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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 4:41:05 PM | vannili, according to your logic, any woman who doesn't "need" a man in her life shouldn't enter a dating site such as this, a singles club or smile at a man on the street?
No, I don't "need" a man in my life to be happy. Wasn't there a deathless thread on this last week that ultimately got deleted? People on there felt sorry for those of us who found happiness within ourselves, instead of relying on externals to make us happy. But let's not go there again!
It's fun to date, to discover another person, find out what makes them tick and how their interests dovetail - or don't - with mine. That's a want, however, not a need. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 4:44:50 PM |
To those saying they want a man but don't need one,where do you think you wants come from? Wants spring from needs.
Wants spring from desire ,could be an intangible necessity like experience of sharing life with the opposite sex that makes you a whole person, or other factors like a childless couple who adopted kids to experience parent hood.
Needs is a mandatory like things essential to life, food,shelter,peoples help, etc. you may be right because LOVE is essential to human being ,we can not survive with out connecting and bonding with others. I have observes some single people that are happy,diverting their love to other matters ,like volunteer works to destitute people or some other activity to make them a whole person.
Some women wants to share their life to someone to experience- to love and be loved,but some times it doesn't last that the result is painful that leaves scar in their heart.
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 4:45:22 PM |
OP, The kind of man you speak of, who is actually willing to do things in a realtionship, to give, to care about someone besides himself, who is able to love, be a partner, has been a very ellusive creature in my world. At the age of 49, I really do have to say that I have yet to have one of these types of men in my life, and that includes all male relatives, daddy, boyfriends, the whole ballgame.
What I have seen almost exclusively is men that are interested in their ego, building their empire, doing what they want to do when they want to do it, no honey do list, no requests whatsoever. I have seen men who love to come over for home cooked meals, massages, sex, whatever they can get and then go off on their merry way, writing that next chapter in their saga. If the woman has alot of money and assetts, something that he could utilize to make his life easier, he may stick around. Or if the man is really attracted to you sexually and the woman is hot and sexy and it is an ego rush for him, then he may be more willing to put some energy into it.
But from what I have seen, men are interested in the payoff, plain and simple. They have been a whole lot of work and absolutey no reward for me, if anything a detriment to my security and peace of mind. Most ARE this way. Not only a few.
So that is why we say we can live without a man. We have never had one we could count on for anything in the first place. What are we supposed to do, shrivel up and die?
I don`t request or expect a thing from a man. That way I am not disappointed when I come to the realization that he is only like the rest, no matter what a good guy he said he is. It is all about what is in it for him.
I view men like any other enjoyable vice such as alcohol, gambling, drugs----fun in the beginning but it destroys in the end.
This post has left me speachless.
This is exactly what I meet. Men who don`t WANT to do anything. They may do some things, but do it so begrudgingly and with such a chip on their shoulders, and get so nasty, I`d just rather do it myself, and pass on the man helping. It`s the ticked off attitude they demonstrate when having to do anything they don`t want to do.
So I have just decided, just be around them when they are doing something they want to do ( their hobby, eating or sex) That way, I don`t have to put up with the nastiness and unending complaining. If you don`t want to be in a relationship that requires effort, don`t .Stay alone. Live a simple life, do what you want to do when you want to do it. Don`t do anything for a woman that you begrudge ( which is almost everything besides sex) and be happy. There are women that are like me, don`t want to push a man to do anything and don`t want to be around him when he is getting all pissy because he might have to do something. Stay alone. There`s enough women out there that don`t want a man around for anything besides sex, that you can find a lover to take care of that. And........no more expectations than that. There are plenty of women who will require no financial help, may even help you, won`t ask a thing of you. You should be happy with this and have nothing to gripe about. Play your life away, some of us just plain aren`t going to try and change that. We get it!
We understand what alot of men want. That`s why we don`t bother even considering a relationship. Men don`t want to do anything.
And this post has left me speachless and angry.... | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:04:15 PM |
I view men like any other enjoyable vice such as alcohol, gambling, drugs----fun in the beginning but it destroys in the end.
Wow... I am sorry you feel destroyed.
I heard on the radio last week that "Bitterness" is an actual medical diagnosis now. (true story)
The official term is: Post-Traumatic Embitterment Disorder
Look it up. Maybe there's help for you.  | |
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| I understand what you are saying....
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:06:25 PM | Motivational theory, really. We are motivated by our highest unmet need. So, if someone isn't worried about his/her survival needs, safety, social needs, etc.. at some point, he/she feels that "what's missing" is to have a special someone in his/her life. Because the more important needs are already fulfilled, the focus becomes finding someone to love, and to be loved in return. It thus becomes the need that feels most urgent.
...being somewhat familiar with Maslow myself. And while I do not entirely agree with you, I "get it" and also would not dismiss it out of hand.
But...what you are describing isn't what the OP is saying.
What you are saying is that step by step...as you climb Maslow's pyramid...the next thing becomes a pressing "need". However, a significant percentage of people in the world never get past being able to take level one and level two (physiological and safety) for granted. They live there entire lives having to actively deal with fulfilling these needs through focused effort. Interestingly enough, these people aren't necessarily unhappy...many a study has found that persons in 3rd world countries where concerns in these areas are more prevalent than here in the U.S. and Canada still report higher levels of satisfaction with life.
It seems that not being able to buy the model 1080dpi HD big screen TV you want just doesn't become a concern if you have never watched television...
What you are referring to, a satisfaction of Maslow's 3rd and 4th layers, cannot be done by just ANY person. It requires the RIGHT person. Accordingly, the vast majority of heterosexual women I know are very, very open to the idea of meeting the RIGHT man.
By comparison, what the OP is inferring is that any woman who isn't open to having ANY man who comes along in her life...the women who for example sent him packing in the past...are doomed to be "unhappy" simply by fact there is no man in their life. But "any" man wouldn't satisfy the "need" you are referring to...it has to be the RIGHT man.
Indeed, it follows that the wrong man would not only fail to help a climb up Maslow's pyramid, but inhibit it, by causing disruption to things like self esteem, confidence, sexual intimacy, or even safety.
Accordingly, a woman would probably be BETTER off without ANY man in their life versus the WRONG man in their life...something most of them already discovered without having to sit in a 200 level psychology class.... | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:13:07 PM | I know very few women that don't need men.
Exception, women who say they don't need men, gay women, or women that were really abused might be this target.
Most average every day woman always needs a man, that is the way women are designed. Strangely I find the exact opposite that happens, MEN WHO DON'T NEED A WOMAN.
What's your opinion. | |
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| I understand what you are saying....
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:18:35 PM |
...what the OP is inferring is that any woman who isn't open to having ANY man who comes along in her life..
Your interpretation is quite different from mine... what you are describing is more of a PANIC DESPERATION.
To me, a need is simply a strong desire to fulfill a want -- vs. a passive "take it or leave it" stance. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:18:36 PM | War ! Huh! What is it good for? Evidently something ! (Good God, Y'all)
Do I need a man to survive? Hail, no.
Do I need a man in order to thrive? Wail, yes.
Do I need a man to feed me & pay my bills? No.
Do I need a man to change my tire? If I want it done in less than 3 hours -- YES.
Thank you Timothy Paul, for being such a skillful poster. There is a discernible topic; it is accurately described in your subject line; you've communicated your viewpoint without trashing other people's; and you've baited the man- and woman-haters into revealing themselves.
Good day's work if they don't delete it for being the millionth, billionth, quadrillionth, fillionth, villionth, post on this topic. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:23:37 PM |
Exception, women who say they don't need men, gay women, or women that were really abused might be this target.
Are you for real?!
Most average every day woman always needs a man, that is the way women are designed. Strangely I find the exact opposite that happens, MEN WHO DON'T NEED A WOMAN.
Are you for real?!
What's your opinion.
Are you for real?! | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:23:43 PM | msg85. My opinion is if a MAN WHO DON'T NEED A WOMAN ,needs a mothering (you bet even a 60 yrs.man needs mothering) cook, laundry,housecleaner,massuer,hooker,confidantes, financial partner did I forget something else ?oh yeah,
mother of his kids, THAT MAN NEEDS ME, Gee, I (don't) feel like a woman.. LOL
PS.Masculinist: Agreed and Highfive. Vannili | |
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| Again...
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:28:52 PM |
Your interpretation is quite different from mine... what you are describing is more of a PANIC DESPERATION.
To me, a need is simply a strong desire to fulfill a want -- vs. a passive "take it or leave it" stance.
...this is a debate about what the words mean...semantics.
Ok....let's go look...
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/need
1: necessary duty : obligation
2 a: a lack of something requisite, desirable, or useful b: a physiological or psychological requirement for the well-being of an organism
3: a condition requiring supply or relief
4: lack of the means of subsistence : poverty
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/need
1. a requirement, necessary duty, or obligation: There is no need for you to go there.
2. a lack of something wanted or deemed necessary: to fulfill the needs of the assignment.
3. urgent want, as of something requisite: He has no need of your charity.
4. necessity arising from the circumstances of a situation or case: There is no need to worry.
5. a situation or time of difficulty; exigency: to help a friend in need; to be a friend in need.
6. a condition marked by the lack of something requisite: the need for leadership.
7. destitution; extreme poverty: The family's need is acute.
So it seems you definition:
2 a: a lack of something requisite, desirable, or useful b: a physiological or psychological requirement for the well-being of an organism
and my definition:
3: a condition requiring supply or relief
2. a lack of something wanted or deemed necessary: to fulfill the needs of the assignment.
Both apply.
I still say however that the OP was attempting to infer that any woman who stated she didn't "need" a man was doomed to be unhappy, by definition. That the lack of a man in a woman's life meant that she was unhappy...that she could not BE happy without a man.
And again, my (solicited) response to such a line of thinking would be:
You strike me as a misogynistic, self absorbed, and yet somehow needy man. IMHO.
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:29:48 PM | I wish I remember which woman poster posted this...she's someone who's posting's I respect and admire....anyway...I borrowed her post cause I liked it:
I wanted to let you know of my needs (or wants rather). So what do I want? I want to be loved......I want to be desired...I want to be missed...I want to be appreciated....I want to be wanted (and needed)....I want someone to go you did/cooked/prepared/do that for me? ...I want someone to laugh with me (and at me too)...I want a partner...I want a friend...I want an ally...I want passion...I want someone who believes in me yet who knows (and accepts) my limitations and flaws...I want to be a family, a unit...I want that you and me against the world feeling again...I want outta here.. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:34:53 PM | desert wildflower, your post makes me so sad. I'm so sorry you never had the experience of at least one loving, wonderful man in your life. They are out there - really.
I can live without a man, sure. I have CarMax for my car needs, I can support myself nicely and I can even change lightbulbs. If anything that needs fixing requires a screwdriver, I'm usually good with that, too.
Do I want a man in my life? Sure, that would be great. But.....if he doesn't happen to come my way in this lifetime, I'll be just fine.
Don't tar all men with the same brush. Lots of men are really good at being with a woman. | |
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| Again...
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:40:28 PM |
I still say however that the OP was attempting to infer that any woman who stated she didn't "need" a man was doomed to be unhappy, by definitio
A woman who feels a "need" to make a point of aggressively saying that she "doesn't need a man" on a dating site, is a woman with issues, in most cases. People who are consumed with "issues", generally are unhappy.
If a woman truly didn't "need" a man, or "want" one, if you prefer that word, wouldn't be likely to waste her time with a dating site in the first place. So, it's one of those counter-productive behaviors that warns off those type of men, who she most likely would like to have in her life, leaving the available pool of men, as being those with few options.
I wouldn't go into a restaurant, and make a point of saying that Im not starving to death, so therefore I don't "need" to order lunch. As someone said earlier, if my shoes wear out, I wouldn't make a point that, since it's summer, I don't "need" shoes, and then go barefoot to prove how much I don't "need" shoes.
In the social sciences it is well accepted that people have needs far beyond the basics for survival. It's called Mazlow's pyramid of "needs" not the pyramid of "wants". An emotionally healthy person is willing to admit to needs beyond mere survival, so those who make a point, for no reason, to say how much they don't "need" a man, are likely to be a pain in the ass to date. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:59:05 PM |
Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Isn't the point of saying that she doesn't need one is that she IS already happy without one? Finding a man AND being happy are not the same thing. It doesn't make sense. If you don't need one, you're less likely to find one, and STILL be happy. Isn't that the point? Also, men often say that they don't like needy women, so saying that women NEED a man goes against what many men claim to want. And there are MANY needy women that fail continuously to find a man, precisely because they want one so bad. | |
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| And you know this...
Posted: 7/9/2009 5:59:12 PM |
A woman who feels a "need" to make a point of aggressively saying that she "doesn't need a man" on a dating site, is a woman with issues, in most cases.
...because you've spent time with some number of them? Was it a statistically valid sample?
I get your point, and I SOMEWHAT agree, but what is the definition of "aggressively"? If a woman were to put in her profile:
Having raised my kids, moved out of the house into a maintenance free condo, and reached t near the pinnacle of my professional field, I no longer need a man in my life. I pretty much have all the bases covered. But, having more free time thanks to the kids being all grown up, I sure would like a special one to spend time with
...is that "aggressive"? To me, she is trying to send the message "I don't want or need to be the center of your universe, and I don't want you to be the center of mine. I can take care of myself. But I sure would like some company while doing so". THAT is the sort of woman I want in my life.
If a woman truly didn't "need" a man, or "want" one, if you prefer that word, wouldn't be likely to waste her time with a dating site in the first place.
Agreed. So shouldn't this tell us that we shouldn't obsess about the semantics of a persons' profile...that if they are HERE, then they probably are open to meeting someone?
So, it's one of those counter-productive behaviors that warns off those type of men, who she most likely would like to have in her life
I'm thinking the opposite. I'm thinking warns off obsessive uptight ass misogynistic bitter pricks who she most likely would NOT like to have in her life, but that is just my opinion.
I wouldn't go into a restaurant, and make a point of saying that Im not starving to death, so therefore I don't "need" to order lunch.
But you might go into a restaurant and make a point of saying you weren't in a hurry in order to let the wait staff know you wanted to take your time reviewing the menu, and that you'd like to enjoy a leisurely paced meal.
To me, that is the EXACT difference between a desperate woman who "needs" a man in order to help make ends meet and help her not be lonely, and one who is content and fulfilled in her life who doesn't "need" one.
In the social sciences it is well accepted that people have needs far beyond the basics for survival. It's called Mazlow's pyramid of "needs" not the pyramid of "wants".
But not everyone is a student of the social sciences, nor are many people intimate with Maslow, so I am not going to get my jock all wound up because a woman says she doesn't "need" me. I read that to mean no more than EXACTLY what she said...she doesn't NEED me.
I am very glad to know that. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 6:17:22 PM | Just for today, I don't need you, but I'd like to experience you.
Just for today, my body works fine, my health is good, my mind is sound...so I can live without you, but I wish I had you to share this with.
Just for today, I can make it with the support of my community, my friends, and my family but I sure wish they knew you.
Just for today, I can enjoy my own company and enjoy the fantasy of who you might be, who you could be, but I am surviving without you here.
Just for today, I'm okay being single.
That doesn't mean I won't love you. When I find you, I will want nothing more.
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And that's how I see need vs. want. | |
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| Are women who don't need men likely to ever find one and be happy?
Posted: 7/9/2009 6:24:58 PM | msg78 -
<div class="quote"> vannili ,according to your logic,any woman who doesn't "need" a man in her life shouldn't enter a dating site such as this,singles club or smile?? at a man on the street ?
Sweet,interacting with someone is two way street, my personal logic is not an imposed to any one. I don't expect that it will not raise an argument,and that is the point to keep the ball rolling. I shared what I have in mind on how I grasped the question. Whatever your truth and intention in this site I respect it.
My truth and intention in this dating site is trying my luck to find Mr.Great Man to* want him* share my life and love experience, my horizon was broaden from some posters > Wants spring from Needs< I realized I NEED to be a whole person to have a meaning of my life, that is why I want a man for happiness. But if he doesn't come I have the power to divert my happiness and fulfilment in another way...
Our mind is like a rainbow of different colors and that is the beauty in each of us.. I bid you peace and happiness | |
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| And you know this...
Posted: 7/9/2009 6:31:38 PM | Re: Post #98
To me, that is the EXACT difference between a desperate woman who "needs" a man in order to help make ends meet and help her not be lonely, and one who is content and fulfilled in her life who doesn't "need" one.
I'll grant that some men may put a positive interpretation on the statement, but the reality is that a woman can convey the same message positively. The rest of her profile should communicate that her life isn't a train wreck, and that she isn't desperate or, for some reason, looking for a "white knight" to rescue her. By telling the reader a bit about her life, career, and future hopes, she will address all those things in a positive, attractive way.
My default assumption is that a woman in whom I'd have initial interest is a self-sufficient, emotionally healthy woman, who has a reasonably full life. So, when I read how much she doesn't "need a man", it warns me that there's a good chance that she is going to have "issues" to deal with, just to get to "hello".
Negative statements in a profile are off putting, and often are there in response to "issues" that the person is struggling with. Negatives do nothing to "attract" and rarely serve to screen out the men she wouldn't want in her life. "no players", as an example, will not deter the "players", but will be off putting to some of the men reading it, because they will assume that she's suspicious of men, thinking that they're likely to be "players", and so on.
Women can put whatever they like in their profiles. My only point is that it can be interpreted negatively, when someone is just doing a quick read. My experience has been that often the women who put "I don't need a man" in their profiles, are those women found in the fora spewing bitterness and anger towards men. Most of the profiles I read are from the fora, which is why I trust that perception as valid. | |
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