| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 4:40:16 AM | I'd like to know how many of the "pro-sin tax" people in here actually take care of themselves by eating right and exercising regularly.
Eating right and exercising regularly will also improve a person's health and keep a person out of the doctors office. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 7:45:32 AM |
What could be fairer then being able to make a choice about whether you pay a tax
EXACTLY!!!
Earl, we might have some common ground here!!
Fairness!! Fairness can be the middle ground. Equality for all.
No more tax "brackets". No more "luxury" tax. Treat everyone the same!
The irony with the "sin tax" is that healthy food is expensive. Have you seen how much a pound of apples costs? $2.99 in Missouri for a pound of honeycrisp apples. Probably lower for some other varieties......but that is not many apples. "organic" food costs more than nonorganic. They are charging us more not to add anything to our foods.
Anyway-
Why just the "fairness" about a sin tax???? Why not fairness all the way around??
That is why I think it is funny.......cause you only think about fairness when it benefits YOU. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 9:39:13 AM | okay again,Please tell me how it is not socialism if I have to pay for your choices, you decide what goes into your mouth not me, why should I pay inflated insurance rates for your poor unhealthy choices of food and drink, I don't want to be your mommy and daddy pay your own way if you want to eat junk pay up front for the health care you will need. No one is forcing you to do any thing it's your choice what you eat and drink. You want it both ways socialism is great as long as it benefits you.
EarlzP; Read carefully; If your insurance premiums go up because of the uninsured it's because of capitalism NOT socialism, it's because the insurance company has to cover it's cost. Should they inflate their price too much they will go out of business because they will be unable to compete with other insurance companies. The more insurance companies there are to choose from the lower premiums will be. You are free to choose the insurance company you want, what kind of insurnce you want or whether or not you want insurance at all. This model is conceptually different from a government dictating to you what you can or cannot have by inflating the cost of something you might find desirable in order to shape your behavior or simply generate a rational to steal your money. If you're saying there's no parental motive inherent in a sin tax then the only remaining motive is parisitic in nature. Tax happy democrats who've become creative with thier greed to the point of destruction. Sin tax, why stop with food when so much more could be percieved as sin. When you travel down the road of taxation you eventually arrive at a place where all of what gets produced is taken and that place is called slavery. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 12:13:34 PM |
The more insurance companies there are to choose from the lower premiums will be.
Unfortunately you are wrong. Insurance companies do contract pricing with hospitals, etc. Their strength in negotiations comes from the number of members they can offer. So if Humana has a 45% share in a market and Aetna has a 15%, Humana can strike a better deal. Lots of insurance companies with few members, not a lot of power. Of course this doesn't mean that these deals will be passed on to the consumer, where you are really screwed is if you are paying cash. They you pay 2-3X the amount an insurance company pays for the same procedure. Makes total sense. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 12:38:01 PM | Generally speaking the company offering the best coverage for the least price will have the largest numbers. The more companies you have competing for high numbers will yield a better price and better coverage.
If you can pay cash for a service you are in a position to negotiate and you can get a discount simply by eliminating the middle man. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 1:40:39 PM |
That is why I think it is funny.......cause you only think about fairness when it benefits YOU.
Stnick...
Amen and well said. Most liberals only think in term of what something will do for them. They do not think about the affect it will have on others. They think it is OK to take from those who have and give to those who have not. Typical socialist Utopian attitudes. They think that those of us who work hard, save money, pay our bills and provide for our family are just bad people ...they want to take MY money..I worked for and give it away. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/5/2009 4:53:44 PM |
Stnick...
Amen and well said. Most liberals only think in term of what something will do for them. They do not think about the affect it will have on others. They think it is OK to take from those who have and give to those who have not. Typical socialist Utopian attitudes. They think that those of us who work hard, save money, pay our bills and provide for our family are just bad people ...they want to take MY money..I worked for and give it away.
You contradict yourself
Most liberals only think in term of what something will do for them. They do not think about the affect it will have on others
and then
They think it is OK to take from those who have and give to those who have not.
You make it sound like the only ones who work or pay taxes are republicans, so when one of us "liberals" who works and pays taxes votes for a bill or tax that will help the have nots according to you we are only thinking of our selves and when you vote against the same bill you are thinkiing of who? Let me help you, it's only YOU are thinking ABOUT
It's apparent that you will never get IT, a sin tax is NON DISCRIMATORY it will effect every one exactly the same way oit's a way to raise money that will help pay for health care and at the same time discourage the use of junk food or at least make those who can least afford health care think about what they put in their mouths and maybe help control some of the disaeses caused by poor eating and drinking habits | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 2:02:48 PM |
Why just the "fairness" about a sin tax???? Why not fairness all the way around??
Wouldn't it be neat to just have a flat tax rate regardless of what one makes or family size.
Income taxes were actually a temporary method in the beginning to help with the Civil War expenses. Over the years it kept coming back as a way to help with government expenses, and then in the early 1900s it became a permanent fixture of our American way of life.
It seems in the last several years various other types of taxes have been being suggested to help with the national debt. Now due to increased governmental spending and proposed health care mess some are looking at a "Sin Tax".
What next. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 2:20:09 PM | Then we should go to a Fair tax...that way all taxes will be fair if that is the aim of the Liberals you know "Fairness"
I know what else we can do too if its all about Health and Fairness,,,we can take all babies that are born with disease or deformities or any condition that will require future medical care an services and tax their parents more. Then we can take the people whose families have histories of Heart Disease Cancer Diabetes and whatever and tax them more because one day they may require expensive procedures...then we can take all of he people with preexisting conditions that we already know will require more Health care and tax them way more than those without preexisting conditions that would be fair don't you think? | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 2:47:45 PM |
Income taxes were actually a temporary method in the beginning to help with the Civil War expenses. Over the years it kept coming back as a way to help with government expenses, and then in the early 1900s it became a permanent fixture of our American way of life.
The income tax originally went away because it was unconstitutional. Fortunately the 16th Amendment was added to the Bill of Rights which granted us the right to pay income tax. So strong is the government's commitment to US citizens exercising this right that any attempt to waive this right is punished with fines, jail, and even death. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 2:48:41 PM |
Then we should go to a Fair tax...that way all taxes will be fair if that is the aim of the Liberals you know "Fairness"
How would a "fair tax" work? Is this a flat tax? What would a proper rate be and how much revenue would it bring? Would it be a percentage or flat amount? So someone making $15,000 a year would pay the same as someone making $500,000?
I know what else we can do too if its all about Health and Fairness,,,we can take all babies that are born with disease or deformities or any condition that will require future medical care an services and tax their parents more. Then we can take the people whose families have histories of Heart Disease Cancer Diabetes and whatever and tax them more because one day they may require expensive procedures...then we can take all of he people with preexisting conditions that we already know will require more Health care and tax them way more than those without preexisting conditions that would be fair don't you think?
I really hope you are kidding about this part. This is sarcasm , right? | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 4:07:16 PM |
So strong is the government's commitment to US citizens exercising this right that any attempt to waive this right is punished with fines, jail, and even death.
I was always told not to mess with the IRS.....From what I have heard they have garnished the wages of a few people who have later won their battle.
The IRS can quite a bit of financial damage to an individual who does not have all their ducks in a row.
The question though is when does all this taxation stop.,...It is getting to the point that about 50% of a person's salary goes to taxes; property, income, sales, gasoline, and some other taxes depending on where you live.
Obama promised tax relief but now we see that we are talking about different ways and different taxes to pay for the mess Obama is implementing. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 5:00:05 PM |
The question though is when does all this taxation stop.,...It is getting to the point that about 50% of a person's salary goes to taxes; property, income, sales, gasoline, and some other taxes depending on where you live.
I know reality is difficult for some right wingers to understand but the truth is the U.S. is one of the lowest taxed industrialized nation of the planet at 29.6 % of GDP.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/tax_tot_tax_as_of_gdp-taxation-total-as-of-gdp
A good way to measure your tax burden is by what they call tax freedom day. The day you stop working to pay your taxes and when you start to keep everything you earn. The earlier in the year, the lower your tax burden.
In the U.S it is April 30 which is only beat out by South Africa which is April 22. Mind you I didn't see Somalia on that list. I am sure that libertarian paradise would probably be better.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/tax_tax_fre_day_dat_of_yea-tax-freedom-day-date-year
Point of all this is what is an acceptable level of taxation? I have asked this question many times and not once has one of the conservatives on this board answered it. I think no matter what level you pay, conservatives will always be screaming they pay too much. | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 5:07:20 PM | | By Industrialized, do you mean Socialist? Of course we pay less because we are a little behind them in our Socialist transformation........I am sure when Obama and the Dems are through we will be paying more in taxes than any other "Industrialized" Nation,.,.... | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 5:17:19 PM | | No by industrialized I mean I am not going to include Somalia and other failed states in the mix. How about the G20 then. Good enough a comparison for you? | |
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 5:23:35 PM | Msg 139 said (I am sure when Obama and the Dems are through we will be paying more in taxes than any other "Industrialized" Nation)
Is that why all the urgency in getting this crazy Health Care Mess passed that would not do anyone any good till 2013.
They already got a bunch of banks that they control(remember the wage freeze or reduction) ...... a few car makers they control(dismissal of CEOs already).....
So now they run the insurance companies out of business in about 5 or so years after they do a public option and what does that leave that they don't control--- Oh our pocket books....
But lets see we have the stimulus that will most certainly raise some taxes and now the health care to find a new type of tax for.....there goes our pocket books....
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| Sin Tax to help fund Healthcare costs?
Posted: 11/6/2009 5:41:05 PM | | sure most of those are pretty Socialist include all you like....doesnt make my point any less valid actually it reinforces it thank you... | |
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