| The California Collapse
Posted: 6/27/2009 11:14:12 AM | Daddy,
You have no idea what you're missing. The food, music, the viewpoints, the dancing, the sense of peace and wonder that comes from so many people, all so different, all curious about one another and willing to get along.
Variety is the spice of life! | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 6/30/2009 10:51:09 PM | | Well the feel good spending may be over. CA is now issuing IOUs. Every jack ball in Sacramento ought to be tarred, feathered and run out of town on a rail. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/1/2009 1:29:14 PM | So Pirate,
You and I disagree on many things, but the ZBB every 10 years is something we can both get behind.
Shoudn't we start organizing a campaign to get that initiative on the ballot?
I cannot think of a more effective kick in the butt to all those ideological idiots (of every stripe) than that initiative! | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/2/2009 3:30:23 PM | Ace wrote:
So Pirate,
You and I disagree on many things, but the ZBB every 10 years is something we can both get behind.
Shoudn't we start organizing a campaign to get that initiative on the ballot?
I cannot think of a more effective kick in the butt to all those ideological idiots (of every stripe) than that initiative
I am willing to help get the ball rolling. I don't have much time these days. If some other folks on this thread want to get involved, I can form a yahoo group. The first thing to do is to come up with the language to define exactly what we want them to do with Zero based budgeting. We need a lawyer to help us with that and a CPA.
Simply put, I think once every 5 years a ZBB exercise needs to be done for the state. All financial legislation needs to be sun setted to eliminate redundancy. An elected panel of
auditors needs to be established to verify that it is done properly and that every spending project is evaluated for efficiency and effectiveness. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/2/2009 10:06:36 PM | | I don't know enough about ZBB to be of much help. The first I'd heard the term was here. My impression is that the people who start initiatives are usually well-connected to sources of lots of money. It might be interesting to contact Walter Moore to see if he could offer some useful advice. As a lawyer who's run for mayor of L.A., I'm sure he knows the inside story on initiatives. Another possible source of information is Doug McIntyre, the morning talk host on KABC. He's a very sharp guy who knows a lot about local and state politics here. He also knows Mr. Moore. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/23/2009 2:06:12 AM | CALIFORNIA
Sales Taxes
State Sales Tax: 8.25% (food and prescription drugs exempt. Tax varies according to locality. Can be as high as 10.25%)
Gasoline Tax: * 48.7 cents/gallon
Diesel Fuel Tax: * 52.0 cents/gallon
Cigarette Tax: 37 cents/pack of 20 plus an additional surcharge of 50 cents per pack, bringing the total to 87 cents.
Personal Income Taxes
Tax Rate Range: Low - 1.0%; High - 10.3%
Income Brackets: ** Lowest - $7,168; Highest - $1,000,000
Number of Brackets: 6
Tax Credits: Single - $99; Married - $198; Dependents - $309; 65 years of age or older - $99
Standard Deduction: Single - $3,692; Married filing jointly - $7,384
Medical/Dental Deduction: Same as Federal taxes
Federal Income Tax Deduction: None
Retirement Income Taxes: Social Security and Railroad Retirement benefits are exempt. There is a 2.5% tax on early distributions and qualified pensions. All private, local, state and federal pensions are fully taxed.
Retired Military Pay: Follows federal tax rules.
Military Disability Retired Pay: Retirees who entered the military before Sept. 24, 1975, and members receiving disability retirements based on combat injuries or who could receive disability payments from the VA are covered by laws giving disability broad exemption from federal income tax. Most military retired pay based on service-related disabilities also is free from federal income tax, but there is no guarantee of total protection.
VA Disability Dependency and Indemnity Compensation: VA benefits are not taxable because they generally are for disabilities and are not subject to federal or state taxes.
Military SBP/SSBP/RCSBP/RSFPP: Generally subject to state taxes for those states with income tax. Check with state department of revenue office.
Property Taxes
Property is assessed at 100% of full cash value. The maximum amount of tax on real estate is limited to 1% of the full cash value. After taxes have been paid, homeowners 62 and older who earn $35,051 or less may file a claim for assistance on 96 percent of property taxes, up to $34,000 of the assessed value of their homes. Call 800-852-5711 or visit for details. Homestead exemptions are handled at the county level. Under the homestead program, the first $7,000 of the full value of a homeowner's dwelling is exempt. The state has a property tax postponement program that allows eligible homeowners (seniors, blind and disabled residents) to postpone payments of property taxes on their principal place of residence. Interest is charged on the postponed taxes. For more information, click here or call 800-952-5661.
Inheritance and Estate Taxes
There is no inheritance tax. However, there is a limited California estate tax related to federal estate tax collection.
For further information, visit the California Franchise Tax Board or the California State Board of Equalization.
* Does not include 1 cent local option.
** For joint returns, the taxes are twice the tax imposed on half the income. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/23/2009 10:57:53 AM | Edding,
I don't fear it either, but neither do I welcome it. If the only difference between socialism, in which an insular elite who is not accountable to me owns the means of production, and campitalism, in which a different elite with a competing ideology controls the means of produciton, then it's "meet the new boss--same as the old boss."
If we were serious about equality and economic representation as well as political representation, we would have direct and indirect stakeholder representation on every corporate board. And, we would require companies to demonstrate that they operate in the public interest consistent with their charters and in exchange for the privilege of exemption from personal liability for their stockholders and managers.
Those would be the only structural change I would make to our economy, and they are in the exact opposite direction of socialism. They call for _more_ representation and accountability, not less. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/23/2009 3:45:51 PM |
Let me give you and example of how ridiculous Cali is:
I volunteer for an Non-Profit that is setting up a off leash dog park. Now the land was donated by Cal Trans and is a by pass that will never be used. We wanted to cut down all the weeds, level the ground and replant fresh grass, Cal Trans said go ahead. Guess what, Oh no in order to do this we have to pay the Cal EPA $3500 to do a environmental impact study that will take 3 -5 years. This is the kind of crap that makes doing business in this state ridiculous, no wonder businesses are fleeing and revenue is down.
I honestly believe that most of the agencies in the state are just a matter of self perpetuating, give me a pay raise, raise fees, taxation without representation, spun out of control bullsh!t.
dealing with any of the california environmental departments is good for a laugh but extremely frustrating.
I dealt with the guy in charge of CARB's vehicle modification department a few years ago. To this day i think that guy doesnt know anything about cars.  Basically i had an old 80s jeep that uses a carburetor, runs poorly, and pollutes much worse then any of the fuel injected counter parts.
Well Dodge created an EFI upgrade for like 3 grand. well long story short, someone figured out a way to do the exact the same upgrade for 800$ out of junkyard parts. After a few emails it came down the fact that even if i assembled the exact same kit, it wouldnt have the appropriate sticker.
My last email was asking the question: "So by Ca emission laws, it is more legal for my jeep to pollute twice as much as it would with fuel injection?"
I never got a reply.
I can only imagine what aftermarket companies go through. Since things that have nothing to do with emissions have to be certified to be legal. Which is probably a 5k minimum fee. lol | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 12:38:26 AM | So Cali has budget, no matte if you like it or not I found something really funny tonight. I was watching an interview with Arnold and before signing the budget he cut another 642 million with the line item veto.
Now what I find funny about it is all the state legislators are pissed now.
Arnold response was this, they handed him the budget and it was still 642 million over, but before he signed it or made any cuts they bailed out of town. There was no one left to even negotiate any of the line item veto's with. They bailed before it was signed are you kidding me.
So if you think your state legislators really care about anything other than their own paycheck, well? | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 12:54:24 AM | Future Mayor of San Francisco
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJZsVbCu4Hk | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 7:37:13 AM | A few years ago when Arnold was providing a $5B stem cell research grant I had a discussion with two school teacher friends of mine. They were adamant it was a grand idea. I was trying to explain this was an out-of-mission use of government money and that if there was payback private money would be all over it.
I was having dinner with them the other night, they were complaining bitterly about the impact this financial crisis was having on education. I reminded them of the prior discussion. They had no recollection of this conversation and were horrified at this misuse of money.
Go figure. After dinner I helped them remove the Obama stickers from their Prius's. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 8:44:00 AM |
we would have direct and indirect stakeholder representation on every corporate board.
Who do you think elects the board of directors now, but shareholders? They can pool their votes, and they can also replace members of the board--they're already well-represented. How would a corporation attract new shareholders, unless it were accountable to them? | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 9:38:54 AM | Shareholders aren't the only stakeholders whose interests require representation. Workers, suppliers, local communities, regional communities, direct customers, indirect consumers, and the public at large also have a legitimate stake in the operation of publicly traded companies. If GM had had a more broadly representative board, they would be hammering Toyota right now, because someone at the table would have pointed out the stupidity of resisting changes that were inevitable. GM could have also drawn on the social capital of those represented for support in obtaining legislation that would be favorable to their efforts to adapt.
I would have much preferred spending the how many billions we used to bail them out on retooling them to produce hybrids 5 years ago.
When you leave it up to the stockholders alone--or any group whose perspective is too narrow--you get groupthink resulting in suboptimization: the apparent maximization of short-term profits that sacrifices the potential for larger, longer term gains. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 9:42:18 AM |
I reminded them of the prior discussion. They had no recollection
golfcoast, notice how that happens a lot.... even in discussions in these threads.
If you are against over regulating, government control, The human CO2 theory of global warming and you feel we should drill here instead of the middle east.... Than they try and paint you as someone who doesn't care about the environment.
It isn't the WHAT you care about... it's the HOW.
Sure we have climate change... it has happened throughout the history of this planet, why would it stop now? And yes, we can always improve on the way we do things and do it cleaner. But in California... the green movement has just about as much to blame for our problems as does, illegal immigrants, our welfare and insurance policies and over regulation and taxing of it's businesses and people. It's the Liberal model, the same model and agenda we are fast tracking our country... Let me rephrase that... that some are moving our country towards.
It's like golfcoasts statement above... People don't remember back when they were for something.... because it was either politically correct or sounded pretty or nice without weighing the consequences... But when they realize what a disaster it really was... how it effects the rest of everything else... They act all pissed and forget they were for it. Just like voting in bills and signing them without reading them and than acting pissed when bonuses are realized... even when you knew they were there... cause you put them there. (right Dodds?)
California is a very liberal state, run by people like Pelosi, Boxer and many others who only have themselves to blame, and only care about themselves. What has happened here... should give us good warning what will become of America.
If we don't wake up and stop this Obamanation going on... we will wake up one day... and America will go bust... just like California. But don't think this isn't the plan of Obama and those he works for. America is too powerful to agree to join a one world order... so it has to fail... this is the plan. Obama is working it to perfection... Because there are way too many people who are asleep, or don't even care...
There is a bait and switch going on.... when the dust settles...  | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 9:48:49 AM | Ace? Stakeholders are represented when the laws of the state are obeyed. The aggrieved groups become stakeholders when they put skin in the game, i.e., become stockholders also, or start a competing firm that being made up of the proletariat insures success lol (god I crack me up).
Your definition of stakeholders are a bunch of thieves who under cover of intimidation dream up new ways to steal from productive people.
Bring on that big ol' MBA. BTW did you get that MBA in some kind of Stasi approved biz school? | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 10:25:45 AM | Workers, suppliers, local communities, regional communities, direct customers, indirect consumers, and the public at large.
Otherwise known as stockholders, they can all invest if they want to, no need to have it government mandated and controlled.
This is kind of and oxymoron of theories.
I don't need the government to represent me in my investments, so they can take the profits and pay for the their bloated programs. I will be awaiting my dividend check from GM when it becomes profitable, not holding my breath.
The biggest problem I see is that allot of these groups invested in the bloated market, real estate, etc. rather than putting long term municipal money into safer investments. When the market went bust they blame it all on wall street. Read any good investment book and it will say diversify.
Allot of the the municipalities, state and local went for the high risk, high profit to pay for their bloated retirement programs and when it went bust it was all, oh look what wall street did. Now they are broke.
Everybody is pissed because the housing flip and get rich quick stock market came crashing down and because they were idiot investors, got caught with their pants down, too bad.
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 10:40:21 AM | | ACE I am posing a challenge to you. If you will read "The case against Barak Obama, The unlikely rise and unexamined agenda of the medias favorite candidate" by David Freddoso I will read any book you suggest. If you want email me your address and I will send you my copy. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 2:17:43 PM |
Workers, suppliers, local communities, regional communities, direct customers, indirect consumers, and the public at large also have a legitimate stake in the operation of publicly traded companies.
I can hardly imagine a lot of people with no ownership interest in a firm telling it what to do. Why would any non-owner have standing to sue to enforce his demands? Since when does a corporation I don't own shares of have to do what I think it should? | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 3:07:03 PM | Ace? Stakeholders are represented when the laws of the state are obeyed. The aggrieved groups become stakeholders when they put skin in the game, i.e., become stockholders also, or start a competing firm that being made up of the proletariat insures success lol (god I crack me up).
When people walk in the workplace door, they _are_ putting skin in the game. Their own. You completely missed the point about the value of broader representation to the stockholders, didn't you? Perhaps the Japanese will get it, or maybe they already have.
As far as my MBA goes, my point was simply that liberals are not necessarily as narrowly read as you'd like to go on thinking. The school I went to had a conservative bias. My parents are both conservative, and my brother proudly proclaims himself a dittohead.
I understand your perspective, and it is narrow my friend. Black and white. My way or the highway. With me or agin' me. So when someone comes along to suggest a positive way to address the problems that actually do occur, you suspect them of plotting against your interest. Talk about drinking the kool-aid! Not every criticism of the system is a communist plot. Not every call for change is the thin edge of the Communist wedge.
Is immunity from personal liability a competitive advantage in the marketplace or not? If so, what do those who do not have it get in exchange for granting it?
You have some choices here. You can answer the question or you can balk at it. But if you balk at it, then it should be clear to you and everyone else that not only is your perspective too narrow to be taken seriously, but also too shallow. And if you now object to me making this about you and your perspective, please remember that you opened the door to this type of criticism by offering it up yourself. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 3:10:49 PM | Since when does a corporation I don't own shares of have to do what I think it should?
They can do whatever they want to when they're willing to put their own skin in the game--that is, forego the privilege of immunity from personal liability. That privilege is worth the cost of having to listen to some input from the rest of us, especially when the vast majority of us want them to prosper--so long as they do it ethically. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 3:24:58 PM |
ACE I am posing a challenge to you. If you will read "The case against Barak Obama, The unlikely rise and unexamined agenda of the medias favorite candidate" by David Freddoso I will read any book you suggest. If you want email me your address and I will send you my copy.
I just requested it from my library. I offer you three options:
The Color of Fear (movie, hard to find, very challenging)
Who Killed the Electric Car (movie)
The Omnivore's Dilemma, by Michael Pollan (food security) | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 3:28:17 PM |
Allot of the the municipalities, state and local went for the high risk, high profit to pay for their bloated retirement programs and when it went bust it was all, oh look what wall street did. Now they are broke.
I think that the government investment committees suffered from the same narrow focus and groupthink as the corporate boards. The only had finance people in the room when the decisions were being made. | |
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| The California Collapse
Posted: 7/30/2009 3:35:40 PM |
California is a very liberal state, run by people like Pelosi, Boxer and many others who only have themselves to blame, and only care about themselves. What has happened here... should give us good warning what will become of America.
Hey Jack,
I think you've made a really important statement here. The prevailing suspicion among conservatives is that liberals really don't care about anyone but themselves. Not only that, but liberals aren't really honest about their selfishness. At least conservatives are willing to acknowledge and harness the power of self interest via the market. Conservatives do not trust appeals to charitable aims and higher purposes coming from the government. When combined with the police power, good intentions are either outright deceptions or quickly devolve into coercion.
It is an understandable position. | |
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