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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/8/2005 5:36:06 PM |
from my reading of the Bible, i whole-heartedly believe that abortion is murder, from God's perspective anyway
One third of all pregnancies end in God induced abortion (a.k.a. miscarriage). God also had no problem killing a bunch of babies during Noah's Flood and the plagues of Egypt. So I think it's a pretty safe bet that the Biblical God has no problem with abortion. Don't these unblemished souls go right to Heaven anyway? Had they lived there would have been the risk that they'd go to Hell. You're doing them a favor really. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/17/2005 9:23:45 PM | | If God says He know us before our birth, still in our mother's womb, and that He plans good for us. He knows us and loves us as an unborn baby, of course it's murder. People use abortion as a form of birth control, which takes an innocent life. If you have ever had an abortion, you can be forgiven, you can still come to the foot of the cross of Jesus. | |
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Garf
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Joined: 4/4/2005
Msg: 1283 | |
| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/17/2005 10:09:50 PM | Um, yeah, I really wanted to avoid this, and if I hadn't read some of the posts, I would've.
But...I read some posts and changed my mind.
Personally, I think that if a woman is raped and conceives; do as you will, the pregnancy was forced (so to speak) and the father, (unless caught) will never support the mother or child, and who would expect it. (He is after all; a rapist...not known for ethics or morals) Aside from that, every time the mother looks at her child, she sees the face of the father.
But as for a pregnancy that was the result of two consensual adults; There's always adoption. If that isn't an option because they don't want to go through with the pregnancy...well they should have considered the consequences of their actions before having sex. If that sounds harsh...my alternative position is that if people want to have sex but aren't willing to deal with the possibility of having children; Vasectomies or hysterectomies are always a possibility. Vasectomies are reversable, and relatively painless...
Bottom line; If you're willing to do the crime, be prepared to do the time. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/17/2005 10:30:31 PM | Bottom line; If you're willing to do the crime, be prepared to do the time
Very good statement!! I ducked out for a while and man this thread is not ever going to end, but I think that if a woman has an abortion, its not between her and anybody, but GOD!!! Not a church, or a preist or any of us. Church and religion is all mostly a political thing, a group of people trying to determine which one is right!! The bible is right, and the real bible, not one that we make up as we go. And there could be several meanings to one verse, etc........... Get it? Who are we to judge? Only have an opinion. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/18/2005 3:37:12 AM | | I know I couldn't. I believe that god creates life, and only He has the right to take it away. Abortion is murder, and I think that if I commit murder, then having broken a major commandment, I would have to pay the penalty. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/18/2005 9:23:33 PM | Well Might as well put my two cents in for what its worth. I don't understand how any Christian can stand up for abortion, under any circumstances. I understand that is a hard pill for some to swallow but I look at it this way. I believe in God. God knows all. We don't. God is the only source for the creation of life, as much as we think its us doing the creating its not. God is the only one that creates life. Sometimes we may question why God would do this under certain circumstances and it may not make any sense to us...but who are we to question God?
I stress here I am not trying to pick an argument, just stating my beliefs. Here is an example. A mother and father have been informed that the child the mother has been carrying for 3 months will be born with a severe metal disability and never be able to lead a normal life, and will never fully understand what life is around him. Why not abort? Who is to say that if that child is born...he gets a nurse that happens to be an athiest. Over the course of a few years, this nurse notices something in the child that brings this nurse to the Lord. Maybe the child being born was to serve this purpose. How do we know>? We don't. Anyone who supports abortion is making decisions that are convenient to them and are putting God in the back seat. I am not saying it is an easy thing, in some cases it is not and I am in no position to judge. I just pray that innocent babies would not be sacraficed as if they weren't even human. Next thing you know, Dad has turned 65....time to put him to sleep...
Peace | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/19/2005 7:51:48 PM | if abortion were considered "murder" it would be illegal and women would be sentenced accordingly for that choice. abortion happens to be a woman's right under the laws that protect her privacy and it's no business of anyone to butt in... hence the "right to privacy" that protects her in making that choice.
and to you admitone... we treat our animals with more dignity and respect than we do our own "65 year old dads". our dog gets cancer and is suffering, we can have them humanely euthanized. our 65 year old dad get cancer and we get to watch them suffer and rot before they die an agonizing death. such sad irony... | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/19/2005 9:33:03 PM |
God is the only source for the creation of life, as much as we think its us doing the creating its not. God is the only one that creates life. Sometimes we may question why God would do this under certain circumstances and it may not make any sense to us...but who are we to question God?
You mean "who are" they.......
That would be those who don't share your belief system, .....for them, any assertion based on your faith is flawed logic, intolerant, and oppressive. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/20/2005 8:49:09 PM | | Sorry for my basic english. My sister had a abortion once and I cried, realy, not for the mother, but for the loss a human being, nefew or niece. Aren't our society in this kind of stuff just because it has forgotten how to manage attraction, love and sex ? | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/20/2005 9:07:33 PM | {if abortion were considered "murder" it would be illegal and women would be sentenced accordingly for that choice}
I appreciate your right to an opinion. But if you look back in the history books, your country considered African American's sub human and could be slaves. Law makes do make mistakes.
{abortion happens to be a woman's right }
What about the rights of the baby? He didn't ask to be in the womb of the mother?
{we treat our animals with more dignity and respect than we do our own "65 year old dads". }
I thank God...I'm not your dad lol
Wish I could figure out how to quote someone.
On a final note...we could argue till the cows come home....Roe...of Roe Vs Wade....She has since become a Christian as is a very big advocate of Life now... Interesting....
http://www.leaderu.com/norma/index.html | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/20/2005 9:47:37 PM | admitone... it's ok to agree to disagree on this topic. as people who know me know... i wouldn't EVER consider abortion for myself but WHO AM I to strip another woman of her right to privacy under the law? what women do with their bodies is their business, not mine and it's definitely not yours.
do you also frown on women like me who choose to take birth control pills? it's the same basic principal as abortion yet it's considered to be "responsible". sad irony if you ask me... nonetheless, it's MY choice, not yours.
i also thank god you're not my father because my father would not want to suffer in death after living such a distinguished and dignified life and have his daughter watch as he's humiliated in his later years as most elderly are humiliated. it wouldn't be humiliating in my eyes because i love my father unconditionally but he does not want to live his remaining days out in a "recovery facility" waiting for someone to come in and change his diaper when it's his time to be cared for by others in his life. some people want to die with dignity and that's ok in my book.
i'll have to go check out the link you posted... maybe i'll comment on what i learn later. thanks for posting it though... it's always nice to see things from another perspective. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/21/2005 6:59:11 AM | This is such a topic that makes my eyes full of water for I once did have a child, we had disscused it that Abortion was not the answer but she was in B.C. and I had so many loose ends to close before I even considered getting out there we where both fairly young. Her mother great Lady but was not too fond of me decided that there would be no child between her and I. I was crushed, the fact is that yes one has killed for what one thinks is not a proper environment for that child. But do you really think it would remain that way? Now look at this from another angle, those who could give birth to a child they have all the means and providings but cannot produce one. A child is the gift from God and this child should be your mentor and life sustaining pleasure. I really forgive the parties involved for the decision but I still like to imagine how things would have been so much more pleasant than what they are now.
Wanted to speak my mind. just how I feel.
so all in all if you have a child Thank God for The child and yes Birth pains are there but really, there are many out there that have the means to provide.
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/22/2005 8:47:59 PM | dei gratia... i think everyone here would sympathize with you based on the personal situation you shared. abortion is not a "happy" choice for any woman that makes that choice and it does have long term affects on both parents involved... it is a choice though... and the woman in your life made what she thought was the best choice for everyone involved. i'm sorry you had to endure that pain.
i'm not saying what i'm about to say to sound mean and i use the word "you" in general, not "you" personally dei gratia. what you have to remember when it comes to this topic is that it is not YOUR choice, it is not YOUR body, it is not YOUR mind, it is not YOUR soul, it is that of the pregnant woman and her choice is hers to make and protected under the law. this doesn't mean you have to agree with it, what it means is that you have to respect her right to privacy, nothing more and nothing less. | |
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Garf
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Joined: 4/4/2005
Msg: 1294 | |
| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/22/2005 9:28:44 PM | | Regarding the birth control pill comment....the pill prevents the egg from going down the fallopian tube, so the conception of life is irrelevant. Preventing someone from being concieved is a little different than preventing someone from being born once they've been concieved....you're just going a step back with this one. | |
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Garf
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Joined: 4/4/2005
Msg: 1297 | |
| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/22/2005 9:38:45 PM | | Catholics will excommunicate for taking the pill, but they'll offer you forgiveness for rape and murder....what kind of priorities do they have, anyway? Not to slam the big C, but seriously, have you ever given this any thought? This is one of the many reasons that I left the whole organized religion thing behind. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/22/2005 9:47:21 PM | | Not really Garf, I don't see how the bible is against contraception..abstinence would be the ulimate form of it..I don't see a command against that..Of course some people us the ole "Onan spilling his seed on the ground" thing, but its obvious from the context that he was refusing to impregate is dead brothers wife, which apparenly was his duty.. | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/22/2005 11:19:25 PM | garf... i was born and raised old school catholic and i have a great amount of respect for the religion but i am a "non-practicing" catholic because it would be quite hypocritical of me to be practicing, especially if i went to church, considering i don't share a number of the same beliefs or should i say, don't agree with their teachings.
birth control happens to be a no no because contraceptive intercourse is inherently wicked, or so the church says. the choice to avoid pregnancies by freely choosing to abstain from relations during fertile periods while freely choosing to express marital love in the marital act during infertile periods can be a morally right way of fulfilling spousal and parental responsibilities is what the church teaches.
can't think anymore... i'm sleepy | |
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| strong feelings about abortion? would you take this bet?
Posted: 7/22/2005 11:45:18 PM | badKit "intercourse is inherently wicked, or so the church says."
Where do they actually state that..Catecisms , etc?...I was raised RC..but I can't remember being taught that sex was wicked..Maybe I conveniently forgot those parts, haha | |
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