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Show ALL Forums  > Relationships  > marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?      Home login  
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 bike_nerd
Joined: 11/9/2009
Msg: 126
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?Page 6 of 8    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8)
there's nothing wrong with lawyers making money by offering a service. if you would rather spend 3 or 4 years going through law school pouring through numerous sleep inducing documents, pass the bar exam, pass the character fitness committee, become competent enough to read through legalese then by all means go do your own divorce.
no? you don't feel like doing that? then pay someone to do all that for you!
 GoodGirl100
Joined: 8/26/2009
Msg: 127
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/6/2009 10:02:41 AM

She is considering leaving him because his way of ignoring her clearly expressed needs (affection, sex , and contribution to the running of the home and family) show her that he does not respect her, value her, or appreciate her and all that she does for the marriage. In short, she feels unloved

GoodGirl


Respect, value, and appreciation are earned by someone's day to day behaviors and actions. They are not automatically guarenteed by saying "I do"

Oldkid

Oldkid, don't you think they should be? I mean , what on earth is anyone doing marrying someone who doesn't respect him/her, and isn't prepared to SHOW it? In the case of my example, notice how I said he should show that he respects, values, and appreciates her for "all that SHE does for the marriage". I promise you, she does value and appreciate him, and that is why she has stayed as long as she has. She is hoping that he will step up and return the favour to save the relationship. She isn't demanding to be treated with respect and appreciation simply because she is his spouse (although I don't see anything wrong with this expectation) she is demanding that he treat her as she deserves to be treated, with the same respect and appreciation that she has SHOWN him, and expressed to him. She also wants more sex and affection.

If you are suggesting that some people do not deserve to be respected by their spouses, I suppose that is probably true, but the idea still supports my main argument: why do people want to be married to spouses who fail to treat them with respect and appreciation?

Consider this:

1) Wife is not a very good wife (let's say, for some strange reason, that the husband thought the wife would be willing to do most of the housework, but she does not, OR that she committed the cardinal sin of gaining weight after giving birth to their children, OR she gets wicked PMS)

2) Husband treats wife with disrespect and lack of appreciation because he feels that she does not deserve any.

3) Wife feels she is not being valued and respected, gets fed up, and leaves the marriage.

4) Man wonders why his wife left him, even though he did not beat, cheat, or drink.

I guess I simply wonder why he cares. He was dissatisfied in the first place, was he not? If the thing that made the wife unworthy of respect in the husband's eyes (messy house, weight gain, PMS, etc.) is not important enough to divorce over, then why was it so important that he had to treat her with disrespect within the marriage? Does it boil down to a need to be right?



The other major factor is the difference in understanding the needs of the spouse and how those needs are communicated and met or not met! Women and men just don't easily speak the same language


Understood. Again, in my example, I specifically mentioned that he was not fulfilling her STATED needs. Mature women realize that men often take things quite literally, and that if you do not ask for something, you will very likely not get it. I would argue that a lot of people are pretty clearly (and loudly....lol) asking for what they need/want and the spouses are simply not open to hearing it.

I spoke to my ex many, many times about how his lack of communication and disregard for my needs/wants was killing our relationship. I pleaded with him to be more open, and I asked many times if we could get some outside help. He simply chose not to hear me, in my opinion. As soon as I told him (after almost 20 years of marriage) that I was finished and was going to file for a separation, he quite suddenly thought seeing a counselor was a terrific idea. I couldn't do it, though. I was emotionally finished by that point, and no counselor on earth can make you love someone who has systematically destroyed the love you once felt by his/her actions over a period of many, many years. He thought I was refusing to get counseling to punish him. He failed to understand that I wasn't ANGRY at him any more for his disrespectful treatment; in fact, his lack of care and respect and appreciation of me over the years had caused me to stop loving him. I guess I could use this as an example of how men and women don't communicate the same way, but what difference does it really make? Selfish, stubborn, and wrong, is still selfish, stubborn, and wrong, even allowing for differences in mars/venus world.
 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 128
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/6/2009 10:58:50 AM
"if marriage is extict, why are there still wedding dresses being made and money cards being printed with words 'congratulations on your wedding"! Why are there people who are still employed as 'wedding planners'?"

Several things here and several reasons. First as the title says 'on the way out' not 'extinct'. Next as to the questions quoted, because there is great money in it, it's a business, has little to do with feelings or divorce or what happens in couple dynamics AFTER the wedding.

Women are conditioned to expect a wedding. Disney, Barbie bride, magazines, peer pressure and the biological clock being some of the reasons. But when you step back and look at the number, the divorce rate for last year, excluding 6 states was, 47.5%. That should give many pause before walking down the aisle.

As for lawyers and their, ah, expertise. You know, they charge an arm and a leg, at least the best ones. Again it is a business for them. You go to a deposition, they are kidding with the other lawyer, making plans for lunch, or golf. Your standing there miserable, angry, upset and more, they exhibit little compassion, why? Because it is just a job to them, a way to make a buck and your feelings don't mean a fuken thing, just thinking how they can eat through the retainer, to get another payment!
 oldkid
Joined: 7/3/2006
Msg: 129
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marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/6/2009 6:35:20 PM
GoodGirl100
I think we can agree that those feelings of respect and value were there at the time of the marriage - the act of marriage shows those feelings. The problem comes later in the marriage when one or both of the partners figure out that their expectations are not being met. Excessive weight gain, PMS, child rearing, and menopause are some things that destroy many marriages from a man's prespective. I would assume that man's lack of concern for children, work compulsion, and emotional support do the same thing from a woman's perspective.


"all that SHE does for the marriage".
While her and you may see this as good, is she doing things for the home and family or her husband? What does "for the marriage" mean? A workaholic could say that and the spouse would totally disagree. Both spouses need to be doing things for the other at a personal level.

Men and women both have difficulty with the needs/wants problem. Sometimes because they require more effort than they are willing to put out, sometimes because they don't see them as important. I agree that communication (- the emotion) would solve many of these issues but it just doesn't happen - too many emotionally charged issues on both sides. Take the sex/affection comment you made; often times these are more connected together in the woman's mind than the man's. Affection being the emotional connection while sex is the physical.

A new thought: maybe the prevelance of emotional problems in society today is a major contributor to divorce? Why can't couples openly discuss any topic without the emotionally charged environment? Obviously a major problem because it doesn't even happen in these forums.
 GoodGirl100
Joined: 8/26/2009
Msg: 130
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/6/2009 8:37:24 PM

While her and you may see this as good, is she doing things for the home and family or her husband? What does "for the marriage" mean?


In the case of my friend, I meant that she does things specifically to nurture the relationship between her and her husband. I agree that this is a separate issue from doing things for the family/household.


Take the sex/affection comment you made; often times these are more connected together in the woman's mind than the man's. Affection being the emotional connection while sex is the physical.


I think most people want both, although maybe more men would settle for sex without affection, and some women would settle for more affection and less sex. My poor friend wants and deserves both and is getting neither.

Oldkid, I know if I were to be in a serious relationship again, I would bring up some touchy subjects early on so that I would know if we had the ability to "fight fair" with one another, because I agree with you that emotions get in the way of having a fruitful discussion.
 MEGONE!
Joined: 11/16/2009
Msg: 131
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 5:36:34 AM
reason being is because everyone in a rush thinking they wont find no one and when they do they rush!! need to slow down..

my rule is build the foundation.. build your home.. and family then let marriage be your retirement!! something to look forward to!! after marriage all you have to look forward to is dieing old together and that sounds so great!!
 PickMe007
Joined: 7/2/2009
Msg: 132
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History
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 9:16:27 AM
Women are much less likely to settle for miserable, unsatisfying, boring marriages than men are. Men would rather stay in such a marriage because they see it as too much trouble to change it. Women are willing to take more risks and do more work in order to possibly be happy one day. I don't see why men see this as a negative quality.


It's obvious why us men don't like this: it's a power shift. Remember the old saying 'he who cares less wins'? Women today apparently care less about being married then men do. So this fact neuters the men, takes away what remaining power they have and places it squarely in the laps of women.

I've been saying this for a couple years now: men desire to be in a relationship more than women do. I don't get it, but it's the truth.

And think of allll those articles in women's magazines about how women want relationship...hmmm. I think it's men that want relationship and women just want to be on their own. It just seems the evidence is mounting more and more that women, somewhere deep down, are mostly interested in men for their sperm donation, and if necessary, financial donation. Compromising to make a marriage work, from some women's point of view, is tantamount to weakness and the loss of one's soul and identity.
 pro-filer
Joined: 5/9/2008
Msg: 133
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 11:00:16 AM

Compromising to make a marriage work, from some women's point of view, is tantamount to weakness and the loss of one's soul and identity.

It does seem sometimes that an awful lot of onus is put on the woman: that she initiates divorce doesn't mean she wasn't willing or didn't try to work on the marriage. My ex-husband was one of those "non-responsive" types that have already been described. I told him for years that a shower and some foreplay would sure do a lot to improve my sexual experience with him. He never made any effort in either of those areas, and he never got refused sex either. That wasn't the only issue between us, but I "compromised" on those and smaller ones, until his third infidelity. The thing was, the infidelity, for me, was something I would have been able and willing to work through, but the other issues were the things that made me feel that I was simply not particularly important to him. By the time he cheated the third time, any feelings of romantic love were long gone, and now I had a "socially acceptable" reason to leave the marriage. (Btw, HE initiated the divorce about 3 years later).

I think it bears repeating that the person who initiates a divorce isn't necessarily the one whose lack of effort ended it.
 forumrum
Joined: 5/25/2009
Msg: 134
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 12:32:58 PM
".....there's nothing wrong with lawyers making money by offering a service. if you would rather spend 3 or 4 years going through law school......" (quoted from message 132 above)

Actually it is a 4 year undergrad degree, then three years of post grad university (law school), then one year articling under another lawyer, then the bar courses, then bar exams.

Education is on par with doctors and a tough way to make a living. The fees for services cover insurance, rent, staff, advertising, utilities, office expenses, etc.

Everyone complains about them until you need one.
 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 9/26/2009
Msg: 135
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 3:21:07 PM

(pro-filer) I think it bears repeating that the person who initiates a divorce isn't necessarily the one whose lack of effort ended it.


Absolutely correct. However, if 70%-80% of divorces were filed by men, NOBODY would want to hear ANY justification for it.

Binroe...
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 136
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 5:09:02 PM

My best friend is trying to decide if she is going to leave her marriage, and her husband does not cheat, beat, or suffer from addiction. She is considering leaving him because his way of ignoring her clearly expressed needs (affection, sex , and contribution to the running of the home and family) show her that he does not respect her, value her, or appreciate her and all that she does for the marriage. In short, she feels unloved. I am only speaking from my own observations (I have no hard data on this) but I see and hear this over and over again. So, yes, I think this is why lots of women leave.


I've found from my experience and from other guys I know that women love to believe that they are being upfront, working hard to make things work, respecting their men, blaugh, blaugh, blaugh... but the women often fail to see what THEIR part in the fvck up is.

I accept that I was at least half of the reason my ex and I broke up, but I refuse to accept that I was the whole reason things fvcked up. Apparently, I never did anything for my ex or the relationship. Did I fvck up? Absolutely. Did I take things for granted? Absolutely. Did I feel entitled in some ways? Abso-fvcking-lutely.

Did I feel that I was not respected? Yup. Did I feel used? Yup. Did I feel taken for granted? Sure did.

Did I communicate that effectively? Nope. Did she communicate her feelings effectively? Nope.

Women really need to get over themselves and their belief that they are the marvelous communicators that they believe they are.....

... 'cause from my experience and every guy I know, women are just as shitty at communicating as they accuse men of being.

 x_file_
Joined: 9/30/2009
Msg: 137
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 5:53:01 PM

Is the idea of lifelong marriage obsolete?
Yes (57) 20%
No (189) 68%
Not sure (30) 10%
Total Votes: 276


The total votes are only 276. That's not large enough sample.



Philosophers and theologians have always placed marriage as the foundation of a society. True or False.
True
(131) 71%
False (Coontz and Gallagher)
(53) 28%
Total Votes: 184


Once again, that's not large enough sample.

Also, the answer should be "False" by default as there are very few philosophers who have spoken kindly about marriage, and infinitely fewer who have placed marriage as the foundation of a society. Actually, I don't know any philosopher who has argued that marriage is the foundation of society, not one in the 40+ philosophers I've read.



a lot of these answers sound jaded. if marriage is extinct, why are there still wedding dresses being made and money cards being printed with the words "congratulations on your wedding!" why are there people who are still employed as "wedding planners"?
and most of all, why do stores have such a thing as "wedding registry"?


It's extinct in the minds of many men. Unfortunately, there are still few men who are not smart enough to figure how damning can marriage be.



In the case of my friend, I meant that she does things specifically to nurture the relationship between her and her husband


Yeah, that's not quite the same as nurturing her husband.



Women today apparently care less about being married then men do.


That's what they want you to believe! Women do care about marriage more than men do. I wager that 90% of women want to get married - regardless of what they actually say.

Some say "I don't want to get married" as means to hook a guy who otherwise considers marriage a red flag.



I've been saying this for a couple years now: men desire to be in a relationship more than women do. I don't get it, but it's the truth.


Relationship? Perhaps! Marriage? No!



However, if 70%-80% of divorces were filed by men, NOBODY would want to hear ANY justification for it.


Yep, men would automatically be deemed as the "black sheep". Kind of like when a woman gets pregnant, it's always the man's fault - no woman wants to hear any justification from the guy (or any guy for that matter).



Women really need to get over themselves and their belief that they are the marvelous communicators that they believe they are.....

... 'cause from my experience and every guy I know, women are just as shitty at communicating as they accuse men of being.


 GoodGirl100
Joined: 8/26/2009
Msg: 138
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 6:02:22 PM

I've found from my experience and from other guys I know that women love to believe that they are being upfront, working hard to make things work, respecting their men, blaugh, blaugh, blaugh... but the women often fail to see what THEIR part in the fvck up is.


I truly believe that the woman of whom I speak has gone above and beyond in terms of trying to make things work, including, but not limited to, moving half way around the world for him. I do not think she is perfect, but I do think she has done a lot more for him than he has for her....Why? She loves him, respects him, and values him. BTW, she is heartbroken and agonizing over the decision she is in the process of making. There is nothing for her to gain by breaking up ( she makes almost twice as much $ as she does, so she is not motivated by $) except the emotional relief in being free from being with a man who shows no affection, no interest in her life, and who is not interested in sex.


I accept that I was at least half of the reason my ex and I broke up, but I refuse to accept that I was the whole reason things fvcked up. Apparently, I never did anything for my ex or the relationship. Did I fvck up? Absolutely. Did I take things for granted? Absolutely. Did I feel entitled in some ways? Abso-fvcking-lutely.

Did I feel that I was not respected? Yup. Did I feel used? Yup. Did I feel taken for granted? Sure did.


I would imagine this is pretty common, both parties feeling similar feelings of being under appreciated. After all, if we showed appreciation for what our partners did for us, we might not all be in this state of runaway divorce.


Women really need to get over themselves and their belief that they are the marvelous communicators that they believe they are.....
... 'cause from my experience and every guy I know, women are just as shitty at communicating as they accuse men of being.


Well, I cannot speak for all women, but when I referred to my friend's situation, I said that her partner was not making an effort to her "clearly stated" needs. She has shared with me some of the things she has told him, and I am convinced she has been very, very clear. I also feel I was clear and explicit with my ex. Not that you hang on my every word or anything, but in a previous post, I said that I begged my ex to go with me to counseling, and told him that his actions were driving a wedge between us that I feared would be the death of our relationship, but he would not hear me until it was far too late. In my experience and observation, many women DO, in fact, communicate clearly, and many (not all) husbands simply do not hear it, or underestimate the seriousness of the situation...OR (it occurs to me as I write this) in the defense of men, perhaps they don't believe the women. I must admit that although I told my ex that if certain problems did not change, I would leave, it took me a hella long time to actually follow through. It wasn't that I didn't intend to leave, I just kept giving it another six months, then another six months, until it hit me that I could keep doing that til hell froze over and he had no intention of fixing the part of the problem that he owned. So, yeah, there's that. Maybe some women threaten to leave so often that men simply don't believe them.
 hmbertero
Joined: 11/30/2009
Msg: 139
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marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 6:13:20 PM
so true...cinsav. I call it the Dumbing of America... Reality shows for everything now! it is totally crazy....!
 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 140
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 6:38:43 PM
"Everyone complains about them until you need one"

That's the problem, needing one!!

70 years ago, you rarely needed one. Now every law is written and administered in lawyerese. Even get away from divorce for a second. SocialSecurity disability from the government, more than 25% of people need one to get their rights under the law! Why? Because most law makers are lawyers and write them so ONLY they understand them. Talk about giving yourself a permanent job, WOW!

Now as to fees they must pay and staffs. Why is that my problem? Is it my problem in any business where costs rocket out of control and I don't buy the product? NO! Here you have no choice. If you make $50 an hour x 40 hours x 52 weeks = 98,000. Now many of the better divorce lawyers charge from 300 to 400 an hour! That's not the top guys either. They get a good life, you can't even approximate justice.

So what would be the answer? Go without? Yeah that would workout real great for you. In the end, the laws need to be changed, suzie homemaker does not exist anymore. But they(lawyers) go on with business as usual. The system is fuked and nobody cares. She gets a payday, the lawyer gets his fee, why change anything!!

THAT'S why marriage is dying, alot of guys don't want to get fuked twice, so why take the chance!!
 NothingLeftToBurn
Joined: 6/11/2007
Msg: 141
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marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/7/2009 6:38:49 PM
I'm going to state the obvious: marriage was doomed to fail since the day it was conceived.
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 142
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/8/2009 4:12:10 PM


I've found from my experience and from other guys I know that women love to believe that they are being upfront, working hard to make things work, respecting their men, blaugh, blaugh, blaugh... but the women often fail to see what THEIR part in the fvck up is.



I truly believe that the woman of whom I speak has gone above and beyond in terms of trying to make things work, including, but not limited to, moving half way around the world for him. I do not think she is perfect, but I do think she has done a lot more for him than he has for her....Why? She loves him, respects him, and values him.


Yes, well, she SAYS she loves him etc, but so what? What she tells you means diddly-squat.

Have you ever asked HIM what his perspective is? I doubt it.

I know of ONE couple of all the couples who are roughly my age who have made it 20 years together who MAY, truly still really love each other. And, to use the stupid distinction between 'love' and 'in love' this particular couple may still be IN love....

... but I've never talked to HER about it. I have talked with HIM and he's still smitten after nearly 30 years, but for all I know, she may hate his guts for past hurt.


BTW, she is heartbroken and agonizing over the decision she is in the process of making. There is nothing for her to gain by breaking up ( she makes almost twice as much $ as she does, so she is not motivated by $) except the emotional relief in being free from being with a man who shows no affection, no interest in her life, and who is not interested in sex.


Well, again, you are getting ONE side to the story. It sounds to me like she's just talking herself into what she wants to do and you are helping her be ok with the decision she's already made.

As I've said many times, today's soulmate is tomorrow's shithead. Her husband is becoming that soulmate morphed into the shithead.

You help to make her case which is something that many women seem to do these days. Divorces seem to come in clusters of friends who kick their husbands to the curb.


Well, I cannot speak for all women, but when I referred to my friend's situation, I said that her partner was not making an effort to her "clearly stated" needs. She has shared with me some of the things she has told him, and I am convinced she has been very, very clear. I also feel I was clear and explicit with my ex.


Yeah... if you asked my ex, I"m sure she'd tell you that SHE was perfectly clear with me before she left with her lover. I'm sure sure she'd tell you that she gave it her all during the counselling sessions we went to at my request in an attempt to repair our damaged relationship.

From MY perspective, she was already LOooooooooong gone before she ever let me know anything 'clearly'.

 Arlo_Troutman
Joined: 9/26/2009
Msg: 143
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/8/2009 4:20:19 PM
(GoodGirl100) A significant number of marriages end due to cheating, abuse, or addiction. You can argue, if you will, that both sexes cheat, and struggle with addiction, but the abusers are overwhelmingly male. My ex thought he deserved some kind of medal because he didn't cheat, didn't beat, and didn't drink. I have heard, over and over again, even in this thread, that men seem to think this is some kind of gold standard for marriage.


Given the low level of morality these days, that *IS* a gold standard. Pretty sad, hunh?


...but the abusers are overwhelmingly male.


Oh, horse-feathers.


Most women nowadays will not settle for this.




Binroe...
 mr.evil
Joined: 11/14/2009
Msg: 144
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/9/2009 11:11:29 AM
What if he didn't beat or cheat, what if he didn't drink or drug? What about the marriage where money was not an issue?

You know I've read hundreds of posts where the above behavior was the issue. Few where they were honest enough to say what actually happened. In all things here, there's his side, her side and the truth in between.

People meet, fall in love, and marry. Then the dynamic changes, she wants this now or he wants that. They grow apart, or more likely fail to acknowledge problems and work on them. I know, I was one of them. Although she cheated, I failed to recognize the problems leading up to it and effective deal with it. One partner changes, the other doesn't, and that second partner is left holding the bag.

The bottom line is without wanting kids, why marry? That drive is shared by many, but strongest in women. For ALL the women on here, who's marriage they ended who had children. How many can honestly say, you showed him he was as important AFTER the kids, as before? Kids aren't cheap, many times, the money problems stem from that. Or sex that happened spontaneously, now happens rarely, because the children leave you drained. So he cheats, or spend money on himself or doesn't make enough to support 4 people where the 2 of you were fine.

There will always be marriage, youth sees themselves as indestructable, so they will do it better(they think) than their parents. Young women will always have their bio clocks and push for marriage. It is among the divorced, that marriage is dead. They know it doesn't work and wish to avoid the whole mess again. Think fool me once shame on ....
 Capitano_Blaugh
Joined: 3/18/2008
Msg: 145
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/9/2009 4:37:44 PM

They grow apart, or more likely fail to acknowledge problems and work on them. I know, I was one of them. Although she cheated, I failed to recognize the problems leading up to it and effective deal with it.


You bring up a couple of good points. Your situation sounds very much like mine in the above bit.

In retrospect, I can clearly see where I messed up, but I had the unfortunate experience of growing up with two parents who loved each other. This really didn't prepare me in any good way for relationships in the late 20th, early 21st centuries. I never even learned the rules of relationship battling because I never saw my parents fight.

I did ask my mom before she died about why she and my dad never fought and she told me they DID fight, just never in front of me and my brothers...

.... well, HELLO! It would have been nice to lear HOW to fight since so many women seem to relish a good fight. Shit, I had girlfriends who dumped me because I didn't fight with them, or know how....

And, back to my point from an earlier post, my ex never let me know she was thinking of pulling the pin until she'd already chosen to leave. And, of course there are those who'll say that I just wasn't listening, which IS possible since I knew she wasn't terribly happy. Neither was I, but I didn't have a need to go and bang someone other than my spouse, something that my ex forgot to let me in on....



That drive is shared by many, but strongest in women. For ALL the women on here, who's marriage they ended who had children. How many can honestly say, you showed him he was as important AFTER the kids, as before? Kids aren't cheap, many times, the money problems stem from that. Or sex that happened spontaneously, now happens rarely, because the children leave you drained.


Kids were definitely the biggest stressor on my relationship with the ex and the ultimate demise of it. I think it's where I started feeling like, even became, the slave without realizing it and she lost respect for me. I just thought I was supposed to pick up the slack because she was the mom, now, and didn't bother point out that I was also working one full-time job, one part-time job and trying to do at least half of the house work as well...

... so, I swallowed the resentment and didn't say anything. Not good...

.. ah, well....

... like most relationships out there, I was clearly the reason things fvcked up, 'cause I'm just a guy....

... talk to my ex, though, I'm sure she can give you a complete list of all the things I didn't do for her....



 PickMe007
Joined: 7/2/2009
Msg: 146
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History
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 12/9/2009 5:30:57 PM
I'm sure you guys have heard this saying:

He gets married thinking she won't change and she does. She gets married thinking he will change and he doesn't.
 friendly friend and fun
Joined: 12/21/2009
Msg: 147
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History
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 4/2/2010 11:47:01 PM
I am thinking of starting a new business- Marriage insurance. But with divorce a certainty, my business will incur only loss.

Another idea- trading derivatives(options/futures) on the length of marriage.
 junkyard dawg
Joined: 6/20/2008
Msg: 148
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marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 4/3/2010 1:24:33 PM
Yet another marriage thread, sigh.
I cant believe Tiger Woods is being mentioned here as a hard done by male.The guy was a serial cheat, could have infected his wife with anything, was a connoisseur of skanks and humiliated and shamed his family. The mess he is in is all his own doing, his wife would still be happily his wife if it was not for his philandering with lap dancers.He was a total idiot and has to take the consequences of his actions.

His wife may not be famous but she was his wife and the mother of his kids.I hope none of those kids can read what their dear old dad was up to.If it had a vaginal cavity and a pulse the guy was up there, quicker than rat up a wet drainpipe.The mags and rags may be speculating what she is getting, but this is a private legal matter and noone really knows.I would expect it will be what was agreed in the pre- nup.My own feeling is they will not divorce and the girl loves him, hence the anger and pain.Should she get 300 million, of course not.But she is the injured party here, not Tiger.
I see that Simon Cowell(very wealthy famous man) is getting married to a woman he has been dating 6 months.He even wants kids to pass his legacy too.Beautiful afghan woman, very classy.Good luck to him,I am sure there is a bulletproof pre-nup in place.

I do believe in Marriage, like Cpt Blaugh my parents are happily married.I have seen them argue, My dad gets emotional and my Mum reasons with him in a cool rational way.Neither gets carried away and end up laughing.The secret is from what I seen; is to keep it rational, respectful, about the topic and never get personal.Prepare to accept you are not always right, take responsibility for your part,apologize if it is needed and compromise.Oh yes see the funny side, there is always a funny side and dont let it affect how you see your partner.When you can look through each others eyes and empathize, it changes your perspective.Over emotionality has no place in any discussion.Then I hate drama.

In the end if a person does not want marriage, then dont wed.Its your choice no -one else's.The person who does want marriage has equal right to choice.Not every woman wants a big white wedding etc what waste of money, I would rather spend it on the house.A trip to the register office, a license , lunch in the pub and boom thats enough. Its not a fairy tale and everyone knows that.It is a serious commitment that both have to work at.
 PregnantLady
Joined: 3/1/2010
Msg: 149
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 4/3/2010 3:23:01 PM
Why are there so many divorces? That's easy. People don't want to try and make relationships work anymore.
 ToughLuv1984
Joined: 9/2/2009
Msg: 150
marriage on the way out?? if not why are there so many divorces?
Posted: 4/3/2010 6:06:05 PM
Man's idea of a woman who doesn't communicate effectively: she is telling him something he doesn't want to hear.
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