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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 926 | |
| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/1/2009 8:33:25 PM | Does the END always justify the means.............I think not.
Being foolishly blinded by duty without regard to consequences is hardly a great way to live.
Deontology - A non-consequential approach to evaluating ethics, whereby the degree of ethicalness
depends on the intentions behind the decisions rather than
the outcomes or actions that result.
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/4/2009 8:24:09 AM |
I don't belong to PETA, not do I support them, however it is obvious that their tactics are effective in getting attention. If they quietly existed in the background, no one would have heard of them.
One could use that same sentence for Al Quaida.
"I don't belong to Al Quaida, not do I support them, however it is obvious that their tactics are effective in getting attention. If they quietly existed in the background, no one would have heard of them."
Give me a break.  | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/4/2009 8:41:50 AM | Talk about needing to give it a break. The same could be said for just about ANYTHING, positive, negative, or neutral.
Throwing Al Qaeda in there is weak. Really weak. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/4/2009 9:17:39 AM | | Perhaps, but it's also a lame attempt to bring PETA into the realm of something it is not. That's nothing but silly manipulation. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/4/2009 11:00:30 AM | Something its not?
They support terrorist organsations. Thats not spin- They give money to organsations that are illegal, and commit illegal actions in the hopes of terrorizing the public into accepting their idealogy. They keep people who firebomb schools and labs out on the streets. They ARE a terrorist organzation. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 2:31:39 AM |
Fasting for days at a time (as long as I have fresh water to drink) is not a hardship for me, so I wouldn't succumb right away. I'd last a whole lot longer than any 6' guy conditioned on a McD's diet easily.
Probably not. You might be more *comfortable* fasting, but the 6' guy would have greater fat stores (read energy reserves), and would outlast you.
I occasionally eat fish, because I'm not a vegan, and have no problem doing so. My rationalization is that fish are not factory farmed, at least in your example, so I wouldn't be compromising my principles in any way.
I hope you don't eat salmon, then - because almost 60% of the salmon eaten in North America IS factory farmed. And current estimates say that NON-factory farmed fish will basically be non-existent by 2050, so plan on dying relatively soon. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 6:24:58 AM |
They support terrorist organsations. Thats not spin- They give money to organsations that are illegal, and commit illegal actions in the hopes of terrorizing the public into accepting their idealogy. They keep people who firebomb schools and labs out on the streets. They ARE a terrorist organzation.
Thats quite the opinion. Too bad its not backed up by fact. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 6:34:17 AM |
I hope you don't eat salmon, then - because almost 60% of the salmon eaten in North America IS factory farmed. And current estimates say that NON-factory farmed fish will basically be non-existent by 2050, so plan on dying relatively soon.
This is true. Wild fish are becoming a thing of the past as the oceans are being overfished. Farmed fish cause huge environmental damage, spread disease to remaining wild fish, and contain large mercury content among other chemicals. Most governments advise limiting your fish intake, and even the Iniut of Northern Canada are being poisioned by mercury contamination of the oceans.
You are much better limiting your diet to plant based products, and choosing organically grown whenever possible. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 6:38:38 AM |
I hope you don't eat salmon, then - because almost 60% of the salmon eaten in North America IS factory farmed. And current estimates say that NON-factory farmed fish will basically be non-existent by 2050, so plan on dying relatively soon. It's not difficult to get wild salmon.
I don't understand the comment, "so play on dying relatively soon."
I occasionally eat fish, because I'm not a vegan, Actually, you aren't a vegetarian either. Vegetarian's don't eat fish. Not that there's anything wrong with eating fish. I just never understood the interest in labeling oneself in an inaccurate way. I notice it happens a lot with vegetarianism... people sometimes seem more interested in calling themselves a vegetarian then they are in actually avoiding meat.
"It is far easier for fight for principles then to live up to them." Adlai Stevenson. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 7:22:45 AM |
Actually, you aren't a vegetarian either.
More properly then, a pescatarian who deviates from vegetarianism a half dozen times a year or so . The only exceptions really, happen when I date somebody who wants to go to an upscale restaurant and nothing else is available. It's a compromise so that he feels I am enjoying the date and accepting his hospitality. So I'm satisfied with my label, as I'm not difficult. I also cook meat on the BBQ for dinner parties as well, because it's not my intent to force my friends to eat according to my lifestyle.
so plan on dying relatively soon.
Great advice to a vegetarian, coming from a smoker. Worth every penny I paid for it too!
Namaste....... | |
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 937 | |
| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 9:19:16 AM | Haven't found a ""vegan"" YET who doesn't ever cheat.......they always cheat, always !
100 % means 100% every day, all day, 365/decade
Eat the salad, order 2 of them and just shut up CHEATER | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 9:34:11 AM | ^^^^
To take a person who has made a will power decision regarding their diet and demonize them because they occasionally slip is rather in poor taste.
I know plenty of avid 'healthy' eaters who eat junk food once in a while... doesn't change their status as healthy eaters. I know plenty of 95% vegetarians... (which is probably one of the best diets)
of course if the 'cheater' is also someone who attacks others for moderately eating meat then that is hypocrasy | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 12:17:14 PM |
...."More properly then, a pescatarian "...
I'm a pescatarian, too. I eat seafood, but I am concerned about the heavy metals and factory farming of seafood, so I don't eat seafood every day.
I just listened to a radio show today on NPR where the columnist "Miss Conduct" (similar to Miss Manners) was interviewed, and the discussion came up about how to have a dinner party when your friends all have very different eating styles and issues...Kosher, vegetarian, gluten-free, low-calorie, peanut allergic, etc., etc.,.... and she said that in today's world, we are becoming more and more aware of the diversity of values and lifestyles.
It used to be we all thought of one generic ideal for a person--marriage, family, lifestyle--and to be polite meant only needing to be aware of that set of values. Like writing thank you notes. She said it's ok to have varied lifestyle choices and values and still get along...well, we seem to be working on that. But it isn't ok to wear your lifestyle "in someone's face"...as in; someone is eating a hamburger at a party and you say to them, "Oh, I'm a vegetarian now." It's going to seem judgemental.
Food is so important to our lives; and this makes it even more of an issue when in social situations. We celebrate with food, we socialize with food, we use food as a topic of discussion, we have rituals involving food in almost every religion, we associate food with security, with nurturing, with comfort, and every lifestyle and every generation has its "in" foods. (Hot food, what a concept.) We use certain foods and their availablility or scarcity as status symbols, or symbols of rebellion, during a boycott. Right now, one of the 'in' foods is pomegranates.
Certain foods are almost ritualised in certain sports and recreation. I went to a baseball game last week (our team won!) and I was amazed to find a vegetable wrap at the hot dog stand, and hard lemonade as a choice instead of beer....but the beer and hot dogs were such a part of the ambiance of the experience, I wouldn't change it. At least in my generation...perhaps the next generation will prefer other foods to remind them of their childhoods. (I didn't "cheat," I had the maple roasted nuts, and a pickle, my date had the vegetable wrap, and I brought gluten-free pretzels that are addicting.)
So we have more choices now but the rules of etiquette aren't keeping up. For instance, how do you react when the same thing is done on the internet, in a public forum or on Face book? Does it seem judgemental when answering a question about vegetarianism?
I have thought of a new label for myself, which I am going to wear proudly: "Pesky-tarian." I have decided that I am going to have to get used to being seen as slightly judgemental whenever the subject of what I eat/don't eat comes up. Maybe I will put this label on a bumper sticker on my van so I can warn people right up front and not suprise anyone.
Why do I need a label? I guess so I can find other Peskytarians so I have a group around which I can relax and feel comfortable about my value choices concerning what I eat. And, no, Peta doesn't count, because they don't eat seafood. Even if they cheat, Sorry. There is such a thing as too pesky for a pesky-tarian. Plus, I don't want to have to do a security search on them when they come to my buffet, which might actually have some chicken on it.
(Oh, and Miss Conduct said she has a menu plan on her blog for a buffet that takes into account all the usual dietary restrictions so many of us seem to have now. She says a helpful rule is to have at least two things each person can eat, one has to be a protein item.) | |
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 940 | |
| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 4:43:12 PM | How just saying to the world ""I eat meat occasionally"" VERSUS ""I'm a vegan""
There is absolutely no need in any language to specifically make up a word for a vegetable only eating person because they don't exist.
It takes all the power out of the statement doesn't it ?
Vegans want to feel powerful, proud, etc., etc., somehow special for their choice when in fact they repeatedly slip, fall off the wagon, etc.
making them nothing less than just average folk.
My BBQ's clearly state if you want something else, bring it along and you cook it yourself.
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 5:07:37 PM | ^^^^ Honestly, you are not worth responding to. Your postings are frequently bizarre and ghoulish, to be honest. And the rest of them are unreferenced snippets culled from the internet. You are still incredibly sore because you could not refute my earlier documented examples of healthy vegetarianism, as proven by documented and legitimate studies.
I don't eat meat "occasionally" dude, and since I am not on any "wagon," I cannot fall off. I eat fish 3-7 times a year to patronize a date or attend a wedding and these are deliberate choices, not the failings of a fallible human being. I don't eat chicken or red meat ever, nor any other kind of meat, going on 19 years now. That doesn't even make me a lapsed vegetarian, not that you could ever figure out the difference between a vegetarian and a vegan.
Go ahead and grab someone's family pet straight off the leash and devour it, as you've suggested you would do in previous postings. I'm sure the blood running through your fingers is quite the aphrodisiac for the ladies. If that doesn't work, your oft-quoted meal of insects should finish you off from any romantic perspective.
Namaste........ | |
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 942 | |
| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 5:20:42 PM | I have a dating pool of 5 Billion , how many in your narrow view of the world ?
Only North American snobs with their obscene view of the world are so high and mighty. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 5:28:05 PM |
How just saying to the world ""I eat meat occasionally"" VERSUS ""I'm a vegan""
Well, that's logical... unless the person really doesn't eat any meat at all they shouldn't call themselves vegan... they can say 'mostly vegan' if it makes them happy. | |
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 944 | |
| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 8:26:56 PM | Okay LET'S start splitting hairs .
Animals have fast & slow twitch muscle fibers - as do fish .
FISH IS MEAT --and I really don't give a damn what the Catholic church says about that
Meat are mainly referred as red or dark and white meat.
Red or dark meat is mainly made up of muscles with fibers that are called slow fibers.
These muscles are used for extended periods of activity, such as standing or walking and need a consistent energy source.
The protein myoglobin stores oxygen in muscle cells, which use oxygen to extract the energy needed for constant activity.
Myoglobin is a richly pigmented protein.
The more myoglobin there is in the cells, the redder or darker, the meat is.
Red meat is red because the muscle fibers that make up the bulk of the meat
contain a high content of myoglobin, which are colored red.
Myoglobin, a protein similar to hemoglobin in red blood cells, acts as a store for oxygen within the muscle fibers.
White meat is made up of muscles with fibers that are called fast fibers.
Fast fibers muscles are used for quick bursts of activity, such as fleeing from danger.
These muscles get energy from glycogen, which is also stored in the muscles.
White meat as in fish has a translucent "glassy" quality when it is raw.
White meat is white because there is less usage in the muscle.
Myoglobin content is low in these muscles.
Fish is white because it lives in water and does not need to support its own body weight.
Basically, there are no myoglobins in these muscles.
CHEATERS- each and every one of you who eat fish is a MEAT eating ANIMAL killer.
Most fish meat is white, with some red meat around the fins and tail, which is used for swimming.
Animals like sharks and tuna has a dark or red flesh because it contains
more myoglobin as they are fast swimmers and a migratory fish.
Fish float in water and so don't need muscle to support their weight.
Their muscle fiber are very short called myotomes and are held together by
connective tissue called myocammata, which is much more delicate than collagen
and breaks down much more easily when cooked.
If you eat fish you eat MEAT and there is no getting around that fact. | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/5/2009 10:28:07 PM | CHEATERS- each and every one of you who eat fish is a MEAT eating ANIMAL killer.
Well, I take offence at that, unless that person caught the fish themselves they are only an accessory to murder or profiting from murder. A person who eats fresh vegetables however is always assured of eating (and killing) real live cells themselves. | |
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 946 | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/6/2009 8:39:44 AM |
I have a dating pool of 5 Billion , how many in your narrow view of the world ?
5 billion? There are only 6.7 billion people on the blue planet! Are some of these women from Vega, or what??? I don't have that much choice in the pool myself, and I am actually swimming in it. Besides, I wouldn't include men from a remote mountain village in Papua, New Guinea, as part of my "dating pool."
Approximately half of that 6.7 billion are women, (let's say 3.4 billion for argument's sake) and many of that number are children. There aren't 5 billion females on the planet, dateable or otherwise. Remember that inflatable dolls do not count! Or are you including female animals in your numbers? If so, I don't think that is actually "dating," now is it?
Again, you continue to find ways to totally creep me out.
BTW, I found the exact text from your posting on muscle fibers in post #944. You should really include quotation marks when quoting the ideas or exact wordings of others, because these are not your original statements are they? Just sayin'
http://www.articlesbase.com/home-improvement-articles/understanding-meats-why-red-meat-is-red-and-why-white-meat-is-white-63616.html
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 948 | |
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| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/6/2009 10:39:54 AM | So sayeth the person with a "75 mile limit" and "Must live in US" filter on their profile.
How did you think you were going to meet those 5 million women with restrictions like that?
Guess you won't be datin' any of those south pacific islanders either dude......... | |
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HO2
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Joined: 10/11/2008
Msg: 950 | |
| Hypothetical dilemma for Vegans/PETA...
Posted: 6/6/2009 4:59:06 PM | I meet plenty of Canadian women kayaking the Detroit River already.
Add to that the fact I own a good chunk of property near Palmer Rapids / Algonquin Park .
Madawaska River & Palmer Fest WhiteWater Weekend is an absolute blast every year.
General Motors paid for numerous month long trips sending me to Mexico launching the Chevy Avalanche truck.
Traveled plenty around other parts of the world, so , yeah, over the years I've splashed in a variety of pools.
Women that eat meat, are open minded, love adventure and exploration are always welcome to hang out with me.
No card carrying PETA members in the pool please, --it adds sedimentation to the water.
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