALL you dear people who post on the religion forums. Seriously I do. Even the ones I sometimes disagree with. You've all given me much more than you'll ever know...each and every one of you:) 
JMO
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 9:16:55 AM | I never made myself define my belief of what it is before, so first attempt. I think an enlightened person or being is one who operates at most times at the highest levels of consciousness possible. A completely conscious person....does not mean they never are in the lower states, as we are all of it, but they are completely conscious of every moment, completely aware of where they are and can change levels of consciousness at will.
also their 'witness' is crystallized and clear and always in a state of non-attachment or 'no effect'......being objective rather than subjective
one who is both the mirror and the reflection....
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 11:41:38 AM | You know, it's so true what everyone is saying:
Being present in the moment, without attachment , that is the true state of enlightenment!
Blessings everyone ! It's Sunday, and where I am the sun is shining beautifully, the birds are singing and the sky is a beautiful blue!!!! | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 12:45:13 PM | Ameerra:
What is the purpose of enlightenment.. ?
I think it is to grow closer to source -- God, and in that way, closer to one another. I love that answer.. but I am biased, it just so happens to mirror my own :)
Raven:
Funny when you surrender to experience, life seems to make sense, even if I'm not making much at the moment. You always make sense to me
I have found that just before I learn to let a little more light shine, NOTHING makes sense... at those times I feel totally alone, confused and out of what I call "the flow".. often things have to get pretty bad before I am able to "let go and let God".. but once I do.. everything falls into place... everything shines again.. Thank God- quite literally :)
Stone:
"Before enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment, chop wood, carry water". I was actually going to add that somewhere, but you read my mind. So nice to see you back!
Indigodream:
I think enlightenment is when one truly realizes they are a part of creator/god/goddess and can manifest in the same manner. Excellent point!
Keysguy:
Succinctly, you have once again posted that no one religion or spiritual path can claim exclusive rights towards enlightenment.
I tried to explain this to you once before, sharing that I spent three years in a Zen Buddhist monastery[[[ or the closest thing that you could come to in regards to a Zen Buddhist monastery here in the United States ]]], and that there are many ways to reach enlightenment I would agree with you, but as [[[ yellow 44 ]]]pointed out some ways are better than others, thus confirming what I was TRYING, to explain to you in the previous post. Some ways toward enlightenment are better?? If that is in fact the case (which of course cannot be verified with any kind of accuracy) the only reason for it is because we are all unique manifestations of the divine and as such, have differing preferences on our path toward enlightenment.. in that sense, there IS no better.. only what works for YOU ;)
Beautifulsoul:
I love you ALL you dear people who post on the religion forums. Seriously I do. Even the ones I sometimes disagree with. You've all given me much more than you'll ever know...each and every one of you:) I echo this sentiment!! And you are by far the most enlightened atheist I know 
WeAre1:
one who is both the mirror and the reflection.... Beautiful :)
And now I will go back to page one..
Gottalight:
I think I just found the universal symbol of enlightenment.The universal symbol is this:
? I like that. How else can we get "there" if we think we already know? Or are already there? It requires a certain openness..
Rainsands:
In my opinion, one of the definitions of enlightenment is the ability to forever eschew self governance by ego, whether by thought, word or deed. No matter whose definition, I don't think this one can be disputed by anyone :)
Constantine:
When I look at your profile and see you mention such words as synchronicity I wonder if you have ever read any Carl Jung. He is one of my heros, his work has greatly influenced me
Sky.. you quoted a lot about pluralism.. like an ability to see all as equal and worthy.. this is a symptom of enlightenment to you?
Scorpio:
I have the intuition that it is a more enlightened and open-minded view of life, that encompasses more of everything in a rich holistic tapestry, that remembers both the overview and the detail. I love that, especially how you used your intuition in describing it :)
Ih8tefrogstoo:
My personal definition of enlightment is this: One who embraces unconditional love above all else. I totally agree.. in a sense, what more can be said?
Dreamspell:
We don't have to know every single mysterious answer. Oh how I agree!! But damn is the urge to know the answers is strong, hence my massive and ever growing library, lol...
Dunrich:
First time I thought about a word, and realized it was an oxymoron, yes a single word, how can that be? I know what you mean.. but then, I truly believe that truth is paradoxical..
Yellow:
Ever unfolding, wordless luminosity.. There are layers and layers of depth within these words for me... almost seems to sum up my views on enlightenment..
SweetnessOne:
I think it's part and parcel of the same thing, because I don't really think that the process/journey towards enlightenment can really be separated from the end result. I agree... to me they are not mutually exclusive... but I also believe that by focusing on only the goal.. this stunts progress on the journey.. if that makes any sense..
Silivros:
An individual journey to know self.
I feel that we have but one mandate in coming into each incarnation, which would be to make known the unknown. Enlightenment is manifested in someone who has gained wisdom of self through the reflection of lifes experiences. There are no coincedences, every person and experience is in you life is for the expressed experience. The observer reflects and owns the experience.
An enlightened person sees their lifes experiences as a reflection of the aspects of self.
An unenlightened person is like the walking dead, never seeing theirselves in any experience in their lives. Often the victim or tyrant. No self reflection.
The purpose of enlightenment? To come home ; - >
Thanks for posting Sassy Your entire post really spoke to me, thanks :)
Vancer:
From that point on, every person who enters that room can easily see the drawing of a woman's face. Now that it has been discovered, it becomes obvious to everyone. There can no longer be any doubt. So do you mean that personal enlightenment is when everyone is enlightened? Or that one person's enlightenment acts as a starting point for others? Interesting thoughts..
Zoretta:
“What is the purpose of enlightenment.. ?” Is someone seeking enlightenment, or just being enlightened? I think they are both seeking and becoming.. that which by nature they already are...
Does there have to be a purpose? Never really thought about it before Good question... who determines it?
This is an enlightening topic! Exactly what I was going for :)
Swordedsaint:
A deep quiet in your mind that reaches to your soul, when nothing seperates you from this eternal moment.
And if you ever met someone who is in or even close to this state, you can see it in everything they do. Rich and beautiful.. I agree :)
Average Anomaly:
just "being" in life is blissful and relaxing, and growing and learning is endless and constant. Awww!! Nice description.. I love being in that place :)
I started this thread so that people from ALL walks and backgrounds can come and share their opinion on something we can ALL relate to in one way or another.. notice how, regardless of the background many of the responses are very similar? Love that... thanks everyone for sharing.. and keep 'em coming! | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 2:52:15 PM | I have thought alot on who is "enlightened". What it means to be 'enlightened'.
Is it measered by who views YOU as enlighted or how you view youself? What would be more valuable? Should it be valuable or desirerable? Does it have any worth if it is a self assesment. Should it be less if its an opionion of others? Is the term a pleasing thought of the ego? I'm I more enlightened today if I feel better about myself then last yr? Doest it mean that I am enlightened because I am always questioning and open or should I be solid and quiet? What do I descibe myself as? What aura or energy do I put forth? Can I be enlightened here in this existance or is that the finnal judgment of which some speak? If I put aside/strip myself of personallity and emotion...What am I? If I meditate on this for hours am I crazy or comtemplative?
WHAT is my soul- how do I know others?
PPl are concerned with discriptions of their life (work titles and activities) and introduce themselves as such. And say they 'know' each other when thier personalities become predictable thus fostering a feeling of security.
Am I enlightened because I am predictable to myself. I am self secure.
What if I want to suprise myself?
Is a soul been enlightened when they suprise me or are they just unpredictable-unreliable?
Do we,as humans, just bounce around trying to have pleasant emotions?
What I know right know is that I am. And I'm trying my best to give others some as I pass.
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/7/2008 4:39:07 PM | Is enlightenment subjective? How does one know when they have "arrived"? What is the measuring stick? If one is able to live a life devoid of regret, anger, jealousy or resentment, is that enlightenment? If you meet two masters on the road to Nirvana, which is more "enlightened"? Does it matter?
Living in the present moment gives one a sense of joy. Stilling the mind can provide bliss. Embracing all manner of experiences can relieve suffering. Being kind, patient and forgiving can give one loving relationships. Working in a way where you feel you contribute, can provide one with a sense of purpose. They can all make one a more complete person and encourage one to delve into their spirituality. Is enlightenment a destination, or is it an ideal state we strive for that loses its' lustre when we believe we have arrived? Is that the challenge of enlightenment?
I know I don't know. But I also know, that striving makes my life better. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/8/2008 7:51:06 AM |
What do you think enlightenment is? A defensive coping mechanism in the face of the awareness of our mortality. An imagination's answers to an imagination's questions.
What distinguishes an enlightened person from a non-enlightened person? I identify enlightenment in someone else by their ability or willingness to accept that it takes a lot of blades of grass to make the hillside green,
but that not every blade is necessarily the same colour.
Is it an end in and of itself, or a process/journey? It is a beginning, a middle and an end...as individual as a single blade of grass.
What is the purpose of enlightenment.. ? Peace of mind and harmony of the herd. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/8/2008 5:00:56 PM |
Is enlightenment subjective?
It could be said that it is a point, place (???) where subject and object dissolve into each other. You'll know it when it happens.
I forgot to mention this in my previous post, but Keysguy said it. Language will always fail to describe it. In fact even attempting to describe it misses the point.
If one is able to live a life devoid of regret, anger, jealousy or resentment, is that enlightenment?
No. Enlightenment doesn't mean that you are automatically physically fit, socially adjusted or emotionally mature. In fact after this happens you need to address the shadow aspects of yourself that get in the way of being able to stabilize this realization. Introspection, some form of psychotherapy are really needed to outgrow and leave behind all that baggage. All that doesn't just magically go away.
Much more to say, It'll have to wait. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/8/2008 7:12:40 PM | | You are enlightened when, while seeking an understanding, the light bulb comes on. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/9/2008 4:01:55 AM | Everyone has moments and experiences of enlightenment. However, IMO in the classical sense, it's a permanent state, the initial awakening being the first stage, and then a gradual unfolding into a more and more permanent and expanded awareness of self and others.
The initial awakening is the realization that there is an eternal part of yourself that has never been born, never died, and where you place your locus of identification of self, (or not-self). That Self is the witness, the permanent state being the rememberance of the witness in the Divine reality. Which means you do not lose your awareness of the connectedness of life. It becomes a more and more permanent awareness as one continues that journey to the Eternal Silence of Light Upon Emptiness.
The Dali Lama said that even he, after each incarnation, had to do the exercises and practices to gain enlightenment once more in this current lifetime. He also said it got easier to do that, once you'd gotten there previously. YMMV. | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/9/2008 5:26:50 AM |
the permanent state being the rememberance of the witness in the Divine reality. Which means you do not lose your awareness of the connectedness of life.
Within my own path, All is Connected is the foremost doctrine. The realisation that all things and thoughts, both seen and unseen, are divine in nature, makes one pause and reflect on one's actions and thought. Do this for years and years, and a subtle but momentous change occurs. Compassion and *Love* become an integral part of one's nature, however odious the person/place/event may seem. (lol, still workin' on that part, but ego is soaddictive! Chalking it up to creative indulgence, yeah, that's it...)
permanent awareness as one continues that journey to the Eternal Silence of Light Upon Emptiness.
Haven't spent but moments there, but it's a place where I'd like to be, and thinking possibly, I already am in my larger reality? Perhaps, one only needs to remember? Can it be as simple as that? I can almost breathe it sometimes....
I've come to realise that its like the Nexus on Star Trek. Spend any amount of time there, and I wouldn't want to come back. Oh, I get so confused sometimes...back to the grind.
often things have to get pretty bad before I am able to "let go and let God".. but once I do.. everything falls into place... everything shines again.. Thank God- quite literally :)
I'm just wondering, do things literally "shine" for you? I seem to be noticing a "glowing" phenomenom lately in which light seems to be more intense. Strange at first, but definitely pleasant when it occurs. And I am unbelievably grateful for this; I throw my arms out and say THANKS!!!, and if I'm not alone, get some real strange looks I've also come to believe that saying thanks is a cue to *Love* that I'm ready for more, and it's given.
Cheers, Raven | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/9/2008 9:37:38 AM | Cool questions *sassie*
Is it measered by who views YOU as enlighted or how you view youself? What would be more valuable? I guess this would depend on the person...I personally would measure it by feel.. to me it is more of an experience.. a knowing, not necessarily something external.. although I think that does come into play too.. not to further obscure things, lol...
I have been around others whose presence made ME feel lighter.. they emanated *love* and kindness.. a total lack of judgment.. to me this is the mark of an enlightened one.
Is the term a pleasing thought of the ego? I suppose the title is... but imo enlightenment has nothing to do with the ego, so if the ego is tickled, well.. how enlightened are you.. ?
What if I want to suprise myself? I doubt any one of us can truly avoid that, lol..
So nice to see you in here, make sure you come back, kay?
Raven:
Perhaps, one only needs to remember? Can it be as simple as that? I can almost breathe it sometimes.... Awesome! It is more of a remembering, isn't it? But as you said.. the illusory nature of the ego is sooo addictive.. like craving that virtual steak in the matrix..
I'm just wondering, do things literally "shine" for you? I seem to be noticing a "glowing" phenomenom lately in which light seems to be more intense. Strange at first, but definitely pleasant when it occurs Yes, I know what you mean.. not only do things look shiny, but they also feel shiny.. I have a funny feeling you know what I mean though ;)
I throw my arms out and say THANKS!!!, and if I'm not alone, get some real strange looks That is adorable, I totally just pictured it, lol...
I have been "caught" in such a fashion as well.. but I think people are getting used to how weird I am, lol...
I've also come to believe that saying thanks is a cue to *Love* that I'm ready for more, and it's given. Beautiful how it multiplies, thanks for sharing your shine
My views on enlightenment have evolved over the years.. I think that within each one of us are spots that resist the light and *love* of God (or we wouldn't be here)... the parts that perpetuate the illusion that we are separate from each other/God... but as we evolve spiritually, we learn to transcend these "dark spots" to let in a little more *love*.. and then shine it back to others... a reciprocity to be shared, high-lighting the truth that we are all connected... of the same source.. to me this is what it means to be en-light-ened :) | |
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/9/2008 9:55:36 AM |
I started this thread so that people from ALL walks and backgrounds can come and share their opinion on something we can ALL relate to in one way or another.. notice how, regardless of the background many of the responses are very similar? Love that... thanks everyone for sharing.. and keep 'em coming!
Exactly!.... there is no right or wrong path.... if I were to travel from my home in London, Ontario to Vancouver, BC, which is on the other side of the country, there are many ways I could travel. I could take a plane, a bus, a train, drive in my car, catch a ride with a trucker friend, a motorcycle, a bicycle.... or any combination of the above.... plus a few other options. Which way would be the right way? No one way is right or wrong.... there may be faster ways.... but that does not make them right or wrong. If I drove with a friend, I could enjoy the scenery and have a travel partner, which would teach me a lot about my friend and also a lot about this beautiful country.... so, it would be a richer experience than flying.... if I let it be richer.... it is all in our perception.
I keep reading posts how a poster claims their way is the best way.... and I keep wondering how "enlightened" they really think they are. When you judge another's path as being lesser than yours, does that make you the more enlightened one.... or are they? I know my path is entirely different than anyone else's, because my experiences along the way have made it different.... and I have learned my lessons along the way in a different manner than anyone else.... maybe similar, but definitely different. BUT... I also no longer attempt to compare my path to Vancouver , BC to someone else's path to London, England.... or wherever their path may lead them.
To me, enlightenment entails, in part, unconditional love and acceptance of all things.... and as Mother Teresa once said, "where there is judgement, there is not love."
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| Enlightenment...
Posted: 9/9/2008 3:06:17 PM | Mystral13, I think the only way a path could be wrong, is if where you just were, can't possibly account for where you now are.
Then existence makes a loud buzzer sound and a huge red sign flashes 'wrong!', then a voice whispers... 'You don't belong here. And you are going to be given exactly 0 seconds to return to where you just were, and it'll keep happening until you go the right way.' | |
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