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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 8/31/2006 11:35:53 AM | I say a pop on the butt or on the hand is enough..really spanking a kid will make them rebelious..i used to get the sh*# spanked out my a*# with a belt! And i also have to say i though about murdering the person that did it! I think if you have to spank your kids then you obviously havent spent enough time talking to them! | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 8/31/2006 11:42:51 AM | For all you people who have, throughout this thread, stated that spanking/ corporal punishment is illegal...you are all wrong.
"The Supreme Court of Canada reaffirmed the right of a parent or guardian to use corporal punishment on children between the ages of two and twelve, under s 43 of the Canadian Criminal Code (a provision enacted in 1892"
"In the USA, spanking children is legal, with some states explicitly allowing it in their law, and a few states even allowing its use by schools"
Agree or disagree with the practice but get the facts right.
IMO spanking is fine but as a last resort. For all you parents who have kids that will respond to "time out" and taking away privleges...good for you! Not all parents are so lucky. No kid has ever been scarred by getting his/her butt spanked when the behavior called for it. The scarred ones are the one's whose parents used fists(or other weapon) and didn't confine the physical punishment to the butt. Trying to reason with a 4 year old is foolish and does nothing to help the child understand why certain behaviors are unacceptable. The threat of physical punishment is there throughout our lives. I know there is a line I don't cross when arguing with a bigger stronger man. The threat of him whipping my ass is what guides my behavior at that moment....not respect for him. You can't expect small children to have a full adult understanding of what is going on around them and the consequences of their actions. So you have to find something they will understand.
Just don't spank them in public or some nosy person(usually without kids) will call social services and tell them you beat your kid. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/8/2007 3:11:22 PM | There used to be nothing wrong with spanking your kid. The shallow brat acts up and you take the spatula to his bottom, to show him which end the trashy crap should be coming out of. My parents spanked me when I was a little kid to teach me discipline and it turned out okay. I don't hate my mom and dad now because they spanked me when I was seven years old, because if I had a kid, it'd be the same discipline.
But in today's society, everyone is against you for spanking your unruly bratty child. Thanks to the liberals running today's education, teachers fill the kids with garbage lectures that if they get 'punished', then the child should tell the teacher and the police will be notified, ending up with the parents being harassed in court or by Social Services for doing an act of discipline that had been practiced for centuries. That's why you hear more about unruly teenagers telling their folks, "You can't touch me or I'll call the cops."
Whatever happened to the good old days? | |
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Keljo
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Joined: 12/28/2005
Msg: 156 | |
| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/8/2007 3:52:26 PM | I once got spanked in school. Then I got home, my mom spanked me for getting spanked in school....then when DAD got home and found out I got spanked at school....HE spanked me!
Guess how many times I acted out in school and got a spanking?
Just that once.
Not saying I was never spanked again, I was....but it was few and far between. All my parents had to do was give me the 'spanking eye' and I immediately altered my behavior.
I turned out just fine....and I spank my nephew when he misbehaves when he is in my care. Funny thing is, he rarely acts out because he KNOWS he'll get a spanking. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/8/2007 9:03:22 PM | I was spanked as a child and I admit I have spanked my children on occasion. It is certainly not my first choice of discipline but I have used it. Under the age of 6 you can not reason with a child, this is the age of discipline, when your 2 year old runs down the drive wya or goes to reach for that pot on the stove do you say "no, no johnny we mustn't do that or you might get hurt, blah blah." In my case they got a quick smack on the bum and a firm NO. In this case they learned to think running on road means OW, touching stove means OW, I woud rather that ow come from 1 quick spank and not a more serious injury.
My oldest had very dangerous behaviours associated with his disorders, if he set a fire he got spanked. This was not a time to reason he needed immediate correction. If he stole he got a spank, etc. His ped has told me he went from having the most severe form of adhd and anxiety to being almost a normal child, he even asked what my secret was, plain and simple I demanded they follow my rules and I on occasion spanked. I do not let their disorders excuse them for bad behaviour, and when the "crime" was severe enough they got a spanking for it. Are my kids perfect no, but they are a heck of alot better than many kids out there.
After the age of 6 is the training phase, where you begin using more reasoning and less spankings, but if they misbahve enough or with a big enough "crime" than we revert back to spankings. Each of them only received 1-2 swats ever for running on the road or touching the stove etc. My 3 yr old has only received one other spanking to date, my oldest was my toughest kid, he's self esteem actually improved as his behaviour did, he felt badly about himself when he did those bad things, as well he is a safer child now that he no longer does those things. He may not have the logical reasoning in his head, or the biblical reasoning in his heart as to why he should not set a fire or play on the roof or steal, but he has caught on enough to know they result in a spanking, the punishment outways teh reward of the behaviour so he doesn't do it. 90% of their discipline is in teh form of time outs, loss of priveldge or natural consequences, but that does not exclude spankings entirely.
Yes the goal is to have them intrinsicly choose to behave correctly simply because it is the right thing to do, but for young children it begins with extrinsic correction. YOu do not spank out of anger. In my home I cool of, they get a spanking on the bottom with my hand, never an object, and then we talk about why they got the spanking, followed by a hug and forgiveness.
Regardless of how one discipline's the problem isn't so much whether kids are wellbehaved or not due to spanking, but due to consistancy of whatever method is chosen by the parent. Too many parents want their kids to like them, so they never make them follow the rules with a consistant consequence if they do not. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/8/2007 11:08:59 PM | | There is nothing wrong with spanking, it's just today's soft, easily offended, politically correct society that has a problem with it. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/8/2007 11:28:55 PM | One major problem in society is the fact that todays parents raise kids.
They do not understand that they are raising future adults. Your job as a parent is not raising a child. It is raising a adult who is a productive member of society.
As Chris Rock said: If your kid calls your grandma, Mom, and their mom Pam, that kid is goin' to rob me in 10 years. "You aint saving for college, your saving bail!" | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/9/2007 5:55:08 AM | There's a huge difference between spanking and abuse. I was raised with spankings, and I intend on raising my future children the same way, government be damned. I never felt like I was being abused, or that I was unloved, or that my parents were spanking me for no reason. I always knew that it was well deserved, and that I would get another one if I didn't start to behave.
I don't want my future children to turn out to be disrespecting little buggers that have no sense of right and wrong (not saying that if you aren't spanked, you won't be able to distinguish the difference).
I don't believe that it should be used as the first form of discipline; it should be more like a back-up method for when the whole 'talking to' needs reinforcement (example: we've had a discussion about the situation, said situation happens again; as a result, the tanning on the @rse starts). Nor do I believe that it should ever be closed or back handed (and personally, I'm not much of a fan of the use of a wooden spoon, switch, or belt). | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/9/2007 2:21:35 PM | It's when a parent calls their kid a name, like "stupid" or "idiot"...THAT'S when you have esteem problems. Nothing wrong with spankings. I got them, too, but my mom was also good with those words. That's when it really hurt.
Another annoyance is the counting...you watch the kid stand there and wait til the parent FINALLY gets close to ten, then does what he or she is told...and that's called minding?
THAT'S why I have cats.... | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/9/2007 2:37:27 PM | The posts in this thread remind me of why society is still the way it is.....
I would prefer using a firm voice. One that means what it says.
But sometimes it happens, especially at a young age, when you can't reason with a child.
But all means neccessary, should be used to restrain from spanking a child. Especially as they grow older.
Similar to what should have happened with the war in Iraq.
All means of reasoning and threats of what can happen should be used to the maximum. Once you strike a child or engage in a war. The child or the enemy has taken the punishment and eventually they become numb to it.
Eventually it becomes in-effective
Parents need to teach and children need to learn
Spanking should be seldom used and always 10 and under. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/9/2007 6:28:18 PM | Wow, loaded topic. I've just finished composing what's written below. It's long. My apologies to those who hate long posts. I'm a thinker and below is my thinking as I thunk it, lol. Also should forewarn I've been dubbed the queen of over explain elsewhere. Just so you know. Read it if you want or scroll past fast. I felt like sharing.
As I read through the thread and it was mentioned how previous generations only used spanks (and though unmentioned per se, fear of God/fear of hell). In the "olden" days parents didn't talk to their kids, or offer physical affection to them once they were out of diapers. The only notion back then for parents to discipline their kids was to spank them. Children were to obey their parents and elders. They were to be seen and not heard. That is just how it was. Most children caught on quick; it helped if they had older siblings to model good behavior after, as the eldest almost always bore the brunt of learning to behave, in ways expected, in order to fit in with family and community dynamics.
A lot has since been learned about child psychology and long term affects of childhood experiences in later life. Turns out talking to kids was a novel idea and letting them speak even more so. Turns out children were people too. It was a step in the right direction. Knowledge is power.
The kids today being raised by this new approach of talking and not spanking are pioneers. For the first time in human history there are adults who as children have never been spanked by a parent or given the strap by the principal at school. Mindblowing to me.
I can't help thinking that maybe that is a step too far the other direction. Children seem to crave violence (ever watch kids play together if they think you aren't looking?). Is it a survival instinct like lion cubs at play gaining hunting skills for when they'll need it? Is that why some are so impassioned about making the next level of the latest greatest shoot 'em up knock 'em out game? Human beings are hardwired to dominate. So far, so good. We do. We are dominant life (on this planet). We made tools to help us succeed to top of the food chain. We're still struggling to eradicate the smaller life forms that threaten our survival (diseases/pestilence) but that's good we like a good fight; challenges to overcome are motivational. Where does spanking or not spanking come into play? What has all this got to do with it? IMO - everything.
We are supposedly more civilised than we've ever been. We look for alternatives to violence. Somebody else already did all the violence for us and helped us gain our place on the planet (we're like the younger siblings of the eldest) so now we can all just sit back and enjoy the results of that. Really? Are we quite certain it's okay to relax now and be civilised and peaceful and non-violent? Far as I know there are still people acting in violence on our behalfs so that we can continue living civilised lives. So then why do children bring guns to school and shoot everyone for obscure reasons? That's not my idea of civilised behavior.
I'm not so sure zero violence is the answer. Certainly I'd hate to backslide back to gladiator times level of violence or even back to the times of spanking with belts and switches and no such thing as talking/explaining or time outs or removal of priveleges or any myriad of other alternate means, to teach children and help them grow into decent, law-abiding, respectful, civilised and well-adjusted adults. I'm assuming that is what all parents want for their own kids and what all adults want for the children in their communities to become. I'm just wondering if by rubberising their worlds; by teaching them to never expect physical/painful repercussions because "violence is wrong", that will turn out to be detrimental to their survival instincts and those of future generations.
I want my 10 year old son to understand that if he walks up to a stranger and assaults him/her that several things could happen: the stranger could tell on him and have him charged, the stranger could stand there and take more (turn the other cheek and all that), the stranger could turn tail and run away, or the stranger just might assault him back. I wouldn't want a stranger's reaction to be my son's first experience with physical/painful consequences for his actions.
His Dad, his step-Mom and I do a lot of talking with him. Mostly that works. When it is clear to me or his Dad that he is testing a boundary, testing authority, testing his own power we have no qualms about assuring him that he is indeed still the child and need not worry about taking on the burden of responsibility for making decisions beyond his maturity level. He is clearly informed what is expected of him. He is assisted in every way possible in being successful in achieving that end. When he has crossed lines of acceptable conduct he has been spanked by either myself or his father. Afterward, he goes back to being our good natured kiddo who knows the adults in his life are at the helm and all is well. He will, in the future, continue to test the limits of his power of course, I expect it and I'm ready to deal with it as it comes. We've done our best to let him know that mistakes are how we all learn and that in life none of us will ever have nobody to answer to. Right now his 3 parental units are in charge of him. What we say goes. We love him and want what is best for him whether he can immediately see that or not. I don't expect him to enjoy being disciplined so oh well. Every decision I make about my child is done out of love and with great thought towards his future and how he will fit into our future world.
So back to the OP's original question
"what's so bad about spanking your kid?"
justifying it to other people whose own experiences have influenced them to choose not to spank ... gray areas abound IMO ... I'm awaiting proof that not spanking is DEFINITELY what makes for well-adjusted adults until then if his behavior warrants it, my son will be spanked (here's me crossing my fingers he'll never get another spanking from me)
*if numbers matter I'd guess my son has been spanked a total of 6 times in his life - it's definitely not our first response to unacceptable conduct but we do consider it a viable option
^that was me sharing and questioning - not shoving or pointing  | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/9/2007 6:43:34 PM | I need one more class and I'm a certified preschool teacher. I even worked as an assistant teacher over the summer. It didn't make enough money so I moved into the corporate world, but anyway... I've experienced both sides of the spectrum and even though my classes said that "hitting children teaches them that is the proper way to show emotion" I don't buy it. I think it depends on each individual child. If you have a shy, quiet, or timid child then a stern look might send them crying and there is no need to hit them, it will only cause fear, distrust, and emotional pain. But in extremely extroverted children who cannot be tamed by any other means, and I mean you've tried everything, a smack on the butt might help them out. As long as the punishment isn't done to relieve your anger and is only a last resort, it might be acceptable. I've found that the reason most children don't listen to you is because parents/teachers don't stick to what they say. If you threaten you are going to drop everything and leave the store if they act up, then do it. If the child knows you mean business the first time, they are less likely to act out. Also, make sure the child has plenty of time to run around and is well rested before you take a 4 year old on a three hour shopping trip. Otherwise, your just asking for trouble.
**There is a difference between a smack on the butt and hitting your child in the face or with belts or other objects. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/12/2007 9:51:19 PM | I don't even know where to begin.
To the people that think it's okay and right to inflict physical pain on a child, a person that should be getting thier guidance from thier parents - what is wrong with you? If you think you are responsible enough to have children then be responsible. What part of you makes you think that it is okay to hurt a child, whether it be a "smack" on the bottom, a flick of a spoon or an open handed slap??
I was smacked as a child, with open hands, and closed fists, with a belt and a spoon and anyway I look at it , I was beaten and it was wrong and it did affect me. Yes I turned out alright, I'm a great person, with a big ole heart, I have morals and believe that I should treat people the way I want to be treated BUT it has affected me in so many other ways.
I can't believe that anyone would intentionally hurt a child and think it's okay. What does it do for you? Does it please you to make a child cry? Once they've cried does that mean they now know right from wrong??
I know it's hard to always exercise patience, I know that children can be trying, but they look up to us, the parent is the one person in the world that that child can depend on to make them feel safe, forever, and everytime you hurt that child it affects them, piece by piece, little by little until someday they will feel totally alone, no matter how many people they have in thier lives.
I know it sounds dramatic but at times it's true.
Smarten up, my God..there are so many ways to discipline children without ever having to lay a finger on them. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/12/2007 11:03:28 PM | I usually don't spank my son, and have a keen insight now into what my father meant when he said, "son, this is gonna hurt me alot more than it's gonna hurt you".
Nevertheless, my understands that dad reserves the right to whip some a*** if he feels it's necessary and so usually doesn't cross the invisible line. And I thank him for that.
Those of us raised in healthy homes, who had fathers know very well of the innate understanding that exists between children and dad. We know that mom's nature is unconditional love, and that moms have traditionally come from an environment, ie. the home, in which unconditional worked. Dad on the otherhand has standards and expectations, and his environmewnt, ie. greater society, will deal with any such acting out much more harshly than a few smacks to the a*** or a stern talking to. Thus, dad will deal much more harshly with our wrong doing than mom.
Nevertheless, nothing quite beats a good ol'fashion *shunning* as a means of correcting anti-social behavior. It is very ancient and very effective, amongst BOTH children and adults, and it is very appropriate to the crime to boot. Might not work as good today as then, depending on how much attention we give our children to begin with, but throughout Indo-European socieities in general to be shunned or worse, set wretched/ostracized, has long been deemed the most horrible fate that could befall a person.
It certainly trumps a good beating. Hell, some kids I knew growing up welcomed a good beating cause at least then they were getting some attention. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/12/2007 11:52:49 PM | I have so many mixed feelings about this. I had maybe 2 bum spanks from mom as a child but was a good kid and listened well, respected her so it wasn't needed. I see my nephews with their attitude and mouth...I would have never spoken like that as a child to an adult/parent.
I'm not sure if it teaches them it's ok to hit? Does instilling fear into a child make them behave? Is this unfair? I have seen how ineffective time outs are..etc.
Only one thing remains solid in my thinking. My mom ALWAYS said what she meant, no empty threats. Maybe that's what parents are lacking, the ability to stick to their guns, follow through with consequences and be consistent. I knew if if was told once, and did it again, there would be consequences.
Interesting topic. Sometimes I see children acting so disrespectful and in my mind I think, man that kid needs a good whipping....Being a Dr Phil fan....I think twice
Let's keep this thread alive, very informative.
What about soap in the mouth for swearing/biting? This is also considered abuse...hmm | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/13/2007 12:08:23 AM | Kids don't act out for no reason whatsoever. If a child is that far out of control that spanking seems like the only option, there is likely more serious abuse going on in the child's life SOMEWHERE. People are very much in denial about this, but the reality is that sexual abuse of children is common, and mostly goes unreported.
If a parent is feeling that helpless to 'control' their child, they need to take a serious look into their own past. You will never be able to recognize the signs of sexual abuse in your child if you have never acknowledged what may well have happened to you.
I would recommend to anyone dealing with child behavioural issues to do a little research on signs of abuse. Read Alice Miller's "Banished Knowledge" for starters. I haven't read the entire thread, but the state of ignorance here regarding signs of abuse in children is appalling.
There is NEVER a good reason to physically hurt a child. There is a difference between 'discipline' and 'punishment'. Discipline is administered with love; punishment is administered with anger, shame and blame, and will scar a child for life. From the sounds of it, most of these children are already scarred anyway.
If you as a parent are unable to get a grip on your own emotional response to your child's behaviour, this is a big red flag. You need to cultivate a deeper understanding of what is really going on, and not just blame it on the child's intractability. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/14/2007 10:51:49 AM | No Spanking Bill
January 11, 2007
SACRAMENTO — A new bill wants to outlaw parents from spanking their children. The assemblywoman sponsoring the measure wants to protect those who can't defend themselves, but is it taking governing too far?
Spanking is a touchy issue for many people. Some use it. Others don't. An assemblywoman wants to ban all forms, even a slap on the hand.
Speaker Pro Temp Sally Lieber plans to introduce a bill that would ban any form of spanking on kids less than three years old. That's includes spanking hands, faces or bottoms. Lieber said, "That would include slapping spanking smacking hitting punching, any striking of a child."
Lieber said, "The borders begin to blur and there ought to be a bright line in the law that says no hitting a child 3 years or under."
We found parents on both sides of the spanking issue, but many, whether they agreed with spanking or not, felt the government shouldn't tell parents how to parent. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/14/2007 12:06:07 PM | If all people really were the same underneath, I suppose a one size fits all approach could be implemented and prove itself successful.
We do have basic qualities in common of course. The human social instinct and need for belonging, security, and social worth for instance.
But in the end different families and different people within families have differing temperments and dispositions. Some children require a firm hand, others not so much. If you try to draft a universal law that governs family discipline you're inevitably bound to wrong at least as many children as you are to help.
Families know best, or certainly should, how to govern their own. So, damn straight that the government and idealists should mind themselves. People need to pay attention to their business, not another legally sanctioned and/or socially acceptable reason to pass the buck. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/15/2007 5:56:42 AM | "To the people that think it's okay and right to inflict physical pain on a child, a person that should be getting thier guidance from thier parents - what is wrong with you? If you think you are responsible enough to have children then be responsible. What part of you makes you think that it is okay to hurt a child, whether it be a "smack" on the bottom, a flick of a spoon or an open handed slap??"
More parenting advice from people with no kids. Sheesh!
"was smacked as a child, with open hands, and closed fists, with a belt and a spoon and anyway I look at it , I was beaten and it was wrong and it did affect me. Yes I turned out alright,"
So the spanking wasn't emotionally scarring or anything like that then......
"I know it's hard to always exercise patience, I know that children can be trying, but they look up to us, the parent is the one person in the world that that child can depend on to make them feel safe, forever, and everytime you hurt that child it affects them, piece by piece, little by little until someday they will feel totally alone, no matter how many people they have in thier lives."
What a load of crap! I was spanked and I'm glad I was. I deserved it. The 10,000 other ways my parents showed love for me made up any angst I may have suffered from the 30 second spanking. What hurts children is the moment they realize there are no consequences for their actions. Hate to break it to you but some kids just don't respond to time out or taking away the video games.
I don't post on the computer thread or the musicians thread because I know nothing about those topics. Perhaps some of you singles with no kids should consider that when you see a parenting thread. | |
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Rhett1
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Joined: 10/16/2005
Msg: 173 | |
| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/15/2007 8:45:42 AM | Well, I'm not a parent, but I don't think being a parent makes someone automatically an expert. Just like not being a parent doesn't make us dense about kids. As in other circumstances, sometimes an "outsider" can offer some new insights. Of course, I understand that if you haven't actually dealt with the issues firsthand, yes, it's hard to judge.
I've worked with a lot of children. I've done behavior management techniques with kids (which I went to college to learn). They work. The problem is: they take work, patience, time and dedication. The problem is, a lot of parents just don't have the time to spend working on a certain behavior, it's not necessarily their fault, they're busy.
I am not against spanking, but I have issues with it because I think that some parents use it as an easy way out of having to actually spend time with their child trying to teach them alternate behaviors. A lot of kids act out because they are not getting what they want, a need may not be getting met, etc.
I think that the big problem with spanking is that it can turn to abuse way too easily.
I'll give an example and try to keep it short:
My friend whom I love dearly is, quite frankly, NOT a person who should have had kids. Before her kids came along, she was one of the sweetest people you'd ever want in your life. A generally all-around good person. Once she had kids, though, she became a screaming, abusive, well, ****.
I don't know that one day had gone by without at least one of her 3 kids getting some kind of a spanking. Her children are hellions, don't get me wrong, but they are a product of their environment (of course, there are children that are raised by great parents, but just have a lot of emotional issues that need some medical intervention).
I talked to her shortly after her kids had been taken away by Social Services and told her that I thought I could help her out, if she was willing to let me. We sat down and devised a plan. We started with her youngest daughter and just concentrated on her. We discussed her behaviors and what the reasons were for them (or what we assumed were the reasons). We put the plan into action. It took about a month for results to start showing, but they showed. It was a lot of work for her. She spent a lot of tense moments fighting the urge to spank. There was a lot of screaming, yelling (from both her and the kids), but she tried. I give her credit. She worked her ass off, and you know what? It's working. It's always an ongoing thing. It always will be. The biggest change was that my friend started paying more attention to the REASONS her kids were acting the way they were.
PS-I was spanked as a child, not a lot but I remember it very well. I hated my mother for doing that. It was shaming, it was painful and it was not warranted for the crime (my mother didn't like my facial expression when she was yelling at me). If a child is in immediate danger, yes, a smack on the hand or a swat on the bottom isn't the same as pulling down a kid's pants and beating their ass. | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/15/2007 9:18:35 AM | | I am very torn on the spanking thing... With my daughter I use a firm voice and time outs and that effects her big time. One time out she will not or has not done it again! I could not imagine spanking her little butt! However I have seen some peoples kids and they I think need a serious spanking session. I think it depends on the child to be honest. The other thing is your children are learning the spanking warrented behavior from somewhere in alot of the cases with my girlfriends it is their own damn fault there child is a hellion and then you punnish them because of your inadequate parenting skills?????? Questionable? I am aware that is not always the case but I have seen that situation more often than the child just came out "evis" so to speak! | |
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| what's so bad about spanking your kid?
Posted: 1/15/2007 10:05:35 AM | My problem is blanket statements by folks with no kids saying spanking is wrong under any circumstances. You simply aren't qualified to make such a statement.....noone is. Each child is different and requires different approaches to discipline.
"I am not against spanking, but I have issues with it because I think that some parents use it as an easy way out of having to actually spend time with their child trying to teach them alternate behaviors."
Then those parents and those for whom spanking evolves into abuse are the ones whose behavior needs to be modified. The problem here is not in the spanking itself but in the inability, or lack of desire, on the parent to live up to their responsibility.
So, for the sake of argument, let's assume that good parents do spend time with their children and aren't prone to abuse. What then, if time-outs and traditional behavior modification fails? Are you all under the assumption that any parent who would spank their child are only one temper tantrum from punching the kid in the face. I disagree and strongly resent that implication.
"We discussed her behaviors and what the reasons were for them (or what we assumed were the reasons). We put the plan into action. It took about a month for results to start showing, but they showed. It was a lot of work for her. She spent a lot of tense moments fighting the urge to spank. There was a lot of screaming, yelling (from both her and the kids), but she tried."
Good for her...i'm glad it worked. But i ask this......is the screaming and yelling any less destuctive to the child's psyche than a spanking? Children, as many anti-spanking people have noted, emulate the behavior they see in their parents. Is it OK then for them to see that the way Mom handles conflict by screaming and yelling? Will that be acceptable behavior when they are adults? Of course not. It sounds as though the environment led these kids to misbehave...not the spankings. You said yourself the woman had no business having kids.
Your examples of the spanking your mother gave you were inappropriate occassions for spanking. Sad, but even those of us defending spankings, would admit that smart ass looks are hardly worthy of spanking. What we are talking about here are kids for whom time-outs and taking away video games do not suffice. If traditional punishments are such that the child is willing to accept your punishment in order to do or get what they want, then something else must be tried.
As a child myself....I did not fear time-out or being grounded...if I really wanted to do something...I was willing to accept those punishments. However, If I had been warned that if I did a certain thing I would be spanked, then I didn't do it. Often just the threat is sufficient. In many instances where the child's behavior becomes out of control, it's because previous threats of punishment by the parents weren't followed through with.
Believe me....I certainly agree that every other means possible should be tried to modify a child's behavior....but by ruling spanking out completely, the parent is doing themselves and the child a disservice. Children must learn to expect consequences to their actions. If you have kids that respond to time-out...good for you...most of us aren't so lucky. | |
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