| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 8:31:18 AM | | Why must we seek to understand an offender who has done the unthinkable to some one's child. Why is his/her/offender's well being a concern over the victim? I believe they should get the death penalty. When you murder someone, you end their life, their family suffers. When you molest a child you sentence them to a life full of nightmares. I believe it is simple. Your covicted of molesting a child, death. Thats how you solve the problem. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 8:44:44 AM | Why must we seek to understand an offender who has done the unthinkable to some one's child. Why is his/her/offender's well being a concern over the victim? I believe they should get the death penalty. When you murder someone, you end their life, their family suffers. When you molest a child you sentence them to a life full of nightmares. I believe it is simple. Your covicted of molesting a child, death. Thats how you solve the problem. I think the reason we need to understand is that, in reality, we are NOT going to be executing child molesters. So it depends what kind of conversation you want to have, really. If you want to discuss everyone's hatred for the behavior and for the people that do it, that's one thing. But if you want to talk about managing the issue as effectively as possible, it isn't helpful to write everything off to death. Understanding an offender's behavior has nothing at all to do with condoning it, and it CERTAINLY doesn't put the offender's well being above the victim's. It is in future victims' best interest for us to understand as much as possible so that we can hopefully address the problem more effectively.
It also makes a difference what we want to prioritize; punishment and vindication or prevention? In my opinion there needs to be a balance that works within the framework of reality. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 8:56:54 AM | Although I am fairly liberal in most of my opinions, I feel the justice system needs to be re-thought. I beleive if we quit supporting criminals to a lifetime of luxury most Americans can't afford and made the punishment fit the crime with public displays of punishment there would be less crime. Murder that has witnesses no excuse, you die, not after 20 yrs. on death row but within 1 month of your crime. Rape, brutal assaults, child crimes= death, no excuses. Weed the undesirable out from the "herd" or gene pool rather. I think we support lifers of violent crimes for no purpose. Violence of anykind is unacceptable! We all agree things need to change so write and call your politicians and let them know your views. Make noise for change! | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 10:50:11 AM | Obviousley no one in your family or anyone you know has been violently assaulted or you might feel a little differently about people who has more rights than their victims. Sorry, my opinion, on a painful subject. I appreciate the fact that in America I am entitled to my opinion! Yes, I would fight and die for my right to be an American! | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 10:57:49 AM | Obviousley no one in your family or anyone you know has been violently assaulted or you might feel a little differently about people who has more rights than their victims. Actually, you are wrong, if you must know, not that it's any of your business. And it baffles me that you said something this ignorant. It's a bit hateful to suggest this simply because we have differing opinions. The REALITY is that our country is not going to execute someone within a month. That has nothing to do with my personal experiences. You have no idea WHAT my opinions are, or how I feel, and you're out of line to presume otherwise. | |
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salexs
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Joined: 10/5/2005
Msg: 107 | |
| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 4:03:28 PM | Why must we seek to understand an offender who has done the unthinkable to some one's child. Why is his/her/offender's well being a concern over the victim? I believe they should get the death penalty. When you murder someone, you end their life, their family suffers. When you molest a child you sentence them to a life full of nightmares. I believe it is simple. Your covicted of molesting a child, death. Thats how you solve the problem.
I think the reason we need to understand is that, in reality, we are NOT going to be executing child molesters. So it depends what kind of conversation you want to have, really. If you want to discuss everyone's hatred for the behavior and for the people that do it, that's one thing. But if you want to talk about managing the issue as effectively as possible, it isn't helpful to write everything off to death. Understanding an offender's behavior has nothing at all to do with condoning it, and it CERTAINLY doesn't put the offender's well being above the victim's. It is in future victims' best interest for us to understand as much as possible so that we can hopefully address the problem more effectively.
It also makes a difference what we want to prioritize; punishment and vindication or prevention? In my opinion there needs to be a balance that works within the framework of reality.
I could not have said it better myself. No one is condoning what a pedophile or other sexual predator has done. What we are saying is understand them, learn, educate yourself!! So we CAN better protect children, women and yes even men in the future.
History is so full of people using viloence to stop violence(and it never works) where does it all end?? Simple. With arming ourselves with KNOWLEDGE. | |
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salexs
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Joined: 10/5/2005
Msg: 108 | |
| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 4:20:47 PM | | Funny thing. I was just debating this with my roommate. And I admit freely if someone came to me and said my nephew, daughter or anyone I know and love was the victim of a sexual crime I would not be so willing to learn. I would be the first in line to buy a gun. Emotions....wonderful things but they can be dangerous too. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/22/2005 7:13:24 PM | Problems with the criminal justice system.
1) Jails are too expensive to run and the administrations are too corrupt and often incompetent.
2) Criminals don't stay in long enough, and when they are in they simply pool their knowledge to teach each other to be better criminals.
Because it costs money to clothe and feed criminals they should be made to earn roughly the cost of the food, shelter, and clothing needed for them unless by physical impairment they are unable to do so.
I think a good solution would be that any criminal convicted of a felony should not be released until he or she can prove objectively that he or she has a marketable skill and can earn an honest living.
Because criminals only teach each other to be better criminals, repeat offenders of felonies such as larceny, assault, etc should not be allowed to mingle.
Criminals convicted of capitol crimes should be given capitol punishment: neatly, efficiently, painlessly as possible.
Criminals convicted of multiple murders (like serial killers) should be decapitated on national television.
Child molesters should be given their normal sentences but put in general population with other felony offenders. If accidents happen, they happen. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/24/2005 3:12:58 PM | To Yams-My apologies but it is a painful subject, one I live everyday! I also thought in America I had the right to my opinion, as you do to yours.
To Majestic lizard..succinctly posted.
As a taxpayer, I don't think my hard earned money should be "buying" life saving transplants for offenders of violent crimes. Prisoners get the best medical treatment, availability of a college education and free housing...plus the right to continue clogging the justice system with inane lawsuits. Again, this is my opinion. | |
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BPMG
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Joined: 8/26/2005
Msg: 111 | |
| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 4:43:23 PM | Still working on the website. It will take a little longer but I have been waiting for this for 34 years, a few more weeks shouldn't be a big problem. It may not be the best way to go but it is a start and I like to see things through to fruition.
I am hoping when enough people can get together on this we can get the attention it desrves.
Chuck | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 5:01:03 PM | I'm with Yams here. Momvon, if you are in fact Christian I suggest you reread the Bible and perhaps focus on the first two commandments. You have a right to an opinion, we have the right to demand substance to back it up. IMHO emotion has no place in justice. That's the problem with assumptions, by definition they're not conclusions based on valid premises. Although I do my best I too am guilty of myopic emotion at times. Yams is one of the few here who's posts invariably fit within viable syllogisms.  | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 6:11:50 PM | i agree entirely with DC's assessment/perception of yams input into these forums, but the question at hand is in the subject line.
Having worked with sexual perps in the criminal justice system for many many years (yes, you can feel sorry for me now), no one knows better than i that there is no magic bullet, no cure for their sick behaviour. bearing this in mind i see no problem with fitting them with electronic monitoring devices for LIFE. Should there come a time where there is an effective treatment, we can reassess each individual case. barring that - drop them all in antarctica, build them a shelter, put up an electronic net (as if anyone would want to rescue them), drop food from time to time and let them fend for themselves.
or we could cut off their hands and feet and pull their teeth so that they never cause another child harm again.
all this and i believe in the UN principle that country is deemed to be civilized by how it treats its young, old, sick and CRIMINAL populations.
so i guess corporal punishment and torture is out. back to elec monitoring bracelets.
wouldn't it be nice if violent offenders (or those who commit crimes which can cause emotional/physical harm to another human being) received max sentences (where they can be studied in the hopes of finding an effective treatment - similar for murderers/seriel killers), financial crooks get financial penalties for the rest of their lives and addicts get community service helping other addicts. i would throw dealers in the first category because they have the potential for causing great harm to children and families, but simple possession or smoking pot should NEVER result in time, especially on a 'three time loser law' (how come actors and rock stars never go to jail??? <<<< you get the lawyerin' you pay for). | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 6:21:38 PM | ...although I do think that jail time is appropriate as well.
Do you suggest we pat child molesters on the butt and wish them a good day? I would say you had it partially right. Jail time is only part of the answer. Intense therapy while locked up is called for. In fact, brooding in a jail cell never made sense to me. All prisoners need reformation while impriosoned. I am not talking A Clockwork Orange therapy. This would be a better use of our funds.
While I mention it, I am compelled:
There was me, that is Alex, and my three droogs, that is Pete, Georgie, and Dim, and we sat in the Korova Milkbar trying to make up our rassoodocks what to do with the evening. The Korova milkbar sold milk-plus, milk plus vellocet or synthemesc or drencrom, which is what we were drinking. This would sharpen you up and make you ready for a bit of the old ultra-violence. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 6:43:37 PM |
...although I do think that jail time is appropriate as well.
Do you suggest we pat child molesters on the butt and wish them a good day? No; what a bizarre thing to cross your mind.
I would say you had it partially right. A more fitting thing for you to say would be that you partially AGREE with me. These are opinions, darlin'. Yours is no better than anyone else's. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 6:47:00 PM | thisis2, great points. Those bracelets would sure be paying off now in the wake of Katrina.
I do not have any answers on this issue. All I know is that incarceration never should have been privatized at all. When we make incarceration an industry certain interests have incentive to keep people locked up regardless of how heinous or relatively benign their crimes may have been. As to rockstars, inequity in punishment only exascerbates an already deteriorating system. Crime didn't drop in the 90s because of stiffer punishments, it passed because of the passage of Roe vs. Wade. Sounds sick, but think about it. Bennett was callous/reckless with that remark a couple of weeks ago, but even I'm capable of doing the basic math to see probability in his point.  | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 6:57:19 PM |
When we make incarceration an industry certain interests have incentive to keep people locked up regardless of how heinous or relatively benign their crimes may have been.
The premise of this is that the law regarding such institutions will automatically become corrupted and according to that premise their can be no legal solutions to anything.
That premise is not valid. | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 7:05:25 PM | Sexual preditors need to be dealt with in a more proactive manner.
No; what a bizarre thing to cross your mind. Looking back, everything seems bizarre to you. That's OK. I do not judge. If I make a statement, grant me that it is my opinion. And I rarely cut and paste.
Please offer us your views on a solution instead of knocking others opinions, unless you plan on sticking with that berating thing. Looking at ones past 25 reveals a lot.
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 8:38:53 PM | Looking back, everything seems bizarre to you. . No, not everything.
That's OK. I do not judge Are you under the impression that people reading this don't see your posts in other threads?
If I make a statement, grant me that it is my opinion. As do others sweetie. And while I appreciate your confusion, you don't need my permission to have an opinion. I think the reason you might be confused is that at times when you disagree with others' opinions, you act as if they've no right to cross you. You criticize and then suggest that others should not. But that's only your approach. And it's generally quite humorous, so please. Carry on.
Looking at ones past 25 reveals a lot.
You're always eluding to looking at my last 25 posts. Are you on some sort of mission to hassle me? That isn't very mature, my friend. You might do well to heed your own advice.
Now, perhaps the topic at hand?
Crime didn't drop in the 90s because of stiffer punishments, it passed because of the passage of Roe vs. Wade. Sounds sick, but think about it. I understand your point here, but I don't think that it can be attributed to just one thing. Particularly Roe v. Wade. I do think it is a contributory factor, and not just for the obvious reasons. Aside from that, I think that people are less desperate when they are not forced into situations that exacerbate their difficulties.
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BPMG
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Joined: 8/26/2005
Msg: 123 | |
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| Sexual Preditors and Pedifiles VS Drug Dealers/Probation Violators/Traffic Violators
Posted: 10/26/2005 8:49:30 PM | | ^^Add: I really believe, though, that punishment/retribution can't be our only goal if we're ever going to decrease the rate of sexual crimes. The reality is that we aren't going to lock people up and literally throw away the key, and therefore we really need to deal with not only how to successfully reenter predators into society but also, on the other end of things, address problems before they result in a crime in the first place. | |
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