| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/21/2009 6:18:23 PM | | OP the point with support might also be that no matter how much someone makes or how many kids there are there is a base amount to raise each kid. So what you have noticed is that the more money one makes the support amount goes up in smaller increments. Plus the Section 7 Child care expenses is based solely on percentages of income from the 2 parents. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 5:39:55 AM | Well I know when I went to my hearing they factored in cost for daycare, if I would have been paying for daycare he would have been responsible for half of whatever it costs for me to have him in there. I am assuming they would have tacked that on to child support but am not sure since my son doesn't go to daycare. At my hearing they didn't say specifically what they were factoring X amount of money in for, for instance they didn't say "Ok, this amount is for this, and this amount if for that" I think that here it's just based off income, that's why some people only get 200 a month (not nearly enough) and other people get more, like me for instance, I will be getting $436 a month, and I think that's plenty. I can buy him what he needs plus put some in my son's savings account.
As far as medical expenses, that's why they have the law here that the non custodial parent MUST put the child on their insurance if they have it. I think it should be like that everywhere. If they don't, they get charged for their medical bills. So technically it's not tacked onto the initial calculation cause they try to give u a chance to put the child on your insurance, but then if you don't they start sending u a seperate bill for their medical needs (rather than holding another hearing to modify the support order, it's easier just to send a bill), and in some cases u have to re-inburse the other parent if they were paying out-of-pocket expenses for the child's medical.
I have never had to pay any out of pocket expenses, fortunatly my son's insurance covers everything. But if I had they would have made him pay me back, and in the future he will be responsible for all co-payments once my child gets on his insurance. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 8:32:35 AM |
OP the point with support might also be that no matter how much someone makes or how many kids there are there is a base amount to raise each kid. So what you have noticed is that the more money one makes the support amount goes up in smaller increments.
I don't see that from my examples though. From 30k through 90k the percentages of net income going to CS remain very close.
Plus the Section 7 Child care expenses is based solely on percentages of income from the 2 parents.
I'm wondering if that is law at all? I've never actually seen anything formally laying out details about section 7 expenses. In my case we set up our own agreement, so I didn't look into it very much. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 11:03:25 AM | A little confusion for me here. I'm in BC and I have yet to go through this.
The child support tables, are they based on the combined income from both parents or just the paying parent? Is the receiving parents income even looked at? My case was started last year and the hearing is in December, I have our child and my lawyer hasn't asked me for my financial statement at all. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 11:20:00 AM | | The tables are based on the payer's income only. The receivers income generally does not matter for child support, only for spousal support. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:22:33 PM | I recently read an article somewhere about a group of people lobbying the government to make it illegal to force men to pay child support when a child is born out of wedlock. Only men who had children while in a marriage would be subject to child support rules.
This doesn't mean that illegitimate children won't get child support, because men can pay voluntarily,
I wonder how that will fly? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:29:06 PM |
That's not how it is in the U.S though, at least not in Ohio. They take the Mother's income into consideration, also.
thats how it is here in florida too. they take both incomes | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:29:45 PM | Futureshock
I would petition that. If thats the case the numbers of children who don't see their fathers ever again (which is already high) would go through the roof and so would poverty stricken children.
That would never fly both parents are responsible no mater what and some parents just don't get it and need a little push from the courts. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:31:23 PM | There are lobby groups out there for everything if you look hard enough. I don't see that one ever even getting as far as a private members bill. There are way too many children born out of wedlock to even contemplate cutting them out.
To throw one back at you though, how about a father being excluded from having to pay child support if he requests an abortion early enough? With the abortion laws the way they are with only the woman having a say, I foresee eventually there will be a court case regarding this.
I now fear we are going to head off track quite far. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:34:40 PM | | right on diamond i agree with you there. They take that away from making them do it, none will, besides what is marriage? A piece of paper? They still walk out on you, they still cheat, it doesn't mean much. A child is a child and has rights regardless if the parents were married or not. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:39:48 PM |
I recently read an article somewhere about a group of people lobbying the government to make it illegal to force men to pay child support when a child is born out of wedlock. Only men who had children while in a marriage would be subject to child support rules.
This doesn't mean that illegitimate children won't get child support, because men can pay voluntarily,
I wonder how that will fly?
what if they are born out of wedlock and the father has the kids?
I don't thing that law will pass but one that should is when a guy meets a SO with kids and the relationshipends the guy shouldn't have to pay CS on a kid she had before, with some other guy.
I've evenknown guys that separated and she had a kid with some one and the husband had to pay CS for a kid that wasn't his(proven threw DNA test). Didn't seem fair, he should have divorsed instead of separating. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:40:50 PM | | I'm curious though, what are your view on the amounts set forth in the child support tables? Do you think the amounts are fair for the payer or receiver? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 12:49:13 PM | With regards to 'who's income do they look at'.. the tables are set up so that your only looking at the core (bio) parents incomes. However.. you can apply to the courts to have the families combined income taken into account, this is seen alot when you're looking into the extras for the kids (extra lessons, camps, daycare, etc etc etc).
If its a 50 50 split of custody, then the formula is
(Parent A via table) - (Parent B via table) and whoever owes after that pays. Basically if both parents make the same amount of money, and have equal time (and responsiblity) then there would be no support to be paid.
Also is taken in, if the paying parent has to make a 'life change' - eg, because the child stays over, and I have had to get an apartment with 2 bedrooms, that can be used to offset the table amounts, so they wouldn't be paying as much.
The tables are a starting point, but aren't written in stone.. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:05:33 PM |
I recently read an article somewhere about a group of people lobbying the government to make it illegal to force men to pay child support when a child is born out of wedlock. Only men who had children while in a marriage would be subject to child support rules.
This doesn't mean that illegitimate children won't get child support, because men can pay voluntarily,
I wonder how that will fly?
what if they are born out of wedlock and the father has the kids? I don't thing that law will pass but one that should is when a guy meets a SO with kids and the relationshipends the guy shouldn't have to pay CS on a kid she had before, with some other guy. I've evenknown guys that separated and she had a kid with some one and the husband had to pay CS for a kid that wasn't his(proven threw DNA test). Didn't seem fair, he should have divorsed instead of separating.
I don't think it matters who has custody or where the children physically live. Either parent can of course pay voluntarily. Also, an agreement between the parties can be drawn up before the children are born stating that in the event of a break up, child support will be paid according to the payment schedules of the county in which they reside, or a pre-determined amount set forth in the agreement. It is sort of like a prenup for unmarried people and their future children.
It sounds fair to me. It protects men because they would have to agree to having a child and being responsible for it before it is born. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:32:37 PM |
The tables are a starting point, but aren't written in stone..
In your example you cite a situation where there is 50/50 custody. In the original post I noted that the tables are only law when custody time falls outside of the 40% through 60% range. Anywhere inside 40-60 the table can be used as a guideline, but any deal can be struck.
I'm curious though, what are your view on the amounts set forth in the child support tables? Do you think the amounts are fair for the payer or receiver?
Personally, I'm not sure what to think of the table amounts. Why I am undecided on finalizing my opinion is for the reasons I've stated earlier, I still don't know what the CS is supposed to be for. Almost every situation involving CS is unique, so how does something that may fit well for one situation fit for another? | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:40:37 PM | I am recently seperated from my darling husband and he is on 3/4 pay from the police department from NYC but we live NJ. He is also receiving SSD which supplements his income. He is now living with his brother and is not claiming that because he would then have to have more time with the kids and yet he is fighting for custody. He also depeleted his 401k after 2 weeks of signing the paper work. Half of that is mine and yet the judge ordered all assets frozen and yet it was left off of the ordand he is slowly depletely the account. Half of that is mine as we were married 25 years. What can I do to have him return my half and what should be my child support payments. I have 3 kids, one will be going to college next year and I have a 6 year old and a 20 year old. How will my payments be determined? I am also entitled to alimoney as I do not work. Does anyone come from NYC and is retired from the NYPD? Since I have no money for a lawyer will he have to pay my lawyer's fees? He is the one fighting for custody and is using my depression as a reason why my kids should be with him and not me and yet I am stable. Does any one know who the NJ courts work?
Mary  | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:42:02 PM | right on diamond i agree with you there. They take that away from making them do it, none will, besides what is marriage? A piece of paper? They still walk out on you, they still cheat, it doesn't mean much. A child is a child and has rights regardless if the parents were married or not. ~ Matariki sweet
All I can say to that is wow! I know many men who never cheated and were left by their exes for another guy, usually someone with more money, none of them got 50/50 custody and are paying through the nose. You make it sound as if all men are pigs, very insulting.
I think if things go as I see it with the full effects of global warming that the idea of of not forcing unwed men to pay will fly. Abortion may not be the answer but one can see that many think they can afford kids now and barely make it.
I believe the powers that be are already crunching the numbers much in the same way china did when they made it law that couples were only allowed one child.
Just wanted to add something about extra ciricular activities. Riding horses for a hundred bucks a weekend is not a neccesity, nor is karate lessons or even organized sports. As the youngest of seven I can tell you that none of my siblings were signed up for anything of that sort unless they raised the money themselves myelf included.
Had a paper route at the age of eight for five years and then moved on to parttime jobs after that. I paid for scouts, my own comic books, and my own bikes. My mom use to buy me the cheap jeans from sears and sometimes they weren't blue so if I wanted levi's or lee's I saved my own money and bought them myself.
The major flaw I see with the tables in Canada is in the lower end of the spectrum.
Considering a global balancing act as far wages go most new jobs for the average joe are not paying nearly the same as they used to. I know it may not be fair to lower income divorced women who end up with the lions share of the custody but there really isn't much left to work with for an NCP who makes little money. Depending on where you live it means that he may not be able to afford adequate living quarters and that also does affect his being able to keep a place for when he does have his kids.
Like the example above where if you had equal contribution of actual money some of these kids will dress way better than either of their parents. Heck they probably could afford to buy the family minivan and insure it for what they take in. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:44:01 PM | I am recently seperated from my darling husband and he is on 3/4 pay from the police department from NYC but we live NJ. He is also receiving SSD which supplements his income. He is now living with his brother and is not claiming that because he would then have to have more time with the kids and yet he is fighting for custody. He also depeleted his 401k after 2 weeks of signing the paper work. Half of that is mine and yet the judge ordered all assets frozen and yet it was left off of the ordand he is slowly depletely the account. Half of that is mine as we were married 25 years. What can I do to have him return my half and what should be my child support payments. I have 3 kids, one will be going to college next year and I have a 6 year old and a 20 year old. How will my payments be determined? I am also entitled to alimoney as I do not work. Does anyone come from NYC and is retired from the NYPD? Since I have no money for a lawyer will he have to pay my lawyer's fees? He is the one fighting for custody . Does any one know who the NJ courts work?
Mary | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:49:07 PM | I am recently seperated from my darling husband and he is on 3/4 pay from the police department from NYC but we live NJ. He is also receiving SSD which supplements his income. He is now living with his brother and is not claiming that because he would then have to have spend more time with the kids, he spends 12 hours a week!! Can you believe that and yet he is fighting for custody. He also depeleted his 401k after 2 weeks of signing the paper work. Half of that is mine and yet the judge ordered all assets frozen and yet it was left off of the order so he is slowly depletely the account. Half of that is mine as we were married 25 years. What can I do to have him return my half and what should be my child support payments. I have 3 kids, one will be going to college next year and I have a 6 year old and a 20 year old. How will my payments be determined? I am also entitled to alimoney as I do not work. Does anyone come from NYC and is retired from the NYPD? Since I have no money for a lawyer, will he have to pay my lawyer's fees? He is the one fighting for custody . Does any one know how the NJ courts workas far as divorce?
Mary | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 1:50:53 PM |
He also depeleted his 401k..............Half of that is mine
like you said HIS!!!!! get your own 401k he owes you nothing, you are not together anymore. | |
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| An unofficial look at CS payment amounts.
Posted: 10/22/2009 2:06:28 PM | | allys - Seek legal aid if you can't afford a lawyer. If you can't get legal aid talk to a few legal firms around, you can likely get a lawyer to take the case with a signed agreement that they get paid out of whatever you get in the settlement. It's what my STBX did. | |
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