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| Maybe its just me...
Posted: 2/25/2009 5:58:48 PM | Yes, love is hard work. Even if it concerns only you and your ability to love yourself, it is hardwork. What more when it involves two individuals with their own idiosyncrasies? It requires hard work to make compromises so that those two separate individuals can compliment each other, like in a dance, as mentioned above. And for that love to grow, it has to be nurtured and nourished like a plant or it will die and yes, that is hard work. You have to work at making your relationship grow. You cannot be complacent. So there is work involved. And for that relationship to succeed, it requires two people; so it is hard work.
I am with txsippogal. It requires sacrifice. We are humans. We cannot consistently be lovable and what do you do when your partner is not, at the time when you feel lovable. It is a two-way street. If one believes that it is a walk in the park while the other thinks it is hardwork, there is no meeting of the minds. 
Edit: Love for me is relationship as I won't have one without love. So, they are synonymous, as far as I am concerned. I mean that kind of love. Love for a child is not hard work as it is unconditional. | |
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| Maybe its just me...
Posted: 2/25/2009 5:59:35 PM | I am with the wonderful lady that said that love is not hard work, relationships are. And you do have to work on your relationships. With that said, I look at it this way. I am an endurance athlete. If I do not put the work, I will not get any results. That means you go out there and go as hard as you can. In a relationship you have to work in two areas, one understanding the needs of the other person, and two, letting your needs be understood. It is give and take, but giving and taking, takes communication, then hard work. You give up some things for the relationship, the other person does the same for you. Then you do the magic, and is what I call Karma, and that is, you do things that are not requested, or asked for, but are just nuggets of understanding. And you give.
If you need to be supportive and show up at some family event that you dread – you do. No questions asked. But let it be also known, that when you are down, and you need that person next to you, that you do not want to have to ask. So there's a lot of give and take. And it cannot go just one way, but both ways. And yes, I am going to say, it also has to be selfish. For if it does not make you happy then it is not worth it.
So back to the analogy of hard work and training. When you do it, with all you got, with all your passion and yes, your pain. The rewards are awesome. So work you a ss off, for the relationship, for yourself. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/25/2009 6:02:44 PM | I agree with MyLifeAsMe, stnicholas, and TxSippiGal and a few others who posted here.
Yes, you can draw a line between love and a relationship and state the obvious: that love doesn't require work, but a relationship does. And, please, let me say that I would like to equate "work" and "effort" here as similar terms. They are closely related by definition and I'm not attempting to start a discussion in semantics.
The OP added a side topic about working on yourself first, indicating that once this has been done, then the work/effort will no longer be a factor in a relationship. I would like to disagree, if I may. I can do all the work necessary to become, in my eyes, the "perfect me." A man may also do the same and become, in his eyes, the "perfect him." This does not automatically equate to a synergism when the "perfect me" and the "perfect him" attempt to form a relationship.
Another variable thrown into the discussion by the OP was "compatibility." Compatibility on all levels, while nice in concept, may not be particularly feasible. When given all the variables (re: those outlined by stnicholas and the OP), finding someone who is intrinsically compatible may be more akin to finding a tadpole in the middle of the North Atlantic. Hence, there may be many issues that will require work / effort on the part of both participants in the relationship (granted, at varying degrees in different situations).
JMO
Sequoyah | |
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| Maybe its just me...
Posted: 2/25/2009 6:04:53 PM | Love can be hard work. So can mucking out a trough full of oxen crap with shovels made from plastic wiffle balls. So can teaching your Commanding Officer Robots how to get the best out of their Robot Infantryrobots, how to make them courageous and selfless, how to make them function as a machine not as machines with an s, how to make them die willingly and happily for the Robot Order and for the eventual domination of the Human World.
To tell you the truth, nothing worth having in this painful and corrupted world is worth having unless it's hard work to get it with the possible exception of a personal economic stimulus package. Hint, hint, President Obama. | |
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| Maybe its just me...
Posted: 2/25/2009 6:11:25 PM | I don't find it is work at all. When you love what you are doing and love the one you are with the effort isn't work.
The interesting thing is how relationships can devolve. Once people give up the willingness to put in the effort, the relationship becomes extraordinarily hard work.
What keeps us willing? | |
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| Maybe its just me...
Posted: 2/25/2009 6:27:37 PM | Oops, ItsMargo.
I don't find it is work at all.
OK, so it's not work.
Once people give up the willingness to put in the effort
Then you say one must be willing to put in the effort.
Definition of work: physical or mental effort.
Definition of effort: the use of physical or mental energy to do something.
Not trying to argue here, folks, but puuhleaze, can we at least agree that "work" and "effort" are at least somewhat analogous / synonymous?
Please don't think I'm picking on you, ItsMargo, just trying to make some sense out of what you just said. Can you explain?
Sequoyah | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/25/2009 6:28:40 PM | Well, I'm not talking about love being perfect or being a robotic perfect individual. I'm talking about love and maintaining it being perceived as work. Do I look at it as work? No. I have expectations that someone may not be in a good mood one day or that I may not (not that I'm a moody type of person - just isn't me) and that there isn't give and take, but that give and take should not be done with resentment attached to it. If you go into a relationship knowing that, where's the work? You go with it instead and understand it and the reasons for it instead of making it a struggle to deal with (work).
My mention of compatibility has to do with the fact that so many people throw themselves into the brain chemistry of love (more often than not lust) that they don't even take the time to objectively or even subjectively consider deep seeded in/compatibilities and figure they'll just "work" on that issue later when the goo-goo, gaw-gaw stage dissipates somewhat...and ya...guess what??..then it DOES become work.
(Puts a disclaimer in here - I like to throw stuff into the wind in forums sometimes and see what happens. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and I'm not saying I'm right nor that anyone else is wrong - just my opinions and I'm not above changing them if someone makes me see the light if my thoughts are like mushrooms that have been growing in the dark.) | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/25/2009 7:18:49 PM | OP -- You mentioned previously in one of your replies that "work" and "effort" are indeed interchangeable...
Let's see what the Dictionary says about that shall we?
Work:
Synonyms:
1. Work, drudgery, labor, toil refer to exertion of body or mind in performing or accomplishing something. Work is the general word and may apply to exertion that is either easy or hard: fun work; heavy work. Drudgery suggests continuous, dreary, and dispiriting work, esp. of a menial or servile kind: the drudgery of household tasks. Labor particularly denotes hard manual work: labor on a farm, in a steel mill. Toil suggests wearying or exhausting labor: toil that breaks down the worker's health. 2. enterprise, project, job, responsibility. 3. industry, occupation, business. 4. job, trade, calling, vocation, profession. 7. product, achievement, feat. 16. toil, drudge. 28. operate, manipulate, handle. 29. accomplish, effect, produce, achieve. 34. finish, form, shape. 37. move.
Effort:
Synonyms:
1. struggle, striving. Effort, application, endeavor, exertion imply actions directed or force expended toward a definite end. Effort is an expenditure of energy to accomplish some objective: He made an effort to control himself. Application is continuous effort plus careful attention: constant application to duties. Endeavor means a continued and sustained series of efforts to achieve some, often worthy and difficult, end: a constant endeavor to be useful. Exertion is the vigorous and often strenuous expenditure of energy, frequently without an end: out of breath from exertion.
Hmm...unless I miss my guess, and seeing as how I've been outta school since 19 I may be wrong...but aren't "synonyms" supposed to mean "same as"?
Let's see...
syn·o·nym [sin-uh-nim]
–noun
1. a word having the same or nearly the same meaning as another in the language, as joyful, elated, glad.
2. a word or expression accepted as another name for something, as Arcadia for pastoral simplicity; metonym.
Nope. Synonym still means "same as". Checking the synonyms I listed above, I don't see "work" as a synonym for "effort" anymore than I see it in reverse. So in reality OP, no they're not interchangeable. People just like to spin the words enough to get the square peg to fit in the round hole. As long as the word fits their notions, they'll make it mean the same thing when in fact, it is not.
Work is work.
Effort is effort.
Same as before. 
(info made available with the assistance of the dictionary and common sense) | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/25/2009 7:37:29 PM | | I agree with you chameleonf. It should be joy, romance, magic, compatibility. Almost (?) effortless. You want to be with your partner and enjoy their company, you agree to disagree and rarely really argue in a big way. You have the same moral values and way of thinking about life in the important parts. You can be extremely different culturally but if you have the same basic fundamental values about love, family, friends, God, it all works and your differences keep you interesting to each other. Good subject... peace.. annie | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/25/2009 7:53:27 PM | | Sorry, BigDaddy, the fact that one word is used to explain another in the definitions I put forth, does make them related in some sense. I wasn't going for exact definitions in the same strict manner of a synonym but to indicate that they are in fact related. If you took exception to my wording, I apologize. It wasn't meant as an attack on you. Whether or not you believe common sense was used is subjective, I suppose. I'll agree to disagree with you on both counts (close relation to meanings and common sense). | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/25/2009 8:42:41 PM | Energy. I actually meant to say energy. Does that work for you? lol
Regarding attitudes to work, perhaps this might help:
If you love your job, it doesn't seem like work, does it? I've had jobs where I've felt thrilled to get paid to do what I love to do. Thus, whatever your efforts or energy are, it sure doesn't feel like work or obligation. If you hate your job, there is no harder work imaginable and the clock moves painfully slowly to quitting time. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 5:53:30 AM | A majority of people go out with people because there is some thing that interest them. I know so many who are not in suitable situations, but they are too scared to be single and free. At the beginning when they don't really know each other, they seem to rush into the commitment part as fast as they can.
Eight out of ten are in relationships that will be hard work because they are not willing to wait until they find anyone compatible. Unfaithfulness for these couples is more frequent and often happens... Is it worth it ?
People would rather have something than nothing and it is their choice at the end of the day.
The people who wait, may not ever meet anyone, but at least they are not making someone unhappy with their constant moaning and deliberate scenes to gain attention.
I agree with you, if you are with the one who lights up your live, it is not hard work.
It is a shame many are stuck in relationships that are dormant and stained.  | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 8:26:33 AM | " It should be joy, romance, magic, compatibility. Almost (?) effortless. You want to be with your partner and enjoy their company, you agree to disagree and rarely really argue in a big way. You have the same moral values and way of thinking about life in the important parts. You can be extremely different culturally but if you have the same basic fundamental values about love, family, friends, God, it all works and your differences keep you interesting to each other. Good subject... peace.. annie"
NO 2 people are that much alike. Everyone has bad moods and off days. One will need a little extra effort/work/energy because they've lost a job or lost someone close to them or is sick, etc]. Now if your psyche is that of a doormat, maybe you have no wants needs or desires and it will be 'effortless ' [not really, but I think most will get the picture].
What does rarely really argue mean? You have to have communication, discussions and ANY 2 people will have disagreements [absolutely agree to disagree on some things, others you HAVE to come to some kind of meeting of the minds or compromise. Would that be considered an argument ?]
I dated a man who said the same thing as this poster ... what he meant was it was his way, his wants, his needs. I nicely tried to tell him that a habit of his annoyed me, and would he please try to curb it. O my gosh, he became furious because I said he had done something to annoy me. Guess what, he's been married 3 times and had quite a few SHORT relationships.
So......if you want to live in the real world and have a real relationship, a good one is NOT even' almost effortless'. I like the poster that said he did something like long distance running and said the more effort he put into it, the better the outcome. Guess that's the bottom line.
Actually the effort starts before the relationship....you need to make an effort to get to know yourself first and to know what your wants and needs truly are. Then you need to make an effort to get to know the other person.
IMO  | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:00:54 AM | chameleonf: This has been a very interesting thread. Thanks for posting it!
While we may not all agree, it has been delightful to read the responses.
To all the contributors here, thank you. This is what keeps me coming back to the forums.
Sequoyah | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:18:05 AM | chameleonf,
Keeping a relationship viable requires lots of effort, but it certainly isn't hard work. When loving someone becomes hard work, it's time to re-evaluate your situation, because there's probably not a lot of LOVE involved in it. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:21:43 AM |
In short, it's not the other person that requires the 'hard work', but it could very well be you. I don't happen to agree with the 'love me as I am' mentality; I am not (yet ) perfect. I think some people use that phrase to mean 'love me with all of my flaws; which I have no plans to repair'.
Perfection is unattainable because we are all human and we are all flawed. Only *GOD* is perfect. We can only make progress. It's always progress - NOT - perfection. Yes - I also agree that we cannot change others. Many people try and fail. Why should you? I've resigned myself from that job. People only change when they themselves choose to do so. Anything else is an attempt at controlling a person, and is NEVER appropriate in any relationship. We can only do our best to change what we find *wrong* with ourselves. There is some point where my best attempt at change may not be *good enough* for someone else - and - well - that's when I have to say............TOUGH SH_T. *Take me as I am, or take a hike!* As a human being I also have limitations, and boundaries. Please respect them, and we'll be okay. If you insist on unreasonable change, then you no longer respect me as a partner, and you've gotta go. Bye - Bye. Don't let the door hit you on the way out either.
The other thing about that is perhaps I don't see what you see as flaws. See - I do believe in "love me / love you as I am / are" because that *is* the only way two people can truly love one another and have a relationship of any kind (romantic, friends or family, etc., etc). Acceptance of one another *must* be there for there to be anything resembling love or any capacity for a healthy, happy, functional relationship. Without mutual acceptance, there's no mutual respect. I must be accepted and respected for who I am, not who you see me as or who you want me to become.
If I do not love *her* as she is, then I also should not be with her. There's reasonable change and unreasonable change. Some things about *me* I can change, some I can't and some I just won't (for anyone). I've learned this the hard way. I love myself too much to be who everyone or even anyone else wants me to be. If it's a reasonable request, then I will consider whether I can. Some requests are unrealistic and unreasonable as-well. If it's a demand, then you may have issues you need to work on. There's a vast difference between a request and a demand. Nobody on god's green earth is worth taking demands from. Go find yourself another b_tch, thanks.
When we try to be who our partner wants us to be instead of who we are, then we're making work where there should be none. We're already complicating the whole thing. Not only that, but it's sacrificing the mutual respect and love that are the essential ingredients of a healthy, happy, functional relationship. If we tried to be who everyone / anyone else thinks we should be, that's *people pleasing* - people that do this usually don't love themselves. It shows a complete and utter lack of dignity and self respect.
In short - I don't need to be *improved* or *made over* - This seems to be a very female expectation in relationships for some reason. I know, I've read all the Mars and Venus stuff, I've seen the proof myself. Eventually us guys just get tired of trying to be everything for everyone or anyone and not being accepted *as-is*.
Mike | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:26:10 AM | This seems to be a very female expectation in relationships
=======================
As someone who dates only men, this seems from my perspective to be a very MALE expectation in relationships. I think I can then surmise it's a human trait. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:37:03 AM |
As someone who dates only men, this seems from my perspective to be a very MALE expectation in relationships. I think I can then surmise it's a human trait.
Okay - I myself, have persistently been on the opposing end myself, enough to stop looking for certain kinds of women. There are many things I cannot and will not change about me to suit anyone else.
I wouldn't call such a trait an asset to ones character or something I could even find attractive in a potential partner. You improve YOU - let me improve ME.
Mike | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:39:14 AM | | It's the relationship that is work, effort. Any relationship is give and take, up and down, etc. To expect smoothing sailing and romance all the time is to rely on a fantasy. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 9:43:38 AM | "What does LOVE have to do with it?"...........I think there is a song about that second hand emotion......  
OT.........Interacting with anyone else takes work, and the closer you get, the harder it becomes, but the rewards can be just as satisfying as the work....... 
Just my opinion.......   | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 10:30:13 AM | | 1Georgia2 - If keeping a relationship viable requires a "lot of effort", please advise what that "lot of effort" is. Is it an effort to understand people have moods and to roll with those moods? Is it an effort to maintain interests or to change interests in common to interact with the individual you are in a relationship with? Is it an effort to compromise or doesn't compromise come easily to most people? I'm certainly not an idealist or even a typical romantic female (whatever that means to some people). I'm a realist and, realistically, if it's an effort to comunicate, maintain interests in common and any of the other things that make up the components of a relationship, in my mind that equates to "work" and it's, therefore, not a suitable relationship but is "made to work" in a "livable sort of way" because of the unsuitability. It would seem that a person has settled for something rather than enjoying something. It almost sounds like drudgery to me, rather than a pleasant experience. Again, just my humble opinion. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 6:25:33 PM | | If you love someone you naturally want them to be happy and don't want to see them hurting, everyone makes mistakes keeping a relationship alive depends on how you handle them. Some people find this hard as once there is a question of trust or insecurity in a relationship it takes a strong love to work through it, most give up. Again you have to know what is healthy love and what is destructive. In a good relationship it should not be an effort but a pleasure to make the other happy; still there will be times when that effort is required that will feel like work, but if the right course of action is taken and there is love between the two it often doesn't take too much to make someone feel secure or loved again if you've made mistakes but again this depends on the people some are forgiving others not | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 7:23:08 PM | In my opinion LOVE is NOT hard work. Love is rediculously easy and incredibly right. Try fighting against real love - it's a solid rock that is MASSIVE and immobile.
But relationships and unconditional acceptance? Takes patience.
Some call that work.
But most people, I call lazy.
So what's a label but a label? | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 7:34:44 PM | Love itself is not hard work but rather life that can be hard and it takes the strength and endurance of two commited people to come out on the other end of things.
Love is love but there are different types of love between husband/wife, parent/child, people and other people in general. It's easy to love yet it takes a lot of work at times to see people through life. | |
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| Is love hard work?
Posted: 2/26/2009 7:58:38 PM | Whomever you love, may it be a friend or more, it is not always a bed of roses. There is some effort and willingness to work through tough times and the benefit is a closer relationship with that person, a more deeply intimate relationship (emotional intimacy not physical intimacy) and a deeper understanding of the other person and of yourself.
We are not perfect, we all have "flaws" and to expect any relationship to be perfect is truly delusional. Love requires compassion and the desire to compromise at times for the greater good of the relationship. | |
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