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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 2:50:40 PM | thats cause with a cap its the nature of the beast now. lots of teams have already felt the effect of the cap in the nhl. be thankful for the cap though just imagane what crosby would get when he becomes a ufa.
see alot of us fans of the game dont just look at the season coming up, but rather look at the next few years also. who is in our systems, our prospects, basicaly like to see a team thats going to win now but not trade the future for one shot at the cup.
its your choice to use the word dynasty or not. you jumped into a discuion on if the pens would be a dynasty. so its only natural that would come up, and makes it sound like your going for that.
and stop your flip flop back peddleing.
game 2 tommrow morning
go canada go
in sutter we trust | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 3:13:18 PM |
see alot of us fans of the game dont just look at the season coming up, but rather look at the next few years also.
only the ones that 'know' their team ain't got a hope! this year smackeboy....and....I completely understand you southern folks need to do so.....might even help to dream too....;)
okay.................drop the PUCK ALREADY!!...is it time yet.........?! (I'm watchin' re-runs on the tube already for Godsakes.... ) | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 3:30:17 PM | | bugg have you looked at your oilers roster. bottom feeders. dont worry one day you will get a gm and coach that knows something about hockey. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 3:42:50 PM | Bottom feeders....this coming from the guy whose team's big FA signing this sumer was Owen Nolan!!
Hey smack...you watched a lot of Flames hockey last year. Tell me...how well did Dion Phaneuf play when Roman Hamrlik was NOT his linemate?
Oh I see a trying year ahead in Cowtown.
God I'm gonna love being back in Alberta! | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 3:55:16 PM | accoin, and sarich big add ons from last years ference, and hamlik.
phaneuf plays better with a right hander next to him. so being macthed with ethier sarich or accoin will help alot.
nolan will add alot to the flames. we lacked a nolan like player for the last 2 seasons. getting rid of amotne, friesn and mccarty are bigger then a free agent signing.
you wacth the oilers last season how well did they do with out smyth? no they have completly stripped the team of heart and soul with smith being traded as well.
if the oilers managment was as good as sutter smyth would never have been lost at the dead line. see how the flames have already inked iggy and reggie.
flames massivley under achived last season. lots of reasons, many on defence having playfair come back your going to see more of the defence from 05/06 then that bad showing last year.
big signing iron mike. a winning coach cant be under estamaited.
and come on do you really think the oilers are going to compete this year? really? be honest with yourself. you know the answer.
go flames go
in sutter we trust
oilers suck | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 4:59:08 PM | "accoin, and sarich big add ons from last years ference, and hamlik."
'scuse me? NOW who's not being honest with himself?
Adrian Aucoin is considered one of the riskiest FA signings of the entire NHL this summer. He has absolutley, flat out STUNK ever since the end of the lockout and, not coincidentally, the crackdown on the rules. His best years are past him by half a decade!
oh yeah...saarich...that great puck-moving, hard shooting, powerplay specialist. yikes. I'd say Sarich for Ference is pretty much a straight across, equal swap. So Aucoin for Hamrlik? If that's an improvement, then the Oilers' blue line is ALL WORLD! Quite frankly, with the loss of Hamrlik (and Stuart, although he wasn't there long), the Flames are starting this year exaclty where the Oilers started last year....without a good puck-moving defenceman. The Oilers addressed that issue in spades this summer. If you think the Flames did the same, by acquiring Aucoin, well...we can have this discussion again in January. I'll be willing to admit I was wrong if I have to, but I'm not concerned.
"phaneuf plays better with a right hander next to him."
Since when? Phaneuf was almost inseparable from Hamrlik last year and clearly struggled when Hamrlik missed games the season before, due to injury. If Phaneuf plays better with a right hander next to him, why would he and Hamrik have been partners for 2 straight seasons? I think you just pulled that one out fo the air smack.
I agree that as it stands, the Oilers will not challenge, but with all the Dmen they have (eight NHLers), and their depth on the farm, I see Lowe making a trade yet, for a bona fide first liner to play with Hemsky and Penner. (That is, if KL hasn't blackballed himself with every GM in the league after this summer )
You, on the other hand, seem to think the Flames, as they are right now, can challenge for the Stanley Cup!
Now, you say the Flames clearly underachieved last year. Could Oiler fans not say the exact same thing, considering where the team was in June the season before? How is it that argument works for the Flames but not the Oilers?
Oh yeah, and Mike Keenan is a winner? Hmmmm....coached a team with Mark Messier on it to a Stanley Cup 13 years ago. Hasn't coached a team to a playoff spot in 10 years. Hasn't coached a team to a winning record in nearly as long.
I will say this, Mike Keenan USED TO BE a winner. Now? Not so sure. Recent history would dictate otherwise.
I love your team spirit, Smack. It always makes for good banter. But when you tell others to be honest with themselves, well...it might taste bitter, but try your own tonic ;) | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/28/2007 5:26:36 PM | | hey smack---i jumped in to tell the poster that the pens were in good shape cap wise. and the last time i looked this was not a "dynasty thread". and i'll tell you something else there are more people on this thread that live in the past , rather than look to the fututre like you claim. my god this thread is full of way back when......and one more thing... you show me where i back peddle on ANY subject. | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 4183 | |
| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 4:35:13 PM | "Nolan will add a lot to the flames"
Only time will tell. For the past several years he has been plagued with injuries and when he is on the ice he is almost absent. His days as a leaf were brutual to say the least. I cant remember the guy scoring any goals since his SJ shark days.
"they have completed stripped the team of heart and soul with smith being traded as well"
Yes i agree losing Smyth and Smith is a huge blow for the Oilers. I do think that the Oilers have improved there D though with the likes of Pittakinen and Souray. Now they need some more firepower up front to go along with Penner and Hemskey.
"if the Oilers management was as good as Sutter"
This is a matter of opinion. Lowe has made some questionable calls. I still do not understand why he quibbled over Smyth's contract. But he did lure Pronger to Edmonton even though his wifie did not like the city. Lowe has been around the game a long time and he will rebound in management given some time. As for the Oilers coach he is excellent. Remeber the Oilers were one came away from the Stanley cup two years ago and knocked off some tough teams that the Flames have had trouble with during the same time.
"Big signing Iron Mike"
LOL, opinions vary.
Imo the flames screwed themselves by hiring Keenan. He may do alright but i do not see him lasting long in Calgary. His record with players is subject to criticism often and his coaching record itself is dismal the past several years.
He has been bounced around from team to team like a ping pong.
"Flames massively underachieved"
LOL, sounds like an excuse for your fav team. The way i see it, with nothing to gain as i like the flames and all Canadian teams except for the Sens lol, is the Flames were inconsistent.
They looked good some nights and like a different team on other nites. They won at home but could notwin on the road. Big problem, especially when the playoffs come around because you have to be able to steal games in the other building if you want to advance.
"do you really think the Oilers are going to compete this year?"
Oilers have a solid D.
If Rollie can play like he did two years ago that would help them.
Hemsky, Penner and company are going to have to have career years.
Lowe needs to sign another quality forward.
ya, i think they will compete. Injuries will play a huge role as the case with any team. If Kipper got hurt the Flames would be SOL even if Iggy scored 50. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 6:15:08 PM | Sorry to both you Calgary and Edmonton fans, I can "feel" the heartbreak...
Get use to not coming close to the CUP for the next few years, maybe decade. Out west, it is a toss up between San Jose and Vancouver. Dallas is done and will struggle to make the play-offs next year.
Pittsburgh will dominate in the East. New Jersey will not make the play-offs. It will be a battle between the Rangers and Ottawa to see who comes in second there. Either way, it is Pittsburgh 4 to 1 over the West in the Cup final. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 6:23:53 PM | Actually I think the Leafs are going to wwww ... Let's try that again,, The Leafs have been masterfully building to this moment for only 40 years.. the Leafs are going to wwwiiii  nope can't do it
Go Sens Go.. Defending Eastern Conference Champs.. | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 4186 | |
| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 7:48:00 PM | "Its a toss up between San Jose and Vancouver"
Ha ha Your kidding right...The Canucks. lol There not much different than the Flames imo. Take Luongo out of the picture and the canucks are not much to speak about. Week defence and the Sedins were pretty much all of the offence.
San Jose is good and will be the top of the West again. But Anaheim will still be the powerhouse. Dont forget about Detroit as well, there always competitive. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 7:50:53 PM | hahahahaha omg who is dreaming now.
ohh i got one. hawks win the west, 2nd is Phoenix and the jackets will have to settle for 4th even though they have more points then the team from the northwest. hahaha thats how dumb you sound.
vancouver is our of cap room they can only make limited moves basicaly dollar for dollar how do you figure a team thats has a complete lack of goal scoring is going to compete when your whole reason for the pens being great is they are al goal scoring?
sharks are good but sem to lack that killer drive in the playoffs. no one here said anything about dallas doing anything.
you really think brodeur is not going to lead a team to the playoffs? do you really. and your think Fleury is for sure going to lead your team to the cup and win it 4-1
"Pittsburgh will dominate in the East"
based on what major change? did they trade for brodeur and some defencemen? are they going to round there game out? what has changed from the team that got a major beat down looked like kids against men in the playoffs last year.
seems to me the flames and oilers have come alot closer in the last decade to the cup then the pens. so playoff experince goes to both flames and oilers. they know what it takes to win the the playoffs. in the new nhl it only takes 1 or 2 seasons to have rebuilted your team. why 10 years? you from the future?
why did i even responed to you its not like your going to try and back anything you say up with some hockey knowalge. you really lack alot of it it seems.
emm i giving you the tittle of the new musicnut on here (people that have been on here awhile will understand)
its a shame you live in a world that is so far from fact i dont know what you will do when the pens dont win the cup. when the devils make playoffs. when the flames are contenders. when your presious sid the kid gets hurt. or when your others kids have to be traded and the team rebuilt. when you get to playoffs next year and still far short due to no vetern leadership that only comes with age. well till then enjoy the blue pill.
you know i have heard of people being big fans heck i am one i have high hopes every single season. i do think the flames have a shot at the cup next season. i didnt before 2003/2004 till we had sutter. i would not say the flames will dominate next year i dont know. i wouldnt say that before any season for any team. heres the funny thing about sports. we play the games to see who wins, what looks great on paper sometimes looks bad on the ice. you never know how a team will gel. did anyone see tampa vs flames in 04? did anyone think it would be oilers vs canes in 05/06?alot of people wrote the ducks off last yer vs the sens before it started.
nothing i saying the pens wont be great, but your getting way ahead of yoruself already handing hem a stanley cup already calling them a dynasty. nothing saying in preseason crosby doesnt get hit from behind falll wrong and never play again. ( i'm not wishing it, never would wish that on any player) you dont know man. and its seems there is alot you dont know.
so tell me why are the pens so great? come on back it up.
go flames go
in sutter we trust | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 8:02:02 PM | hey hey now pucks. yeah i agree only time will tell. and after repling to rck, im not feeling another reply right now but nucks same as flames come one.
the nucks lack alot when it comes to scoring
only 1 30 goal scorer, annd 4 20 goal guys,
flames 3 30 goal guys, 2 20 goal guys, iggy would have been closer to 50 if not going down for 12 games.
goal tending id say is a draw you couldnt complain going with ethier kipper or lougo.
and the flames have a hugh edge in defence.
plus flames still have cap space so if kipper went down could make a move for another guy that could start for extended periods of time. and who knows what happens when a goalie goes down we only traded for kipper due to injuires on the back end. kipper wasnt a started when we got him. you never know when where or how you will find the next star. the same can be said with most teams in the nhl if they lose the top goalie they most likly will struggle. i cant think of many that would just keep on winning the same as they did before.
go flames go
in sutter we trust
go canada go
in sutter we trust
irving gets the start in game 3
go flames go
in sutter we trust | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 4189 | |
| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 8:06:43 PM | ^^^ but the canucks have shown they can win on the road
what were the goals scored totals? If i recall they were similiar.
Just as you say the flames underachieved last year the same could be said about Naslund and Ohlund and a few other nucks.
The Canucks finished in third if i recall last year, several points higher than the flames who made the final 8th spot. You really think the flames are that much better? The Standings and stats do not agree with you view. If the flames could win outside of Pengrowth then perhaps i'd agree. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 8:39:40 PM | flames finished tied for 5th in the nhl with 258 and the nucks finished 9th from the bottom with 221. hugh difference. 15th of the 16 teams to make playoffs and flames were well tied for 5th lol and the nucks were only 9 points ahead of the flames when all is said and done. only 1 ahead of the wild. thow in the aves only 10 points back in which the aves it really was alot to cacth up they got hot as the flames went cold.
but only finishing 9 points ahead of a team that didnt finish over 500 on the road.
nucks were really compairable to the flames of 05/06 flames had 218gf and 200 ga nucks were 221gf and 201ga
flames lacked defence hugh through last season. seeing they allowed 26 more goals against without playfair using his time on the back end. another aspect people forget about the keenan deal is playfair returns to the roll he had before, working with the defence. the best defence in the nhl last time he was helping back there. players commented on missing him back there. and the lack of defence last year showed. flames couldnt clear the zone at times.
with keenan he knows this is going to most likly be his last ride. he is a hard ass but sutter was worse. most of the flames respond to being called out in public. sutter did it all the time. i would not want to be iggy or any one on the flames with a road record like last year sitting in a meeting with sutter and keenan asking whats going on. the road record has no where to go but up. if the flames played on the road at 500 a low mark would have won the north west.
the changes the flames have made as well with all teams will be messurd by on ice suscess. but adding a vet coach vs a rookie coach is a big step, bringing back playfair for his defencive knowagle is a big step, nolan is a big step up from amonte or mcarty.
ference was ok but ran around alot and was often out muscled. sarich is a iron man hasnt missed a game in 4 striaght seasons, where hamlik was always hurtin. frieson didnt want to be hre in the roll he was asked to play. with one or 2 spots going to go for the kids on the farm that are more then ready rookie contracks will free up room for either kipper or phauef to be given a raise. or make a big move during the season.
go flames go
in sutter we trust | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/29/2007 9:00:51 PM | | ok anyone now wanting to join the fantacy league just send me a message i will send you a link. | |
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Pucks
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Joined: 10/14/2006
Msg: 4192 | |
| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 12:14:19 AM | Nolan is done...Like dinner.
Maybe he'll be the comeback player of the year but i doubt it. He has been below average the last few years.
I still do not see all these changes you speak of that are going to make a big difference.
Sarrich is ok and Keenan will do more harm than good imo. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 7:14:55 AM | how do you figure having a winning coach is worse then having a coach that couldnt coach a team that won 30 games games at home to even go .500 on the road. you dont think playfair knows what he is doing with the d?
nolan isnt coming here to be a 30 goal scorer. he still had 40 points last season. thats 10 more then amonte. and that was he worst season ha has played points wise on a bad team. flames have top line players. iggy, tanguay, juice, langkow, lambo, moss looked like he could be a good 2nd liner. conroy.
seriosly your veiws are blocked by not liking the team.
there is no way keenan does more bad then good. lol sutter is a hard ass that learned from keenan. if by any chance keenan wasnt the right fit its not like the flames cant fire him as soon as things go down hill. i like that keenan is here adds that leval we have been missing from when sutter stepped away from the bench. flames ar not getting keenan the gm but keenan the coach.
go flames go
in sutter we trust | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 10:14:04 AM | "seriosly your veiws are blocked by not liking the team."
Not as much as yours are by being a fan of the team smack.
You can spin the Owen Nolan thing as much as you want. Fact is that he's WAY past his prime....same with Aucoin. Same with Keenan. In fact, pretty much every new signing Sutter made this summer, with the possible exception of Saarich (who should really help you offensively with his 10 goals in 500 career games), has been of a player whose best years are CLEARLY behind him.
Owen Nolan hasn't gotten 50 points this century! And please, don't tell me that he is a great defensive forward. I've seen him play. He's a 35-year-old wash-up. He'll have as much effect in Calgary as Geoff Sanderson will have in Edmonton.
You admit that last year's defence wasn't that great, then somehow feel that replacing Hamlik, Stuart and Ference with Saarich and Aucoin is an improvement! That's just precious
Step back, take off your Flames shirt for a second and look at that statement not as a Flames fan but as someone with some knowledge of the game. Do it this way....can you think of any GM in the league who would NOT give up Saarich and Aucoin if I offered them Hamrlik, Stuart and Ference (as well as Andrei Zyuzin, who was part of the Aucoin trade) in return ? When comparing your gains and losses, that's all you really have to do, to determine whether you've improved or not.
Up front you gain Noland and drop Amonte...pretty much a wash, but you save a ton of cap money, so it's a good move. That's pretty much the only change.
In net you drop Mclennan and probably gain Krahn, if what I've been reading is correct. Maybe a slight drop in talent/experience there, but it doesn't really matter because whoever gets that job just needs a strong right arm, as his main role will be opening the gate. And should Kipper go down, Sutter will be on the phone making a trade, guaranteed.
So really, when it comes to the Flames, the only real changes are on the blue line and behind the bench. The coaching issue will play itself out. Some players absolutley LOVED playing for Keenan. Others hated it. I don't see a lot of slackers on the Flames so for the most part, I can't see that being an issue. The immediate issue I see with Keenan is goaltending. Keenan's nickname of "Captain Hook" is well earned. He'll have to learn not to pull Kipper if two quick goals are scored. That will be hard for Keenan, but Kipper has proven time and time again that you may beat him twice, but he won't let the third one by him, even if the first two come in the first five minutes. Other than that it's a question of whether Keenan still has the ability to be a winning coach. Time will tell.
As for the blue line, it's a definite drop down from the end of last season. That's where the Falems are going to hurt most. If Aucoin fits with Phaneuf it will be a huge piece of the puzzle, but we'll see. History contradicts your statement that "Phaneuf plays better with a right-handed shot as a partner". And Aucoin replacing Hamrlik as your main puck-moving defencman is a mistake on Sutter's part. | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 11:13:33 AM | the blue line sucked last season, was weak they ran around. it sounded amazing on paper but really apart from reggie and dion was very weak. Stuart was a rentail and didnt play well other then what game 6 of the playoffs. dropping warrner down to the 5/6th spot is big. how know maybe reggie and dion play well at the start of this year toghter.
so with playfair back beind the d. those are some massive changes with having to make hugh changes. on paper maybe hamrlik would be ahead of sarrich and accoin. but on paper doesnt mean a thing. you have to also factor in the ruuning around ference, and zuzin did. hamlik may be missed, but sarich is a ironman which is always needed.
its not really right to add Stuart even in the talks of the defence, he was a rental player that never really shined here. to compair roseters its the start of one season to the next. of corse teams are going to make moves through the season. Stuart was better then warrener with reggie, but lacked the extra step. i wasnt inpressed at all.
go flames go
in sutter we trsut | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 11:55:50 AM |
Actually I think the Leafs are going to..
have new line this season. The MAP line. From Sweden. Mats, Alex Steen, and, of all people, highly covetted by the other Ontario team up the highway there...Peter Forrrrrrrrrrsberg....lol
Leafs eyeing Forsberg To play on all-Swedish 'MAP' line
http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Toronto/2007/08/30/4457512-sun.html
Did anybody happen to make it to the bachelor party with the Staal boys?
Staal brothers offered plea deals
http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/News/2007/08/08/4402899-ap.html | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 3:23:30 PM | ^^^ bit of a stretch.. It is just a rumour
From the Sun:
The GM told me that while he is not planning on going into the free-agent market, if conditions become favourable he could be interested in Peter Forsberg, the often injured Swedish warrior.
"As it stands now, we won't go into the free agent market," said John Jr.
"But things could change. We could be interested in Peter Forsberg if conditions are right.
However, in that case, we would have to make room for him in view of the cap situation." | |
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| Hockey anyone?
Posted: 8/30/2007 3:42:48 PM | | sorry to say everyone but the Avalanche have the cup this year. | |
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| flames will win the cup.
Posted: 8/30/2007 6:53:56 PM | ok guys its settled no point on the season this year. i have heard the pens are going to win the cup now the aves. i guess we should just jump ahead, and let the aves and pens play for the cup now. why waste anyones time if its already in the books according to people.
cause you know saying the pens or aves are going to win the cup is going to give your teams such a boost they will not be able to fail. wow i wish i would have said my team would win the cup before all these smart people came on and made there teams better and completey used great points. wow i am stunned. always next year.
go flames go
in sutter we trust | |
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| flames will win the cup.
Posted: 8/30/2007 7:36:06 PM | ''always next year...""
now try saying that for forty years.
Then you'll understand why a lot of us become hockey fans instead of just leaf fans. | |
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