| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 12:07:57 AM | like you OP, one of my parents was alcoholic and he abused my mom, every now and then. i was in essence her mom and i took him on and "won". i found my voice slowly but surely and learned to become a "leader". but my attractions were always to the artsy craftsy and musician types and often the very brilliant and sometimes the brooders. i did not fit into the average high school scene and even in college i was at saint adrians' art bar in the village, actually "protected" by some pretty famous people who were older than i and back then had some integrity. i was only 16 in college.
i met my first husband in grad school. he was a good friend and five years older. we were brilliant together and his "drinking" got worse in our professional life. there was no closeness (aside from sexuality) unless he was the older and wiser one, and i too became his enabler. but slowly i evolved and he did not appreciate my equal fame and fortune. he found another younger professional woman who was content to have his child while he was married to me and for a period of time, this MBA woman became a housekeeper. he clearly had the upper hand and she had the money she desired. after divorce, we worked often together and i let him think he could have me back--just to get even. when he tried, i turned him down. later i became friendly with her. i realized i could have destroyed their relationship in the name of revenge and for what purpose? i forgave him, her, myself and moved on.
my second husband was an engineer. he was not artistic but i thought he was gentle and kind. that nightmare marriage turned into a scenario from hell. he clearly misrepresented himself to me, employers and his family. my mistake was not to get out sooner, but i stayed to secure and make safe, my adopted teens. i clearly was in denial but also with a lot on my plate.
my last love had depression and had bouts of blaming me for all sorts of strange and undeserved things. i forgive him three times too often. we had a passionate beginning and a dour ending. i tried to keep the friendship going, as i knew that depression was an illness. but although he didn't believe in medication, he self medicates with drinking and thus the underlying cause of the undeserved rage towards me. he sobbed when i left him. go figure.
i am not sure i destroyed past relationships, but i sure did help to preserve destructive relationships. i've had my fill of dysfunctional people. i still make mistakes, but i move on and away quickly when i see the signs.
i have learned to be proud of who i am and what i stand for. i no longer take any barbs from messed up men and i do my best to remove them from the atmosphere that i operate within. i don't want to breathe the same air with them any more. however, i do give people chances, i take risks, i don't judge superficially, and i forgive. forgiveness is letting go, not standing around as target practice for dysfunction. it doesn't mean you are wrong. but lack of forgiveness is an energy drain.
i give a lot and now i know that i deserve the same. immediate gratification was probably my underlying modus operandi. i try now to connect on all levels with different people while i sort out who it is who will be my next partner of a very different plane than which i operated on before. it takes focus, not giving up, forces of nature, and trust that it will happen. i really do trust that which i call Higher Power--HP is the fond nickname i give to that underlying force that has managed to buoy me up throughtout my life. haven't succeeded "yet" in the partner department, but i have been successful in many other aspects of my life. why? because i worked it. the saying goes: it works, if you work it! "it" being life.
my next partner will be a good friend and he will make me feel good about myself and vice versa. i don't think that's a tall order, do you? | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 12:30:21 AM | Only you can make YOU feel good. None can control that inner part of you and when you let them you loose yourself.
I had a long term after my divorce.( 10 years) I did not want to marry. We both lived in seperate homes. I had daughters to rasie. We traveled and went everywhere together, when he pushed the marriage thing ( i would loose alimoney and retirment funds) I said NO. He walked. Sad to say he was the one that got away. But I never depended on him to make me happy. We shared much happiness and I will miss him forever. Happiness is in ones self. If some one does not make you happy look at yourslef to see why.
My marriage was set on my husbands ego. The higher he grew on the corporate ladder the more obxious he became. I held on to my values. Divorced him he later remarried and had a different life.
The choices we make follow us forever. I would love to have another long term.
I don't need much. But affection and careing are key.   | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 3:16:30 PM |
I'm curious to hear what others might say. Below is in regards to my most recent marriage which ended 4 yrs ago. Unfortunately, much of the same behavior was apparent throughout the others. Being a caretaker and an enabler is difficult to break away from. I was raised to be that way by an alcoholic mother. But I think I finally have succeeded in ending the cycle.
The enabler part is a main concern. I was guilty of enabling a seriously non-social wife to use the friends I made, as her excuse to have friends, outside the marriage. Maybe I've always been a "fixer", but it took the next 3 LTR's to recognize that fact. I was drawn to the same type person, and soon found out that my gregarious nature is not a fix for what's already wrong with another.
OK, next time, I have some flags set in my brain.  | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 5:52:48 PM | ...When my first marriage ended.....I can honestly say I had no idea it was coming...I was totally broadsided. Silly me, and here I thought we had a good thing going. What can I say, I was young, naive and foolishly in love.
...I take most of the responsiblity for the beginning and the end to that marriage. I didn't pay attention to the red flags...I was too swept up in the romance. Jumped in too quick and got burned...totally my fault. Like the OP, I thought I could save him from himself... instead I followed him along on his little journey to nowhere....not to say I was into the drugs or alcohol, but I too was an enabler. He had deep seeded emotional problems that I would never have been able to *fix* It was a shame too cause he was such a wonderful person otherwise.
...maeflowers | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 6:09:17 PM | Well ... there was the cyanide in the sticky buns trick. That worked well. The dynamite sticks on the back of the toilet were effective, but awful messy. I suppose the most successful was faking my own death as tanganyikan*guy to return as ... well ... you know ...
cdn guy | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 7:34:33 PM | | Looking back, I think I failed my marriage by being a doormat. I worked a job 50 hours a week, cleaned house, did laundry, washed cars and had them serviced, ironed all his clothes, made homecooked meals, grocery shopped and waited on him hand and foot. He ended up cheating on me and then told me I bored him. FFS bored him? I was exhausted. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/26/2008 10:46:17 PM | I don't believe I helped destroy my prior relationships, at least the last two big ones. Like you, OP, I may be a bit of a "fixer" and a carer, honestly learned from childhood experience, but all that has served me was to hang in when others would have walked.
What I have learned is to avoid falling into the types of relationships that need fixing. I have learned to heed red flags early on and sadly, that may prevent me from bonding into new relationships. One of my biggest red flags from those two relationships is avoiding men who do the "head over heels" thing way too early, way before they can really know me. I have come to believe that the strays at my age who are free floating in the pond are free for a reason. Many are incapable of having a long relationship. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/27/2008 6:36:18 AM | I think that if you form a relationship, then you are also part of the destruction of that relationship. Of course, its certainly true that you can get into a relationship with someone who is a drug addict, alcoholic, or psychotic in some way, and you are justified in the destruction of the relationship for your own preservation or the safety of your children, but you do act to destroy the relationship which you previously acted to create.
Many failed and failing relationships that I have seen, outside of the cases cited above, appear to me to be the result of a downward spiral of increasing bad habits developed over the years that a couple is together. Little things produce patterns of interaction that are irritating instead of soothing, each on causing the other to armour themselves against the next slight. After a while it gets to the stage where each knows how the other will react, and communication becomes negative and stylized until it stops altogether, or amplifies to constant fighting and negativism. The relationship breaks down.
Its clearly a case of "It takes 2 to tango". The only way out of the spiral is to break the multitude of bad reaction habits, something that requires either a lot of personal discipline, or the help of a counselor. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/27/2008 6:59:58 AM | Wow. "Destroy" is such a harsh and violent word! In that context, I haven't ever destroyed a relationship. I do think my previous relationships served their purposes at their times, and then ended when they needed to. And, I learned something from every one.
At this rate, I may finally be evolved by the time I reach the age of 90!  | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/27/2008 7:49:41 AM | Indeed............i figure i am doin ok...cuz i see many my age still thinkin it was someone else's responsibility instead picking up my choice to be in the relationship to BEGIN with.
that denial door was not easy to open...infact i would go so far as to say...the destiny door is always the difficult door ..the hard choice almost never the easy path....
i used the easy door for the first part of my life and now it is time to start kickin the difficult door. .......(denial is the easy path)
the doggie door is for human's who sit in denial and expect to enable the denial to....sorry sometimes you use nice and you end up in the ENABLE hole.
does not excuse the adult responsibility to have justice to self first always...or not risk expectation without gravity to back it up!........and hold for trust to proove
respect to self first.
for the victim: I realized at one point... if you want to be in the big girl pasture you need to hold your adult choices and not pawn the responsibility of the effects into revictimizing yourself. I learned to draw anger and recognize it as confusion and not take that personal...to allow yourself the dignity of forgiveness you must own the adult who made the choice to be in the relationship from the first day...not the day you got mad...the entire block of time....(to aide those who can notfind) forgiveness is on the other side of that reality... .....................promise you. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/28/2008 1:50:17 PM | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^......................................................
My mistake was trusting in everything my ex-husband told me. Not listening to my own gut feelings when answering no to the marriage question the first two times.
Yes.. I have learned a great deal since then.. I was only 21 when I said yes.. the one and only time.
I haven't been in a relationship that held up for more than a few months since then.
I don't think it's fear on my part.. just.. seems the men in my area are full of fear.. or.. full of sh*t! Either way.. I'm still here lookin.
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/28/2008 3:46:51 PM | Like a lot of people, I have been a "fixer" and an enabler in the past. I fixed messes that had been made. Instead of getting angry when I should have been, I made excuses for irrational or unacceptable behavior. I did this because I did not had the greatest childhood, and I understood what being damaged was all about.
We cannot control what is done to us, to some extent. Past hurt and bitterness can consume a person and affect everything that they touch. How we choose to deal with it, is entirely within our power and is our responsibility to change. Instead of reacting out of pain and fear, we should respond with consideration and love. That does not mean fixing things for them.
When I really reflected on it... I realized that where I had worked hard in therapy and life to put my baggage and pain behind me, many people never seemed to do that. I see a lot of people that completely lack the ability for intelligent and honest self reflection. They just scramble around and try to avoid any hint of pain, because they think that any pain is bad.
Pain is not bad at all, it's an important part of life. It lets us know we are alive. It instructs us if we are willing to experience it fully and allow it to fully illuminate the corners of ourselves where we can hide. When we know pain intimately, we appreciate joy for what it truly is.
My compassion for their situation was not only hurting myself, but them as well. I put up with abuse, passive manipulation, until I got to the end of my rope.
So now, I try to walk in a balance myself. I attempt to make sure that I look at things as objectively as possible. When I see a red flag, I try to dig deeper and find out what is being communicated by the action. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/28/2008 4:10:59 PM | Damnit Momi, will you marry ME next? Your post is chock full of wisdom and "gettin' it".
So many blame everyone else, refuse to do their own work and end up wondering what the fvck happened....
If a relationship failed, you can bet you had something to do with it. No, maybe you didn't ask to be cheated on, or beat or manipulated.... but at some point a choice was made by you.
The trick is figuring out your part in it and making better choices next time.
Momi? About that next time................... you know where to find me. *snort
(oh relax people.... she knows I'm kidding..... sorta..... lol) | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/28/2008 4:17:54 PM | OP, I can relate to you by being raised by an alcoholic mother.
During my upbringing, along with my 2 brothers, were faced with many divorces.
All our stepfathers were abusive alcoholics and served as bad role models as far as caring father figures.
The problem with me is being brought up like this - no history of stability in my family. After witnessing so many divorces in my childhood; I don't believe in marriage. My belief has destroyed any chances on getting married. I know I've upset some women who confessed that they thought of marrying me and were stunned when things ended up with a break up. They were confused and mad at me. I don't blame them.
I've also brought up to be independent. As the oldest son, my mother depended on me to take care of things while she worked. My mother's going out and getting drunk after work every night took away money to pay for living expenses, so I had to get a job (by her demands) and start paying rent at the age of 13. Of course, I struggled at school because I was doing so much at home. I learned to multitask: working; taking care of the house and brothers; and doing homework. This made me very independent on myself.
I think my independence and not wanting anyone to occupy my life is another downfall. I'm very uncomfortable when someone wants to do something for me, I feel that I don't deserve anyone fussing over me. and I know that women want to feel a part of a relationship by doing things for their partners and therefore, get a self gratification for being involved. I always denied that from women.
My parents pretty much abandoned my brothers and me. That abandonment stays with you and on a psychological level - has become a hidden fear of mine being close in a relationship. I feel if I end the relationship, I don't have to fear that I will be abandoned. I've walked away from many good relationships.
I can understand why my life is what it is. Not saying I'm totally happy not having someone in my life. But I have to go on and accept it.
I've given up trying on going out dating. I've destroyed my profile in here and decided just to use this site for the forums. It's comforting that I know through forums that I'm not alone being scarred by alcoholism. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/29/2008 12:24:40 PM | First of all for a great thread and being brave enough to be first. Enabling is a tough one to break, it seems as if your being told to stop doing good when someone tells you to stop "helping" but at least you recognize it.
For the old parrothead i did in marriage number one by devoting time to myself and what i wanted and by drinking like a damm fish. those two things led to most of the problems. now my ex was not wife of the year either but if i had cleaned up my act she might have done hers as well. being partners and supporting each other is what its all about.
marriage number two was just me being dumb. i got involved with the wrong person at the wrong time and it was hell for over four of the five years we were together. my part in that was getting involved at all. i admit that distrust on my part, especially when she started manifesting money issues, was a big part of it but the real mistake was getting involved at all.
since then the thing that has hampered any attempt at relationship has been not being fully recovered from the past. i had/have lots of trust issues and when things get close i get scared and back off leaving a good woman (or most of the time a good woman) puzzled as hell as to what just happened. its getting better. the problem you recognize and own up to can be fixed, no matter how bad. the one you refuse to admit will never be helped.  | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/29/2008 5:33:02 PM |
Why are you asking others this question? You should be asking yourself, with the assistance of a therapist. That would be more effective in helping you move on with your life.
Judith
Judith, you obviously didn't read my opening post. I have spent a number of years in therapy in order to understand and counteract how my childhood made me into the enabler, caretaker and co-dependent personality I was for most of my life. I have moved on with my life and have found balance and acceptance in who I am. I was not asking others for advice. I was asking them to share their experiences and revelations in their own failed relationships. Perhaps, you should try reading the opening post before you jump to conclusions as to what is being discussed. Just a thought. | |
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| How did you help destroy prior relationships and what has it taught you?
Posted: 11/29/2008 5:46:35 PM | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^................................................
"Pain is not bad at all, it's an important part of life. It lets us know we are alive."
Well.. Mominatrix..
I guess that all depends on what type of pain we're talking about. Physical pain from an abuser.. is never a good thing. Fighting to survive.. is rough. JMO | |
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