| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 10:35:41 PM | | This is never an easy subject to discuss. I can be a firecracker to sometimes Kirota, usually in traffic :) Anyway, with what you described if someone tells me that I would probably be in shock as I still am this evening after hearing it. Myself I probably wouldn't leave in that manner I would stick around, because my heartbreaks for everyone (unborn) in the situation including the woman. I would want to see if I could figure out why she did that, and what could change that type of behavior. What you did was fine imo, people react differently to intense situations like this and I don't fault you for leaving like you did. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 10:35:48 PM |
What do others think........am I just being prudish or would other handle it better than I did?
I'm just curious, for those who are up in arms about this woman having all the abortions, do you or do you not support the "morning after pill"? | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 10:47:50 PM |
am I just being prudish or would other handle it better than I did?
To me it seems you were prudish because you felt you "were going to throw up and then felt so angry that I wanted to punch her," and, "wanted to through a glass of water in this woman's face."
Did you have any evidence she was telling you the truth? Maybe she read you, wanted to control your reaction to her, or see her how she wanted to be seen.
You said
...she is having trouble meeting people.
Maybe she has trouble meeting people because she lies a lot and tells outrageous or shocking stories. Basically, she already knows she is going to be judged so she pushes people away with her stories trying to find someone that see's her worthy enough to be around her despite them.
It seems you took what she said at face value, and then internalized it so that it reflected on your own self image or what you think to be right and wrong. As though her (voiced) behavior was an attack on you.
I don't really see this as "prudish" so much as insecure. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 10:52:06 PM | So why exactly should she be feeling horrible and guilty about this? Do you believe that abortion is murder? But you said you were pro choice and think a woman should be able to do what she wants with her body, so that doesn't seem to fit. Have you been in a situation where you felt guilted into having an abortion / not having an abortion? Should she have to struggle with guilt because you did? You don't need to answer, but I just can't help shake that feeling that something really resonated with you personally to make you react so strongly. That's all I was getting at. Not trying to say that you were "wrong" to feel the way you did.
Where did I say she should feel bad? Never said she should........I just think it shouldn't be spoken like it is something everyone does on their lunch break. I don't want to get into whether I think abortion is right or wrong. I have stated that I think it is a persons choice. I myself would have an abortion if I got pregnant and couldn't take care of the child..........but I would not use it as a way of birth control. Everyone makes mistakes.............8 times is taking it a bit beyond making a mistake........that is making it part of a life style. But, telling me that I must feel guilt of having one or guilt to not have one is trying to tell me that I shouldn't feel the way I do. Could it be that I find it a horrific and totally disgusting that a woman wouldn't spend a $10 on a box of condoms than to use abortion as a way to not have kids. Why not just spend the money to have her tubes tide?
It seems you took what she said at face value, and then internalized it so that it reflected on your own self image or what you think to be right and wrong. As though her (voiced) behavior was an attack on you.
I don't really see this as "prudish" so much as insecur
I have no idea what you are talking about..........how would her having many abortions reflect on my self image? Yes, I did think about what I think is right and wrong. I have that choice.......especially when someone has the choice to have 8 abortions......... | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 11:09:38 PM | Okay.............going to end this great debate here..
Please feel free to go and have all the unprotected sex that you like and have so many abortions that you have no uterine wall left. You are all grown A$$ women and most certainly do have the right to do what ever it is to your body that you choose to. Just please please don't tell me about it. I guess I need to start saying the "Don't ask don't tell" quote when I meet people from now on. There should really be some kind of protocol on when it is appropriate to tell someone you have had 8 abortions and when you are allowed to be upset by the news.
Have a great debate............... | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 11:11:37 PM | But, telling me that I must feel guilt of having one or guilt to not have one is trying to tell me that I shouldn't feel the way I do.
I never said that you must have either had to feel guilt over having or not having an abortion. I was just asking if that was the case as a way of trying to figure out where this wave of anger is coming from. It's easy to say that it is horrific and disgusting - I just thought you might find it more enlightening to self-reflect on *why* you feel it is so horrific and disgusting. But hey, then again, maybe not.
Again, I'm not saying your opinion or your feelings are wrong. Just that they were much stronger than I think most people would have had in that situation. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/13/2009 11:24:01 PM | You were there Kirota, the rest of us were not and we can only base our opinions on what you have told us. It sounds to me like this woman has/had serious emotional issues to have engaged in sex without any forethought or planning. Eight abortions insinuates that she was doing this for a number of years starting in her mid-teens perhaps and continuing into her early twenties? To a teenage, or immature adult, birth control can be an admission of intent. You can't say you didn't mean to if you planned it! So, maybe she has grown up a little since then but still needs to learn to be discrete. Immature people can be very indiscrete and it usually hurts them as happened in this case.
I don't blame you for your reaction. You're only human and some people have a talent for "getting under your skin". I would feel the same way as you did ( Eight times? Wow) and would prefer not to associate with her if she talked about it like it's no big deal. But, consider the possibility that it does bother her and she's "acting tough". Still, it's not your fault and you aren't obliged to associate with her. Don't mention it to your other friend unless she brings it up first and then be gracious about it. Perhaps in time you will learn a little more about this woman's history and it will be possible to accept or, at least, understand her.
Thanks for posting a very interesting question and don't loose any sleep over how you reacted that day. Maybe too many people have heard her story and pretended not to be upset by it and she needed a wake up call.
ExMtlr | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 12:36:14 AM | I would have reacted the same as you did. As a matter of fact when I was 19 and VERY pregnant with my first child I was staying with a young woman who was scared to be alone. Our husbands were on military maneuvers. She decided to tell me that she had had an abortion. She also told me about her husband drinking and driving which resulted in him killing an elderly lady. I told her that they obviously belonged together and stormed out. Four and a half years later I was having complications with my second pregnancy. It was suggested that I abort my baby. At this time I was almost 8 months along. That beautiful little girl is now 21 years old. Had it come to a choice between myself or my baby, I wanted my baby to have a chance at life.
Some seem to think that just because I'm pro-life that means I'm anti-abortion. Not so. I was and am anti-abortion for myself, but I know there are circumstances where an abortion seems to be the only solution. I'm fine with that, but 8 abortions because someone admittedly was too damn lazy to use birth control.  | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 1:45:08 AM | Her body and choice whether or not you agree. Why would you want to beat the hell out of her, she did nothing to you. Some people need a helping hand in this life, next time extend that rather then that holier then thou mind-set of yours. Don't judge another until you have walked a mile in their shoes, so it goes. I don't agree with using abortion as birth control; however, I don't agree that beating someone is the way to go either.
I will say that if we had been out at night in a club or something and she told me that I would have beat the hell out of her.... | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 1:59:50 AM | The reaction in my truest humble opinion was over stated. Storming out? Your reaction. Yours to own. No validation needed.
There are a lot of assumptions that the woman did this without care. Maybe she did. Maybe she didn't. Maybe she had some mental health issues and maybe not. Maybe she was doing so to get a reaction maybe not. She is not the issue and neither are her choices. Perhaps the carefree attitude comes from the fact she may have not been given a choice medically....who's to know what she said was true?
OP had stated that she is very open sexually and can respect that in others. Quite frankly, who is that open about sexuality issues/ interests with individuals one does not know well? Some may view such disregard as rude, inappropriate behaviour. The can of worms were opened by the OP and then the OP is upset by a comment made? Odd.
One can not be pro-choice but have conditions. The parallel argument would be one can wear blue hats. It is their choice afterall. But everyone knows that blue hat dye can run on rainy days so the person who wears the blue hat on a rainy day should be condemned.
If the new-lady-to-lunch was off topic....her inappropriate behaviour could be starting a new lunch topic?
In a civilisation that likes to believe that choice is freedom from persecution then that is what there is. My choice regarding abortion is just that: my choice. My emotional investments are in my choices not someone else's choices. Validation is irrelevant.
MTHO
Shiraz21 | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 6:24:15 AM | I agree ,,,, Abortion is not birth control , these days women can use the morning after pill ,, and of course abstinence .. but sometimes you just have to agree to disagree .... Its her body to do with what she will , whether we agree or not , its her choice to make ... sad but true .. life has a way to teach these people a tough lesson ... it will catch up with her eventually !!!
JMO | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 6:35:48 AM | Im thinkin she was older when abortion was really accepted....in this day and age doing it for a form of contraceptive isnt an option....its irresponsible....to many ways to head a pregnancy off than after the fact...I applaud you.... | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 7:24:19 AM | Give the person a copy of the short flick called "Silent Scream". Where a baby is pictured on a ultra sound sucking his thumb. And the next moment the child is screaming with its mouth open as it shows its head being ripped off. I guarantee you friend will think about that the rest of lher life. 8 babies she did that to without a care.  | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 7:30:13 AM |
Good for you Kirota, I would have done the exact same thing. It disgusts me just hearing that. I know someone who had 2 LIVE-BIRTH ABORTIONS, TWO! The second one was when she was 28 and she had to go to a different state where it was legal at the time. 8 abortions is nuts! I'm pro-choice as long as the decision is made right away and not into live abortion stage.
just seems a little weird..the artificial line drawn there..one can legally abort the fetus..yet if 'born', and you killed it on the first day..that would be 'murder' punishable by years in prison.
a one-day old baby is not able to live on its own without someone taking care of it..
so the artificial 'legal' line seems quite arbitrary..those so supportive of abortion..why not then allow killing a child up to one or two years old, let's say?
rather than 'forcing' someone to keep akid they may not love, may even resent? | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 7:36:28 AM | | Im also prochoice-but could not get along with a female that used as a form of birth control. I grew up in one of the richer counties in NY. We have certain areas though where its a lil more hood then others. Theres this female i heard of coming up-she use to let anybody run trains on her-unprotected. She would insist on guys not wearing condoms-and would wind up gettin pregnant all the time.I heard she had over 20 abortions-I told my friends if she ever wanted to have kids-it would probably be impossible for to hold any kids since she had 20 abortions. Not knocking for anyone that run trains on females-call me selfish or self centered or whatever but i just cant squeeze my d1ck in something someone elses balls just finished slappin against-ewwww.In my late teens,my high shcool sweetheart had an abortion and although i was to young to be a father-i was depressed behind it for a year and half | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 8:41:08 AM |
I would like to comment more but don't want to make this a abortion debate........
You already did by starting this thread.
I'm totally pro-choice and she CHOSE to have an abortion...ok multiple abortions....So what?!
Are you her? Do you have to look at your face every morning thinking of what you did?
Who are we to impose our moral beliefs on her?
You don't know her from a hole in the ground and have absolutely NO RIGHT to judge her. Then again, neither do any of the people who replied on this thread.
It's her body, her life.
Those who live in glass houses always seem to be the first one to throw stones.
I'd just like to say that I'm fairly disgusted with the immaturity level that caused someone to go onto a public forum trashing some unknown person (admittedly to the op) in hopes that a bunch of strangers would validate their belief. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 8:45:09 AM |
Who are we to impose our moral beliefs on her
ah, the old moral relativism argument..no-one has any 'right' to' impose' their morality on anyone else..so riled up are you?
I think most of it do that often.
e.g. some people believe that murder, rape, armed robbery, hard drug trafficking, etc., etc. are OK..I disagree
the nazi SS believed that what they did was OK..I disagree.
kirota did not "impose" her morality on anyone.
she simply chose NOT to 'accept' someone else's morality..or if you like, have that person impose HER morality on kirota..
don't we all have that 'right' as well?
I'd just like to say that I'm fairly disgusted with the immaturity level that caused someone to go onto a public forum trashing some unknown person (admittedly to the op) in hopes that a bunch of strangers would validate their belief.
of course, that is your right...just as it is the right of the rest of us not to care what you think.. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 8:59:10 AM |
I'm sure I probably did over react...........but I was totally disgusted and couldn't have enjoyed my meal anyway
I feel you over reacted. But that is your prerogative. But why waste so much anger on such person. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 9:09:10 AM | Leavemeb.......why should I lower my moral beliefs to match anyone?
If you read all of this you would have realized that the question was.......
Clearly having unprotected sex and using abortion as birth control..........
Where did I say abortion was a bad thing? Where did I even bash her for having unprotected sex.........I believe I said I didn't care because I wasn't having sex with her!!!
Where did not using Abortion as a form of birth control, because we all know safe sex can be had, a moral issue? Well, maybe it is..........but why should I have to lower my morals and except someone like that?
Just as I don't know her from a hole in the ground you don't know me from a whole in the ground.........so there for practice what you so boldly preach........NO RIGHT to judge.
I don't live in a glass house..............I have lived my life the way I see fit. Nope not everyone is going to agree with the way I think........and thank goodness because if we all agreed people like you couldn't try to ride in on a white horse and bash everyone who has different morals than you.
I'd just like to say that I'm fairly disgusted with the immaturity level that caused someone to go onto a public forum trashing some unknown person (admittedly to the op) in hopes that a bunch of strangers would validate their belief.
Where did I trash this woman? Did I call her a slut.......did I call her names? I didn't trash her I said I didn't agree with her using Abortion for birth control and asked if handled the situation the right way or not? Some have said I did and some have said I didn't. I agreed I could have handled it better.........but hind site is always 20/20.
Yet, you must be disgusted with yourself because you just did the same thing.
But, heck if it made you feel better for trashing me totally contradicted your own post.......
Have a great day............smile. I would hate for you to get frown lines. | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 9:52:13 AM | ok wtf.. listen up kirota...
#1 Do NOT send me any emails on here... got that? Confine it to the Forum...
#2 you defy logic here, inexplicably attempting to disprove and contest a remark which YOU yourself WROTE ...
Today you took the liberty to send me an email stating:
“Where did I ever say that I threw a glass of water in her face? Please be more clear on your accusations.
Thank you."
huh?!
Newsflash: it was YOU who stated:
I suddenly wanted to through a glass of water in this woman's face
My response:...
The albeit staggering number of abortions this woman has had, has been mitigated by your “over the top” reaction of revulsion and anger to the extent that you wanted to“throw a glass of water in her face”
Now what part of that don't you get?
To reiterate, Nobody is on here is saying "abortion as birth control" is ok!
However, your over the top aggressive and excessively hostile reaction ( eg stating that you would want to "beat her up" ...wtf is that?) derailed your message, instead resulting in a shift focusing on your inexplicable vitriol
Yeah, it sucks when your own words come back to bite ya in the ass huh?
You know what else sucks?
When a poster misleads everyone on that forum pretending to have a SERIOUS SEXUAL QUESTION when in fact your post is a not so thinly disguised moral/ethical ABORTION DEBATE on how many is too many....And quite predictably, all the looneys came out ranting about abortion, slatherin on about how abortion is murder..another claiming the 8 abortions represented murdering someone else's baby 8 times blah blah......and other psychotic rants..
Next time pls confine this type of Topic to the appropriate Forum.
Thankyou | |
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| A serious sexual question for men and women
Posted: 1/14/2009 12:57:49 PM | | your reaction and reasoning spot on and abortion being for unwanted childbirth not contraception spot on again ...im only dissapointed you didnt throw in an uppercut... | |
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