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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 5:47:15 PM | Just as every woman who complains about a deadbeat is told 'you chose him".
Well, if the woman you had children with is a POS that would take support for her children and not use it on them, well, ya chose her, didnt ya.
Im all for recievers of support showing proof of where the money goes.I am required to do so, social security requires recipients to show proof of payment, (my children recive survivors pay thru the taxes my husband paid into social security) though i think that live fathers paying support have the right to see where the money goes, not just the dead fathers. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 5:59:32 PM |
though i think that live fathers paying support have the right to see where the money goes, not just the dead fathers.
Not sure what you meant by the dead fathers part...
My personal thought on how child support is handled should be as such:
A portion of the money never even reaches the custodial parents hands, but rather is forwarded directly to things such as rent, electric, utilities, etc.
Another portion of the money still doesn't reach the custodial parents hands, but is rather moved to an account in the children's names for when they turn 18, then they can use the money for college or a downpayment on a house or whatever they want to.
The rest of the money is put on a card, and that card can be used to buy food, diapers, clothes, school supplies, etc. All money spent from the card must have a receipt as to where it went and must be sent to the child support office on a monthly basis to be put in a file where the non-custodial parent can have access to it if he so desires.
I can't think of a more fair, more useful use of the money. In this scenario, not only does the kid(s) see immediate benefits, but they also have future benefits, and the custodial parent gets a little break on their rent/utilities. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 6:43:29 PM | Mr. B...you are forgetting something very important....standard of living should be relatively the same for children post divorce as it was pre-divorce.
Also if one parent makes substantially more money than the other parent, that parent can easily become the "good" parent and the parent who can afford less becomes the "bad" parent.
Dad takes us on a cruise every year for March break.
Mom never takes us anywhere.
Dad loves me more than Mom.
This is the main reason why family support tables consider the income of the parties. What I think though is that the NCP support amount should be offset by the amount the CP would pay the NCP if the situation were reversed. Since both parents have to maintain a home for the children, they both have expenses to cover. I also think more custody should be 50/50 unless one parent doesn't want it that way.
Chieftan - I hope you realize that you sound like a total control freak, right? You don't have a right to control the finances of your ex, even though you might want to. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 7:06:21 PM | The problems with support are many...
Often, the support order for child support is much more than would be spent raising the child if the parents were still together...
In British Columbia(Canda for the geograhpically impaired) a few years back, the Family Services collection office was turning a profit. In other words, after they collected the money from paying spouses, they paid for all the overhead and infrastructure, wages etc. To top it off, they made a profit, even despite the number of non-paying "dead-beat" parents. To do this, they were taking the support payments by good payors, and giving their spouses, less than the full payment received, then clawing back other assistance payments... | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 7:39:41 PM |
Mr. B...you are forgetting something very important....standard of living should be relatively the same for children post divorce as it was pre-divorce.
It would be nice if it could work that way. I don't like to do this, but I'll use my own situation for a moment. When my ex and I split up, we were both making under $30,000/year, with her making $6,000/year less than I was... gross. With the child related tax credits, benefits, and subsidies she was receiving from the government, she was bringing in about an additional $6,000/year tax free. I would have to make about an additional $9,000/year gross to net that same money, so now she has a greater source of income. Now it's tough enough to maintain the same standard of living post-divorce when you turn one two-income household into two single income households, but imagine the difference in standards between the two when you now take another 10% out of one and move it to the household that already has the higher cashflow. Is the standard of living staying the same?
Wonderful concept, just not really achievable. Changes in the standard of living are inevitable.
Also if one parent makes substantially more money than the other parent, that parent can easily become the "good" parent and the parent who can afford less becomes the "bad" parent.
But the courts don't take that into account. They simply say, "You spend less time with your child, you pay," even if you're not the one with the higher income. I believe I once read something where someone said Calfornia handles it the way you suggest, but that doesn't happen in Canada. Ensuring the standard of living isn't the goal here, that's just legal pillow talk.
What I think though is that the NCP support amount should be offset by the amount the CP would pay the NCP if the situation were reversed. Since both parents have to maintain a home for the children, they both have expenses to cover. I also think more custody should be 50/50 unless one parent doesn't want it that way.
Ideally, for children, that would be he best way to handle it in as many cases as it's actually possible. Think that'll ever happen? If there was ever a resource centre where people could get legal information from legal experts who had no vested interest in their case it might. But as long as people have to rely on getting their advice from lawyers who are only looking to milk them for every last penny they can get from them... nuh uh. Just a lot more hate, anger, and resentment to follow I'm afraid. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 8:19:55 PM | Sorry i wasnt more clear cheiftan, my husband died, and when he died i got a letter from social security telling me that they would be paying my children support in the form of survivors benefits, annually, i am required to account for every dime of that money, now i actually dont even spend it i put it an account so i can send off to college, but even that i have to prove that i havent 'partied the money away at the bar", or what have you.
Now i wonder, WHY, are mothers recieving pay from live fathers not required to show how the money is spent?
I fully agree with you on your belief on how the support system should work.
I think both parents are equally responsible for the raising of a child, unless one has for whatever reason chose not to ask for support.
I think NCP's would be wiling to pay their fair share if they had documented proof that the money was going to better their kids lives.
I don think thats 'controlling", but just wanting to know where your money goes. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 8:45:52 PM |
Chieftan - I hope you realize that you sound like a total control freak, right? You don't have a right to control the finances of your ex, even though you might want to.
If you say so, lol.
I could care less what she does with HER money. But I"m not talking about her money, I'm talking about the money that I am giving her that is supposed to go to the benefit of our children.
I don't much like the idea that my ex can take child support money and blow it at a bar if she wants to, but I know it happens. Let her use HER money for that. Not the mutual fund that is designed to be a support for our children. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 8:55:20 PM | see I can kind of see the whole money going towards rent or mortgage, utlities, groceries, clothes, etc. I wouldn't have an issue with that in the least. Unfortunately, givng my ex that modum of control would mean the discussions would then become that I bought the more expensive tomatoe sauce rather than the other cheaper generic one. Or that I bought our son sneakers too often or I bought the more expensive brand of diapers..
It doesn't end.. .. its all in the perception of both parties.
Getting someone else to look over our expenses.. hahahah.. just add 40,000 a year to the cost of your settlement for the third party at the child support office to figure it all out!!! | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/11/2009 9:03:13 PM |
see I can kind of see the whole money going towards rent or mortgage, utlities, groceries, clothes, etc. I wouldn't have an issue with that in the least. Unfortunately, givng my ex that modum of control would mean the discussions would then become that I bought the more expensive tomatoe sauce rather than the other cheaper generic one. Or that I bought our son sneakers too often or I bought the more expensive brand of diapers..
I'm not saying that the NCP should have a say in things like that.
My "plan" is pretty much set in place by the child support office.
A portion of the money goes to the rent, utilities, etc. <<--No say from either party on that one
A portion of the money goes to an account for the children to have future access to it <<---no say from either party on that one either
The rest of the money goes to a card, where the ONLY accountability is that the custodial parent spent the money on things that the children NEED (like clothes, food, diapers, etc.) or that benefit the children in some way (toys, dancing classes, etc.). <<--the custodial parent has FULL control over how to spend this money, but it's LIMITED to ONLY be used on things that she has to prove were spent on the child. So it doesn't matter if she bought the most expensive spaghetti sauce, because if she's making dinner, it's likely that the kids are eating it. It only matters that the money is being spent on things that the kids get some benefit out of, and not things like a trip to the bar for the custodial parent, drugs, or any of the other shit that the kids don't get any benefit from.
How anybody can argue with that, is beyond me, unless, of course, we've got custodial parents abusing the child support they receive. IF the custodial parents want money to spend on themselves, they should be seeking ALIMONY. PERIOD. No ifs, ands, or buts. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/12/2009 1:44:57 PM |
I could care less what she does with HER money. But I"m not talking about her money, I'm talking about the money that I am giving her that is supposed to go to the benefit of our children.
I don't much like the idea that my ex can take child support money and blow it at a bar if she wants to, but I know it happens. Let her use HER money for that. Not the mutual fund that is designed to be a support for our children.
Agreed. | |
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Tika75
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Joined: 12/19/2008
Msg: 62 | |
| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/21/2009 3:42:23 PM | All right people....no point in being angry. She is seriously asking for advice. Honey if the state steps in and helps you to get child support....more power to you. In the state of Tennessee, child support is set by what EACH parent makes, not just the non-custodial parent. They set the first court order eight years ago. Another was set three years ago. I'm waiting on it to be reset. And this is why....My daughter has never received anything from her father in eight years. And she is how old??? Eight. No birthday or Christmas gifts. Not even a freaking Glad you are alive card.
And people say get help from the government I went to the government office to seek assistance and this is what I was told...."I'm sorry, but with you working two jobs, we see no reason that you should require assistance. According to the information that you have given us, you make about $128.00 too much a month to receive assistance."
And let me add something to that real quick.....I already hired the attorney, dosen't do any good if he can't keep a job. No check, no garnishment. And to downgrading my lifestyle??? I drive a car from 1989, buy groceries at SaveALot, and clothing and other necessities at WalMart and Dollar General. So get off the soapbox if you want to talk about how single mother's need to downgrade their lifestyles to support their children better. I support my child fine. Maybe some of the people on here need to start talking about the dead beat dad instead of the mom that thinks it would be nice to have a little help raising his child. | |
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Tika75
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Joined: 12/19/2008
Msg: 63 | |
| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/21/2009 3:49:00 PM | | To be perfectly honest....if I had to show where I spent every dime of the child support that I do not receive.....I would gladly do so instead of having to tell my child "I'm sorry but Mom can't afford to do that this week."If it is a need she gets it; but if it is something she wants.....sorry baby, gotta wait till I get the bills paid and we can see what is left over. A left over should be something left after dinner is eaten, not the 10 dollars left after you get your bills paid and fill the car with gas. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/21/2009 9:24:10 PM | Okay, here's my 2 cents...
HE is their father, he should be helping out financially. If the child support was awarded in the divorce and he hasn't paid in 7 months, and the state has just now decided to go after him, I think that the friend of the court has issues also. It is my understanding that if a payer goes more than 4 weeks without paying, a show cause hearing would be scheduled. At the show cause, he would have to tell the judge (or referee) why he has been unable to pay. If he fails to show up or provide a good reason, then he goes to jail/has a bench warrant issued for his arrest. However, speaking from experience, I know friend of the court is not on the ball with this. My oldest sons dad is always behind. I'll go 4-5 months or more without any financial help, then I have to call FOC and point out how long it has been before they do anything. I never count on him paying anything because of this. However, a child has a right to be supported by both parents.
Next, I wasn't completely sure when you said the state was going after him, if you meant FOC or Family services Child support board. IF its family services child support board, they can usually help with ADC (some sort of state funded child support), and allow you to explain why you don't want the fathers wages garnished (I.E.-if it would possibly cause the absent parent to hurt you or the children).
And Finally. If it is through the FOC, there is also a way to protect yourself. First (if you haven't already), file for a personal protection order. If your ex knows where you live, move to a new location (possibly a cheaper one?). DO NOT tell your ex or anyone else he knows where you moved to. Then turn your new address in to FOC. When you turn your new address in to FOC, tell them you have a protective order against your ex, and that you wish to keep any and all information confidential for the purpose 0f you and your childrens safety. Specify your address ,work, and any other contact info. This way FOC will not have to give him your info. However, they will still go after him for the support.
If he is unstable, and you are afraid- don't talk to him. It only encourages his erratic behavior. Your first priority should be the safety of you and your kids. He is a grown man, he will learn to take care of himself if no one is there to do it for him or coddle him. Trying to make his life easier is only hurting/endangering you and yours. | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/21/2009 9:59:47 PM | "And let me add something to that real quick.....I already hired the attorney, dosen't do any good if he can't keep a job. No check, no garnishment. And to downgrading my lifestyle??? I drive a car from 1989, buy groceries at SaveALot, and clothing and other necessities at WalMart and Dollar General. So get off the soapbox if you want to talk about how single mother's need to downgrade their lifestyles to support their children better. I support my child fine. Maybe some of the people on here need to start talking about the dead beat dad instead of the mom that thinks it would be nice to have a little help raising his child."
Kudos to Tika 75. I think they should be coming down on the dead beat parent, not the one who is there taking care of the child day in and day out, keeping the child fed, clothed, sheltered, and healthy. I've been there and had to tell my kids no, because necessities come first. It does hurt.
And in response to the cheiftan- Your comment about how the only people complaining would be the ones miss using the child support. I beg to differ. I think it is completely assanine to think the custodial parent should document where they are spending the money and report back to the ncp about it. We divorced control freaks like you for a reason. We don't have to give you documented lists of what we bought, when we bought it, how much we spent, what time we went in the store, what time we left the store, ect. If you have that much of an issue with not being able to control your ex, maybe you should seek counseling....hmmmm....wonder what your therapists view would be on your controlling nature......do you think they would see it as normal behavior? My god, you and the woman above you who's ex is dead both sound very bitter, jealous, and controlling.....get help!
Yes, I'm the CP. No, I don't miss use the Child support. I don't make enough to miss use any money. What I get goes directly towards the care and well being of my kids. I don't document it, I won't document it, and my exhusband (not my oldest sons father mentioned above), even though he is a control freak- is smart enough to conclude that the money he pays goes towards raising the kids. The more I listen to your case of the gripes, the better he looks! | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 1:21:50 AM | | Im divorced, my so called ex wife left me for my so called est friend when my daughter was 3 months old. Now she is almost 3 years old. I dont make a lot of money and only loan i have is my house. My ex has 2 cars and a house 3 kids 3 diff dads. Im paying 615 a month now and they want to take over 870 now. Its a joke. I have to live also and dont get me wrong I love my daughter. Women use support as a pay check. I do agree. Its all a joke!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 4:48:56 AM |
Im paying 615 a month now and they want to take over 870 now
You know, you'd be hard pressed to spend that kind of money on a 3 year old kid...
How much food and clothing etc can a 3 year old need...????
Even allowing for things such as a rent for a larger place....
Yet, if you're a single adult person, welfare would give you a lot less to pay for your food, rent, clothing etc... If a 3 year old needs more money, then so does someone on welfare... time for the government to pay more.... | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 4:55:49 AM |
think it is completely assanine to think the custodial parent should document where they are spending the money and report back to the ncp about it.
Why?
If there's an issue with defaulted payments or the custodial parent wants more money, then the NCP had better be able to document where EVERY penny goes/went...
I think it's only fair.... We're talking several hundred dollars a month here... in exchange for a few documents... or a little bookkeeping... too much to ask?
Then take less money..... maybe a default minimum rate of child support, unless the custodial parent can PROVE a greater need...
Why is it too hard for a custodial parent to at least make a list or photocopy the receipts????
And this is not to deny proper support for children, it's to deny the custodial parent from supporting HER lifestyle off her Ex.... Which is all too common... | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 5:03:53 AM |
if I had to show where I spent every dime of the child support that I do not receive.....I would gladly do so instead of having to tell my child
You know, it would probably make things easier for a lot of women if they did show a "receipt" for where the money went...
On the whole, most men WANT to provide for their families... they just don't want to feel RIPPED OFF.... and let's face it, a lot of men have no idea what it costs to raise a kid... so showing is better than demanding... might get a bit more co-operation....
If a man can see that hey, child support as it is, isn't cutting it for you, they might be inclined to pay on time, or even toss a few extra bucks into it... or show up with a few supplies on a visit etc...
But if a guy feels he's getting ripped off, he'll dig his heels in and become as stubborn as a mule about every penny.... | |
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Tika75
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Joined: 12/19/2008
Msg: 70 | |
| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 9:13:54 AM | I could care less what she does with HER money. But I"m not talking about her money, I'm talking about the money that I am giving her that is supposed to go to the benefit of our children.
Good Grief, you have got some issues. If I were to actually get a regular child support check, I would first just drop in a dead faint, and then quit my second job so that I would be able to spend more time with my daughter. If that makes me a money grubbing b**** then so be it. I am doing the work of two parents. Plus having to provide enough money for two people because God knows the economy sucks. Not just raising her, but also......going to the parent/teacher conferences, taking her to the doctors, taking her to the zoo, taking her to the park, trying to teach her right from wrong, teaching her about responsibility,(thats a hard one when she never sees her dad....where the h*** is his responsibility)and doing the other same exact same things every other single parent does. So until you know the circumstance of every single individual that has put a posting on here........stop being so dang judgemental. You try raising a kid ALL by yourself with no help from the non-custodial parent or the US Government and then come see me. And if you can sit there and tell me that it is soooooooo easy to raise kids on your own while working two jobs(and trying to do so around the child's schedule because they need time with the parent too) then I will say kudos to you. Until then, stop being a control freak and shut up.
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 10:37:46 AM | hmmmm....wonder what your therapists view would be on your controlling nature......do you think they would see it as normal behavior? My god, you and the woman above you who's ex is dead both sound very bitter, jealous, and controlling.....get help!
Bitter jealous and controlling as to what?
Im all those adjectives because i have no problem showing what i do with my childrens support. If i dont they would lose it and have less cash for college and buying homes when they hit legal age, i think i can do a little book-keeping each month to ensure their future. My husband worked extremely hard for his money and risked his life everyday in his career, i dont see it as trouble to show that it goes where he wanted it to go. He always said if something happened to him to make sure the kids had money set aside for their futures. I honor his wish. I pay for all our day to day needs and wants out of my own pocket so that they have more for their future. We want for nothing. Who the hell am i controlling? Jealous of? Bitter at?
And because i think that maybe more fathers would ante up if they were were shown where their money goes, and that there might be a reduction in women pissing off their childrens support? Whatever.
So whom am i bitter, jealous, and controlling at?
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 11:39:20 AM |
teaching her about responsibility,(thats a hard one when she never sees her dad....where the h*** is his responsibility)and doing the other same exact same things every other single parent does.
Unfortunately, even if you two had stayed together, you probably would still be doing all this stuff by yourself.
People's characters don't really change becaue of relationships or divorce. My own G/F's ex never helped her with the kids while they were married, or even afterwards. His view was it was women's work.
As much as I hate to say it, a lot of men should never have kids. And a lot of women, should look at a man's character more before having kids with that man. All too often, I think women turn a blind eye to certain character flaws, then wonder why the guy is such an ***hole a few years down the road.
It's a pity, but there's not much you can do except be the best parent you can be... | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 11:51:51 AM |
I am terrified about how he will react.. He has always had a bad temper and every action he has had in the last 3 years has said he hates my guts. He has told me he still is in love with me. He has threatened me, called the cops, and made my life hell since the divorce.
I'm literally afraid. Not only for myself, but afraid he will harm himself and the kids need their Dad
Are you SURE the kids need a dad like this???
My first thought... .restraining order! If you're afraid he might hurt you or the kids or himself, then make it so he can't come in contact! This guy sounds like he's off the deep end and needs some serious psycho therapy! If you are not comfortable w/ a restraining order, then I suggest you talk to your lawyers and see about a supervised visitation, and discuss your concerns about his temper and the safety of you and the kids. When it comes down to it, he's been ordered to pay the support.. he hasn't.. that's HIS issue and the state will do what is needed to make him keep his end of the bargain. If he gets pissed, that's his own problem. Had he been paying, he wouldn't be in that boat! | |
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| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/22/2009 7:39:08 PM |
hat's exactly it. YOu nailed it. It's not "child support." It's "ex-wife support" disguised as child support.
Right, cause kids eat air and wear imagination. They live in clouds and breezes pay for braces and medical care! WOOHOO!
I want to live in YOUR world, because the child support ordered in *my* world doesn't even cover half of what my kids cost.
Damn, wish I could find these free kids!
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Tika75
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Joined: 12/19/2008
Msg: 75 | |
| Child support issue has gone through
Posted: 1/25/2009 6:20:12 AM | Right, cause kids eat air and wear imagination. They live in clouds and breezes pay for braces and medical care! WOOHOO!
I want to live in YOUR world, because the child support ordered in *my* world doesn't even cover half of what my kids cost.
Damn, wish I could find these free kids!
Girlfriend, me too.
As much as I hate to say it, a lot of men should never have kids. And a lot of women, should look at a man's character more before having kids with that man. All too often, I think women turn a blind eye to certain character flaws, then wonder why the guy is such an ***hole a few years down the road.
It's a pity, but there's not much you can do except be the best parent you can be...
I am being the best parent I know how to be. And I looked at his character before I had my daughter, but you know what.....people on here talking about women being schemers....men can be too. Women hide the scheming at times....but so do the men. | |
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