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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 7:10:56 AM | Goodbye bendy bananas, farewell curved cucumbers, so long chunky carrots
The Press: EU regulations mean the end of bendy bananas, curved cucumbers and chunky carrots. Greengrocers must conform to the myriad of rules covering size, length, colour and texture of fruit and vegetables.
(The Times, 19 December 2003)
The Facts: Bananas are classified according to quality and size for international trade. Individual governments and the industry have in the past had their own standards with the latter's, in particular, being very stringent. The European Commission was asked by national agriculture ministers and the industry to draft legislation in this area. Following extensive consultation with the industry, the proposed quality standards were adopted by national ministers in Council in 1994.
The diameter of the fruit is a way of measuring its maturity/development. Fruit grown organically or conventionally have to reach a certain degree of maturity in order to have a reasonable chance of satisfying the consumer. The minimum diameters laid down by standards are usually fixed at a level at which most fruit are of a satisfactory quality for consumption. This minimum stage of development does not depend on the method of production, but more on cultivation techniques diminishing the number of fruits on the tree to allow a better development of the remaining ones. That is why there is no specific requirement for organic produce. The contrary would mean organic farmers being allowed to sell smaller produce.
Cucumbers do not have to be straight. There are grading rules, which were called for by representatives from the industry to enable buyers in one country to know what quality and quantity they would get when purchasing a box, unseen, from another country. Nothing is banned under these rules: they simply help to inform traders of particular specifications. The EU Single Market rules are identical to pre-existing standards set down both by the UN/OECD and the UK. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 7:28:30 AM | | I meant the people of Britain, who elect their politicians, who presumably nominate the commissioner. Like I said, I'm no expert but I understood that EU commissioners were supposed to act in the interests of the EU, not necessarily their own country. I can confirm, I'm not an EU commissioner. I was trying to be witty and ironic, I obviously failed, just forget it. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 7:28:46 AM |
So, you based this comment on the content of a post written by one person with a poor grasp of grammar but a passionate belief in his country?
No, read the views on any other website eg BBC have your say, or teletext whenever anything remotely EU-related crops up.
Even the BNP is happy to foster existing trading links with Europe once we have left the EU.
I think if the BNP came to power, we would have sanctions placed on us and wouldn't be able to trade with anyone, Europe or outside - but I take your point, it would be possible to retain free trade although we would then be subject to many of the same regulations, but wouldn't get a say - as Norway and Switzerland are currently. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 7:37:25 AM |
I LOOK FORWARD TO GETTING OUT ,I CANT STAND BEING IN THERE,AN COWARD BROWN KEEPS ASKING HOW HIGH,GET RID OF THE HUMAN RIGHTS ACT AN CLEAR ENGLAND OF ALL FOREIGNERS
Is that just foreigners who have recently come here, or people with Muslim parents who were born here? Where are you going to clear them to and how are you going to enforce this? Send them all back on flights to where they came from, even the people who are second and third generation. A lot gets said about clearing England of all foreigners but I don't see much about where they are going to go, or how it's going to be done. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 8:25:47 AM | Whether our laws are made by people with their snouts in the trough in Brussels or Strasburg or whether they are made by the corrupt buggers in Westminster doesn't really make a great deal of difference to the average man on the street as both systems are flawed in similar ways.
People are usually very quick to complain about the actions of the British government. However, the strange thing is that whenever the issue of the EU is mentioned suddenly our government becomes the epitome of how things could be done so much better. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 8:26:14 AM | @ MSG 26
The quoted article fails to mention anything about the relevant 'myth', and there is a sound reason for this - it wasn't a myth!
Here's another EU link which shows Directive 2257/94:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/Notice.do?mode=dbl&lang=en&ihmlang=en&lng1=en,pt&lng2=bg,cs,da,de,el,en,es,et,fi,fr,hu,it,lt,lv,mt,nl,pl,pt,ro,sk,sl,sv,&val=302995:cs&page=
I'll quote the relevant sections.
"COMMISSION REGULATION (EC) No 2257/94 of 16 September 1994 laying down quality standards for bananas" [ ffs...]
"Whereas Regulation (EEC) No 404/93 makes provision for laying down common quality standards for bananas intended for consumption fresh, not including plantains; whereas the purpose of these standards is to ensure that the market is supplied with products of uniform and satisfactory quality, in particular in the case of bananas harvested in the Community, for which efforts to improve quality should be made;"
" In all classes, subject to the special provisions for each class and the tolerances allowed, the bananas must be:
- free from malformation or abnormal curvature of the fingers,"
It then describes how to tell if a banana is abnormally curved:
" Sizing is determined by:[this is the relevant bit]
- the length of the edible pulp of the fruit, expressed in centimetres and measured along the convex face from the blossom end to the base of the peduncle,
- the grade, i.e. the measurement, in millimetres, of the thickness of a transverse section of the fruit between the lateral faces and the middle, perpendicularly to the longitudinal axis.
The reference fruit for measurement of the length and grade is:
- the median finger on the outer row of the hand,
- the finger next to the cut sectioning the hand, on the outer row of the cluster.
The minimum length permitted is 14 cm and the minimum grade permitted is 27 mm. "
So, 2257/94 laid down a precise measurement for helping to determine as to whether as banana was excessively curved!
Therefore, it wasn't a tabloid myth, and you and The Times are wrong.
@ MSG 27 I take your point - but I advise against using sarcasm on the serious threads.
You are correct in stating that a country's EU Commissioner must act in the best interests of the EU, and not his country. This is a terrible state of affairs, but underlines the EU's undemocratic set-up.
@ MSG 18
You quoted my comment about my education, and noted that:
look no further than Energy healers posts for an example of what is meant by ignorant xenophobia!
At that point, the poster in question had stated:
Iam english, proud to be english, i didnt know we had under signing up must have been fixed an pushed through regardless to the common market, we had signed up to be a european country to be told by un-elected no-marks wat we can an cant do , to fill this country with immigrants
He was referring to the fact that although we signed up to a trading bloc, we ended up losing our borders, allowing our country to be not only flooded with non-EU people, but the potential for every EU citizen to turn up at Dover and be allowed entry to our country.
He is totally correct on both points, yet at no point does he state or imply that doesn't like 'foreigners' as such - he is angry clearly at those foreigners who are "scounging immigrants,asylum seekers,an the crims from europe".
I suspect that you also aimed your comment:
Theres another for you, Zeegary....
at the poster who stated:
Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
because we are islanders, we are not part of the same piece of land, they have no time for us nor us for them.
I can appreciate why you are looking for support for your earlier comment, but that poster clearly referred to the EU, not the people of Europe. Even if they weren't, and they hate Europeans, your earlier comment is still incorrect. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 8:34:26 AM | What about his clearing England of all foreigners comment then? All of them? Including the people who have a legal right to be here, including people who have successfully applied for asylum, or people from other EU countries?
on another thread
3- there will be a top charge for use of our NHS, NO BENEFITS WATSOEVER
they can only employ english,no foreigners
Yet
Fair play to the guy, the foriegners come here should intergrate with us, embrace our history,herritage, our customs, an speak the queens english
So the Nottingham sub postmaster can stay then?
<div class='quote'>
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 8:52:34 AM |
I can appreciate why you are looking for support for your earlier comment, but that poster clearly referred to the EU, not the people of Europe. Even if they weren't, and they hate Europeans, your earlier comment is still incorrect.
I don't need to look for support for my earlier comment. Look on any messageboard on anything even vaguely EU-related.
The comment "they have no time for us and we have no time for them" - clearly directed at anyone else in Europe, not "the EU" is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about and it arrived right on cue.
I'm not by any means saying there aren't good and intelligent arguments against the EU, but a large proportion of anti-EU arguments tend to be unintelligent, ignorant and xenophobic ones. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:15:28 AM | Some of our football teams would be decimated if they couldn't 'employ' players of a different origin (and just for the sake of argument lets assume that Britons are Celts, all these Anglo Saxon invaders should be sent home along with the rest of these so called foreigners). And never mind about our Olympic team.
And remember that Britain was 'rescued' after the last war by West Indian immigrants from the 'Windrush' helping to rebuild the country.
American, Australian, South African (white) immigrants, are they ok to stay?
The Queen and the Royal Family, where do you stand on these particular foreigners?*
* Questions aimed primarily at ShoutsAtAngels (or whatever his name is now) and the rest of what Benjamin Disraeli would have called 'little islanders' in their 'splendid isolation'. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:26:48 AM |
Typical lefty reaction!
People's politics don't need to be typically left of centre just because they might not agree with the stance on the EU or on immigration, it's like saying anyone who is opposed to a certain view is a left wing communist.
Oh, that's whats already been said on here. After all the foreigners (I'm not yet sure who falls into that category) are sent home and after all the left wing commies are sent to Basra, there will be full employment, because it's obviously the immigrants who have nicked all the jobs and left the poor UK workers with none. Even though the rules say that asylum seekers can't work (but lets forget that because it doesn't fit with the argument.
If there are any unemployed people left over after that, they can do the jobs of the people who have emigrated to Basra.
The problem you have when making blanket statements such as all immigrants should go home, you then have the issue of who falls into the immigrant category.
The BNP might say it's anyone who isn't white anglo saxon and protestant, but there's a few people who don't fall into that category. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:36:27 AM |
People are usually very quick to complain about the actions of the British government. However, the strange thing is that whenever the issue of the EU is mentioned suddenly our government becomes the epitome of how things could be done so much better.
The most sensible and balanced reply so far! I couldn't have put it better myself.
because we are islanders, we are not part of the same piece of land, they have no time for us nor us for them.
Unfortunately that’s not such a sensible and balanced reply.
I’ve seen lots of comments about how awful it is that ‘Those dreadful Europeans’ can come and work in the UK……… but nothing at all about the fact that we can go and work anywhere in Europe!
It’s a two way street you people! Wake up to that fact!
I am delighted that we are members of the EU because it opens up business opportunities for me (and all of us!) in every EU country.
I’m a partner in a business in Latvia. That could never have happened if the UK wasn’t a member State of the EU (or indeed, if Latvia wasn’t a member State). | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:37:13 AM | "The BNP might say it's anyone who isn't white anglo saxon and protestant, but there's a few people who don't fall into that category. "
havent you noticed the figures for people moving abroad,so many whites re leaving this once great land due to labours lack of skill not only cant run this country,but also due to the millions of millions of imigrants, coming in, or is that an offensive thing to say,An i know various friends have gone abroad due to these reasons. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:38:12 AM | I would be the first to hold my hand up if i was wrong, but, nowhere does it state that bananas couldnt be bendy, it sets out a series of guidelines for the uniformity of said fruit, strictly speaking, its not a fruit, its a seed by the way, the tabloids picked up on it and extrapolated and exagerated its wording as an anti EU propaganda story, just as the right wing press will do with anything that sheds a bad light on the EU.
Sorry to be so pedantic people, but i think the poster is more interested in proving how right he is and how very wrong we are | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:46:05 AM |
but also due to the millions of millions of imigrants, coming in, or is that an offensive thing to say,An i know various friends have gone abroad due to these reasons.
How many millions of milions are we talking about. On one thread you have stated you want to clear England of immigrants, on another you've said its ok as long as they blend in and speak the Queens English. So what is it you want to do, who do you want to send home and where do you want to send them? Or is that a difficult question to answer? | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:50:42 AM |
due to the millions of millions of imigrants, coming in, or is that an offensive thing to say
I don't know if it's offensive but it's certainly incorrect.
An i know various friends have gone abroad due to these reasons
They wouldn't have gone to any European country obviously, or this comment could be construed as slightly hypocritical.  | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 9:54:27 AM | | maybe us brits have looked across the sea and seen what the eu are doing in ireland? they voted no to the lisbon treaty, so instead of accepting that, there making them vote again and prob till they get it thru! how very fair ... | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:07:43 AM | How many millions of milions are we talking about. On one thread you have stated you want to clear England of immigrants, on another you've said its ok as long as they blend in and speak the Queens English. So what is it you want to do, who do you want to send home and where do you want to send them? Or is that a difficult question to answer?
If your going to quote me. then quote wat i say an not leave out bits ,
an twist it, to suit your needs??
what i stated was foreign multimillionaire company owners who wished to sell an build there products could for a pre deterimmed time , the other scoungers could go to hell,
but like you say,is it a differcult question, because you refuse to answer why is it you have problems with people who are proud an pro english , do you find them wat, "racist" or some other term. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:18:09 AM | | how much money was paid out to eu workers claiming for tax credits of children who arnt even in the country? then theres the joke of paying farmers not to farm? lol im still waiting for a post of the benefits of the eu? | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:19:09 AM |
Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
I cannot speak for the silent majority but I can for myself.
No one has had the guts to bother asking me whether I am pro-eu or anti-eu and as it will affect my future and the future of my offspring, I am a tad miffed at the lack of a referendum on membership, never mind referenda on the revised constitution or the euro.
Ruffy
xx | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:24:07 AM |
Sorry to be so pedantic people, but i think the poster is more interested in proving how right he is and how very wrong we are
To which WE are you referring?
Only one person on this thread is disputing the facts about the 'bendy bananas' story.....and it's you!
nowhere does it state that bananas couldnt be bendy
No-one is claiming otherwise!
Your original comment on the matter stated :
That story about bendy bananas is an urban myth, dreamt up by the tabloids some years ago, and is rightly derided as such.
The media at the time generally stated that the EU had brought out a directive which governed the curvature of bananas. I have produced two EU links, one which acknowledged that such a directive existed, and the other was the actual directive (2257/94) containing the rules regarding the curvature of bananas.
Therefore, the tabloids were correct, and the story wasn't a 'myth' - it was fact.
Your original comment about it being a 'myth' is, therefore, wrong!
Any chance of seeing that hand?
the right wing press will do with anything that sheds a bad light on the EU.
Which just demonstrates how patriotic the 'right wing' is!
People are usually very quick to complain about the actions of the British government. However, the strange thing is that whenever the issue of the EU is mentioned suddenly our government becomes the epitome of how things could be done so much better.
Does it?
I cannot remember the last time a British government did something 'right' - anyone care to help?
I do, however, believe that electing our government is far better than having one foisted upon us.........anyone disagree?
I’m a partner in a business in Latvia. That could never have happened if the UK wasn’t a member State of the EU (or indeed, if Latvia wasn’t a member State).
What utter nonsense!
Egypt isn't a member state of the EU, yet it's perfectly possible to start a business there.
Even though the rules say that asylum seekers can't work
But successful applicants can!
(Can't believe I had to state that).
@ MSG34
You quoted two posts, and I'm not sure why you did. Neither contradicts the other. One states that foreigners are welcome to come as long as they embrace our culture, heritage, language etc, but that they cannot be paid benefits nor can they have jobs.
@MSG 36 Can any body address your comments, even those of us who don't support forced repatriation?
I'm not sure why you mentioned Disraeli's feelings towards those of us who oppose the EU, given that he never had to face such a threat. Is it simply that you used the term 'little islanders' (a term that he used? I can't find a reference to it) in a bid to cause offence? Well, it can not have been aimed at me, because, like Disraeli, I considered the Empire to be a good thing for both Great Britain and the colonies. Being a patriot as he was, I suspect that Disraeli would have opposed the EU.
As for our sporting teams, who cares if they are bereft of foreigners? Home-grown talent took our sports around the world.
I don't need to look for support for my earlier comment. Look on any messageboard on anything even vaguely EU-related. The comment "they have no time for us and we have no time for them" - clearly directed at anyone else in Europe, not "the EU" is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about and it arrived right on cue. I'm not by any means saying there aren't good and intelligent arguments against the EU, but a large proportion of anti-EU arguments tend to be unintelligent, ignorant and xenophobic ones.
Here's a link showing many anti-EU sites:
http://www.freebritain.co.uk/
Feel free to indicate any article on any of them which contains a comment in support of your quoted section.
Also, feel free to provide me with any links which you have obviously read, going by your repeated comments.
VVVV
The myth that the EU banned the sale of bendy bananas is exactly that; a myth.
No ifs, not buts, it's a myth. End of.
What the EU did was introduce a classification system, with varying grades assigned dependant of the curvature and size.
And what happened to any bananas which failed to make that grade?
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:25:47 AM | Would Defra take ASDA to court over breech of the rule if it were an urban myth...
And would the BBC would report that urban myth...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/2066730.stm
You're adding two and two and coming up with five...
The myth that the EU banned the sale of bendy bananas is exactly that; a myth. Doesn't matter whether you agree with that, or think it's rubbish, it's a myth, no ifs, no buts, End of. The information people have posted here trying to show it's not a myth even prove it is a myth if they had bothered to read it properly.
What the EU did was introduce a classification system, with varying grades assigned dependant of the curvature and size.
ASDA were not taken to court because their bananas were bendy, they were taken to court because their produce had not been correctly graded and classified under EU regulations. All they had to do was correctly label the fruit (I use the word "fruit" loosely of course, since technically a banana is a herb) and everything would have been fine. And if food does not comply with the relevant FOOD LABEL requirements, then is it not fair enough that action should be taken?
Oh, but yes; the EU is shite 
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 10:31:10 AM | There are many things raised in here as objections to the European Union which are not even things for which the EU has any responsibility. For example immigration. Laws pertaining to immigration into the UK are passed in Westminster and not in Brussels. The world is seeing the mass migration of peoples at rates never seen before with some 200 million people each year relocating from the place of their birth to other countries. Almost every developed nation in the world and most developing nations are currently experiencing large scale immigration. Even places like China and Iraq have issues with it.
Before the fall of the Berlin wall and the breakup of the former Soviet Union, immigration into the UK was almost exclusively from non European and Commonwealth countries. This has resulted in the largest immigrant / ethnic minority in the UK being British Indians. However, due to this country having the highest rates of inter-racial marrages anywhere in the world it is forecast that they will be surpassed by mixed race people who will make up some 4% of the British population by 2010. Since the wall came down some 33% of immigration comes from within the EU as part of the free movement of workers. As most people are aware the largest proportion of these come from Poland.
Some interesting information about Poland should be noted.
a) Poland is Britain's fourth largest trading partner and our largest market within Central and Eastern Europe. According to the British / Polish chamber of commerce, trade with Poland in 2008 increased 30%, in no small part due to the influx of Poles into the UK. Our trade with Poland went up just over 24% to just under £3 billion which is 15% of their import market. Their trade with us totalled some £4.2 billion.
b) Polish immigrants are amongst the best educated immigrants by far who come to the UK. Most are multi lingual placing little or no additional cost on this country for translation. Many have two high quality university degrees in subjects British industry is crying out for, language skills, engineering, computer science, teaching, dentistry and construction. Years of under-investment in our education system have created vast shortages of British workers with these skills and our NHS (which is 40% staffed by immigrant workers), government offices and businesses have all suffered as a result. It costs well over £250,000 and takes between four and six years to bring someone up to this level of education and training here in the UK. With Polish immigrants, we get these skills FOC thanks to Stalin et al. They also have a strong work ethic, something that is increasingly difficult to find at home.
c) Polish immigrants, who tend to be young, fit and healthy and therefore place minimal demands upon our health service, are amongst the most law abiding and the girls are much cuter than their often drunken British counterparts.
d) Polish immigrants share our genetic makeup, our religions and our belief systems. Nearly 1 in 6 people in the UK have some Polish blood flowing through their viens after the last large wave of immigration from Poland after WWII. After fighting alongide us in the Free Polish Army against the Germans, Italians and Russians they found their country sold out to communist Russia by the war criminal Churchill and chose to stay here. Despite suffering horrendous discrimination such as having "No Blacks, No Irish, No Poles" signs in boarding houses across the country, being denied access to council housing and having only the lowest paid jobs available to them despite their higher education ability at that time, they remained here and assimilated into society without too many problems. (De Ja vue!!)
e) When 450,000 British and Commonwealth soldiers found themselves on the beach at Dunkirk, scattered on the beaches without weapons or means to defend themselves having abandoned them in the rush to escape, it was the Polish, together with the Beligum, French and Dutch forces that stood between them and total annihilation by the German forces. Some 400,000 brave men and women stood firm against the German killing machine and fought to the death to allow the British troops to be taken from the beach back to Blighty. Only 1,000 of these heros managed to make it to the boats. All the rest either fought to the death or were captured and sent to concentration camps. Without them, my grandfather and hundreds of thousands of others would be laying now in the ground somewhere in France and Britain would have been invaded and defeated in the war.
The fact is that the Polish immigrants are exactly the type of immigrants that this country needs to succeed given that our own population is aging, increasingly obese, clinically depressed and dwindling in number by the day due to low birth rates. It should also be noted that Poland and it's economy is one of the fastest growing in Europe and will soon overtake Germany as the Economic powerhouse of Europe. Poland is now experiencing large scale immigration into Poland by Slovakian and other less well developed countries and are rubbing their hands with glee at the way people in the UK are encouraging their own highly skilled workers to return home. In Poland, they call these immigrants horseheads and say exactly the same things about them as has been said in here about our immigrants and their effect on the country.
It really is a great loss to the UK to see them leaving but whatever your views, it should be remembered that the EU is not responsible for who does and who doesn't get into the UK. | |
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| Why are so many British people so opposed to the EU ?
Posted: 3/31/2009 11:01:13 AM | It really is a great loss to the UK to see them leaving but whatever your views, it should be remembered that the EU is not responsible for who does and who doesn't get into the UK.
firstly Its not a great loss all these spongers are going,all claiming child benefit to send home for non-exsistent kids in poland!
secondly for labour supporters would you be voting in this imcompetent inept goverment again after failing us again ?
thirdly, isnt it disgusting Coward Brown an blair havent the backbone an are so spineless they cant stick up for us, an ruined this country by letting everybody , ignoring the preachers of hate, but lock old people up for refusing to pay their rip off council taxes, they have failed us time & time again, spineless an grow a backbone brown & blair | |
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