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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/23/2008 4:09:51 PM | http://www.taxfoundation.org/news/show/22600.html
Married households, many of which have two earners, have the highest income profile and appear "rich" compared to unmarried households. Median income for married households was just shy of $70,000 in 2006. The range of the middle 20 percent was approximately $57,000 to $83,000, and the range of the "Baucus middle class"—the middle 60 percent—was about $35,500 to $122,000. This $122,000 figure, then, represents the highest possible income that a married household could accurately call middle income, or "middle class."
Over $122K is "rich." | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/23/2008 4:16:10 PM | Russia is correct. The top 5 producers in the world are (in thousand barrels per day as of 2006, that is the most current data available)
Saudi Arabia 10,655
Russia 9,677
USA 8,330
Iran 4,418
China 3,845
Top 5 Exporters again in thousand barrels per day as of 2006
Saudi Arabia 8,525
Russia 6,866
United Arab Emirates 2,564
Norway 2,557
Iran 2,469
Next question…..
Who is the largest consumer of oil and how many thousand barrels per day? | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/23/2008 7:54:38 PM | USA 20,730,000,000 bbl/day
China 6,534,000 bbl/day
I not sure but I think these figures may be skewed because of the amount of oil used by China due to the Olympics. I think the pre Olympics and the Olympics themselves caused a spike in the oil usage by China. If you look at when the price of oil started to fall and when the Olympics ended they are pretty close to the same time. I don’t think this is just a coincidental. I think it has to do with the supply and demand side of the market.
Not to sound like a "know it all" but I did know that Russia was the 2nd leading oil producer. I saw a special a couple of years ago regarding Russia's oil industry and they have their sights set on passing Saudi Arabia as the largest oil producer back then.
Mystic in reference to looking at the Summary of Income report I had looked at that a long time ago after hearing so many pro oil and anti oil radicals talking about taxes and profits ect. I've seen articles claiming the effective tax rate that Exxon pays is 78% which is BS because it included all taxes (sales, excise, duty) and not just income tax on profits. I've seen people saying oil companies don't pay their fair share which is also BS IMO. Many experts say that the oil companies pay about 42% income tax on profits which is accurate from the figures I've seen and it looks to be correct. Being bored yesterday I went back through the 2007 Summary of Income report for Exxon. After taking into consideration the amount of income earned in the USA and the amount of income tax (not all taxes, just income tax) I calculated the approximate effective tax rate here and its about 50% =/- a couple percentage points.
The numbers are huge when it comes to large corporations and I think that’s what many people don‘t take into consideration when they see profits. Often the donations to charities and foundations that these corporations, and ultra rich individuals for that matter, aren’t seen either. In the USA philanthropy by companies and individuals is greater than any where else in the world. It is even more evident when you look at the countries that have higher tax rates.
People can complain all they want about “big oil” not paying enough in taxes but facts are facts. If they don’t feel that a 50% income tax rate is fair then I just have to disagree.
My guess is that if those that complain about the oil companies tax rate would be outraged, and rightly so, if they made $50,000 and a year and had to pay $25,000 in income tax.
My ideas and view probably aren't in line with many other retired teamsters!!!!
I just happen to think that fairness should apply to EVERY individual, company, organization and/or group no matter how big or small, or how rich or poor they are. I know that's a strange concept that I believe in. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 6:07:35 AM |
gmain, that is racist and sexist.
Nope, just facts. The majority of blacks would vote for Obama's wife, if she where running against Hillary Clinton for the nomination. You know it, I know it, we all know it. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 6:18:54 AM |
Fact: Companies don't pay taxes, tax costs are passed on to the consumers.
Go ahead and increase taxes to everyone who makes over 250k. As stated, they never take these hits without passing it on to someone else. Evidently, some of you people have never interfaced with any wealthy people. They pinch pennies so hard.... They never ever pay for anything, if they can pad there expense sheets, etc.
You will pay more for EVERYTHING.... The cost of the milk(hey, the trucking company taxes where increased), the cost of the clothing(hey, they increased taxes on the clothing outlet co.), and on and on.
AGAIN the RICH NEVER PAY!!!!!!!!! An increase on them is an increase on consumer. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 6:48:57 AM |
gmain, that is racist and sexist
Nope, just facts. The majority of blacks would vote for Obama's wife, if she where running against Hillary Clinton for the nomination. You know it, I know it, we all know it.
Very white of you! African-Americans do vote for Democrats in much higher percentages then Republicans, not sure how you spin that into a racist thing. I guess one needs to be predisposed to racism that to start with.
African- Americans are not lemmings who only vote for African-American candidates. Just look up the facts! Look at the African-American vote breakdown between Obama and Clinton in the primary, or Sharpton in 2004, or Jackson in 1984, or Alan Keyes, etc. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 7:23:57 AM |
McCain is a shill for the Republicans, Obama a shill for the Democrats. I see no real change in the direction our country is going from either of them as they both will end up towing their party line. We need someone who will think and act independently and gain cooperation from both sides of the aisle.
Unfortunatly, every politician is bought and paid for by someone with LOTS of money. Everything that is happening now with the financial crisis and the war was planed long before it happened by the large bankers and others like Halaburton who would profit. This isn't the first time it has happened either. Click on this link if you would like to see for yourself. There are two movies, one goes over how goverenments have controled the thinking of their people through out history, and the other talks about the money system we now have and why the Dollar is losing its value.
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 7:28:54 AM |
African-Americans do vote for Democrats in much higher percentages then Republicans, not sure how you spin that into a racist thing.
I knew you would say that, that is why I said "Hillary vs. Obama's wife. In case you don't know it, BOTH are Democrats, and BOTH are female. How reversed racist you are for spinning my words to make your racist accusation. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 7:36:59 AM |
Obama now has such a lock on the loyalties of African Americans -- 84 percent of the black vote in Alabama, 87 percent in Georgia, 84 percent in Maryland, and on and on -- that the black vote is no longer contestable.
That from way back when Hillary vs Obama for the candidacy. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 8:28:30 AM | It is unfortunate that race is going to play a part in this election. The main stream media is pretty one sided when it comes to reporting who will benefit (McCain) as a result the race issue in the end. I think both of the candidates should have come together, perhaps at one of the debates, and asked voters not to cast a vote based on the color of their skin.
There will be people that will vote for McCain only because he is white, which in my opinion is idiotic.
There will people who will vote for Obama only because he is black, which in my opinion is equally idiotic.
There will be people who will vote based on gender (I think this will be minimal in comparison to race) which in my opinion is idiotic.
The best outcome for all of us IMO is that all the people who vote only based on race will offset each others votes. That would be extremely optimistic to hope that is the case but isn't very realistic.
The media and the democrats will likely place race as a major factor if Obama is not elected. I truly hope I’m wrong about this. With the tension in this country at the moment this could create a volatile situation and I find this more worrisome than who is places in the Oval Office in the short term. Long term who knows what will happen. Every candidate makes promises that are unrealistic and never come to fruition.
I do find it troubling that we may have the house, senate and the presidency being controlled by one party.
Too much control can be a bad thing which is why we have anti trust laws. Everyone should hold onto their seats because we may have one hell of a ride ahead of us. Whether its good or bad ride time alone will tell. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 2:18:09 PM | my comments are just a numerical fact. What it amounts to is we have a white female governor. And what a peice of work. She has run Michigan under the ground, and then ran a disk over us. She is a Canadian, with a degree from Berkeley, ya think she is a right wing extremist? Her idea to save michigan is to make methane out of canadian garbage. I know one real quick way to make methane out of canadian garbage. Our state is led by a democrat, and is becoming a wasteland every day. Wait until you get one leading america. Canada has laws preventing building any landfills and the ones they have are full, leaving only michigan, the great landfill to take every toxic polluted shit covered rag they can make. And whats more our landfills charge 20 percent of what indiana, ohio, and pennsylvania charge. WHY Why is it even legal to import foreign garbage?
If we fill Saginaw bay with Canadian Garbage this state will truly look like a tombstone. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 2:54:58 PM | "Nope, just facts. The majority of blacks would vote for Obama's wife, if she where running against Hillary Clinton for the nomination. You know it, I know it, we all know it."
Wow. I thought I was getting a decent political education reading most of the posts. Now, I realize you have to be careful who's doing the teaching. I'm sickened by this attitude. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/24/2008 4:38:12 PM |
USA 20,730,000,000 bbl/day
John’s right. Now, for some additional information that’s come to light, on one side we have OPEC who wants to lower production to drive up prices. On the other side, we have Russia whose entire economy is based on $75/barrel for 2008 and $95/barrel for 2009. Russia could also become a swing producer to influence global pricing. We are only producing 40% of our daily oil needs and we do not have enough to be self supportive even if we started drilling now for oil. We are no where near being oil independent. It’s been mentioned by me, john and flawed how tax increases are passed on to the consumer. Do we really need to tax big oil while we’re in this situation?
My ideas and view probably aren't in line with many other retired teamsters!!!!
I know what you mean; I know mine aren’t in line with my former UAW brethren.
Justmeandmax, there wasn’t a link in your post, could you repost it or email it to me?
Susie—With a few exceptions, this has been an enlightening and educational thread. It’s one of the few I’ve come across where most people posted facts, refrained from mudslinging and asked good questions.
I don't expect to convince anyone but seriously are you tired of negative compaigns don't you want to hear about the issues......
I think we’re all tired of it, but unless we start a grassroots movement and get a law in place to stop the mudslinging and have them stick to the issues, we’ll be pulling out our waders every election. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/25/2008 4:44:22 AM | The media and the democrats will likely place race as a major factor if Obama is not elected. I truly hope I’m wrong about this. With the tension in this country at the moment this could create a volatile situation and I find this more worrisome than who is places in the Oval Office in the short term.
The Bradley effect can not be denied. Some people are just uncomfortable, for whatever reason, with a black candidate, which leads them to mislead pollsters on how they will vote. Means we still have a long way to go to eliminate racism in America.
I've posted about my concern if Obama loses, I believe the level of partisan politics would reach levels never seen before (assuming Democrats control Congress). I hope the divisiveness would lessen with voters, but I fear that it will enter into our social lives too. I so hope my fears are wrong..... | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/25/2008 7:43:01 AM | Justmeandmax, there wasn’t a link in your post, could you repost it or email it to me?
I'll try to do both.
http://www.zeitgeis tmovie.com/
I too agree with John and am also a Local 7 Sheet Metal Worker. But, I also think it is wrong for the oil companys to be making windfall profits when it effects the world economy the way it has. It's nice to see that the cost is comming down but as another poster said, they are still gouging us seeing that when a barrel was $65, gas was about $2.10 and yesterday the cheapest I seen it here in Kzoo was $2.60. It seems to me that it doesn't matter what they pay for oil, they will decide what we will pay. It also accures to me that the same thing that happened in the 70's is going on again. Gas went on the rise and we started demanding alt. fuels. Prices came down and nothing came of it. Now here we are almost 40 years later and have the same thing going on once again, but our Gov. along with big oil has suppressed this technology. Check out "Water4gas". I know a guy that gets an extra 3mpg per container of water and has four hooked up too his car. He went from 25 too 37 mpg (yes I seen his records) and I will be building a simular system for mine. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/25/2008 11:25:44 AM | I was a student at the Jordan Energy Institute. in 1979, 80 We were studying alternative energy designs, learning the important laws and such governing energy in nature, thermodynamics, Entropy, physics, R values, heat load calculations.
There were endless articles in the paper about advances, and our work was perceived to be the earths salvation. then OPEC lowered the prices dramticaly, and suddenly the well went dry. The Us government "pork barreled" all our work, closed all subsidies, eliminated the energy tax credit, and there we were, back to geeks again. Try to find work with my 1981 resume. No tank drivers needed {army} who cares about energy, gas is cheap
They are doing it again. Its contrived to keep us using the filthy shit. And corn based Ethanol? HA HA HA if you thnk thats gonna help us your way wrong! it takes 1 gallon of gasoline to make 1.25 gallons of ethanol, and then get this, its efficiency is so low it takes 1.5 gallons of ethanol to produce the work of 1 gallon of gas!
METHANE. its the real and true way to save emissions. anything that ever lived can be made into methane, not just the corn, but the whole thing to the roots. you can grind up your house and make methane. But why arent we using it? BIG OIL cannot regulate price nor supply. until they can it will never be used. Methane, being harder to make portable, is hugely suitable for staionary applications, like producing electricity, and could easily make low cost electricity, to run our electric cars. Why dont we have Electric public transport is beyond me. but hey, ya know I am not in charge here.
YET.
In the Immortal words of the Joker, "this town needs an Enema" | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/25/2008 7:46:12 PM | """I hope the divisiveness would lessen with voters, but I fear that it will enter into our social lives too. I so hope my fears are wrong..... """
How about people quit looking at the color of people's skin and we won't have to ever worry about that issue? Good grief! One of the best things about my job is that being around people with disabilities...you forget there are people of different colors...because they don't see colors, they only see people! They sure could teach others something! What a wonderful world we'd have!
It's rediculous...our race for the presidency is now fought with colors and sexes involved? What happened to may the best man win?
ROFL.... In the Immortal words of the Joker, "this town needs an Enema"
Can we make that "COUNTRY" rather then town? lol!  | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 6:49:12 AM |
I'm sickened by this attitude.
How black our hearts have become when we support a person that backs "late term abortion" and allows these innocent pure beings to die from neglect wrapped in a towel.
How empty our souls have become when we support a person that keeps a terrorist as a friend. It didn't take us very long to forget all about 911 did it, when it was only a few years ago that the entire country was calling out for blood and revenge.
How hateful we have become when we support a person who attends a church for over 20 years that preaches white hate and hatred of the country. I find that very offensive since I have always thought of church as a place of "love of God", not love of color and hatred of whites.
Mrs. Obama said it best, "I have never been proud of this country...". Gee, what a shock. Can you imagine if Mrs. McCain said that? She would have killed the McCain campaign on the spot.
But, let a person point out reverse discrimination and ... "I'm sickened..." Whew, I've never before NOT been proud to be a USA citizen.
Well, one good thing, Obama will make sure that the "black farmers" are helped here in Michigan. My oh my, am I the ONLY person who finds that racist and offensive? In case you don't know what I'm talking about, google for yourself "black farmers" +obama | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 8:48:53 AM | Wow where to begin, jak you seem to know why Obama opposed the abortion bill. While I give you it is possible he favors late term abortion isn't it just as likely that he opposed the abortion bill(did not favor a bill allowing late-term abortion) due to some of the wording?
Check your facts on the "terrorist friend" I don't think you can claim he is friends with or really ever was friends with Ayers, who by the way it seems is a former terrorist.
I won't defend his church choice which concerns me somewhat but remember that what his church supports isn't necessarily what he supports.
I believe the quote of Michelle Obama you are looking for is "For the first time in my life I am really proud of my country..." . A little troubling perhaps but the fact that she had 'really' in the quotation allows she may have been proud of USA just not 'really proud'. Maybe it's a little more difficult given the history of the US and it's race relations, for a minority to feel proud.
I did google "black farmers + obama" and the only thing I saw was that he supports Congress getting involved so that some 74000 black farmers might get restitution they were entitled to at one time but lost the entitlement because they missed the deadline to file. Wouldn't you want the extension if you were one of the 74000? | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 9:08:53 AM | Pffffffft.....sorry, that bucket of water you are carrying has so many holes in it that by the time you get to the polls it's going to be empty in MY opinion....and remember, it's JUST MY opinion so nobody slam me please, awww, what the heck, I have broad shoulders,go ahead...lol!
I am all for pro choice, just not for using it as a contraceptive. I am however completely against ate term abortions..that's a baby. I delivered a pre term son that passed away from complications of being born too early...do not tell me he wasn't in pain or wasn't a real baby!
Do not tell me if smeone goes to a church for 20 years they aren't believers of what is being preached...if they aren't...they're awfully damn dumb for listening to something they don't believe in for that long.
Don't tell me a terrorist can be a former terrorist and I shouldfeel better about it...WTF! It's ok that a presidential candidate calls him friend? Oh oh oh noooo way, not in my book!
Don't tell me it's ok for a person to finally feel proud of their country for the first time now....when their husband is running for the presidency...hmmm, how curious is that.
Yes, there's lots of things I'm not so thrilled about the reublican party this time either...but this race has me chosing the least worst of the two this time around. I'm not happy with either, I'm an independent and I vote for the person, not the party.
Don't tell me to look at what the republicans have done to the country because I'm too busy looking at what the democrats have done to Michigan...it's a no win situation right now.
Why won't any one take me serious when I say Bill Cosby would make a great president? Brains, sense of humor and what every one else lacks...MORALS! | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 9:26:53 AM |
can claim he is friends with It doesn't matter that Obama's politcal career was launched in this mans home to you? Friends or not, how could a person stand to be in the same room as this person, let alone, allow him to host a party to launch your career?
"seems is a former terrorist?" Wow, you are misinformed are you. He is a self admitted terrorist and the only reason he hasn't been fried, is due to illegal wire taps.
After listening to someone preach hatred for over 20 years, how could one possibly not have some of these ideals and practices rub off on you. Church is not about hatred, so why in God's name would anyone listen to these preachings for that long of a time, if they did not, in some amount, agree with the preachings, or at least, enjoyed hearing this type of preaching. I can just imagine the outrage if "black hatred" churches where so prevalent as Rev. Wright type churches. Wrap your head around that for a minute.
I agree, that discrimination was prevalent, but I thought that by now, we would be past that. I suppose it will be another 20 years, maybe longer, until it stops. Not that discrimination will ever stop, but the blaming of everything unfortunate to occur to us, is due to our race. I too, was turned down many years ago for a loan, and I had a job. Since I was turned down, it must have been due to my color. Where is my reparation? Waaaaa.
Michelle Obama finally being proud of the USA? Gee, it took her husband to be nominated as the Democratic candidate to make her finally feel proud? Whew, if you don't see the problem with that, I give up.
It appears that my message isn't clear. My dislike of Obama has nothing to do with his color. If he where most any other black political person, I could care less and base my decisions on the person's character/past. But for a person with such a history as his, to be worshiped by so many, is ludicrous. Yes, I say worshipped, because he surely isn't being supported due to his wonderful voting record or lifestyle. It's more of a blind "worship" than an intelligent, logical following.
Anyway, maybe if we all vote "present" on election day, like Obama has done so many times on important legislation, then maybe he will actually start to be a productive Senator and try running again later. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 9:29:14 AM | No problem robitty no need to slam. But a few things stick out. First Obama opposed an anti-abortion bill that required doctors to try and save a baby even though there was no reasonable chance of survival. I am with you on opposing abortion as a form of contraceptive, however there are circumstances where abortion is a reasonable option such as rape and incest.
I've attended church for years and the church invariable supports Republican candidates so does that mean I am Republican?
I go back to the fact it was revealed that Obama and Ayers were never really friends but merely acquaintances who rarely see each other let alone associate with each other.
As far as Michigan goes I'm with you to an extent, remember we had a surplus here until Engler got in office. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 9:40:07 AM |
Bill Cosby
I don't care who you put up for a vote, unless maybe Ross Pero( I really liked his ideas on how to get the country out of debt), I would vote for Bill Cosby in a second.
Reason is, he is all about being an individual. He inspires me to become a better person through self initiative. NOTE: SELF INITIATIVE, NOT HANDOUTS, or SCREEMING RACISM at EVERY TURN of EVENTS.
If Bill Cosby was nominated for presidency, it would be the first time that I was "EXCEPTIONALLY PROUD" to be American.
OK, so let's get back to Obama and vote him in, because he wants to inspire me by putting more government in my home/life, and putting more people in the hands of government dependancy in order to survive. Here, here. more government, spread the wealth, socialize medicine, we love long lines... Obama.. Obama...
We don't need those innocent beings anyway, so yea, vote in your Obama and by all means, tell us just how disgusted you are with me, since I worship life over anything else. Nothing more disgusting and sickening than that, surely.
Tell me again how righteous you are with your dislike of my "pointing out the truth", instead of buriing my head in the sand and clicking my heals 2 times.... | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 9:43:37 AM |
rape and incest
This issue isn't about that, it's about "late term" abortion. Surely a person doesn't have to wait that long to abort, if they where in fact raped, etc.
Obama supports "late term" abortion, given the proper circumstances, which in the past, meant any excuse a person chooses to cook up. | |
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| Take THAT Michigan!! Love , John McCain
Posted: 10/26/2008 10:35:26 AM | Look, I actually thought that all of us where on the same page, in relation to "protect our loved ones". I'm not going to chastise women for making a choice that I don't agree with, but I will chastise someone for supporting legislation to make it "acceptable and legal". The reason is, if that is done, then it will simply become one more step to a future I abhor the thought of.
Males have given there lives for countless centuries in the name of "protecting our loved ones" and as we are all aware, for other reason's that have nothing to do with protection. Is it legal and acceptable to for a soldier to value his life and choose to NOT participate in that effort of "protection"? No, soldiers have been shot on sight for such a thing.
As most soldiers attest, they are fighting for what they believe is the preservation of there way of life and the safety of those that they love.
I can only base my values on this issue from the perspective of "what would the most precious woman in my life do in such a case?". I know for a fact, that if the fetus stood even a "snowballs chance in hades" better chance of survival, if she was to give up her life to provide that extra chance, that she would do so. She would NEVER have aborted to save her own skin, unless there was absolutely ZERO chance of the baby surviving either way. I would EVEN go as far as saying she wouldn't abort early, even in a case of rape/incest/etc. She loved children that much. So, please, pick your candidate or choice and live with the knowledge of knowing just exactly what that person's record is and what there values are.
It makes me shudder to think of this topic, as I can't think of anything more "sickening" than "late term abortion". But hey, still gotta love that Obama, since he is going to save us all from ourselves. Gotta love more government.... Obama... Obama... | |
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