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| | ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***Page 5 of 13 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13) | I do not believe for a second his surgery had and an effect on how he took those shots
Anyone that has gone through a major surgeries can tell you that your body isn't the same as it once was. He went through a bad illness and a major surgery. I'm not taking anything away from Overeem, but Brock hasn't been the same guy since those surgeries and a lot of that has to do with what he went through those past couple of years. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/1/2012 1:29:24 PM | I don't think you understand.
I wasn't talking about his performance, I was talking about the shots he was taking.
He might have taken him down two years ago, but he wouldn't have taken those knees any better.
Those were very nasty.
I think that some just don't wanna consider Reem to actually be that good because he hasn't spent most of his career fighting in the UFC. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/1/2012 3:28:56 PM | | I understand what you are saying, i'm just saying that getting hit ina surgically repaired area doesn't help matters any either. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/1/2012 4:22:58 PM | And that wasn't why he was getting hurt.
It was about 6 months ago when he had the surgery.
He may be feeling the physical effects of the issues, but he by no means was feeling any extra pain because he was being kneed in the body.
He was feeling pain because he was being hit by someone who throws some of the best knees in the game. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/1/2012 9:02:38 PM | Did it help? no I mean it doesn't matter if it was 6 months ago i'm guessing you have never had major surgery done before, because you would understannd it can take years before your body can fully recover if at all.
how do you know that are you his body. Do you know what he was going through? No, neither do i but i can imagine someone like me that's actually gone through major surgery understands the recovery process of having your body fully recover from a major operation can take a long time to fully heal. You maybe med cleared to do something but that doesn't mean your body is fully recoverd from something that took a toll on your body to begin with.
Ok but even with that said it still doesn't help when you are getting hit in a region where you had to go under the knife to have major surgery done to you body, where it can cause reoccuring pain in that region, but doctors or the person themselves dont' actually know that until that region gets put under stress. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/2/2012 5:41:36 AM | Sorry, but I believe those knees would have had the same effect no matter what.
Knees to the body hurt everyone no matter what.
Infact, not only do they inflict pain, but they can knock the wind out of you, and that would present someone with adversity.
Brock isn't big on that at all. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/5/2012 2:05:54 AM | I have to agree with both of you on this.
I do believe that Brock's overall physicality (and possibly his mental attitude) has been affected by his battle with Diverticulitis, perhaps not enough to impede him at training and sparring intensity, but perhaps enough to affect his former physical 'edge' when competing at a top level.
That said, I think it was fairly clear that as Brock competed against some of the bigger, stronger heavyweights in their prime, he wasn't necessarily going to be able to simply power through them as he had with previous opponents, and they were certainly going to have the ability to hurt him, neutralise his strengths and test his mental resolve.
His skillset was improving steadily, but he was coming up against opponents who were far more experienced and perhaps a little more accustomed to dealing with the adversity of taking punishment (though he certainly showed some tenacity when he endured that beating he took from Carwen).
Knowing that Brock's camp had already expressed doubts about his return to competition, and knowing now that he had only intended to return for the Overeem fight and potentially the subsequent title fight shows that he had already acknowledged the new limitations of his body post-Diverticulitis.
Brock looked more hesitant and uncomfortable than I'd ever seen him in all his post-Diverticulitis fights against Carwen, Velasquez and Overeem, perhaps largely due to their impressive fighting abilities and strategies for neutralising his strengths as a fighter, but I also believe there would have been an element of 'ring rust' due to all that time out of competition between fights, and also perhaps a psychological apprehension about throwing his newly-recovered body fully into that kind of punishment - and finally perhaps his body just wasn't quite the same after the surgery.
In the end, I don't think it's fair to simply dismiss the whole affair as a matter of Brock finally getting in over his head and being outclassed and bullied by better opponents. It's probably a cop-out to try to explain away his final losses solely as a result of his illness, but I for one would have MUCH preferred to have seen the pre-Diverticulitis Brock fight those matches, it's a shame he ultimately had to go out on a whimper like that.
Fair dues to him though. He's had to put aside his personal pride (probably no small act!) and accept that the body on which his entire career/celebrity has been defined is no longer what it once was, and he's made the choice to concentrate his efforts on his family life and keeping safe and healthy for the sake of all his loved ones.
Brock's short MMA career provided a fascinating chapter in UFC history and upped the UFC's profile just a little more in the mainstream. With the new FOX gig and exciting new heavyweight fighters like Overeem joining it's ranks, I'm sure the UFC will continue to grow from strengh to strength long after his departure... | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/9/2012 12:47:02 PM | | Brock's heart wasn't in it, and those liver shots and knees didn't help his cause. Still what he has achieved in MMA is fantastic imo. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/13/2012 6:44:04 PM | UFC 142 is tomorrow night.
And i'm hoping it's Anthony Johnson's last fight in the UFC ever.
He weighed in at 197 pounds! Which is 11 pounds over the 186 limit.
I hope he twitches like Lindland did.
Also, hydration will be important tomorrow since Vitor has said that if Johnson rehydrates past 205, he will refuse to take the fight.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mma-cagewriter/ufc-142-weigh-bloated-anthony-johnson-misses-12-214932854.html | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/15/2012 6:59:22 AM | Total domination by mini-Silva, I mean Jose Aldo. LOL Even with the fence grabbing, he was giving nothing to Mendes. Quite impressive.
Johnson got what he deserved. He should be cut and forced to fight at 205 if he wants to get back in the UFC. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/19/2012 2:27:31 PM |
The UFC is REAL FIGHTING....this fact is undisputed.
Happy to dispute it. Real fighting doesn't have rules. The UFC, Strikeforce, Belator, etc all do have rules. Ipso facto, they are not real fighting. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/20/2012 8:53:59 AM | Happy to dispute it. Real fighting doesn't have rules. The UFC, Strikeforce, Belator, etc all do have rules. Ipso facto, they are not real fighting.
It's certainly 'real fighting' as far as a sanctioned full-contact combat sport goes.
As far as being 100% 'real' fighting - the UFC only claims to be 'as real as it gets', which I take to mean 'as real as it gets....without actually being an illegal streetfight with no rules'.
I think that claim is fair - it ain't the ThunderDome!! | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/21/2012 4:36:17 AM | Happy to dispute it. Real fighting doesn't have rules. The UFC, Strikeforce, Belator, etc all do have rules. Ipso facto, they are not real fighting.
lol, as well as weight classes, watching film of a guy before fighting him, referees, and judges, who could at any moment be watching a totally different fight from the fans and each other.
The best thing MMA provides is if a guy can out punch or kick you, you can try and wrestle him. lol, god help you if he can out do you in all aspects.
I real fight will allow you to do other things that may turn the fight in your favor. like biting or eye gouging | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/21/2012 12:20:15 PM |
Happy to dispute it.
so your solution in Kimbo in some dank back alley fighting bar trash?
I love it when the armchair wannabes step "into the ring", as it were, claiming MMA is not technically "real fighting", kinda makes me puke a little bit in my mouth, especially when they don't think, for whatever reason, the top MMA fighters would reign destruction on your average bar room brawler.
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/23/2012 8:57:35 PM | Luke,
You're right that the current MMA organizations are probably about as close to real fighting as you can get in a sanctioned, sport setting where the competitors still have some level of protection from completely debilitating injury. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/23/2012 9:07:10 PM | Trurhissee,
Actually the UFC and other MMA organizations are about a close a "solution" as I think one can get to being able to show something like "real fighting" without going to the extent of gladitorial games. And I don't think society is going to go for that latter solution.
And absolutely no question whatever that almost any of the MMA fighters in competition out there would destroy any bar room or street fighter out there. Hell they're trained and the brawlers rarely are, so of course the outcome would be obvious.
One does wonder what might happen if say Rampage were actually allowed to just rip off parts, bite, scratch, slam, and so on. Would that change his result vs. John Jones?
At the end of the day though MMA isn't "real fighting" in that it does have rules, refs, time limits, etc. But make no mistake, I am not silly enough to think that makes the guys who do it amateurs or wannabees or anything like that. I know some of them and have trained with them. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/24/2012 1:19:05 AM | I think it's interesting that when the UFC started, it had no separate weight divisions, allowed headbutting and hairpulling, had prolonged time limits on rounds, and held round-robin tournaments where fighters had to fight more than once in an evening against different opponents they hadn't necessarily prepared for - it seemed to be closely modelled on the "Kumite" from the JCVD movie "Bloodsport".
For these reasons, it was labelled 'Human c0ckighting' and was considered illegal in most states of the United States. Even today with all its added rules and regulations, MMA is still illegal in New York (and in Ontario until about a year ago).
So, for those who argue it's nothing like 'real fighting', you may be right, but there are still folks out there who need convincing of that.  | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/25/2012 9:10:03 AM | Actually the UFC and other MMA organizations are about a close a "solution" as I think one can get
so what are you bitching about?, if you don't like it don't watch it.
One does wonder what might happen if say Rampage were actually allowed to just rip off parts, bite, scratch, slam, and so on. Would that change his result vs. John Jones?
does this mean Jon Jones gets to do the same?
listen, I know it's not real fighting, anybody with half a fucking brain can figure that out, but, as you said, it's the closest we have, and I for one will always be a fan.
I know some of them and have trained with them.
bet it didn't feel like "real fighting", now did it.
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/25/2012 2:21:05 PM |
I love it when the armchair wannabes step "into the ring", as it were, claiming MMA is not technically "real fighting", kinda makes me puke a little bit in my mouth, especially when they don't think, for whatever reason, the top MMA fighters would reign destruction on your average bar room brawler.
If the bar room brawler is stupid enough to try and fight a MMA bare handed deserves to get his head stomped. Especially when there are pool sticks in that bar room. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/26/2012 10:16:41 AM |
so what are you ****ing about?, if you don't like it don't watch it.
Not ****ing and I like it a lot and watch regularly. Someone said at the top of the thread that you couldn't say it wasn't real fighting. I chose to debate that. Simple debate. If you don't like simple debate, you don't have to join in.
listen, I know it's not real fighting,
So there's no debate then. We agree. Good. We also both agree that we like the UFC and other currnt MMA venues an that they are about as close to real fighting as we're likely to get on TV.
bet it didn't feel like "real fighting", now did it.
No it didn't. We controlled what we did, respected the tap out, stopped if anyone wanted to and discussed techniques so we could learn from one another. In short it was fun, and mutually respectful. I don't think you'd apply either of those terms to a real fight. | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/26/2012 2:51:27 PM | Listen martialist a dont know how you can say what your sayin if you are a martial artist , you have no basis in your comments and it does not make any fkn sense at all , all av heard is you blowin yer own trumpet about street fightin which means fk all , any body can train in the arts but no everybody gets what there about , its about skill and perfection , the standing game alone is only an aspect of MMA and the same goes for grappling , when you put the 2 together it makes a complete mixed martial art and any 1 who is skilled and has evolved with the sport is superior to any1 who can only do either the stand up or the grappling alone . Street fighting is fk all , means nothin . actually fighting in the octagon is where the men are separated from the boys and the true warriors of our planet are fighting against each other with the fkn highest of skill!!...a 7lb sword ? haha ure in dreamland a would much rather be using a 3inch blade that u cant see and take you on anyday lol , the bigger the weapon the much easier to deal with n defend against!!....personally a dont think you should be at black belt level in any art as yer no fkn mature enough to realise what yev learned son . If you were a student in my dojo a would expel you if ye couldny learn the concept of your responsibility to being a protector !! yed be automatically expelled anyway because of yer silly convictions which ye so brag about .....silly boy !! a hope ye can wake up 1 day.xx  | |
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/27/2012 7:15:08 AM | Street fighting is fk all , means nothin . actually fighting in the octagon is where the men are separated from the boys and the true warriors of our planet are fighting against each other with the fkn highest of skill!!
It's good to see someone who actually knows what the fuck they're talking about, and I couldn't agree more.
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| ***MMA, UFC, WEC, and REAL FIGHTING***
Posted: 1/27/2012 7:55:56 AM | | As someone who has done both often I have to disagree..street fighting is the real deal..cage fighting is great, but as a cage fighter you know you can tap to avoid severe injury you also know that the ref will protect you if you are choked or knocked out..Fear of losing is nothing compared to the fear of being killed..on the street you can die or be maimed in the cage not very likely to happen... | |
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