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 serenityCW
Joined: 1/21/2006
Msg: 126
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???Page 6 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
since we don't know the percentage of total bills that you are contributing, i would assume that it is less than one fourth? do you also use his car, even if together? do the kids watch cable? his car is an asset, although if new, it depreciates fast the first year. so, hopefully it's a good used one. the asset is in his name, as it's his car. is the house in his name? and your car?

it sounds like you really care for the kids and you take care of them. i assume he does too and also does things that benefit you. if not, then it's a no win-win situation as that should be your objective: win-win.

so, assuming that this is just a "struggling" issue, i'd suggest you invest in a copy of quicken software, get all your bank accounts and credit cards on there, categorize your expenditures, including taxes and both your incomes. then use either the class feature or tag feature to the effect of something like this: Y (you), H (him), k1 (kid one) et al and then J (joint). this helps get a handle on what exactly you are spending versus what you think you are spending and who is it for. so, if the car he bought is used by all of you, then it's one fourth. you both should agree that in the future, once your budget is made and agreed upon, that extra expenses must be discussed or come out of either his or your discretionary income. then together sit down and analyze.

if you had your own place, it would cost you probably more. same for him with respect to your care for the girls. try to develop a household budget and agree to each person's contribution. one way to do this is each of you pretend you are the other, then switch places so you both see both points of view.

he should be paying for costs incurred by the girls. if they share a room, then they are not a full one fourth when it comes to rent, heat, etc. that allocation goes by use of space. water is often shared equally. you'd both be the best judge of assessing what costs are allocated to whom and by what proportion. then you just split the entries according to each person's estimated consumption.

it takes the emotions out of it, gives you both a joint task to focus on and as a tool, can help you both think objectively. there should be no blame, just problem solving. it should demonstrate that each of you has some discretion, but that doesn't mean that if he chooses the car and you chose the cable, that either of you should hoard it. he can still drive you and if you get cable, he's free to watch it as well. but he gets first dibs on the car use and you get first dibs on the cable.

it just means you each get some personal gratification and if he does pay considerably more and you do more of the household "stuff", then you should receive an "in-kind" credit for what you do , that he would otherwise have to pay for. if he still makes way more and does way more than you do for the "household", since you are not yet married, your future investment may bring nothing towards the family if you then up and move out. so, you need to demontrate some sort of equitable contribution right now, or allow him some more discretionary income.

this becomes autopilot after a while. it may not be the relationship as much as it is that neither of you have faced your spending patterns. you can get the kids involved also and teach them the art of budgeting early. you can also use envelopes, each with a budgeted amount. when the envelope runs out of food money, that's it for the month. you adjust very quickly when you can "see" the money and watch it diminish. credit cards are often not a good idea when money is as tight as your describe!

ps quicken was used in our marriage whenever he got laid off, to assess the unusual costs of teen adoption and in the end, we sat down togther and analyzed/concluded a divorce agreement. i'd take quicken over a marriage counselor any day , if it's a money problem you are having!
 davidsauvignon
Joined: 2/6/2008
Msg: 127
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/24/2008 11:02:02 PM

I own a house.
I get involved in a relationship with you and you move in.
You contribute towards the payments on the mortgage but your name is never put on the title.
5 years later we split and the court orders you to continue making payments toward my mortgage while I remain living in it and in full control of it.

IOW, you DON'T get any equity back. You just get to continue making payments.


Exactly. Let's go back to the OP's scenario, i.e. 1 year, not 5, 7 or 10 or whatever common law in the U.S. is. Say he just refinanced and took a second mortgage, rolled in all his unsecured debt, etc. So now, he has a $200,000 mortgage on a house he originally bought for $160,000. Add to that, the way the housing market is today, he might be lucky to get $180,000. So my point was, is the person who is cohabiting going to step up and assume half of the $20,000 negative equity? The same as they would if the $20,000 was real equity? I mean the same love and hope and promise for the future exists between them, right?





~ds~
 Lil Brooker
Joined: 6/17/2008
Msg: 128
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/24/2008 11:10:15 PM
Irrelevant. Your on POF seeking a male for dating while you're suckering a poor guy for co-habiting expenses and then trying to garner pity. I expect you to stop using others.
 sherilyn70
Joined: 1/26/2007
Msg: 129
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 5:26:02 AM
Exactly. Let's go back to the OP's scenario, i.e. 1 year, not 5, 7 or 10 or whatever common law in the U.S. is. Say he just refinanced and took a second mortgage, rolled in all his unsecured debt, etc. So now, he has a $200,000 mortgage on a house he originally bought for $160,000. Add to that, the way the housing market is today, he might be lucky to get $180,000. So my point was, is the person who is cohabiting going to step up and assume half of the $20,000 negative equity? The same as they would if the $20,000 was real equity? I mean the same love and hope and promise for the future exists between them, right?


I would expect the same as in any split relationship. If a couple divorces they do not continue paying on a house together. They sell it even if it is negative equity. if the owning partner needs to sell the house (and not wait out the market) then yes, I would expect both to take up the loss (but it would not be a 50/50 split and be based on the number of years ratio).

I own a house right now, the boyfriend will not pay me money for living here for the first year but will put it into a savings account where it can gain interest. After that 1 year trial the money will either go back into the house or we will have broken up. If we are still together, at that point I would expect him to have some vestment in the house and if we broke up 5 years after that I would make sure he got his share back from the investment. Once we start paying all of the bills as a single unit then I don't care if his name isn't on the title... he is still investing in a property and it would just be silly for him to go out and buy his own house. A house is an important part of most retirement plans.

Maybe I'm not a greedy and selfish person in breakups like it seems so many others are. I'm not in a relationship to see how much I can take the other for for my own financial gain.
 Rachelle~C
Joined: 6/30/2008
Msg: 130
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 5:56:27 AM

Irrelevant. Your on POF seeking a male for dating while you're suckering a poor guy for co-habiting expenses and then trying to garner pity. I expect you to stop using others.




She already said pages back that they just broke up.It helps to read a thread.
 WhiteWaterRogue
Joined: 4/3/2007
Msg: 131
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 5:57:41 AM
Tread is too damn longe....
 Jim978
Joined: 7/15/2008
Msg: 132
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 6:20:27 AM

I would expect the same as in any split relationship. If a couple divorces they do not continue paying on a house together.


I don't know how many divorced men you've known over the years but there are many, many, many that DO continue to pay after a divorce. (I don't know about women but I'd guess those that make child support payments are in the same boat) Stroll through the Single Parents forum and look at how many discussions there are about how Child Support payments are used to cover all/part of the mortgage.
 El_Mariachi
Joined: 4/21/2007
Msg: 133
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 7:06:47 AM
Generally 50/50, but sometimes that isn't possible.

Sometimes... and this is my own experience here... one of you makes way more than the other. This was the case with my ex-fiance and I, so how we did it was he paid the rent (and his own credit card, gas and car expenses) and I paid everything else.. utilities and the majority of the groceries (plus my own credit card and school loan expenses).

It worked out great.

When I lived with another BF, we made around the same so we split everything 50/50.

Either time we sat down and figured out what would work best.
 sherilyn70
Joined: 1/26/2007
Msg: 134
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 7:12:53 AM

I don't know how many divorced men you've known over the years but there are many, many, many that DO continue to pay after a divorce. (I don't know about women but I'd guess those that make child support payments are in the same boat) Stroll through the Single Parents forum and look at how many discussions there are about how Child Support payments are used to cover all/part of the mortgage.

You keep changing the scenario... now you're bringing kids and child support into this issue. :) I've known lots of divorced men and most of them had full custody of the kids. The guy I'm with now is divorced as well but the ex-wife has custody. He isn't paying her mortgage.

How a full custody parent chooses to use the payments of child support is up to them, that is no longer the other persons income. They are the one that has to pay taxes on the money and it is considered THEIR income. The children also live there and that money is for their share in the house (which assuming they don't run their money into the ground will eventually go to the children at death). If they didn't have the kids they could just buy a 1 bedroom condo and save a lot of money. If they spend it all on the mortgage they still have to pay for the kids food and clothing out of something, right? Unless of course the other person is stupid enough to give them even more money on top of the child support agreement.
 Jim978
Joined: 7/15/2008
Msg: 135
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 7:31:40 AM

You keep changing the scenario... now you're bringing kids and child support into this issue. :)


Well, I'll fully admit that I'm playing a bit of devil's advocate here.

When you make statements like...


I would expect the same as in any split relationship.


you are speaking in terms of absolutes. Isn't a relationship where one or the other has children a part of "any relationship"? (And it does tie in since that was what the OP posted about before things went off on tangents.)

This was my basic objection to the 50/50 and "Whoever makes more should pay more" scenarios that people have suggested all along. Everyone's situation is different so, to me, there are no absolutes. I think Serenity laid it out pretty well above. If two people are going to cohabitate you have to break things down and take the emotion out of it. Then you can establish an agreement that both can live with without any hard feelings either way.
 Michaelann
Joined: 9/11/2004
Msg: 136
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 8:36:39 AM
Either time we sat down and figured out what would work best. - El_Mariachi

Now, that sounds like the smartest way to deal with this & most other issues. I couldn't begin to count the number of times I've read
the dose's (a free newspaper) sex advice column, or Dan Savage's column & seen "I just don't know how to talk to my S/O, boyfriend/
girlfriend/spouse, etc." And they don't even seem to realize that they are not dealing with just the original isse, but 2 issues (original
issue + communincation issues).
 kellygrl51
Joined: 9/21/2008
Msg: 137
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 8:45:02 AM
"She already said pages back that they just broke up.It helps to read a thread."

It sure does...she started the thread 10/17 broke up with the guy 10/23 and she's already looking for someone else. Sounds like she needs her bills paid....
 GrandmaBooBoo
Joined: 12/30/2006
Msg: 138
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 8:58:04 AM
Yes, if YOU want the cable, then you should pay the bill. At first, I almost agreed with those suggesting that you should pay only 1/4 of the bill...or as one recommended...kicking the guy if he was caught watching it; then I allowed maturity to rule and it occurred to me, that PERHAPS neither of you is really ready for a big grown up relationship.

I have just the slightest inkling that the cable bill is only a cover-up for some more serious issues in the relationship.
 carolann0308
Joined: 12/9/2006
Msg: 139
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 10:39:47 AM
In the US, you can charge anyone rent to live in your home. Adult children, elderly parents and yes even a live-in GF/BF.
All you need is to set an amount (best to have a rental agreement you can easily download online) and have them issue a check monthly stating it is for rent, you can even get it notorized at your bank for a few dollars. This way they contribute towards expenses and it is very clear that they hold no interest in the ownership of the home. They are your tenant and you are protected financially.
 angelbrighteyes
Joined: 2/29/2008
Msg: 140
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 11:53:05 AM
There is no point moving in together if you don't join most of your money together. His ten dollars is the same as your one dollar that you put into the kitty.
After all you moved in together because you wanted to be together and love each other.
I can not see any point in moving in together if you are so separate with money.. Yes have separate accounts but have one joint one as well so that you can pay all the bills.. I would treat living with someone as being sort of married and all should be ours not yours and mine. Just my opinion.
Money can cause so much damage to relationships, so it is best that you both talk about this more, as you are not feeling happy about his idea of loosing your cable tv. good luck...
 wannashakeyourtree
Joined: 8/17/2005
Msg: 141
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/25/2008 12:06:23 PM
so why did they break up???

Score another one for love and P.O.F.!!!
 oceanbreeze77
Joined: 4/19/2008
Msg: 142
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/27/2008 3:25:24 PM
I have some cave crickets living in my crawl space. Since the heat of the dryer goes into the crawlspace and they can hear the t.v., should they be splitting the bills with me?

This subject has be beaten to death.


Happy Halloween, Ya'll!!
 MyKidsDadIAm
Joined: 8/10/2005
Msg: 143
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/27/2008 3:43:33 PM

This subject has be beaten to death.
And looks like you gave it one final blow!!!.. :) Happy Halloween to you too... May this thread rest in peace.
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 144
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/27/2008 4:14:24 PM

I would treat living with someone as being sort of married and all should be ours not yours and mine....


That's a really good deal for the person who makes less money, trust me on that one. Especially when pensions, RRSPs, equity and such are factored in. Just ask my ex....


Money can cause so much damage to relationships...


Yup... and the damage it causes AFTER the relationship can often be just as bad or worse....

 sammyjcjr
Joined: 2/28/2008
Msg: 145
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/28/2008 3:46:49 PM
If times are so hard why is he getting a new vehicle that costs more money? But at the same time if you need cable then thats your choice as well... Pay that bill if you want cable. As long as your not paying for his new vehicle
 JMurphyE
Joined: 10/28/2006
Msg: 146
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/28/2008 5:19:54 PM
Well I look at things differently than most. There should be a joint fund that covers the house bills. You had cable when you moved in. Just because he increased his bills doesn't mean you should have to go without cable. If you go buy a car, should that mean that he should pay all the rent because you can't afford to help anymore? NO. It works both ways. He should still pay what he was paying. If buying the car puts you in a position where you have to start going without some things then he should have kept his old car. My opinion. I'm a little old fashioned anyway so kill me.
 screenangel
Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 147
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 10/28/2008 5:33:37 PM
Goodness! Isn't cohabiting COMPLICATED!?...... .. ..... .... .... ....
 good guy75
Joined: 3/25/2008
Msg: 148
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 12/4/2008 12:34:37 PM
if your arguing over that small stuff your doomed.it shouldnt be 50/50 pool your money and go from there.
 BigDaddyJinx
Joined: 11/4/2006
Msg: 149
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Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 12/4/2008 1:48:32 PM
Jim978 -- I found what I think it was that I had eluded to earlier...that document that can be signed that sees one dismissing all claim to any assets...it's called a Quit Claim Deed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quitclaim_deed

From what I've been told, this can apply to any "real" property that one owns.

Sorry it took me so long to post it back...I thought this thread had died long ago lol.
 EdVonBlue
Joined: 10/7/2008
Msg: 150
Who Pays What When Your Cohabiting???
Posted: 12/4/2008 4:57:57 PM
Split everything 50/50...
...and just get rid of cable, your life will be better without it. Plus when the switch to digital comes in February there are going to be literally dozens of free channels, including weather, sports, even movie channels...
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