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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/18/2009 7:27:05 PM | | and I still dont think the tax dolars should be used so someone can change their stroke | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/18/2009 7:28:22 PM | Eight, I'm hoping that I've proven that the reason people are so committed to not funding this surgery is that it's perceived as weird, creepy, unnatural, and homosexual in nature. And that's still one of those things that goes..."I ain't spendin' none a my money on them wackos" rather than figuring out if there is any actual justification there. I've obviously failed in all these things because...
"after all nothing you have said changed or even shook my opinion that these wackos self mutilation shouldnt be covered by ahc."
The above is another perfect example.
Hey, I found something to fill this double post spot! | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/18/2009 9:20:58 PM | Would the American Medical Association and the World Health Organization be okay for proof, trub? Or is your knowledge superior to two entire colleges of physicians?
"In 2008, the American Medical Association passed a resolution opposing any exclusion of insurance coverage for gender identity disorder treatments when prescribed by a physician. Failure to provide such treatment can have deleterious consequences, including "stress-related physical illness, depression, and substance abuse problems," according to the AMA.
The AMA drew upon the recommendations of the World Health Organization, which has rejected notions that surgeries for transgender patients are “cosmetic” or “experimental.”"
We good now? You satisfied in knowing that excluding transgendered patients from appropriate care is actually illegal in the States yet still firmly championed by some in Alberta.
"where is this proof?
all you did was voice your own opinion and backed it up with bs. where is the documentation"
My gawd you're like Baghdad Bob during the second Gulf War...."We have the Americans on the run!!! They are drowning in their own blood!!! They are retreating to the land of the Infidels!!! That is to say totally delusional. The proof was your own f%#$ing articles which you didn't read!!!! Go f&%#*ing read them! And, see the above quote from the AMA and all the other quotes you wrote off as medical blah blah.
"OMG..you seem to think you have a lot of knowledge on this subject..were you a she that turned into a he or maybe a he that wants to be a she"
No, not at all, just not totally stunned. But that was a good one! Think of it this way, if you don't wake up every day and have to think about what sex you want to be, that should be a clue, just a clue, that maybe there is something significantly abnormal about people who do. We all have masculine and feminine qualities, (of course not you trubble, don't worry, you're all man) so it's really not a problem for me understanding that these qualities can be exagerated in some, denied and burried in others and completely mixed up in a few. Take a good look at yourself and then at the characteristics of the opposite sex. If you can't recognize all of those characteristics in yourself, then you're in complete denial. We are all on a continuum of sex and gender. Yes, even physical qualities for all you chucklers right now. Guess what they make fake boy you know whats out of....existing female you know whats.
Gawd, I'm wasting more time on this when Troy is on!! "Is there no one else?" | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/18/2009 9:46:03 PM | Since there is a split decision on how people think this should be funded, why don't the supporters of the transgendered just establish a charitable fund and keep raising money for these surgeries.........The rest can do the same with the causes they support.....No one is homophobic or a slut, just because they don't wish to support other peoples whims. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/18/2009 9:49:47 PM | Gasp...Troy is on! and here I am on here....AND trying to figure out who won the game that I missed the end of (last I saw 2 to 1 for Chicago....Thinking it's not good :(
^^ Are you talking about a split decision on here? POF Forums establish government decisions? That's news to me | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/18/2009 11:44:08 PM | I'm speaking about the POF debaters primarily...Feel sorry for these poor people go ahead establish a fund and support the cause.....Don't call me homophobic because i don't entertain the same ideology.
As for the Government it should be up for a vote, definitely let the taxpayers decide...I don't feel like being lumped and obliged to pay for whims, just because these people have a fit of some sort... | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 12:35:14 AM | ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That is the point we are trying to make here that its truly is a bona-fide condition. It is very real for the people who suffer from it.
obliged to pay for whims, just because these people have a fit of some sort...
The money used to fund these rare surgeries are probably less than to treat them otherwise for their entire lifetime. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 4:34:45 AM | lol spring, ive suggested they put their money where there mouths are as well(several times. they apparently skip over that part as they tend to do that quite often)
i notice not one of them has the fortitude to put up or shut up
funny how the ones that want to fund these things arent willing to actually spend a penny of there own on these frivolous activities eh. apparently the "taxpayer" can pay for everything" no problem
by the way " It can cost anywhere from $3,000 to $100,000 to get a sex change, none of which is covered under medical insurance"
so you zealots should start contributing today.
i noticed not one of you made any mention of contributing .or helping as you term them" these poor normal people. other than jumping on the funny bus and oushing them towards the old scalpel | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 6:05:01 AM | Well, I've always felt I was a millionaire, born into the body of a working class guy. Guess that means the government should give me twenty million dollars.
Let's see if that's going to happen.
Should sex changes be covered? In a word, NO. I don't have a medical opinion on whether the desire to do that comes from a genuine mental problem, a biological problem, or just some whack job deciding he doesn't like what he sees when he gets out of the shower. I don't care. It's not my problem, and I don't want to pay for someone I don't know and will never meet's gratification.
This whole debate is just another example of why public healthcare, which sounded like a good idea in the beginning, has proven to be a horrible mistake. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 7:04:23 AM | Sorry trub, you deserve an answer to....
" ive suggested they put their money where there mouths are as well(several times. they apparently skip over that part as they tend to do that quite often)"
I guess I just thought it was painfully, brutally, completely, horribly obvious that in Canada the rights of minorities are protected from the vote of the majority and that since everybody pays taxes, philosophically they should cover everyone's needs. I believe the very first thing I said is realistically, there's only so much money to go around and we should likely focus that on only the most serious needs, likely not sex changes. I'm actually starting to think that it is a higher priority need. But this is the problem with socialized medicine in general. The philosophical point is the same, we should cover sex changes. I hate pointing out such stupidily obvious points 'cause it's like arguing with six year olds, or drug addicts. But, there you go. Think of it this way, why should a transgendered person pay for anything unrelated to his or her needs? They should get refunds for all the times someone hits the emerg for having the sniffles? And just for the record, I'm not calling anyone homophobic for disagreeing. (actually trub is the definition of homophobic, but that was eveident long ago, not just this thread) If you're still saying that this surgery is just a whim, or that people do it just for attention like gay pride parades, then you just don't get it, probably never will because life is better and easier in the small world you're rockin'.
Now, let's get to some of the stuff you guys skip over...points one through eight. My direct question to trubble about gay people. Why you posted links to articles completely opposed to your point of view. What the AMA and W.H.O. said. All the other quotes on medical blah blah blah. None of this is addressed by the "spilt decision" side, just the same old line, "I ain't payin' for no freaky people". | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 8:46:33 AM | Yes sure, if I was a millionaire I would be covering those proceedures, plus surgery for burn victims, crime victims, babies born with cleft palates, etc. etc. I would go as far as to start a spay and neuter program so as to cut the number of unwanted dogs and cats that are killed each month in shelters.
But I'm already paying for a health condition of mine out of my own pocket that requires expensive treatment that is not covered by AHC, namely muscle therapy, physiotherapy, osteopathic services, accupuncture, and now, chiropractic services. I also have a mortgage and other bills I have to cover too. But perhaps if I win the lottery, that may all change....
So your idea that I "put my money where my mouth is" is just stupid on your part. I already live with a body that I don't want and that surgery cannot correct, thank you very much. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 4:22:28 PM | ahhhh, the barrage of excuses ,lol what a joke, wah wah wah .
if you as a supposed supporter arent even willing to cough up a few dollars to help these misbegotten transexuals, then what the heck are you pretending to defend?
it figures tho , when the chips are down and your asked to actually cough up a dime to support them , you all scurry away like the rest.
you still however expect us that dont agree with it to cough up money tho eh , well i guess we know how much you actually support these people
rights of minorities
transexuals arent a minority tyvm
I hate pointing out such stupidily obvious points
but you do it so well , you seem quite well versed actually in stupidity
Think of it this way, why should a transgendered person pay for anything unrelated to his or her needs
um well with that type of stupid example, the only thing to add would be. "why should regularly gendered people pay for things related to their needs? unfortunately someone has to pay , i would like everything to be offered free of charge , however, it aint gonna happen.
your examples are just plain redundant and completely useless, they are one sided and your limited comments proclaiming youve proven anything, are only found proven in the depths of your own head.
dont worry if you ever even come close to proving a point, ill let you know
(and omg. because i dont choose to associate or participate in homosexuality , doesnt make me a homophobe, it makes me a practicing heterosexual tyvm, save your moronic name calling verses for the gay bars you apparently frequent .
i also dont associate or participate in beastiality, am i also a beastialityphobe? or a pedophobe or how about a rapistophobe,
any other brainy attempts to insult me at hand?its all you do
try harder next time) | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 5:03:54 PM | transexuals arent a minority tyvm
Just because you have decided in your little head that they are not minorities does not make it so. Transexuals, transgendered, gay, bisexuals, and lesbians are ALL considered gender or sexual minorities....here in Canada and in the US.
according to what crackpots ideas are they"born into the wrong bodies"
This might answer you question if you actually attempt to read it.
http://www.helpstartshere.org/Default.aspx?PageID=1114#what
thats it, use insults , that makes your arguement really mean all the more.
Yo have constantly called these people freaks, crack pots, etc. and even went as far as to basically call OMG gay, but I am the one insulting because I consider the Alberta government redneck? Come on...wake up! Ed Stelmach is not a redneck?! LOL! I think you seriously need to figure out your arguments before you constantly post them and come across as a hypocrite.
Being transgendered is not about attention seeking(if you'd acually read and do a little research before spouting of your ignorant ideals you'd know this). Most of them just want to have the change so they feel they are in the right body and lead a normal life after struggling for years being in the wrong one. Wether or not you may believe it, but I honestly think its not even truly about what you believe, its about what inane things you can say to stir the pot.
I hate pointing out such stupidily obvious points 'cause it's like arguing with six year olds, or drug addicts.
I couldn't agree more and its almost as productive as banging your head against a wall when it comes to trub. No matter how much proof or research you provide he will never attempt to see it any other way. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 5:21:06 PM |
Transexuals, transgendered, gay, bisexuals, and lesbians are ALL considered gender or sexual minorities
sexual choice doesnt make you a minority , sorry . neither does wanting to be something your not,. with the loose leaf ideology you proclaimed.we could all make up our own minorities and pretend whatever we want to
to even use the term "sexual minority" to allude to transexuals really shows how pathetically you are trying to make some sort of inept point.
um sorry to burst your hot air bubble, but from what ive read, transexuals arent homosexuals.
maybe you need to do a little reading and not lump all the trash into the same bag
by the way, are you coughing up some cash to chop off transexuals genitalia perchance?
somehow i highly doubt it ,
Being transgendered is not about attention seeking
Most of them just want to have the change
its about what inane things you can say to stir the pot.
so because you and 3 or 4 other crackpots say it isnt about attention seeking...... that makes it proven?
oh and let us not forget the profiters of genital disfigurement surgery, they to are lining up to fill there pockets. thank goodness the government isnt as doped up to fall for that bs.
you need help lol
seriously, id even chip in for your shrink.
i truly dont give a crap about homos or transexuals or lesbians or any other type of deviant, and thats just being honest and direct ok.
i know you people(i use the term lightly) wish to hijack the thread and make it about homos, but the topic is health care,
start a homo thread if you wanna argue semantics about homos | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 5:28:48 PM | I chip in with taxes therefor I am contributing to their surgeries at this time. I have no problem having my taxes cover their surgery or anyone elses even though it does not affect me or is even something I believe in. I have clearly stated that I have no problem having AHC cover these surgeries. I plan to write the proper authorities to try and fight the government on this decision. So, yes, I am in fact contributing with time and effort along side taxes(for the time being anyhow).
And for the record a sexual minority is a minority regardless of how you see it. Google transgendered and sexual minority comes up repeatedly, but why bother with the research. You say its so so it must be. Ba ha ha ha ha!
As for attention seeking....well I guess you know all about that! LOL! Your the pro! So once again you are oh so right. Not, but you can think you are because you will regardless of what other prove, say or know. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 7:20:05 PM | That's right - the topic is health care. From what I understand, the amount the province has for health care is $13 billion and the cost of gender reassignment surgeries is a paltry $700,000. How is this going to save taxpayers any substancial amount. To quote the headline of Ian Robinson's article in today's Calgary Sun ...."Picking on a tiny, troubled minority". Really ironic when you consider they spent $25 million to create a new slogan to replace "The Alberta Advantage", and possibly make-over our redneck image.
And trubble, you say you could pick out a transgendered person from someone being born that sex? There is a picture of three transgendered women and I wouldn't be able to pick them out as not being born female. You're probably thinking of men in drag (Well, duh!) not post-op transgendered.
http://www.calgarysun.com/comment/columnists/ian_robinson/2009/04/19/9164561-sun.html
I don't think the photo in the newspaper shows in this link. Oops, I shouldn't tell you that. You might have actually read it! | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 7:46:07 PM | just because some clown wastes taxpayer money on something stupid, doent mean they should repeat the stupidity process.
as a side point.. spare me the pretend civility daisy.im not about to go look at any homo sites you or anyone else posts.im not interested in any way shape or form tyvm
if you have a personal comments . email, otherwise dont bother me with your trivial comments aimed in my direction
as soon as omg comments,then start waving your pom-poms again,
this thread has merely been hijacked and used as a tool by certain tools, to push forth the homo agenda . frankly
since this is my last post on this thread, i still dont think it should be covered by any healthcare. if you wish to mutilate yourself, get yourself a nice sharp knife n chop away .i still wont pay for the knife tho. and i wont chip in for the funeral either 
i guess we can thank our stars that most of the canadians arent as mentally challenged as those who would push mentally ill people under the knife and allow them to undergo a disgusting mutilation of their naturally functioning bodies.
obviously the issue with these people is their minds,so why dont you get off the soapbox,and actually give a crap about these people and try to help them mentally before you enable and support a twisted unnatural operation
btw, even after chopping off a dink and adding fake tits.................. they are still men . as the adage goes........... a rose by any other name..... is still a rose | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 7:54:28 PM | | Pretend civility? I have no personal comments for you. I posted information pertinent to the topic - Specifically, the amount that this budget cut is about and the amount of the overall healthcare budget, as I don't think I've seen those figures anywhere here. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 9:12:19 PM |
they are still men . as the adage goes........... a rose by any other name..... is still a rose
Uh, don't know if I did that quote thing right. But anyway, it's attributable to trubble and of course to the great William Shakespeare....the rose part. When Juliet speaks about the curse inherent in her name, she says,
that which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet;
The meaning of the "adage" is that it doesn't matter what something is called, the only thing that matters is what it truly is. So very apropos. Couldn't be a more fitting epitaph for trubble in this thread. Very well said. Please just leave it at that.
Oh, one last thing, your homophobia. What happens if at some point in life you can't avoid "homos" anymore? Like, you get married, have a kid and his/her teacher, best friend, or, heaven's to betsie, your kid him/herself, is gay? How f'cking scary would that be? Or even worse, your kid has half a brain, grows up avoiding gay people for no reason, then realizes his dad is a prejudicial idiot. Avoiding someone because of their sexuality is judgemental. There's no need to avoid people you don't know unless you're prejudging them in some way.
also dont associate or participate in beastiality, am i also a beastialityphobe? or a pedophobe or how about a rapistophobe,
You numbskull. All those things are illegal!!! You should be avoiding those kind of people because they're criminals. Good lord you're fun.
obviously the issue with these people is their minds
Nope. You're still wrong. You can have a unique genetic code that juxtaposes one sex with the other in the same setting. That which we call a rose, by any other name would still be as sweet. It happens, the result is the mental issues you're thinking about. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/19/2009 10:38:39 PM | When I find myself in need of entertainment, I just tune into Channel POF and catch the latest Trubble story. It's kind of like reading about Lindsey Lohan and that bunch.
You feel so sorry for them because they are so fcked up but you absolutely can't take your eyes off someone making such as an ass of themselves. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/20/2009 5:59:50 AM | Well, I hate to be a party-pooper (as such mature antics are kinda comical and entertaining) but as has been stated more than once, this thread wasn't aimed at any sorta sexuality issues, it was asking (as the title states) whether AHC should cover sex change expenses. I think if the little clique of sympathizers here took a deep breath and tried to put away their mudflinging apparattuses long enough to address the topic being asked about, it'd be tough to argue that such a miniscule fraction of the populace merits the expense it incurs, when belts are being tightened all over the place in current times and pieces of healthcare important to far greater numbers of people are being axed already as well. (as an example, I think I'va seen a few mentions of chiropractic here already)
Look south people, it's coming here too whether folks like it or not. The biggest thing we can do to address the issue is to try and guide that evolution as we see fit. I believe this thread was an attempt to guage peoples feelings in exactly that way, on specifically the issue of sex change expenses, and do we wan't our tax dollars going there.
I feel it's kinda naive to think that government's a bottomless well that can just PAY FOR EVERYTHING JUST. It doesn't have a magic wand either. Many folks already complain about how much of their money goes towards taxes. I'd even be surprised if some of this little gathering saying pay, pay, pay, doesn't express that very concern themselves on occasion.
In summary and back on topic, (and to join the villainous crowd I guess ) despite being sympathetic to the few poor people aflicted with such a terrible disorder, I'd prefer if my tax dollars were allocated where they'd be used for things more important to a greater chunk of the general populace. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/20/2009 6:04:52 AM |
Be gone Ignoramus!
(Merriam-webster dictionary definition: utterly ignorant person; dunce)
I find it quite amusing, and yes, rather ironic, although typical, that the same posters who are blasting Trubble for being narrow minded and judgemental....can turn around and do the same thing to him that they are accusing him of.
Indeed, anyone who does not share your opinions must be an ignoramus. | |
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| Should AHC cover sex changes?
Posted: 4/20/2009 12:18:54 PM | ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whatever janalta.
At least I have some compassion and empathy for those who are afflicted. Apparently you don't suffer from any health condition otherwise you would feel the same.
And if you actually read the posts, this wasn't about anyone's opinions. It was based on facts that this actually is a bona fide condition albeit rare and recongnized by the medical community.
I never said anyone had to share my "opinions" but when I hear a grown man point fingers and use name calling and predjuidicial slurs along with actually admitting that he wouldn't even read about the condition, then yes, that makes him an ignoramus. | |
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