| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/14/2009 8:42:26 AM |
Remember that there is always hope. The only thing I might say is that it's better to have loved and failed than to have not loved.
Truer words have never been spoken.
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/14/2009 8:49:12 AM |
CassaGo wrote: I'm single, too, never married. So what? I never made a conscious choice to not marry, just never found the "right" guy, or had much of an inclination. It's not because I'm smarter -- or because I'm lesser quality, either. Get over yourselves.
As for me, marriage means having kids and raising them. I'm not going to do that until I have had a steady job (which pays at least $20) for at least 3 years.
Funnily enough, though, back in the day, often a "confirmed bachelor" was a gay man. So maybe that is why the "stigma" survives? Just like a spinster was a frigid woman (unless she dressed like a man, then she was gay).
Nowadays, a lot of married men are sneaking around and having sex with other men. Maybe they're really gay or they're not getting enough sex in a marriage. Then again, a lot of men (and women too!) cheat for no good reason at all. Who's to say but the individuals themselves? | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/14/2009 10:05:38 AM | | thats a rather generalised opinion, you must have had some bad experiences, quite frankly older men are often very good company, you dont have to be in a relationship to be of value to the opposite sex. I have some male friends in their early sixties and I love them to bits, I can talk to them, share my concerns and seek their advice, they dont come on to you, you dont have to live up to any image or preconception and they often share your interests. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/14/2009 12:21:44 PM | I'm single, too, never married. So what? I never made a conscious choice to not marry, just never found the "right" guy, or had much of an inclination. It's not because I'm smarter -- or because I'm lesser quality, either. Get over yourselves.
I think what some are saying is just that the same sort of story doesn't seem to fly so well for single men, that he's often presumed guilty of something even before any interrogation takes place and no matter what the facts or circumstances are. Hence the word "stigma". Then he gets blamed for being a bit testy over this injustice...
Some of you have a bad attitude (OP), like women are your enemy and THAT's why you "chose" not to get married.
Well, that's one of the fall-outs from feminism which has a very long half-life, because a major portion of feminism was based on the notion that men and women are basically enemies. So you could look on the bright side and say they're feminists after all because they adopt this stance. 
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/14/2009 11:44:10 PM |
because a major portion of feminism was based on the notion that men and women are basically enemies.
Most of the threads I've read here appear to support that notion. There's a lot of hostility out there. Plenty enough to go around. I wonder if a truce is at all possible. Naaaa probably not. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/14/2009 11:44:55 PM | From what I have learned over the years is that women will put bachelors down because many women operate on the mindset of 'pre-selection'. If another woman is with a guy then this is a signal to the other women that this guy has something to offer. He's good enough for her to be seen with him in public. And that gets their curiosity up. Single men are held in a regard as pigs, slobs, stuck in their ways, or must they have something wrong with them otherwise they would be with someone.
Many women are also looking for a man that will commit. It will make a woman wonder why you've never been married if you are in your late 30's or early 40's. It's like they would prefer a guy that has a few divorces under his belt at those ages. Because at least it shows he is able to commit. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 1:11:20 AM | So are these bachelorettes that are putting the bachelors down???
If some female is putting you down because of that, then take that as a warning sign: would you really want to waste your time with someone whose mind is that shallow??? | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 8:09:31 AM |
ShoMeSomethin wrote: So are these bachelorettes that are putting the bachelors down???
Nah, just a bunch of spinsters. 
[u]spinster:[/u] An unmarried adult female (as opposed to a widow). Commonly seen in public records to identify a single woman of age 21 or older. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 9:00:29 AM |
Most of the threads I've read here appear to support that notion.
Really? Cuz most of the people who bring up "feminism" are men. Stop promulgating myths and half-truths about what you think "feminism" is and you'll do better in the "war". Truthfully? Most of you are feminists and don't even REALIZE it. Most American men are (I can think of only a few on these threads that are not, and they are glaringly "out there"). | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 10:29:14 AM | UGH, I hear ya brother. Im 39, never been married, no kids, doing well financially, never have a problem meeting new people and not bad lookin. I socialize w/ women ages 22-60 BUT, seems like most of the time Im sort of viewed as a "yeah he's fun and we have a great time together but there MUST be some reason he's pushin 40 and hasnt tied the knot yet" sort of thing. I can actually see it when it happens! A woman will begin to like me and then give me "the look" like "Okay, so what exactly is wrong with him?" "There must be something he's hiding and I just cant put my finger on it". You know what Im talking about LOL.
Your question was why. Your guess is as good as mine and as good as the next guy's. Its true that women even in the face of observable facts will jump to certain conclusions about the over 30 bachelor and in order to "protect" themselves justify their unwillingness to trust our intentions based on their fears or dare I say more often their assumptions about our over 30 bachelor staus. Not saying their wrong in doing so, it's their life, their feelings and often thir childrens that they are looking out for but (along w/ the other million possible reasons) my best guess is that women just dont want to get "burned"...again.
Personally, on the flip side of all of this... From experience, I look at the 35 yr old single mother thats been divorced once or even twice as probably someone that is just bad at relationships and certainly carrying a healthy load of spiteful, distrusting baggage around w/ her. Who wants that?! Not me. I avoid em like the plague. See we have our stigmas too my friend. Keep your chin up brother. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 12:07:15 PM |
CassaGo wrote: Really? Cuz most of the people who bring up "feminism" are men. Stop promulgating myths and half-truths about what you think "feminism" is and you'll do better in the "war". Truthfully? Most of you are feminists and don't even REALIZE it. Most American men are (I can think of only a few on these threads that are not, and they are glaringly "out there").
Most women nowadays are nothing like the feminists of the 1970s. Then, they were fighting for things such as equal pay and treatment. Nowadays women enjoy things like high-paying careers, but once they find a guy who makes much more than her, she's ready to get married and sit around at home all day and not doing much cooking, cleaning, or other housework at all.
These women want the rights of feminism; they just don't want the responsibilities! Equal rights for them, but not for men. "Men are only useful for reproduction and taking care of me and the kids until I get tired of him and/or find a guy I can trade up to, then I'll take most of my husband's stuff and the kids we had together and move in with the other guy (or kick my husband out and have the other guy move in with us)."
I'm sure most guys would love to have a wife support them while they get to watch sports on TV 5 days a week (instead of talk shows and soaps) and not do any cooking, cleaning, or other housework.
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 12:43:14 PM | I SAID STOP PROMULGATING MYTHS AND HALF-TRUTHS
Nowadays women enjoy things like high-paying careers, but once they find a guy who makes much more than her, she's ready to get married and sit around at home all day and not doing much cooking, cleaning, or other housework at all.
Bullshit. Show me stats that this is even true, much less that this is a feminist.
Men are only useful for reproduction and taking care of me and the kids until I get tired of him and/or find a guy I can trade up to, then I'll take most of my husband's stuff and the kids we had together and move in with the other guy (or kick my husband out and have the other guy move in with us)."
Who are you quoting? Give your source.
Opinions and facts are not the same thing. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 5:30:07 PM | | ^^^^^He is quoting most all of todays" bitter" women.....you know... the kind who don't want a "nice guy" because they are too" predictable" and" boring", the kind who prefer the "exciting" "bad-boy" type , who will inevitably give them more than their share of verbal abuse, mental abuse, and often...physical abuse. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 6:02:39 PM | | ^^^ ugh. self-fulfilling prophecy. face it guys - if you were getting the share of poontang you want, feminism would be a nonissue. but you blame it for whatever career or relationship lack you feel because it's easier than looking at yourself and your choices. cassago is asking for evidence and you have none. you're entitled to whatever opinion you cook up, but consider yourself to have no credibility on the subject until you can produce some. even self-reporting survey results. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 6:04:11 PM |
Why do women always put bachelors down? Do you really think it's easy to find someone, fall in love, and get married? Some guys sincerely want that, but it just doesn't happen to everyone. So why do you always put us down?
Because most aren't very bright. They think they are, but sadly, a lot of them are about as bright as a box of hammers. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 6:11:45 PM | CassaGo, I'm not quoting anybody. Divorce courts are littered with these kinds of cases. When a woman marries, I don't think she's consciously thinking about later dumping the guy she just married for someone else. It's a subconscious process really. Really, it doesn't take a lot to please a guy when it comes down to it. Feed him, frak him, get out of the way and let him do guy stuff. That's basically it! Now women, on the other hand, are thinking about having children and being able to provide for them, so she marries a guy who makes good money. She may or may not be physically attracted to him. It doesn't matter. In her subconscious she's thinking the guy can provide for their kids. Usually the provider type of guy becomes "boring" to the woman sooner or later. She finds a guy who knows how to hit her excitement buttons and she's off!!! She divorces the good provider husband, even if he's very good to her. The poor guy stays friends with her in spite of the a$$-raping she's giving him. There are basically two kinds of guys in this world: cads and dads. The women leave with the cads while sticking dads with the bill.
You say: "Prove this is true."
I say: "Prove this isn't true." | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 6:31:09 PM |
davidpiano0609 wrote: ^^^ ugh. self-fulfilling prophecy. face it guys - if you were getting the share of poontang you want, feminism would be a nonissue. but you blame it for whatever career or relationship lack you feel because it's easier than looking at yourself and your choices. cassago is asking for evidence and you have none. you're entitled to whatever opinion you cook up, but consider yourself to have no credibility on the subject until you can produce some. even self-reporting survey results.
True, if we were getting our share of poontang, we wouldn't even be on this site, much less participating in the forums. So David, why are you here? Choices? A lot of guys make what they think are right choices. If there's a book on how to make the right choices in every situation, I'd love to read it and learn from it!!! (Teach me, O wise one... haha!) However, each case is different and what might be the right choice for one person may not be the right choice for another. And then some people are lucky enough to either have connections or show up in the right place at the right time and be exactly what the employer (or woman) is looking for. The thing about providing "evidence" is that it usually isn't good enough for the person asking for it, no matter how reliable your sources. By the way, any guy living in California should be aware that no piece of "poontang" (as David puts it) is not worth marrying and getting divorced from. California happens to be one of those alimony states where the woman gets a sizeable monthly portion of your check in case of divorce. A lot of men are apprehensive about getting married and having a 6:4 chance of getting a divorce isn't good odds. You'd have better luck in a casino if you play your cards right. The thing is, even if you play your cards right in life or marriage, sometimes you still lose, just like in a casino. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 7:06:30 PM | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I agree.... besides a lot of those folks out on the southwest coast seem to be stuck in that state of mind that says .... you aren't" cool or hip or one of us", unless you dress like this, or drive one of those, or make this much money etc. etc. I have always preffered to be a" trendsetter" myself- so to speak, instead of emulating all of these sorry examples of humanity that Hollywood has been showing us for the last 50 years. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 9:47:53 PM |
Why do women always put bachelors down? ... So why do you always put us down?
Because most aren't very bright.
THIS is your great explanation? "Girls are dumb?" Are you still six?? Or just sort of dull-minded yourself?
So DO women "always" put bachelors down? That's not what I hear--in FACT, I hear single women PREFER bachelors. Weird, eh? In fact, I hear most single women get pissed when married guys (opposite of bachelors) hit on them. Why, I even read somewhere that MOST of the guys that women eventually marry are bachelors! | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/15/2009 11:31:35 PM | WHY??? Why the OP asks? Who can say for certain.
I'm loving this thread. But for all I've read I tend to agree most with Msg.110 from 2825buck.
I'm 41, never married, no kids. If you have a problem with that then it's your problem. I like me & feel no need to put up with anyone who is emotionally unwell. I did the conquest thing. I've felt the fear of comittment. I've wanted the good wife, 2.5 kids & white picket fence. I've played the field & watched from the bench. There are reasons I did what I did & didn't do what I didn't do. If you want to get to know that about me I'll tell you but have absolutely no need to justify my life to anyone.
But I feel that people try to size you up & place you in a category too quickly. If we lived & let live more maybe it wouldn't be that way. If people concentrated on making themselves the best they could be rather than looking for support, validation, or leaning on others as an emotional crutch then quite possibly we wouldnt have 1 out of 2 marriages ending in divorce.
Happily ever after is what we all seek. Some of the lessons learned to achieve that take us in different directions. I could be judgemental of the single grandmother of two who's just turned 40. Or the neighbor with the revolving bedroom door. Or the cousin that's been married 4 times before her 35th birthday. But WHY? It's not my life. Not my decision. If a woman chooses to box me into her perception of who I am that's her loss. Your reality may very well be your perception of it but your perception may not be reality.
It takes all kinds. If you aren't willing to step outside of yourself & view the world from another's point of view then I believe you are missing out on some of the best life has to offer. So fence me in. Place me in a category that feels right for you. Maybe that's why you're single But it's not why I am.
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/16/2009 8:11:42 AM | ^^^^ Well, I wouldn't expect them to be able to see it from your side of things.
Just about everyone around here has heard women say, probably numerous times in numerous different places, something to the effect that they want a "Real Man", a "man, not a boy". In every culture there is some similar way of putting it, the central idea being that manhood is provisional and must be earned, rather than simply being granted to males.
By contrast, every adult female is a woman just by virtue of her biology, her potential to bear children. But almost all cultures withhold respect from, and validation of, the males until and unless they first prove themselves. This is of course tremendously useful for the culture, because it can set the terms by which males earn respect as men, and in that way it can motivate the men to do things that the culture finds productive.
This has been studied quite a bit by sociologists and anthropologists, and the gist of the male role around the world is that you have to produce more than you consume. That is, men are expected, first, to provide for themselves. If somebody else provides for you, you’re less than a man; dependency is reserved for women and children. Second, the man should create additional wealth or a surplus so that it can provide for others in addition to himself.
That's all men are good for so far as many women are concerned. The single, never-married, no kids, bachelor who is beyond some age (35-ish?) is thus seen as having been deficient in this essential element of what constitutes manliness in their minds. He's failed to do what men are supposed to do, therefore he's highly suspect as not being a "real" man, of being "immature", a "boy, not a man".
I really think that's a large part of what is at the root of the stigma being discussed here -- women acting as cultural agents to "motivate the men to do things that the culture finds productive". It really doesn't matter the particular path one took or didn't take. It was not getting to the prescribed destination. A "real" man is just supposed to overcome all obstacles and difficulties in getting there.
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/16/2009 10:28:04 AM | | I think it is telling that so many people assume that because you have not married you have not beeen in LTR. I have never been married but have been in 2 ltr that including living with my partner. I have never seen the need to have the state legitimize my most intimate relationships, so not getting married was about a philosophical position and not about fear of committment etc. In fact in Canada after a couple years of living together your legal commitment/responsibility is the same as if you had been married. I think the OP's problem comes not so much because he is a lifelong bachelor, but because, his profile reeks of negativity and his picture is not that flattering. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/16/2009 10:43:06 AM | My job is the biggest obstacle to me not being married. I'm 44 and I travel extensively with my job and have little time to date let alone to build a relationship. I end up with the"traveling salesman stigma".
I have a great social life on the road, going out with clients and other reps. Women back home feel I should be sitting in my hotel room watching TV. I have never had a relationship last over six months. Usually 2 or 3 months. Part of it is my fault by never promising to be exclusive. I think I need to be in a relationship longer than three months to commit to this. Seems like jealousy sets in and relationship over before getting serious. I understand what a women needs in a relationship but cannot give it all now. Perhaps when I'm off the road. I've pretty much settled into being single awhile longer. | |
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| Why is it such a stigma to be an older bachelor?
Posted: 10/16/2009 12:28:01 PM | What you say is not entirely true. I had my own bussiness and supported my wife and her 2 kids. I gave her what most women say they want. I showed her love and respect every day. I'm not saying I was the perfect hubby, but no one is perfect. I feel for the OP because i get the same reaction and I'm 20 years younger. The only differance is that I was married. That just adds to the stigma of being an older male with no kids and single.
The problem is that most people think they want something other than what they really want and need, or they go after what looks greener but in the long run is really nothing but crap they dont need. | |
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