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 grizzelda
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 882
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Not giving sex away without the relationshipPage 37 of 38    (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38)
]quote]Hmmmm---and here I always thought GPS meant Golden P**is Syndrome.



^^^^^^^^Yeah me too, with all these guys that think because their****is hard they are entitled to sex immediately, regardless of what the circumstances are and if it doesnt happen, the woman who wont have sex with them is a prude, has issues, sees sex as a chore, or is a lesbian or whatever shaming or ridiculous insult they can muster at the time and later to their buddies in an effort to justify their GPS....And they say women have "entitlement issues"
 peppermint petunias
Joined: 9/2/2009
Msg: 883
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 12:38:11 PM

women have all the power until they give up the goods and then they have none.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
REALLY? She is doing it ALL WRONG then




peppermint petunias , back when I was seeking a relationship, I read an article on how to jazz up your username to attract men's attention and changed mine to that end. And since both men and women, strangers, family and friends have described me using these and similar terms - I thought it was a good one.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I always thought I had nice curves, but ONLINE curvy is usually taken to be over weight by most people esp with no picture.
I don't agree as one can be a size 2 and curvy or a 14 and curvy..

Its having a desirable hip to waist ratio or some bust to speak of to me.


I was going to jazz my name up but MOTOWN was taken
 pasmal
Joined: 2/24/2010
Msg: 884
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 4:32:29 PM
"GPS"-any guy saying this is advertising failure and sour grapes and ensuring it continues.
Anyhow, men are the ones overvaluing the "GP", saying things like "if it weren't for THAT,
men would have nothing to do with women", which I found to be news.
Really?
I know too many men hate women, aside from the sex, but the focus on GP is vaguely surprising.
But then, there is all this porn which is very clinical and interior pics ( which most women find not particularly attractive) vs pics of nice hair, faces, hourglass curves...
I guess those pics are as close as some will get to knowing what the GP looks like.
Most women aren't obsessed with pride over their GP, at all, and certainly nothing like men and their phallocentrism that makes them send out unpleasant diick emails to strangers.
How often do women send out GP emails?
Pretty rare.
This GP Syndrome seems another handy projection of men, another faulty assumption that we share the same consciousness on anything related to this topic.
Maybe if those who enjoy this phrase stop presuming rejection means GPS or some such, you'll have no ammo to malign some woman who spurns you.
No prudery, no religiosity, being stuck up, GPS. She just didn't fancy you cuz if she did, you'd be the first to know.
I've been accused of being "bashful, conservative, a prude, shy, not friendly, a lesbian..." and the reality was I thought the guy dumb, a jerk, juvenile, unattractive, creepy, etc.
But they always need a "reason" why your're a horrible person for rejecting them .
 zookie57
Joined: 1/27/2012
Msg: 885
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 5:24:53 PM

It could mean she's bored with losers who consider "courting her" nothing more than the chore required (no more than 3 times) in order to get laid.
It could mean.....


Yes, it could mean a lot of things for her & him........................


Or it could mean she does not know a honest guy out there as of yet after her past choices of men..........jmo

And if u pick them just because.............. then u will always repeat your past mis happens of true character of men........yet there are those who are just into it for their ego.......whatever....
happiness is for those who finally have their own & their s/ other.........jmo
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 886
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 6:00:46 PM
Many of us flat out stated that we like sex just as much as men. We just don't want to have it with someone we just met.

That's a contradiction. Pick one. The fact that you don't want to have sex with someone you just met (even if sexually attracted to him), means it's not really the sex, per se, that you are after. What you're after is a relationship. The sex is only incidental and a nice perk.

Just because people choose not engage in casual sex doesn't mean that they view sex as a "chore".

No, but it means that such women make sex a chore for a guy, since he's getting sex in exchange for giving up his freedom, having to become responsible and having to play all those roles he has to play to be in a relationship.

It just means that they would rather limit their sexual partners to those they are in a relationship with.

And I think most guys don't want to change their lives just to get laid and that's what getting into a relationship means.

It just means that they would rather limit their sexual partners to those they are in a relationship with.

I guess it depends on whether a person considers having caual sex to be giving up less than giving up ones freedom. I'm pickier about a person I become responsible for than a person I have sex with. However, in this era, that's no longer really an issue. There are lots of women who have grown up with less need to be in a relationship to have sex and who place a greater value on independence, than women my age.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 887
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 6:38:31 PM

Many of us flat out stated that we like sex just as much as men. We just don't want to have it with someone we just met.


That's a contradiction. Pick one. The fact that you don't want to have sex with someone you just met (even if sexually attracted to him), means it's not really the sex, per se, that you are after. What you're after is a relationship. The sex is only incidental and a nice perk.


That isn't necessarily true. Being sexually attracted to a man is not a good enough reason for a woman to sleep with him right away. There are often safety issues for her to consider.
 Dare to
Joined: 2/11/2009
Msg: 888
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 6:48:14 PM

giving up his freedom
Interesting that so many men have an issue with the words "giving it away" when the woman refers to sex but have no issue with using 'giving it up" when referring to his freedom.. And discussing how many men use the term "giving it up"when referring to sex is a whole 'nother thread.. Why is it perceived to have such different meanings and levels of insult depending on the gender of who says it??
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 889
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 7:50:53 PM
Interesting that so many men have an issue with the words "giving it away" when the woman refers to sex but have no issue with using 'giving it up" when referring to his freedom..

You have to be kidding. Are you really losing something by having sex? If so, does your partner know you think of sex that way? On the other hand, I can certainly list several things I gave up for relationships. What have you ever given up by having sex with someone? If there was nothing I had to give up for a relationship, I'd have gotten married long before now - maybe several times. If you don't see the difference between that and having casual sex, you don't place much value on your freedom and independence, or you don't care much for sex, or both.

I'm also not making any claims that I'm not making a tradeoff for a relationship and that what I expect to get in return (which doesn't include sex, since that's available outside of a relationship) is worth what I'm giving up. So sure, if you want to think sex as you giving something up, go ahead. My guess is that your partner won't be thrilled to know you see it that way.
 errant71
Joined: 4/4/2009
Msg: 890
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/19/2012 8:24:45 PM

Interesting that so many men have an issue with the words "giving it away" when the woman refers to sex but have no issue with using 'giving it up" when referring to his freedom.. And discussing how many men use the term "giving it up"when referring to sex is a whole 'nother thread.. Why is it perceived to have such different meanings and levels of insult depending on the gender of who says it??


I don't refer to sex as "giving it up" or "giving it away". I refer to sex as sharing it. If I'm sexually attracted and he is too, we'll likely be "sharing it" without either of us having to "give up" much of anything including our independence and freedom. Don't know about calling it "casual sex" ... sex isn't very casual to me 'cause I enjoy it too much.


Being sexually attracted to a man is not a good enough reason for a woman to sleep with him right away. There are often safety issues for her to consider.


Don't know about that since it certainly doesn't fit me ... speaking for women, even in general, is a bit of a generalization.


You have to be kidding. Are you really losing something by having sex? If so, does your partner know you think of sex that way? On the other hand, I can certainly list several things I gave up for relationships. What have you ever given up by having sex with someone? If there was nothing I had to give up for a relationship, I'd have gotten married long before now - maybe several times. If you don't see the difference between that and having casual sex, you don't place much value on your freedom and independence, or you don't care much for sex, or both.


May be posted by a guy ... but as a woman, I'd have to agree. I haven't gotten married again because I've felt I'd be giving too much up. When I feel I won't be giving too much up ... I'll consider marriage again.
 motown_cowgirl
Joined: 12/22/2011
Msg: 891
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 5:00:36 AM
Many of us flat out stated that we like sex just as much as men. We just don't want to have it with someone we just met.

That's a contradiction.

It's not a contradiction at all because being more selective isn’t a contradiction, it’s just being more selective, but I'll stipulate that you see it as "a contradiction". I guess this does prove that men generally think about sex quite differently than women generally do. As if we didn't already know....

Women like to travel just as much as men, but we just don't want to fly to Hawaii with someone we just met. I like donuts just as much as cops do, but I'm not going to eat three of them every time I pass a Krispy Kreme. In other words, how much you LIKE the way doing something feels is completely different from your reasons for actually DOING IT. However when it comes to sex in particular, some men don't seem to make much of a distinction and then immediately start faulting women for not seeing things the same way, because that gets in the way of what the man thinks the woman should be giving him. Interesting.


women have all the power until they give up the goods and then they have none.

What a bizarre thing to say. Who knew that having sex with a man is really a power struggle that the woman completely and automatically loses every time she indulges in what was otherwise a consensual act.


REALLY? She is doing it ALL WRONG then

^^^^^^^^^^^^^ LOL
 ontario_woman
Joined: 4/3/2005
Msg: 892
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 6:07:03 AM
That's a contradiction. Pick one. The fact that you don't want to have sex with someone you just met (even if sexually attracted to him), means it's not really the sex, per se, that you are after. What you're after is a relationship. The sex is only incidental and a nice perk.


If I had sex with every man that I was sexually attracted to when I first met him, I would have had 100s of sexual partners by now and probably a nasty STD or two.


No, but it means that such women make sex a chore for a guy, since he's getting sex in exchange for giving up his freedom, having to become responsible and having to play all those roles he has to play to be in a relationship. And I think most guys don't want to change their lives just to get laid and that's what getting into a relationship means.



It's interesting that you view being in a relationship in such a negative way considering that you're engaged...


I'm pickier about a person I become responsible for than a person I have sex with.


I'm pickier about whom I choose to share an intimate part of myself with.

The bottom line is that I'm not interested in a man who views being in a relationship in a negative light and needs to manipulated into one. I want a man who wants a relationship as much as I do.

Not all men think about casual sex in such a manner.

I'm currently dating a man who has made it very clear that he has no intention of sleeping with me until we are in a serious relationship. He has informed me that he has only had a handful of sexual partners in his life. This guy is moving far more slowly and cautiously than what I am accustomed to. I certainly don't feel any need to push the issue with him. It'll happen when it happens and I don't want to pressure him into doing something that he is not comfortable with because I care about him a person, not a masturbatory aid.

I told him about this thread and the opinions of some of the male posters and he was flabbergasted that they aren't more worried about catching something.
 tlcme1964
Joined: 8/28/2009
Msg: 893
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 6:35:04 AM
Yet I've experienced the opposite. Those I've dated seemed to believe an emotional relationship can be built on a physical one & want sex sooner rather than later. Perhaps it's just in my age group because it's how we did it when younger. Doesn't apply now though, at least to me & although I express my views upfront, I lost count how many times I've been grabbed, groped & fondled, so soon after meeting.
 Dare to
Joined: 2/11/2009
Msg: 894
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 7:55:45 AM

You have to be kidding. Are you really losing something by having sex? If so, does your partner know you think of sex that way?
Are you even reading the words i wrote?? How on earth you read that I felt i was losing something when i have sex I will never know.. My post was about the use of the words "giving it away/up" and how guys often use the expression themselves but get all pissy when women use it. These forums are full of men referring to women "giving it up" but for some reason the men here aren't jumping all over them for using the expression, only doing so when a woman uses it..

It continually blows my mind when a man and a woman can look at the same words (or even say the same words) and see two totally different meanings...
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 895
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 8:05:43 AM
My post was about the use of the words "giving it away/up" and how guys often use the expression themselves but get all pissy when women use it. These forums are full of men referring to women "giving it up" but for some reason the men here aren't jumping all over them for using the expression, only doing so when a woman uses it..


There's a bit of a difference between someone using an expression in a post buried in some thread and someone posing a question about it in the title of a thread. I don't even open the majority of threads on here.

As for what some men say, I believe you should hold the person who utters a phrase responsible for those words rather than use them as an ad hominem argument against the entire gender. If the same guy used a phrase and got pissy about women using it, you would have a point.
 pasmal
Joined: 2/24/2010
Msg: 896
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 8:14:08 AM
GPS is an ad hominem. No men on this thread seem offended by that.
 Paderic
Joined: 2/23/2010
Msg: 897
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 8:42:13 AM

GPS is an ad hominem. No men on this thread seem offended by that.


Not sure what it even is, aside from global positioning system. Maybe general purpose sex? If so, I'm not sure how that would be considered an ad hominem.
 ohenryx
Joined: 3/12/2010
Msg: 898
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 9:03:35 AM
Some interesting posts recently in this thread.

Yes, you do give up something to be in a relationship. The question is, do you receive enough in exchange to make it a worthwhile trade off? I believe this is equally true for both men and women. And everyone has to make that decision for themselves, based on the individual circumstances.

I do not understand what the female posters are talking about, when they state they are giving up something in order to have sex. What exactly are you “giving up”?

And here’s one that totally, completely flabbergasts me. Ontario_woman states clearly and unequivocally that she is pickier about whom she has sex with than whom she becomes responsible for. This statement completely blows my mind. Casual sex is just that, casual. Becoming responsible for someone else, another human being, is a very, very drastic step. It is life changing, you cannot just make that kind of commitment and then walk away from it. I simply do not believe that most women would share her viewpoint, no matter what they think about casual sex.
 ontario_woman
Joined: 4/3/2005
Msg: 899
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 9:06:53 AM
And here’s one that totally, completely flabbergasts me. Ontario_woman states clearly and unequivocally that she is pickier about whom she has sex with than whom she becomes responsible for.


Perhaps I should clarify. I am only responsible for myself and my minor child. My spouse, as a full functioning adult, is responsible for himself. I don't consider being in a relationship to mean that I am responsible for someone else. It's about boundaries. I consider a relationship as a partnership where we both work together for a common goal.

The women in my family have a tendency to be over-responsible in that they take responsibility for their spouse. The outcome to that is never good. I've seen them struggle too often with men who were little more than overgrown children in need of a mommy. I don't want another child. I want a man.

I mentioned that I am pickier about with whom I get intimate with because I view getting physically intimate as more than just a physical act. It's an emotional one as well. When I get physically/emotionally intimate with someone, I am sharing a very personal part of myself, thus putting me in a vulnerable position. I don't want to do that with just anyone.


Yes, you do give up something to be in a relationship.


That's what I was trying to get at in my earlier post. If you view a relationship as somehow giving something up, then you shouldn't be in a relationship. I only want a man who wants a relationship; not one I have to coerce into a relationship.
 hardcandy24
Joined: 3/2/2012
Msg: 900
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 10:20:34 AM
Sex before a relationship doesn't make u a whore, are people 12 on here lol as 4 waiting, nothing wrong with that!
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 901
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 10:51:46 AM
It's not a contradiction at all because being more selective isn’t a contradiction,


It is a contradiction, since you can't really be sexually attracted to someone you wouldn't sleep with. To claim otherwise is to abuse the meaning of sexual attraction to mean ``physically attractive.'' If you find those two to be equivalent, then you are less selective, not more selective. I find lots of women to be physically attractive, yet they do nothing for me sexually.

It's interesting that you view being in a relationship in such a negative way considering that you're engaged...

It's interesting that you think it's possible to have any sort of relationship without both of you giving the other what the other person wants in exchange for what you're getting. That contradicts any notion of selectivity at all and it's certainly not true unless you'd accept anyone for a relationship, have no standards or expectations at all and have nothing to offer anyone. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you do have standards and expectations, you do have something to offer and you wouldn't just get into a relationship with anyone and also assume you just never gave any of that any thought.

The bottom line is that I'm not interested in a man who views being in a relationship in a negative light and needs to manipulated into one. I want a man who wants a relationship as much as I do.

The bottom line is that you never seemed to have given much thought to the fact that you wouldn't care about being in a relationship unless you wanted something out it and you wouldn't be able to get into a (lasting) relationship unless you were willing to commit yourself to doing things you wouldn't do unless that relationship existed. In other words, you have no basis for a relationship unless both people want what they are getting out of it and are willing to make sacrifices to maintain it. It just never occured to you that is what you are doing. I know exactly what I'm getting myself into and what I'm giving up for it (because I did give that some thought), which is why sex is not something that I'm willing to use as a bargaining chip. I can get laid and I don't need a relationship for that.

I'm sure there are lots of guys who want a relationship as much as you do, so obviously that criteria is ridiculously easy to meet unless you want more than that. I assume you do, but that you somehow failed to realize that you aren't willing to give up your freedom for just anybody who will agree to be in a relationship with you.

Perhaps I should clarify. I am only responsible for myself and my minor child. My spouse, as a full functioning adult, is responsible for himself. I don't consider being in a relationship to mean that I am responsible for someone else. It's about boundaries. I consider a relationship as a partnership where we both work together for a common goal.

Good luck with that. My parents have been married 55 years and they've stayed married because their responsibilty is toward the relationship which means being responsible for each other. If I wasn't willing to take on additional responsibility to be in a relationship, I wouldn't be in one. When my fiancee needed a root canal ``right now'' a few weeks ago, I didn't just tell her to figure out where she'd come up with the money because we have ``boundaries.'' That wouldn't be much of a relationship, in my opinion. Perhaps I take a relationship a little more seriously than just someone to see regularly in order to feel better about having sex. Personally, I think my fiancee would prefer that I have my so-called ``negative'' perception of a relationship because she'd do the same if the situation was reversed.

That's what I was trying to get at in my earlier post. If you view a relationship as somehow giving something up, then you shouldn't be in a relationship.

I just gave up $1800.00 for my fiancee's root canal, so I think I can quantify at least one thing I'm prepared to give up knowing that she'd have done the same if the situation was reversed. You're either pretending that sort of thing doesn't count (even though I wouldn't have done it for ``just anyone'') and that there aren't numerous other examples of things you are or would be giving up, or your idea of a relationship falls way short of what I'd call committed. In the latter case, what you'd be calling a relationhip is what I'd be calling fck buddies. I had assumed by ``relationship'' everyone meant something that will involve some sort of personal sacrifice for the sake of the relationship.

Not all men think about casual sex in such a manner.

Not all men (or women) think it's ok to have sex outside of marriage, too. Not all men or women think, period.

I told him about this thread and the opinions of some of the male posters and he was flabbergasted that they aren't more worried about catching something.


Then, he'd probably be at least as flabbergasted at how many people drive cars given the odds of dying in an automobile accident. I've been single my entire life and have never caught anything. Some people also win the lottery by catching something on their first experience or even from an unfaithful spouse. Tell him to calculate the odds and thn get back to me. He can find data to use for this purpose in the medical literature.

I don't want to do that with just anyone.

Can you show me one, just one, post in which anyone has advocated that you or anyone else have sex with ``just anyone?'' If not, then your argument is specious and you are only arguing against a position you invented in oder to have an argument of any sort.

I only want a man who wants a relationship; not one I have to coerce into a relationship.

That's nice rhetoric, but the bottom line is that no one will want to be in a relationship with you (or anyone else) unless he is getting something out of the relationship that you are putting into it. You may not realize that, but that only limits your ability to be selective. There's no virtue in not knowing why you want to be in a relationship or why another person would want to be in a relationship with you. In my opinion, the biggest reason people have difficulty finding ``good men/women,'' is that they have not given any of that any thought and/or aren't honest with themselves about what they want and what they have (or are willing) to offer another person. Relationships are hard to come by if you expect it to be more meaningful than the sacrifices you're willing to make for it..

Are you even reading the words i wrote?? How on earth you read that I felt i was losing something when i have sex I will never know..

I did read what you wrote, but you aren't reading what I wrote or you wouldn't confuse questions with assumptions.
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 902
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 11:47:32 AM

It is a contradiction, since you can't really be sexually attracted to someone you wouldn't sleep with.


Of course you can. I find my neighbor's husband sexually attractive---I can picture us sleeping together in my mind. Would I sleep with him if he wanted to sleep with me? Absolutely not, because I have respect for other people's boundaries, as well as my own.
 abelian
Joined: 1/12/2008
Msg: 903
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 11:51:15 AM
Of course you can. I find my neighbor's husband sexually attractive---I can picture us sleeping together in my mind. Would I sleep with him if he wanted to sleep with me? Absolutely not, because I have respect for other people's boundaries, as well as my own.

You're prevaricating. I'd like a million dollars, but I'm not willing to rob a bank to get it. You have an impediment that would require you to biolate some other ethical constraint than just having sex. Ultimately, iof you want to throw that in there, the bottom line is that you will do that which you feel most comfortable doing. However, you should at leasty bwe able to identify what it is that makes one choice more desirable than another and eliminate self-imposed limitations that serve no purpose other than to limit your enjoyment of life. People used to feel guilty about maturbating, but many have figured out that there's no reason to feel guilty about that. In your case, your neighbor is married and you're in relationship. That ought to be more than sufficient to keep you from acting on your desire. However, if those weren't constraints, then the situation would be different. Assuming that you were both free and clear to go at it, then your choice oof whether or not to sleep with him has nothing to do with whether or not he wants to sleep with you besides his willingness to participate (and vice-versa). I'm not sure why people keep mentioning the other person's desire to have sex as being the criteria here.
 pasmal
Joined: 2/24/2010
Msg: 904
Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 5:14:03 PM
"GPS" --ask the other posters who like to toss that out as a reason for many female behaviors that displease them.
It's a cowardly way of saying the the "C" word.
 Dare to
Joined: 2/11/2009
Msg: 905
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/20/2012 10:42:35 PM
^^^^ And also used as a shaming tactic for any woman who won't throw herself on her back when some horny guy wants to get laid...
 Halcyon_Skies
Joined: 2/1/2009
Msg: 906
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Not giving sex away without the relationship
Posted: 3/21/2012 9:10:53 AM

Ultimately, if you want to throw that in there, the bottom line is that you will do that which you feel most comfortable doing. However, you should at least be able to identify what it is that makes one choice more desirable than another and eliminate self-imposed limitations that serve no purpose other than to limit your enjoyment of life.


Everyone will do that in which they feel most comfortable doing---that goes without saying. Since one’s comfort level directly affects their enjoyment of life, I’m not sure why you felt mentioning that would strengthen your argument. I’ve identified the reasons why holding off on sex until I’m in a committed relationship is safer, as well as more emotionally fulfilling for me than sleeping with a man I just met.


People used to feel guilty about masturbating, but many have figured out that there's no reason to feel guilty about that. In your case, your neighbor is married and you're in relationship. That ought to be more than sufficient to keep you from acting on your desire. However, if those weren't constraints, then the situation would be different. Assuming that you were both free and clear to go at it, then your choice of whether or not to sleep with him has nothing to do with whether or not he wants to sleep with you besides his willingness to participate (and vice-versa).


In the case of my neighbor---assuming he and I were both single and mutually attracted to one another, I might act on it and sleep with him at some point---but it still wouldn’t be before I took the time to get to know him and trust him.


I'm not sure why people keep mentioning the other person's desire to have sex as being the criteria here.


I can’t speak for other women, but for me personally, unless a man gives me some kind of signal that he’s sexually attracted to me---either by body language or verbally, I don’t even notice him past the physical attraction point.
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