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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 11:48:16 AM | There is a huge spread between emotionless casual sex and committed long term loving sex in a relationship. The point is where on the scale do you prefer to start and how do you gauge your experiences. I don’t care for casual sex, never have and don’t participate in it, it’s a measure and I have found it on my own, not by what I have been told.
OnlyThis, you can only speak for you, not all men and certainly not me. I don’t need love to have sex, but I need more than lust. Can you come up with a better description than “crap”, I think you have rubbed it into the ground by now as is the rest of your diatribes. Oh yeah, I forget you’re still in a high school locker room era, never mind. The only thing that is ludicrous here is your assumption that you know it all. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 11:58:35 AM |
Dude, you're creepy. Obnoxious, rude and very creepy.
In typical fashion of many pof women, you are making judgments about someone you do not know. I have dated many women from this site and some who are even in these forums. I doubt any of them would describe me as creepy or obnoxious and certainly not rude.
I find the forums a fascinating place. Generally, the men don't talk like men and the women aren't representative of those that actually date on the site. Seriously, look at the posts from the women about the men who approach them from the site.. and then look at the posts from the guys posting in the forums.. it's like two completely different species exist. Why do you suppose that is?
In the forums, I tend to be brutally honest and blunt. If that offends some, I am sorry but I just don't feel the need for pretense... | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:04:02 PM | | I am the same way I can't just have casual empty sex myself. My ex sure can thats why she left me because she wanted to do it with a ton of dudes. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:06:06 PM |
So,onlythis, do you go up to women and say " I don't want to be your friend or be in a relationship with you, I just want to f*ck you and forget you?" Or do you have a package of pretty lies you tell?
Believe me, I am a master of the game (in my 20's I was a pick up artist) but I don't need to play anymore. At my age, I expect women to be very comfortable with sex and sexuality.. if they aren't... I simply move on.. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:10:07 PM | I think that most men who have matured emotionally (no age limit here- I know mature 20 year olds and immature 50 year olds) DO need to feel at least some connection to the women they have sex with. It doesn't have to be love though. When I met my guy, it took perhaps 5 months to realise I actually loved him, and for certain I could not have lasted 5 months before getting him nekkid 
I'm pretty sure it was the same for him- we liked each other, we slept together, we got to know each other physically, intellectually and emotionally, then we used that L word!
My non-scientific equation is therefore: spark+connection+sex | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:15:19 PM |
Sex is like drinking beer--its an activity that creates a buzz. You can do it alone, with friends, or with strangers. If you see it as only pleasure, then you never feel like you "gave it up too soon". You get what you expect, right away.
lol...I am glad that you said it. I, as a woman, know that alot of men do feel this way about sex and that is exactly the reason why I don't enter into casual sex/flings.
Don't get me wrong. I love sex and apparently I am one lusty/hot lady when I am indulging in that nirvana, but for me to totally let go and immerse myself in sex, I have to have feelings for him and he has to have feelings for me. The attraction has to be "I can love this person....all of the ingredients are here." Not just..."oooh...she/he's hot..."
How teenybopperish.
Love and relationships are serious and they shouldn't be taken lightly. Sex can generate a whole world of emotions in women...especially the bonding type.
My mother or any other influential woman did not counsel me to be this way (social conditioning) as I am of the generation where our mothers didn't talk about sex. It was a subject that was not to be discussed other than "don't get pregnant...and good girls are not promiscuous." Most of us women discovered our sexuality on our own. Just like most men did. Instinctual.
There wasn't the heavy advertising of sex, nor were there anything blatantly sexual in the media except Marilyn Monroe.
One of the most blatant sex manipulation"cards" used on here is the fact "that we women are conditioned from our mothers to be like the way were are sexually and that we were taught to think sex is a tool.." Nope...nope...nope. Hands up, any woman from my generation that had a mother sit down and be very frank about sex. If there was, it is a rarity. Most of the time subject was evaded.
Sex is a medium thru which one shares life with another. Are there other mediums a person uses to share their life with you? Do they take you to events they enjoy, to hang out with families and friends, et cetera? Then they appreciates your company. Do they help you when you need help, just b/c they hates seeing you hurt? Then they could be in love.
When you both really want to share ALL aspects of your life with each other, then it is love. Love doesn't operate very well on a part-time basis. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:26:30 PM | Wow, everyone is giving OnlyThis such a hard time....he is just trying to enlighten everyone!
Sure, maybe there are a couple of men out there who really NEED love to have sex, and enjoy it...but that is a small percentage of the population. I think men can enjoy sex without love, but that it is maybe just more fulfilling when you care about the person you are sticking it to.
I think the main thing that OnlyThis was trying to communicate, is that NuDig's way of thinking is more the exception than the rule. And I have to agree. I have known enough men to fully believe that...ALTHOUGH, there are men out there who I have known who are very religious and so would only have sex within the confines of marriage.
But overall, this is true...for most people. And I think it's pretty lame that sex is considered a functional/mechanical act, unless there is love. I don't think I believe that for one minute? Maybe it is the person you choose to have sex with, and the chemistry between the two of you...because without love, there still can be passion. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:32:09 PM | Valid points but I think for some women it is not the whole giving it up thing it is a degree of vulnerability that is difficult for people to gauge when they are able to allow those particular walls to come down. I think when you are with an abusive type partner, who will the morning after rip you a new one for not cleaning the kitchen or when you do wait and the guy takes a hike, you may feel made a fool of or used.
With the guy that takes a hike, there is always the assumption that he hung around for the sex and took off as soon as he got it but I think in some cases, even with older men, the sex becomes some sort of goal and they fail to evaluate whether they really want to be with the woman and then when they finally are, they start looking around and just don't care for her as much as he thought he did.
It would be nice if people could stop making someone the bad guy but someone who has felt rejected in that way, after sharing that part of themselves, can you stop yourself from hurting if you are sort of hardwired this way? I fully agree that there is making love and having sex and if both people know which of those they are doing going in there should be no harm no foul, but it doesn't seem to work that way. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:36:04 PM |
you cannot take back the emotional pain or physical harm of a bad sex partner.
But I think you can train yourself to be more prepared for the instances of bad sex partners( whatever that means to each individual person),therefore sustaining LESS pain,harm, disappointment, whatever.
and the idea of allowing just anyone to enter this special area
I'm inclined to doubt that there are many here posting to/reading forums who are 'allowing just anyone to enter this special area'. The problem lies in the fact that men can pretty much separate sex and love. But when they find a woman who can do, and DOES, exactly the same thing, many men will look down on her. They'd rather find a "good woman" and lie about their intentions, 'cause they don't want THEIR weiners where lots of other weiners have gone before. It's just another damn double standard that women have to try and work around. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining. That's just how it works . I don't expect men to change. I do know there ARE men who need a strong emotional component to fully enjoy sex. In fact, even the damaged "get what I can get and get away" men, if they happen to find a loving relationship (and manage to NOT screw it up) find another dimension to sexual intimacy. But too many of them are too afraid, or angry/resentful to take that risk, to make that effort. I've been in both loving relationship scenarios , FwB scenarios, and judiciously chosen "itch scratching" encounters. All have good points in different ways. I'm sure about 98% of us would dearly love to have our love life be with that one special man or woman. Some are able to take an iron hold on their sex drive and wait for that to occur. Others can't, or wont. That doesn't make anybody bad, wrong or stupid.
Cindy O | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:36:45 PM | Dude, you're creepy. Obnoxious, rude and very creepy.
Whatever...
You get your knickers in a bunch.
I can't tell you how many times I've gotten the same criticisms levelled at me, despite having made dozens of female friends on the forums, met and dated a few, who are all too familiar with my opinions (which seem to align with OnlyThis) and posts.
I doubt any of them would describe me as obnoxious, rude, or creepy.
Well.....maybe obnoxious... but I've never had a problem being labelled that...
Just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder, so is ugliness.
In the forums, I tend to be brutally honest and blunt. If that offends some, I am sorry but I just don't feel the need for pretense...
It's not uncommon for people to want to know the reality and truth, and then not be able to handle it.
Old news... | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:47:06 PM | I find myself agreeing with Blissout on this. Most men I've met have enjoyed sex without love. Most, like women, want a deeper connection, lust, chemistry, but love is harder to wait for.
To say that sex without love is functional/mechanical act is going too far. While Love makes the act different and enjoyable on a different level I dont believe that love is needed for enjoyable sex. Lust, chemistry and like someone said above, the small 'L' is key. But love isn't needed for a passionate wonderful time. Just makes it more secure, different maybe. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:47:21 PM |
But if you see it as something you trade for company or as a sign of love I've heard many men from this forum use that phrase, that they think we are trading sex for a relationship.... They just don't get it that most of us are not trading at all, we are just waiting until we decide if we like them enough to have sex with them, and that usually takes more than a couple of hours of their company.. We can decide if we are attracted to them in a couple of seconds, but they can stuff that up as soon as they start talking or show some other negative character trait which turns us off.. And i like to be turned on when i have sex....
I don't have to be in love either, but as others have said, i do have to like the man. I'm damned if i'm going to let some guy i don't even like unload his jizz in me just because i'm horny. I'd rather go home and do myself!
Fortunately i don't have to worry about all that anymore.. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:47:31 PM |
I think that most men who have matured emotionally .... DO need to feel at least some connection to the women they have sex with
I'm sorry, this is what you want to believe .. it is simply not true. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:52:40 PM |
I think that most men who have matured emotionally .... DO need to feel at least some connection to the women they have sex with
I'm sorry, this is what you want to believe .. it is simply not true.
Simply not true? Again, your opinion, please present your evidence. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 12:58:10 PM | Sex by itself is great.
Love is also great.
Sometimes both are better when both are present.
IMO, sex can be great if you at least care for your partner's enjoyment as well as your own. Of course, some people believe (or are programmed to think) love is needed in order to have sex, but good sex has been happening for millenia without it.
They are separate things, but can become closely linked in a good relationship. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:01:14 PM | Sex without love is purely a physical act. In the sixties we said if it feels good do it. Sex with love, imo, brings the act of sex into a new galaxy.
We all have choices. That's why it's important to pick your sexual partners wisely. Not everyone falls in "love" with each sexual partner they have. If you want to feel good, do it. If you need the commitment of love, you might be waiting a little longer. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:04:58 PM | | Men at the very least like to be liked on some level when they have sex - that in itself is a form of an emotion. I mean really, I can't see too many guys getting off and having good sex themselves if a woman is popping her gum, doing her nails and talking on the phone at the same time. It may not stop him from going ahead and having sex but the quality would be pretty crappy, now wouldn't it? So he wants at the very least to be liked. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:12:27 PM | It's fascinating to see how many people keep repeating the same old stuff..."I can't have sex unless I'm in love" ...fine, some people do prefer a connection of some kind....but how can you possibly fall in love with someone WITHOUT the sex?
Whenever I see threads like this it makes me wonder if people really are living in the real world or the made up love stories that Hollywood creates...If people stopped viewing sex as BAD and love as GOOD...there wouldn't be so much confusion. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:17:01 PM |
I'm sorry, this is what you want to believe .. it is simply not true.
No, it simply isn't YOUR truth. We get that.
You just want to have sex,without any obligaion on your part. That's fine, but then if a woman posts that she expects a man to pay for a date, just for the pleasure of her company, you can hear the male screams of outrage clear to Iceland.
Personally, I don't much care what anybody else does or how they do it as long as no harm is being done, nor diseases spread.
But I had to point out the inconsistency.
And there is, I suspect a fine line between a woman who handles her sexuality as she sees fit out of complete self confidence, and the woman who has given up all discrimination and has simply become resigned to being a boinkhole because she thinks that's all she can get. You can talk all you want about a woman having come to terms with sex but if you find out she comes to terms with sex via a different guy every Saturday night, I bet you lose her number mighty quick.
Cindy O | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:20:41 PM | I may be one of those rare males that prefers to make love over just having sex with someone. I find sex, although physically gradifying lacks so much compared when you have it with somone you love and care about. Like the lady said, its just a mechanical activity with another person when it lacks some feelings for the person you doing it with.
For Arabian angel above,
Sex can be good or bad depending on the state of mind your in and if your just plain horney at the time, but I personally find it more gratifying if I know and care for the person I am doing it with as opposed to some stranger I hardley know. | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:22:17 PM | | ^^^^^sure but to get to the state of LOVE were you NOT having sex? | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:29:33 PM | Arabian Angel,
Yes after sex for the first time with someone you like, sex brings on a deeper connection for me. Yes myself as a man takes it to a next level after the act of sex. So I can see your point, without sex maybe love isnt attainable. I mean with the sex intamcy follows and a closeness occurs, a bond. Prior to sex a friendship is established | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:33:05 PM | and sex is infinitly better when in love!!! | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:44:27 PM | In my experience, some of the absolute best, mind-blowing sex I've ever had was with someone I barely knew, and some of the worst and least satisfying was with someone I loved greatly and was within a long term relationship.
Love is not necessary for great sex - at least for me. Sex is not necessary for love, but sure helps! If you can find great love and great sex in one person, keep them! | |
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| Sex versus love
Posted: 11/3/2009 1:44:36 PM | This is the first time I've posted, and I cringe thinking of the emails Im going to get. But. IMO, it's perfectly possible to have sex for the sake of enjoyment- what it takes to enjoy it is different for each individual. I do think that many women are conditioned- by society, not their mothers- that if they have sex without love that makes them some kind of slut. Therefor they cannot allow themselves to just have sex with someone they are attracted to, without attaching some parameters of love around it. Then when it turns out to be either a one night stand, or something other than a LTR they feel badly because of the story they built up in their heads about it. The disconnect between their false expectations and reality causes that feeling of being used. If we can allow ourselves to just acknowledge our sexuality without expecting love, we wouldn't feel badly in those situations, but would rather just enjoy the moment. Or, dont have sex without being 100% in a committed loving relationship- something next to impossible to achieve without experiencing sex in my opinion. If men werent conditioned to label women who have sex because they enjoy it as sluts, both genders might get along a whole lot better.
For the record- if a man asks me out, I expect him to pay. If I feel like having sex I will, if not, I won't. It has nothing to do with who pays. If I do have sex with a man, I expect him to treat me with respect- the act may be casual, but treat me casually and I won't be seeing you again. That said, I might or might not want to see the guy again anyway. Either way, both parties should be respectful of each other- it has nothing to do with sex, but with manners.
And for the record- I had sex with my husband the first time we dated, although we did know each other as friends and colleagues for a few months before. We've been married for 27 years. Sadly, things have changed for us, something I wont go into here, it's personal. | |
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