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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/25/2009 11:04:59 AM | Sorry Zeke got to go with Irish and Daisy. A real man won't "stand his ground", he'll be assertive and correct, there is a difference.
There are few more opinionated than me, on these threads. Yes I at times appear obnoxious, arrogant. BUT it is not those things that I am, I am passionate about what I believe. She should speak her mind, I should listen, doesn't mean I should get in a snit because I don't agree! I should explain my reasons and do what I think is right.
Treat your woman well, show respect, expect the same and settle for nothing less. Bob | |
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toyoux
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Joined: 5/28/2006
Msg: 177 | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/25/2009 11:47:50 AM |
Yes I hold men responsible for the way the world is because almost every position of power where choices are made in the world is (and with very very few exceptions) always has been held by men. Commerce, politics, medicine, banking and higher education etc. Women only very recently are starting to rise to the top in those areas that control the world so yes I hold men responsible because it's a world so far run by men. Men have been leading - making all the big decisions. Who else could be responsible?
It seems you are trying to blame men today for everything that has happened since the beginning of time. Men today can only be responsible for what happens within their lifetime. Right now, there seems to be no better time to be a woman. Women running for president, CEO's, executives positions. It appears your still living in the past for things that happened before you were even born.
I suppose you are afraid men being outspoken, they are trying to go back to those times. Even though there were bad men back in those times, there are a lot of good ones too. | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/25/2009 12:00:16 PM |
Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
They don't .
Neither do puffed up, arrogant blowhard jaded angry bitter men. They just piss me off.
I see examples of both here on a regular basis.
"Nothing so strong as gentleness, nothing as gentle as true strength" Native American proverb
Cindy O | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/25/2009 5:26:35 PM | Forumologist,
I did not mean it in that way. You can have your views and not lose what makes you a woman.
There are strides being made as we speak. Women have obtained powerful positions within the government. I know some of these women second-hand. I have the utmost respect for them.
We will get closer to an acceptable balance, but I don't think it will be what any of us thinks it will be. I could be reflecting the peculiar microcosm in which I operate, but I do think there is a role for conflict and competitive heirarchy in society. Collective decision-making is not the answer to all of our problems. The challenge is determining when the paradigm should shift.
There is a part of most men -- repressed perhaps, but still there -- that wants to compete and protect. I want a woman to look up at me. There are times when I want to beat my chest. We can intellectualize all we want, but we are fighting millions of years of evolution and conditioning. I think changing men is a lost cause to a significant extent. We should focus on accepting our differences and putting these differences to productive use. | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/25/2009 9:37:24 PM | Hey, great thread ... and some of my favorite posters here! :) Not too much flaming, some absolutely wonderful opinions and some - well, not so much maybe. Plus, I got to learn a new word!
The OP generalizes, always a mistake. There are doubtless women who are intimidated by strong, independent & outspoken men - and I doubt this is a modern-day phenomenon. There are also men who are intimidated by strong, independent & outspoken women - it ain't gender specific.
OP suggests that women let men concentrate on being men, whilst they concentrate on being women. Unfortunately, I lost my how-to-be-a-woman handbook shortly before I was born, so I've been concentrating on being me - actually, I keep trying to be a better me. That's the kind of man I want - one who wants to be himself, only better. I prefer someone who would describe themselves as articulate rather than outspoken, and someone who seeks interedependency rather than stress his independence. Strong is good, unless it means I get a black eye. I have no interest in men who think feminism is the root of all societal evil, and that they're "emasculated" in today's society. I have no interest in women who think that men are the root of all evil, or who ignore the ways in which men are genuinely disadvantaged in society.
What the bejesus is an "Alpha" male? | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 4:49:44 AM |
I think changing men is a lost cause to a significant extent. We should focus on accepting our differences and putting these differences to productive use.
Yep, I've been saying this for years. This goes for both sexes. Change is a long time coming and breaking out of our parents mold is extremely difficult.
I believe that most women will try to mold men somehow. Whether someone thinks that "mold" means cleaning and keeping the house the same way as the woman or whether it means (trying) to change a man's attitude.
Personally, if the guy is a slob, I don't think trying to change him to pick up after himself is such a big frickin deal. Wanting to change his core however is another matter. Think about how hard it is to change yourself.
Many men for the most part have been raised by women and depending on how they were raised, this will have a profound affect on how he chooses his mate and what he "expects" from his wife etc.
I do think however that some men have been stifled by some overbearing women. I've seen it firsthand. These men will continue to run to women like this because it is what they grew up seeing or got used to.
Most of these comments can be gender reversed. | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 4:53:26 AM | Women who attempt to change their men ....go from someone who was acceptable...to a changed man who is not...
jmo,
Irish
VVV of course the subtle changes are ok...like learning how to put down the seat....but, those weren't the changes I'd mentioned....these were the personality changes that some women tend to impose on their men | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 4:55:33 AM | ^^^Well, sometimes you can't win. Saying you can't change men's personalities nor would you want to is great, you should only want to date as is. When you explain what "as is" means for you and what you want from day one or you walk, it can get you complaints for wanting someone who's too perfect and not giving people a chance.
I agree tho that people are who they are, the only change that matters is one the person themselves wants based on something they experience. | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 11:15:05 AM | This is the weirdest question...I honestly haven't seen enough of this around me to understand why this generalization is even being made. In fact, I usually see the exact opposite: women want a responsible strong type, and shy away from the *doormat* type unless they desperately want to dominate the relationship.
Now if this:
Strong, Independent, Outspoken
Really translates into rude, obnoxious, loud, and obnoxious, then yeah, I'd stay the hell away, just as I would if a female held all of those characteristics. | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 2:23:51 PM | Why do Strong, Independent, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
They don't . Such men annoy women. Women do not know what exactly they want. In their mind, a real man is like a good father, that would take care of her and protect her, best friend and a great lover, someone who would never argue with her, support her in everything, be loyal, blah, blah, blah, anyway, such men do not exist. So, they go from one man to another disappointed and getting bitter the older they get. They would tell a man:" Be a man!" But men can tell her:" Be a woman, not a ****!" | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 4:30:02 PM | ~
I want a man that will not put me down for my accomplishments or education simply because he hasn't experienced them.
I want a man to recognize my passions and be interested in them.
Yes, I agree in sharing in each other passions and teamwork..... together.
now about all those kitty litter boxes!
~
I want a man to take care of me and my cats. (All 82 of em') (I can do it myself just fine, but I need to know he will step up to the plate and take it from there if need be.
Yes Sans, real love, would be a man who would clean out all those kitty litter boxes! ~smile~ | |
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| Why do Strong, Independant, and Outspoken MEN scare the hell out of the modern-day woman?
Posted: 3/26/2009 8:22:28 PM |
hate terms such as "real man," "Alpha male," and "wimp." I wish we could talk about personality types in men without resorting to labels of this nature
Just wanted to let you know that I agree!
And yeah ... it's as shortcut. But it's also misleading to use them. Can miss real gems if you label someone before actually finding out about them.
Not that I'm any less guilty of this than anyone. | |
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