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| was in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 7:14:23 PM | cubanguy has said exactly where you should be heading with this.. situation.
I was living less of a life as you are now and believe me stick around any longer and all you are doing is adding more fuel to the pain bank of hell. I read Dr.Phils book entitled ,Self Matters and after I was done recognizing that I was brainwashing myself into believing that this was a normal existence I left and never looked back.
One very important pot sticker for me was when he detailed in the book that an addict is a person that you don't really know because the addiction has taken over their lives and you are truly unaware of the personality .. so you are not loving a person you are in love with an addict and that is in itself an unhealthy relationship. Love if you own it means you keep all that are important to you away from the addict or they will drag you with them as far down as you want to go.. and having your children around an addict is irresponsible and you need to get that issue under control immediatey .. you have no right to subject your children to a monster of their own addiction. The guy needs professional help and it is totally going to be an individual choice to get his life sober .. but if you stick around he will never respect you and you will always be someone to use.. you need to stay away deal with the pain you have inflicted on yourself and get healthy.
I do know it can be done.. I am a survivor of seeing into what was .. and am very glad that I made the choice to realize that my life and my emotions were being invested in the univestable and now .. I am so not the person I was.. you need to walk away for you and your identity as a good strong woman and a protective mother.
There is only one person you can change and it ain't the binge man.. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 9:18:48 PM |
And this commet makes you a good guy? Alrighty then
No it doesn't make me a good guy..i'm just fed up of grown women asking silly questions that should not be asked..she asked a very stupid question to be quite honest....at 48 or whatever she is i cant believe she is asking such a question | |
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| was in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 9:24:02 PM | I grew up with an alcoholic father who made our lives miserable. He was wonderful when not drinking, but those days didn't come too often. My mother is now happily remarried to another man, and she doesn't have to deal with that life anymore. Neither do I.
If he is really suicidal, it is dangerous to have your children around him. People kills themselves and loved ones every day. For some reason, you don't seem able to get away from him. Why not? No one else is your responsiblity!! You and your children are your responsibility, and truthfully, you are doing harm to yourself and your children by staying with this man. My mother would tell me that she stayed with my father for my sake. It certainly wasn't for my sake. He made my life h*ll!
I once read the book "Codependent No More." I see someone else on this thread already mentioned it. You might want to pick up a copy or get some therapy to see why you are putting up with this. Al-Anon might be a good group, but I've never been. I can understand needing support, but make sure it's support to get away from him not to put up with more of his behavior.
I'd rather be alone than with someone like this. I have never accepted an alcoholic into my life because I know the damage it did to my family growing up. I felt I was never the same for what I had to put up with. Don't do this to your kids! | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 9:43:35 PM | i'm just fed up of grown women asking silly questions that should not be asked..she asked a very stupid question to be quite honest..at 48 or whatever she is i cant believe she is asking such a question
and I'm sick of 20 somethings appointing themselves the question police...
she can ask whatever she likes, this is a public forum, if you don't like the post then don't read it and move on... | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 9:43:58 PM | 2dolphins, as a professional person that as worked with alcoholics and drug addicts, you have two choices leave b/c he is the only one that can help himself or stay with him and be miserable. He will get worse that is the nature of his disease.
You can get all the professional advice you need for free by going to alcholic support group. Just look under AA support group.
And just as a previous poster has stated, alcholics live to manipulate. Is this the kind of person you want as role model for your children?? I rather be alone the rest of my life than live the kind of life you and your children will live with an alcholic. This man is a train wreck, he has already began to get abusive, the black out, unable to keep a job. If he is willing to go to AA and follow their rules and regulations is the only salvation for him.
You on the other hand have to think about your children. I urge you to go to AA or leave this man. He will drag you and your children down with him. And just think, if he has not changed in four years he might never change. Why do you think his parent are getting away from him?? Best of luck to you | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 9:46:15 PM | | its hard to do but you have to walk out ,,,, he needs serious help until he gets t u shouldnt be near him ... | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 10:01:00 PM | Please read this; it was from a previous post I read last year. I know it has nothing to do with someone being an alcoholic, but my ex was an alcoholic and this is how mine started and I ran and yes I went back as well. I went threw what you are now , you want to stay for the kids, but believe me kids are smart and know when something is wrong. But I finally said I had enough. Best thing I ever did for me and my son.
HE GAVE ME FLOWERS
I got flowers today. It wasn't my birthday or any other special day.
We had our first argument last night and he said a lot of cruel things
that really hurt me. I know that he is sorry and didn't mean to say the
things he said - because he sent me flowers today.
I got flowers today. It wasn't our anniversary or any other special day.
Last night he threw me into a wall and then started to choke me.
It seemed like a nightmare but you wake up from nightmares to find
that they aren't real. I woke up this morning sore and bruised all over.
I know he must be sorry - because he sent me flowers today.
I got flowers today. And it wasn't Valentines Day or any other special
day. Last night he beat me and threatened to kill me.
Makeup and long sleeves didn't hide the cuts and bruises this time.
I couldn't go to work because I didn't want anyone to know
But I know he is sorry - because he sent me flowers today.
I got flowers today and it wasn't Mother's Day or any other special day.
Last night he beat me again and it was much worse than all the other
times. If I leave him what will I do? How will I take care of the kids?
What about money? I'm afraid of him and too scared to leave him!
But he must be sorry - because he sent me flowers today.
I got flowers today. Today was a very special day.
It was the day of my funeral.
Last night he finally killed me. I was beaten to death.
If only I would have gathered enough courage and strength to leave him.
So I got flowers today - for the very last time.
~Author Unknown | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/8/2009 10:38:36 PM | Hey 2dolphins...
Let me tell you as a nurse who has worked with substance abuse and psychiatric illness ( and yes, alcoholism, is an illness) as well as someone who has "been there"...you need to let go of your guilt and let go of him....I know this is the hardest thing to do. You said you "provoke it"...there is NOTHING YOU can do to make an alcoholic drink...it is a sickness and a choice. DO NOT accept the blame for what he is doing. They are very good at placing blame, apologizing, making promises and doing whatever they need to do to keep you enveloped in their cyle and let you keep enabling him.
I was abused physically,emotionally and sexually( when he could still perform) It seemed the more he drank the more "powerful" he became over me.
He would have days where he would go without a drink, admit he had a problem, and ask me for help...he would tell me NOT to allow alcohol in the house, buy it for him, or let him go out....of course, that didn't work...he got it when he wanted it, usually from other women. I offered him support, treatment and anything and everything he would need to get help. Not only was he abusive to me, but to my son as well, who was really the only male role model in his life. It interferred with a very prominent work position that I had, my child's life and mine and those around me, as I was afraid to answer the phone, the door, or go anywhere, for fear of what would happen, and who might find out. I isolated myself from everyone. He would leave and not come back...I didn't know if he was once again with another woman, dead in a ditch or whatever. He ALWAYS apologized, and claimed not to remember a thing. He too, could not hold down a job.
The last straw was when I was held at gunpoint for 12 hours with a shotgun, while he drank the day away...he told me he was going to kill me... he beat me, verbally abused me and raped me. I always thought I could "handle" it, but the truth is you can't. Especially not alone. After the event was over and I was taken to a safe house, I left the next day, leaving most of my belongings, the farm, the animals and all that I had worked for, and moved away.
Now Alanon and AA are helpful for those who have been in the cycle...they also have groups for children, who are also very much affected.
I guess the bottom line here is this: YOU cannot help him....HE has to WANT to help himself...he has to hit rock bottom, and realize what he's done. Do not let guilt lead your life....he has a choice to change, and has, at this point made it obvious that he chooses alcohol over you and his life.
Remember that your life and your children's lives are much more important than the roller coaster cycle that you are going through, and that he is not your responsibility...look for help for you and your kids to work through your emotions, and lastly, do not believe for a second that he has or will change until he has gone through treatment and remained sober for a significant period of time, while continuing to seek help and face his addiction on a daily basis.
I wish you the best of luck! I know all of this is easier said than done...but you can be strong! Hang in there!  | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/9/2009 6:53:03 PM | want to thank everyone for helping me clear my thinking
I thought we could still be friends but of course he wanted more and I understand that
I am not blameless,
but I am also not responsible for him
Amazingly we closed the "book" without any screaming or yelling
and I am loking forward to a good night sleep
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/9/2009 7:27:25 PM |
(in the past he was physical but not for the last 2 years)Claims I provoke it and I expect sometimes I do. I am not blameless. But each time after hes so apologetic, and begs me to not give up on "us
WHOA WHOA WHOA there dolphins, first off let me say how big a problem I have with this pattern of thought! You are NOT in any way responsible, or are to blame in this matter, those are the words spoken by someone that has lived through and with an abusive partner and the brainwashing they have gone through. My father was the same exact way, while on his benders and he would ALWAYS blame everyone else, especially my mother, for ALL of his violent out bursts and mental cruelty and I have got to say this, you are a fantastic and beautiful woman and in NO way are you to blame for ANY of this nor do you or did you deserve any of this BS he put you through. As many have stated before, he has put you in the enabler position and you simply have to walk away from him and not look back no matter what happens to him. You are NOT to blame for his position nor are you nor "should" you be responsible for him or his life. For cryin out loud he is 46 FFS, it's way past time for him to become a man and cowboy up and take control of his own life and clean up ALL of his messes. As long as he thinks or knows you are there and might help or bail him out of his messes he will NEVER do it, so that is another reason you have to walk away, and as far as your kids go, he cannot be making a very good impression on them with his drinking and his sh*tty behavior. For their sake as well as yours and your sanity, you simply have to just walk away and never look back no matter what he says or what happens. He needs to hit rock bottom and be there a while before he will decide to turn his life around. So, again, you ARE a great woman who has put up with a lot and deserve so much better. I wish you much luck with what you know in your heart what has to be done. | |
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| in love with alcoholic (Update 1/9/2009)
Posted: 1/9/2009 11:05:47 PM | I thought we could still be friends but of course he wanted more and I understand that
I am not blameless,
but I am also not responsible for him
Amazingly we closed the "book" without any screaming or yelling
and I am loking forward to a good night sleep
With your past work with Alanon, you could be so much more to him without ever even having a physical relationship again. You were in love with a man, not a disease. The man has a disease which no Doctor can cure. Most people who get his disease die from it, or die with it.
Wise men have said to allow the grieving man his drink. You haven't stated what he grieves about, but there might be something in his past. Most alcoholism is genetic, but it isn't always. I have heard the "hole in the heart" theory, and there are many others. Abuse as a child, military records, criminal records, and other miseries can bring on the disease.
His 51 sober days were a sign that he wants to work, and the majority of alcholics take it one day at a time for a good reason. He just started at number one again, or at least he will if he starts again. After 24 hours, he will start on a second day of sobriety. AA doesn't cure the disease, it provides support for the victims on any day they choose to stay sober. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 12:00:01 AM | | Ten million people. Five stories. Migod if I hear this one again I'm gonna scream. It's almost like a bad sitcom. Same script. Different people. This guy is an obvious loser and wants nothing but to play you like a violin and if you continue to give, you'll go down with him. If you have any sense whatsoever, get out, get out, get out! If you don't you're just enabling him. You're playing the "victim/rescuer" game and it's one you can NOT win. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 12:29:34 AM | You are enabling him to continue with his bad behavior by always taking him back. Time for some Tough love! All sounds very dysfunctional. Why are you letting your kids be involved in this saw-saw relationship? Unless he gets help there is nothing you can do. He has to get professional help.
A friend of mine husband was an alcoholic, he drank himself to death (three days before Christmas, 2008) and he was only 41. Such a waste of a life.
Tell him you will see him after he has sought professional help. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 2:53:40 AM |
Amazingly we closed the "book" without any screaming or yelling
I highly doubt that the book is fully closed.... just give him a few days to think up some new story, some new promise.
This is the time you need to take care of yourself. Change your numbers to unlisted. Look for a support group for yourself and possibly your children. It can be Alnon as a stepping stone to another support group... but Alnon can be a start. Reflect. Start a journal on your experiences with this man. Often partners of alcoholics or any other addict start remembering only the "good" times. And often minimise the "bad" times. A journal can be a tool to help you stop your own relapse into this unhealthy relatioship. Journal everything that you can remember, read it... and reflect the journey you have gone through. Recite the reasons, you don't want to go there again.
Good luck to you and your family | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 3:42:22 AM | | he needs help, but he has to want to get the help....you can not force him....I know from past experience.....my ex was a big time drinker....you also need to go for counseling, and look into it, because there are alot of free services around.....Let him go and try and move on with your life.... | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 3:50:50 AM | There are a lot of issues at hand here and i'm sure many with similar issues or buttons will touch on them but i think the most important thing here is that you are not making a positive impact on his life so letting him go will be the best course of action. We've all enabled others to be less then they can be or kept them from hitting rock bottom so they get the help they need, but at the end of the day the only way an addict will get better is to hit a rock bottom that will make them want to change the direction of their life. Leaving him will help him in this direction...
Hard as it is it the best course of action for him and if you love him you'll want the best for him even if it doesn't look like the best for him in the short run. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 5:06:20 AM | | Sounds like you're describing my father. He was exactly the same way. Nicest guy in t world when he was well but drinking evntually ruined his life and my mothers life was ruined on account of her refusing to leave him | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 5:43:53 AM | My mother: dead at 42 from alcoholism-related liver failure
My sister: dead at 44 from alcoholism-related kidney failure
The lesson I learned from this? Above all else, you must love yourself. Loving yourself includes taking care of your mind and spirit (OP, you already know that the body is the 3rd element in this equation). There is nothing you can do for an alcoholic. They either find the inner strength to help themselves or they waste away - taking anyone and everyone with them that chooses to stay involved with them.
Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT). You believe in nutrition and exercise for the body to keep it strong, well, CBT is the same for the mind. Ideally, you obtain the services of someone trained in CBT to "provide fuel" for your mind. In lieu of that, seek out some literature to help guide yourself.
I cannot emphasis the next point enough. NEVER UNDERESTIMATE the capability of someone who threatens violence, including suicide. An alcoholic has a severely skewed version of reality and they are capable of ANYTHING.
I leave you with this:
I met a girl years ago and we dated for almost a year. Over the years we have kept in touch and we occasionally saw each other and met for dinner and drinks. The last time I saw her was about 3 years ago. A couple of weeks ago I sat down to read the paper and saw this: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/volusia/orl-slaying2808dec28,0,5469641.story | |
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| in love with alcoholic (Update 1/9/2009)
Posted: 1/10/2009 6:03:09 AM | "You haven't sated what he grieves about, there might be something in his past".
Yes you are correct - his father was a bad alcoholic ( cheated , smashed windows , physical hurt) but was a daily drinker and not a binger and thus able to hold a regular job through his life. Seems he still was able most times to take/coach his son's hockey,and his wife finally left when the 3 sons were in their 20's yet she kept in touch, in their later years they lived next door and now as seniors are back living together.
Every time the man I spoke of drank he couldnt stop, then he'd recover , be very sweet, go to AA 2-3x/week, read, journal, find a new job, usually in management, workout at the gym daily, look like an athlethic wonder, bike for hours , get all healthy. To me the pattern i saw was there would be a "honeymoon " period both with relationships andwhere he would be very appreciative and kind, and with the new job, where he enjoyed the compliments, perks, travel, etc but then after a few weeks it all wore off and then w he was expected to work the longer hours, take the responsibility, first he was ok and did well but if he started getting criticism instead of praise he ended up drinking til he wasnt able to get to work.
He was apparantly sober and working for almost 4 years during his 30's at one job , this was folowing a ?2-4 week inpatient stay at a rehab centre. But those are very expensive, and not working steadily he cant afford that now. He has been in jail, lost his liscense, lost me, lived with each of 2 younger brothers and been kicked out by each.
Perhaps now with me gone and his parents moving where he cant stay with them he will finally hit that "rock bottom"? who knows but I feel good today, a clear conscience that I did everything I could and that it is his responsibility not mine and that to love him as a friend I have done the best thing by ending this , by ending my cycle of enabling . | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 6:04:11 AM | I have one love, a soul mate kind of lover, who is tragically a non-recovering alcoholic at a horrifically young age.
He has been since age 18 and he is now 34.
While sad to witness, I had two very young sons and could not allow the love we shared for each other to be a part of my sons' lives or my life. I continue to watch his slow alcohol induced suicide with heartache and grief. But will do nothing to enable him by participating in it.
I have also had the sad knowledge of dating and being attracted to a coke addict. This is a different kind of hard. Edgier, tougher to witness, more out of control and I feel dangerous. With the young man who was alcoholic there was always the full knowledge and certainty that he was in control of his location, his emotions and would eventually simply fall asleep. He never drives or leaves home while drinking.
The coke addict...drove across states, without knowing. Had flashbacks day and night, spontaneous muscle reactions he couldn't control, wild emotional upheavals. Watching him attempt to do the simplest things, put on a watch, put on a shirt, open the frig door became painful to observe. Such a beautiful man, but so incapable of controlling even his own arms or legs.
For me? I am a control freak. I rarely lose control of anything in my life. Possibly this made these two men more painful for me to have in my own life, or perhaps their influence made me more determined to never lose control of my own.
I don't know.
I know loving them and watching?
Very, very painful to do.
I wouldn't willingly choose it.
Nor would I ever continue to do so.
It only enables their bad choices for their lives. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 6:12:48 AM | thanks Sasha, but I feel strong and i have to say reading all these posts really has helped . I hope others in the same situation, as said by another poster, 500 posts same story different people,
As for changing the numbers - not a good idea, if he couldnt ever try to emailor phone he'd quite possibly show up at the door and I dont want that. 4 yrs ago he broke through a glass door at my last house to get in despite my warning him I would call the policeif he did.
Alanon as some have said may be helpful for some but there are mostly people who plan to stay in the relationships, I did go to some meetings and most were saying, "when he drinks just ignore him " cant do that. the "elephant in the living room scenario"
I made lists of the good and bad things and i will keep it tucked away. but not too far- the bad side was about 3 x longer than the good. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 6:16:15 AM | if he keeps going like this he will be dead sooner than later the drink has overcome his body and hes allready committing suicide and hes killing everything that loves him .
he has to do something now or he will pass the point of no return the body can only be poisoned for so long then it quits repairing itselve
its life or death now | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/10/2009 6:38:02 AM | When you feel that someone is your soul mate it is harder to stay firm and stay away from them through such things as this. When you realize that your children had feelings for them then you feel guilty about leaving especially when their own father was not much of a father but in the end it is a relief to leave and to live once again.
Time heals the heartache and you begin to know yourself and love yourself. The children are much better off even if they sometimes act like they are not. Changes are always hard but often very necessary.
Been there........done that and I agree with most of what everyone else has said. I do think that Alanon is only a stepping stone and that most people in Alanon are trying to stay with the partner. I don't recommend that. It takes way too much away from you, your heart, your soul, your physical and emotional health and you could very well die before them either by their hands or by the toll that it takes on you.
Today, I focus on my brothers and my father as they were no way like my former husbands and much more like the man I need in my life. My father died two years ago and I still grieve about that as he was one of the best men I've ever known. I believe that if I focus more on him that I can find the man that will treat me and my adult children better. Find a male role model that you can look up to and then head in that direction. Don't get caught up in people who are troubled. They will get help if they want it not because you want it for them. | |
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/12/2009 6:34:06 AM | If you really felt this person was your soulmate, and you broke up, but he hit his "rock bottom and finally sobered up and asked to try again how long would you wait- til he was sober a year? til he had worked at one job full-time for a year? or never- just not any chance it could work?
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| in love with alcoholic
Posted: 1/20/2009 6:50:53 PM | 2dolphins, I share your anguish of still being emotionally involved with an alcoholic you once loved. I'm probably in worse shape than you, as I have made this futile attempt to be the rescuer at least *four* times in my dating life.
Like you, I've been thru the suicidal partner thing. It was only after being with "B" for two years that I learned she had already attempted suicide twice before I met her. Our three-year relationship finally ended with her third suicide attemptjust over a year ago -- this time with a large-calibre firearm. Fortunately, she missed.
My advice is to always remember these alcholic people are suffering from a genetically-transmitted mental illness, and will always be ill -- as their children probably will be.
We enablers need to stop trying to save these people and spend our remaining mental and romantic energy on other, more promising social prospects. | |
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