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TDH49
| | Joined: 8/13/2010 Msg: 51 | |
| | One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today..Page 3 of 6 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6) | What you have failed to comprehend is that regardless of the colour of skin, the laws are applied equally. So if a white person sold crack, he received the same sentencing that a black person would... same if a black person sold cocaine, he received the same sentencing that a white person would. This is totally true and on the surface is sounds good. But that's not taking into account what majority uses what drug. Crack cocaine is a Ghetto drug used by minorities, sold to them by minorities mostly . Powder cocaine is a drug used by middle or upper class white people, sold to them mostly by the same middle class whites.
So even if the above statement is true(and it is)the realities are totally different based on what majority uses and sells what drug. The only way to make it fair is to punish ALL cocaine dealers equally, regardless of what form of coke is being sold. Thus a ounce of powder/crack get sentences under the same guide lines to the same time.
If the law was slanted the other way(as if that would ever happen in our life time), and white people were being sent to jail and minorities were gettng probation and drug rehab. I would still think it's a law that discriminates and racist and should be scrapped. Discrimination is discrimination, regardless of the colour of the person being discriminated against.
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere Martin Luther King.
I think you should perhaps flick the chip off your shoulder before venturing out into the world. Your obvious concern for my well being is duly noted and appreciated. I will make sure I check in the mirror before venturing out in public.
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 8:48:41 AM |
This is totally true and on the surface is sounds good. But that's not taking into account what majority uses what drug. Crack cocaine is a Ghetto drug used by minorities, sold to them by minorities mostly . Powder cocaine is a drug used by middle or upper class white people, sold to them mostly by the same middle class whites.
The way I view this, isn't so much a race issue as it is a class issue. Crack is cheaper to obtain, and sells on the street for only a fraction of the price of powder cocaine, while being just as or more potent. The reason I say it's a class issue more than anything, is that poorer people can also afford it along with the richer folk. That immediately extends the target market far beyond the range of powder cocaine, which is likely why the law was designed to be a little stiffer in the first place. It has potential to affect a much larger range of people. The fact that it's inadvertently shown minorities to comprise a high portion of that demographic is merely incidental IMO.
The only way to make it fair is to punish ALL cocaine dealers equally, regardless of what form of coke is being sold. Thus a ounce of powder/crack get sentences under the same guide lines to the same time.
I actually agree with you here, not sure why there's such a difference in penalties between the two. Only guess I could come up with, I listed above (about it having a much larger market). | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 8:59:45 AM |
The only way to make it fair is to punish ALL cocaine dealers equally, regardless of what form of coke is being sold. Thus a ounce of powder/crack get sentences under the same guide lines to the same time.
If the law was slanted the other way(as if that would ever happen in our life time), and white people were being sent to jail and minorities were gettng probation and drug rehab
If I'm comprehending your statement correctly, you are saying that white cocaine dealers are getting probation and rehab sentences? I really don't believe this. Not for dealers. Maybe possession charges, but selling / distribution? I don't think so. I would like to see a cite or two from a reliable source to support that statement. | |
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TDH49
| | Joined: 8/13/2010 Msg: 54 | |
| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 9:27:40 AM | If I'm comprehending your statement correctly, you are saying that white cocaine dealers are getting probation and rehab sentences? I really don't believe this. Not for dealers. Maybe possession charges, but selling / distribution? I don't think so. I would like to see a cite or two from a reliable source to support that statement. This part of the issue isn't even debatable Trinity. Just google 100/1 cocaine law and you will find more evidence than you can handle. But I will try to break it down for you.
Under the old law if a 18 year old kid with NO brushes with the law in the past gets caught with 1 ounce of crack cocaine, it's MANDITORY that he get sentences to at least 5 years in a federal prison. The Judge had no leeway in this, he had to sent that kid away for 5 years minimum, That was the law.
Now that same kid get caught with 99 ounces of powder cocaine. The judge didn't have to give him that 5 year sentence. For the manditory 5 year sentence to kick in that kid would have had to be caught with 100 ounces of powder cocaine. So that kid being a first time offender would very likely get probation or a stint in rehab. While the kid that got caught with 99 times less in crack coke would be shipped of to jail for 5 years.
Even now under the NEW law. It's still a 5 year minimun for getting caught with 1 ounce of crack cocaine. While for that manditory minimun sentence to kick in for powder cocaine it would have to be 18 ounces. Still totally unjust, but it's a huge step from where is was before.
Since judges have way more options in sentencing when it comes to powder coke. Mainly because someone pretty much have to be caught with a trunk full of the stuff to face a manditory 5 year minimun sentence. They tend to be much more lenient when sentencing those people. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 9:45:37 AM | | did some research..apparently crack is far more addictive and potent than powdered coke.it takes effect within 10 to 15 seconds where coke takes 10 -15 minutes.given these facts it is easy to understand why harsher punishments were in place for crack offenses.since crack is far more potent and addictive it is understandable that possession of less carries harsher penalty than the same amount of coke. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 10:02:35 AM | The Supreme Court, just this summer, and in a unanimous decision, upheld the federal law which imposed longer sentences for crack than for cocaine powder. It not only upheld it, it said the law also applied to coca paste and freebase. It sounds like this recent change may have involved this same federal law, the ADAA of 1986.
The Court didn't address the question whether the law discriminated by race. But if it did (or does) discriminate, according to the Court's constitutional test, it's odd no one seems to have challenged it on that basis.
Anyone who thinks laws in the U.S. are racially biased should study the question a little more. Laws meant to discriminate against blacks are almost automatically unconstitutional. A law like that could survive a challenge only if the government could prove it was *necessary* to achieve a *compelling* government purpose. And that's next to impossible to do. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 10:10:26 AM | I know that nothing will convince you otherwise, given what you've written, but just because you asked:
Find me ONE law on the books in America that puts more WHITE people in jail than minorities.
I am reasonably confident that there are more whites jailed for insider trading, than any other group.
By your reasoning, that would make THAT law a racist one, aimed at whites.
But that's not taking into account what majority uses what drug. Crack cocaine is a Ghetto drug used by minorities, sold to them by minorities mostly .
This is YOUR reasoning. YOU say that what makes a law racist, is who is jailed for breaking it. Therefore, laws against serial killing would be sexist AND racist, because the vast majority of serial killers are white males.
By the way, I am not in any way refuting the fact that non-whites still tend to be unfairly treated AFTER arrest. So do the poor, and so do lots of groups. Males are more likely to be convicted of spousal battery than females. The uneven ADMINISTRATION of the laws is not a valid reason to label the LAW racist, but it IS a good reason to label the ENFORCEMENT people as racist.
YOU asked for examples of laws that jail more whites than non-whites. I gave you examples, so you denigrate me personally, at least in your own estimation. I'll leave it to you then. I only deal in logic and facts, when those fail, I move on.
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TDH49
| | Joined: 8/13/2010 Msg: 58 | |
| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 10:17:58 AM | I am reasonably confident that there are more whites jailed for insider trading, than any other group. Obviously I gave you way too much credit in the past. It would only be racist if there was a seperate law for insider trading that gave minorities less time for said insider trading. In that case you damn right I would view it as racist. But since it's only the one law and everybody is being sentences under the same guide lines I will just roll my eyes at your silly comment
If everybody who get caught with cocaine(regardless of powder/crack)is being sentenced under the same guide lines. If 99 percent of those who wind up in jail happen to be minorities. Then so be it, there is nothing unjust about it under those circumstances, more minorities just happen to be dealing and thus more of them wind up it jail. Under those circumstances it would just be " Too damn bad, so sad" but that's not the case now is it? Thus the system is broken, and it was changed, not changed enough to suit me. But some change in the right direction is better than no change at all. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 10:24:39 AM | Again, the profiling, descretionary actions by cops and judges, and selective sentencing play into the inherently discriminatory crack witch hunt. The sentencing disparity between powder and rock unduly targets minorities. Multi-agency sweeps are common in minority neighborhoods. I was in a courtroom situation for several sessions where there was obvious profiling by the Sheriffs department and the lawyers and judges were complicit with blatant racial profiling and sentencing. In a 90% white community, the courts are filled with over 90% minorities. It happens.
The addiction differences mythology does not stand up to science, nor the "violence" differences between powder and rock with backing soda added. Just making sh*t up again folks. http://www.aclu.org/drug-law-reform/interested-persons-memo-crackpowder-cocaine-sentencing-policy
Cocaine Sentencing Has Racially Discriminatory Consequences
Unfortunately, the difference in the cocaine weights that trigger mandatory sentences for crack and powder cocaine has racially discriminatory consequences. Nationwide statistics compiled by the Commission reveal that the race of those prosecuted for crack offenses has predominately been African American. In 2000, 84.7% of crack cases were brought against African-Americans, 9% against Hispanics and only 5.6% against Whites. Caucasians, however, comprised a much higher proportion of crack users: 2.4 million Caucasians (64.4%), 990,000 African Americans (26.6%), and 348,000 Hispanics (9.2%).[ii] For powder cocaine, the disparities are somewhat different. Of all powder cases brought, 30.5% were against African-Americans, 50.8% were against Hispanics and 17.8% were against whites.[iii]
The Reasons for the Sentencing Differences are Unwarranted Three reasons are often cited for the gross distinction in the penalties between powder and crack cocaine: addictiveness, violence, and accessibility due to low cost. All three reasons fail as a justification for the l00:1 ratio in punishment between two methods of ingesting the same drug. The Commission has been aware for many years that there are no scientific or medical reasons to justify the disparity.
Disparate treatment in sentencing between crack and powder cocaine users is not justified on the basis of the greater alleged addictiveness of crack. Research has proven that crack is not more addictive than powder cocaine. In her 10-year study of the developmental and behavioral outcomes of children exposed to powder and base cocaine in utero, Dr. Deborah Frank testified before the Commission that ""the biologic thumbprints of exposure to these substances"" are identical.[iv] While there are differences in the manner in which the body absorbs base versus powder cocaine, since Cocaine hydrochloride (powder) can easily be transformed into crack by combining it with baking soda and heat, it is irrational to apply a stiffer penalty between cocaine which is directly sold as crack, and cocaine which is sold in powder form but which can be treated by the consumer and easily transformed into crack. Furthermore, the myth of the ""crack baby"" has been debunked. Dr. Frank testified, ""There are no long-term studies, which identify any specific effects of 'crack' compared to cocaine on children's development. Based on years of careful research, we conclude that the 'crack baby' is a grotesque media stereotype, not a scientific diagnosis.""[v]
Likewise, there is no research to indicate that the use of crack cocaine creates more violent behavior than using powder cocaine. A comparison of powder to crack cocaine offenses indicates that in 91% of all powder cases and in 88.4% of all crack cases there is no bodily injury. Threats were present in 4.2 % of powder cases and 3.7% of crack cases. Bodily injury occurred in 1.4% of powder cases and 4.5% of crack cases and death occurred in 3.4% of both powder and crack cases.[vi] Furthermore, according to Dr. Glen Hanson, there is ""very little research on the role that drugs of abuse, such as stimulants like cocaine or amphetamine actually play in violence."" Dr. Hanson concludes, that, ""research has not been able to validate a casual link between drug use and violence.""[vii]
Neither are excessive penalties for crack cocaine justified by its low price and accessibility. To apply draconian penalties for first time possession of crack on the basis of its low cost discriminates on the basis of class, especially in light of the fact that powder cocaine, in spite of its greater cost, is a drug abused more in this country.[viii] Furthermore, higher penalties for crack cocaine guarantee that small time street-level users will be penalized more severely than larger distributors who possess powder cocaine before it is transformed into crack. This type of drug abuse policy, which disproportionately impacts lower income people, is neither logical nor effective.
http://www.prisonpolicy.org/scans/sp/1003.pdf
Racial Disparity Approximately 2/3 of crack users are white or Hispanic, yet the vast majority of persons convicted of possession in federal courts in 1994 were African American, according to the USSC. Defendants convicted of crack possession in 1994 were 84.5% black, 10.3% white, and 5.2% Hispanic. Trafficking offenders were 4.1% white, 88.3% black, and 7.1% Hispanic. Powder cocaine offenders were more racially mixed. Defendants convicted of simple possession of cocaine powder were 58% white, 26.7% black, and 15% Hispanic. The powder trafficking offenders were 32% white, 27.4% black, and 39.3% Hispanic. The result of the combined difference in sentencing laws and racial disparity is that black men and women are serving longer prison sentences than white men and women. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 10:29:07 AM |
The only way to make it fair is to punish ALL cocaine dealers equally, regardless of what form of coke is being sold. Thus a ounce of powder/crack get sentences under the same guide lines to the same time.
They are not the same. I'm no expert, but doesn't it take a significantly smaller amount of crack to get high than powder? Isn't it somehow enhanced by the manner in which it is prepared for sale? (Cooking or whatever the hell it is that they do to it?)
If you compare the same weight of each of the two drugs, wouldn't crack be worth far more?
I don't agree that the law was intended to be racist. I believe the penalties are based on street value and the effect on the user.
As far as disparity in the law...let's discuss weed vs powder. (Another day.) It's not racist. Nobody is forcing these people to deal or use crack. It's one of the most addictive substances around. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 10:33:24 AM |
http://www.prisonpolicy.org/scans/sp/1003.pdf
Racial Disparity Approximately 2/3 of crack users are white or Hispanic, yet the vast majority of persons convicted of possession in federal courts in 1994 were African American, according to the USSC. Defendants convicted of crack possession in 1994 were 84.5% black, 10.3% white, and 5.2% Hispanic. Trafficking offenders were 4.1% white, 88.3% black, and 7.1% Hispanic. Powder cocaine offenders were more racially mixed. Defendants convicted of simple possession of cocaine powder were 58% white, 26.7% black, and 15% Hispanic. The powder trafficking offenders were 32% white, 27.4% black, and 39.3% Hispanic. The result of the combined difference in sentencing laws and racial disparity is that black men and women are serving longer prison sentences than white men and women.
Now this is a VERY interesting cite. It would appear that application of the law is racist, even if the law itself is not. | |
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TDH49
| | Joined: 8/13/2010 Msg: 62 | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 11:08:28 AM | The "addiction" mythology is also addressed in the sites I posted. There is no difference between powder and rock other than ingestion methods. Snorting powder is a more long lasting and mellower high, where crack is more instantaneous and intense. There is no super special chemistry involved in turning powder into rock, merely a simple cooking process with backing sode to solidify it for easier distribution. After cooking, only 89% of the original coke is contained in the rock. It's not more concentrated, nor is there any difference in addictive qualities.
I knew quite a few cokeheads and a few crackheads back in the early-mid 80s that when the money ran out or they got scared, started losing families and friends, decided to quit, and did so far more successfully and easier, cold turkey, than drinkers and nicotine encounter in trying to quit their addictions.
Most of the citations on addiction come from people engaged in the war on drugs to justify billions of wasted dollars and millions of lives destroyed in a futile prohibition campaign that would have fared far better with education and treatment instead. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 2:29:07 PM |
Yanno, I find it amusing when someone claims that they're being oppressed because of the colour of skin or religion or whatever for being arrested and jailed for committing a crime.
Easy answer... stop breaking the law.
OK, is there still racism in America and the world? Most certainly. One of the ways racism manifests itself is by not being especially inclusive of certain groups in the economy. Simple facts state that minorities have about DOUBLE the rate of unemployment. They are therefore not included in the "legitimate" economy. They then enter the black market to try to get by in life, or whatever else their reasons are. We know full well this is happening, and any laws attacking the black market economies will have a direct effect on those who do not have as good of access to the "legit" economy.
So either you think that black people are lazy and don't want to work (racist) or they fall back on the black market as a means of survival and get caught up in the legal ramifications.
Anyone who cannot accept these basic facts is at least exhibiting highly suspect, racist attitudes.  | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 4:42:37 PM | | Maybe if they are'nt getting enough jobs and cannot take care of their own then they need to stop breeding altogether.But rather than work harder to get ahead THEY resort to crime,more so than any other group. Double the unemployment,gee I wonder if any of that has to do with the 2nd,3rd and 4th generation familes living off welfare and public assistance. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 4:51:24 PM | most importers of heroin into the uk are muslim turks
google is your friend
does that mean its religioinist to jail the turks then?
most inporters of crack cocaine in the uk are west indians
google is your friend
does that mean its racist to jail west indians?
i know, lets play pick the drug and dealer and see who's pain we feel the most | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 5:03:55 PM | I have to be honest, I don't understand how this law is racist. If anyone, regardless of their colour, deals in class A drugs they should be put in prison. If it so happens that the main perps of Crack dealing happen to be black then it figures that most of the crack dealers in prison are black, does it not? According to addiction recovery basics, the 3 most addictive drug in the world is Crack Cocaine. That is after Nicotine as the top one, and Ice as the second. Are you somehow saying that if you are imprisoned for Crack dealing and happen to be black then it is racism?
Crack, an infamous new variation of the drug cocaine, emerged in the 1980′s. Crack is actually cocaine in a rock crystal form, that can be heated, and its vapors smoked. The substance tends to make a “cracking” noise when heated, hence the name. Crack will give an instant feeling of intense pleasure, but the rush only lasts for about 5 to 7 minutes. The user will then experience depression, which can only be alleviated by more of the drug. This begins the dangerous cycle of crack dependancy. Long term use of the drug can cause anxiety, delusions, paranoia, lung cancer, panic attacks, heart disease, and bronchitis. Are you saying that is is ok to get someone hooked on and supply and make money whilst causing the above? Dealers dont just sit there waiting for someone to knock and ask for drugs, they get people hooked. Prison sentences should be proportionate to the crime. Dealing in a Class A drug regardless of what it is should be punishable in the same way.
It is a crime to deal class A's over here in britain. If you deal drugs you know that there is a chance you might get caught and put inside. Regardless of your colour. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 5:03:58 PM | Top ten reasons why the crack offense sentencing guidelines were not racist as they stood:
10. Well, I certainly don't see anything in the law addressing race.
9. Simply put, there wouldn't be so many blacks in jail if so many didn't break the law! An ignoramus could figure that out.
8. Have you seen some of those ghettos? They might be living better in jail.
7. So, having crackheads freely running around making crackbabies is better?
6. Crack dealers get harsher sentences than child molesters? Still, that doesn't prove anything.
5. We don't have racist laws; that would be illegal. Um, I mean since the Civil Rights Act of 1964 it has been illegal. Speaking of that, the constitutionality of the Civil Rights Act is debatable, but that's for another thread.
4. We're kinda tired of people getting off scott free because of their race. Not to mention any names, but the initials "OJ" come to mind...
3. They're not in jail because they're black; they're in jail because they're criminals.
2. Crack is bad-- black or white.
1. Ah, yes... again with the race card...
When reason and reading comprehension fail, sometimes parody is the best option...
For the intellectually curious here:
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/901579/criminal_jail_sentences_drug_offenders.html?cat=17 http://cjr.sagepub.com/content/22/2/133.abstract http://www.jsonline.com/news/wisconsin/29456354.html
... and there's a lot more where that came from. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 5:11:12 PM | foxy i think here in the uk we are more inclined to see the crime rather than the colour of the criminal.
its when nonsensence is spouted that the hackles rise
ive been down the dark road and certain folk on the uk forums know that to be true
i coudnt give a donald duck who sold me it as long as i got it
it seems our cousins over the pond want to find race in everything well carry on then lets play your game
wharts the race ratio on crank users and dealers over the pond then and should whites be up in arms? nonsenscense like my spelling lol | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 5:18:21 PM | The issue isn't whether crack is good or bad. The issue is that crack isn't a different drug - it's cocaine sold in a different form than the form Bush and Obama used. Pretty much everybody does stupid things when they're young.
I can understand why the law was introduced when it was. But clearly the application of this law is racist in effect - not in intent.
There's a deal we all make - that the laws we live under should be just. If you see a disproportionate number of young black men going to jail for longer times than young white men convicted of larger quantities of the same drug, then that bargain is seen to be broken. The social contract has to be fair, or else you get all kinds of problems. Back in the 18th century a bunch of guys saw paying taxes without having any input into the decisions was breaking the social contract. In the last century, even the most ardent segregationist Senators couldn't justify denying voting rights - and they voted for the first voting rights act back in the 50's.
Fairness is an essential quality of the modern state. This law was clearly not fair. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 5:24:57 PM | so half time
black folk are jailed just as much as white folk regarding crystal meth? or do thet get longer jail terms than white meth dealers/users?
its an honest question because anything we see over here on telly its usually whites with crank blacks with crack
was that quantities when it was in rock form or powder form? | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 5:49:25 PM | ^^^ Well yes and no, from what I can glean from my (admittedly) poor knowledge of drugs. While it might still be technically the same drug, it sounds rather like apples and oranges in many ways to me, crack vs powder cocaine. And I haven't yet seen an example cited of where a black man was given a much harsher sentence for possessing/trafficking the exact same quantity of the exact same form of the drug, as opposed to the sentence a white man has received. And even then, one would have to take into account was it a first offence, or third? According to what was cited earlier:
Racial Disparity Approximately 2/3 of crack users are white or Hispanic, yet the vast majority of persons convicted of possession in federal courts in 1994 were African American, according to the USSC. Defendants convicted of crack possession in 1994 were 84.5% black, 10.3% white, and 5.2% Hispanic. Trafficking offenders were 4.1% white, 88.3% black, and 7.1% Hispanic. Powder cocaine offenders were more racially mixed. Defendants convicted of simple possession of cocaine powder were 58% white, 26.7% black, and 15% Hispanic. The powder trafficking offenders were 32% white, 27.4% black, and 39.3% Hispanic. The result of the combined difference in sentencing laws and racial disparity is that black men and women are serving longer prison sentences than white men and women.
From what I glean from that, more whites were convicted of powder cocaine offences than any other race, so is the disparity truly that widespread overall?
I'm no expert on drugs, but from what I gather, crack was set out to be a more affordable (aka cheap) form of cocaine, and primarily associated with lower-income areas. If it so happens that the majority of the population of said areas happen to be minorities, then I still don't see it as a race issue. Class issue? Yes. But race in and of itself? No.
Typically, most inner-city or poorer neighbourhoods will have a much higher police presence compared to more affluent neighbourhoods. Logic would dictate that, higher police presence is likely to lead to higher arrest/conviction results. If it so happens that more minorities (or blacks, for the purposes of this thread) are living in those neighbourhoods, then it stands to reason that they will account for a higher percentage of that particular statistic. Also something to take into account, likely those of lesser income can't afford to hire the same sort of lawyer to fight said charges, as those of more affluent means. Once again leading to higher conviction rates.
I also wonder..."possession" vs "trafficking" rates...again, I'm no expert but, I would just have assumed that someone charged with trafficking would also be charged at the same time with possession? That might skew things a bit more as well, make it appear to be double the rate.
Most likely, at least IMO, when these laws first came into effect, crack was flooding the market, and the politicians/lawmakers panicked to a certain degree. Wow, a cheap form of cocaine, with a higher potency rate and apparently more addictive qualities. Since it was so affordable to the masses, not just the rich folk, it was able to reach a much larger market, so it's not really that surprising that it was deemed more of a danger to society or whatnot.
As an aside, I found it...odd, and curious, the article the OP chose as the basis for his thread. The woman mentioned in the article, proclaiming the "unjustness" of it all...was apparently convicted on crack charges (I don't recall if it specified whether possession or trafficking) but also had five children apparently. Probably not the stellar model anyone would want to respresent a cause, no matter her race. Sorry, just couldn't resist pointing that out.
Anyway, JMO. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 7:40:37 PM | Just butting in with my own findings.
Use of Cocaine by Students 2008 Monitoring the Future Survey 8th-Graders 10th-Graders 12th-Graders Lifetime** 2.6% 4.6% 6.0% Past Year 1.6 2.7 3.4 Past Month 0.8 0.9 1.3
Crack Cocaine Use by Students 2009 Monitoring the Future Survey
8th-Graders 10th-Graders 12th-Graders Lifetime** 1.7% 2.1% 2.4% Past Year 1.1 1.2 1.3 Past Month 0.5 0.4 0.6
Myth: Crack is purer than powder cocaine, and is more potent.
Fact: There is no pharmacological difference between crack cocaine and powder cocaine. Crack cocaine is simply powder cocaine which has been converted into a solid "rock" form that may be smoked. The effects of smoking crack cocaine may be more intense, but this is a result of the mode of ingestion rather than the drug's purity. Regardless, it is difficult to rationalize the extreme sentencing disparity between crack and cocaine Source: Hatsukami, D. and Fischman, M. Crack cocaine and cocaine hydrochloride: are the differences myths or reality?. Journal of the American Medical Association (November 1996).
Myth : To use crack once can lead to instant addiction.
Fact: While crack cocaine is addictive, it is extremely unlikely that one would become addicted after one use. 2004 statistics from the National Household Survey on Drug Use and Health shows that 7,840,000 (3.3%) of Americans have smoked crack cocaine during their lifetime. However, only 467,000 (.2%) of Americans reported smoking crack cocaine in the last 30 days. If crack was instantaneously addictive, the number of recent users would be much larger Source: SAMHSA. Results from the 2004 National Survey on Drug Use and Health: Detailed Tables.
Myth: Crack is much more addictive than powder cocaine.
Fact: There is very little evidence to support the claims that crack is more addictive than cocaine. According to the National Household Survey on Drug Abuse in 2004 of Americans age 12 and older, 5.9% of individuals who had ever tried cocaine went on to be "current users" (reported use within the past 30 days). The same statistic for crack use was also 5.9%. These numbers show no statistical difference in the tendency towards the future use of cocaine and crack. Source: Reinerman, C. and Levine H., Crack in America. University of California Press (September 1997). 2004 National Survey on Drug Use and Health: National Findings.
Myth: Crack use is much more dangerous than powder and kills its users more often.
Fact: The misuse of any drug (legal or illegal) may be detrimental to the health of an individual. However, it is erroneous to claim that the use of crack cocaine alone is a major cause of death. In fact, in 2000 the percentage of deaths attributed to ALL illegal drugs was .7%. In comparison, 435,000 deaths (18.1%) were caused by tobacco in the same year. Claims that crack use is a leading cause of death are, for the most part, unsubstantiated. Source: Actual Causes of Death in the United States, 2000. American Medical Association (2004).
Myth: Crack is used almost exclusively by Blacks and is a special plague of the Black community.
Fact: While often characterized as a drug of the Black community, 60% of individuals who have used crack in the last month are White. White crack users also account for 66% of individuals who have ever used crack in their lifetime. Simply stated, the majority of crack users are White. Despite this reality, 80% of people arrested for crack offenses in 2002 were Black. Consequently, a disproportionate number of Black crack offenders face the harsh mandatory minimums associated with crack convictions. Source: SAMHSA. Results from the 2004 National Survey on Drug Use and Health: Detailed Tables. Bureau of Justice Statistics. Compendium of Federal Justice Statistics, 2003. Table 1.4.
Myth #7: Crack use leads to violence much more than the use of other drugs.
Fact: The claims that crack induces violence are grossly exaggerated. Research has shown that crack use does not necessarily result in violent behavior. Most of the violence related to crack is a result of the drug's status as an illegal substance. Violence is rarely a result of the pharmacological effects of the drug, and is most often attributed to the violent nature of the illegal drug market. Source: Reinerman, C. and Levine H., Crack in America. University of California Press (September 1997).
Of the more than two million Americans that currently use cocaine, just over 700,000 are users of freebase or crack cocaine. Source: Office of National Drug Control Policy. “Cocaine Facts & Figures.” Accessed: June 2, 2009.
I honestly cannot see how crack should be treated any differently than powder cocaine. While I personally believe that the law may not have intentionally be racist, clearly the enforcement of it is. Therefore, I believe that the law should be that both powder and rock form should have equal punishment. If you get 5 years in prison for an ounce of rock, you should get 5 year prison for powder. | |
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| One of the most racist and unjust laws in American history is coming to an end today.. Posted: 11/3/2011 7:51:07 PM |
This is the kind of clueless statements I am talking about. The vast majority of these criminals are drug dealers NOT drug users.Most dealers don't use, if they do they soon become users only or dead.
And even the users have kicked the habit after years in a federal prison. And they will be tested on a weekly basic once out to make sure they stay clean if they are released with probation attached.
But even if they were 12000 addicted people being released. Maybe they can now be treated like their white counterparts were. You know, get sent to rehab over and over again until they get cured or run out of chances. Is white society better off with all those white drug dealers getting sweet heart deals and not being sent off to prison like their minority counter parts were?
Can't answer the question, can you? Are minorities better off with 12000 crack dealers (dealers are worse than addicts. they're the f'cking scum of the earth) freely milling about in the communities they single handedly destroyed?
I'll answer your question now. No. We're not better off with white drug dealers doing their thing out of prison.
Suggesting crack and coke are the same drug is idiotic. Pricing makes all the difference in the world. | |
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