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 vampyreshadow
Joined: 3/21/2011
Msg: 226
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Feminism Your ViewsPage 10 of 44    (4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44)
They actually have a contraption that gives males fake breasts to simulate breast feeding for fathers, that being said I do not believe fairness can be legislated, it requires teaching tolerance of different ideals, and simply put enforcing gender rolls based on antiquated traditions on either gender isn't fair. I will never agree with people who preach intolerance for this reason, I am not you, I am not anyone else. If you don't like me, you really have no requirement to be around me, but I will not live the life you wish of me, I would rather be single as myself, then go down that road again. I wouldn't ask anyone to change for me, if I don't like them the way they are, I will send them on their way with best wishes for a better life. As I said no price is to high for the privilege of owning oneself, if the cost is being alone, I have friends who love me, and I shall be content with that.
 CharityTrue
Joined: 11/15/2011
Msg: 227
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 7:22:13 PM
Msg 4:
I was talking about how feminists will judge me over my choices.
They don't accept that, for some of us pride and gladness in life may come from rising our children well, instead of choosing not to wear a bra.
I have a university education, my own business, and I can go on with five hours of sleep a day to do everything. Still, If I were to choose, I wouldn't be doing this. But that's not politically correct...
It's all very good that we women have stopped being inferior beings and that we have now a right to vote, to healthcare, to an education and to work. I'm glad that our worth doesn't come from having a husband, and that we are allowed to hold property.
Still, I don't quite know how the above made the jump to being bossy and mean towards men, drinking, becoming foulmouthed, having to become lesbians or be into casual NSA sex only, and other derivations of the same.

One thing is to be independent and liberated, a very different one is to demean those who don't share that view. So what's the problem if I would prefer to have a husband? Or whether I would rather cook, clean, educate the kids, sow, embroidery and look after the garden all they long? Why is it wrong to treat a husband with respect?

So, I'm a woman, with an education, with responsabilities, with more balls than some of the men who have appeared in my life, but hell, no, I'm not what is modernly known as a "feminist".



I agree with pitufina... I am a well educated woman, I have a good job, my own house, and am very capable of supporting myself, I feel I have a lot to offer. However; All i've ever wanted was a family, to create that space and that legacy of my genes, and a good caring environment to bring up children in. however, if women (who call themselves feminists) ask me what i want to do, and i tell them that, then i get told that i'm backwards, and am ruining the cause of feminism. I've been called ungrateful, and told that I don't appreciate the opportunities others have worked for, just because i don't want to work a 70 hour week and take over the world.

I feel that as with many other good causes, feminism has changed to mean less that what it was originally intended to mean. It was about the choice and freedom to follow our dreams. it now seems to mean that i have a choice, as long as i choose to work, set aside my dreams of a family, and give up on what i was biologically created to do. In other words no choice at all....

funny that.


Here are posts from just 2 women who are convinced that feminists will no support them/ do not agree with what they want for themselves. they are criticized and castigated for wanting what they want, for their choice...
Because feminists promote, value every role for women except wife/mother homemaker. "mindless drudgery" "soul-destroying" housewife's lot. they never recognise how deeply fulfilling w a woman can be with this life, no matter how many women say it. When i do i am called names, like dinosaur, throwback , even worse...
Because in my experience, feminists are very sure they know what is best for everyone, what is right... they laugh, insult and pooh-pooh all other points of view and when logic doesn't work, they insult, attack or get emotional.... or change the subject... I've seen it all my life.... To wit;

some people can read but comprehension skills are lacking
there it is the sneering supercilious arrogance of the typical feminist... So rude...

Here's the bottom line... I have no truck with it, why? because i like people, I don't blame groups of people for historical wrongs...

The thread is about feminism and the fact it has provided a choice, whereas before feminism there was no choice whether to be a housewife because society, and men in particular, demanded it.

Somebody had to be in charge of childcare... ::rollseyes::... Regardless what was happening 40/50 yrs ago, it isn't happening now... When are you going to just start being nice so we can all get along... Don't worry, I'll wait...

I refuse to blame white people of my generation for the sins of their ancestors towards my ancestors...
I also refuse to blame men of my generation for the "sins" of their fathers. It's counterproductive for me and my life to do so, so I left that way of thinking behind many yrs ago...
 --Zen--
Joined: 6/29/2011
Msg: 228
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 7:24:32 PM
@ chameleonf
While I understand that it's a somewhat heated reply I'll have to disagree. Yes there ware few women overlooked that made notable contributions. Change was needed to adapt society to industrial world. It made some positive changes but mindset developed unfortunately outweigh the positive. Point being, here today is, some feminists try to condemn and 'liberate' women who choose to have traditional lifestyle. Here is an example: "Every time you focus upon propaganda, every time you support a logical fallacy of oppression, you are the architect of your own oppression." If the 'choice' is created to deprive of choice how is it a choice? This is done not only in western society but just like spreading 'American democracy' it is done to other cultures. Soviet propaganda operated on exact same level.
 ItsMargo
Joined: 4/24/2007
Msg: 229
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Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 7:30:24 PM
Arguably feminism was not about choice. Good heavens, the housewife was villified in the march to get us all into the workplace. " You're "just" a housewife?" "You're not going to do more with your life?"

Choice did evolve, but I think that was more about smart marketing than alignment with the feminist agenda.

Oddly enough, now that we do have choice, many of the women who would like to stay home with their children can't afford too.

One of the direct casualties of feminism is the family. As was intended.


Soviet propaganda operated on exact same level.

As did feminism. Not surprising given its Marxist revolutionary base.
 R00T
Joined: 3/13/2012
Msg: 230
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 7:33:36 PM

in my view if a person occupies themselves only with household activities over a longer period of time without other activities to broarden their horizons and learn, then yes the brain will go mushy due to no new input.

As of one size doesnt fit all, this is directed at personalities. every personalty is different.

But even a different personality wont save your brain from being underworked, when you are not putting new stuff in.



If that was true the Buddhist monks' brains would be mushy but not the case. I mean all they do is eat, sleep, mediate do a few house chores, give a few lectures and that's pretty much it.

I don't see feminism as a threat more like an annoyance. It's more a threat to companies that will lose out because feminist want to get paid for something they don't deserve. I wonder if these companies would either move or just close it down. Speaking of other countries my employer employee men and women from another country and guess what they all get paid the same.
 vampyreshadow
Joined: 3/21/2011
Msg: 231
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Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 7:38:51 PM
Charity, that isn't true for all feminists, I was a house wife for 14 years, I support housewives, it just wasn't for me. I love my kids and it would have been fine for the first 5 years, past that I started going nuts, its not my goal. I was living someone elses ideal for me. I wouldn't force that on anyone, if you want to be a housewife, more power to you, but I am no less a person then you because it is not my choice. A father who chooses to be a stay at home dad is no less of a man because of his choice. My issue, is people need to quit judging and let others live the life they choose for themselves.
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 232
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Posted: 4/10/2012 7:58:06 PM
some people can read but comprehension skills are lacking there it is the sneering supercilious arrogance of the typical feminist... So rude...

No, that's stating a fact and has nothing to do with feminism at all.


Here are posts from just 2 women who are convinced that feminists will no support them/ do not agree with what they want for themselves. they are criticized and castigated for wanting what they want, for their choice...


No, that's two women who are sneared at by other women who likely wish they were able to stay at home by choice but are still more concerned with proving themselves as "I am woman here me roar." You obviously must have let a number of women's jealous comments get to you if you drew your conclusions and picked one phrase "mushy brain" out of all the rest of the comments and took it out of context so readily. It's an unfortunate conclusion but one that is based on your past experiences, not unlike conclusions being drawn by some men who believe their problem with finding or holding relationships with women is the fault of feminism.


Somebody had to be in charge of childcare... ::rollseyes::...

Try to unroll your eyes for a moment so you can clearly see that feminism has also allowed the ability for men to be in charge of childcare - if that's the choice the people involved make. What others have to think of those choices means squat.

For the record, I'm not a "typical feminist" in the manner you suggest. I also believe that men have their own struggles because of the swing of the pendulum in "some" circumstances because of it - quota filling of jobs, ridiculous child custody judgements, horrendous and unjustifiable spousal support, etc. I do not believe, however, that their inability to find and hold a meaningful relationship is caused by the feminist movement of long ago or as it stands now, but rather more a fact of either how they, personally, treat women or the crappy personality of the women they've chosen or continue to choose. That's where the reading comprehension skills come into play. Somehow you've either wilfully or unintentionally missed those aspects in the posts. The fact that I was a stay at home mother myself would mean I found it a derogatory position to hold in life. As I stated, I loved it and I would promote it for anyone who has the ability to make that choice. I suppose the difference is that I don't give a chit what "other women had or have to say about it." I do appreciate the fact that it was others long before me who allowed me the ability to have the choice to be a stay at home mother, be a joint home-owner while married and a sole home-owner now, have my own bank account, make investments, seek any kind of education I choose and be self-employed. That's the part of feminism I applaud.

vvvv The key point is that she
was one of the fist women to graduate from University of Michigan
...before that it was unheard of. I'm speaking of true feminism that afforded your grandmother that choice - not those who today will degrade their own gender for choosing to be a housewife and think it has to do with feminism when it more properly has to do with sour grapes.


Oddly enough, now that we do have choice, many of the women who would like to stay home with their children can't afford too.

...and very often, but not always, that has more to do with poor financial planning prior to having children than not.


Men in particular huh? Well is it men in particular that are today holding women back from serving on the front lines of Afghanistan? No it's as true today as it's ever been. Men aren't oppressing women!! society as a whole is oppressing women and society as a whole is made up of both men and women period!!


I'm not oppressed. That's the thing. And I wasn't and am not the one who got me to this state of not being oppressed. Yes, men in particular - not men of today, men at the time who believed a woman's place was solely in the home. There goes that reading comprehension thingy again...
 LinuxD
Joined: 12/6/2008
Msg: 233
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Posted: 4/10/2012 7:58:36 PM

The thread is about feminism and the fact it has provided a choice, whereas before feminism there was no choice whether to be a housewife because society, and men in particular, demanded it. Women were not permitted to even have anything but the most rudimentary education, never mind "some college".
Her name (married) was Helen Hogenson.. she passed away when i was 9 yrs old.

are you kidding me? my GRANDMOTHER( and I am 43) was one of the fist women to graduate from University of Michigan! With a degree in education! She was a Principal of a school where there were no other females on the board.. there she sat. She Then went on to found one of the first specal education programs in the state,until she was disabled by a stroke well into her years.WHILE SHE WAS MARRIED and raised ..low and behold 5 kids besides MY MOTHER.. .. So.. Sistah's lets get it done like Gramma did.. she did what it took.. and the legacy still lives on.. what can you say you are going to pass on to your offspring? Xbox and bellyaching?
 RAMPERBILL
Joined: 2/16/2010
Msg: 234
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 8:13:11 PM
The only way you can say you have a choice is to know that what you choose is able to be achieved, and sustained.

I can choose to be a stay at home parent as I think I have the credentials to qualify for raising foster children, and I have 3 spare rooms in a clean home. This is sustainable. Therefore, a choice, and profitable.

If my kids had children and needed me to take care of their children for some reason, I have the space, and the income even if staying home. This is sustainable. Therefore, a choice, but an expense.

If I had no income, and married a professional who wanted children and me to stay home, and she lost her income. This is sustainable, but risky. But, it is still a choice. I'd keep my fingers crossed, but I'd still get a big house with a pool (kid's love pools). This is profitable, but can also make you homeless.

It was inevitable that this thread would go from equal pay, back to the family unit.
 1ukn4u
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 235
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 8:23:38 PM

Oh for crying out loud. I swear...some people can read but comprehension skills are lacking.


No you and a few of the other ladies on here read only what you want to and bypass the rest so that you can keep your manhater card activated.


The thread is about feminism and the fact it has provided a choice, whereas before feminism there was no choice whether to be a housewife because society, and men in particular, demanded it. Women were not permitted to even have anything but the most rudimentary education, never mind "some college". They had no choice to leave an unsatisfactory or abusive relationship.


No because I have female relative like great aunts and such who were in fact divorced they also cussed spit and drank all the time. Your full of it. This is a big manhater club and most of you know it. Oh men oppressed me!!!


Men in particular huh? Well is it men in particular that are today holding women back from serving on the front lines of Afghanistan? No it's as true today as it's ever been. Men aren't oppressing women!! society as a whole is oppressing women and society as a whole is made up of both men and women period!!



Women were not permitted to even have anything but the most rudimentary education, never mind "some college".


Really? Cause my grandmother really had it going on.



They had no choice to leave an unsatisfactory or abusive relationship. The fact that they were very often treated as a domestic beast of burden, with no voting rights and any number of other rights, did not allow them to explore other interests and their brains were forced to remain at an uneducated level, even though they craved more.


No again society as a whole allowed this and did this. They did have choices it's just those choices were very frowned apon. Just like an unwed mother would be forced by both her parents to give the baby up for adoption.


Go have a drink at your favourite pub and chill while you ponder your ability to be divorced.


There was prohibition. A time where society thought no one should be drinking both men and women. Maybe we should just blame prohibition on women some how.lmao


The part I hate is the full blame going on mens shoulders as if they alone are responsible for societies past. This is just a big joke in general.
 newonthescene76
Joined: 2/24/2007
Msg: 236
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Posted: 4/10/2012 8:44:02 PM
Concerning the "feminists bash traditional women" points, I think this works both ways and I don't think it is necessarily feminists that bash traditional women. Working moms are frowned upon and ridiculed because they supposedly don't care enough about their kids to stay home. SAHM are frowned upon and ridiculed as lazy and dumb. There will always be someone who doesn't agree with what someone else is doing, not just the "feminists".

On a personal note, while I think any woman who wants to be a SAHM should be one, I have to admit it confuses me. Especially if the woman had always planned to be a SAHM, but spent years and money on an education, I don't really understand the point of going through all that hassle if you are not planning to be part of the workforce. Plus, the fact of divorce, death, and/or unemployment can leave a woman who has not been in the workforce in many years in a very precarious position.

Also some posters brought up the show Orange County Housewives as a slam towards the supposed feminists sitting on their bum and not doing anything, or something similar to that. Well I haven't watched the show in a long time, but from what I remember, didn't all the women work? As a matter of fact, I believe 2 of the husbands were unemployed and their wives were supporting them.
 RAMPERBILL
Joined: 2/16/2010
Msg: 237
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 8:45:56 PM
Women were not permitted to even have anything but the most rudimentary education, never mind "some college".
--------------------------------------------------
I guess Madam Curie got lucky when she discovered radium. I wonder how she was able to get out of her cage.



They had no choice to leave an unsatisfactory or abusive relationship. The fact that they were very often treated as a domestic beast of burden, with no voting rights and any number of other rights, did not allow them to explore other interests and their brains were forced to remain at an uneducated level, even though they craved more.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Whenever something like the above is said did anyone ever notice that you never see the work "I" in it. It's always they and their. Even my sister, when she makes up stories to influence, always tells them with only dead people in them. She thinks the stories can't be confirmed, but these people that are dead still have living relatives that state that she is full of it.
 chameleonf
Joined: 12/22/2008
Msg: 238
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Posted: 4/10/2012 8:47:09 PM
No again society as a whole allowed this and did this. They did have choices it's just those choices were very frowned apon.

I'll agree to the extent that there were societal elements that governed the day and various things were frowned on. You know, like a woman being allowed to vote was likely frowned on by a lot of women - so they chose not to vote...no wait...they weren't allowed to vote, in much the same way that African Americans weren't allowed to drink from a water fountain at one point. A societal norm at the time.

There was prohibition. A time where society thought no one should be drinking both men and women. Maybe we should just blame prohibition on women some how.lmao

I'm not talking about prohibition. I'm talking about a time when women "had their place". Where I live there is a place called the Bruin Inn. Part of an article describing the history states: "Five cent beer was on tap, too and, because St. Albert was exempt from a provincial regulation that restricted men and women from drinking together, the Bruin’s beer parlour permitted mixed drinking." I remember my aunt, who is only 10 years older than I am, would come out here because of the lack of establishments that allowed mixed drinking (not prohibition). How radical, huh!? It had nothing to do with prohibition, but with restricting men and women from drinking together. This was part societal and part feminist movement and part greed that created that change.

At the end of the day, there are going to be die hard woman haters, die hard man haters and whiners and complainers of both sexes. I appreciate what anyone has done, man or woman, that affords me to live the life of choices I'm able to enjoy during my lifetime. If you don't like what someone else's choices have created in your life beyond your control, stop wasting your time being so apathetic and expend energy instead of whining by joining forces with others who agree with you to create change. Just do it for the right reasons and not as a show of one-upmanship, no matter your gender.
 1ukn4u
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 239
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 9:20:08 PM
Thank you chameleonf for being more reasonable and open minded. Yes women not having the right to vote is wrong. Yet at the same time societies mentality at the time is married couples are more than likely going to have very similar feelings and vote for most of the same people or things anyway so why have 2 voters in each household instead of just one. To a degree I don't think any of it was to purposely oppress. Atleast this is what I've been told by my female elders who grew up in some of these times. I listened very closely to my female elders as well as my male elders. My grandmother was a riveting rosey during world war 2. She built airplanes for the United States of America Showing society that women were in fact far more capable than society as a whole believed. Women had to prove they were capable even to themselves. Abusive men are just that. They exist now just as they existed then. There are non abusive men now just as there was then. My grandfather was a very good man and gave my grandmother no limits and supported her in everything she choose to do as any good husband should. Any good spouse for that matter. Men of today are not deserving of the abuse of self proclaimed oppressed women no matter how you ladies choose to justify it.


Yes a large amount of what we as a society have had to over come has been due to religion and preconceived notions of abilities. To some degree there was a limiting on drinking for women because it wasn't very well known what alcohol would do to fetuses. There are a million reasons society made some of their choices on what was deemed acceptable for women to do and not do. Some of it was due to what they thought hard labor would do to a womans health or her ability to have children. Scientifically we know a whole lot more today then we did at those times. Society is better for the knowledge too.



Concerning the "feminists bash traditional women" points, I think this works both ways and I don't think it is necessarily feminists that bash traditional women. Working moms are frowned upon and ridiculed because they supposedly don't care enough about their kids to stay home. SAHM are frowned upon and ridiculed as lazy and dumb. There will always be someone who doesn't agree with what someone else is doing, not just the "feminists".


Some of this is due to each party projecting their own insecurities onto the other. From my perspective both a working mom and a stay at home mom are probably good moms just trying to give their children the best they can. Both should be honored and cherished and praised equally. Thank you moms!!!
 1womanman33
Joined: 3/25/2012
Msg: 240
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 9:32:37 PM

Is there a confusion between power and energy, here?

“Energy cannot be created or destroyed, it can only be changed from one form to another.”
― Albert Einstein

Just because we view power in a practical, or scientific sense (in a man's world? snicker, snicker) does the theory of conservation of energy apply to social empowerment?

If I'm struggling to shift a lump of concrete on my own and Vampyre comes along and helps me, showing me how to maximise my strength and size with technique, because she has taught me how to do it and we have shared the burden of actually doing it, does that mean we both have less power, or in achievement, teaching, learning and having fun doing it, we have more power?

Empowering a person, whoever they are, does not mean that someone else loses out. In a psycho-social setting there's no reason why all cannot be empowered for personal gain and the greater good.

The concept of one taking power at another's expense strikes me as buying into the theory of dynamics such as wife beating, slavery, war and starvation. I like to think that abuse and greed are not the only possibilities for survival of the 'fittest', but that co-operation and sharing are survival techniques in their own right (and perhaps more successful, efficient ones).

I was raised with religion and whilst I was unimpressed with most of it, an analogy I was taught has always stuck in my mind:

Heaven and hell are exactly the same. They are both beautiful, comfortable and there is enough food for everyone. In both, the spoons have 6 foot handles. In hell all the people are miserable as they can't eat all this wonderful food with the 6 foot spoons. In heaven they are happy as they feed each other.

We can choose to feed each other's empowerment, or we can choose to make each other go hungry out of spite.

Like the response...but you kind of missed what I was saying. My question wasn't women taking power at the expense of men...but women taking power at the expense of OTHER WOMEN. Again, my biggest beef with feminism is the idea that women who choose willingly to live a traditional lifestyle in terms of being a homemaker, mother, etc. are railed against or discouraged. The other elements of the battle are truly not much different than what blacks (men and women) go through on a daily basis. You know, the more proof there is of a discrepancy, the louder calls get to try and mute these facts down. But again, much like you will have those seemingly in the same group that curiously seem in opposition to a group goal with blacks (i.e. Ward Connorly, Clarence Thomas), I see that with women in their continuous movement towards equal footing. Plowing over those who don't universally agree with you doesn't do much towards engendering sympathy and support to your cause IMHO. And with many of the feminists who have the loudest voices seemingly against women willingly accepting a traditional role, it makes me wonder WHY? I thought the idea was to have equality...which is rooted in complete choice, not just a power play.
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 241
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Posted: 4/10/2012 9:34:22 PM
Arguably feminism was not about choice. Good heavens, the housewife was villified in the march to get us all into the workplace. " You're "just" a housewife?" "You're not going to do more with your life?"

Choice did evolve, but I think that was more about smart marketing than alignment with the feminist agenda.

Oddly enough, now that we do have choice, many of the women who would like to stay home with their children can't afford too.

One of the direct casualties of feminism is the family. As was intended.

Brilliantly stated!

~OT~ I don't care who burns their bras, toots their horns for Gloria Steinem or worships some phantom/mystical perception that some "movement" (which actually, for those least informed, began in the late 1890s) was brilliantly crafted and actually worked for the mass majority of women ~ everyone is entitled to their opinion on things, but for me? All this supposed movement got me? Education, a career that was necessary but not what I wanted (I wanted to be a stay-at-home-Mom) a step on the rung of the corporate ladder just inches below the men who likely relied on me far more than they relied on their own selves, and WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too little time spent with my son while he was turning from a baby into a toddler into a teen-ager into a man. Oh, and signs of carpel tunnel and many many headaches over the years. And? I got the job of doctor, taxi-driver, maid, cook, tutor, counselor, and also at times, Father. (I'd not trade ONE moment of those "jobs" ~ I did those things out of love, not because society made me.) Yeah, this "movement" was the answer to alllllllll of my dreams as a child. I'm all for those who think this "movement" really did some miraculous things and I hope they are happy with the choices they've made and the things they find rewarding about their lives. But I would have sold my soul to have been a stay at home mom. JMO
 ladyc4
Joined: 2/14/2006
Msg: 242
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Posted: 4/10/2012 9:36:58 PM

For the record, I'm not a "typical feminist" in the manner you suggest. I also believe that men have their own struggles because of the swing of the pendulum in "some" circumstances because of it - quota filling of jobs, ridiculous child custody judgements, horrendous and unjustifiable spousal support, etc. I do not believe, however, that their inability to find and hold a meaningful relationship is caused by the feminist movement of long ago or as it stands now, but rather more a fact of either how they, personally, treat women or the crappy personality of the women they've chosen or continue to choose.


This I absolutely agree with and I do believe that the "pendulum swing" is a good part of the cause of dissension.


Actually, I prefer to consider myself a humanist-all I care about,is that we are not wasting human resources because of the social constructs of 90-odd years ago.
I'm all for stay-at-home dads,women CEOs, stay-at-home moms, women doctors and male nurses, female farmers and male administrative assistants. I'm for women welders and male sewing-machine operators. I think that the courts should TRULY look at the best interests of the child(ren) in custody matters, not traditional roles from 60 years ago.

I freely recognize and acknowledge that there are physiological differences between men and women and there are some jobs where those differences DO matter. I will change that opinion the day a man gestates and births a baby (without the aid of extreme medical engineering and retooling!)

I realize that there was/is probably a small core of feminists who did/do want to destroy the family, but I believe that most women who supported the concept of gender equality were simply looking at the idea of allowing women to be equal citizens in our society,of having more options to pursue higher education and a greater choice of careers.
Both the woman who has chosen to make caring for a spouse, children and a home her life's work and the woman who had chosen to forego having a family in order to pursue a career are valuable to society and neither one should be looked down on, pitied, or vilified.

It is my fervent hope that someday soon the pendulum swing will stabilize and center-and we can all go find something else to fight about-or fight FOR.(World peace, anybody?)

Cindy O
 newonthescene76
Joined: 2/24/2007
Msg: 243
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Posted: 4/10/2012 9:41:35 PM
@verygreeneyez:

Who put a gun to your head to force you to get an education and go to work? That was your choice, not feminism.
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 244
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Posted: 4/10/2012 9:49:25 PM
@verygreeneyez:

Who put a gun to your head to force you to get an education and go to work? That was your choice, not feminism.

Is that right? You would have been happy to pay for me and my son to live? Pay our rent/mortgage, buy our groceries, pay for the car I drove to make a living and get him to his activities and his medical appts? My utilitites, etc? Or are you one of those who hates the welfare system and thinks only lazy people need that assistance, as well disliking those of us who would have liked the opportunity to be stay-at-home-Mothers/wives??? Who put the gun to my head and made me do what I had to do? No one. I was bright enough to make it all on my own and to have a home life that was paid for by ME and not the system. That doesn't mean I wanted it that way. But I did it because it was the RIGHT thing to do for my child, even though it took my time away from him. And thankfully as he grow older I was afforded more time with him because he died at age 23. Do you know what I'd give today to have those first few years to do over again and be AT HOME? I'm sure you don't or you'd not have made such an assinine remark phrased as a question. JMO
 Silverhawk_tkn
Joined: 12/3/2010
Msg: 245
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Posted: 4/10/2012 9:59:10 PM

I do not believe, however, that their inability to find and hold a meaningful relationship is caused by the feminist movement of long ago or as it stands now, but rather more a fact of either how they, personally, treat women or the crappy personality of the women they've chosen or continue to choose. That's where the reading comprehension skills come into play.


...lol.......it does if you use feminists as a filter for those who you will NOT date, and it takes exceptional comprehension and reading skills to weed out those crafty feminists.

Shrunk my dating pool down quite significantly I might add. I wouldn't say I had an inability to find a relationship by filtering out feminists, but it did make things harder for sure.
 newonthescene76
Joined: 2/24/2007
Msg: 246
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Posted: 4/10/2012 10:01:36 PM

Is that right? You would have been happy to pay for me and my son to live? Pay our rent/mortgage, buy our groceries, pay for the car I drove to make a living and get him to his activities and his medical appts? My utilitites, etc? Or are you one of those who hates the welfare system and thinks only lazy people need that assistance, as well disliking those of us who would have liked the opportunity to be stay-at-home-Mothers/wives??? Who put the gun to my head and made me do what I had to do? No one. I was bright enough to make it all on my own and to have a home life that was paid for by ME and not the system. That doesn't mean I wanted it that way. But I did it because it was the RIGHT thing to do for my child, even though it took my time away from him. And thankfully as he grow older I was afforded more time with him because he died at age 23. Do you know what I'd give today to have those first few years to do over again and be AT HOME? I'm sure you don't or you'd not have made such an assinine remark phrased as a question. JMO


I interpreted your previous post as saying that you were unable to stay home because of feminism, which isn't quite accurate as you have pointed out. So you couldn't be a SAHM due to financial reasons, again, I don't see how that is related to saying feminism forced you to educate yourself and go to work.
 verygreeneyez
Joined: 3/15/2006
Msg: 247
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Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 10:08:11 PM

I interpreted your previous post as saying that you were unable to stay home because of feminism, which isn't quite accurate as you have pointed out. So you couldn't be a SAHM due to financial reasons, again, I don't see how that is related to saying feminism forced you to educate yourself and go to work.

It destroyed "family structure" to a serious degree. Family values went to crap in the 60s and I was a product of that particular era. I don't know why this is so hard for some to correlate, but clearly it is. Which is fine, I see you have NO children, so you'd not likely feel the sting of that reality ~ that is indeed, directly tied to feminism and this supposed "movement." JMO
 1ukn4u
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 248
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 10:26:09 PM

@verygreeneyez:

Who put a gun to your head to force you to get an education and go to work? That was your choice, not feminism.



Wow!!! You are a jerk lady. I knew what greeneyes meant. It was a what if society hadn't been changed forever by feminism would she of had more of an opportunity to be a stay at home mom. DUH!


Ignore my positive posts the expressed and begged reason for the bettermeant of our society. It seems that many of you ladies are so hate filled that you must be bashing someone even if it's each other. I think I'd rather you gang up and bash me for being born with a penis rather than bash each other. So let's go back to the man bashing please I'm so sorry I interupted. WOW!!
 1ukn4u
Joined: 10/30/2010
Msg: 249
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 10:31:06 PM

...lol.......it does if you use feminists as a filter for those who you will NOT date, and it takes exceptional comprehension and reading skills to weed out those crafty feminists.

Shrunk my dating pool down quite significantly I might add. I wouldn't say I had an inability to find a relationship by filtering out feminists, but it did make things harder for sure.



Why is he such a bad guy for not wanting to date someone who hates him? Who blames him for their woes? Who will always look at him from a place of inferriority? The man obviosly wants a partner he can be equals with that will be on his side and know he isn't her enemy but her biggest fan. Whats so wrong with that?
 R00T
Joined: 3/13/2012
Msg: 250
Feminism Your Views
Posted: 4/10/2012 10:37:15 PM

It destroyed "family structure" to a serious degree. Family values went to crap in the 60s and I was a product of that particular era. I don't know why this is so hard for some to correlate, but clearly it is. Which is fine, I see you have NO children, so you'd not likely feel the sting of that reality ~ that is indeed, directly tied to feminism and this supposed "movement." JMO


And that was the goal of social engineering. To break in the family unit so they can reduce population. It is working. Feminist don't and won't ever get it, well maybe when it's too late. It's all this me me me attitude like a little kid. Who cares if hurts their own children let alone the men. This is the brain washing at it's finest.
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