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 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 676
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No one is basing this game on satistics alone, I think everyone realizes that it's how they play on the field that day which will determine who wins that game, but at the same time statistics shouldn't be taken lightly either because they do mean something. Statistics show what a team is capable of doing on avg.
 JackDiamond312
Joined: 1/21/2007
Msg: 677
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 12:28:41 AM
This should be a great game, two powerful offenses. with decent "D's" The edge goes to the Colts only because the pressure won't be felt as much, because they have been there. But in saying that, they'll still feel it, besides after the first hits, both teams should forget where they are and know they're just playing football.

It all comes down to protecting the ball, who makes the less mistakes. A fluke play can change the game in a second, because both teams have the possibility of putting up big numbers.

With the stats of these two teams being pretty close, I'm thinking you can just throw the stats out the window, and pray for your team to have the breaks go their way on Sunday.

Go Saints
 big pacific
Joined: 7/2/2009
Msg: 678
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 6:49:18 AM

No one is basing this game on satistics alone, I think everyone realizes that it's how they play on the field that day which will determine who wins that game, but at the same time statistics shouldn't be taken lightly either because they do mean something. Statistics show what a team is capable of doing on avg.


Yes, in the NFC. All the defense is in the AFC my friend, stats are great, when you look at the whole picture.

But would you find a guy to say the saints offense is better than the colts?
 Kulbrz
Joined: 12/31/2009
Msg: 679
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 7:54:16 AM
I am gonna have to side with Jack Diamond there... Who ever has the better day, and who shows up.. But i really lean with the Saints cause they are really hungry for a Superbowl ,,Like it or not it'll be hard hitting and a sweating game i promise you.!
 skoochie
Joined: 4/29/2008
Msg: 680
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 8:22:45 AM

All the defense is in the AFC my friend, stats are great, when you look at the whole picture.

Let's see a list of the top twelve defenses:
Jets
Pack
Ravens
Steelers
Bengals
Vikings
Broncos
Panthers
Girls
Redskins
Pats
Eagles
Six are in the AFC and six are in the NFC. Seems pretty evenlty split to me, although the top five favor the AFC. Another thing I noticed is the Saints beat half of those teams including the Jets.


But would you find a guy to say the saints offense is better than the colts?

I will. Has been better for the past trwo years.
 broncsbuff
Joined: 4/18/2008
Msg: 681
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 8:36:27 AM
When I rank defenses what matters to ME is points given up....

Jets
cowboys
ravens
niners
pats

The colts played 2 of the 3 top defenses (scoring wise) in the playoffs and toyed with them. The ravens game wasnt even close. If there was gonna be a defense that was gonna stop the colts it would be the ravens....manning made it look easy...

After the colts woke up, they started toying with the jets second half, and made it look easy...

now...the saints defense isnt the ravens or the jets....it has to rely on turnovers and momentum to play well. If the colts get up early...game over.

I think it will be close till about the third quarter...then the colts will start to pull away..

Colts 45..Saints 23
 skoochie
Joined: 4/29/2008
Msg: 682
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 9:22:17 AM
^^^Actually the Colts played four of those teams. They got the Niners also 17-14.

The list I posted is ranked by average yards per game. I agree with Broncs that points are more important. Yards don't win games.
 Kulbrz
Joined: 12/31/2009
Msg: 683
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 9:34:33 AM
The Colts have to score in the 40's to beat the Saints, Look at the ave points the Saints score a game vs Colts! The Colts barely won some of their games,as did the Saints.Its a barn burner eitherway u look at this game ppl..Everybody is gonna be on the edge of their seats!
 broncsbuff
Joined: 4/18/2008
Msg: 684
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 9:43:20 AM

Look at the ave points the Saints score a game vs Colts!


the saints averaged about 31 points a game...the colts averaged 26 points a game..

The colts are DEAD LAST in rushing yards per game in about 80...Drew brees had a running game of about 130 yards a game...

I like Drew brees..hell of a qb. BUT..This just shows the greatness of Manning to still score points without a running game. If your a defesne and stop the run, it doesnt matter, Manning will still get you...
 skoochie
Joined: 4/29/2008
Msg: 685
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 11:07:56 AM
^^^The same could be said for Brees. He's come back from defecits a bunch of times.

The Saints got their yards rushing thanks to the large leads they had and were running the clock out. The Saints avg. just under 8 points per game while the Colts avg 6 point per game with the rush. Subtract that from the stats in Broncs post, and you'll find Brees still put up more points than Manning eventhough the Saints hand the ball off more.

I'm just saying the points the Saints get from their rushing isn't much more than the output of the Colts rushing offense. Not even a whole two points is the difference.
 dennyden
Joined: 6/27/2007
Msg: 686
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 12:19:18 PM
The same could be said for Brees. He's come back from defecits a bunch of times.


the colts have 7 of there 14 wins this year from coming frombehind in the 4th quater, iam pretty sure thats the most in the nfl, hell some teams dont even have 7 wins let alone 7 come backs,lol. i think most of these stats dont really matter anymore, sure it does for how good the ofense and defenses are. but does it really matter how the colts fair against the niner in the reg. season or what the saints did against the panthers?? i dont really think so at this point. for my example of that look 2 years ago the patriots came in with one of the best offense ever , brady had just set the record for tds and so on, and they lost. it should be a great game. good luck luck to all the saint fans but go colts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!,lol
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 687
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 12:39:39 PM

Yes, in the NFC. All the defense is in the AFC my friend, stats are great, when you look at the whole picture.


Um that wasn't what the basis of the current debate was about, the current debate was about how each teams offense stacks up to one another, which is why I only pulled up the offensive stats.


But would you find a guy to say the saints offense is better than the colts?


Yes, anyone that had real knowledge of the sport and were aware of what each team did this past season on offense, would see that the Saints have a better offense overall then the Colts do.
 dennyden
Joined: 6/27/2007
Msg: 688
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 12:51:36 PM
^^^ while u make a good point, let me ask u this, if its a close game what offense would u trust more, the offense that is the best by stats or the offense that has won the most close game and is the best 2 min offense in the game?? again iam not saying that the saints dont have a great offense they do, but at this point in the year its not about just stats. also them stats are hard to go by when u think the colts for the most part took the last 2 games off. also i will use the same point i just used, 2 years ago the patriots had oneof the best offenses ever, they didnt win. look at last year, i would say that the cards had a better o then the steleers they didnt win either.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 689
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 3:20:29 PM
Honestly? The Saints and I'll tell you why. The Colts are 32nd in the league in run offense, if you shut the Colts pass offense down by getting to Manning, the Colts become very vulnerable, because they have no real run game to counter balance the workload off the pass offense. The Saints are much more diverse in their offense than the Colts are when it comes to counter balancing between their pass offense and their run offense. So if the Saints pass offense gets shutdown at least they can rely on their run to help carry the work-load off of their passing game, the Colts can't.

If it came down to a few minutes left in the game and I had to choose between Brees and Manning in a pass rush style pass defense, I'm going with Brees, because Brees, is not only more mobile out of the pocket then Manning is, but he has a lot better passer rating then Manning does throwing outside the pocket. Manning is only as good when his line holds up and he isn't being chased outside the pocket. Brees on the other hand is a diverse quarterback that doesn't always have to rely on his line to hold up to make big plays in and out of the pocket.

So that's who I'm going with and why.
 Kulbrz
Joined: 12/31/2009
Msg: 690
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 3:35:14 PM
I totally agree with you Steel on pretty much everything u said there...But if Mannings O gets good blocking u will see him try and shred the D...But the D is good.
 dennyden
Joined: 6/27/2007
Msg: 691
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 3:46:13 PM
Honestly? The Saints and I'll tell you why. The Colts are 32nd in the league in run offense, if you shut the Colts pass offense down by getting to Manning, the Colts become very vulnerable



thats eazier said then done, they had no rushing game all year and went 14-0 when they played there starters, if thats ur opinion that the saints are going to win thats cool, we all have our opinions. if u go with breese again thats cool, but if u are a stats guy, then nobody is better then manning in the close game, i dont really see how u say stats are so important on 1 hand then dismiss them on the other hand, the colts had the most 2 min drives, it is what it is bro , they where the best at that. ur right breese is a diverese qb, alot of that has to do with his run game, if u can say if u get manning outta the pocket, then u also have to say that if u can shut down the saints run game then they are in trouble, again thats also eazier said then done. by the way every qb has to rely on there line to hold up. why do u think manning so so few sacks this year?? but u are right if manning is outta the pocket hes not that good, but again eazier said then done. 2 of the best ds in the nfl couldnt do it so far, that has nothing to do with sunday, iam just saying its just not like u can say get him outta the pocket and we win, he have to actually get him outta the pocket first
 skoochie
Joined: 4/29/2008
Msg: 692
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 4:02:43 PM
Having the most two min. drives isn't exactly a badge of honor. It means the Colts had to squeek out more games than the Saints did this year.
 dennyden
Joined: 6/27/2007
Msg: 693
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 4:08:00 PM
^^^ thats a good point, but the again u where the one bragging about that deffense of the saints, ya know the one that ranked about middle of the pack or lower, also i was talking in context of a close game, so in that context i guess it would be a great thing!! close games arent a badge of honor, well go tell tom brady that, ya know a guy who won 3 superbowls all by 3 points,lol, again iam not comapring manning to brady just pointing out a fact about close games and the nfl thats all!!!! also just for the record the saints won by a avg of 10 points a game, the colts won by avg of 8 points a game, not really a big difference, iam just saying
 newdejavu
Joined: 9/11/2009
Msg: 694
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 4:28:03 PM
Let the build-up to the big-game begin! dennyden and steel both have good points. Heck, you could argue points for both teams; both are excellent and deserving! If they played 10 games; they very well could split them 5 apiece. That's why football is so great; ONE game to settle the score!

On paper, I would lean towards the Colts. However, their two best defenders will miss the game or be very limited (Bob Sanders - out, Dwight Freeney - questionable at best). I think the Saints tall receivers (Colston, Meachem) and TE's (Shockey, Dinkens) will present match-up problems for the Colts undersized LB's and DB's. And, the Saints are a good running team which should set up play-action. Without Freeney, the Saints can double-up on Mathis on the other end and give Brees time to pass.

I hope we get a good, close game like the last two SB's. It could go either way but I am leaning Saints in a very close game. The Saints have been forcing turnovers all year and I don't see any reason they won't get a couple in the SB!
 MGMLION
Joined: 4/29/2008
Msg: 695
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 5:56:19 PM

Brees on the other hand is a diverse quarterback that doesn't always have to rely on his line to hold up to make big plays in and out of the pocket.



That's not true his O line collasped in the Dallas game. Threw 1 Int fumbled twice and was sacked 4 times. No telling how many times he threw the ball away in a hurry.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 696
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 8:52:22 PM
they had no rushing game all year and went 14-0


Yeah and the majority of the teams that they played this season had medicore defensives. I'm not taking that away from them winning those games, but when the majority of the teams you face don't have very good defensive lines, it's nothing to brag too much about either.

then nobody is better then manning in the close game


Nobody is better then Manning? That's highly debatably. Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger, Drew Brees have shown to be solid clutch QB's that can easily rival that of Manning when close games are on the line.



i dont really see how u say stats are so important on 1 hand then dismiss them on the other hand, the colts had the most 2 min drives, it is what it is bro , they where the best at that


I never acted like stats are everything, where did I state that? I clearly stated that it's what's on the field that day what counts the most, but stats shouldn't be taken lightly either considering they show an on acg what a team is capable of doing.

like Skoochie said the Colts had to squeek out more games with those last two minute drives then not, which either says most of the time that your defense was stumbling or your offense wasn't producing for most of the game to allow it to get to that point.



if u can say if u get manning outta the pocket, then u also have to say that if u can shut down the saints run game then they are in trouble


The Saints aren't one dimensional like the Colts are, you shut down the Saints run game they resort to their passing game. So no you can't say the same.



why do u think manning so so few sacks this year??


Why did I think Manning has not had that many sacks this year? Well a mediocre schedule had something to do with it playing against many teams this year who didn't have a strong defense.



the best ds in the nfl couldnt do it so far, that has nothing to do with sunday


Um well one of those two teams that you proclaim couldn't do it also had a Rookie QB playing for them that ended up giving the Colts breaks in the second half. Kind of hard to win games on your defense when your offense is stumbling and giving the team breaks.



iam just saying its just not like u can say get him outta the pocket and we win, he have to actually get him outta the pocket first


I don't think anyone said that like that's all their is to it, but when Manning is rushed out of the pocket he starts making a lot of mistakes and his passing record shows that. You don't need to continually pass rush a QB like Manning to win the game, one or two big pass rush mistakes by Manning can change the entire landscape of the game depending upon what mistakes he makes, that's how bad of a out of pocket passer he is.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 697
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 8:59:16 PM
That's not true his O line collasped in the Dallas game


You are talking about a Collapse which is diff then a hold up as in the whole offensive line caving in seconds after you snap the ball which did happen in that Cowboys game a few diff times when the Cowboys brought diff blitz schemes that the Saints weren't aware of, but No QB can get away from that. I mean it's kind of hard to when you got 4 or 5 guys coming in at you at the same time from all diff angles seconds after you hike the ball.
 broncsbuff
Joined: 4/18/2008
Msg: 698
New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 10:06:03 PM

Well a mediocre schedule had something to do with it playing against many teams this year who didn't have a strong defense.


funny..

The saints and colts both played the following teams...
pats
phins
rams
bills
Jets

So there is 5 games that is a wash...now, to break down the other 11 games..

The saints played the bucs twice(lost once)..bad defense
Played the falcons twice...average at best
carolina twice...little better than average
cowboys..very good defense
philly..good defense
g-men...bad defense by seasons end

Colts got to play bills twice...average at best
texans twice...little better than average
Jags twice..not that great
colts got the ravens..very good
Broncos...better than average

I really dont see an argument here. Your acting like the saints played world beaters all year..they didnt. Colts played the ravens twice and beat them twice. Saints got a good defense in the cowboys and lost...

If all the saints fan have to go is ...."well if we can get manning out of the pocket we can get him to make mistakes"...really?...that is it?

The colts didnt even care about running the ball and teams STILL didnt stop them. What makes you think all of a sudden teh saints are gonna come up with a game plan to do it?...

again..feel good story is the saints...but this has blowout written all over it..

colts 45...saints 23
 yeswho
Joined: 12/27/2007
Msg: 699
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/2/2010 10:38:29 PM
From what I've noticed from watching every super bowl sin super bowl 3,the team that plays the best dee.and runs the ball for the team that runs the for more yardage wins the super bowl.The saints have 3 good RBS Bush,Thomas, and Bell.The Colts have Addai.The Colts have the better dee.The Saints will win with creating more turnovers.
 SteelCity1981
Joined: 8/16/2005
Msg: 700
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New Orleans Saints
Posted: 2/3/2010 1:28:49 AM
You missed the point in what i was implying about who the Colts played this year inregards to what their offensive line had to go up against this season as if they had a tough sehedule and had to face a bunch of good teams with that offensive line like some people on here tend to think.

But now that you brought their schedule up the Saints had the 8th toughest schedule @ 557 in the league this year, the Colts the 13th toughest scheduling @ 512. So yes if we wanted to compare who had the tougher road to not only win in the regular season but to win in the playoffs to get to the Superbowl, it was the Saints overall.





I really dont see an argument here. Your acting like the saints played world beaters all year..they didnt. Colts played the ravens twice and beat them twice. Saints got a good defense in the cowboys and lost


I wasn't implying that the Saints were world beaters all year, i don't know where i was stating that, because there is no where in my statements implying such thing. What I have been implying is that the Saints offense is just as good in many areas if not better then the Colts overall in which very little people outside of New Orlean fans give the Saints that type of respect when compared to the Colts offense. I mean those stats showed and that the Saints are not to be overlooked just because the Colts have Manning in their offense. Which goes all the way back to page 27 in which I was further reiterating skoochies point on msg 675.

How did the Colts play the bills twice? They aren't in the same division.





The colts didnt even care about running the ball and teams STILL didnt stop them. What makes you think all of a sudden teh saints are gonna come up with a game plan to do it?...


You're acting like the Colts just ran through everyone this year with their pass. I do recall a few games this year where they had to resort to the run, because they were getting passed rushed by defensive lines that were better then the majority of the medicore defensive lines they were playing and the Saints have a better defensive line then the majority of the teams the Colts played this season and because of that they have a good chance at getting at Manning.

I think some of you are way overlooking what the Saints are capable of doing against the Colts.

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