There are inexperienced girls who are naturally gifted with the mail, erm, instrument. I'd say my sister is one, but I am not.

That being said, we are talking like other-side-of-the-globe far, far away.

And then again, I don't know if it's possible for me to both feel VERY physically attracted to someone AND VERY comfortable around someone. I'm afraid those tendencies for me work against each other.

I also wonder whether in most dating situations or relationships its usual for one person to be more physically attracted to the other than vice versa?

And is it usual to feel really intimidated by guys you find really attractive?

And to find feeling really comfortable around someone to be less sexy?

On the other hand, I've heard the whole logic of how after a few months intense physical attraction for anyone dissipates a bit, and that the best longterm relationships occur between people who are really comfortable together

I don't know if it's possible for me to both feel VERY physically attracted to someone AND VERY comfortable around someone

I also think this lack of attraction for him and his extreme attraction towards you is a very appealing scenario for you (and most women) because it a) puts you at ease since you do not feel initimidated by him or that you aren't good enough for him and b) it is easy to get addicted to how attentive and complimentary he is towards you.

I agree with A and B, however I did not say I had a total lack of physical attraction for him, I just said that it wasn't as strong as it's been with some other guys.

But I have two more thoughts here, the first is that the last guy I was strongly physically attracted to, I don't think I developed that attraction until AFTER we did some making out and heavy petting, and I think his technique (very aggressive in bed) had a lot to do with, although he was also very good-looking. Technbique is something that can be learned.

The other thing is that well frankly, we don't always get to get with the people we are most attracted to. I kind of suspect that the guys I feel that very strong, immediate physical attraction for tend to be guys who are better looking than I am, so by continuing to chase them all I will be doing is continuing to chase broken hearts...

And that maybe "settling" at the beginning isn't such a bad thing... because your feelings for someone change over time anyway.

I've tried to do this little exercise in my mind, where I picture the guy I was wildly attracted to before (but who broke it off with me and I've since had somewhat of an ambiguous relationship to) changing his mind and saying he wants to get with me, and I try to choose between that guy and the newer guy. It's REALLY tough... but I think I might still go with the newer guy.

The emotional connection I feel towards him is NOT just what I feel towards my other guy friends. It's more complext than that... somehow.

Regardless, the point is that if not for this newer guy's great personality and the emotional connection you made with him, you'd not likely have given him a second thought if he say, walked into bar you were at.

I would disagree with that. That is much more of a confidence issue and not feeling like you aren't good enough for someone simply because they are more conventionally attractive that you. Or are you suggesting that you will eventually break the heart of this new guy (assuming you were to date) just because you are the more attractive one?

I have a sneaking suspicion that if you and the newer guy HAD stayed in the same geographical location, the relationship would have fizzled out in quite short order (short of him being the best sex you ever had or something).

I think it would have been the longest relationship I've ever had, based on the extreme brevity of my others.

you seem to be trying to convince yourself (like so many women who post here) that there is some correlation between "really good-looking" guys and you being rejected by them after sleeping with them....there isn't one.

That is simply your insecurities playing into your rationalization. Perhaps you need to look outside your individual experience and realize how ridiculously common it is for women, such as yourself, who have been burned by very attractive men in the past, to find solace in guys who are somewhat attractive but have great personalities.

Of course a relationship like that would last longer than any previous one you've had but that is meaningless given what you've said about your previous relationships. Just because a guy is "better" than anything you've had previously, doesn't mean you should start a relationship with him.

How would you know? Does it not make sense that if you pursue a guy who has many options among women, you're lessening your odds? Not everyone can have a relationship with a really good-looking guy, just as not everyone can have a relationship with a really good-looking woman. I think both men and women could stand to be less superficial and more realistic. They say the relationships that last the longest are between people who rank similarly on the "conventional attractiveness" scale.

Again I say, how is that a bad thing? It's not simply "finding solace" if you want to be with the person. It IS perhaps learning to appreciate people who appreciate you. And attributing it all to "insecurities" assumes that I'm being totally irrational. Well let me tell you, I've watched quite a few men fall head over heels for the most conventionally attractive girl they'd ever dated, when other girls couldn't move them nearly as much. So I believe looks matter.

Right. I should just stay single forever until Mr. Perfect comes along... except, not everyone gets to be with Mr. Perfect, so I may just be single forever. OR, I could stop expecting some kind of fairy tale, and live my life interacting with other people fully, learning from those experiences, and accepting that life is imperfect. I think I come closer to loving this boy than I ever have with anyone.

Obviously you are someone who places lust in a position of importance above all else. Me? I've felt extreme lust, I've satiated it three hours after meeting someone, and? Well, it's a good story yet I believe there are far more important things in life.

Personally, when it comes to this immediate physical attraction thing, I've felt that lessoning with my age. I think in high school I fantasized over screwing at least a quarter of the boys in my class. Since then I've become increasingly pickier, maybe due to bad relationship experiences, a higher assessment of myself, and other things. A lot of attraction is in your head, and changes over time and with experience. I haven't felt myself being very attracted to ANYONE in quite a long time. I want to live a little.

And by your logic you shouldn't date anyone rich, successful, or intelligent either since you would be "lessening your odds" with those people as well.

Fortunately, some people would rather not date the lowest common denominator of society simply becuase there is a decreased chance of rejection.

"Learning to appreciate people who appreciate you" is perhaps the best rationalization i've ever heard for settling. Well done.

And no, i wouldn't say you are being totally irrational, but i would say that you are allowing your past relationship experiences to devalue what you think you deserve in a partner.

You made the jump from "a guy better than anything you've had previously" to Mr. Perfect!? I hate to break it to you but there is a lot of grey area between the two. Frankly, if the options are a) date someone who "appreciates me" but that i'm not particularly attracted to or b) stay single, then yes, i think option b is the preferred choice. However, if you wish to perpetually date anyone and everyone who is remotely physical attractive to you but happens to treat you well, more power to you. Most people don't have that kind of time.

On the contrary, i specifically said that the "wild physical attraction" you experienced in previous relationships should NOT be considered a factor as far as a "real" relationship goes but rather, lust. I don't think lust has much if anything to do with long term relationships.

How you manage to equate wanting to be with someone LESS attractive as being MORE picky is truly mind boggling. You are, in fact, being less picky and clearly have a LOWER assessment of yourself.

You act as though a guy who is attractive AND very appreciative of you is some sort of mythical creature only found in Greek legend. Yes, it's harder to find but it's far from impossible.

In conventional measurements, I am both intelligent and successful (and definitely not poor) for someone my age. So, looking for those things in a partner (such as this boy) simply means we are well-matched.

I would not consider this boy anywhere near the lowest common denominator.

Well, there are a lot of people in our culture that value something more if it was a challenge to get it. I think I am one of those people, who in the past have tended to be more attracted to people who haven't showed me much attention or appreciation. That too can be about insecurity and not valuing yourself (i.e. thinking those who'd actually like you aren't desirable enough), albeit in a more subconscious way.

If past experiences aren't for learning from, I don't know what they're for.

Well, perhaps in the last sentence there you are speaking from a guy's perspective? Because I think there may be more guys in this world who are ***holes than women who are ***holes. But anyhow, he doesn't just treat me well, it's head and shoulders better than what anyone else has treated me, AND it's not in a creepy suck-up way, it is in fact just that we both care about each other a lot. And I talked about "Mr. Perfect" because I think in order for me, being who I am, to not have uncertainties or ask these kind of questions about whether I should date a guy, he would pretty much have to be Mr. Perfect. Because I am the type of person who tends to worry a lot, be constantly picking out flaws in others, and second-guessing myself a lot. Is that about insecurity? Sure, and that's the kind of thing I'm trying to work on getting over.

Really? Then why again are you telling me getting with this guy would be a bad idea? Because I think he's more or less perfect for me in every other respect...

Actually, I simply meant that to feel that strong immediate physical attraction is becoming rarer and rarer for me. And I think that might be based on experience, and my body telling me I need to change my values.

Well, it's been around ten years I've been interested in dating, and I haven't found one yet. (If by "attractive" you mean that strong, immediate physical attraction which I've said I've only felt with around half a dozen people, including two guys I've hooked up with.) I'm not interested in waiting another ten years.

I just happen to recognize myself that I'm extremely picky and critical in the looks department when viewing the opposite sex. Probably moreso than it is healthy to be (for instance, I'm constantly looking at the boyfriends of my sisters and good female friends and thinking they're ugly). Personally, I think logic points to this being a problem on my part, and something I need to work on.