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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/23/2009 4:10:39 PM |
If a man or woman have to "pursue" someone to get a commitment, you're chasing the wrong person.
Exactly. Whether you are male or female, if you are a grown up human being and not just a child, you will have learned to (1) have a desire, (2) express your desire, (3) accept that you may or may not get your desire satisfied and the Earth will still rotate every 24 hours anyway.
That's reality.
No "pursuit" involved, just honesty. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/23/2009 7:36:12 PM | You know, I gotta agree with posters like GoneSailinBabe... I hear lots of guys say, "I'm not like that!" But you know what? (and this is in NO way a dig) yes you are. From my own experiences and those of my friends (and some girls I didn't even know!), this scenario is extremely prevalent. And no, I do not read Cosmopolitan or any other women's magazines (it's true! If I read a magazine at all, I read McLeans or Time). It's sort of like saying "no woman has ever faked it with me!" You'll have to just keep telling yourselves that you're right, guys.
Personally, I really do think it's an unconscious thing, so I'm sure no one is saying that men are bad! bad! bad boys for doing it. It's just the way it seems to go. So, sorry guys, but you've been sussed!
And I hope no one thinks I'm being bitter or anything, I'm really not. It's just one of those obstacles you have to get round in the dating world. Ever notice that the people you want don't want you, and the people you DON'T want seem to be totally enamoured?
Of course, this doesn't mean you can't find yourself in a great relationship. Sometimes it's those little games that keep things fun in an LTR. As long as there's a little reciprocity....
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/23/2009 7:55:04 PM |
Exactly. Whether you are male or female, if you are a grown up human being and not just a child, you will have learned to (1) have a desire, (2) express your desire, (3) accept that you may or may not get your desire satisfied and the Earth will still rotate every 24 hours anyway.
That's reality.
No "pursuit" involved, just honesty.
I've read everyone of your posts...and I just don't get it. I have no idea what expressing a desire or whether it is satisfied or not, or being honest has to do with anything in pursuing...I happen to do all four, and yet, I still think there is nothing wrong with a man acting like he likes me...just think we think so vastly different I will never get it...or, you don't get what I'm trying to say either... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 8:13:02 AM | When I was young and naive I assumed you had too "pursue." Then I grew up. The funny thing is that it was then that my social life really took off. I discovered that I really like myself and do not need to apologize for that. Then I found that people were more and more attracted to me. Perhaps nobody can like you better than you like yourself. Maybe it is a good idea to work on becoming your own best friend. Then all the good stuff follows. Who taught you that you're not supposed to like yourself, anyway? Do you have to believe them?
As a free independent individual who has a self and likes it, you start running into other people who are also free and independent and like themselves. Then when you give something to each other it is not just filling a need but acting on desire. What you give each other is then a real gift.
Then when you give affection to another person who does not need it or expect it but enjoys your gift, they are accepting you and what you have to offer not because either party is expecting to get something out of the other but simply to exchange gifts. The woman knows that the man is not just trying to get into her pants. The man knows that the woman is not just looking for a meal ticket. These are two people each already complete and happy with or without the other.
That is the foundation for a really rich and rewarding relationship and I think that kind of relationship is what Ayn Rand describes in her novel "Atlas Shrugged." It starts out with self-esteem, not need, and builds on desire.
Desire rocks but need sucks. Barbra Streisand is way off base when she sings that people who need people are lucky. More often needy people are miserable.
Why do we hear so much about need and pursuit and so little about desire? William Blake gets it right: "Bring me my bow of burning gold ... bring me my chariot of fire ... bring me my arrows of desire." | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 8:21:11 AM | Maybe that is why I feel unappreciated and the women who crack the whip seem to have a man following her around with his tail between his legs.
I am caring and I tend to do to much. I try to help people, but they don't appreciate it. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 9:01:12 AM |
Maybe that is why I feel unappreciated and the women who crack the whip seem to have a man following her around with his tail between his legs.
The question is, then, if you would be happy with the type of man, who responds well to having a woman "crack the whip", or who walks around with his tail between his legs?
IME, when a woman tries to "crack the whip", I laugh a lot, and then I leave. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 9:07:35 AM | Pursuit=desire=courting=romance...and if it's mutual....then you both better keep it up for a lifetime...cause when it stops...the other will go find it elsewhere...
jmo,
Irish | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 9:13:22 AM | | To the OP: I don't feel men should be responsible for pursuing. Females need to take responsibility for initiating relationships if they are interested in men. I have no desire to be with an female who is so childish that she cannot do what is in her own best interest. I don't think men should be required to shoulder the responsibility in the early stages of a relationship; this should be a two-way street. Nor do I know of any man who would feel emasculated or lose interest if a female takes charge; of course, if that is the only kind of man you are connecting with, you might want to reevaluate what you are looking for in a man. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 10:08:37 AM | lookingingpms...
It is the conumdrum of all conumdrums....
Here is something that another poster said:
it is the hypocrisy that makes these kinds of threads and the others so bemusing,yet so confusing to women.
Men want a woman that will put out, and stop acting like her puzzy is gold, yet in the next breath or post, they will say they will NEVER have a ltr with someone that slept with them on a first date.
A woman bemoans she has felt used, because he hit it after they waited, and men and women will beat her calling her a ho, and that she should have kept her legs closed...
So here we have men berating exotic dancers, calling them low lives, yet they will get their kicks out of porn, strip clubs, or what ever, and call that just fine. Who the heck do they think they are beating off to???
Most men will gladly tell women to pursue/chase them...and the new ones on the block will do it. Then they get it after awhile. It just doesn't work. Both sexes don't know why...but it just fizzles out after awhile. On one hand...I think it has to do with over-loving, over-pleasing women who just want to love you to death. You have no room to breathe. On the other hand...men who don't put much effort into launching a romance...and just get the sex right away...are not mentally into it. They feel trapped after a bit...and then become MIA.
Read the threads about chasing a man.
There is just something about the rules of Evolution that make the mating dance between humans as intriguing and mysterious as possible. It just is.
As Irish put it...
Pursuit=desire=courting=romance...and if it's mutual....then you both better keep it up for a lifetime...cause when it stops...the other will go find it elsewhere...
So..if she means anything to you...pursue her....and if she is receptive...she will allow the pursuit...and it becomes delightful...as she pursues you in her special way ...... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 10:25:46 AM | Ahhhh...the dance of love and romance....just as music has evolved over time so has the dance of love....as the sexual revolution has come about...the steps may change, but the dance remains the same....
As you both feel the initial desire...the dance begins...each, hopefully, knowing the proper steps, so as, to not step on each others toes....as you pursue each other around the dance floor of love....courting begins.....and the romance of holding each other in your arms...sigh...takes place.....the music will end for a moment...but, then another song begins...and you and your partner will begin the ritual once more....and again...and again....and again....sigh...and again...
jmo,
Irish | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 12:44:37 PM | Irish...(swooning....fanning myself furiously....blushing..)
Be still my beating heart...
As the music starts with a waltz...snaps into a samba ...flows into a tango...
You lead...I willingly follow....
Ahhh...yes! We were talking about pursuit...
Maybe the genders should go dancing a bit more to understand the dips, curls, turns and moves that seduce the two dancers into a fluid connection....that can last forever...
Sigh... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/25/2009 7:24:33 PM |
Why do we hear so much about need and pursuit and so little about desire?
Not going to get into the need/want thing here...lol...However, I don't need it...I like/want it..I like myself fine...I just don't have any clue most of the time if the feeling is reciprocated without action that shows it? I'm not a mind reader...
In my mind , (which I like very much and am quite confident works as well, or better than most) this isn't about expecting anything...except real interest and action. And in my mind, also , this is about desire..he desires me enough to actually do something about it, and show it... I've wasted too much time on men who couldn't decide, couldn't act, needed reminding, etc...not very attractive either..not anymore...
I really can not agree, and maybe I am even a little annoyed , about the statement that it is needy to want strong , decisive men whose actions convey their interest..who think I am not just one of the many.
To each his own... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 2:11:37 AM |
When I was young and naive I assumed you had too "pursue." Then I grew up. The funny thing is that it was then that my social life really took off. I discovered that I really like myself and do not need to apologize for that. Then I found that people were more and more attracted to me. Perhaps nobody can like you better than you like yourself. Maybe it is a good idea to work on becoming your own best friend. Then all the good stuff follows. Who taught you that you're not supposed to like yourself, anyway? Do you have to believe them?
As a free independent individual who has a self and likes it, you start running into other people who are also free and independent and like themselves. Then when you give something to each other it is not just filling a need but acting on desire. What you give each other is then a real gift.
Then when you give affection to another person who does not need it or expect it but enjoys your gift, they are accepting you and what you have to offer not because either party is expecting to get something out of the other but simply to exchange gifts. The woman knows that the man is not just trying to get into her pants. The man knows that the woman is not just looking for a meal ticket. These are two people each already complete and happy with or without the other.
That is the foundation for a really rich and rewarding relationship and I think that kind of relationship is what Ayn Rand describes in her novel "Atlas Shrugged." It starts out with self-esteem, not need, and builds on desire.
Desire rocks but need sucks. Barbra Streisand is way off base when she sings that people who need people are lucky. More often needy people are miserable.
Why do we hear so much about need and pursuit and so little about desire? William Blake gets it right: "Bring me my bow of burning gold ... bring me my chariot of fire ... bring me my arrows of desire."
Love it! and very well put.  | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 7:31:04 AM |
....and if she is receptive...she will allow the pursuit...
If "she" is merely "receptive" I don't want her. I want women in my life who are real persons, not just receptacles.
If she "allows" my "pursuit," then forget it, I don't want to be "allowed." I am not asking permission to "pursue."
I want a person who desires me, not just one who tolerates other people's desire. It's when two persons both want each other that good things happen.
The relationship is founded on equality and the mutual respect of equals, not a "pursuer" who chases his next "conquest" like a big game hunter in Africa pursuing the next big game trophy to decorate his wall convincing himself that he must be "a real man" as he racks up more and more of them. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 7:43:19 AM | I say patato they say potato...I say tomato they say tamato....some people will argue symantics till the cows come home....sounding like the Bill Clinton debate over "is"...
Seems that some will only "allow" one rigid interpretation of pursuit and desire....geeze...I wish I knew when I was being desired...it get rid of a whole lot of that courting crap...she'd desire me...right off the bat...she'd communicate that to me....we could skip e-dating, dinner, a movie, dancing and git right to it.
No, I still prefer the dance....finding that mutual desire...timidly feeling each other out...learning the dance steps of the other, courting along the way, pursuing each other around the dance floor of life, embracing each other in romance...
But then, I'm a hopeless romantic...
jmo,
Irish | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 9:41:08 AM | | I prefer if woman don't make any movement at all. My eyesight is based on movement sooo it spoils the fun of the chase. But in answer to your post, men feel the need to pursue until a few weeks after the restraining order is issued. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 2:45:40 PM |
(zangie) ....and if she is receptive...she will allow the pursuit...
(fra59e) If "she" is merely "receptive" I don't want her. I want women in my life who are real persons, not just receptacles.
Trying to "get" a person through semantics is very low-brow. She didn't say "receptive", as in not having a backbone: she quite clearly meant receptive, as in "the woman LIKES the idea." There's nothing "wrong" about being "receptive" to this or that idea, if it appeals to you. I'm "receptive" to the idea of two university girls, a wrestling ring filled with Jello...  ... but, that hardly makes me a "receptacle". I'm a real human bean!
Arlo | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 4:50:48 PM |
Women, it is in your best interest to be the total woman you can be....men are more attracted to women who are women....not men pleasers....
Unless a woman knows how to please a man then she's not a total woman, duh...
GoneSailinBabe is totally correct.
If the woman takes the initiative, they think she is a desperate psycho.
Maybe they won't say so or show it, but in the back of their minds, at some point,
maybe not the first time it happens, they will get put off by it.
If a woman initiates a conversation with me, I should assume that she's a desperate psycho? I had no idea the city I live had that many psycho's. There should be a warning in the papers and on the news of this apparent pandemic...
What she doesn't understand is that men will SAY ANYTHING if it gets them the woman....
Another apparent pandemic...
You know, I gotta agree with posters like GoneSailinBabe... I hear lots of guys say, "I'm not like that!" But you know what? (and this is in NO way a dig) yes you are.
Guilty till proven innocent. Nice to see a positive attitude. What do you do for an encore?
And I hope no one thinks I'm being bitter or anything, I'm really not.
Nice encore....
So...if you like to be pursued and courted...say it loud and clear!
Cricket...cricket....
The "dance" analogy is one I've also used.
It's ironic that the proponents of courting and pursuing will use the metaphor of "the dance". Courting and pursuing in context here, would be analogous to a man being proactive, while the woman remains reactive.
While dancing, is two people in sync. Both are equally proactive and reactive. It is apparent to everyone, including the dancers when they are not in sync.
....and if she is receptive...she will allow the pursuit...
That's a nice euphemism for being a tease, and playing cat and mouse games. Most men picked up on that in high school, but called it by a different name.
Dating is a simply a sampling process with an objective that doesn't need to be obscured by playing games.
Any woman wanting to be pursued(sic) is really just trying to feed a shallow self worth by having someone fawn over them in order to make themselves feel one of a kind special. If you truly are one of a kind, soliciting external validation wouldn't be required. Not much different than someone constantly "fishing" for compliments. Fishing for compliments is childish and annoying as hell. If you want to know why the interest in you no longer exists, it ain't 'cause you gave him sex too soon. You've probably alienated him with your constant need to be propped up by his "pursuit".
A man who desires you as a woman has already gone through quite an initial process of elimination selection process by the time he has decided to be proactive and initiate dialogue with you. If you are receptive, it's because he passed your initial process of elimination. While getting to know each other, you are each going through another stage of processing. And you're both doing it, equally....It's simply data gathering by experimenting. Sorry if breaking it down this way is not "romantic" enough, but the metaphors and euphemisms used here make things too ambiguous. | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 4:57:24 PM | | Ohboy...another tomato vs tamato...potato vs patato poster...symantics debaters...yikes they'll argue about the color of blue sky... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 5:18:35 PM | Yeah, Irish, I'm beating a dead horse evidently...lol..
I say we all stick to our own definitions and the heck with what anybody else thinks...lol..
One wonders if we all just like arguing..lol...not like I have ever seen anyone change their position on here after hearing others..maybe , at my advanced age, and others, we have found what works for us, and are reluctant to give that up...
And arlo..thanks, but daisypetals actually said that particular line...lol..though I agree...receptive is NOT the same as receptacle...
verity one: I generally like your posts...but, this one did strike me as being pretty logical and linear and void of the recognition of feelings..or, that feelings are allowed at all...romance is NOT a dirty word in my book, and I'm ok with that.... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 5:31:20 PM | (zangie) And arlo..thanks, but daisypetals actually said that particular line...lol..
Yeah, so? I said it BETTER!
Arlo
EDIT: Oh, man, I musta eaten a bad 'shroom or something... zangie was tearing me a new one for attributinig daisypetal's statement to her. Man, I'll just stick to beer from now on... | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 5:34:32 PM |
yikes they'll argue about the color of blue sky...
Well, come ON, there's azure, cerulean, sapphire, baby blue, navy, midnight...
--Ms. Flis | |
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| How long do men feel the need to pursue?
Posted: 3/26/2009 6:03:37 PM |
verity one: I generally like your posts...but, this one did strike me as being pretty logical and linear and void of the recognition of feelings..or, that feelings are allowed at all...romance is NOT a dirty word in my book, and I'm ok with that....
Which is why I apologized at the end if I took all the "romance" sentiment out of equation in order to make my point.
It's not my intent at all to suggest that there shouldn't be feelings and emotions involved in dating. But the "courtship" and "pursuit" notions are counter productive games IMO. | |
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