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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 8:27:36 AM | Child support is complete BS. It is a punishment for fathers that "do" for their children.
Good Fathers get punished.
Shitty Fathers get free passes.
Good father get to pay CS, because they are responsible and have jobs. They are limited time with their children.
Mothers of children with shitty fathers get ZERO money, and only wish that the father would be part of his children's life.
I hand my ex 20% of my take home every month. 1 day a week I wake up early, pay to drive my truck, etc, to hand her that days pay, tax free. 14% of my truck payment, gas, car insurance, etc, is also given to her. 20% of my work clothing, shoes, etc is purchased for me to work for her.
How much I am really paying to my ex?
My son is only allowed to stay with me every other weekend. Does my mortgage company pro-rate my son's room based on usage? I pay for his room if he is there or not? Why do I also have to pay for his room in her house?
Do I need any extra money to do things with him? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 8:35:46 AM |
I just got a CS payment of $1.02
The payer would need an annual income of $8000.00 to be paying that little here. That is underemployment unless there is a legitimate disability that is limiting employment. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 8:42:58 AM | | How horrible that you work 1 day each week to support your child. I work a minimum of 50 hrs each week and at times have worked up to 80 to support my kids. At least 80% of my pay is to support them. My own clothes come from second hand stores and I still only own 2 dresses and 3 pairs of jeans. I almost never go out with out my kids and when I do, it's to go hiking or something else that doesn't cost anything. Between 5 & 7 days each week I wake up early to go work a 12 to 14 hour day and then come home to clean up after my kids, cook their dinner, help with homework, etc. My ex only takes them every other weekend - not because I am selfish, but because the judge didn't think a man who is always drunk and who beats up his wife while the kids are there should have more time than that to influence them. What did you do to end up with only every other weekend? Do I normally complain about my check going to support my kids? No - because I had those kids and it's my responsibility to support them. I love them and would not have it any other way. Again, I am sorry that one day each week is so difficult for you. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 9:50:32 AM | unfortunately, he is just a deadbeat thatusername...
he would rather keep changing jobs when CS catches up to him instead of taking care of his children. But it's alright...we have survived without him for long enough that it doesn't matter... | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 9:52:10 AM |
I've never spent $3,982.00 after taxes (about $5600 gross) per month on my two children ever. Yet the tables suggest that those would be the costs involved as with 50/50 shared parenting the table suggests $1991.00
Providing for the children is one thing, providing for an ex is another and should not be covered under the guise of a child support payment.
I actually agree with what you are saying. If my paycheck was for that much I would be doing pretty well, Child support or no. I don't think that child support should be paying for anything for the ex. The only exception is if she pays for something out of the child support money and the money gets put back from her paycheck/bank account.
Child support is complete BS. It is a punishment for fathers that "do" for their children.
Good Fathers get punished.
Shitty Fathers get free passes.
Good father get to pay CS, because they are responsible and have jobs. They are limited time with their children.
Mothers of children with shitty fathers get ZERO money, and only wish that the father would be part of his children's life.
I hand my ex 20% of my take home every month. 1 day a week I wake up early, pay to drive my truck, etc, to hand her that days pay, tax free. 14% of my truck payment, gas, car insurance, etc, is also given to her. 20% of my work clothing, shoes, etc is purchased for me to work for her.
How much I am really paying to my ex?
My son is only allowed to stay with me every other weekend. Does my mortgage company pro-rate my son's room based on usage? I pay for his room if he is there or not? Why do I also have to pay for his room in her house?
Do I need any extra money to do things with him?
It sounds to me like you are looking for an excuse to get out of accepting any responsibility for your child. Yes, you do need extra money for him also, but if you don't have full custody or joint custody then the brunt of caring for and raising your child is falling to your ex. Their is a lot more to raising children than just money. There is the discipline, the homework, field trips, PTA, cooking, cleaning, and laundry, nightmares, illnesses, confusion about the separation/divorce to deal with, boy/girl issues, after school activities, etc, etc, etc. all on top of working as well. Not that I am complaining, in the least bit. So if you aren't dealing with all of this stuff, and you aren't contributing to doing these things or contributing to his bills, then what exactly are you doing to help raise your child, other than trying to impress everyone what a great father you are?
And I have read a lot of single parents posting on here that they don't limit the time their exes want to spend with their children, but the exes don't take advantage of that. I am that way. But mine chooses to babysit for certain days, which means he is watching the boys mainly while the girls are in school and all 4 one night a week. Since he moved out in July, he has asked to take them out somewhere to spend time with them 1 time and that was just a couple of weeks ago for about an hour and then he took the oldest 3. And yet he goes around telling his family and everyone that will listen how he has all 4 kids 4 days a week. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 5:41:30 PM | thatusernameistaken (love the screen name, btw!):
As I said, arguments directed at the tables may be valid, but that doesn't mean that the tables don't incorporate logic. For the most part, the higher your income the higher your expenses, but the percentage of those expenses related to the children remain the same. If a couple chose to raise their children in an area where the mortgage payments, taxes, etc. are higher, than the percentage is comparable to the table for mortgage qualification. Attributable percentages for the children remain the same, as the assumption is that both parents want to retain the quality of life for the children that they enjoyed prior to the separation. The problem arises when one or the other decides that it is the other ADULT who doesn't deserve this quality of life, and so states that they won't pay for it. That is sour grapes, if you ask me. If denying the CP results in denying the child(ren) that which one was willing to provide so long as the adults were together, it is simply a display of selfishness. The children are not the ones who should pay for the mistake. Personally, I lay out 23% of my gross income for ONE expense of ONE of my three children, and that expense is directly related to the fact that my ex husband and I divorced. I would never imagine denying that benefit to my child!
I am not judging you as a parent, but the the bottom line is that our children deserve to have responsible parents, even if we have to make sacrifices for their benefit, and even if it pizzes us off that the other parent may see some benefit from that which we provide to the children. Life isn't fair, but the attitude with which one deals with the unfairness makes life easier to live.  | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 5:49:52 PM |
but, if a parent can manage to survive on the court ordered support they get, how come so many NCP's are facing such financial hardships really? If two or three manage on say 20 to even 50 %... how come one can not do it on what is left?
Look at the custodial parent...look at where they are in life and realize they are probably where they would have been with..or without the children.....
The deadbeats are the ones who do not pay...and the deadbeats or users are the ones who use the lack of cs and pitiful amount to hide the fact they are themselves not capable of finacially supporting the children and probably themselves.
I work a minimum of 50 hrs each week and at times have worked up to 80 to support my kids. At least 80% of my pay is to support them.
50hrs x $7.25 = 362.50 or $18,850 year...
One could ask why would you have children or undertake finacial responsibilities when you are barely able to finacially provide for yourself?
[PDF] CMAR - Boise, IDFile Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
Analysis of the Boise, Idaho Housing Market as of July 1, 2004 ... costs. As of the Current date, the rental market is entering the third year of .... approximately $600; the average rent for an 800-square-foot apartment is $625.
So it is a few years old...but perhaps you can provide updated data?
$625 month translates into $7,500 in rental costs....but the bulk of that would be there even without the children. so you cannot unlike many custodial parents take the bulk of the rental costs and suggest it it is for the kids....
But 80%....suggests you are spending $15,080 on your 2 children??? since the other 2 are now adults?
But does that 80% include the vacation 2 years ago...and the one you are planning?
On the same note, I am not going to accept all of the blame for my marriage failing. I tried and tried. I even accepted the fact that he wouldn't get a job and tried to work around that. But I did not make him decide to get a separation and not tell me. I did not force him, or even tell him too for that matter, to go out and find himself a couple of girlfriends.
I don't ever expect to see a dime from him in the form of child support. And this means that in the state of South Carolina, he will eventually end up in jail, because my circumstances right now are such that I have to go and apply for family assistance. I need to apply for daycare vouchers so that I can work and my children will be in daycare of some sort. But once I apply for these things DSS will be going after my ex for child support and there is not a thing I can do about it. But I need to do what is right for my kids and that means getting a job and getting back on my feet so that I can take care of them without that government assistance.
Sorry the marriage was not rosy and did have the white picket fence and story book ending. But then mine was not what i expected either.
But correct me if i am wrong here. We have two parents here who both are out of work and unable to provide for the children they brought into this world. One might even ask who is paying even for their finacial requirements?
One is suggesting she can get benefits to get her on her feet while at the same time suggesting the other should be in jail for not meeting his finacial obligations?
I am having problems getting my head around that one and cannot understand how others are not seeing a little hypocrisy there?
As for me, I'll never understand why a parent willingly provided for their children while committed to the other parent, but complains about doing so once the relationship is over
I agree I do not understand that either...but then I understand why some non custodial get frustrated when they are legally required to work full time and contribute finacial resources to their ex and the children.....to improve their living conditions yet the custodial parent is not legally required to work or work full time...and the same value of living condition or housing that is considered critical in the custodial home is not in the non custodial home...yet the mothers whine if they are not involved enough...and then whine if the housing conditions is not up to what they feel is appropriate so they can use this to argue no overnights.
Bottom line I suggest the ncp who can afford it, most are paying...but there are always those less fortunate or less capable of meeting their finacial obligations....but then is there not a saying that birds of a feather flock together...
Yes, you do need extra money for him also, but if you don't have full custody or joint custody then the brunt of caring for and raising your child is falling to your ex. Their is a lot more to raising children than just money. There is the discipline, the homework, field trips, PTA, cooking, cleaning, and laundry, nightmares, illnesses, confusion about the separation/divorce to deal with, boy/girl issues, after school activities, etc, etc, etc. all on top of working as well. Not that I am complaining, in the least bit. So if you aren't dealing with all of this stuff, and you aren't contributing to doing these things or contributing to his bills, then what exactly are you doing to help raise your child, other than trying to impress everyone what a great father you are?
So if the trials of raising the children are so difficult why are most woman againts shared 50/50 custody? We had one strident hawk who was very vocal about how it was not good...until her children suddenly were looking to change custodial homes.... | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 8:12:28 PM | One could ask why would you have children or undertake finacial responsibilities when you are barely able to finacially provide for yourself?
My ex intentionally made it impossible for me to finish college while we were together and I believe I have already explained about the pregnancies. Also, I certainly didnt expect to be raising them alone - my ex wanted me to be at home with them and he was able to support us. Anyway, I never said that I can not provide for myself - I said that I sacrifice things I could use to better provide for my children. Most good parents do this at times.
But 80%....suggests you are spending $15,080 on your 2 children??? since the other 2 are now adults?
I make quite a bit more than $7.25 or the $18,000 that you somehow came up with but I also spend a lot more than 15,000 on the kids. If the kids did not live with me, I probably would be in an apartment, but that is not what I think my kids deserve. My kids have a decent home in a good neighborhood (although it's not nearly as nice as their dad's) and a good life, but I am not the one who watches cable. They have cell phones (as do their dad's stepchildren). They are dressed decently, have music lessons, participate in sports (some of them quite expensive), there have been surgeries, broken bones, contact lenses, braces, serious illness, etc, etc.
But does that 80% include the vacation 2 years ago...and the one you are planning?
A small portion of it. Why shouldn't I pay for my kids to have a vacation? The adult children pay their share. Kids deserve to go on vacation at least a few times. Especially when their dad takes stepkids on great vacations every single year and refuses to take his own. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 8:48:29 PM | Now we can go back manually over the posts but I am positive you were very strongly againts split visitation with children as not being healthy or in their best interest. $$$$$$Or was it your finacial best interest...but now with the intent of your youngest to move...it suddenly becomes palatable or viable...So please tell me how that is not self serving or simply finacially motivated.
But I will agree by page three you did switch or add as an additional consideration the scenario that the children missed school...and that they supposedly miss school the day after they are or have spent the night with their father.
Now foolish me...I would be myself more concerned about that fact than i would about the finacial loss....or the fact I might have to start working full time again. But the my priorities have been different. i also object or argue that the homework did not get done if they spend time at the mothers as she would take them out visiting. But since they spend all or the majority of time here...i have little to complain about. ~Tealwood~
^^^Yes foolish you!..how selective of you quoting posts that only support your over view to support your ridiculously biased opinion...
I do not believe I struggled with the issue of the amount of child support I recieved until I became concerned about my youngests living arrangements or custody dispute that has brewed to a boil now with my ex.
The irony of my situation is I was willing to give back some child support to my Ex for our 16 yr old son who decided to live with his Dad...until my Ex got greedy..He saw the opportunity to end child support payments with my younger son but has demonstrated none of the responsibility to parent a child his age.....so now he gets nothing unless he takes me back to court...and then he will probably end up paying more for those 10 years he left me to struggle working two jobs on what he did pay back then....karma is a **** isn't it?
So if the trials of raising the children are so difficult why are most woman againts shared 50/50 custody? We had one strident hawk who was very vocal about how it was not good...until her children suddenly were looking to change custodial homes.... ~Tealwood~
^^^^The better questions are...
Why is it that so many men are leaving the home before they have a 50/50 custody arrangement in place?
It dosen't count when men rethink their decision to leave..because they suddenly realized 5 months, 1 year or 5 years later that they should have stayed to fight for joint custody...(kinda makes their intentions suspicious dosen't it?)....
Why do men feel that because they have 50/50 custody it absolves them of equalizing the finacial circumstances for the mother who stayed home and put her career objectives on hold?
The old saying..."throwing the baby out with the bathwater" comes to mind when I think about the expectations some men have in regards to child support.
I think the cycle is never ending...but the constant fight to gain control over finances is really counterproductive for both parties.
The end result usually consists of one parent sacrificing years of being able to achieve advancements and promotions at work because of the custodial parental role, while the other parent goes on to achieve wage increases that come with the promotions they achieved by having less of the family responsibility their ex spouse had.
It kinda leaves a bad taste in everyones mouth dosen't it?
****I know I should be using politically correct terms like NCP instead of some men or Dad's....but honestly...I don't really care to tailor my posts to be politically correct when so many men here don't give the single Mom's who work hard to raise their children the same respect or consideration when they post... | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/2/2009 8:55:06 PM |
One is suggesting she can get benefits to get her on her feet while at the same time suggesting the other should be in jail for not meeting his finacial obligations?
You need to get a little bit of reading comprehension there. We were actually making it while I was working. I lost my job, not because I was a poor employee, but because the company was continually making cutbacks. The other part, if you have read any of my other posts in any thread, is that I am TRYING to find work to get myself back on my feet. I don't know where you live Tealwood, but here in SC, jobs are scarce. We have the 6th highest unemployment rate in the country at 11.6%. So it's not like I am just sitting around waiting for someone to hand me a job. On top of that, I cannot just go and move somewhere else where there may be work because of the custody laws here in SC that say I have to get my ex to sign a paper saying I have permission to take them out of the state. Now, irregardless of the unemployment rate, he never even tried to find work, even when he was told that my job may be in jeopardy.
And I never suggested he should be in jail. In fact, I am very much against that for anyone, as all that does is aggravate the issue. What I said is that he will probably end up there because that is what happens here when you don't pay court ordered child support. And if I go to sign up for those benefits then the Department of Social Services will go after him for child support, whether I want them to or not. I have no choice in that matter.
As far as 50/50 custody for my children, if he was interested, had a job or some form of regular income, (he is currently being supported by his girlfriend)had his own place (not his girlfriend's house which is where he is currently living) where the children had a place to sleep (their own room, not the couch or the floor, etc.), the baby has a crib to sleep in, has reliable transportation (again, his girlfriend drives him around and every once in a while lets him drive her car), and his girlfriend was not living there (mainly because I have tried letting my children spend time at their house and now I am having serious discipline problems because it is just too much for them to deal with at this time) I would have no problem sharing custody with him. I want my children to have a relationship with him. They absolutely adore him, which is a good thing, as he is their father. I want to encourage that relationship. And I have no intention of cutting him out of their life. But he has also shown almost no interest. He will babysit the boys (the girls are in school during the day) when it doesn't interfere with his busy schedule. He moved out in July and he actually took them somewhere for the first time about 2 weeks ago. He only took the oldest 3, to the park for about an hour before he brought them home. That was the first time he even showed an interest in taking them anywhere. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 7:37:33 AM |
The end result usually consists of one parent sacrificing years of being able to achieve advancements and promotions at work because of the custodial parental role, while the other parent goes on to achieve wage increases that come with the promotions they achieved by having less of the family responsibility their ex spouse had.
Lizbeth, what you are talking about is covered very well under the laws of spousal support (alimony). It is not supposed to have any relation to child support.
Why is it that so many men are leaving the home before they have a 50/50 custody arrangement in place?
This does seem to be the norm, doesn't it. A separation occurs for whichever reason, the husband moves out, the children stay in the family home with the Mom. It is almost as if that is the accepted "normal" thing to do. I feel that many men don't realize that they don't have to just give in like that. Just because she is Mom does not make her a better parent than Dad automatically. I wish more fathers would challenge this norm. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 8:44:11 AM | | My ex fought for full custody, but you are right - there are to many men who seem like they would be good fathers, but don't even try for split custody. Sometimes that is in the kids best interest though. The courts here suggest that primary custody go to one parent until all kids are over the age of 6, then adjusted. They believe younger children don't do as well with 2 homes. They are even reluctant to give overnights for infants. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 2:39:48 PM | ***50hrs x $7.25 = 362.50 or $18,850 year...
One could ask why would you have children or undertake finacial responsibilities when you are barely able to finacially provide for yourself?***
I'm assuming she was married when the children came along, and between both incomes they could support the kids just fine.
GEESH...why don't people think about what they write before they write? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 3:22:22 PM | | Why is everybody assuming that working hard to give my kids a good life means I can't even support myself? I have been on my own for 15 yrs and I am not the kind of person who never gets a raise or promotion. I did start at the bottom - in a domestic violence shelter with no job and not even a fork or towel to my name, but I worked my way up. I actually make double what is being suggested and that is not my point anyway. All I am saying is that I do it for my kids. Most people work hard for their kids. For someone to be on here whining and saying how unfair it is that ONE day each week is for his kids is just crazy. How much work did he think kids would be before he had them? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 3:35:11 PM | | yes conscious soul i have a house and pay tons of child support and still have one of my kids still living with me full time so i know how much stuff actually costs and the incremental cost of having the child live with me, go clothes shopping, food shopping, gas, car, blah, blah, blah. think i'm just a b.i.t.c.h.y single dad? you assumed wrong. so i have experience on both sides of the fence so i know exactly what i'm talking about. before you think i'm bashing it, i also have children living with me full time. you know what they say about assuming right? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 6:30:33 PM | Okay I have read all ten pages of this and have decided to toss in my two cents worth on the subject. Take it how you will.
First a little background as to my situations ( as there have been more than one..lol). I have been both a ncp and a cp so I can speak with experience from both situations. I had custody of my two oldest for just over seven years and even though the judge who awarded me custody informed me that "by law" I was entitled to a bare minumum of $50 per month per child I refused it as I did not want support "at this time". That was my choice . When I did ask for an increase I was told that it would cost me more to seek one than I would recieve, so I let it go. That money was better spent on them. She wasnt , and still isn't working so I wouldn't have gotten anything anyway. Again my choice, no faults or blame to anyone else.
Currently I am back on the ncp/ payor side of the fence with my youngest, and come Friday the case is up for review by the "table viewers". I know the amount will increase as my pay has increased since the amount was set 6 years ago. I have no problem paying support but heres a twist that no one seems to have mentioned thus far as I have seen. My ex currently is living with her boyfriend ( he owns his own company and has two apartments in a rather well to do building "with a Lake front view" ( her description not mine..lol). She is asking for an increase in support. I am being asked to pay more support for my child who lives under a roof she doesn't pay for with utilities she again, doesn't pay for and the kid doesn't even have a room of his own. He has a folding bed that goes in the living room behind a folding partition during the night and a closet during the day. I never have had a problem with paying support for my kids I am an old school kind of guy. I brought them into this world and its my place to raise them, but the question it seems we all have is how much is enough and how much is more than what a cp should be paying for the given situation?
A table doesnt take into account all of the variables that each case may or may not have. I do agree with a few points that have been made here as far as accountability issues that have come up. I also have a few ideas of my own on how things could be handled.
I liked the idea of using a card ( debit)to make purchases with so that there can be some accountability as to where and how the money is spent. This may help quell some of the " the ex spends it on her/ himself" folks out there. For those who say it can't be done I say it very well can be. Ever have a kid go to college and you were their sole source of support..? I have, and I can tell you where every penny went. Yeah it takes some planning but it is possible and you dont have to be a CPA to do it.
Any tax credits should be split or have the option to defer the payors cs amount as a credit. If you were married the credit would be split evenly so why should that change? I don't see that as being unfair to anyone, but I am sure a few here will argue the point.
The sad part of the whole situation here that no one ( til now) has mentioned is that this is a no win situation no matter how you dress it up or cut it down. The kids lose a two parent home and everyone gets knocked down on the stardard of living index. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 7:33:25 PM | He has a folding bed that goes in the living room behind a folding partition during the night and a closet during the day
How did she end up with custody? If I were in your place I would be trying to do something about this - unless it's a very short term situation. As for the debit card, I think it's a horrible idea. In Id, we have them - but not to track how it's spent. Yes, I will use child support to make my car payment - if it's six weeks late and the money I was going to use for the car had to be spent on the child. The money gets mixed up in most households and that does not mean that it isn't spent on the child. As I explained before, my tax credits are split, as are everybody's - at least in Id although many men don't seem to see it that way. You do not get to manage her money. It's her home and her rules and you have to accept that as long as your child is taken care of. Apparently, you don't feel he is, but instead of doing something about it, you are making the issue about the $ amount. As for the ex living off her bf, it's not fair, but life isn't fair. My ex has a wife who makes plenty, but her income didn't count when cs was last reviewed - and they are married. It goes both ways. Your child is not his child. Also, if he is living in a nicer area, the cost of supporting him goes up. If he is going to fit in with the kids in that area, he will need more expensive clothes, he will have more expesive school activities, he will be invited on more expensive outings, etc. Your son should not be sleeping in the living room - that is what you should be concerned with. Find out if this is supposed to be permanant and if it is DO something. It does not have to be a no win situation if you both focus on what is best for the kids instead of on your anger and how it is unfair to YOU. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 7:50:08 PM | | ^^^^^ I know in this medium emotions are easily confused. I have made no statements out of anger in my previous post. I also made no such complaints about the money I have to pay. I asked a question. As for managing her money I have no desire to do such, nor did I make any reference to doing so in any way. Make no assumptions please it only causes confusion and often leads to arguements .. I offered suggestions to which you are free to disagree with and very well entitled to do. I was also not making the no win comment in just my situation..It was a comment about all kids and divorce. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 7:55:56 PM | [The sad part of the whole situation here that no one ( til now) has mentioned is that this is a no win situation no matter how you dress it up or cut it down. The kids lose a two parent home and everyone gets knocked down on the stardard of living index.]
Finally, someone who really gets it!  | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 8:01:52 PM | | I just want to add that there are other expenses that nobody else has mentioned. What if there's no insurance? My ex is supposed to pay 78% of medical, but for anything "elective" I need his permission if it will be over $500. My son needed braces, another had wisdom teeth growing sideways that had to be surgically removed and 3 kids had strep throat so often that they were missing school every month. Both their regular dr and the specialist insisted that they all 3 needed tonsilectomies. In one yr alone I ended up with nearly 50,000 in medical bills. I was able to get some help with reduced hospital bills, but not much. All of these things are considered "elective". Of course I could have gone to court first and made them court ordered procedures - if I wanted an all out war with an ex who would put the kids in the middle. Even hospital bills he was supposed to pay he didn't. One of you referred to me having only 2 kids at home now - I'm still paying on 4. Also, what if your kids graduate early? Do you make a 17 yr old pay their own college tuition while they are still living with you and not ready to be on their own? Some people have strange ideas about how little kids cost. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/3/2009 9:30:08 PM |
Look at the custodial parent...look at where they are in life and realize they are probably where they would have been with..or without the children..... I disagree with this statement, I think I would have been in a much different place. I have always said that if I had kids I would raise them; not someone else. I do believe that in this day and age a lot more people (in relationships) could afford to have a stay at home parent if they really wanted to. It is not really the kids who need the expensive show homes, cars, and all the other trappings of this day and age.
If you were married the credit would be split evenly so why should that change? I don't see that as being unfair to anyone, but I am sure a few here will argue the point. When we had children in our marriage I stayed home with them, he claimed all of the tax credits.
Also, if he is living in a nicer area, the cost of supporting him goes up. If he is going to fit in with the kids in that area, he will need more expensive clothes, he will have more expensive school activities, he will be invited on more expensive outings, etc.
As parents we may wish to give all of this to our kids; especially when we can afford it. The child does not actually need it though. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/4/2009 7:55:27 AM |
I just want to add that there are other expenses that nobody else has mentioned. What if there's no insurance?
It was said that those types of expenses are handled outside of the basic CS amount (at least here in Canada).
PS - Time for national health care in the US methinks. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/4/2009 1:16:33 PM | Extracurricular Activities
Typically, child support guidelines distinguish between child-related expenses that are included in the basic child support award and entertainment-related expenses. Entertainment-related expenses are generally not included in basic child support awards. Thus, the non-custodial parent (one who does not have physical custody) does not have to contribute to the cost associated with extracurricular activities.
A court may award additional, extraordinary expenses. If the parties have sufficient financial resources, a court may require the non-custodial parent to pay for a share of the child(ren)'s extracurricular activities, including both enrichment activities such as piano or ballet lessons and sports-related activities. If the parties have limited financial resources, a court will likely find that the cost of such activities should be covered by the basic child support award.
Courts typically rule on extra child support requests on a case-by-case basis, looking at the non-custodial parent's income. If he/she earns a high income, the court will most likely rule favorably on reasonable requests for extra child support for these additional expenses. If he/she is struggling to pay necessary living expenses or if he/she has started a new family, the court will likely rule that the additional expenses are covered by the basic support award.
Exceptions
Special exceptions may arise with extremely gifted or talented children where, prior to their divorce or separation, both parents provided for expensive lessons or activities. In such cases, the court may direct that each parent contribute to the costs of the lessons or activity in proportion to their respective incomes. This order is separate and apart from the basic child support order.
Summer Camp
Whether summer camp is considered "child care" makes a big difference in child support obligations. The primary factor considered by the courts is whether summer camp is essentially taking the place of necessary child care because the custodial parent is working or going to school. Presumably, if the family unit had remained intact, both parents would treat child care as a necessary cost. As such, the expense incurred would be for the benefit of the child(ren) that both parents should share.
However, if a child is old enough to go without child care, the cost of summer camp is not considered child care. If summer camp is not "child care," but rather a discretionary expense, the cost may or may not have to be shared by the non-custodial parent. That said, even if summer camp is not deemed to be a necessary child care expense, a court can order the cost to be paid as an added expenditure in the best interests of the child(ren).
Summer Vacation
Child support is not suspended during summer vacations, even if the child(ren) spend an extensive amount of time with the non-custodial parent. However, the parents can agree to a different amount during vacation periods when the child(ren) are away for long periods of time or a court can order a modification.
Religion
Generally speaking, if the intent of both parents to raise the child in a particular faith is apparent at the time of a divorce or separation, the reasonable educational costs associated with that religion can be apportioned by the courts. Thus, costs for bar/bat mitzvahs, confirmation, and first communions should be expected to be paid by both parents.
http://family-law.lawyers.com/child-support/Child-Support-and-Extra-Curricular-Activities.html
What is child support used for?
Child support covers everything a child needs, "and even more", during the growth and formative years. Keep the following in mind:
A parent's first and principal obligation is to support his or her minor children according to the parent's circumstances and station in life; and
Children should share in the standard of living of both parents. Thus, the amount of a child support award is more than a question of "bare necessities."
If the child has a wealthy parent, that child is entitled to, and therefore ?needs? something more than the bare necessities of life. Where the supporting parent enjoys a lifestyle that far exceeds the custodial parent's living standard, child support must "to some degree" reflect that more "opulent lifestyle." This is so even though, as a practical matter, the child support payments will incidentally benefit others in the custodial household whom the payor parent has no obligation to support (e.g., custodial parent owed no spousal support, adult children, or children from custodial parent's other relationships).
Children should share in the standard of living of both parents. Child support may therefore appropriately improve the standard of living of the custodial household to improve the lives of the children. Children are entitled to share in non-custodial parent's "elevated standard of living" despite custodial parent's substantially lower income. Awarding supported children a percentage of a non-custodial parent's future bonuses ensures they will share in his standard of living.
http://family-law.freeadvice.com/child_support/1child_support.htm | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/4/2009 4:18:38 PM | "Children should share in the standard of living of both parents. Child support may therefore appropriately improve the standard of living of the custodial household to improve the lives of the children. Children are entitled to share in non-custodial parent's "elevated standard of living" despite custodial parent's substantially lower income. Awarding supported children a percentage of a non-custodial parent's future bonuses ensures they will share in his standard of living."
Okay I have a real problem with this statement. Who says that if I make more money that I would keep it all from my child? I understand that some people may be that petty, I am not. Do you really think that as my situation improves that I am not going to share the benefits of that with my child/children? This kind of thinking is what really amazes me. What... they think I am not going to put more money away for the kids future ( higher education) or the raise the childs standard of living because I make more money?
What little extra money I do make goes in his college fund but that is never given any creedence when cs is figured. How will the kid go to school to better his/her own standard of living today with out a higher education? I saw one poster who made mention of putting some money away but I would be willing to wager she is more often than not the exception to that kind of thinking.
This kind of logic escapes me, and yet again proves that good intentions by our governing bodies are somewhat misguided and paint with just as broad a brush as I have seen used in many a forum post. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 11/4/2009 4:56:09 PM | Is this actual text from the law because if it is then that is a problem. The fact that it reads as if it is already as sumed that the custodial parent will in fact be female and that he WILL in fact be keeping her standard of living intact even though she may have been the one who initiated the divorce regardless of reason.
I would think that women would be offended by this considering all this continuous noise one hears about equal rights, independance, asking to be treated fairly in all aspects of life.
Like is heard so often in these threads, WE ARE NOT IN THE FIFTIES!!!!!
That text is very gender biased and this is alimony disguised as CS. If it hasn't been caught onto from before the whole idea of a marraige was for economic stability and the numbers do show that they will succeed financially in most cases. Seems women are still the weaker sex afterall or they wouldn't allow for this kind of catering to them.
And before we get the first poster to state "Well I take care of the kids most of the time" , there are plenty of men who would gladly help ease your burden but unfortunately with laws enacted and worded as such those days are still far off. | |
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