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| | Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?Page 17 of 22 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22) | "i simply can not imagine how another man would just be "meh" about his own child."
Symbolically speaking: a woman is a mother from the moment she feels the first kick of the baby in the womb, a man feels himself father from the moment the baby born grabs his tumb around with the litle hand.
Theoretically speaking: the emotional bond is stablished for the mother from the day one because is inside her; for the man, since is not physical, is somehow, something abstract until birth when become reality rather than an idea, presencial rather than imaginary, a life which can be seen rather than a dream...
For a man who doesn´t want to be father... futhermore, who rejects to be father... is easy to be emotionally detached. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 3:55:59 PM | ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
you equate man´s sex for pleasure with the wish to be father.
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No I don't.. I simply have the same expectations of a man that they do for a woman.. if the" sex for pleasure" results in a pregnancy then both of them have to take care of the impending child. If no pregnancy result then have at it.
QueenBeeSweetness said it much better then I did. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 6:01:33 PM |
Theoretically speaking: the emotional bond is stablished for the mother from the day one because is inside her; for the man, since is not physical, is somehow, something abstract until birth when become reality rather than an idea, presencial rather than imaginary, a life which can be seen rather than a dream...
I think this is an important point and is really the answer to the OP.
As usual, women believe that men should think and feel the same way that women do and if men don't, then they are somehow deficient. Men, as usual, understand where women are coming from much better than women understand what men are about simply because of women's feeling of superiority in most things.
I am always amazed by women's fatalistic attitude as well, which is another problem with understanding when this topic comes up. A large number of women love the deniable plausibility of an "oopsie" pregnancy. Rather than taking whatever measures they possibly can to prevent pregnancy, knowing that there area men who will not share their happiness in getting pregnant, the women love to roll the dice not really caring about, and likely secretly hoping for, pregnancy.
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 6:12:18 PM | So now dealing with the consequences of your actions and taking responsibility for them is deemed fatalistic???
I understand where men are coming from. It still doesn't excuse them from the part the played in it and the responsibility it brings.
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the women love to roll the dice not really caring about, and likely secretly hoping for, pregnancy.
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I'm always amazed by the men's out look that when a woman becomes unintentionally pregnant it was in fact on purpose for some reason or another..
We can play the blame game all day long.. in the end it doesn't' matter.. there is a child that was created by 2 people and it need to be taken care of by both of them. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 6:21:29 PM |
So now dealing with the consequences of your actions and taking responsibility for them is deemed fatalistic???
Not deemed, most women's attitude IS fatalistic when it comes to pregnancy. Most women dream of having kids one day. Most men don't really give it much thought at all, and if they do, it's much later in life than women.
I understand where men are coming from.
Hmmm... I haven't seen much from your posts that would support this statement.
...there is a child that was created by 2 people and it need to be taken care of by both of them.
Yes, but it's only brought INTO the world by ONE person's decision.
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 6:45:40 PM | | One person can't have sex with themselves that produces offspring.. Therefore it's is TWO people's decision. If I could pass the pregnancy on to you.. i'd gladly forgo it.. and still take care of the baby after it's born. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 6:51:40 PM |
Therefore it's is TWO people's decision.
I agree, the sex involves two people. The decision to bring a child into the world lies solely with the woman.
I could pass the pregnancy on to you.. i'd gladly forgo it..
Well, maybe YOU would, but, really, if having a kid is so Gawwwwd-Awful, why do women do it ONCE, let alone numerous times? Kinda stupid, really, if it's so horrible, especially since most females have listened to the horror stories of their mothers, sisters, aunts, friends since before they even knew what a hard penis looked like.
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/10/2012 8:23:53 PM | Legally, the bare minimum a man has to do if he chooses to abandon his child, is break off a little chunk of chump change for child support.
And some don't even do that...
Men, like it or not, abortion & pregnancy is a womans issue.
I recognize the consequences of making abortion illegal, & womans bodily autonomy.
Women hold the post-conception choices, because women gestate & birth the children.
And really, there is no way a woman can force a man to be a father.
So keeping all these things in mind, I would definitely think that women hold themselves significantly more responsible and hold themselves to a higher standard than men.
Here's a question, what do you do about these guys that bail, and don't even pay child support? So far, all I've seen from these forums is a lot of fist-shaking and feet-stamping.
i tried the shot years ago & it made clumps of my hair fall out & i had dizzy spells.........i give up using artificial hormones, i dont react well to them.
If/when a male pill comes out, I'm sure there will be several men that will have similar testaments and choose to forgo taking it because of which. And not only that, you're talking about probably a handful of variations to the pill as opposed to the hundreds that women have. Seeing how women have a 50+ year head start on the pill, there is a lot of catching up to do. Until then. Condoms are the way to go. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 7:03:26 AM |
So keeping all these things in mind, I would definitely think that women hold themselves significantly more responsible and hold themselves to a higher standard than men.
Yes that would be nice, but I would think, that men, knowing that they have no post-conception choices because of the way biology works, & can not have an abortion, nor give birth, would hold themselves to a high standard as well.
Here's a question, what do you do about these guys that bail, and don't even pay child support? So far, all I've seen from these forums is a lot of fist-shaking and feet-stamping.
I dont do anything about them. It is not my job to chase down the deadbeat Fathers of the world & make them pay child support. I feel bad for their children, I dont understand it, but there is nothing I can do about them. I just live my life, make sure my kids are well loved, cared, & provided for, & thank God i had a man in my life who cherished the children, & cherished his Fatherhood, & wanted children. I cant make a difference in the world but i make a difference in my home.
If/when a male pill comes out, I'm sure there will be several men that will have similar testaments and choose to forgo taking it because of which
Of course there will be. Artificial hormones are nothing to screw with, if they dont react well with your body they can cause more harm than good. I am sure it will be wonderful for the men it does work well for, but it isnt going to work for everyone. It is a great idea, but wont be a magic "save the world" pill.
And not only that, you're talking about probably a handful of variations to the pill as opposed to the hundreds that women have.
There is only a select handful of pills i personally can take, & even those few have caused problems, miscarriages being the biggest one. What particular pill would you recommend? I have tried Ortho-Novum, Nortrel, Ortho-Tri-Cyclen, Alesse, Micro-Nor, Nor-Q-D, Seasonique, Camila, Errin, & Jollivette.
I can not take anything but Norethindrone, & Norethindrone is not strong enough to stop ovulation, so i would have miscarriages on that pill rather than just not ovulate. I do Natural Family Planning now & couldnt be happier. What brand & dosage would you suggest?
Until then. Condoms are the way to go.
And there is also nonoxynyl-9 that can be used in conjunction with condoms. And choosing female partners wisely. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 7:05:43 AM |
Well, maybe YOU would, but, really, if having a kid is so Gawwwwd-Awful, why do women do it ONCE, let alone numerous times? Kinda stupid, really, if it's so horrible, especially since most females have listened to the horror stories of their mothers, sisters, aunts, friends since before they even knew what a hard penis looked like.
Because of the rewards. Creating our own families. And we tend to forget & gloss over how bad it really was until we are back in the delivery room. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 7:20:50 AM | | ^^^ I am quite educated in how pregnancy works, when you go through infertility & have to resort to Doctors & Clomid to conceive, you end up having so much knowledge on the subject you could write a book about it, thanks for the tip though, will keep it in mind. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 7:38:12 AM |
Because of the rewards. Creating our own families. And we tend to forget & gloss over how bad it really was until we are back in the delivery room.
I'm sure you are correct. For women there is a payoff no matter how horrendous the experience. Which is why I say that women are so fatalistic about getting pregnant. Rolling the dice has a payoff even if they throw craps and get "accidentally" pregnant.
Men just plain don't see it like this unless they really want a kid and really love the woman they're banging.
It really ain't rocket surgery....
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 7:41:53 AM | | After skimming thru some of the posts here single moms think having kids is the greatest thing in the world. Now once they give birth their world changes and they start ****in. Some dont learn from one mistake and continue to reproduce. And of course its always the guys fault for getting them pregnant... | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 4:44:20 PM | ~~~~~~~~~~~
And of course its always the guys fault for getting them pregnant.
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Who said that? All I've seen any woman say is that it takes 2 and both are responsible.
All I've seen the men say is that it's not their responsibility and it's all the woman's fault.
Of course once we have the children we think it's the greatest thing in the world!! What else could we think???
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 6:23:45 PM | Who said that? All I've seen any woman say is that it takes 2 and both are responsible.
I have no problem with this premise....but answer me this....how do single mothers suggest they are upholding their responsibilities when based on government statistics...only 50% hold down full time employment?
I would suggest that financial and emotional responsibility is something both are required to illustrate...and suggesting you do not have enough money to eat...does not suggest prudent responsible choices being made to have brought in a innocent child into this world....having so many single custodial mothers being unemployed or not working full time to provide for themselves...let alone their children does not suggest responsible behavior.
Of course once we have the children we think it's the greatest thing in the world!!
of course you would....someone who will show or demonstrate love and affection towards yourself without reservation...without question.
But then some use their children to give them what they are unable to provide themselves. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 6:53:05 PM | Ok tealwood.. When the NON-CUSTODIAL man will be the one calling out of work to stay home with a sick child, when the NON-CUSTODIAL man will take the day off to take the child to the doctor, when the NON-CUSTODIAL man is the one cooking the dinners and taking the kids to all the activities.. then perhaps the the numbers will rise. When men start taking prevention seriously, and stepping up to the responsibility of raising the child they help create.. maybe the numbers will rise. I'm not referring to the men who do step up. There are still way to many that don't.
That is the only answer. When BOTH parents stick around to support the CHILD the numbers you rely on will improve.
My brother married a single mother.. Her son is severely autistic.. He can't be watched by anyone not certified to care for autistic children. The father takes him for 4 hours a week.. He goes to a special school for autistic children for 5 hours a day. During which is her only time to get anything done, and she has to be available to get to the school if they call as he could have a melt down at any time.
She doesn't' work.. She gets very little help from the father.. What should she do? Hmmm? You have all the answers.. what's the answer??
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having so many single custodial mothers being unemployed or not working full time to provide for themselves...let alone their children does not suggest responsible behavior.
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having so many deadbeat non-custodial fathers not contributing to the upbringing of the offspring they create does not suggest responsible behavior.
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I have no problem with this premise.
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Contrary to just about everything you post right??
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of course you would....someone who will show or demonstrate love and affection towards yourself without reservation...without question.
But then some use their children to give them what they are unable to provide themselves.
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sigh.. this is so off base.. and such a bitter outlook. Your ex left you to raise your kids. GET OVER IT. She's a bad mother, that doesn't make all of us bad mothers.
**if you can repeat yourself ad nauseam so can I** | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 8:39:23 PM | Yes that would be nice, but I would think, that men, knowing that they have no post-conception choices because of the way biology works
Sure they do. It's called "disappearing." It's not exactly the most admirable choice, but it happens all the time. Even for the dudes that are paying like $200-$250 a month in child support, they're doing what is legally required of them and still pretty much getting off easy. $43,000-$54,000 over the course of 18 years really isn't that much.
I dont do anything about them.
I'm talking about people in general, not you specifically. Or is this just one of those "sidestep the question" moments?
What brand & dosage would you suggest?
Kind of a dumb idea to just ask some random person what medication you should take. I'm not an OBGYN, and I don't know your medical background. I don't even know why you asked the question to begin with.
And choosing female partners wisely.
That kind of goes without saying. However, when I mention my particular methods of woman-choosing, I get ridiculed for it. I'm sure I'm in the extreme minority in the fact that I address such things even before getting naked. But I guess even talking about sex with your partner is too taboo despite the fact that you're about to have sex with each other...
*facepalm* | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/11/2012 9:47:14 PM | | PS.. I didn't ridicule you.. I ridiculed the women who went ahead and slept with you anyway after you said you wouldn't stick around. I did say that you perpetuate the problem if you do in fact participate in a pregnancy and then run from it. Only I said it with other words. That's not ridicule.. it's a fact. I think it's great you say that so you can walk away if they don't give you the answer you want. If that's truly how it goes down. But your whole attitude on single moms in particular and the whole responsibility thing.. is totally off base.. leaves a lot to be desired. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/12/2012 1:51:46 AM |
PS.. I didn't ridicule you..
Really? Because post number 414 says differently.
"I will do the absolute minimum that is legally required of me to raise that child. He/she would be lucky to get an annual phone call from me on birthdays/holidays." gee..you're a winner. One step above prom mom anyway..
That in and of itself makes me question what posts you're looking at that you are considered "bashing" when you completely disregard your own posts.
I did say that you perpetuate the problem if you do in fact participate in a pregnancy and then run from it.
I think the real problem would be that if a woman were to acknowledge what I said, and decided to have the child anyway in the even of a mishap. But it seems like some people have zero faith in what others say anymore and they
force themselves to learn the hard way. It's like the "oops, well I'm keeping it" women that are talking to their boyfriends/husbands that they KNEW didn't want kids [yet]. Yeah, that's a great foundation for starting a family. Things like this are why the marriage rate has been on a steady decline, and the divorce rate has been on the rise.
I ridiculed the women who went ahead and slept with you anyway after you said you wouldn't stick around.
You realize that this is all assuming that they said "no" to the original question of "would you have it." If they wouldn't have the baby anyway, then it doesn't matter. I would -like- to think that my partner has enough integrity to do what they said they would do if the situation comes up. If they can't for one reason or another, I'm going to at least do what I said what I was going to do. YOUR attitude implies that women should not be held accountable for what they say. Of course, we already live in a society that allows for that, so I guess it's really no surprise. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/12/2012 5:00:18 AM | At the end of the day, if a man doesn't want to become a father, HE is the ONLY one he can rely onto in order to ensure that doesn't happen.
Whatever the reasons are, from a craftly planned conspirancy, to sheer ignorance, going through pills not working (as it can happen if combined with certain medication), or just believing that "for only one time" it's ok to not use contraception, the reality is that, unless you are in a committed relationship with a person YOU TRUST, you cannot expect the other party to be doing all the homework. And that is a fact!
As to why all these men who profess to not want children EVER do go on dates without carrying some condoms, it really escapes me. There was a time when, if I went on a date I thought could end in sex, I always carried some. I was already on BC, but didn't want to have to deal with potential STDs from somebody that I didn't know. But... that was me!!! As to why men insist on going on dates totally unprepared... I really wish to know.
And no, it's very wrong to expect a woman to use abortion as a contraception method. I've known women who have chosen to keep babies conceived in rapes, and all because, albeit unplanned and initially unwanted, once pregnant they felt the bond and love for THEIR child, and wouldn't want to kill it, which I think, with all the violence children suffer in this world, is an incredible and very respectable point of view.
So guys, it's really easy, and unexpensive: you don't want kiddies, either abstain, or use protection!!! Didn't they ever teach you that in school???
Confuzzled: MRCS84 has been around a while and is known for his misogynist and misopedist tendencies, which, surprisingly, don't stop him from wanting to have unprotected heterosexual relations. So don't waste your words away, your point is made. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/12/2012 6:07:42 AM | Has been around a while and is known for his misogynist and misopedist tendencies, which, surprisingly, don't stop him from wanting to have unprotected heterosexual relations.
Just because I feel like men are continually marginalized through pretty much every faucet of society, it doesn't mean that I hate women. I can't think of anything better to have sex with 
And where did I ever say anything about not using condoms? I do remember saying this though:
How hard is it for a woman to say, "put on a condom or get out?"
Yeah, that doesn't condone condom use at all.
How about this?
I guess you want to completely ignore the fact that condoms are the most unreliable forms of contraception. Obviously it's better to use them than not...
That probably doesn't count either.
it would behoove the man to use a condom as well I'm pretty sure that everyone is on the same page with condoms.
How about that?
Misopedist, really? I guess working in the childcare department of the YMCA for almost a year before enlisting is evidence to that. Moreover, I continually reiterate that women should be doing a better job of choosing when it comes to their male partners as well as the timing of their choice to procreate. You know, so they can actually be together (or at least at least try; divorce is pretty popular these days) instead of having yet another pair of single parents in the ranks and yet another child being cheated. It still stands that having both mom and dad is "in the best interest of the child" (assuming that they can get along together) despite all of the literature that has come out in recent years that tries to empower women and marginalize men by saying that children don't need their fathers around and that single mothers by choice is the new "in" thing. Women can be great mothers, but they can't be great fathers.
And there is plenty of ridicule for deadbeat losers, but nothing seems to be done about the cycle continuing. I would -like- to think that actually discussing a family, maybe even seeing a family/career/financial councilor, would be a smart thing to do before having children. As much as people love to spew all their rhetoric in regard to childbirth and child rearing, I would ASSume that they would want to do it under their conditions. However, the actual trend still seems to be quite the contrary.
So don't waste your words away, your point is made.
At least it was made in the portion of the female camp where readers like to ignore posts that disprove the points they are trying to make. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/12/2012 11:12:17 AM |
Sure they do. It's called "disappearing." It's not exactly the most admirable choice, but it happens all the time. Even for the dudes that are paying like $200-$250 a month in child support, they're doing what is legally required of them and still pretty much getting off easy. $43,000-$54,000 over the course of 18 years really isn't that much.
Thats what i said. A man can not be forced to be a father. The most the law can do to a parent who does not want to parent is tell them to pay a little chump change for the child. 250 in support is a drop in the bucket, i spend more than that on a weekend Disney trip or a new set of school clothes, my electric bill in the summer runs about that.
Even if paying some little child support check, nobody can be forced to parent. Not a woman, not a man. A woman can abort, a man can walk away & send a little change each month, there is no forcing of anything.
I'm talking about people in general, not you specifically. Or is this just one of those "sidestep the question" moments?
Then why did you ask? I dont have the answer to the worlds problems. All i can do is ensure MY children are well cared for.
Kind of a dumb idea to just ask some random person what medication you should take. I'm not an OBGYN, and I don't know your medical background. I don't even know why you asked the question to begin with.
because you seemed to be an expert in womens birth control methods.
That kind of goes without saying. However, when I mention my particular methods of woman-choosing, I get ridiculed for it. I'm sure I'm in the extreme minority in the fact that I address such things even before getting naked. But I guess even talking about sex with your partner is too taboo despite the fact that you're about to have sex with each other...
Who said it is tabboo, at least you are up-front with these women, but if God Forbid you did end up somehow procreating, i can not fathom how you would walk away from your own flesh & blood, permanently, not even a call here & there, even if someone else is the primary caretaker, kids are not garbage to be cast aside. I truly hope you takde Capitano's suggestion of having a vasectomy & freezing some sperm in case you ever do want a child in the far future, hopefully nothing will ever happen to you if you do have kids, thus leaving your own partner as a single parent. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/12/2012 2:02:04 PM | "...having a vasectomy & freezing some sperm in case you ever do want a child..."
Off topic:
Now that you mention... I recall , lurking once about precedents in cases law, about two ruling regarding vasectomy: a clinic can´t request spousal consent anymore and a wife can´t take sperm from the bank without husband consent.
Unfortunally, I can not find those cases now. | |
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| Why men run at the first sign of pregnancy?
Posted: 6/13/2012 1:05:37 AM |
Then why did you ask? I dont have the answer to the worlds problems. All i can do is ensure MY children are well cared for.
*sigh* Nevermind
because you seemed to be an expert in womens birth control methods.
Even if I was, a diagnostic would still have to be run in order to come to a conclusion. Simply saying "these ones don't work for me" isn't good enough.
You cared for other peoples children?!?!
I hope you were not cruel to the children that had single parents.
Being cruel to children isn't exactly a good way to keep your job. If I were to do anything, I would give the parents a piece of my mind, but again, that's not exactly a good way to keep your job. | |
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